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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: Overload on July 01, 2007, 09:40:37 AM
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This morning was first pin in over 6 months! shot 500mg Test and 200mg Para.
1000mg Test E
400mg Parabolin
40mg Halo 6 weeks before meet
Probably run this sucker a good 24 weeks. i have a bench only meet in October that i'm training for. i'm 222 right now with abs and i'm aiming for the 242 class.
Trab - Shot 3cc in the hip, smooth shot. this is my new favorite location to shoot.
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Just curious, why did you go with the para?
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This morning was first pin in over 6 months! shot 500mg Test and 200mg Para.
1000mg Test E
400mg Parabolin
40mg Halo 6 weeks before meet
Probably run this sucker a good 24 weeks. i have a bench only meet in October that i'm training for. i'm 222 right now with abs and i'm aiming for the 242 class.
Trab - Shot 3cc in the hip, smooth shot. this is my new favorite location to shoot.
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I'm also wondering about the Parabolin.
It's a very basic cycle, any reason you didn't want to go with more variation?
The Halo is always a good choice at the end.
DIV
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I too was wondering why Para.
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Is not Parabolin just the Old Trade Name for the original French Tren? Do they still make it?
I only ever saw a few amps of it Real Deal.
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Is not Parabolin just the Old Trade Name for the original French Tren? Do they still make it?
I only ever saw a few amps of it Real Deal.
It's still out there, but like all tren it only comes UG...most UG's started carrying it again a few years back
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It's still out there, but like all tren it only comes UG...most UG's started carrying it again a few years back
I dont know Jack about Tren's. What's your Fav AJ? ANything good been covered here (GB) on it previously?
SOunds like a interesting product. ALL of them are short acting I assume?
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I dont know Jack about Tren's. What's your Fav AJ? ANything good been covered here (GB) on it previously?
SOunds like a interesting product. ALL of them are short acting I assume?
I like tren-a the best. Tren-e works fine I just prefer the other...seems more stable. I've never used para though.
Go here: http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=4730.0 scroll down about 1/3 and you'll see a post all about tren.
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Tanks Arnie. Have to give thet a whirl someday.......
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It's still out there, but like all tren it only comes UG...most UG's started carrying it again a few years back
I am anxious to tri the Tri-Trenabol, just haven't had the opportunity yet.
I prefer Tren Acetate over Enantate as well.
DIV
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I am anxious to tri the Tri-Trenabol, just haven't had the opportunity yet.
I prefer Tren Acetate over Enantate as well.
DIV
U prefer to pull the plug on it early, or run till end cycle?
Pretty strongly supressive Im guessin?
I hear it blamed for deca dick syndrome time to time. About the same as the NanDrolone thing, or is this BS?
Lots of "Deca Dick" is often a culmination of other factors IMO.
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U prefer to pull the plug on it early, or run till end cycle?
Pretty strongly supressive Im guessin?
I hear it blamed for deca dick syndrome time to time. About the same as the NanDrolone thing, or is this BS?
Lots of "Deca Dick" is often a culmination of other factors IMO.
Tren without test can reek havoc on the ole man pole function...but like everything there are those that can pull it off successfully. I know a guy who loves running tren all alone, he combats the possible problem with provoron. Most could not get away with this and most shouldn't try it IMO.
You know it's like we always say, every drug affects everyone a little differently...that's why some guys can run tren or deca without test and end up being fine...they're just a small minority.
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I'm also wondering about the Parabolin.
It's a very basic cycle, any reason you didn't want to go with more variation?
The Halo is always a good choice at the end.
DIV
I wanted to try something different and i know a few guys who have used this labs Para with good results.
I've never used any type of Tren so i want to keep it simple to see just how good this Para may/maynot be.
I include Halo in every cycle!
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i didn't know there was even any real Para around anymore, man am i out of the loop.
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U prefer to pull the plug on it early, or run till end cycle?
Pretty strongly supressive Im guessin?
I hear it blamed for deca dick syndrome time to time. About the same as the NanDrolone thing, or is this BS?
Lots of "Deca Dick" is often a culmination of other factors IMO.
Supression depends on the individual.
Deca and Tren are derived from the same base chemical structure, so anything's possible.
I personally only get suppression from Deca, while Tren only increases my libido.
I don't understand it and neither did William Llewellyn.
I wanted to try something different and i know a few guys who have used this labs Para with good results.
I've never used any type of Tren so i want to keep it simple to see just how good this Para may/maynot be.
I include Halo in every cycle! 8)
Overload, a word of caution.
If this is your first experience with Tren, I recommend you use Tren Acetate so you can control it easier in case you don't like any potential sides.
You can also steadily increase the dosages thereafter if you want to.
Trust me, bro, do the Acetate and alter your cycle.
As always, Halo is a welcomed addition to any good stack.
Can't argue with the Green Halos..... :-X
DIV
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Overload, a word of caution.
If this is your first experience with Tren, I recommend you use Tren Acetate so you can control it easier in case you don't like any potential sides.
You can also steadily increase the dosages thereafter if you want to.
Trust me, bro, do the Acetate and alter your cycle.
As always, Halo is a welcomed addition to any good stack.
Can't argue with the Green Halos..... :-X
DIV
Agreed...big time!
For some reason I had you confused with someone else Overload...I could have sworn you had used tren-e before, several times. Even so, Div is absolutely correct. There are some people who do not react well to tren at all, and if you happen to be one of these, you'll want it to be out of your system as soon as possible...the odds are in your favour though.
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Agreed...big time!
For some reason I had you confused with someone else Overload...I could have sworn you had used tren-e before, several times. Even so, Div is absolutely correct. There are some people who do not react well to tren at all, and if you happen to be one of these, you'll want it to be out of your system as soon as possible...the odds are in your favour though.
I just pray to God that Overload hasn't jumped on that Parabolin train already.....
I thought he was smarter than that. :-X
DIV
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I just pray to God that Overload hasn't jumped on that Parabolin train already.....
I thought he was smarter than that. :-X
DIV
From the sound of the first post, he started it today.
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From the sound of the first post, he started it today.
:-X
DIV
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Thank you for your concern gentlemen. All my training partners have done this exact setup with zero problems, in fact all of them use Para over Tren E or A now. for some reason P seems a bit easier on the sides from what they say. i trust them and they have never led me wrong in the last 5 years.
I'll keep you posted as time goes on. I've never had a bad reaction to any gear in any way. never had a sore nipple or hair problems. the only problem i get is acne and a few painfull injection sites.
I also don't use any Ancillaries...but i do have them on hand just in case.
Also i will be running 250iu HCG Twice a week.
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Good luck.
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Keep us posted on your lifts. . .
I thought thought you were getting out of PL and moving back to BB?
UDE
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Keep us posted on your lifts. . .
I thought thought you were getting out of PL and moving back to BB?
UDE
This is my last run! i need to hit 500 before i get out. i've done 480 with a pause during my last cycle.
my strength is very good right now considering i've been clean for 6 months and i had knee surgery. i did a double with 455 last week so i think once this test/tren kicks in i'll be up there where i need to be.
Starting in 2008 i'll be back to BBing...i don't think my wrist will allow me to lift this heavy much longer. it's been wrecked for a long time.
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I NEED to hit 500... we is a sick people
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I NEED to hit 500... we is a sick people
it started with 315, then 405, then 455...hahahahaha i love it!
i've done 550 with a single ply Titan F6 shirt...
i want 500 RAW!!!
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I NEED to hit 500... we is a sick people
HAHA I love that, I know that feeling of need very well!
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it started with 315, then 405, then 455...hahahahaha i love it!
i've done 550 with a single ply Titan F6 shirt...
i want 500 RAW!!!
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Ok, Hey this metal pro Viking I got, I swear it could stop a .22 hp with the chest plate!
Lets see, who could we test it on... ;D
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Ok, Hey this metal pro Viking I got, I swear it could stop a .22 hp with the chest plate!
Lets see, who could we test it on... ;D
These shirts are tough!
i've only seen one guy blow one out and it was with 715 pounds and the shirt was 2 years old with lots of abuse.
i can tug on it all day and it won't move an inch!
i haven't put a bench shirt on in almost a year, those heavy lockouts are what destroyed my wrist.
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This is my last run! i need to hit 500 before i get out. i've done 480 with a pause during my last cycle.
my strength is very good right now considering i've been clean for 6 months and i had knee surgery. i did a double with 455 last week so i think once this test/tren kicks in i'll be up there where i need to be.
Starting in 2008 i'll be back to BBing...i don't think my wrist will allow me to lift this heavy much longer. it's been wrecked for a long time.
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Good luck with whatever you choose, Overload.
I don't think you should give up PL, just moderate your training better.
Know when to push it and when to lay off.
It would suck to see you take a step down to bodybuilder.
I hope you understand what I mean. :-X
DIV
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it started with 315, then 405, then 455...hahahahaha i love it!
i've done 550 with a single ply Titan F6 shirt...
i want 500 RAW!!!
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I was wondering that. Do you compete RAW? Now I think that means all you can wear is a belt, no wraps or shirts or suits.
I think that is the coolest with just a belt pounding out big #'s in the squat for reps nice and deep!
I would maybe one day like to try PL I think I would have a good squat and dead, my bench would be so-so.
Good luck in the event bro, keep us updated.
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I just pray to God that Overload hasn't jumped on that Parabolin train already.....
I thought he was smarter than that. :-X
DIV
whats wrong with para? its actually way more expensive of a compund. if its real high grade para I would opt for that anyday over acetate.
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I was wondering that. Do you compete RAW? Now I think that means all you can wear is a belt, no wraps or shirts or suits.
I think that is the coolest with just a belt pounding out big #'s in the squat for reps nice and deep!
I would maybe one day like to try PL I think I would have a good squat and dead, my bench would be so-so.
Good luck in the event bro, keep us updated.
I've competed RAW for 7 years. just wrist wraps on bench, knee wraps/belt on squat and belt only for deadlifts.
my last two comps were single ply only meets...i used a single ply shirt and squat suit, wraps and belt. got 80 pounds out of the shirt and 120 pounds in the squat suit. the suit didn't do much for the deadlift, maybe 20 pounds. the squat was a big difference, that suit works great.
Best RAW meet lifts - 595 squat, 480 bench, 635 deadlift at 220 pounds.
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I've competed RAW for 7 years. just wrist wraps on bench, knee wraps/belt on squat and belt only for deadlifts.
my last two comps were single ply only meets...i used a single ply shirt and squat suit, wraps and belt. got 80 pounds out of the shirt and 120 pounds in the squat suit. the suit didn't do much for the deadlift, maybe 20 pounds. the squat was a big difference, that suit works great.
Best RAW meet lifts - 595 squat, 480 bench, 635 deadlift at 220 pounds.
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Don't give up on the dream, Overload.
Don't give up your power.....
DIV
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I've competed RAW for 7 years. just wrist wraps on bench, knee wraps/belt on squat and belt only for deadlifts.
my last two comps were single ply only meets...i used a single ply shirt and squat suit, wraps and belt. got 80 pounds out of the shirt and 120 pounds in the squat suit. the suit didn't do much for the deadlift, maybe 20 pounds. the squat was a big difference, that suit works great.
Best RAW meet lifts - 595 squat, 480 bench, 635 deadlift at 220 pounds.
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Man those are some good #'s! Now I dont know a lot about PL but dont most guys and gals have a bigger squat than dead?
For peeps who are not picturing it that dead is more than 6.5 plates per side!
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Man those are some good #'s! Now I dont know a lot about PL but dont most guys and gals have a bigger squat than dead?
For peeps who are not picturing it that dead is more than 6.5 plates per side!
You are correct...most guys usually have a better squat but at 6' tall i struggle with the squat. always had problems getting low enough to get the press command. with a squat suit my squat numbers are higher than my deadlift but that suit does all the work.
also the bench and squat numbers are with a full pause at the bottom, i've done a 625 RAW squat without a pause in the gym. that 1 second pause is a bitch!
DIV - i can only train bench heavy, i had my ACL reconstructed in april so heavy squats and deadlifts won't be happening for a while. this is why i might try bodybuilding for 2-3 years until i can go really heavy again.
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You are correct...most guys usually have a better squat but at 6' tall i struggle with the squat. always had problems getting low enough to get the press command. with a squat suit my squat numbers are higher than my deadlift but that suit does all the work.
also the bench and squat numbers are with a full pause at the bottom, i've done a 625 RAW squat without a pause in the gym. that 1 second pause is a bitch!
DIV - i can only train bench heavy, i had my ACL reconstructed in april so heavy squats and deadlifts won't be happening for a while. this is why i might try bodybuilding for 2-3 years until i can go really heavy again.
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Different Fererations must have different rules on pause. SOme of these vid clips of meets I see look touch and go on the bench.
That, and a 4" Rom w/ arms practicaly to the end of bar, but elbows tucked. And, a arch that ya could put a Basketball under. I cant even pull that form off.
I'm Afraid of a blown peck W/ that wide grip, even in a thick shirt.
Too much arch seem to steal my leg drive anyway, I can get a lot of pop from that.
Chain & board press & the Fat Bar is kick ass to get strong and thicker FAST. As impressive as a drug cycle.
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Different Fererations must have different rules on pause. SOme of these vid clips of meets I see look touch and go on the bench.
Correct...i lift in USAPL/WABDL/APA
all these feds are very strict on the pause command...i'm a judge for APA/WPA.
Some of these WPO meets are complete bullshit...touch and go bench presses and half squats. watch a USAPL squat, you have to get real deep with a very good pause. i think it's the toughest rules out of them all.
i arch pretty well but i don't have a gut, so i still have a long way to press the bar. i place my middle finger on the ring for RAW bench press. tuck the elbows real tight and touch the bar on the upper abs/lower chest. it's not a pretty bench but my form is flawless, i learned from some of the best.
always widen your grip slowly, it's very easy to tear a pec going from close grip to wide grip if you aren't used to it.
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Correct...i lift in USAPL/WABDL/APA
all these feds are very strict on the pause command...i'm a judge for APA/WPA.
Some of these WPO meets are complete bullshit...touch and go bench presses and half squats. watch a USAPL squat, you have to get real deep with a very good pause. i think it's the toughest rules out of them all.
i arch pretty well but i don't have a gut, so i still have a long way to press the bar. i place my middle finger on the ring for RAW bench press. tuck the elbows real tight and touch the bar on the upper abs/lower chest. it's not a pretty bench but my form is flawless, i learned from some of the best.
always widen your grip slowly, it's very easy to tear a pec going from close grip to wide grip if you aren't used to it.
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So a FULL 1 sec Pause?
That's a long one. I dont go for the bounce shit. That's just nothin, esp in some of these shirts today.
Hell, even w/ the pause it's a loaded spring @ the bottom if ya set up 1/2 well.
I cant get much arch anymore, but I can get a LOT of leg drive, shoving my toes into the front of the boots and flex'n my ass at the very same time.
I work wide now and then, but it's never gona be my strongest grove.
Slightly lower then nipples is the lowest I touch in a shirt.
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Man I gotta say when the bar is bending that is the best!
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Man I gotta say when the bar is bending that is the best!
I have that shirt that says "If the bar ain't bending, you're just pretending"...i wear it on back day.
Some of these cheap Barbells at LA fitness bend SO easily. i was deadlifting 585 a while back and the bar would whip so hard at the top i could barely keep my balance. the bar was wobbling all over. that is why we use the "texas power bars" in competition. same with squat, you can really lose you balance with anything over 495 if you lock it out real hard it will bounce around.
Trab - i always count one second and then give the press command. in the rule book the bar must come to a "complete and controlled stop before giving the command". at my last bench meet with the bench shirt i had to pull the bar down so it would touch my chest. those shirts give one hell of a push at the bottom if they are tight.
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I have that shirt that says "If the bar ain't bending, you're just pretending"...i wear it on back day.
Some of these cheap Barbells at LA fitness bend SO easily. i was deadlifting 585 a while back and the bar would whip so hard at the top i could barely keep my balance. the bar was wobbling all over. that is why we use the "texas power bars" in competition. same with squat, you can really lose you balance with anything over 495 if you lock it out real hard it will bounce around.
Trab - i always count one second and then give the press command. in the rule book the bar must come to a "complete and controlled stop before giving the command". at my last bench meet with the bench shirt i had to pull the bar down so it would touch my chest. those shirts give one hell of a push at the bottom if they are tight.
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At LA Fitness, everything is geared toward fitness, not powerlifters...
The older LA Fitness gyms are more like the Golds used to be.
There is one I train at that has all the old equipment.
DIV
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At LA Fitness, everything is geared toward fitness, not powerlifters...
The older LA Fitness gyms are more like the Golds used to be.
There is one I train at that has all the old equipment.
DIV
The one i train at is about a year old, it has some decent stuff. the manager is really cool and lets us use chalk as long as we clean up.
The closest powerlifting gym is about an hour away. there used to be one down the street but he went bankrupt from trying to open 2 other gyms at the same time.
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I have that shirt that says "If the bar ain't bending, you're just pretending"...i wear it on back day.
Some of these cheap Barbells at LA fitness bend SO easily. i was deadlifting 585 a while back and the bar would whip so hard at the top i could barely keep my balance. the bar was wobbling all over. that is why we use the "texas power bars" in competition. same with squat, you can really lose you balance with anything over 495 if you lock it out real hard it will bounce around.
Trab - i always count one second and then give the press command. in the rule book the bar must come to a "complete and controlled stop before giving the command". at my last bench meet with the bench shirt i had to pull the bar down so it would touch my chest. those shirts give one hell of a push at the bottom if they are tight.
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bro,when and were is the match.i will see if i can make it.
bench
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The one i train at is about a year old, it has some decent stuff. the manager is really cool and lets us use chalk as long as we clean up.
The closest powerlifting gym is about an hour away. there used to be one down the street but he went bankrupt from trying to open 2 other gyms at the same time.
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I don't like the new LA Fitness gyms..........they remind me of Bally's.....
They are good for training clients, but sub-par for serious lifters.
The free weight areas are too crowded and there are too many machines.
The old gym is cool because no one goes there and everything is open.
People call it "the Dungeon".
DIV
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bro,when and were is the match.i will see if i can make it.
bench
NASA East Texas Regional - Tyler, Tx
I might do Tiny Meekers meet, the date slips my mind for some reason, it's in Humble.
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NASA East Texas Regional - Tyler, Tx
I might do Tiny Meekers meet, the date slips my mind for some reason, it's in Humble.
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cool i will see if i have to work,if not i will be their.hell i might even enter just to get a rivalry going ;D
bench
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NASA East Texas Regional - Tyler, Tx
I might do Tiny Meekers meet, the date slips my mind for some reason, it's in Humble.
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I'd like to meet you Overload, perhaps you could give me some bench tips......
I go wide, but I do negatives, so my lifts aren't technially powerlifts.
You could teach me some things though......but I don't do powershirts.
DIV
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I'd like to meet you Overload, perhaps you could give me some bench tips......
I go wide, but I do negatives, so my lifts aren't technially powerlifts.
You could teach me some things though......but I don't do powershirts.
DIV
As would i...
I've done alot of negatives as well. the biggest improvements came from heavy board presses and rack lockouts. along with some chain and band presses.
with a wide grip you can tuck your elbows better and get a big drive out of the hole.
my best asset is my form, i was taught by world class powerlifters so i have the arch and form down to an art. I've helped alot of guys add 40-50 pounds to their max bench in a matter of 4-6 months, many of these guys are drug free and have been lifting for 10+ years. as you know, form and explosive power is the name of the game. i bench twice a week, heavy triples and doubles on monday and speed work on thursdays for sets of 5.
i gave up on the shirts, just not my thing really, seen alot of guys get hurt using too much weight. my buddy snapped his upper arm in half benching 500 with an inzer ragex shirt, his RAW bench was only 355. not a pretty sound...
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As would i...
I've done alot of negatives as well. the biggest improvements came from heavy board presses and rack lockouts. along with some chain and band presses.
with a wide grip you can tuck your elbows better and get a big drive out of the hole.
my best asset is my form, i was taught by world class powerlifters so i have the arch and form down to an art. I've helped alot of guys add 40-50 pounds to their max bench in a matter of 4-6 months, many of these guys are drug free and have been lifting for 10+ years. as you know, form and explosive power is the name of the game. i bench twice a week, heavy triples and doubles on monday and speed work on thursdays for sets of 5.
i gave up on the shirts, just not my thing really, seen alot of guys get hurt using too much weight. my buddy snapped his upper arm in half benching 500 with an inzer ragex shirt, his RAW bench was only 355. not a pretty sound...
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I'm sure it sounded like a loud pop/crunch.........as bones usually do when they break.
I don't like some aspects of PL as it is currently because of the cheats, such as shirts and wraps to some degree.
I think knee/wrist straps can be beneficial but also abused as a crutch.
Most of my lifts are on a 1:2, concentric:eccentric tempo.
My body responds to negatives like nothing else.
DIV
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As would i...
my best asset is my form, i was taught by world class powerlifters so i have the arch and form down to an art. I've helped alot of guys add 40-50 pounds to their max bench in a matter of 4-6 months, many of these guys are drug free and have been lifting for 10+ years. as you know, form and explosive power is the name of the game. i bench twice a week, heavy triples and doubles on monday and speed work on thursdays for sets of 5.
Overload, I've been training for 8 months anywhere from 5-6 days a week. Initially (for first 7 months) I was following the retarded principle of 8-10 reps @ 4 sets and started to plateau. Now I try to lift as heavy as possible for 4-5 sets @ 4-5 reps and then throw in a 1 rep max, which is only at 205lb. 4-5 days latter I perform speed presses, 8 sets @ 4 reps @ 120lbs. I don't know if my routine is actually any good. Can you give me tips on improving my routine to get big and strong fast? Also, is it normal on speed day to feel like it was a breeze?
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Overload, I've been training for 8 months anywhere from 5-6 days a week. Initially (for first 7 months) I was following the retarded principle of 8-10 reps @ 4 sets and started to plateau.
Retarded principle? Been training for 8 months. Started to plateau? I just don't know what to say.
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I meant it as "the word of God". Meaning, because I got the idea from a magazine I was in the mind set that 8-10 reps must be the only way to lift to get big. Since joining the forum I've learned otherwise. Regarding the weight, yes I started to plateau in the sense that I had difficulty benching anything more then 145-150lb at 8 reps, part of which was a mental thing. Add to that the fact that I stuck to the same exact movements the entire period of time and yeah the combination wasn't optimal. Hence the reason I switched to lower reps higher weight. Bottom line, I'm very open minded, and looking for advice from you guys to maximize my efforts. It has been an amazing journey so far. I went from hating working out to loving it.
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Retarded principle? Been training for 8 months. Started to plateau? I just don't know what to say.
He was seriously Overtraining luv. He was doing like a Schwartzenager pre olympia routine DAILY!
He also very lean.
BodyMachine Luv knows his crap too. Everyone trains different. Each body react different.
With the low rep heavy stuff, it's a fasst track to strength and some solid mass. Most dudes cant pound away non stop at it.
Like if you rev a engine to redline nostop - IT BLOWS. Need cycle training also.
Very few guys can pound nonstop like Ronnie Coleman did. Even w/ buckets of drugs.
Id check out what Overload likes too, He's prolly out of town.
The Magazines have done A HUGE DISSERVICE to young lifters, deluding them taht if they only copy
a pros precontest workout and diet, they will look same. It's total BULL SHIT!
Those guys are genetic freaks and on so much drugs it'd blow your mind.
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He was seriously Overtraining luv. He was doing like a Schwartzenager pre olympia routine DAILY!
He also very lean.
BodyMachine Luv knows his crap too. Everyone trains different. Each body react different.
With the low rep heavy stuff, it's a fasst track to strength and some solid mass. Most dudes cant pound away non stop at it.
Like if you rev a engine to redline nostop - IT BLOWS. Need cycle training also.
Very few guys can pound nonstop like Ronnie Coleman did. Even w/ buckets of drugs.
Id check out what Overload likes too, He's prolly out of town.
The Magazines have done A HUGE DISSERVICE to young lifters, deluding them taht if they only copy
a pros precontest workout and diet, they will look same. It's total BULL SHIT!
Those guys are genetic freaks and on so much drugs it'd blow your mind.
Awesome post, i couldnt agree more. I manage a supplement store in orange county CA. So So many teenagers come in telling me they're following these bullshit programs they found in flex M&F etc, and i have to tell them. Dude your only 17yrs old, and natural, you cant train shoulders in the morning and arms at night. 6on 1 off. I just doesnt work that way.
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"Lets think about how our muscle grow for a minute. When we break down muscle fibers, these fibers eventually have to repair themselves and make themselves stronger so that they can withstand even more "force" the next time. When doing a set of Bench Presses, which set do you think results in the most GROWTH? Obviously, the heaviest set in which you get at least 4-6 reps since it's THIS SET that results in the most fiber activation and thus fiber damage. If you can perform this HEAVY, INTENSE, SET during your bench press workout after 1 warmup or after 4 warmups, does it really matter? Of course not, the end results is still the same! Therefore, why do 4 sets for a particular exercise when you can do 1 or 2 and get the same OUTCOME? If you do 4 or 5 sets, all you're "adding" is the chance to overtrain and overtax the nervous system (which is exactly what the term "overtraining" means-- to exhaust all the neurotransmitters in the nerves so that now they have trouble telling the muscles how to contract). ARTHUR JONES, MIKE MENTZER, DORIAN YATES, and myself all believe that if you can maximally stimulate the muscle in less sets, you'll grow just as easily and you'll be less likely to overtrain (exhaust the nervous system)."
...I'll give you one guess.
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i agree to an extent of that. For longevity purposes that style of training is not optimal. I prefer "jaycutler/Milos style" heavy enough, volume/ training using speed to take the muscle to failure. I do beleive their is a proper time for HIT such ass offseason. The muscle density/size achieved by HIT is unique, and therefore it is important. But its too dangerous in the long run IMO. All of its followers have fallen apart and battle injuries. Ronnie, Dorian, Branch, Fux, the list goes on
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"Lets think about how our muscle grow for a minute. When we break down muscle fibers, these fibers eventually have to repair themselves and make themselves stronger so that they can withstand even more "force" the next time. When doing a set of Bench Presses, which set do you think results in the most GROWTH? Obviously, the heaviest set in which you get at least 4-6 reps since it's THIS SET that results in the most fiber activation and thus fiber damage. If you can perform this HEAVY, INTENSE, SET during your bench press workout after 1 warmup or after 4 warmups, does it really matter? Of course not, the end results is still the same! Therefore, why do 4 sets for a particular exercise when you can do 1 or 2 and get the same OUTCOME? If you do 4 or 5 sets, all you're "adding" is the chance to overtrain and overtax the nervous system (which is exactly what the term "overtraining" means-- to exhaust all the neurotransmitters in the nerves so that now they have trouble telling the muscles how to contract). ARTHUR JONES, MIKE MENTZER, DORIAN YATES, and myself all believe that if you can maximally stimulate the muscle in less sets, you'll grow just as easily and you'll be less likely to overtrain (exhaust the nervous system)."
...I'll give you one guess.
Aj is that Daves style? Ive never read his training ideas come to think.
The striking thing about him is hes very insightfull. Seems like a really smart,cool guy.
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Aj is that Daves style? Ive never read his training ideas come to think.
The striking thing about him is hes very insightfull. Seems like a really smart,cool guy.
Yes it is. Although the above is just a brief little tid bit of information. His style of training is not exactly HIT per say, simply because more sets are involved then the typical HIT routines by way of multiple exercises/multiple angles...it's simply fewer sets per exercise. It's also tweaked, just like anything else according to individual response, to a degree...what works best.
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I meant it as "the word of God". Meaning, because I got the idea from a magazine I was in the mind set that 8-10 reps must be the only way to lift to get big. Since joining the forum I've learned otherwise. Regarding the weight, yes I started to plateau in the sense that I had difficulty benching anything more then 145-150lb at 8 reps, part of which was a mental thing. Add to that the fact that I stuck to the same exact movements the entire period of time and yeah the combination wasn't optimal. Hence the reason I switched to lower reps higher weight. Bottom line, I'm very open minded, and looking for advice from you guys to maximize my efforts. It has been an amazing journey so far. I went from hating working out to loving it.
Well I guess the point I was trying to make is that you are just getting into it and to say one method at this point is retarded seems a little premature. Very cool you are into training and welcome aboard. I think you will find over the years to come that plateaus are quite common and part of the game. Smart on your part to have switched things up when you plateaued. I think you will also find that different training styles will be usefull as you progress. So all I'm saying is keep an open mind and try different things out to find out what works best. remember what works best now may not work as well down the road. I have always felt that hard, heavy training needs to be used to build a solid foundation and to maintain it too.
I feel training in varied rep schemes in one session is the best. Maybe you are doing a few sets of 5-8 reps in your big compound moves, who says you also cant throw in a couple sets in the 12-15 range? This works ALL the muscle fibers and is quite draining, gives a nice pump also. Its pyramiding and is a good method, gets you warmed up right and lets you really pump up at the end, paying particular attention to form and squeezing the muscle.
Most people undertrain, so I like more volume with good intensity and focus. But yes big weights with good form builds big bodies
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Overload, I've been training for 8 months anywhere from 5-6 days a week. Initially (for first 7 months) I was following the retarded principle of 8-10 reps @ 4 sets and started to plateau. Now I try to lift as heavy as possible for 4-5 sets @ 4-5 reps and then throw in a 1 rep max, which is only at 205lb. 4-5 days latter I perform speed presses, 8 sets @ 4 reps @ 120lbs. I don't know if my routine is actually any good. Can you give me tips on improving my routine to get big and strong fast? Also, is it normal on speed day to feel like it was a breeze?
5-6 days is too much IMO. i train 4 days a week and do cardio one day.
Nothing wrong with 8-10 reps @ 4 sets. how's your diet?
NEVER max out! i only max out in competition. do triples and doubles with 80% of your max, be explosive and don't do any forced reps. smooth controlled reps.
Speed work is good but 8 sets is overkill IMO, even with 120 pounds. speed day should feel easier, i do speed bench before shoulders, 3 days after chest day. 4 sets of 5 explosive reps should be enough.
i don't know if your routine is good either, care to post it?
Big and strong fast? i wish i knew brother, it's taken me almost 10 years to get where i'm at.
You can google "powerlifting bench form" and it will lay out how to arch and tuck your elbows. westside barbell and metal militia have good setups.
i wish i had more time to answer, today is a busy day, i'll try to get back with you when i can.
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That looks pretty good, i'd throw in some machine or DB pullovers on back day, i like to superset them with chins.
Here is my routine.
Mon - Chest/Biceps
Heavy BB bench
Incline DB bench
Cable flyes - rest pause sets DC style
DB curls
DB hammer curls
Tues - Legs/abs
Heavy squats
Front squats - high reps
Leg extensions
Ham curls
Standing calf raises
Rope crunches
Weighted crunch machine
Weds - cardio
Swim for an hour, medium pace
Thur - Shoulder/triceps
Speed Bench - close grip
Overhead DB press
Upright rows
Behind the head DB extension
Cable press downs
Fri - Back/abs
Heavy floor deadlifts
Weighted chins - rest pause DC style
one arm DB rows
Machine pullovers superset with reverse grip pulldowns
abs are the same
pretty simple huh? i don't follow a pure powerlifting routine anymore, just a powerlifting rep sceme for the 3 big lifts, everything else is more of a bodybuilding routine.
just keep training hard, don't get frustrated, just keep training like a beast!
8)
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If you look at his pics, he's made real fast progress. Super bony to start.
Its like.. You never seen a bulky prisoner of war camp laborer no matter how hard they worked them, right?
You seem to be holding up to the changes well, thriving actually.
But, keep in mind that Delts take a beating in bench AND shoulder work, your tagging them 2x with chest alone.
Along the same line, biceps (tendons in particular) take a whooping on back day. esp if you probe towards max #'s. Max deads have blown many a bicep too.
Ditto for low back re: Squat and Dead (even leg press)
Ideally if we can recover, the more often and heavier we train the faster we gain. But not many hold up long at 2x per Bodypart with high intensity. Only 1 Ronnie, and it seems to have run its course w/ him.
The second you feel low energy, lethargic, uninspired towards workouts... Cut back awhile.
Keep the prime mover exercises only going unless something is tweaked. Work around nagging stuff. Switch to something that don't bother it. The real key is staying on a roll and not hurting self as long as you can.
Watch big guys train (and eat) if you can. Lot of different lifting styles, check out plenty.
Your progress is real good. Shit, it'd make a good steroid, ... oops, I mean SUPLEMENT advt Photo.
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If you look at his pics, he's made real fast progress. Super bony to start.
Its like.. You never seen a bulky prisoner of war camp laborer no matter how hard they worked them, right?
You seem to be holding up to the changes well, thriving actually.
But, keep in mind that Delts take a beating in bench AND shoulder work, your tagging them 2x with chest alone.
Along the same line, biceps (tendons in particular) take a whooping on back day. esp if you probe towards max #'s. Max deads have blown many a bicep too.
Ditto for low back re: Squat and Dead (even leg press)
Ideally if we can recover, the more often and heavier we train the faster we gain. But not many hold up long at 2x per Bodypart with high intensity. Only 1 Ronnie, and it seems to have run its course w/ him.
The second you feel low energy, lethargic, uninspired towards workouts... Cut back awhile.
Keep the prime mover exercises only going unless something is tweaked. Work around nagging stuff. Switch to something that don't bother it. The real key is staying on a roll and not hurting self as long as you can.
Watch big guys train (and eat) if you can. Lot of different lifting styles, check out plenty.
Your progress is real good. Shit, it'd make a good steroid, ... oops, I mean SUPLEMENT advt Photo.
Thanks for the compliment Trab. My mindset has certainly changed in the past few weeks from all the great advice I'd been given. One example is listening to my body and getting more rest, before I was so brainwashed by the magazines that no matter how I felt, I made it a point to go to the gym and bust it (twice per day even!) and it was a mistake. Oh well, at least I learned better. I'm so grateful I found this board and getting advice from guys that really know their stuff.
That looks pretty good, i'd throw in some machine or DB pullovers on back day, i like to superset them with chins.
Here is my routine.
Mon - Chest/Biceps
Heavy BB bench
Incline DB bench
Cable flyes - rest pause sets DC style
DB curls
DB hammer curls
Tues - Legs/abs
Heavy squats
Front squats - high reps
Leg extensions
Ham curls
Standing calf raises
Rope crunches
Weighted crunch machine
Weds - cardio
Swim for an hour, medium pace
Thur - Shoulder/triceps
Speed Bench - close grip
Overhead DB press
Upright rows
Behind the head DB extension
Cable press downs
Fri - Back/abs
Heavy floor deadlifts
Weighted chins - rest pause DC style
one arm DB rows
Machine pullovers superset with reverse grip pulldowns
abs are the same
pretty simple huh? i don't follow a pure powerlifting routine anymore, just a powerlifting rep sceme for the 3 big lifts, everything else is more of a bodybuilding routine.
just keep training hard, don't get frustrated, just keep training like a beast!
8)
Thanks Overload. I will alternate mine with yours so that I avoid performing the same routine week after week. Definitely good stuff.