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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Training Q&A => Topic started by: Guest on January 31, 2004, 11:14:36 AM
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Cardio
Some people say cardio is not neccassary cause you can just eat less food and skip the cardio, well there is more to cardio than burning calories during it, actually burning calories during it has little to nothing to do with the change in your phsiuqe, the fat burning benefits you get from cardio are hormones that are secreted during and after cardio that elevates your metabolism to burn fat while your resting, and prevent food from accumulating into fat.
It's important to remember that cardio is an important tool that you do which prevents food from accumulating on your body as both fat and muscle, but you can still gain muscle depending on other hormones such as testosterone, and how much of the thyroid hormone T3 is being produced in your body (see thyroid section at ???? for more info on thyroid hormones), cause T3 eats away at fat and more muscle than other thyroid hormones. Later ill explain how to get more T2 rather than T3 from cardio, since T2 preserves muscle more than T3. The point of being able to eat more without it having to turn into bodyfat, will result in a faster metabolism. Your body will simply use the food as energy, turn some into glycogen, then most of it will actually get "wasted", yep, not excreted, your metabolism will simply waste the calories, cause it has no use for them, and in turn in will increase your metabolism, cause your metabolim HAS to increase to waste the calories.
The Hormonal response to cardio
The main hormone secreted when doing cardio is GH, secondly TSH (thyroid Stimulating Hormone). The more intense you do it the more of those hormones will get secreted. The point of these hormones is to help your body adapt to the physical stress your doing (cardio), your body does everything in its power to keep your body from getting heavier, which involves preventing food from accumulating on your body as fat and muscle. If you regulary do intense cardio (at least twice a week) for only even like 15 minutes, that is generally enough to keep anything you eat from acummulating on your body. Yes, you can eat all the pizza, cake, pie, tons of calories whatever you want, and you most likely wont gain weight or extremely slowly at the least, your body looks at this as a threat to your survival of the surroudings of your environment. But keep in mind in order for this non-accumulating of food to occur, you must push your self as hard as you can with your cardio workouts.
Long, moderate intensity cardio raises the following hormones: GH, TSH, T3, cortisol, Some T2. note: T3 and cortisol eat away at both fat and muscle
Short, high intensity cardio raises the following hormones: GH, TSH, T2, and some T3. note:T2 preserves more muscle than T3.
Long, low intensity cardio raises the following hormones: generally little to none at all.
The best way to increase your metabolism is a combination of doing intense cardio, and eating tons of calories all through out the day. Eating plenty of food helps your body adapt to its environment better, and in the case of cardio, it will help you lose fat. This is the key to getting that lean small look.
What kind of cardio should i do?
Now here's something interesting to note, do you think walking as a form of a cardio workout is a threat to your survival and that your body will prevent all incoming food from accumulating on your body? I don't think so, unless walking for you is difficult and intense to do. It's important to keep in mind that most of your calories you burn in a day is not directly from the activities that you do but rather your metabolism which is created from the activities that you do. In other words, changes to your physique are due to your metabolism and not burning calories during physical activities. The only time your changing your physique from burning calories from physical activites is when your starving yourself (this is actually done by the last week or so of a bodybuilder preparing for a contest, trying to get totally shredded, but they are losing muscle at the same time with this process). Remember, burning fat during cardio is not the real fat loss benefits you get from cardio, its all about adaptations to your environment, and this is all done by hormones.
Now putting this info together its easy to say that short intense cardio workouts is so much superior to longer less intense cardio. It enables you to lose fat and keep you from getting fatter, while allowing you to preserve more muscle than longer durations.
Another interesting comparison is looking at distance runners verses sprinters. Notice how distance runners are generally a lot skinnier with less muscle than sprinters who have a lot more muscle with still the same low amount of body fat? It's because of too much T3 and cortisol eating away at everything their body has so they get very light, so that the stress of running long distances is reduced greatly.
As far as what kind of cardio is better than the other (such as swimming, running, jump ropping, hiking, dancing, etc.., there is none! It's usually good to do different ones every now and then for a change of stress, which equates to more GH output.
how much cardio should i do?
Keeping in mind the more short and intense the better, it's good to mix up your cardio workouts, if running is the type of cardio you like doing then, say, do interval training one day, and do a 10 minute fast run another day etc..
Generally you don't have to do cardio every day to keep the hormones flowing, your body still releases hormones from a workout days after a workout and sometimes weeks, months, years, and/or decades after depending on how long of your life you've been doing cardio or whatever workout (this is discussed more in chapter XXX). I'd say do at least one cardio workout a week no matter what your goal is (gaining muscle or losing fat), but if your goal is to lose fat i'd probably do about 2 to 3 cardio workouts a week, that's it. I'd say if your a begginer do 3 a week, someone who has been doing cardio for a long time, it would not hurt to switch to only 1 or 2 a week, this is because of the long term hormonal effect of exercise (this is explained in more detail in chapter XXX). People who do cardio almost everyday (especially for longer durations), are wasting thier time! If Someone's goal is to gain muscle, they would probably only want to do 0 to 2 cardio sessions a week, doing only a few short sprints, usually only like two 15 - 30 second sprints. that's it. If you allready have an extremely fast metabolism i'd do no cardio at all if your trying to gain muscle.
Why NOT do the same "fat burning phase" cardio sessions with your gaining muscle phases? Cause like i said, this will stop you from gaining muscle along with fat. Your goal during the gaining muscle phase is to slow your metabolism down a bit so you can gain muscle. Doing cardio will prevent this. But, like i said, short sprints will not hinder muscle mass gains, while keeping your fat in check as best as possible.
At what time of the day should i do cardio?
Anytime you feel you have the highest amount of intensity to do it, after at least your first meal of the day, and that insulin is settled down a bit (this is done by not eating a high carb meal before the workout and that you've waited at least an hour after eating to do it.) The reason why you don't want so much insulin in your bloodstream while your working out is because insulin prevents GH from being secreted.
Most People will say first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, reason being is because your body is short on glycogen supply and will take only fat for fuel for the workout. This is nonsense. The point of doing cardio is alterating your internal hormonal environment that increases your metabolism, not burning fat during the workout. There are several important reasons why you should not do cardio first thing in the morning. One, you are more prone to injury, you just woke up from a 6+ hours of sleeping, your body needs warming up before doing intense exercise. Two, your intensity will be decreased, which is extremely important for a good hormonal excreting cardio workout. Three, when you wake up in the morning the hormone cortisol is raised which is the "main" catobolic hormone, which goes away after eating breakfast. Breakfast jumpstarts your metabolism for the day, skipping breakfast and doing cardio instead raises catobolic hormones even more and slows your metabolism, which is a good formula for losing muscle and gaining fat!
How do I combine my cardio workouts with my weight workouts?
Although it's better to do cardio and weights on seperate days. When doing both on the same day do resistance exercise first (but a 5 minute aerobic warm-up is beneficial before weight training to get the blood pumping). It's more important to preserve your strength, energy, and intensity for the weight training part of your workout, because intensity is more critical to weight training than to cardio training.
Although you can do two seperate workouts during the day, doing cardio earlier in the day, then do resistance later on in the day, making sure you have several meals inbetween that time. But if your doing them all in one workout, do resistance first, then cardio.
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Yes, i believe you're right about all of this. No wonder i didnt loose any fat during my cardio sessions of 2 hours on an empty stomack.
Thans a lot bro.
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Cardio
Your body will simply use the food as energy, turn some into glycogen, then most of it will actually get "wasted", yep, not excreted, your metabolism will simply waste the calories, cause it has no use for them, and in turn in will increase your metabolism, cause your metabolim HAS to increase to waste the calories.
**Turns to adipose (FAT), not "wasted"
The Hormonal response to cardio
If you regulary do intense cardio (at least twice a week) for only even like 15 minutes, that is generally enough to keep anything you eat from acummulating on your body. Yes, you can eat all the pizza, cake, pie, tons of calories whatever you want, and you most likely wont gain weight or extremely slowly at the least, your body looks at this as a threat to your survival of the surroudings of your environment. But keep in mind in order for this non-accumulating of food to occur, you must push your self as hard as you can with your cardio workouts.
**I don't think so...eat all you want, do a couple 15 minute sessions of cardio??
The best way to increase your metabolism is a combination of doing intense cardio, and eating tons of calories all through out the day. Eating plenty of food helps your body adapt to its environment better, and in the case of cardio, it will help you lose fat. This is the key to getting that lean small look.
**the best way to increase metabolism is to incorporate resistance exercises
Generally you don't have to do cardio every day to keep the hormones flowing, your body still releases hormones from a workout days after a workout and sometimes weeks, months, years, and/or decades after depending on how long of your life you've been doing cardio or whatever workout (this is discussed more in chapter XXX).
**Aerobic activity only elevates the metabolism for a couple hours, unlike resistance training, which raises it for up to a couple days.
Although it's better to do cardio and weights on seperate days. When doing both on the same day do resistance exercise first (but a 5 minute aerobic warm-up is beneficial before weight training to get the blood pumping). It's more important to preserve your strength, energy, and intensity for the weight training part of your workout, because intensity is more critical to weight training than to cardio training.
**now that I agree with!
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gijoe, tell me then what can i do to loose fat and keep all the muscle. give an example, its getting confusing.
ciao
r'dam-boy
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gijoe, tell me then what can i do to loose fat and keep all the muscle. give an example, its getting confusing.
ciao
r'dam-boy
The simplest thing is to cut back by 500 calories a day from maintenance (usually 10-12 calories X Bodyweight) and incorporate whichever type of cardio you prefer for 3-5 days a week. Keep the protein high, carbs low to moderate, and don't take in any extra fat except that which apperas in the protein sources (except maybe some EFA's). Keep the foods clean, like chicken, lean beef, fish, oatmeal, yams, fibrous veggies, etc...Don't lose more than 1-2 lbs per week, or it may be muscle. If you aren't losing weight, drop some extra calories until you find your groove. Hope that help, I am sure the other fine patrons of the training site can give some awesome input as well.
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The simplest thing is to cut back by 500 calories a day from maintenance (usually 10-12 calories X Bodyweight) and incorporate whichever type of cardio you prefer for 3-5 days a week. Keep the protein high, carbs low to moderate, and don't take in any extra fat except that which apperas in the protein sources (except maybe some EFA's). Keep the foods clean, like chicken, lean beef, fish, oatmeal, yams, fibrous veggies, etc...Don't lose more than 1-2 lbs per week, or it may be muscle. If you aren't losing weight, drop some extra calories until you find your groove. Hope that help, I am sure the other fine patrons of the training site can give some awesome input as well.
Sounds like something I wouldve said ;D
Cardio is very much an individual thing..your body type is going to dictate how much cardio you need to do. What works for some will not work for others. Some can get away with next to none and others have to do it up to 3 hours per day precontest.
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Yeah , but what about that hormone raising-routine of sprints, that gay said?? That its useless doing mutch cardio like 2 hours, then you loose muscle also. You think thats bullshit??
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Yeah , but what about that hormone raising-routine of sprints, that gay said?? That its useless doing mutch cardio like 2 hours, then you loose muscle also. You think thats bullshit??
Sprints are just interval training, plain and simple. I think no more than an hour should be good for MOST people, there are always exceptions. That full hour shouldn't be at full intensity either, or you will lose muscle.
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I got a Hometrainer at home, i used to ride it for 2 hours every other day, it didnt word i lost a lot of muscle also. Now im gonna start 30 min. each day, with 20 min slow riding, and 10 min fast (interval training). I eat a lot these couple of months, and im growing over night. I used to always train hard, but i never did eat enough how i supposed to. Such a fool i was. So im bulking now, and with that 30 min a day i hope to loose some fat you know, and keep on growing like i do right now. Is it possible?? I eat a lot of FIsh, meat, and pasta also a lots of fruitjuice with sugars and coca-cola. I need that caffeine before a workout bro.
So 30 min a day should be enough??
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My cardio consists of 15 minutes total, 3 to 4 times a week. 4 minutes warm up on treadmill, bust out a 40 second sprint, rest a minute at a 5.0 speed, bust out 30 second sprint, rest another minute at the 5.0 speed, repeat till I hit 12 minutes, then do a 3 minute cool down pace. I usually set it at 2% incline. Does wonders for me and I dont feel like Im spending all day on the treadmill.
But thats just me..
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Hi,
the cardio which you discuss here is only for at burning, right?
What about long-time cardio with low intense? 3x60min. ?
For your heart? Does this help or disturb musclegrowing with the right calories?
sorry, for my bad english...
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Hi,
the cardio which you discuss here is only for at burning, right?
What about long-time cardio with low intense? 3x60min. ?
For your heart? Does this help or disturb musclegrowing with the right calories?
sorry, for my bad english...
First of all, your English is just fine.
High Intensity Interval Training benefits the overall fitness a lot. You will get conditioned, and increase your all around wellness.
I highly recommend it.
Walks I only do when I feel like it. They can be beneficial as active recovery, ie speed up your recovery from heavy training. The increased body temperature and blood flow is beneficial.
Other types of active recovery includes:
Swimming (Lowtempo)
Sauna
Tanning
Skating (Lowtempo)
Biking (Lowtempo)
YIP
Zack
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At what time of the day should i do cardio?
Anytime you feel you have the highest amount of intensity to do it, after at least your first meal of the day, and that insulin is settled down a bit (this is done by not eating a high carb meal before the workout and that you've waited at least an hour after eating to do it.) The reason why you don't want so much insulin in your bloodstream while your working out is because insulin prevents GH from being secreted.
What is a considered high carb?
::)
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Hi,
the cardio which you discuss here is only for at burning, right?
What about long-time cardio with low intense? 3x60min. ?
For your heart? Does this help or disturb musclegrowing with the right calories?
sorry, for my bad english...
First of all, your English is just fine.
High Intensity Interval Training benefits the overall fitness a lot. You will get conditioned, and increase your all around wellness.
I highly recommend it.
Walks I only do when I feel like it. They can be beneficial as active recovery, ie speed up your recovery from heavy training. The increased body temperature and blood flow is beneficial.
Other types of active recovery includes:
Swimming (Lowtempo)
Sauna
Tanning
Skating (Lowtempo)
Biking (Lowtempo)
YIP
Zack
Hi,
but do you recommend high intense cardio even when the goal is not to burn fat but gaining mass?
I think high intense cardio may not good for an ectomorph guy, because he needs natural a lot of food and with high intense cardio his metabolism will explode?!
What do you recommend for an HST-Trainee, which trains 3 time a week?
Addional 2 HIIT Sessions? Wouldn't that lead to overtrain?
Hope you can understand my posting and you'll answer me... ;)
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Helpful yes, but you can throw all these guidelines out the window if you're on roids.
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Just to throw my thoughts into the mix.
I decided to lean up a little a couple of months ago. And all I've done is backed off the carbs a bit, drinking more water and eating really clean. Seems to be working. Although its going to take longer than if I included cardio but it should help me keep all my size and hopefully I can keep growing.
Anyone else do this?
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I throw in a few light cardio sessions after some workouts but generally I just eat clean, all of my carbs pw or from veggies (except breakfast) and I have been losing fat at a nice pace. Just be patient. I'm am purely endomorphic too and this has worked better than running 6 days a week.
Also, my workouts are pretty intense and heavy so I don't need all that cardio.
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i dunno i run at least 30 miles a week and i don't think my bf has been over 10% since... well ever!
but on the down side its hard to keep size on with that much running.
its like they say, if you want big muscles you gotta lift big weights and if you want to be fast you gotta go run fast.
its all about trade offs and choices
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Yeah, that's more marathoning than cardio. But hey, whatever works.
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No, this is how you lose weight, fewer cals,lift heavy, clen, eca.bi fool.
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One good form of cardio that is joint friendly if you have some decent mass/wt os walking fast on a high % incline on the treadmill. Set the ol' treadmill on 10-15% and walk from 3.5 to 4.0 mph and that should do it uo right. Howard
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Wqsaz, if you wanna know what high carbs are.. go out and buy a carb counter book. Atkins makes a great one.. and you dont have to follow his exact guidelines. Its a great way to understand what is good and bad carbs, and what amounts of food give you in carbs. I had to really change my eating habbits to cut down on alot of UNKNOWN carbs. Just 1 piece of fruit and id be almost at my max carb intake for the day.
The books are cheap , and might save you alot of headaches. Youll also save at the grocery store becuase you wont be buying all those crap food items that cost a bundle and all they do is hurt you. ( ie. fruits, milk, bread, pasta, potatoes etc. )
This is strickly if you wanna LOSE weight. If your already slim.. then dont worry too much on carbs.
As for the guy who said he liked drinking pop and stuff to give him an energy boost before working out... Bad choice. If you really must drink coke or pepsi, drink diet. I know it sucks compared to the real stuff and there is a higher count in aspartame, BUT, this will give you energy as well and it has 0.08 carbs per large glass so works for losing weight and allowing you to drink it. I suggest not drinking 4 or 5 cups a day though, as aspartame is nto good for you. Try coffee with sweet low and cream, water , tea with cream, diet drinks, or a protein shake mixed with water ( chocolate seems to make me think i have more energy because i think its chocolate yet its good for you.) Any other drink like gatorade, regular soft drinks, fruit juices, tomato juices, ice teas, etc. are ALL high on carbs.. so if your intaking those, youll get the energy to workout but youll be killing your self with sugar are carbs and wasteing all the cardio your doing in order to lose the weight.
Hope this clears a few things up on high carbs and what to drink.
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what's wrong with aspartame?
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I guess you havent heard the news.... aspartame is really bad for you in excessive quanties.
READ MY NEW POST ON ASPARTAME IN THE NUTRITION SECTION
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I havent started nt cardio yet Im thinkking of waiting until may I dont want to trade off any size :)
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until you post some references this thread is as useless as a thread that would promote pro-whore-moans.
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Hey GiJoe, I'm alittle over 250lbs @ about 20% bodyfat...I've been doing cardio everyday for the past tw weeks...1hr running 5mph, then 30minutes on the bike at level 5...I've been feeling a little weeker when I workout, could this be from too much cardio? I would like to drop my bodyfat to at least 15% cause I'd like to start seeing vains in my arms & shit....I also have changed my workouts to more reps with less weight, for instance I would curl 55lbs for 10 when I was bulking, but now I do about 30 for 30reps...is this the right direction to go with all my workouts? thanks
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Hey GiJoe, I'm alittle over 250lbs @ about 20% bodyfat...I've been doing cardio everyday for the past tw weeks...1hr running 5mph, then 30minutes on the bike at level 5...I've been feeling a little weeker when I workout, could this be from too much cardio? I would like to drop my bodyfat to at least 15% cause I'd like to start seeing vains in my arms & shit....I also have changed my workouts to more reps with less weight, for instance I would curl 55lbs for 10 when I was bulking, but now I do about 30 for 30reps...is this the right direction to go with all my workouts? thanks
Without knowing you or your metabolism, I really think 1.5 ED of cardio is excessive and impacting your resistance exercises. Also, go back to training like you did for mass, don't change the rep and set scheme up. Make sure the most important area is up tight--the nutrition. Cut the carbs down to only complex and none toward the EOD. Keep the protein high and fats low.
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GiJoe,
If I am correct, complex carbs would be brown rice-oatmeal-potatoes...I have cut two out of my five daily meals to being Isopure protein shakes which are 50g's each, but it does not give me the essential carbs I beleive my body needs...do you think it would be ok if I threw in a 1/2 cup uncooked oatmeal giving me 50g's carbs?
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The oats in the shakes are fine. I ground mine up finer in a blender, but it's all a matter of taste.
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Haha,I meant make it in a blender...ok, one more question since you seem to know you're shit...Since chicken breasts are so high in cholesterol & a healthy consumption would be 200-400g's should I use excessive amounts of balsamic vinegar since I eat up to 6 per day?
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I think as a BBer, a person could easily go as high as 600mg per day without a second thought. I think there is about 60mg in a boneless, skinless chicken breast, so you'r OK.
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I think as a BBer, a person could easily go as high as 600mg per day without a second thought. I think there is about 60mg in a boneless, skinless chicken breast, so you'r OK.
I heard a chicken breast has up to 220G's of chol! Where did you see it only has 60 buddy?! As for me, I use a shit load of vinegar! Thins out the blood, you got the right idea!
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I think as a BBer, a person could easily go as high as 600mg per day without a second thought. I think there is about 60mg in a boneless, skinless chicken breast, so you'r OK.
I heard a chicken breast has up to 220G's of chol! Where did you see it only has 60 buddy?! As for me, I use a shit load of vinegar! Thins out the blood, you got the right idea!
There you go....buddy.
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/cgi-bin/list_nut_edit.pl
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GiJoe,
If I am correct, complex carbs would be brown rice-oatmeal-potatoes...I have cut two out of my five daily meals to being Isopure protein shakes which are 50g's each, but it does not give me the essential carbs I beleive my body needs...do you think it would be ok if I threw in a 1/2 cup uncooked oatmeal giving me 50g's carbs?
thats funny, carbs arent essential.
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having trained a lot of clients and put them thru different cardio routines, my advice to all who want to burn some fat but keep the most muscles is do short high intensity sprints on the treadmill. 15, 16 minutes at the highest speed you are comfortable with. 3, 4 times a week.
good luck.
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GiJoe,
If I am correct, complex carbs would be brown rice-oatmeal-potatoes...I have cut two out of my five daily meals to being Isopure protein shakes which are 50g's each, but it does not give me the essential carbs I beleive my body needs...do you think it would be ok if I threw in a 1/2 cup uncooked oatmeal giving me 50g's carbs?
thats funny, carbs arent essential.
"essential" is all a matter of opinion.
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Just to throw my thoughts into the mix.
I decided to lean up a little a couple of months ago. And all I've done is backed off the carbs a bit, drinking more water and eating really clean. Seems to be working. Although its going to take longer than if I included cardio but it should help me keep all my size and hopefully I can keep growing.
Anyone else do this?
I do this...or i may. I've been doing cardio like i felt i should but i swear i do better with my lo-cal diet and only doing cardio 3 times a week.
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gijoe you still have posted no references and im worried when you say keep fats low, essential fatty acids are very important and should not be kept below 20% for extended periods of time.
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Did I miss something? I didn't know I was supposed to provide any references. I do agree though, EFA's should be around 20% of the diet. That is low to me. EFA's are an "essential" part of our diet, so don't skimp.
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Hi, GiJoe,
How about this H.I. cardio, done for a short time like it's meant on the article (say like 15 min.) for the traditional pre-contest bodybuilder, getting closer to contest day (say like 2 weeks out)?
I ask this cuz I'm 2 weeks out, doing 1 hour on the recumbent lifecycle I have in home, on manual, level 3, and it tears my heart out like hell. I do it at night (11 pm) and train with the weights in the morning. Thanx.
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Hi, GiJoe,
How about this H.I. cardio, done for a short time like it's meant on the article (say like 15 min.) for the traditional pre-contest bodybuilder, getting closer to contest day (say like 2 weeks out)?
I ask this cuz I'm 2 weeks out, doing 1 hour on the recumbent lifecycle I have in home, on manual, level 3, and it tears my heart out like hell. I do it at night (11 pm) and train with the weights in the morning. Thanx.
I think it is a great way to get in contest shape. Do HIIT cardio 1-2 times a day for no more than 20 minutes each time. I know I would rather bust my a** for a few minutes than for 1-2 hours doing traditional cardio when I am all depleted and feeling like crap already! ;D
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I justed wanted to say that this article explains is it all. In high school I was on the swim Team. As a sprinter it was obvious that I needed more intense training, and lots of weights. This article just goes to prove that the 12,000 meters a day my couch had us swimming did nothing but burn us all out, preventing us from reaching our peak. I am changing my routine starting tomorrow.
Thanks!!
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I have been cutting a little bit now because of the summer, I am doing very well, I was becoming too big. I incorporated cardio in my training and starting lowering the carbs dramatically; almost only eat brown rice and some vegetables.
I was advised from a friend and I read it some where that it was good for you to have a shake after your training and then go do your cardio. What do you guys think about that?
I have to do my training and cardio at the same time. I train 5 times a week and take cardio 4 times a week, 2 hardcore cardio where I cycle or run as a maniac for one minute and then chill for the next 3-5 min for 40 min, and the chill cardio 2 times a week for 40 min.
So whats your opinion about taking a shake after the pumping and then go and hit the cardio.
The shake is compromised of 45gr and protein and about 40-55 simple carbs with creatine
Sorry how long this is ::)
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I have been cutting a little bit now because of the summer, I am doing very well, I was becoming too big. I incorporated cardio in my training and starting lowering the carbs dramatically; almost only eat brown rice and some vegetables.
I was advised from a friend and I read it some where that it was good for you to have a shake after your training and then go do your cardio. What do you guys think about that?
I have to do my training and cardio at the same time. I train 5 times a week and take cardio 4 times a week, 2 hardcore cardio where I cycle or run as a maniac for one minute and then chill for the next 3-5 min for 40 min, and the chill cardio 2 times a week for 40 min.
So whats your opinion about taking a shake after the pumping and then go and hit the cardio.
The shake is compromised of 45gr and protein and about 40-55 simple carbs with creatine
Sorry how long this is ::)
If possible, bump up the carbs in the post workout drink slightly. 70-80 grams would not make you fat. Only help to prevent muscle breakdown.
Other than that, it looks real good.
The drink as it looks now, would get an 8/10. Really good. Just lacking the proper amount of carbs, although that is slightly debateble.
Good luck
YIP
Zack
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Post workout drink should have roughly a 2:1 carb/protein ratio. So about 80 grams of simple carbs and 40 grams of protein.
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I avoid protein immediately after, instead going straight for the carbs.....sugar, cake, anything. Protein within the hour though.
http://golfaustralia.blogspot.com (http://golfaustralia.blogspot.com)
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Doing cardio for 20 minutes, three times a week, benefits your health and has no negative effects on your muscle growth. In fact, it allows you gain muscle while keeping your bodyfat low, because it allows you to eat more protein and carbs after your weight training-which is highly anabolic-while burning the excess in the for of fatty acids, provided, of course, that you do your cardio first thing in the morning, on an empty stomach. Anything more than one hour of cardio per week will will hamper muscle growth dramatically.
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Anything more than one hour of cardio per week will will hamper muscle growth dramatically.
From Danny Padilla (www.originalgiantkiller. com)
Do aerobics burn muscle tissue?
No, you can increase your calorie intake if you include aerobics in your work out routine.
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He is wrong. More than one hour of aerobics per week will force an adaptation of the body to cardiovascular fitness. You can't adapt in size and cardiovascular capacity at the same time because the body's resources are very limited.
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He is wrong ::). More than one hour of aerobics per week will force an adaptation of the body to cardiovascular fitness. You can't adapt in size and cardiovascular capacity at the same time because the body's resources are very limited.
I will let him know that he has been training wrong all these years and could of went farther. :P
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Citing Danny Padilla means nothing, because he was/is a steroid taker. Furthermore, yes, he would have made even greater progress if he hadn't indulged in aerobics.
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He is wrong ::). More than one hour of aerobics per week will force an adaptation of the body to cardiovascular fitness. You can't adapt in size and cardiovascular capacity at the same time because the body's resources are very limited.
Can you site a scientific report? I am interested in this because I've been doing 20 min of HIIT 5x a week to cut.
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He is wrong ::). More than one hour of aerobics per week will force an adaptation of the body to cardiovascular fitness. You can't adapt in size and cardiovascular capacity at the same time because the body's resources are very limited.
Blanket statements like these are always wrong. It's too unspecific. What do you consider cardio? Going max 3 times a week for 20 min? Going max hard once a week, with 2 cardios at 70% intensity? How about different bodytypes and recovery abilities.
I do cardio 5 days a week for 15-20 minutes. 1 session is all out, heart rate 175-190 for a good part. 1 is around 90 intensity (hrt 180 or so). The other 3 are at 60% intensity (basically coasting). These coasting cardio sessions (still in my cardio zone) are done purely on off days to circulate blood and get the immune system going. I added the 3 sessions and have seen gains in size since not losses. My cardio times have also progressed nicely. So yes, it is possible to gain cardio wise, and strength/size wise at the same time.
BB
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Another question:
I have not been incorporating cardio into my workouts because I do leg workouts extremely heavy (almost to puking as do many of you I'm sure), and it takes me a good five days to fully recover. Although I would like to trim 10-15 pounds of fat off around the belly and love handles (I weigh 230 at 5"11), I am worried that starting a cardio, even a Low IT one will hinder if not stop any gains of size in my legs. Am I too paranoid?
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i do lots of cardio for my contest prep. twice a day,in the mornings with an empty stomach,not really ,i take bcca's,glutamine and a rtd whey protein shake before i go out to an hour walk.
and after trainig my second time.i tried at night befor bed ,but i'm not able to sleep for about 2 hours later.
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I've got a situation here: I went out for a jog a few minutes together and 3 minutes into it, I start having a hard time breathing and I can taste blood in my saliva. It was 0 C outside and I normally don't get that winded out running. What gives?
I'm ok now, but I'm still coughing.
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As a habit, we humans have spent years breathing shallow. If you begin taking deeper breaths into your lungs, you get more oxygen. More oxygen, more fat loss. That's why cardio works, it forces you to breath harder. Doing it between sets is suffice, however, the consistent pump your heart gets with additional cardio cannot be replaced.... Meaning? Breath deep all day, but cut back on the cardio.
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I do both HIIT and long endurance (30 min.) cardio.
They are both very beneficial to body fat levels AND cardiovascular fitness.
Whos body would you rather have? sprinter or marathon runner? Just by watching the Olympics this year I would have to say a sprinter for me.
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I do both HIIT and long endurance (30 min.) cardio.
They are both very beneficial to body fat levels AND cardiovascular fitness.
Whos body would you rather have? sprinter or marathon runner? Just by watching the Olympics this year I would have to say a sprinter for me.
Definitely a sprinter.
YIP
Zack
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Is 6/10 of a mile enough cardio? lol. No way!! Unless you sprint it in intervals like 10 times. Or better yet. Jog it. turn around sprint it. turn around jog it. etc until your tired. 6/10 of a mile once isn't enough to burn off a half a candy bar. Let alone the 3500 calories you need to burn a week to shed a lb. of fat.
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Thats cool if your trying to build up to a normal somewhat physically fit person. I didn't know your endurance was that off. Keep it up and you will get there although you may have to push yourself.
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Ok don't laugh too hard but a brisk 30 min jog with my dog ( a 2yr old female sheltie) really helps get me lean. I find that a nice day in a decent park is awesome and is a fun and effective way to get in cardio. Sometimes I go for longer and walk a min for every 10 min of jogging, thus, I can go longer.
I also run a few local 5k's as this provides extra motivation to keep running and doing cardio. Howard
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Interesting information. Anyone know the actual source? Took this into mind when cutting/dieting the last couple months. Have been hitting the bike for 20 mins, doing 3 fast 5min intervals, with short rests in between each. Roughly 3 or 4 days of the week. Seems to have worked fairly well for me.
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???
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hi im 18 and bout 14 stone. im eager with weight training but i dnt want to be ripped and looking like a bodybuilder. i want to have solid body mass and the physique of somone like magnus samuelsson (world strongest man). if anyone has any tips or regimes that will help me get my goal it will be greatly appreciaated.
email me on rossjchan@hotmail.com
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hi im 18 and bout 14 stone. im eager with weight training but i dnt want to be ripped and looking like a bodybuilder. i want to have solid body mass and the physique of somone like magnus samuelsson (world strongest man). if anyone has any tips or regimes that will help me get my goal it will be greatly appreciaated.
email me on rossjchan@hotmail.com
You need to eat like a horse. Extreme amounts of foods, in the range of 6000+ calories per day. And it should be good food too. Drink 4 liters of skimmed milk every day, it will be a good start. Add pasta, LOTS of vegetables. Fish, chicken and meat.
Also protein powder of course, creatine will help keep the muscle cells full.
Another thing. Do cardio at least once a week to keep your general health in check.
YIP
Zack
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Interesting, but need a sorce realy. whered it come from dude?
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to lose any kind of flab or a little gut,you need cardio,there is no point in being big and smooth when you can be big and cut like a stone.i prefer stallones body in rocky 4 over THE ROCK anyday.
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I was fat and my car broke down so I rode my bike into work every day for a two months (Ten miles total, five days a week). I didn't go high intensity and I was cut as hell by the time I got my car fixed. I keep pretty good size when ripped (215 cut at 6'1). I wouldn't say that anyone who does cardio at low intensity levels is "wasting their time".
Tom
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After reading trough the thread, I'm still a little confused
What i got out of reading it
Long cardio routines = bad to keep musile
Medium length and difficulty= better allaround
Long and slow = bad to keep mass
What do you recamend for Cardio? I used to go for a job and do about 5 sprints after....
I'm going to have to change that :D
I want to loose weight and gain mass (healty mass :D)
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This thread has some useful tips. However, this thread also proves that the information highway can be too much. Too much conflicting information can and, does confuse the novice trainer.
I know, I have been there. I can remember reading from many different sources of material about bulking for strength and mass, and then cutting for a body to kill for. I spent more time reading about how to do these things then applying some of them.
I can tell by the way some of you guys ask how much or is this the right combo of this or that?
Just get in there and train, it really is that simple. We are all in this for the most part the same reasons, to get more muscle and to hopefully be healthy too.
Cardio is very essentiall. When the vascular system is regulary worked the muscular systems will be that much the better for it. Increased blood flow means better supplies of oxygen and nutrients that which the working, repairing and hopefully growing muscles need.
Do cardio every other day if possible and at least 30 min. Even if you are adding muscle, it can be done.
Just try not to get so wrapped around the menutia of all the "how many sets and, reps- how much cardio for this result or that- is 10 min on the tred with 10 min on the bike then back on the tred enough?"
The key is this...........It is all in how your body adapts and responds that the individual needs to tune into........if you feel like your doing to much of something and your not getting the stimulus needed. Then back off a little and see what happens. Use the mirror, it is a great tool for tracking progress. The scale is not, who cares what one weighs, after all it really is not what one weighs but how they wear it right?
Chalk up and Train, Chalk up and Train..............keep it simple... ;D
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Eric2 -
Bulleyes with your comments!
Only thing I'd add is that Tominflorida's post is EXTREMELY important to consider -- why DRIVE to a concrete building w/ wood flooring flourescent lighting and proceed to to do the aerobic-scopalooza" with a bunch of strangers of sundry shapes to music from the top 10s of 1976, 1986 and 1993, when you could bicylce several miles a beautiful woodland park and finish by chilling near a pond with your IPOD, water and a healthy snack?
Heck, I can get a great light cardio workout walking briskly 15 blocks to the grocery store and walk back with 8 full bags of groceries OR just avoiding the elevator at work and taking the stairs!
As Eric2 suggests - just get out of the car, elevator, escalator, AND move yo' butt!
Now, if you want are a long distance runner or sprinter and it is too cold outside -- then definitely use the treadmill to your advantage (altough it is NOT a substitute for the actual practice your sport).
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We spend sooo much time trying to improve the outside but what about the inside? The Heart is a muscle and needs to be exercised so I am a big proponent of Cardiovascular exercise....
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I am 6'4 300lbs and am switching from football workouts to a bodybuilding routine. I need to drop bodyfat, but dont want to lose muscle. I know I wont gain any but thast ok for now. What do you rcommend for cardio.
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I am 6'4 300lbs and am switching from football workouts to a bodybuilding routine. I need to drop bodyfat, but dont want to lose muscle. I know I wont gain any but thast ok for now. What do you rcommend for cardio.
Great to hear you want to lose wt and get fit overall, good luck. Ok, the best way to go is a combination of strair climber and walking at a brisk pace on a treadmill set on an incilne.
DStay with it and work up to a good 30-40 min at least 4 times week. All the best!
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We spend sooo much time trying to improve the outside but what about the inside? The Heart is a muscle and needs to be exercised so I am a big proponent of Cardiovascular exercise....
BINGO, great point. In days of yore bodybuilding was known as physical culture and the idea was to be fit and strong along with a decent physique.
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thats funny, carbs arent essential.
"essential" is all a matter of opinion.
nah www.dictionary.com
essential
particularly
"# Biochemistry. Being a substance that is required for normal functioning but cannot be synthesized by the body and therefore must be included in the diet: essential amino acids. "
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I do 30 minutes every day. Keep the heart rate between 135 and 150. I do all my training in the morning with a whey shake and half a cup of sunflower seeds in my stomach. I do the cardio after my weights 5 days a week, and two days by itself. After 6 months of this I have lost a significant amount of bodyfat while losing ZERO strength.
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I read in the new Mens Health mag that cardio after you work out can stimulate muscle growth....Maybe it's possible..? Having food in your stomach seems like it makes sense, I've always done cardio on my days off..
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The requirements to match to be in a cardio-workout are:
1. Elevate the resting pulse rate.
2. Maintain it for a period of time.
3. Using larger muscle masses.
4. In rhymtic movement.
It mattters not, what you are doing to reach these requirements.
Doing your cardio and free weight\High-Tech Machine workouts would provide best results because it allows the mandatory, more bio-chemical rest between activities, which helps
insure building of muscle tissue.
Recuperation is the secret of maximum gains in minimum time.
It is best to produce all of your high-level physical activitys on the same day, and allow complete rest between workouts.
Author
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never do cardio on an empty stomach. that's a nice way to break down muscles. eat a nice meal, then go run.
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I disagree
Many bodybuilders do cardio on an empty stomach first thing in the morning to lose fat. Cardio with no carbs in the system, maybe a lil protien if any, lots of water, and maybe some green tea is a great way to burn fat.
Eating breakfast like oatmeal with some pp directly after this cardio is the best thing to do for the metabolism. Never wait in a situation like this.
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Got to have a little something in your stomach if you are going to do cardio in the morning. Protein shake, banana's, or something. Running a mile a day at a fast pace will help you keep a lean look. Keeping your heart rate up will also keep you conditioned for lifting on those heavy days.
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What do you guys think about 15 minutes on the eliptical EOD after workouts?
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I'm never doing cardio again. I was training for fatloss a while back and did 6 days cardio a week and 4 days weights. My cardio sessions were 20 minutes to half an hour. I ate 40 30 30 with 1g protein per bodypound. in 3 weeks i lost 13 pounds and about half of it was muscle. If I just ate a little less and circuit trained I'll lose fat and keep my muscle. I guess bodybuilders don't lose their muscle when they do so much cardio because they take steroids.
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I was a sprinter in High school and college. Older guys have to be careful with sprinting. It's so easy to pull a hamstring or calf tendon. Warm ups are not to be taken lightly when your past your forties. It's also incredibly hard on the heart so it's not for a older guy who's getting into shape without a heart check up.
Having said the above I think it's a great form of cardio for preserving muscle. Who hasn't over done conventional cardio and have lost muscle and strength? I think doing 60 yard/meter sprints is a little to intense. The risk of injury is to great and I think you need a little more distance to burn up the fat. Try going to a high school track and sprint a half lap. After sprinting 220 yards you should rest by fast walking 220 yards. Repeat 6 times. Don't forget to warm up. You should see the fat burn off at an alarming rate.
The current thought of low intensity cardio does work. Walking for 30/40 minutes does burn the calories without cutting into recuperation. It just takes a long time for this grandma type cardio to give you results.
The body adapts for survival when training. Gaining muscle and losing fat is an adaptation to a stressor. To much long distance running will make your body shed fat and any unnecessary muscle to survive. How many elite distance runners have a muscular physique? Distance runners need muscles with endurance. They don't need the strength to squat 400lbs; bench 300lbs; or sprint a 48 second quarter.
Use cardio by all means for health, endurance, and to lose fat. Just don't over do it if bodybuilding is your primary goal. If your a bodybuilder then lifting weights is your primary activity.
Sprinters have a muscular physiques. To sprint you need power and strength. Intervals preserve lean body mass better than long distance runs at a moderate speed.
I think the heart rate fat zone burn is old news. It doesn't matter what fuel your body uses during cardio. Whether it's glucose or fat it's the total caloric cost that matters. On Clarence Bass's site he puts out his research on this very topic.
I find that there are basically three intentsities of cardio. Some use low intensity like walking so they won't interfere with recovery from lifting. There is the high intensity interval crowd that is effective but it's easy to burn out from. The middle of the road that use basically long slow distance will hurt a bodybuilders goals if used to often. I think the bottom line for a bodybuilder is to use aerobics. If it cuts into your lean muscle mass then cut back if bodybuilding is your primary goal.
The heart is the most important muscle. It should be trained hard even if you can't see it.
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Here is another take on this topic that seems to support the opposite opinion. To be honest my own research (both empirical and anecdotal) seems to support this postulation. That being said I'm willing to rethink and re-examine my postion based on the suggestion of the role cardio plays in hormonal secretions, as suggested in the first post of this thread.
It's a long read but well worht it.
DON'T DO AEROBICS!
Weights build muscle. Aerobics burn fat. Right? Not necessarily. The standard thinking is aerobics are a necessary component for fat loss and cardiovascular health, but in my opinion, they're essentially just an ineffective form of exercise. Aerobics will do next to nothing to alter one's appearance, yet people will include them because they're considered essential for providing a complete and balanced exercise program. That makes about as much sense as adding Styrofoam bricks while building a house because they provide a "different" form of support. They're only weaker. No one wants to admit that they've wasted hours of time on something that has reaped no reward. It isn't unlike the gambler who continues to lose and lose because he's already invested so much money on trying to win. Sure, it's senseless. But humans also react out of emotion. Most serious exercise enthusiasts include aerobics in their program but no one knows why -- other than what they've heard. Now you'll hear something different.
MOVE MORE. LOOK THE SAME.
The first premise regarding the necessity of aerobic training that I'd like to take on is the "targeted heart rate" theory. The belief is that once the heart rate is elevated to 60% of its maximum potential for over 20 minutes, the body begins to burn fat. Makes sense. I guess. You'll sure be burning a whole lot of calories. But if this method is so effective, why is it that I see so many aerobic instructors who are obviously in great cardiovascular condition with big fat asses!?
The reason is simple. Once the body becomes accustomed to the demand that is being put on it, there is no reason to adapt. It's capable of performing the activity effectively. The only alternative would be to increase either the intensity or the duration, both of which are self-defeating. It's imperative to remember at all times that the body's number one function is survival. Your body doesn't give a damn about how you want it to look. It is a primitive and highly efficient organism that will use a multitude of resources to adapt to an almost limitless array of bombardment. Keeping that in mind, follow me on this next point. A gram of fat consists of 9 energy units (calories). A gram of protein is 4 calories as is a gram
of carbohydrate. Your body doesn't care if the fat is coming from your oblique or a stick of butter, it will use what is most readily available. When performing an activity that requires constant low level movement for over 20 minutes, what you are essentially doing is giving your body a command:
Must run...
Must keep moving...
The master demands I travel great distances...
Now, knowing the body is going to respond as efficiently as possible, it will then begin to drop weight, allowing it to perform the task at hand with greater ease. This is where the belief that aerobics are effective gets misconstrued. If the body is going to take the path of least resistance (which is the only way it knows), will it use 9 energy units (fat calories) to drop a gram of weight or will it use 4 energy units (protein or carbohydrate calories) to drop a gram of weight? Of course, it will use only four!
Would you pay nine dollars for something when you can get it for four? The first source of fuel is to use the stored carbohydrates. As long as carbs are present, there is little need to use fat. This is why it's preposterous to eat carbs in order to have the energy to run. It's like working at a job that pays just enough to pay the expenses of getting to and from work. What happens once carbs are depleted? Now we enter the fat burning zone, don't we? Not so fast Sparky. It still has another 4 calorie per gram energy available -- protein. What's so bad about
that?
Well, just as the body doesn't discern where the fat comes from, it also doesn't know a protein molecule in a piece of steak from a protein molecule in a piece of human muscle tissue. The muscle on your body is a readily available source of energy just waiting to be used. So whenever you do aerobic activity, you're burning muscle -- like it or not.
"I'LL GET HEALTHY EVEN IF IT KILLS ME!"
Aerobics are an extremely damaging form of exercise, yet for some strange reason, the ability to withstand pain has become associated with athleticism. The epitome of withstanding punishment by way of aerobic overload is the marathon. The story behind the Marathon Run is based on an ancient Greek legend of the soldier, Pheldippides, who ran 26 miles to tell the emperor that their army was victorious in battle over the Persians. Then he dropped dead. (Let that be a lesson to you.)
What's interesting to note is, after a runner completes a marathon, the average weight loss is only four pounds. About three of those pounds are water which return the next day after the individual re-hydrates. That leaves only one pound of actual weight loss. It's a fair bet that a good portion of that pound is muscle loss. That means the amount of fat utilized from running a marathon is only a few ounces. So, if it takes running consistently for 26 miles to burn a few ounces of fat, how much fat do you think you'll burn from running for 20 minutes? About as much as a couple of spoonfuls of oatmeal. You'd be better off not eating the extra oatmeal. As much as I may admire the physical and mental toughness it takes to finish a marathon, it has little to do with one's health or appearance. It certainly won't enhance it. Proving how much punishment one can endure is so typical of the "weekend warrior" mentality.
It may make for inspiring Gatorade ads, but the ability to tolerate damage is not a very accurate gauge of one's health or strength. If it were, then my friend Louie is a regular gold medal winner. He can sock away 12 beers and a pack of cigarettes in one sitting, sleep for 3 hours, eat a plate of French fries and do it again. That would kill me! I wouldn't say he was in better shape than I because of it; he's just able to tolerate this form of abuse better due to the fact he's built up a tolerance to it. An activity such as running, besides being unnaturally stressing to the knees, ankles, and lower back, will also increase free radical damage due to the higher ingestion of oxygen. (Oxygen intake equals oxygenation) Let's not forget increased uptake of pollutants. If you're going to run, do it in a wooded area where the air is clean. I never fail to get a kick out of the people I see on the
city streets, huffing and puffing, running in place as they wait for the light to change. Breathe deeply folks. Yep, take in that invigorating carbon monoxide. Oh look! A diesel engine truck is heading up the block! Don't want to miss the opportunity to suck in some of that.
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THOSE ARE VERY NICE BREASTS YOU HAVE THERE SIR.
As most bodybuilders know, testosterone is a major factor in the success of everyone's training progress. Studies done on long distance runners have shown a severe depletion in testosterone levels. It stands to reason. Any long-term stressful condition will cause a severe drop in testosterone. Long duration stress is also extremely catabolic in that it overly taxes the endocrine system. This could lead to a slower metabolism -- just the thing you're looking for if a tighter body is your objective. It's so ironic. People do these things in the name of health. How sad it is that running will not do what everyone is expecting it to do. It is NOT healthy. It will NOT increase your lifespan. It will NOT improve flexibility. It will NOT grow muscle. It will NOT strengthen your heart any more than weight training or even moderate exercise such as walking. It will NOT improve your appearance. And most of all, it will NOT help you lose fat. You know what helps you lose fat? Eating less food. Try it and see.
Muscle is the key. Muscle is what keeps fat in check and aerobics won't help you build muscle. Aerobics are good for one thing and one thing only: They make you better at doing aerobics.
NOT CONVINCED? HERE'S MORE.
A while back, I was speaking at a seminar on training and sports conditioning. A student stated he made his best gains through weight training but was concerned about his cardiovascular ability when he tried to swim for the first time in years. He said he became quickly winded after only one lap. He then remained on a program of swimming every day and within a month he was able to swim ten laps. "Mister Montana, with all due respect, doesn't that prove that aerobics improve cardio capability?" he asked. The answer was no. And here's why. I explained; how long did it take to complete that lap? A minute? Less? That doesn't fit the definition of "aerobic." What you did was push yourself to your cardiovascular limit in a short amount of time, which is considered an-aerobic. So why would engaging in an activity that only elevates heart rate for 20 minutes improve the ability to do something that requires maximum exertion for one minute? The reason the lap took so much effort was because the exertion was unfamiliar. Therefore, you didn't get better at swimming because your aerobic ability improved from swimming every day for a month. You simply became a better swimmer!"
The same goes for any activity. Even though yoga wouldn't be considered an aerobic activity, it can make you breathe harder if the strain is new to you. This is why alternating training stimulus is optimum for total conditioning.
THE HEART OF THE MATTER
All exercise works the heart. And in case you haven't heard, weight training is exercise. This brings me to my next point. When I was studying to get my certification to be a personal trainer, there was a point where the instructor told the class that weight training will not improve one's cardiovascular condition, to which I just had to say, "excuse me?" "Um, professor. Are you suggesting that if you were to take a previously untrained individual and put him on a weight training regime for six months, that at the end of that time he would show no improvement in cardiovascular ability than from the day he started?" The instructor looked me square in the eye and said..."Yes." I guess he's never done 20 rep sets of squats.
I'll bet my entire bank account (granted, not a very impressive wager) that high rep weight training will improve cardiac output as well, if not better than low intensity aerobics. Any takers? The thing is this: The heart is a muscle and although cardiac muscle tissue is different from skeletal muscle tissue, there are similarities. All muscle becomes stronger through use. There is no evidence that the usage from an extended moderate activity increase is superior to the anaerobic version that weight training provides. Even the terms anaerobic and aerobic are misleading. They're essentially "made up" terminology which exercise practitioners have used and repeated throughout the years. Anaerobic means "without oxygen." Well, all exercise requires oxygen. Come to think of it, last I heard, everything outside of death requires oxygen. Along the same lines one must realize, any activity will burn calories and induce weight loss, especially if the trainee is new to an exercise program. But even in the case of previously untrained subjects, aerobics are the least effective of all forms of exercise for fat loss. When it comes to calling on its energy resources, the body doesn't know if it's lifting a barbell or running on a treadmill. It's expending effort, burning calories and stressing the nervous system with both activities. Of course, cardio training is of a lower intensity and longer duration. That's exactly what makes it less effective. If low intensity, long duration burns fat (which it does) then all activity, short of being in a coma, will burn fat -- which it does -- just not enough to make a difference. Of course, keeping the rest period in between sets brief is the best fat burning tactic there is, yet people ignore it to ride a bike that doesn't go anywhere. Go figure.
A LOT OF HOT AIR
The increased oxygen intake for fat loss is based on elevating the heart rate and here's where the theory falls apart. If you aren't in shape and you run a mile, your heart rate may go up to 200 BPM (Beats per Minute). If you're in good condition, it may stay at about 100 BPM. So if an elevated heart rate and increased oxygen uptake is what burns fat, then only unconditioned people would burn fat from most aerobic activity. Conditioned athletes would require more intense activity to get into the fat burning zone. Instead of running farther, it would make more sense to run faster, which is just another way of increasing the "resistance." Running sprints is excellent exercise for both cardiovascular development and leg strength. Of course, then you'd no longer be performing what is regarded as aerobic exercise.
SEMI - RETIRED
I love it when people say they do aerobics on "off days." Then it isn't a day off dammit! Proponents of brief infrequent training sessions say they get fat unless they include some aerobic activity. Well, why not just work out more? There's only so much energy the body can expend before it becomes over trained. Why waste it? It's crucial to make the most of that window of opportunity by implementing the most effective form of exercise. And aerobics are at the bottom of the list. I also find it funny how some strength coaches think that training for a pump by using higher reps with a lighter weight is worthless, yet believe aerobic activity, which offers less resistance, has merit. (?) I've heard people swear they look leaner after a cardio session. Sure. It's called sweating. When you perspire, you remove the subcutaneous fluid which looks like fat. You see your muscles more clearly. If that's what you're looking for, dress warmly when you workout. Or wear a sweat belt. You'll get the same results. Most people, other than the severely sedentary, get plenty of activity that will increase their heart rate for twenty minutes. Walking, dancing, playing sports, or riding a bike (a real one) are excellent methods to elevate heart rate. Even sex is a great way to increase heart rate. Sure beats the treadmill.
IT'S IN THE CARDS
When it comes to exercise, doing more won't assure more health or a longer life. Look at Jim Fixx. He wrote the famous book on running back in the 70's when it first started gaining popularity with the public. (By the way, how exactly do you go about writing a book on running? How many times can you say; left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot...?) Jim Fixx died at age 36. When I mention this to running addicts they invariable say; "Jim Fixx had a congenital heart problem!" That's my point. Running didn't correct or even alleviate the problem. No disrespect intended, but all that running may have very well aggravated it.
MORE MUSCLE = LESS FAT
Using aerobics as a method of burning fat is only fanning the fire. Muscle requires energy to sustain. Fat does not. Therefore, the best way to keep body fat in check is by having more muscle. And how do we do that? Lifting weights of course! Are you getting all of this?
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STATUS QUO WOES
As we now know, the human organism doesn't like having to change. It will adapt and adjust in an effort to maintain homeostasis. That's why it's so difficult to grow muscle or lose fat. The body likes things just the way they are and it requires the torturous stress of lifting ever increasing poundage before it will concede and grow more muscle. The same goes for losing fat. Accepting the fact that the body doesn't want to alter its total bodyweight, does it not make more sense to make
as much of that weight muscle? Let's say your set point is 200 pounds -- that's where your body is comfortable. It could just as well be 200 pounds with 6% body fat as 16% body fat. The mistake many people make is to attempt to lose weight in the hopes that they will lose fat. If you force your body to lose weight, the first thing it's going to give up is muscle since muscle weighs more than fat. Once again, since protein is 4 calories per gram and fat is 9, it requires more to sustain a gram of muscle than it does a gram of fat. When you deplete the energy intake (calories), you are telling your body to lose muscle. No wonder so many people throw in the towel and lament, "It's impossible!" It isn't impossible. There is a positive flip side to this phenomenon. If you have enough muscle, you can eat more and still remain the same bodyweight. More calories will provide more energy and once again, since the body wants to maintain homeostasis, it will burn those extra calories, if your muscle to fat ratio is high. This re-confirms the fact that the emphasis must be on building muscle and not on trying to burn fat by punishing the body in an attempt to use up calories.
A NOTE TO THE DIEHARDS
Even if you've accepted the premise I've presented, you may still want to engage in some aerobic activity now and then. I certainly have no problem with that. If I feel like getting into a good game of handball, I'm not going to worry, "Oh my god, I may lose some muscle!" Go on, break a good sweat. Show that you can use that beautiful body for things other than lifting weights. It feels good! Some cardio-based exercise can offer, if nothing else, a change of pace. I've even been know
to test myself every now and then by running a 10 minute mile or two. Granted, Carl Lewis has nothing to worry about, but it shows I'm not suffering any serious defect in aerobic ability due to just weight training as the only source of exercise for my heart.
THE GIFT THAT DOESN'T KEEP ON GIVING
If you enjoy running then go for it. Just keep in mind, aerobics increase metabolism only while you're doing them. They won't utilize fat for fuel when you're at rest. Only having more muscle will do that. Resistance training also improves glucose disposal and insulin sensitivity. Aerobic activity doesn't do either very effectively.
AM or PM?
There's also some controversy as to when aerobic activity should be executed. The precept currently in vogue is to do aerobics in the morning on an empty stomach, the theory being that you will more quickly use up stored carbohydrates and burn fat faster. I don't agree with this line of thinking. Without available carbs, the body is more vulnerable to catabolism. If you insist on running, the preferable time would be at the end of a workout. In this way, the heart rate is already elevated and less activity will be required to achieve the desired effect.
THROWING DOWN THE GAUNTLET
If you are currently on a training program that includes aerobics, I'd like to offer a challenge. Try this test for one month: Train exactly as you do now but eliminate all aerobic activity from your exercise regime. Since you will be expending less energy, you may want to up the poundage of the weights you're lifting or at least add a couple of extra reps to each set. Continue to eat as
you are now, making sure to maintain a high intake of protein. At the end of one month, I guarantee you that none of your aerobic ability will be lost. You will also have more energy, fuller shapelier looking muscles, and the exact same body fat percentage that you have now. Trust me.
AND NOW A WORD FROM OUR SPONSOR
And if all of this isn't evidence enough, I'll let Doctor Kenneth Cooper have the last word. He wrote the book "The New Aerobics" and is credited with coining the very term "aerobics." Twenty five years after the debut of his book, Dr. Cooper admitted that many of his conclusions were incorrect. He was quoted as saying: "Further research has shown that there is no correlation between aerobic performance and health, protection against heart disease, and longevity."
Newsweek Magazine ran a piece on Exercise Guild president Ken Hutchins who refers to an article that appeared in Men’s Journal Magazine where Dr. Cooper goes on to say that aerobics are far more carcinogenic than first realized and are to blame for many injuries. There you have it. Do you still want to do cardio? Be my guest. While you're at it, put 20 bucks on the number 7 horse in the fourth race at the OTB. You've got as much chance at getting rich as you do of improving your fitness goals through aerobic activity. Aerobics are a terribly ineffective form of exercise. The sooner that's realized, the sooner you'll be on your way toward better progress. I know it's tough to accept. But changing a bad habit is a lot smarter than defending it.
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So according to this nutjob, one can not lose fat at all since the body will prioritize carbs and protein over fat. Ha! What a joke.
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Oh right, and we should all be walking blobs of bone and fat since fat has 9 KILOcalories (NOT calories) and carbs and protein only have 4!
What a joke. I wonder how this guy ever gets his clients lean?
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So according to this nutjob, one can not lose fat at all since the body will prioritize carbs and protein over fat. Ha! What a joke.
There is some merit to what he says. While I don't have the info at my disposal for quotes or ref. , I have heard this before. And whilst it may be seem easy to dismiss this with a flippant "what a joke!" I'm uncertain if a dismissal is warranted. Although kudos to you for reading the entire article! :D
As a fitness consultant I see examples of "cardio-bots" (those who mindlessly spin their wheels on treadmills and elipticals while staring at a tv) waste hours and hours on end with no tangible results. Their bodies remain the same, or more accurately lose weight at the expense of lean tissue. My connundrum is in being somewhat unsure in recomending cardio to my clients. ON one hand I've used it for contest prep with some success, but the science (and evidence) seems to support at least some of Mr. Montanas claims. Hmmm?
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According to Mr. Montana, one can sit flat on their ass and lose more fat than doing cardio. I think anything over 20 minutes is a bunch of crap myself, HIIT is the way to go for FAT loss.
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I bought both of Nelson Montana's books and at first I took the cardio thing as fact. Then I saw that all these pros did a lot of cardio so I tried the cardio thing myself. I don't know who's right but as for me... I won't ever be doing any more cardio.
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It's true that higher intensity cardio workouts burn
more calories per unit of time AND increase metabolism
more after the workout than low intensity workouts.
High intensity cardio, including high intensity interval
training (HIIT), is very effective and time efficient,
(although it's not for beginners or those with certain
health problems).
It's common sense if you think about it - work harder,
burn more calories, right?
Here's where the confusion has come from:
It's well known that low intensity exercise utilizes
primarily fat as fuel and high intensity exercise utilizes
more carbohydrate as fuel.
In the past, this was the basis for the idea that low intensity,
long duration aerobic exercise was superior for fat loss. Some
people were were afraid to exercise too hard because they
thought it would take them out of the "fat burning zone" and
make them them burn only "sugar" and not body fat.
Today, research has proven that this belief in exercising at
a low intensity to stay in the "fat burning zone" was false.
At lower intensities, you burn more calories from fat, but
you burn fewer total calories.
For example, a 1995 study conducted by Grediagin, et al,
published in the Journal of the American Dietetic Association
(95(6):661-5) compared fat loss in two groups over a 12 week period.
One group performed exercise at 80% of VO2 max for a duration
sufficient to burn 300 kcal, the other group performed exercise
at 50% of VO2 max for a duration sufficient to burn 300 calories
(took a lot longer, of course). Hydrostatic body composition
testing revealed that...
***each group lost an identical amount of fat.***
The authors concluded:
"This study suggests that fat loss is a function of energy
expended rather than exercise intensity. Therefore, if fat
loss is the goal and time is limited, persons should exercise
safely at as high an intensity as tolerable to expend as much
energy as possible during their allotted time."
In my opinion, that conclusion pretty much hits the nail on
the head when it comes to answering the questions, "How long and
how hard should your cardio workouts be?"
Another study published by Ballard, et al in the same journal
(51(2):142-6, 1990) showed identical findings. High (80-90%
VO2max) versus low (40-50% VO2max) intensity rates were
compared in two groups with duration carefully controlled
to ensure each group burned the same number of calories.
The high intensity group exercised for only 25 minutes and
the low intensity group for 50 minutes...
***both groups lost the same amount of body fat! ***
Keep in mind BOTH approaches worked, but the high intensity
group got it done in half the time!
Regardless of whether your cardio sessions are 20 minutes,
30 minutes, 45 minutes, or whatever, the higher the intensity
during that time period, the more TOTAL calories you will burn.
The more TOTAL calories you burn, the more fat you burn.
Although many factors are involved in exercise-induced fat
loss, the most important factor is the total number of calories
burned, NOT whether the calories burned are fat or carbohydrate.
It's also important to consider energy expenditure after the
workout, not just the calories burned during the workout.
Higher intensities not only burn more calories per unit of
time, but they also elevate your metabolism more at rest
after the workout is over. This post workout increase in
metabolic rate is known as "excess post exercise oxygen
consumption" or EPOC for short.
It has been proposed, based on the results of several
studies comparing the amount of calories burned at rest
after low intensity versus high intensity exercise, that
HIIT is a superior method of fat loss due to its effect
on post workout metabolic rate.
Clearly, HIIT is the logical protocol of choice if you are
healthy, already fit and you have little time to work out.
However, it's also logical that time permitting,
more frequent and longer duration exercise might cause
even greater overall fat loss if intensity is sufficient,
simply because more total calories can be burned over
the course of a week.
Remember, it's all about the intensity and the calories
burned, not necessarily whether the workout is peformed
with intervals or in a steady state.
For example, if you do 20-25 minutes of very intense
cardio, you might burn about 400 calories. That's a lot
of calories for such a brief workout. But it only adds
up to 1200 total calories in one week if your frequency
is only three days per week.
If you (gradually) built up your frequency to four, five,
then even six days per week, you could double your caloric
expenditure to 2400 calories per week.
If you also increase your duration, your intensity will
decrease so you'll burn fewer calories per minute, but the
calorie expenditure for the entire workout is higher, which
increases your total weekly calorie burn even further.
Duration and intensity are inversely related, so the longer
the workout, the lower the intensity. But that doesnt mean
a 30 or 45 minute workout necessarily has to be "low" in
intensity.
A 30 or 45 minute steady state workout can be "moderate" or
"moderately-high" in intensity. The combination of the highest
intensity you can muster with a 30-45 minute duration can
create an enormous calorie burn. Some of that calorie burn
will occur after the workout as well, because studies have
shown that EPOC is influenced not just by intensity, but
also by duration.
Although infrequent and very brief (15-20 minutes or even less)
HIIT workouts have recently gained great popularity (and
deservedly so), that doesn't mean you should never do steady
state cardio, nor does it mean that certain individuals
aren't better off with longer, less intense cardio.
Respected organizations such as The American College of
Sports Medicine (ACSM) still recommend longer daily and
cumulative weekly exercise duration when the goal is
fat loss.
The ACSM position stand titled, "The recommended quantity
and quality of exercise" states, "A threshold level for total
body mass and fat mass loss generally would require at least
30-45 min of exercise per session for a person of average
fitness. If the primary purpose of the training program is
for weight loss, then regimens of greater frequency and
duration of training and moderate intensity are recommended.
Shorter duration, higher intensity programs may be recommended
for healthy individuals at low risk for cardiovascular disease
and orthopedic injury."
To avoid overtraining, injury or aerobic adaptation, which
become risks with higher intensity, frequency, and duration,
it's important to build up slowly and ALWAYS get your physician's
clearance before attempting high intensity cardio.
naturally, of course, it's not wise to dramtically increase
your training volume or intensity suddenly, but rather to
increase gradually.
If your current goal is to maintain your level of body fat
and stay healthy, I'd recommend starting with at least 20 minutes
of cardio 3 days per week. If your goal is maximum fat loss,
then time permitting, I would recommend higher frequency and
duration, sometimes building up to much as 30-60 minutes
5-7 days per week, if necessary, based on your weekly results.
Once you reach your desired percentage of body fat, then you
can gradually shift back into a "maintenance" program of lesser
frequency, duration and intensity. This is a form of "cardio
periodization," similar in nature to the periodization of
weight training used by elite athletes. Staying on high volume
cardio all year round is counterproductive and may lead to
overtraining, aerobic adaptation and a plateau
in fat loss.
Genetics also play a role in the ideal volume of cardio for
fat loss. If you're one of the few people who are genetically
blessed with the fast metabolism and physical attributes to
burn fat easily, then three days a week for twenty minutes
often provides sufficient stimulus for results. In fact, I
know a few people with hyperactive metabolisms who stay ripped
all year round without doing any cardio at all (I hate those
people, don't you?)
The bottom line is that a single cardio workout prescription,
such as "three days a week for 20 minutes" will not work for
everyone.Exercise programs must be developed on an individual
basis and they are not static. The frequency, duration AND
intensity all need to be adjusted based on your results.
If the intensity is high enough, three twenty-minute cardio
sessions may be sufficient for you, depending on your goals,
your current level of fitness and your actual results, but
longer and/or more frequent cardio sessions are sometimes
a "necessary evil."
For more information on fat burning cardio and fat burning
nutrition, visit www.burnthefat.com
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I'm still never doing cardio again after the disaster i experienced. what's wrong with circuit train and just less food? people are always on that cardio's good for your heart crap but MOST people who get heart attacks don't get it cause they didn't do cardio. Most people don't exercise at all so someone who lifts weights and plays the occasional sport has better cardio capacity than the average joe. unless you are a runner and need to get better at running or need to do the cardio for a particular sport just skip it. circuit training with weights gives you a helluva cardio workout and that's what i'm going to do from now on for fatloss. when i train for mass i'm not doing any cardio at all. one minute rest between sets is good enough if you work hard... keeps you fit. when i was doing cardio after my regular workout i'd get on the bike and see that my heartrate was at 110 right after the weights. that's not bad seeing as the "fat burning zone" is 130-140. If it works for you GREAT! I'm jelous. If you're a hardgainer type like me. Don't do cardio ever!
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Heart attacks are the number one killer. The heart is a muscle and it should be trained. If the heart was on the outside of the body every bodybuilder would train it like it was a bicep. The first thing a cardiologist tells a patient after by pass surgery is to do cardio. Sometimes bodybuilders are to concerned with cosmetics instead of function.
1.Cardio will increase the hearts out put volume. This will lower your resting heart rate. Many runners have resting heart beats below 45 beats per minute. This means your heart doesn't work as hard as an untrained heart.
2. Cardio can lower blood pressure. This can lower the risk of stroke and heart attacks.
3. Cardio can change the ratios of LDL and HDL to lower the risk of a clogged artery.
4. Cardio can give your body a better shot at regulating your bodies sugar level which can decrease the risk of diabetes. Diabetes can increase your risk of heart attacks.
5. Cardio can lower blood fats namely triglycerides.
6. Cardio can lower you overall cholesterol.
7. Cardio can decrease visceral fat around the organs.
8. Cardio increases feel good chemicals in your brain that fight depression.
9. Cardio will give you more energy to pursue lifting. If you feel to run down and tired to lift it could be that your conditioning is poor. Cardio will take care of that.
10. I could think of 10 but the wife brought a red wig and hooker heels. She's holding a six pack and I gotta go.
Cardio isn't a cure all but it decreases the risk of the number one killer. Odds are that most people reading this post will die from heart disease.
If liting is your number one priority then lift weights and put cardio a distant second. A little cardio isn't going hurt your lifting unless you train for a 10K at the same time.
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why do people think that lifting weights isn't cardio? do you breathe? does your heart go faster? doctors also don't know jack. they're out of shape anyway. i firmly stand by what i say. When i cut up i circuit train with weights. that IS cardio and can raise your heart rate just as well as so called "cardio" can. when i bulk i just lift weights. if it only gets your heart to 110 or 115 that's okay it keeps you more fit than most people who never exercise anyway.
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I can't beliee this topic is still here. It was one of the first threads I replied to, after I registered, one and a half year ago.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Yeah, that's more marathoning than cardio. But hey, whatever works.
There is no better way TO LOSE LEAN MUSCLE MASS THAN DISTANCE RUNNING. Been there, done that. :'(
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you dayum right
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why do people think that lifting weights isn't cardio? do you breathe? does your heart go faster? doctors also don't know jack. they're out of shape anyway. i firmly stand by what i say. When i cut up i circuit train with weights. that IS cardio and can raise your heart rate just as well as so called "cardio" can. when i bulk i just lift weights. if it only gets your heart to 110 or 115 that's okay it keeps you more fit than most people who never exercise anyway.
There is a point, from a general health perspective, to force your heart to work at near maximum rate for short periods of time.
Basically, it will help you stay fit.
YIP
Zack
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I think anyone drug free and doing cardio should look at their abs before deciding to add or remove whatever they currently perform.
But that is just my two pennies.
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im currently 335lbs, 6,0 really overweight,whjen i was tottally ripped i was 175-180 this like 5 nyears ago im now 26years old
this aint healthy id like to get down to be as lean as possible
im doing intense boxing 6 times a week
since i cant run cuz im so heavy, im doing walking for about a hour
would weighed vestwhgile walking help increase fatloss or am i heavy enouigh as it is?
but my hour walk is already hard
,but maybe ive put on mmuscle since the last time i was 175 so im not sure hwat weight id be lean at, im thinkin prob around 200lbs
with training really hard and eating clean how long will this take to get to 200
im thinking at least a year
as soon as i can run the weight will come off quicker, so i think at 235 i can run with no prob
what do you bros think?
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The figures you provided tell me your almost obese, fix your diet up, and keep active, see a doctor also get your heart checked.
let us know how you go.
ive been eatring clean for 2 weeks now, but i did see a doctor and got cheked for diabetes,cholesterol and heart chek, everything was fine
but im real seriouis about getting my weight down
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yea thx for the sdupport
im having one cheat meal a week,
i also got my thyroid checked as well and that was normal too
im training real hard right now so i ll be back in shape in no time
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I think you can do better, I can do 220 calories in 11 mins.
Wow, seems like I would be burning more. I pour sweat the whole time. Maybe the tread mill is not accurate?
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I think when it comes down to it Cardio is very important...we worry about training every muscle and getting it into shape but it seems we forget one of the most important muscles of the body.....
The Heart!!!!
Now my question is..... 30 minutes at 3 mph or 20 minutes at 4 mph (calories burned being pretty much the same)
Your thoughts?
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Im my view there is in offseason cardio and contest prep. cardio. Offseason While bulking I limit my cardio to 20 min. 4 times a week. During contest prep. I always do 2 cardio season's aday. One 1 st in the morning (before breakfast) and 2 nd later in the evening. The time depends on my progress.
Personally I keep my pluse range around 120-130 range (my age is 42). I want to hold as much muscle as possible.
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i used to be a really really skinny guy and i'm natural. cardio seems to knock my muslce off like nothing else.
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When i dont have time for cardio, I just lower the weights slightly and increase reps. I decrease time between sets as well as decreasing the time before starting the next exercise. Guaranteed to have you breathing hard and dripping with sweat like cardio. Being female my goal isnt to build muscle mass, its to stay lean and ripped. Straight up cardio can get really boring, so I use the weights to achieve something similar.
Wish it was safer to just go for a run or a walk at home, but there are too many goons where I live.
sigh
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you burn more calories after you do the cardio, cuz it gets your body in gear and raises your metabolism (even while your sleeping)
so dont worry too much about calories burned (like it says on the machines you use). just do it
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This article has completly changed my ideas on cardio. Ive been training hard for around 3 years now,and ive put on significant size over the course of these three years. I was roughly 165 when i graduated highschool ,and now im about 220 , with 17 inch arms. i just always kept the protien high,and calories high,and lifted like the world was coming to an end.
My problem is that i have way more fat around my midsection than i would like, i would say i need to burn about 10 lbs of fat to really get to the level i want to get at. Im not concerned with having a six pack really , i would just like my midsection to be trim.The rest of my body is somewhat low in body fat.
ive started a diet and cardio routine and ive been on it for about 6 weeks now with little to no results. its one of the most frustrating things ive ever encountered.
i generally lift hard 4 times a week for roughly 45-60 minutes, and sometimes finish the workout with 30 minutes on the bike, keeping my heart rate at around 175. about 2 times a week, i go to the gym to just do cardio. i do cardio about 4 times a week.im on lipo 6(the ephedra free kind) as well.
what am i doing wrong? should i do the interval training or what? are my cardio sessions just not intense enough?
any feed back would be greatly appreciated.
thanks so much.
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well there's a "fat burning zone" look it up. heart rate at 175 is way too high.
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I keep my heart rate at 110-115 during cardio. I think thats low enough to be in the fat burning zone, from what I've been told anyways. Just hard enough to break a small sweat. Seems to be working.
I would agree, 175 and your burning muscle fo sho.....
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People, he's bullshitting. No way can he keep his heartrate at around 175 unless he is a superhuman.
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Definately depends on body type. If youve been lifting for some years you should be able to tell how easily you burn fat. Ive seen a lot of people do way to much cardio. Usually the non body builders. A reall slim guy with little tone works out at my gym. One morning his girlfriend asks me on the side how he could gain more muscle. I told her first of all he does weights for 20 mins and does over an hour of cardio every day of the week and he is small to begin with. Cut the cardio way down and concentrate more on weight. Most of us on here prob know that however but you never know. beginners do some strange things
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my fat brother's heart-rate is like 165 right when he steps on the cardio machine after lifting. and he stays on there for like 20 minutes. 175 is definately do-able
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my fat brother's heart-rate is like 165 right when he steps on the cardio machine after lifting. and he stays on there for like 20 minutes. 175 is definately do-able
No, it's not, the monitor is lying.
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because you cant do it dont mean it's not possible.
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No, it's impossible unless you are Lance Armstrong.
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ok so i'm blind.
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You cannot maintain a 175 heartrate unless you are a top-level endurance athlete such as a professional cyclist. It is impossible for normal people.
Time to invest in proper heartrate monitors.
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No you don't.
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I can get mine in the 150-155 range, but I can't imagine 175 for 20 mins.
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Ripped at 135 pounds, my GOD you are a BEAST, hahahahahahahaha, pathetic, you couldn't do 175bpm for 20 minutes if your life depended on it, hahahahahahaha.
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I do 20-30 twice a week thats it. But I eat clean thats what makes the difference. And since Ive been active since i was very young. Someon just starting that is overweight would need a lot more cardio.
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i dont do cardio and i'm trying to cut down. when i do cardio lose tons of muscle mass. just a while ago i was doing circuit training for cardio and lifting and i lost muscle. now i'm just controlling my carbs and calories and lifting regular and i'm still losing muscle. what the hell is wrong with me? i'm eating 2700 calories daily and it's about 40 percent protein.
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i dont do cardio and i'm trying to cut down. when i do cardio lose tons of muscle mass. just a while ago i was doing circuit training for cardio and lifting and i lost muscle. now i'm just controlling my carbs and calories and lifting regular and i'm still losing muscle. what the hell is wrong with me? i'm eating 2700 calories daily and it's about 40 percent protein.
hahaha! you're still loosing fat little man!......
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yes i'm losing fat but i don't want to lose any muscle. losing both fat and muscle just makes you a smaller version of yourself. who wants that? of course the fatloss is greater than muscle loss but still. if things continue this way i'll go back up to 190 and try a different fat loss plan. get on the steak and egg diet and eat no carbs for days at a time.
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yes i'm losing fat but i don't want to lose any muscle. losing both fat and muscle just makes you a smaller version of yourself. who wants that? of course the fatloss is greater than muscle loss but still. if things continue this way i'll go back up to 190 and try a different fat loss plan. get on the steak and egg diet and eat no carbs for days at a time.
bro why do you worry so much? just fucking eat and lift heavy!
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(no carbs?) Then you'd have no energy.
Just do what the superstar says. You're overthinking it.
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i love to just eat and lift heavy but you dont lose fat that way. remember the days and days of crazy posts we had after i posted my pictures? of course you do. so you know i wanna get my bodyfat below 10 to look good. after i enjoy having abs for a while and show them off this summer then i'll go back to eat and lift heavy.
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Both my nutritionist and trainer suggested for cardio that I keep my heartrate around 140-150 for 30 minutes. I do that about three times a week after my workout and I've been doing well, though only into my third week of my new routine. Then again, not sure how differently such a cardio workout affects male and female. For me, it doesn't take much, 6 incline at about 3.7-3.8 km/hr. Heh, I'm not used to all this though, I really hate cardio, but I push myself to finish and I feel great afterwards.
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for what reason do you do your cardio?
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A few reasons, really, to burn a bit of fat, I'm quite overweight, and to strengthen the heart and circulatory system.
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ok but remember running on a hampster wheel isn't the only way to get your heart rate up
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lol I know, but I'm in the middle of a city, not like I can get fresh air out here. It does seem to be the easiest way though boring. Least there's a tv. Not to mention with my short attention span, if I were out in the woods somewhere, I'd be stopping too often to inspect things along the way like bugs and plants and snakes and stuff.
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Hi guys! I am the original poster that started this thread a few years ago, at the time I used a guest account to make the post without thinking. I really haven’t posted here in a while, but I actually was going to make this into a complete book, but decided to make a website instead with all the knowledge I have gathered for the past 20 years of bodybuilding for free. Here it is:
http://www.rippednaturally.com/
There is a couple of ezine articles in there, but most of the articles I wrote myself.
Take care :)
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Rrrrright and there are pictures of Ronnie there.
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Hi guys! I am the original poster that started this thread a few years ago, at the time I used a guest account to make the post without thinking. I really haven’t posted here in a while, but I actually was going to make this into a complete book, but decided to make a website instead with all the knowledge I have gathered for the past 20 years of bodybuilding for free. Here it is:
http://www.rippednaturally.com/
There is a couple of ezine articles in there, but most of the articles I wrote myself.
Take care :)
Good article and nice job on your website! I'm 1 day out from our prov. champ. here in Sask and in the best shape of my life (43 years old). Vascular and ripped to the bone and x-mas right up my mid back. What type of cardio did I do? Well I did 45 to 60 min 2 times a day 7 days a week. Interesting enough as I got closer to the show I increased my pace of my long workouts to 30 secs. hard on the bike on mid range tension than 2 min recover just spinning on very low tension (enough so I could do 95-100 rep per min).
I believe both have there place in contest prep.
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Both my nutritionist and trainer suggested for cardio that I keep my heartrate around 140-150 for 30 minutes. I do that about three times a week after my workout and I've been doing well, though only into my third week of my new routine. Then again, not sure how differently such a cardio workout affects male and female. For me, it doesn't take much, 6 incline at about 3.7-3.8 km/hr. Heh, I'm not used to all this though, I really hate cardio, but I push myself to finish and I feel great afterwards.
YUP! 30 minutes before breakfwast....mod. incline walk...watch the news and read the paper while u work up a sweat, great routine...then when I cut, I just bump it up to 45mins.....now, I'm bulking, so it's still daily, or 6x per week, but 25 mins is good enough...
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Cardio SUCKS ;D
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Cardio SUCKS ;D
But you gotta do it :(
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Nah Serge Nebret didn't do it, Vince Taylor doesn't do it and in the 02 Olympia I heard them say Dexter Jackson doesn't do it. If it's for fatloss just eat cleaner and train hard. If it's for health... TRAIN HARD your heart pumps when you lift weights too.
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maybe you should try cardio, that might be your problem
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mine?
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mine?
no, not you Gibber, you look awesome.
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i wasn't talking to you mr. liar.
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Nah Serge Nebret didn't do it, Vince Taylor doesn't do it and in the 02 Olympia I heard them say Dexter Jackson doesn't do it. If it's for fatloss just eat cleaner and train hard. If it's for health... TRAIN HARD your heart pumps when you lift weights too.
I disagree. I think cardio is a necessity.
If you do cardio while dieting you can eat more calories to support more muscle mass. So if you don't want to lose muscle while dieting, you should do cardio.
There are very RARE exceptions. Some people have crazy genetics. They lose body fat without even trying. It's also harder for those type of people to build mass. I think Dexter Jackson was doing cardio but started to lose too much weight. He had to stop (at least thats what he said in the Pre-Contest Bible). Darrem Charles is another example, he only diets for like 5-6 weeks.
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every time i've done cardio i've lost inmense amounts of weight including muscle. when i was 135 LOL i was more than ripped. only reason i put on fat is because i overate for a loooong time. i am getting leaner right now without any cardio.
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every time i've done cardio i've lost inmense amounts of weight including muscle. when i was 135 LOL i was more than ripped. only reason i put on fat is because i overate for a loooong time. i am getting leaner right now without any cardio.
The fact that you can get down to 135lbs. proves my point!
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No you're mistaken. I CAME UP to 135 from 120. When i was in the 135-145 range i was shredded to the bone. Anyway how would it prove your point? if i did cardio at that time and i actually got DOWN to 135 then that means the cardio knocked off a lot of muscle.
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No you're mistaken. I CAME UP to 135 from 120. When i was in the 135-145 range i was shredded to the bone. Anyway how would it prove your point? if i did cardio at that time and i actually got DOWN to 135 then that means the cardio knocked off a lot of muscle.
My point was, if you want to maintain the most amount of muscle mass while dieting you need to consume more calories and nutrients. Typically, this is only made possible by doing cardio. Thus, attempting to diet without cardio typically results in muscle loss.
However, I also stated that "hardgainers", those who have trouble holding onto weight (the ones with crazy genetics) can't do cardio or they lose too much.
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i've never lost muscle on low calorie-no cardio. that's the only way i've been able to keep it.
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i've never lost muscle on low calorie-no cardio. that's the only way i've been able to keep it.
when did you have it?
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so post your pic and show me what it is to have any muscle... liar/loser.
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so post your pic and show me what it is to have any muscle... liar/loser.
calm down Gibber, not all of us are so self conscious that we need approval from a message board. And why don't you just shut up and take the mans advice? you are not a hardgainer!
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i've never lost muscle on low calorie-no cardio. that's the only way i've been able to keep it.
Count your blessings Bro. You are a LUCKY man!!!
Most of us have to bust or booties on the cardio.
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anyone have gibbers picture?
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Yea... I do. my pictures are irrelevant. everyone says that i'm fat in my pictures but you all have to realize that in the pictures i have here i go from 120 to 185 with no cutting of any kind in between. talk about "bulking".
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i never said you were fat, just no muscle what so ever.
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Well EXCUSE ME for not reaching my goals yet I've only been training seriously for 2 years!
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Well EXCUSE ME for not reaching my goals yet I've only been training seriously for 2 years!
Proves my point even more...
no clue and no experience...
bulk up and cut down, post pics of both phases, we could all use a good laugh.
8)
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yea sure... why don't you stick to the topic instead of getting personal? you're not talking about anything.
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seriously, i've only been training for 3 yrs, 2 all out.. went up to 250, now diet down to 220.
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dieted down to 220 and look like what?
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you people are crazy!
you comparing the few people in the world with superior genetics and are on steroids to the average person..not a fair comparison
Sure surge and Dexter don't belive in cardio good for them
Based on the general population it is clear that most people cannot do it through diet alone. Also most people don't have the determination and will power to diet and lift heavy long enough to get their bodyfat to a low level. Look around the average gym and you will see a bunch of fat men lifting heavy. Of the people that I see in shape they lift/diet and spend time doing aerobic activities.
On a personal I am 5'10 200lbs, I lift heavy but I have never gotten my BF under 13%. This has always troubled me. I started doing 45 minutes of cardio on an empty stomach 4-6 days per week. Before doing cardio I take 5g of glutamine and a handfull of BCAA. I have also began taking more carbs with my post workout shake. My abs are coming in real nice and guess what my weight is: 202. I make sure that eat 6 meals and so what if I have the occasional cheat meal? I burn it right off.
I also take Creatine, 40 grams of whey protein and BCAA after working out also, plus some fast digesting carbs
I maybe be burning muscle but rest assured that I am burning fat at a higher rate.
I truly belive that those with a low BF can get by with minimal cardio if any. Their BF is so low that they don't need to burn off anything. If you are a male and over 14% BF then you need to do some form of cardio. As to how much cardio, I will left you and your stubborn belly fat determine that. Catch me on the stairmaster
oddly enough everyone says that I am looking bigger :)
I didn't spell check this so excuse any errors
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you people are crazy!
you comparing the few people in the world with superior genetics and are on steroids to the average person..not a fair comparison
Sure surge and Dexter don't belive in cardio good for them
Based on the general population it is clear that most people cannot do it through diet alone. Also most people don't have the determination and will power to diet and lift heavy long enough to get their bodyfat to a low level. Look around the average gym and you will see a bunch of fat men lifting heavy. Of the people that I see in shape they lift/diet and spend time doing aerobic activities.
On a personal I am 5'10 200lbs, I lift heavy but I have never gotten my BF under 13%. This has always troubled me. I started doing 45 minutes of cardio on an empty stomach 4-6 days per week. Before doing cardio I take 5g of glutamine and a handfull of BCAA. I have also began taking more carbs with my post workout shake. My abs are coming in real nice and guess what my weight is: 202. I make sure that eat 6 meals and so what if I have the occasional cheat meal? I burn it right off.
I also take Creatine, 40 grams of whey protein and BCAA after working out also, plus some fast digesting carbs
I maybe be burning muscle but rest assured that I am burning fat at a higher rate.
I truly believe that those with a low BF can get by with minimal cardio if any. Their BF is so low that they don't need to burn off anything. If you are a male and over 14% BF then you need to do some form of cardio. As to how much cardio, I will left you and your stubborn belly fat determine that. Catch me on the stairmaster
oddly enough everyone says that I am looking bigger :)
I didn't spell check this so excuse any errors
I'm 6'3 240 with a 21% BF. Yes I'm fat, but I have worked hard to get to this weight. About 4 years ago I was a scrawny 165 pounds.
In the past I have done the empty stomach cardio and the 6 meals a day thing with all the right supplements. Doing that I lost both weight, fat and muscle which I didn't want to lose. However, I was never able to get really cut like when I was really skinny.
I wonder if my cardio was too high impact (running) and maybe walking or stairmaster might help me lose fat while retaining my muscle.
I need somebody to recommend a plan of action...I've gotten really frustrated with the setbacks I've been experiencing the last year.
My question is would walking or
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Heres a question that i got
We all know cardio is quite boring but is imperitive to shed fat
My question is , is sport , anything that uhm involves around , will it be contitied as cardio? And if so , is it goood form of cardio
In particular the sport i wanna know about if is the equivalent of cardio is SQUASH
Any takers?
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i did both HIIT and slow walking. I've read tons and tons of research and they all indicate HIIT burns more fat, and helps u keep ur muscles better, but then from personal experience, slow walking helps me keep muscles much better. I'm still scratching my head on that one. Perhaps there's a reason why 99.95% of pro bodybuilders do slow walking for their cardio despite all these studies backing up HIIT.
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For fuck sake, man, this fucking thread is still up?! It's been here for years! :o :o :o :o :o :o
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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i did both HIIT and slow walking. I've read tons and tons of research and they all indicate HIIT burns more fat, and helps u keep ur muscles better, but then from personal experience, slow walking helps me keep muscles much better. I'm still scratching my head on that one. Perhaps there's a reason why 99.95% of pro bodybuilders do slow walking for their cardio despite all these studies backing up HIIT.
I agree when I'm getting ready for a contest I keep my pulse between 120-130 when doing cardio. I hate cardio first thing in the morning as I'm not a morning person, so I do may first cardio workout after my morning weight trainning around 11 AM.
I have seen first hand HITT people burn off their muscle. When I'm in contest mode I eat about 2600-2800 cals but do 2 one hour cardio workouts. When contest time comes I'm ripped to the bone and look full. Well as full as a light middle weight can look!
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i did both HIIT and slow walking. I've read tons and tons of research and they all indicate HIIT burns more fat, and helps u keep ur muscles better, but then from personal experience, slow walking helps me keep muscles much better. I'm still scratching my head on that one. Perhaps there's a reason why 99.95% of pro bodybuilders do slow walking for their cardio despite all these studies backing up HIIT.
Only way to go in my book....5am, 2.8 speed, 12% incline...bulking.
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Only way to go in my book....5am, 2.8 speed, 12% incline...bulking.
Is there Sun Light at 5 AM? LOL. My wife is up at that time, but not me I get up at 7:30. Remember you grow when your sleeping and I sleep lots!
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sleep by 9pm
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Heres a question i got
When you do cardio , after the cardio should you drink A protein shake (*50 protein, 25 carbs) ??
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Most People will say first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, reason being is because your body is short on glycogen supply and will take only fat for fuel for the workout. This is nonsense. The point of doing cardio is alterating your internal hormonal environment that increases your metabolism, not burning fat during the workout. There are several important reasons why you should not do cardio first thing in the morning. One, you are more prone to injury, you just woke up from a 6+ hours of sleeping, your body needs warming up before doing intense exercise. Two, your intensity will be decreased, which is extremely important for a good hormonal excreting cardio workout. Three, when you wake up in the morning the hormone cortisol is raised which is the "main" catobolic hormone, which goes away after eating breakfast. Breakfast jumpstarts your metabolism for the day, skipping breakfast and doing cardio instead raises catobolic hormones even more and slows your metabolism, which is a good formula for losing muscle and gaining fat!
What a load of BS.
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What a load of BS.
My view is simple "Just do it". As long as you burn off the cals in that 24 hour period it doesn't make that much difference. For most of us we do that fits around our "Real Lifes" that pays the rent.
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I've got a question for you cardio guru's out there. Ideally I would like to do a nice long cardio session in the morning on an empty stomach but recently I've been having some issues with falling asleep and thus I'm having a hard time waking up in time to do my cardio. Now I can do some cardio after my workout which takes place on my lunch hour but the session would be limited to about 20 minutes. Now I figure I have 2 options:
1-perform 1 cardio session in max-ot fashion which is basically an interval session, 1 minute intervals, time limit of 16 minutes always trying to beat my total from the last session. I'd probably do about 4 of these sessions a week.
2-I was thinking of setting a goal of 45 minutes of cardio a day, probably 4-5 times a day but broken down into 2 sessions one at lunch and one in the evening, as long as I hit 45 minutes total it would all be good.
Which do you guys think would be more beneficial?
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My cardio rotuine is off the chain at the moment, i got a little to bulky for my liking over christmas, i was 5'8 and 89kgs now down to 81kgs, my routine was on the treadmill for 25 mins and burning according to the machine 400 calories..8.0km and 8.0 incline 7days a week ( i know its to much, i love seeing the dramatic changes and i'm still doing weights afterwards to maintain )...also i can see my abs now...
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5mph at 8% is brutal!!!
I go 3.0-3.2 at 12% and am whooped....but its' also 30-40 minutes.....
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I am 6'5 and 285 lbs. I workout M,W,TH,F,Sun hard and heavy. T,W,TH,F,Sun I do an hour of cardio on the bike. From the start to end I interval every1:30 from 90 rpm at the slow mark to 115 rpm for 1:30 on the hard mark. I eat clean for breakfast, mid-morn., lunch, & pre-workout, then I have a normal dinner of meats,potatoes, pasta & sauce, veggies, or anything like that, nothing frozen or prepackaged. Then before bed I have a protein shake. My question is will my cardio be sufficient enough to get down to the 240 mark come mid march? I am 30 days into my cardio and really only see a small difference in the mirror, but feel great. Any suggestions.
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sprinters also weight train completely differently than long distance runners do, which has a lot to do with their respective body compositions.
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Hey guys i just joined this site yesterday and I need some advice. I had been working out religiously for about 6years, I did a cycles of Winni about 3 years ago, I was in good shape (5'10 ,214, 12% BF). Due to med schools intense hours I have not been able to workout for about 5 months, I also wasn't getting adequate sleep or eat the proper foods at the proper time, so I'm now (215lbs, I would say about 20% BF). I Finished my first year of med school 2 weeks ago, and now have the time to get back into things. I've been out of the bodybuilding loop for awhile so I was wondering if you guys knew of any good supplements that cause for some nice muscle gains, oh ya I don't want to do another cycle. So, I'll tell you what I'm currently taking and you tell me what to get rid of and what to add.
I drink anywhere from 2 to 4 liters of water during my day.
7am-- Gasparian Pump 250( 2scoops) , Novex Biotech Endothil-CR
7:15-- Nitrotech Protein Shake
7:45-- Workout
9am-- Muscletech Protein shake with a Gatorade
11:30-- Tuna Salad (30-35g protein), 1 red apple,1 orange, 1 GNC multi vit, two 600mg L-glutamine capsules, 1000mg CLA
2:30pm-- Tuna Salad (30-35g protein), brown rice or wheat pasta (one and a half cups)
5:30-- Chicken Breast (30-35g protein),one serving of fruit, two 600mg L-glutamine capsules, 1000mg CLA
8:30-- Chicken or Turkey Breast (30-35g protein), a cup of veggies
10:30-- 1-3 mile jog every other day, it's not an intense jog, I try to keep it at a slow pace ( 9- 11 minutes a mile)
11:10--2 cups nonfat milk or 1 cup nonfat milk mixed with 20 grams whey protein,1 GNC multi vit,two 600mg L-glutamine capsules, 1000mg CLA, 2 tablets GNC ZMA
11:30-- In bed
Thanks
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You have a solid diet and you dont ned cardio.......get some more good quality carbs in and more potein,....meats....quit relying so much on suopplements and ditch the cardio,,,,time to put on some solid wieght!
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My cardio consists of 15 minutes total, 3 to 4 times a week. 4 minutes warm up on treadmill, bust out a 40 second sprint, rest a minute at a 5.0 speed, bust out 30 second sprint, rest another minute at the 5.0 speed, repeat till I hit 12 minutes, then do a 3 minute cool down pace. I usually set it at 2% incline. Does wonders for me and I dont feel like Im spending all day on the treadmill.
But thats just me..
Ditto...I average about 3lbs of fat per week when cutting when I do it this way. I also swim laps...to one end and back as fast as I can, rest 30 sec to 1 min...then repeat. Fat just melts. I don't even cut my calories. I rearrange them (higher protein) but don't cut. Everyone is different, find what works. Hi/Low has been proven to burn more fat regardless of how.
6' tall, 262lbs@19(or so)% off season (Rugby) - 240-6@ 10-12 (or so)% during season (but I up my calories 600-800 before, on, after game days being that I get tons of cardio in...I play outside prop). I run a 7.3sec 40.
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this Q&A might be relevant here:
: Is it a bad thing to work out in the A.M. on an empty stomach? I know it’s great for cardio, but wasn’t sure about weight training following the cardio. I will admit that it’s easiest to just roll out of bed and throw on gym clothes and hit weights and cardio, and I did get great gains from this after a long lay-off, so I wanted to know if there is evidence to support it not being a good idea?
A: Well, you yourself just said that it gave you great gains, but it’s true that it may be because of being in a year lay-off and then coming back. Nearly anything will do the trick at that time. You didn’t say if there was a point of diminishing returns at any time after. But to your question... Mostly, a person’s ability to lose fat is what ultimately benefits from an empty stomach and low insulin after sleep, whereas weight training requires having some calories in the body. I suggest you do cardio in the A.M. and find another time to do weights. While insulin is low in the A.M. and that benefits fat loss, cortisol is elevated until you eat something. Cortisol is not your friend when wanting to add muscle. Plus, low blood glucose levels are bad for weight training too. But you can compromise. Do your cardio on an empty stomach, and then have an 8oz. glass of milk or a small new potato and a little protein powder. Your stomach won’t be full, but you’ll get an immediate boost for training. You don’t have to have a big breakfast. Have just a tiny bit of carb and some protein. Studies show that protein in the system before you work out will have a large impact on protein synthesis. So get your MRP or your protein bar, or a couple of pieces of toast with peanut butter on them, and you’re good to go, guy!
http://www.getanabolics.com/2007/07/morning-cardio-on-empty-stomach.html
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when cutting, cardio is best done three times a day. in the mornings before eating, take some form of pure protein/amio acid(a good example= l-glutamine powder), and a fatty acid pill..wait 20-30 minutes; and then do moderate intensity cardio for at least 25 minutes. then, after your workout later in the day, wait for your post workout shake to digest(20 minutes or so for whey proetin), and then do at least 20 minutes of light intensity cardio. and then do cardio again at night before you go to sleep and after you are done eating. again moderate intensity....at least 20 minutes, but you need to go as long as it takes to burn off whatever is left in your stomach from dinner. before your sleep, take a fatty acid pill, and another serving of some pure protein/amino acids...(again, l-glutamine would work great here.)
the explanation for each of these is=
in the morning, when you have a empty stomach, your cardio goes directly into fat stores. you wat to keep it at moderate intensity though; because if you put your body understress without nutrients, it will start to burn muscle instead of burning fat. that is why you take the fatty acid pill ad the pure protein, because the faty acid pill lets your body turn over into fat burning mode, and the amio acids keep your muscles from being consumed for energy.
after your workout, doing cardiovascular activities boots syour bodies groth hormone responses, and allows for faster protein synthesis, thus speeding your rate of recovery, and the total amount of muscle you can achieve from the workout which you just completed.
at night time, any food left in your body, with the debateable exception of protein, will be stored as fat. so you need to burn off any left over food sitting inside before you rest. and then, the fatty acid pills lets your body turn back into fat burning mode, and again, the pure amino's will keep your muscles from being conusmed for energy... thus you will be burning fat all night, while maintaining muscle mass.
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I want to begin doing low impact brisk walks on the treadmill after my training 3-4 days per week. Two questions I have are 1. Is it still ok to take my cell tech right after the weights and cardio plus a shake with cytocarb 20 miutes later? and 2. I am thinking of repalcing all carbs thereafter with steamed broccoli leading up to the time I sleep.(I work nights) I powerlift so continuing to increase my strength and keep muscle is what I'm concerened about. Thanks.
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I want to begin doing low impact brisk walks on the treadmill after my training 3-4 days per week. Two questions I have are 1. Is it still ok to take my cell tech right after the weights and cardio plus a shake with cytocarb 20 miutes later? and 2. I am thinking of repalcing all carbs thereafter with steamed broccoli leading up to the time I sleep.(I work nights) I powerlift so continuing to increase my strength and keep muscle is what I'm concerened about. Thanks.
You should get carbs either after or during workout.
Those brisk walks would be of better value, if done on off training days, to help with recovery.
I suggest trying to find 1-2 days per week on off training days when you can do a brisk walk, either at home, outdoors, or at the gym.
It will help with recovery, as well as boost the general health and may keep the BF in check, depending on what diet you are on.
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I will try the cardio on the off days and once on a training day. So would you recommend the creatine after lifting and then the shake after the cardio on my lifting/cardio day? Thanks again. That is where I am still a bit unsure what to do.
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talk about a thread revival...wow.
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bumping for 08, dont act like your too good for cardio, just look at your hips...yeah, i thought so.
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cardio is your friend...it lets you eat more shit and not get fat. :)
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ok jerk offs, bumping again,
Doing alot of cardio the last week and half, 2 session per day 1 hour each, getting cut like a diamond, off on holidays soon, got to be real cut