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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Wiggs on May 16, 2013, 01:34:33 PM
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;D Kobe wont recover
http://www.foxsportswest.com/fox-sports-networks/story/Phil-Jackson-book-MJ-more-charismatic-th?blockID=902903&feedID=3707
Perhaps Los Angeles would prefer not to be reminded of this detail, but before he was theirs, Phil Jackson belonged — in the sense that any coach can belong, at least – to Chicago. He was the Bulls coach of the storied 1990s, winning six NBA championship rings. He was Michael Jordan's coach.
Before Kobe Bryant. Before the next five championships. Before he became Jeanie Buss's boyfriend and then fiancé, thereby a member of the highest echelon of Lakers society. Before all that, he had a bigger star. He had the best.
In his new book, "Eleven Rings: The Soul of Success," which he co-wrote with Hugh Delehanty and will be available in stores on Tuesday, Jackson looks back over his career in a big way, and one of the narratives that arises is that of a comparison: MJ vs. Kobe. They were his two biggest stars, his two biggest personalities, perhaps, and Jackson will be remembered as much for them as he is for his style of coaching and success.
The Los Angeles Times, which received an advance copy of the book, wrote Thursday in detail on the Jordan-Bryant comparison, with excerpts culled from Jackson's memoir:
"Michael was more charismatic and gregarious than Kobe," Jackson writes. "He loved hanging out with his teammates and security guards, playing cards, smoking cigars, and joking around.
"Kobe is different. He was reserved as a teenager, in part because he was younger than the other players and hadn't developed strong social skills in college. When Kobe first joined the Lakers, he avoided fraternizing with his teammates. But his inclination to keep to himself shifted as he grew older. Increasingly, Kobe put more energy into getting to know the other players, especially when the team was on the road.
Some other differences Jackson notes are the differences in the two players' defensive skills and accuracy. No surprise — Jordan comes out on top.
"No question, Michael was a tougher, more intimidating defender," Jackson writes. "He could break through virtually any screen and shut down almost any player with his intense, laser-focused style of defense."
"In general, Kobe tends to rely more heavily on his flexibility and craftiness, but he takes a lot of gambles on defense and sometimes pays the price."
"Jordan was also more naturally inclined to let the game come to him and not overplay his hand, whereas Kobe tends to force the action, especially when the game isn't going his way. When his shot is off, Kobe will pound away relentlessly until his luck turns. Michael, on the other hand, would shift his attention to defense or passing or setting screens to help the team win the game."
And perhaps the comparison that speaks the loudest about Jordan — and may throw Kobe into a rage — is this one:
"One of the biggest differences between the two stars from my perspective was Michael's superior skills as a leader," Jackson writes. "Though at times he could be hard on his teammates, Michael was masterful at controlling the emotional climate of the team with the power of his presence. Kobe had a long way to go before he could make that claim. He talked a good game, but he'd yet to experience the cold truth of leadership in his bones, as Michael had."
The Times story also revealed a few more nuggets from the book:
* Jackson's interest in Zen picked up after he met a practicing construction worker who helped build his house in the 1970s.
* Jackson's words to Jordan after he showed up in the coach's office in 1995 hoping to return to basketball after a failed attempt at a baseball career: "Well, I think we've got a uniform here that might fit you."
* Jackson's daughter, Brooke, had been the victim of sexual assault by an athlete in college, and when the Bryant situation occurred, it "triggered all my unprocessed anger and tainted my perception of him," Jackson said.
* Jackson considers the Lakers' Game 7 victory over the Boston Celtics in the 2010 NBA Finals the most satisfying of his career.
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:D ;D ;)
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Poor Kobe.... :'(
;D
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He didn't say anything anybody who has watched the game for the past 20 years or more and has 2 functioning eyes couldn't see.
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Meh
It's a fair criticism and not particularly harsh or insulting. As a Laker fan I think it would be nice if Phil also gave Kobe the credit that he is due for being a Hall of Fame superstar that helped him win 5 rings in LA. Drama sells books. I'll read it.
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When Kobe retires, he will hide away and probably rarely be seen. Because if he doesn't, he's bound to say or do something really fukced up that will mess him up. MJ is out playing golf with Titans of the world and still building an empire...I could see Kobe ending up in prison someday not unlike OJ.
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MJ is the best there ever was or ever will be, so no surprises here.
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So, basically not going to college to play in his chosen sport, gave him poor socializing skills and a Green Giant size entitlement complex and ego, and that he didn't learn how to be patient and become a complete player, offensively and defensively?
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Saying Kobe wasn't a "complete player" is going a little far don't you think? He's not as good as MJ sure but who is? I doubt spending a year at Duke or wherever would have changed his career much.
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Saying Kobe wasn't a "complete player" is going a little far don't you think? He's not as good as MJ sure but who is? I doubt spending a year at Duke or wherever would have changed his career much.
He's good, but just like Phil had said, he can spend some nights being a bricklayer, instead of being a defensive foreman. He is not really a leader, he doesn't "command" respect as a leader, like Jordan did.
He seems to implode...
And maybe a 2-4 yrs with coach K at Duke he may have, but Coach K doesn't recruit players like Kobe.
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Jordan knew when Father Time won
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would like to hear more on the part about phil jacksons daughter sleeping around with the afletlets
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No disrespect to Kobe but I'm sure even he knows Michael is still king and has successfully defended his title. Next up, KING JAMES!
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a clear signal that kobe is being amnesty'd for next year.
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No disrespect to Kobe but I'm sure even he knows Michael is still king and has successfully defended his title. Next up, KING JAMES!
QFT
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a clear signal that kobe is being amnesty'd for next year.
This. But, does Phil get back the team?
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Jordan knew when Father Time won
he did play for the wizarsd until he was entirely average.
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People in our age range I'd have say age 30+ are lucky to watch and remember Jordan. I mean Michael Jordan, you say that anywhere on the civilized planet, they know his name. And his shoe created the athletic shoe market we have to today, the whole fucking market! I couldn't tell you name of Kobes shoe what colors they come in or anything about them. People feared Jordan not just for his presence but his power and time after time he destroyed his competitors.
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Yeah the kobe Jordan shoe :D ;D
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I was only a fan of basketball during the years that Michael Jordan played. Even though I rooted for the Knicks, once Jordan would come to the Garden, I had no choice but to put my money on good old 23.
Once he retired (and I mean retired, like when he stepped down from playing for the Wizards), I stopped watching Basketball all together. It's as if they started to roll the credits and I had no choice, but to walk out of the theater.
I felt as if Michael Jordan was Basketball's leading actor, the protagonist that always found a way to deliver a happy ending for the fans, regardless of what side you cheered for. He and Phil Jackson were the dream weavers of the NBA. Phil would send out a play and Michael would make it come to life in such a way that would make you want to stop, rewind and take part in the magic once more.
Long live Michael Jordan!
"1"
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I was only a fan of basketball during the years that Michael Jordan played. Even though I rooted for the Knicks, once Jordan would come to the Garden, I had no choice but to put my money on good old 23.
Once he retired (and I mean retired, like when he stepped down from playing for the Wizards), I stopped watching Basketball all together. It's as if they started to roll the credits and I had no choice, but to walk out of the theater.
I felt as if Michael Jordan was Basketball's leading actor, the protagonist that always found a way to deliver a happy ending for the fans, regardless of what side you cheered for. He and Phil Jackson were the dream weavers of the NBA. Phil would send out a play and Michael would make it come to life in such a way that would make you want to stop, rewind and take part in the magic once more.
Long live Michael Jordan!
"1"
Well said. He spoiled watching pro basketball for me for life, it's not the same anymore.
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Saying Kobe wasn't a "complete player" is going a little far don't you think? He's not as good as MJ sure but who is? I doubt spending a year at Duke or wherever would have changed his career much.
Kobe was as complete of a player as there ever was. Scoring, rebounding, assists, defense. He could change his game and play anyway he wanted to play and be the best player on the court. To say that he didn't quite reach the level of MJ is not an insult. He was really close.
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Kobe was as complete of a player as there ever was. Scoring, rebounding, assists, defense. He could change his game and play anyway he wanted to play and be the best player on the court. To say that he didn't quite reach the level of MJ is not an insult. He was really close.
I would say he's the closest thing to MJ that we've seen since MJ. LeBron is a better overall player than Kobe but he's a much different kind of player than Jordan or Kobe.
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kobe is not close to Jordan.
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If I was starting a team I would take Magic Johnson over Jordan or Kobe.
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kobe is not close to Jordan.
In your mind
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I will always love Magic
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kobe is not close to Jordan.
You're letting your personal biases get in the way. Nobody is close to Jordan but Kobe is the closest of his generation easily.
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Jordan
kobe
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In your mind
He isn't close, most players with elite skills can go on memorable scoring streaks in the regular season, it's the playoffs when the defence tightens up and the pressure goes up that it really counts.Remember all those memorable Jordan moments from the playoffs?I do.Remember all those memorable Kobe moments?I don't.Kobe is lucky to have walked onto the richest team in basketball that surrounded him with big man talent through most of his playing career.
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I was only a fan of basketball during the years that Michael Jordan played. Even though I rooted for the Knicks, once Jordan would come to the Garden, I had no choice but to put my money on good old 23.
Once he retired (and I mean retired, like when he stepped down from playing for the Wizards), I stopped watching Basketball all together. It's as if they started to roll the credits and I had no choice, but to walk out of the theater.
I felt as if Michael Jordan was Basketball's leading actor, the protagonist that always found a way to deliver a happy ending for the fans, regardless of what side you cheered for. He and Phil Jackson were the dream weavers of the NBA. Phil would send out a play and Michael would make it come to life in such a way that would make you want to stop, rewind and take part in the magic once more.
Long live Michael Jordan!
"1"
This. I don't think I've watched 2 complete NBA games since his retirement, so I'll be one of the few, who will miss all of King James' career ::).
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Check Mate. Army of one wins.
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I will always love Magic
Game 6, 1980 NBA Finals. 20 year old rookie Magic Johnson.
42 points
15 rebounds
7 assists
No Kareem. Beats Dr J for the title and wins the Finals MVP.
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Game 6, 1980 NBA Finals. 20 year old rookie Magic Johnson.
42 points
15 rebounds
7 assists
No Kareem. Beats Dr J for the title and wins the Finals MVP.
lol Wilks 37 points and 10 rebounds...Magic had help, he didn't do it by himself. Most overrated performance in playoff history.
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I still pick Magic Over kobe
both five rings but Magic could play every spot
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I still pick Magic Over kobe
both five rings but Magic could play every spot
And make everyone around him better...
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yep and make every one gel
not lay bricks past heaven
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Where is Nails?
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He isn't close, most players with elite skills can go on memorable scoring streaks in the regular season, it's the playoffs when the defence tightens up and the pressure goes up that it really counts.Remember all those memorable Jordan moments from the playoffs?I do.Remember all those memorable Kobe moments?I don't.Kobe is lucky to have walked onto the richest team in basketball that surrounded him with big man talent through most of his playing career.
Kobe is very close to Jordan in talent and skill. Their career paths are very different. A lot of variables, timing, teammates, opponents.
Jordan had all those NBA Finals signature moments against mediocre teams. Jordan's teams NEVER played teams in the finals as good as the 2004 Pistons, or the 2008 and 2010 Celtics. He had Seattle, Utah twice, Portland, Phoenix. lol. Even the 91 Lakers had no Pat Riley, no Kareem, no Michael Cooper, also James Worthy and Byron Scott both had leg injuries and weren't 100%. It was basically Magic and Vlade Divac. ;D Basically when the Lakers, Celtics and Pistons dynasties all got old the Bulls finally started to win. lol.
If Kobe's teams played against Jordan's finals opponents he would probably have 7 rings and be the GOAT.
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lol Wilks 37 points and 10 rebounds...Magic had help, he didn't do it by himself. Most overrated performance in playoff history.
Nonsense. As good as Wilkes was he wasn't player that could get his own shot. Magic and Norm Nixon initiated the offense and he shot jumpers and finished on the fast break. You can't downplay the fact that Kareem was out. He was the league MVP that year.
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Kobe is very close to Jordan in talent and skill. Their career paths are very different. A lot of variables, timing, teammates, opponents.
Jordan had all those NBA Finals signature moments against mediocre teams. Jordan's teams NEVER played teams in the finals as good as the 2004 Pistons, or the 2008 and 2010 Celtics. He had Seattle, Utah twice, Portland, Phoenix. lol. Even the 91 Lakers had no Pat Riley, no Kareem, no Michael Cooper, also James Worthy and Byron Scott both had leg injuries and weren't 100%. It was basically Magic and Vlade Divac. ;D Basically when the Lakers, Celtics and Pistons dynasties all got old the Bulls finally started to win. lol.
If Kobe's teams played against Jordan's finals opponents he would probably have 7 rings and be the GOAT.
I doubt it...what happens when Kobe starts throwing up bricks---he keeps doing it until he hits.
Jordan was good on the boards, blocks, and steals. If he didn't have his stroke, he was patient. Kobe is impatient.
I think Kobe would have been schooled. His maturity level throughout his own career has been lacking.
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Nonsense. As good as Wilkes was he wasn't player that could get his own shot. Magic and Norm Nixon initiated the offense and he shot jumpers and finished on the fast break. You can't downplay the fact that Kareem was out. He was the league MVP that year.
Wilks played just as good as Magic that night. Perception was Magic dominated by himself, which was untrue.
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Parker just beat the hell out of the truth
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One on one Jordan would beat the piss out of Kobe if at the same age.
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I doubt it...what happens when Kobe starts throwing up bricks---he keeps doing it until he hits.
Jordan was good on the boards, blocks, and steals. If he didn't have his stroke, he was patient. Kobe is impatient.
I think Kobe would have been schooled. His maturity level throughout his own career has been lacking.
A young Kobe gave Jordan all he could handle when they played against each other. Even though Jordan is "better", there aren't too many players in history that are as skilled and accomplished as Kobe Bryant. That fact get lost because everyone is so preoccupied with comparing him to MJ.
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Only thing Kobe is better than Mike is shooting 3s. Rest Mike owns him...but yes Kobe is great, crazy streaky shooter.
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Only thing Kobe is better than Mike is shooting 3s. Rest Mike owns him...but yes Kobe is great, crazy streaky shooter.
Kobe once hit 12 threes in one NBA game including 9 in a row.
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Jordan > kobe
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Donyell Marshall did it too
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Kobe once hit 12 threes in one NBA game including 9 in a row.
His best game was the 62 points in 3 quarters against Dallas, out scored them too. The 81 point game was forced, jacking up shots against a terrible team.
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I was at the Sports Arena in 1994 when David Robinson put up 71 points against the Clippers
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I saw Jordan play Dominique Wilkins at the Omni in ATL in mid 80s. Spud Webb was playing then too. Dad took me.
8)
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Donyell Marshall did it too
Kobe had 11 threes in only 3 quarters and his shots were much deeper than Marshalls. Some of those were several feet behind the line.
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I saw Jordan play Dominique Wilkins at the Omni in ATL in mid 80s. Spud Webb was playing then too. Dad took me.
8)
I'm jealous
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His best game was the 62 points in 3 quarters against Dallas, out scored them too. The 81 point game was forced, jacking up shots against a terrible team.
The 81 points was a comeback win. The team was playing like shit and down big. Kobe took over and won the game. Anyone who would nitpick an 81 point game is a hater.
From the Urban dictionary:
1. hater
A person that simply cannot be happy for another person's success. So rather than be happy they make a point of exposing a flaw in that person.
Hating, the result of being a hater, is not exactly jealousy. The hater doesn't really want to be the person he or she hates, rather the hater wants to knock someone else down a notch.
Susan: You know, Kevin from accounting is doing very well. He just bought a house in a very nice part of town.
Jane (hater): If he is doing so well why does he drive that '89 Taurus?
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The 81 points was a comeback win. The team was playing like shit and down big. Kobe took over and won the game. Anyone who would nitpick an 81 point game is a hater.
From the Urban dictionary:
1. hater
A person that simply cannot be happy for another person's success. So rather than be happy they make a point of exposing a flaw in that person.
Hating, the result of being a hater, is not exactly jealousy. The hater doesn't really want to be the person he or she hates, rather the hater wants to knock someone else down a notch.
Susan: You know, Kevin from accounting is doing very well. He just bought a house in a very nice part of town.
Jane (hater): If he is doing so well why does he drive that '89 Taurus?
Naw calling it as everyone saw it. Raptors were horrible....
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Naw calling it as everyone saw it. Raptors were horrible....
That's interesting because I watched the tv coverage of that game on almost every sports network and no one said anything like that.
Only on the internet does this kind of bullshit happen. When haters dislike someone they are in a hurry to find fault with that person and downplay their accomplishments.
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Poor Kobe.... :'(
;D
Poor Kobe,meh
I'd say Jackson's takes are spot on
Even w/o Kobe being a rapist Jordan wins
I think lakers get rid of Kobe and take a shot at lebron and he accepts
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That's interesting because I watched the tv coverage of that game on almost every sports network and no one said anything like that.
Only on the internet does this kind of bullshit happen. When haters dislike someone they are in a hurry to find fault with that person and downplay their accomplishments.
Pat Riley wasn't impressed or MJ. They said if someone keep shooting like that, keep fouling him til everyone fouls out.
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Pat Riley wasn't impressed or MJ. They said if someone keep shooting like that, keep fouling him til everyone fouls out.
It wasn't they "weren't impressed" by what Kobe did. They felt that a team shouldn't allow someone to shit on them like that.
Although, Kobe did score 42 in the first half on his way to 55 against Jordan and the Wizards in 2003. lol
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It wasn't they "weren't impressed" by what Kobe did. They felt that a team shouldn't allow someone to shit on them like that.
Although, Kobe did score 42 in the first half on his way to 55 against Jordan and the Wizards in 2003. lol
On Stackhouse not Mike...MJ never guarded him ::) AND Kobe was wearing air Jordans..just trying to be like Mike.
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On Stackhouse not Mike...MJ never guarded him ::) AND Kobe was wearing air Jordans..just trying to be like Mike.
Jordan played in the game why didn't he do something about it? Why didn't they keep fouling him like Jordan said.
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Jordan played in the game why didn't he do something about it? Why didn't they keep fouling him like Jordan said.
Jordan was like 40.... ::)...Kobe won't be able to make a team on that age. Mike had 51 points in a game at the age of 38...lol when was the last time Kobe scored 50?
Jordan better than Kobe #dealwithit
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Jordan was like 40.... ::)...Kobe won't be able to make a team on that age. Mike had 51 points in a game at the age of 38...lol when was the last time Kobe scored 50?
Jordan better than Kobe #dealwithit
The point is that it's easy to talk shit after the fact about what you would have done. When you are in the moment and Kobe is in the process of shitting on you there isn't a lot that you can do about it. Kobe had 47 on April 10th of this year his 17th season.
You are a hater #dealwithit
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A young Kobe gave Jordan all he could handle when they played against each other. Even though Jordan is "better", there aren't too many players in history that are as skilled and accomplished as Kobe Bryant. That fact get lost because everyone is so preoccupied with comparing him to MJ.
A young Kobe gave a worn out Jordan a good show...push came to shove (and a Flu) who would you put money on?
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kobe rape reminded Phil just how much he hated kobe
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He's good, but just like Phil had said, he can spend some nights being a bricklayer, instead of being a defensive foreman. He is not really a leader, he doesn't "command" respect as a leader, like Jordan did.
He seems to implode...
And maybe a 2-4 yrs with coach K at Duke he may have, but Coach K doesn't recruit players like Kobe.
The moronic level in this thread is off the chart even for getbig standards, but saying coach k doesn't recruit players like kobe has to be near the top. Take one fucking guess where kobe has started numerous times he would have went to college had he done so. Coach k recruits the top level of players every year, including the one-and-doners.
Where the fuck do you think their relationship was built when kobe was personally asking k to come coach the Lakers when phil left? And k saying being able to coach kobe would be the only place that he would ever consider leaving Duke. People have so much hate for kobe and love licking the shit out of mj asshole they cant help but post the stupidest, most completely wrong garbage about kobe
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The moronic level in this thread is off the chart even for getbig standards, but saying coach k doesn't recruit players like kobe has to be near the top. Take one fucking guess where kobe has started numerous times he would have went to college had he done so. Coach k recruits the top level of players every year, including the one-and-doners.
Where the fuck do you think their relationship was built when kobe was personally asking k to come coach the Lakers when phil left? And k saying being able to coach kobe would be the only place that he would ever consider leaving Duke. People have so much hate for kobe and love licking the shit out of mj asshole they cant help but post the stupidest, most completely wrong garbage about kobe
You obviously don't realize who coach K recruits. Coach K doesn't recruit ball players that act like they are starring in their own And 1 commercial. He recruits players that are good at being team players, not ones that are "all about me". These players that he recruits also are academically inclined as well.
If you followed Coach K's teams from the Grant Hill ones to now, you will see the type of players coach K recruits. Many are Not the top crop, not the Stars, but are very good, and he can woo them with the fact when they graduate, they have a degree from Duke, which has more cache than say Michigan or Cincinnati or UVA or U of Md.
Kobe being who he is, might have done well at Duke, that is if he learned how to be a team player and a leader. But, who knows, he never went.
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You obviously don't realize who coach K recruits.
He very much tried to recruit Kobe.
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Jesus, I respect Phil as a Coach, but sometime he's really pushing it too far.....he needs to leave Kobe the fuck alone....it's not the first time he has been taking cheap shots at Kobe Bryant.....Retire in peace, Phil.....you won't be coaching LA anytime soon again. just enjoy your life, Dude
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You obviously don't realize who coach K recruits. Coach K doesn't recruit ball players that act like they are starring in their own And 1 commercial. He recruits players that are good at being team players, not ones that are "all about me". These players that he recruits also are academically inclined as well.
If you followed Coach K's teams from the Grant Hill ones to now, you will see the type of players coach K recruits. Many are Not the top crop, not the Stars, but are very good, and he can woo them with the fact when they graduate, they have a degree from Duke, which has more cache than say Michigan or Cincinnati or UVA or U of Md.
Kobe being who he is, might have done well at Duke, that is if he learned how to be a team player and a leader. But, who knows, he never went.
Holy shit you have no fucking clue what you are taking about. K recruited kobe. Its where their relationship began. Kobe loves k. Its why he personally asked k to coach the Lakers. K loves kobe. He said that was the only job that ever made him consider leaving duke because he didn't get the opportunity to coach kobe at duke. K constantly gushes over Kobe in olympic basketball as well. Kobe is also one of the smartest dudes in the nba. Well above average even for duke basketball standards. But here's a little clue for you, Duke basketball players don't have to meet the admission standards of the average duke student. I seriously hope you didn't think otherwise.
And lolololol at your stupidity if you think k doesn't recruit top level stars. Duke is a top 10 recruiting class every single year. How the fuck do they stay so high in recruiting rankings if he isn't recruiting star level talent?
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Jordan 10 Scoring Titles
kobe 02
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Watched Jordan score 46 at the spectrum
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Watched Jordan score 46 at the spectrum
And Chick at the Mirage?
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Jordan
30.1
49.7
50 point games
scoring titles
steals per game
blocks per game
1st team all defensive team
defensive player of the year
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http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2013/1/11/3864814/kobe-bryant-is-ruining-kobe-bryants-historic-season
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Holy shit you have no fucking clue what you are taking about. K recruited kobe. Its where their relationship began. Kobe loves k. Its why he personally asked k to coach the Lakers. K loves kobe. He said that was the only job that ever made him consider leaving duke because he didn't get the opportunity to coach kobe at duke. K constantly gushes over Kobe in olympic basketball as well. Kobe is also one of the smartest dudes in the nba. Well above average even for duke basketball standards. But here's a little clue for you, Duke basketball players don't have to meet the admission standards of the average duke student. I seriously hope you didn't think otherwise.
And lolololol at your stupidity if you think k doesn't recruit top level stars. Duke is a top 10 recruiting class every single year. How the fuck do they stay so high in recruiting rankings if he isn't recruiting star level talent?
Olympic ball and College ball are two different things...
Plus, name 1 dude that came out of Duke other than Grant Hill that actually did well in the pros. Not L man, or Batty...pretty much nobody else. Duke recruits players that work well as a team, not Super stars.
I've followed Duke and the ACC since duke won over UNLV,
About the only dude who had the biggest hype other than Hill and Huley was Jason Williams.
Wojo, from Maryland, he is doing well NOT playing ball.
As I said, the Degree from Duke will carry most of the players farther than than many of them would get in playing ball, and that is the cache of Duke.
As far as Coach K recruiting Kobe, I wouldn't know, but Coach K being him, would have probably done so.
And as far as Kobe loving Coach K, well he is Effing Coach K, he Garners respect. Damn near every player respects Coach K! He is today's Dean Smith.
Please...
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Olympic ball and College ball are two different things...
Plus, name 1 dude that came out of Duke other than Grant Hill that actually did well in the pros. Not L man, or Batty...pretty much nobody else. Duke recruits players that work well as a team, not Super stars.
I've followed Duke and the ACC since duke won over UNLV,
About the only dude who had the biggest hype other than Hill and Huley was Jason Williams.
Wojo, from Maryland, he is doing well NOT playing ball.
As I said, the Degree from Duke will carry most of the players farther than than many of them would get in playing ball, and that is the cache of Duke.
As far as Coach K recruiting Kobe, I wouldn't know, but Coach K being him, would have probably done so.
And as far as Kobe loving Coach K, well he is Effing Coach K, he Garners respect. Damn near every player respects Coach K! He is today's Dean Smith.
Please...
First you said coach k wouldn't recruit someone like kobe. Now you say you wouldn't know, but k probably would have done so.
Just admit you don't know what the fuck you are talking about and you hoped no one would call you out on you bullshit.
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You're letting your personal biases get in the way. Nobody is close to Jordan but Kobe is the closest of his generation easily.
This. Kobe is a great player, and one of the top ten ever. Not being as good as Jordan doesnt change that. As far as off the court personality....i can virtually guarantee I'll never be hanging out with Kobe Bryant so who gives a shit.
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Kobe's response to Phil's critique...
http://www.foxsportswest.com/fox-sports-networks/story/Kobe-responds-to-Phil-Jackons-critique-i?blockID=903273&feedID=3707
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Olympic ball and College ball are two different things...
Plus, name 1 dude that came out of Duke other than Grant Hill that actually did well in the pros. Not L man, or Batty...pretty much nobody else. Duke recruits players that work well as a team, not Super stars.
I've followed Duke and the ACC since duke won over UNLV,
About the only dude who had the biggest hype other than Hill and Huley was Jason Williams.
Wojo, from Maryland, he is doing well NOT playing ball.
As I said, the Degree from Duke will carry most of the players farther than than many of them would get in playing ball, and that is the cache of Duke.
As far as Coach K recruiting Kobe, I wouldn't know, but Coach K being him, would have probably done so.
And as far as Kobe loving Coach K, well he is Effing Coach K, he Garners respect. Damn near every player respects Coach K! He is today's Dean Smith.
Please...
That's great except you just said "Coach K wouldn't recruit Kobe"
Parker strikes again.
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Kobe's response to Phil's critique...
http://www.foxsportswest.com/fox-sports-networks/story/Kobe-responds-to-Phil-Jackons-critique-i?blockID=903273&feedID=3707
???
Jordan wouldn't have allowed Shaq to touch the ball in the last 5 mins to keep him off the foul line. As far as centers, Shaq is an upgrade over Longley, Bill Wellington and Cartwright ???
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First you said coach k wouldn't recruit someone like kobe. Now you say you wouldn't know, but k probably would have done so.
Just admit you don't know what the fuck you are talking about and you hoped no one would call you out on you bullshit.
I'll admit that I don't know whether Coach K tried to recruit Kobe, but other than that, it's you who doesn't know what you are talking about. Kobe is NOT and never will be a true leader, he is a selfish prick, who cannot see the bigger picture, he never learned to, and quite frankly, I believe he doesn't care to. This was set before he became a pro, could Coach K have reset that, we don't know.
As it stands, Duke recruits and gets players that do well as a team, not players who want to be the whole team themselves, or want to do the 1 and done thing. Many of those players are legit scholar-athletes.
You think Wojo was stupid in HS, think again? Grant Hill? Please, Coack K banks on Duke's titles and Duke's reputation as a school to bring the players in. That piece of paper when they graduate often times takes those players who are not NBA material a lot farther than graduating from other schools.
And since the only thing you can harp on is one part, obviously, you don't know what you are talking about.
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I'll admit that I don't know whether Coach K tried to recruit Kobe, but other than that, it's you who doesn't know what you are talking about. Kobe is NOT and never will be a true leader, he is a selfish prick, who cannot see the bigger picture, he never learned to, and quite frankly, I believe he doesn't care to. This was set before he became a pro, could Coach K have reset that, we don't know.
As it stands, Duke recruits and gets players that do well as a team, not players who want to be the whole team themselves, or want to do the 1 and done thing. Many of those players are legit scholar-athletes.
You think Wojo was stupid in HS, think again? Grant Hill? Please, Coack K banks on Duke's titles and Duke's reputation as a school to bring the players in. That piece of paper when they graduate often times takes those players who are not NBA material a lot farther than graduating from other schools.
And since the only thing you can harp on is one part, obviously, you don't know what you are talking about.
Is it impossible for you to admit when you are wrong ? Fucking walls of text that have jack shit to do with your original statement.
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Is it impossible for you to admit when you are wrong ? Fucking walls of text that have jack shit to do with your original statement.
I just did...
Read the first statement. I said I was wrong.
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I just did...
Read the first statement. I said I was wrong.
Cool. I'm not the freaking getbig police...but IMO this site would be much more chill and civilized if people could actually say "you make a valid point"....."well shut my mouth".etc, and just move on to the next. Watching people argue to the death over nothing is the most pathetic aspect of this site IMO
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Cool. I'm not the freaking getbig police...but IMO this site would be much more chill and civilized if people could actually say "you make a valid point"....."well shut my mouth".etc, and just move on to the next. Watching people argue to the death over nothing is the most pathetic aspect of this site IMO
True. As I get older, the lamer many of the shit seems to be. And in retrospect, what eff am I arguing about anyways?
Sometimes, I want to do a Kiwiol.
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Olympic ball and College ball are two different things...
Plus, name 1 dude that came out of Duke other than Grant Hill that actually did well in the pros. Not L man, or Batty...pretty much nobody else. Duke recruits players that work well as a team, not Super stars.
Oh come on, the "Duke players can't make it in the pros" thing is way outdated.
Carlos Boozer, 2x All-Star, career 16.9 ppg
Elton Brand, RoY and 2x All-Star, career 17.4 ppg
Luol Deng, 2x All-Star, career 16.0 ppg
Kyrie Irving, RoY, career 20.6 ppg, maybe the best young player in the league
Corey Maggette, career 16.0 ppg
All good NBA players. Redick has been a solid but unspectacular pro, same for Battier. So was Laettner for that matter.
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Irving will be the best point guard in 2 years.
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Irving will be the best point guard in 2 years.
Curry will be better
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now everyone knows kobe is toast... let's start subtly hate on him behind his back haha.
lol at pjax finally saying what he thinks when nobody expects it, he has his way to backstab someone deep in the spinal cord out of the blue and when he's down haha. Clearly pjax and mj are, were, tougher than kobe. Kobe has always been a nerd coming from a dysfunctional family, never been a real adult, man, always been childish / introverted / egocentrical. Still, he was the best after MJ, and before lebron.
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Curry will be better
Curry is always hurt, I wouldn't bet on it.
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now everyone knows kobe is toast... let's start subtly hate on him behind his back haha.
lol at pjax finally saying what he thinks when nobody expects it, he has his way to backstab someone deep in the spinal cord out of the blue and when he's down haha. Clearly pjax and mj are, were, tougher than kobe. Kobe has always been a nerd coming from a dysfunctional family, never been a real adult, man, always been childish / introverted / egocentrical. Still, he was the best after MJ, and before lebron.
Greetings Uberman, hope all is well. I've been studying my Bible hard this year. I hope you have and I hope you keep preaching the lord's word but remember your racism, (especially against so called African-Americans aka Hebrews ((If you are a follower of Christ as you claim, you'll know that he and his people were in fact what we know as African-Americans. If you do know this and still behave in this blasphemous manner, then I don't have to tell you what happens next.)) and judgement of people is against Yahweh's (God) word. Just felt the need to remind you that my Christian brother. Keep the faith.
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As far as centers, Shaq is an upgrade over Longley, Bill Wellington and Cartwright
and Will Perdue
Boom!
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http://www.foxsportswest.com/fox-sports-networks/story/Kobe-responds-to-Phil-Jackons-critique-i?blockID=903273&feedID=3707
What is she smoking?
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Kobe gets a bum rap with the Jordan.comparison. Nope, he ain't Jordan...but he's in the discussion, which is more than you can say about anyone else who has played in the league in the last 15 years except Lebron...who is still writing his legacy.
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Kobe gets a bum rap with the Jordan.comparison. Nope, he ain't Jordan...but he's in the discussion, which is more than you can say about anyone else who has played in the league in the last 15 years except Lebron...who is still writing his legacy.
Exactly. Arce is disparaging Kobe because he's a drama queen and wants to act like he knows him personally when any rational fan knows that Kobe's at the top of the conversation for best player of the last 15 years. Parker is just being obtuse.
The ONLY players whose careers have overlapped substantially with Kobe's and are in the conversion with him are Shaq, who I love but he was not a complete player, and LeBron, who is pretty clearly better than Kobe and might even be better than MJ but their primes have not really overlapped so hard to compare them.
Any criticism of Kobe's 81-point game is absurd. The man scored EIGHTY-ONE POINTS in a game, that's a ridiculously impressive feat. How many players in the NBA or even in NBA history could do that against an NBA defense even if you just let them shoot all game long? It's happened twice ever. Jordan was given the green light to go for it in the last game of the '97 season and couldn't do it (he was 34 years old by then though). Even Wilt had to hit a bajillion free throws to do it which was highly unusual for him. He also did it against the Knicks who were one of the worst teams in the league at the time so the criticism that Kobe did it against Toronto is invalid.
LeBron vs. Jordan is the better question in my opinion. I'll take MJ but I'm an old curmudgeon who grew up with his heroics.
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I love the part where Phil called kobe a human pile of shit because he raped that white chick in colorado
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Cool. I'm not the freaking getbig police...but IMO this site would be much more chill and civilized if people could actually say "you make a valid point"....."well shut my mouth".etc, and just move on to the next. Watching people argue to the death over nothing is the most pathetic aspect of this site IMO
Wise words from the big armed geezer :D
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I love the part where Phil called kobe a human pile of shit because he raped that white chick in colorado
he didnt rape or attempted to rape her, it was a setup she wanted to trap him and we all know it. Still he s a cheater.
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I love the part where Phil called kobe a human pile of shit because he raped that white chick in colorado
I wonder what he thinks of Ben Roethlisberger since he was guilty x 2, actually. No setups with this dude, buddy
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Olympic ball and College ball are two different things...
Plus, name 1 dude that came out of Duke other than Grant Hill that actually did well in the pros. Not L man, or Batty...pretty much nobody else. Duke recruits players that work well as a team, not Super stars.
I've followed Duke and the ACC since duke won over UNLV,
About the only dude who had the biggest hype other than Hill and Huley was Jason Williams.
Wojo, from Maryland, he is doing well NOT playing ball.
As I said, the Degree from Duke will carry most of the players farther than than many of them would get in playing ball, and that is the cache of Duke.
As far as Coach K recruiting Kobe, I wouldn't know, but Coach K being him, would have probably done so.
And as far as Kobe loving Coach K, well he is Effing Coach K, he Garners respect. Damn near every player respects Coach K! He is today's Dean Smith.
Please...
Danny Ferry and Christian laetner were great in the nba and thomas hill
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Danny Ferry and Christian laetner were great in the nba and thomas hill
All great players, Thomas was best. However Jordan would beat the piss out of them.
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(http://www.kshof.net/si/westphal80.jpg)
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(http://www.kshof.net/si/westphal80.jpg)
What's his exact location looks like a fag, probably needs a good choking.
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http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/jacksonbookexcerpt130519/nba-eleven-rings-phil-jackson
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Kobe Bryant and the Triangle
Updated: May 19th, 2013, 4:17 PM ET
By Phil Jackson | Special to ESPN.com
Phil Jackson and Kobe Bryant won five titles together in L.A., but weren't always on the same page.
Phil Jackson had already won six NBA championships as a coach when he arrived in Los Angeles, inheriting a team with stars Shaquille O'Neal and Kobe Bryant. Jackson's plan for dealing with his two stars was derailed early on when Bryant suffered a broken hand in the preseason. In this excerpt from his new book, "Eleven Rings: The Soul of Success" -- available May 21 from Penguin Press -- Jackson explains how Bryant was like no other player he ever coached, and how he dealt with the challenges the young star presented in the 1999-2000 season.
If children are fated to live out the unfulfilled dreams of their parents, Kobe was a textbook case. His father, Joe "Jellybean" Bryant, was a six-nine forward for the legendary 1970s Philadelphia 76ers. Bryant Sr. once claimed that he played the same kind of game as Magic Johnson, but the NBA wasn't ready for his playground style.
So after stints with two other teams, he finished his career in Italy, where Kobe grew up.
The youngest of three children (and the only boy), Kobe was the golden child in the family who could do no wrong. He was a bright, talented overachiever with a natural gift for the game. He spent long hours practicing, imitating the moves of Jordan and others he studied on tapes his relatives sent from the United States. When he was thirteen, the family moved back to Philadelphia, and he soon developed into a star at Lower Merion High School. John Lucas, then head coach of the 76ers, invited Kobe to scrimmage with the team over the summer and was surprised by the young player's courage and level of skill. Not long afterward, Kobe decided to forgo college and jump right into the pros, even though he had high enough SAT scores to take his pick of schools. Jerry West said Kobe's pre-draft workout at age seventeen was the best he'd ever seen. Jerry made a trade with the Hornets to draft Kobe thirteenth overall in 1996 -- the same year he lured Shaq away from Orlando with a seven-year, $120 million free-agent deal.
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Kobe had big dreams. Soon after I started with the Lakers, Jerry called me into his office to report that Kobe had asked him how he had averaged 30-plus points a game when his teammate, Elgin Baylor, was also scoring 30-plus points per game. Kobe was hell-bent on surpassing Jordan as the greatest player in the game.
His obsession with Michael was striking. Not only had he mastered many of Jordan's moves, but he affected many of M.J.'s mannerisms as well. When we played in Chicago that season, I orchestrated a meeting between the two stars, thinking that Michael might help shift Kobe's attitude toward selfless teamwork. After they shook hands, the first words out of Kobe's mouth were "You know I can kick your ass one on one."
I admired Kobe's ambition. But I also felt that he needed to break out of his protective chrysalis if he wanted to win the ten rings he told his teammates he was shooting for. Obviously, basketball isn't an individual sport. To achieve greatness, you must rely on the good offices of others. But Kobe had yet to reach out to his teammates and try to get to know them. Instead of spending time with them after games, he usually went back to his hotel room to study tapes or chat with his high-school friends on the phone.
Kobe was also a stubborn, hardheaded learner. He was so confident in his ability that you couldn't simply point out his mistakes and expect him to alter his behavior. He would have to experience failure directly before his resistance would start to break down. It was often an excruciating process for him and everyone else involved. Then suddenly he would have an aha moment and figure out a way to change.
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One of those moments happened in early February. That's when the team was struck by a puzzling malaise. After a less-than-stellar performance, I closed the locker room to all but the players and asked what had happened to cause them to suddenly stop playing together. It was a rhetorical question, but I let them know we'd take it up the following day after practice. We gathered in a small video room at Southwest Los Angeles Community College -- our temporary practice space. There were four rows of five chairs, and in the first row sat Shaq, Fox, Fish, Harp, and Shaw. Kobe was in the last row with his hoodie pulled over his head. I reviewed the demands that the triangle offense placed on each team member, then concluded: "You can't be a selfish player and make this offense work for the team's good. Period." When I opened the floor to comments, there was complete silence, and I was about to adjourn the meeting when Shaq spoke up. He got right to the point, saying, "I think Kobe is playing too selfishly for us to win." That got everyone fired up. Some of the players nodded in support of Shaq, including Rick Fox, who said, "How many times have we been through this?" No one in that room came to Kobe's defense. I asked him if he had anything to say. Kobe finally addressed the group, and in a calm, quiet voice he said he cared about everyone and just wanted to be part of a winning team.
I wasn't pleased with the meeting. I worried that having everyone's complaints on the table without any resolution would have a negative effect on team harmony. In the days that followed, we lost four out of five games, including a 105-81 "massacre" by the Spurs in the Alamodome. One night that week I had a dream about spanking Kobe and giving Shaq a smack. "Shaq needs and Kobe wants -- the mystery of the Lakers," I wrote in my journal.
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The players started blaming one another for the breakdown, and I realized that I had to address the unrest head-on. The first thing I did was meet Shaq for breakfast to discuss what it means to be a leader. I started by relating the story of how Michael galvanized the Bulls with his confidence in himself and his teammates before the must-win game 5 against Cleveland in the 1989 playoffs. The Cavaliers had just beaten us at home to tie the series, and Michael had had an off night. Still, that didn't faze him. His uncompromising faith revved up the team, and we won the final game -- not surprisingly, on a last-second miracle shot by Jordan.
I told Shaq he needed to find his own way to inspire the Lakers. He needed to express his confidence and natural joy for the game in such a way that his teammates -- Kobe especially -- felt that if they joined forces with him, nothing would be impossible. A team leader's number one job, I explained, was to build up his teammates, not tear them down. Shaq had probably heard this kind of spiel before, but this time I think it clicked.
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With Kobe I took a different tack. I tried to be as direct as possible and show him in front of the other players how his selfish mistakes were hurting the team. During one film session, I said, "Now I know why the guys don't like playing with you. You've got to play together." I also indicated to him that if he didn't want to share the ball with his teammates, I would gladly work out a trade for him. I had no trouble being the bad cop in this situation. (See under: Sometimes you have to pull out the big stick.) I knew [Ron] Harper would soften the blow later by explaining to Kobe -- in far less strident terms -- how to play more selflessly without sacrificing his creativity.
I also talked to Kobe about what it takes to be a leader. At one point I told him, "I guess you'd like to be the captain of this team someday when you're older -- maybe like twenty-five." He replied that he wanted to be captain tomorrow. To which I said, "You can't be captain if nobody follows you."
Eventually it sank in. Kobe began looking for ways to fit himself into the system and play more collaboratively. He also made an effort to socialize more with his teammates, especially when we were on the road. And after the All-Star break, everything started to come together. We went on a 27-1 streak and finished the season with the best record in the league, 67-15.
The players seemed relieved that we'd put to sleep a problem that had haunted the team for the past three years. As Rick Fox put it, Kobe's me-first attitude "was a land mine that was about to explode. We all knew that somebody had to step on it, but nobody wanted to. So Phil did it, and we all walk a lot more freely now."
Excerpted from "Eleven Rings: The Soul of Success" by Phil Jackson and Hugh Delehanty.
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Good stuff Arce. Sounds like an interesting read.
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You're letting your personal biases get in the way. Nobody is close to Jordan but Kobe is the closest of his generation easily.
Didn't Kobe play for like 2 generations?