Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: whork on December 23, 2013, 04:54:06 PM
-
Utah Is on Track to End Homelessness by 2015 With This One Simple Idea
Give them an apartment first, ask questions later.
Utah has reduced its rate of chronic homelessness by 78 percent over the past eight years, moving 2000 people off the street and putting the state on track to eradicate homelessness altogether by 2015. How’d they do it? The state is giving away apartments, no strings attached. In 2005, Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000. Each participant works with a caseworker to become self-sufficient, but if they fail, they still get to keep their apartment.
MORE: San Francisco’s homeless take free showers on a bus retrofitted with bathrooms
Other states are eager to emulate Utah’s results. Wyoming has seen its homeless population more than double in the past three years, and it only provides shelter for 26 percent of them, the lowest rate in the country. City officials in Casper, Wyoming, now plan to launch a pilot program using the methods of Utah’s Housing First program. There’s no telling how far the idea might go.
-
They should give them a car and ab xbox too.
-
Utah Is on Track to End Homelessness by 2015 With This One Simple Idea
Give them an apartment first, ask questions later.
Utah has reduced its rate of chronic homelessness by 78 percent over the past eight years, moving 2000 people off the street and putting the state on track to eradicate homelessness altogether by 2015. How’d they do it? The state is giving away apartments, no strings attached. In 2005, Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000. Each participant works with a caseworker to become self-sufficient, but if they fail, they still get to keep their apartment.
MORE: San Francisco’s homeless take free showers on a bus retrofitted with bathrooms
Other states are eager to emulate Utah’s results. Wyoming has seen its homeless population more than double in the past three years, and it only provides shelter for 26 percent of them, the lowest rate in the country. City officials in Casper, Wyoming, now plan to launch a pilot program using the methods of Utah’s Housing First program. There’s no telling how far the idea might go.
why do people who produce nothing get an apartment paid for by money taken from people liek me?
-
why do people who produce nothing get an apartment paid for by money taken from people liek me?
Because it costs more not to give them an apartment.
-
Because it costs more not to give them an apartment.
Hard to argue with the results here.
-
Because it costs more not to give them an apartment.
thats a lie
it costs 0 to give them 0
-
thats a lie
it costs 0 to give them 0
Can you read:
In 2005, Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000
-
Can you read:
In 2005, Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000
there you go again ( Ronald Reagan )
quoting facts.
Or, as The Bookworm told Batman/ Robin, "Facts are stubborn things"
-
That's not really solving homelessness, it's only lowering the cost. You still have a group of people who can't support themselves.
-
That's not really solving homelessness, it's only lowering the cost. You still have a group of people who can't support themselves.
Bingo. Still destitute, still mentally ill, still addicted to drugs and still not producing anything.
But hey, they get a free apartment and "cost less" to support....
-
So a worthless piece of shit is costing the Utah tax payer between 11-15 K? Do they require them to work? Let me guess..
-
Should turn this into a situation that employs people a certain amount for their "apartment" (in reality, most places that do this are only putting people into a single room WITHOUT bathroom, kitchen, etc., so it barely qualifies as an apartment). Those that are serious and capable can be allotted more hours to start saving money to lead a more comfortable life.
Fact is, people want to be successful and they want to be respected. If they're out in the cold, however, they will lose the ability to strive for that. That's what we're seeing.
-
None of which is my problem. If people feel so inclined they can donate time or money to these people. At the very least the taxpayer should be compensated for thier tax dollars. Public works projects..simple stuff like trash pick up in parks etc. Fresh paint, mowed grass....
-
None of which is my problem. If people feel so inclined they can donate time or money to these people. At the very least the taxpayer should be compensated for thier tax dollars. Public works projects..simple stuff like trash pick up in parks etc. Fresh paint, mowed grass....
Absolutely. Myself, I'd have no problem if it gradually replaced the gang of overpaid, under-producing people we currently have holding most government jobs.
-
Its human nature. I'm military but have civilians under me. They can get bonuses and various prizes, time off etc. The process to do this or get my folks this stuff is near on impossible. The friggen bureaucracy under which the gov operates on all levels is ludicris.
-
Yes, bro. It cannot stand.
-
That's not really solving homelessness, it's only lowering the cost. You still have a group of people who can't support themselves.
If you give people a home they are no longer homeless so that is solved actually.
No argument about the second part.
-
So if they have an apartment they no longer abuse drugs, use the er for free healthcare or commit crimes?
Genius ::)
Maybe we should give every illegal alien and urban youth a free apartment too.. Oh wait, here in ca we DO
-
That's not really solving homelessness, it's only lowering the cost. You still have a group of people who can't support themselves.
Its much easier for a person to find a job if they have a place to live so they can shower, clean up, and look presentable for an interview.
-
That's not really solving homelessness, it's only lowering the cost. You still have a group of people who can't support themselves.
Oh it solves the homelessness, you mean the poverty?
They are receiving a home= negates homelessness.
Kids and babies can't support themselves, should be kill them with fire?
-
Oh it solves the homelessness, you mean the poverty?
They are receiving a home= negates homelessness.
Kids and babies can't support themselves, should be kill them with fire?
We should support all people who can't work, don't earn enough money, or would rather play video games.
-
Its much easier for a person to find a job if they have a place to live so they can shower, clean up, and look presentable for an interview.
Yes, that's right. It's much easier for a person to find a job if they have a vehicle too. So let's give them free vehicles and free gas as well. While we are giving away free stuff, throw in a free computer and free internet service too. They can't find a job without a free computer and free internet service.
-
Oh it solves the homelessness, you mean the poverty?
They are receiving a home= negates homelessness.
Kids and babies can't support themselves, should be kill them with fire?
It's semantics. I'd like to see what the long term success rate is. How many of these individuals become self sufficient. It doesn't address the cost of mental health care or substance abuse treatment, a major reason for homelessness.
-
there is 1 way to get people of welfare success 100%
end it
work or starve baby!!
motivation!
-
there is 1 way to get people of welfare success 100%
end it
work or starve baby!!
motivation!
Even children?
-
Interesting concept. Not sure it makes good financial sense, because a working American contributes more than an unemployed American on government assistance.
-
why do people who produce nothing get an apartment paid for by money taken from people liek me?
fucking racist.
-
Interesting concept. Not sure it makes good financial sense, because a working American contributes more than an unemployed American on government assistance.
It's not addressing any of the causes of homelessness. Treatment for substance abuse, mental illness or any kind of job assistance is not being made available as far as I can tell. Add these programs and the cost goes up.
-
It's not addressing any of the causes of homelessness. Treatment for substance abuse, mental illness or any kind of job assistance is not being made available as far as I can tell. Add these programs and the cost goes up.
Agree. Plus the loss of tax revenue from a working American.
Another issue is the cyclical nature of poverty (and success). People given indefinite free housing are more likely to have kids who will require government assistance.
-
These people won't stop doing drugs, ODing weekly and stealing to get their fix just because some simpleton gave them a free apartment.
All the well meaning Mormon idiots did was add $11k to the existing cost per year of a drug addicted , disease ridden bum using the ER every few days, being arrested for stealing regularly or loitering , drinking on the street etc.
I'm sure they won't take that into account since that doesn't fit the agenda here.
-
It's semantics. I'd like to see what the long term success rate is. How many of these individuals become self sufficient. It doesn't address the cost of mental health care or substance abuse treatment, a major reason for homelessness.
I think having a home would do wonders for your mental health. Might even give you the break you need to address the drug issue. And save the taxpayers = You some money. Its a win-win
-
Agree. Plus the loss of tax revenue from a working American.
Another issue is the cyclical nature of poverty (and success). People given indefinite free housing are more likely to have kids who will require government assistance.
So if you give them apartments they will stop working the job they dont have?
-
I think having a home would do wonders for your mental health. Might even give you the break you need to address the drug issue. And save the taxpayers = You some money. Its a win-win
Seems all to easy.
-
Yes, that's right. It's much easier for a person to find a job if they have a vehicle too. So let's give them free vehicles and free gas as well. While we are giving away free stuff, throw in a free computer and free internet service too. They can't find a job without a free computer and free internet service.
We already do...its called public transportation and public libraries with computers with internet service.
-
there is 1 way to get people of welfare success 100%
end it
work or starve baby!!
motivation!
Hello soaring crime rates! Desperation can make people behave in ways they otherwise would not.
-
Yes, that's right. It's much easier for a person to find a job if they have a vehicle too. So let's give them free vehicles and free gas as well. While we are giving away free stuff, throw in a free computer and free internet service too. They can't find a job without a free computer and free internet service.
Sounds good to me. And while we're doing that, ...I can show how to get free gold too. :D :P
-
Interesting concept. Not sure it makes good financial sense,
Does this make financial sense to you?:
In 2005, Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000[/b]
because a working American contributes more than an unemployed American on government assistance.
-
Hard to argue with the results here.
Not really. We don't know the assumptions behind those numbers, what - if any - weighted factors they used. And just because they now have an apartment, have they even done any follow up to determine these people are still not using the ER or going to jail?
And it's not like the government has a stellar track record with accurately assessing costs or properly applying unbiased formulas.
This is hardly something anyone would want to take at face value and not argue the results.
-
We already do...its called public transportation and public libraries with computers with internet service.
Public transportation is not free. How are they going to get to the library? I say give them a free car, free gas, a free computer and free internet service.
-
Sounds good to me. And while we're doing that, ...I can show how to get free gold too. :D :P
24KT/JaguarEnterprises always pushing her scams here.
Michael Forrest Pleads Guilty to Selling Illegal Devices
For several years, doing business as Jaguar Enterprises, Dragonfly Enterprises, and BioElectric, S.A., Michael Forrest manufactured and marketed quack devices for treating cancer, AIDS, hepatitis, herpes, chronic fatigue syndrome, Candida yeast infections, lyme disease, parasites, gastritis, and rheumatoid arthritis. In 2001, Forrest signed an FTC consent agreement that he would not make unsubstantiated claims for any device or herbal products. However, he continued to make illegal claims on his Web sites. He even bragged that (a) "With the intuitive sense that the feds may be knocking on my door soon as a result of making claims about unapproved medical devices I moved from the USA to Costa Rica in 1999," (b) he was then in Paraguay and "out of the reach of the FTC," and (c) he had "hosted the his site "in a country that the feds could not shut it down." After an FDA investigation uncovered what Forrest was doing, he was charged with wire fraud, mail fraud, conspiring to mislead the FDA, and marketing an unapproved medical device. He pled guilty to the device charge in 2005 and in 2006 was sentenced to two years in prison.
Is this why SamsonEnterprises is so angry at America? I'm sure the Feds aren't too receptive towards anyone marketing their products under the "JaguarEnterprises" name.
What is it that makes pyramid schemes tick and why are they so successful? Lets keep it political. ;D
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
FEDERAL TRADE COMMISSION
http://www.ftc.gov/os/2001/06/jaguarconsent.pdf
-
So if you give them apartments they will stop working the job they dont have?
If you give them apartments, indefinitely, you remove the incentive to either find or keep a job and perpetuate the cyclical nature of government dependency and poverty.
-
If you give them apartments, indefinitely, you remove the incentive to either find or keep a job and perpetuate the cyclical nature of government dependency and poverty.
They dont have a job now and is costing the tax payers a lot of money.
Here they get an apartment and save the tax payers money.
-
They dont have a job now and is costing the tax payers a lot of money.
Here they get an apartment and save the tax payers money.
That's exactly how welfare destroyed the African American family. What the government meant as emergency rescue became a way of life.
Poor people barely making enough money to pay rent will now have plenty of incentive to stop paying, get evicted, and then get a Rent Free apartment form the government.
-
That's exactly how welfare destroyed the African American family. What the government meant as emergency rescue became a way of life.
Poor people barely making enough money to pay rent will now have plenty of incentive to stop paying, get evicted, and then get a Rent Free apartment form the government.
So you are saying they will lose their homes on purpose, live on the streets for a while with the plan in my mind to get an apartment? Really?
And even if the above holds true the solution in this thread STILL saves dollars.
-
They should give them a car and ab xbox too.
agreed. it's cruel to expect a homeless person to live in an apartment with entertainment and transportation.
Free wifi and cable should be given too. ObamaFi and BarrackTV.
-
So you are saying they will lose their homes on purpose, live on the streets for a while with the plan in my mind to get an apartment? Really?
And even if the above holds true the solution in this thread STILL saves dollars.
Have poor, American women ever popped babies while remaining unmarried on purpose with the plan in mind to get free government help? Really?
-
Utah calculated the annual cost of E.R. visits and jail stays for an average homeless person was $16,670, while the cost of providing an apartment and social worker would be $11,000.
So the cost is now $27,670 per person.
Or is this apartment a magical drug free place where people don't get sick or into trouble?
-
The idea is that a social worker will be onsite to maintain a relationship with each person, and will continually apply pressure on each individual to resolve the existing issues. For many of the tenants, it's probably the first time in years that they've regularly interacted with a "normal" person.
As I say, everyone wants to be successful, respected and loved. If you put a path in front of people to do that, good things will result from it.
-
The idea is that a social worker will be onsite to maintain a relationship with each person, and will continually apply pressure on each individual to resolve the existing issues. For many of the tenants, it's probably the first time in years that they've regularly interacted with a "normal" person.
As I say, everyone wants to be successful, respected and loved. If you put a path in front of people to do that, good things will result from it.
it worked for tbumz.
-
Not really. We don't know the assumptions behind those numbers, what - if any - weighted factors they used. And just because they now have an apartment, have they even done any follow up to determine these people are still not using the ER or going to jail?
And it's not like the government has a stellar track record with accurately assessing costs or properly applying unbiased formulas.
This is hardly something anyone would want to take at face value and not argue the results.
Nothing like rebutting stats with opinion and conjecture huh?
-
Nothing like rebutting stats with opinion and conjecture huh?
Pointing out what we don't know is not opinion or conjecture.
For the record, I support giving the homeless a place (albeit with reasonable strings), and I've got no problem with assigning them a social worker to try and get them help.
Since you're stupid, reread my post and think about what I said.
I've got a niche market going on this board educating retarded Canadians.
-
I've got a niche market going on this board educating retarded Canadians.
:o {Hrmph} Just when I was starting to like you too. >:(
-
Not all Canadian's are mentally retarded, but you definitely are.
How very Christian of you. ::)
-
How very Christian of you. ::)
24KT/JaguarEnterprises, how very tolerant and very loving of you. ::)
I FVCKING HATE DELUSIONAL EVANGELICALS >:(
You are fvcking certifiable in your delusion & denial.
It's the goddamn evangelicals who make it a political issue. Get real!!!
I will welcome the day that religion is forced underground!
Any evangelical I off, is gonna be one who trys imposing themself on me. There's a big difference.
It's like someone on here once said "I'll shoot the fvckers if I have to."
-
Have poor, American women ever popped babies while remaining unmarried on purpose with the plan in mind to get free government help? Really?
I dont think anybody is HOMELESS on purpose especially in the winter.
-
24KT/JaguarEnterprises, how very tolerant and very loving of you. ::)
I have ABSOLUTELY NO TOLERANCE WHATSOEVER for delusional megalomaniacal evangelical nut jobs determined to force me into living the life they determine I should. Those who harass and bombard me with pages upon pages upon pages of references to religious verses, repeatedly faxed to me. Those who insist upon censoring the books i read, whether chosen by me, ...or even gifted by family members. And I have no tolerance for lobotomized morons who support or condone their insane criminal harassment, simply because they've slapped a socially acceptable label onto themselves. And I have no tolerance for the lobotomized morons who believe it is their duty to do this, as well as punish me if I dare resist or refuse to read their materials
If you want to take my comments out of context and interpret them as me wanting you and all Christians dead, have at it. All reasonable and clear thinking individuals know otherwise.
These deluded fucks are no different than schizophrenics. Those who hear voices are considered nuts.
Talk with dead people, and it's claimed you're speaking with demons, ...but if you slap a religious label on yourself.... well, you have now miraculously become an enlightened being, and the abuse you mete out is perfectly OK because it must be sanctioned and ordained by GOD! ::)
Believe in whatever deity or non-deity you choose, ...just don't try to force me into your psychosis!
Grow a Brain! ...and learn how to use it while you're at it!
ps: Get some new material why don't you? This has become overplayed and staler than day old douche water.
-
I dont think anybody is HOMELESS on purpose especially in the winter.
You've clearly never lived with a self-righteous bible thumper! ;D
-
You've clearly never lived with a self-righteous bible thumper! ;D
Maybe homelesness is no big deal for them because their faith in jesus keeps them warm :P
-
Public transportation is not free. How are they going to get to the library? I say give them a free car, free gas, a free computer and free internet service.
Are you an evangelic christian ???
-
Pointing out what we don't know is not opinion or conjecture.
For the record, I support giving the homeless a place (albeit with reasonable strings), and I've got no problem with assigning them a social worker to try and get them help.
Since you're stupid, reread my post and think about what I said.
I've got a niche market going on this board educating retarded Canadians.
I don't mind either but I suspect the costs are much higher than are being estimated. Giving shelter while not addressing the underlining causes of homelessness does absolutely nothing to remedy the problem in the long run.
-
I have ABSOLUTELY NO TOLERANCE WHATSOEVER for delusional megalomaniacal evangelical nut jobs determined to force me into living the life they determine I should. Those who harass and bombard me with pages upon pages upon pages of references to religious verses, repeatedly faxed to me. Those who insist upon censoring the books i read, whether chosen by me, ...or even gifted by family members. And I have no tolerance for lobotomized morons who support or condone their insane criminal harassment, simply because they've slapped a socially acceptable label onto themselves. And I have no tolerance for the lobotomized morons who believe it is their duty to do this, as well as punish me if I dare resist or refuse to read their materials
If you want to take my comments out of context and interpret them as me wanting you and all Christians dead, have at it. All reasonable and clear thinking individuals know otherwise.
These deluded fucks are no different than schizophrenics. Those who hear voices are considered nuts.
Talk with dead people, and it's claimed you're speaking with demons, ...but if you slap a religious label on yourself.... well, you have now miraculously become an enlightened being, and the abuse you mete out is perfectly OK because it must be sanctioned and ordained by GOD! ::)
Believe in whatever deity or non-deity you choose, ...just don't try to force me into your psychosis!
Grow a Brain! ...and learn how to use it while you're at it!
ps: Get some new material why don't you? This has become overplayed and staler than day old douche water.
You're awful chummy with Ahmed, a person who wants to exterminate all homosexuals.
-
I don't mind either but I suspect the costs are much higher than are being estimated.
Why ??? If the figures was upside down would you suspect them to be wrong also?
Giving shelter while not addressing the underlining causes of homelessness does absolutely nothing to remedy the problem in the long run.
They might still be drunks, drug addicts or just plain poor but now they have a place and all save money. Im not sure where you are going here.
-
They save money only if the cost analysis is right. I don't believe it is. This is a band aid not a cure. I would feel the exact same way if the numbers were "upside down" As a matter of fact, I would pay ten times the cost if I knew the program was helping people become productive contributers.
-
They save money only if the cost analysis is right. I don't believe it is. This is a band aid not a cure. I would feel the exact same way if the numbers were "upside down" As a matter of fact, I would pay ten times the cost if I knew the program was helping people become productive contributers.
Well you wont know unless they try it out now would you?
and wouldnt you know they tried it in Utah and it saved a bunch of money and made life easier for a lot of people.
Its not an analysis anymore they tried it out and ran the numbers.
Are you saying the good people of Utah cant do math properly?
-
You're awful chummy with Ahmed, a person who wants to exterminate all homosexuals.
Of course I am. He has genocidal fantasies... I'm gathering a database of all those with genocidal fantasies.
{whisper} I'm hoping to recruit them for my "War on Religious Proselytizers & Racists" shhh... :P
I have no problem with him. Some of his opinions... well thats another matter. If people treat me with respect, I will do the same. Just because I am polite or cordial to one of my neighbours does not mean I agree with, condone, or support everything they believe in totality. I've made my positions clear to Ahmed, and he has made his clear to me. Like adults, we have agreed to disagree. Because that's what adults do.
We live in a civilized nation where same-sex marriage is the law of the land.
When the mentality of this country shifts to such an extent that there exists the possibility that views like his may gain traction, then perhaps I may alter my attitudes and/ or behaviour towards him.
-
why not free house, car, handjob massueses, tv, beer and everything for everyone ????
-
why not free house, car, handjob massueses, tv, beer and everything for everyone ????
If it could help you not being a sad miserable nut im all for it ;)
-
If it could help you not being a sad miserable nut im all for it ;)
dude I ama super happy hetero hunk and one of most rational people around
you are the welfare commy
lol
-
dude I ama super happy hetero hunk and one of most rational people around
you are the welfare commy
lol
Im glad thats settled then :)
-
Public transportation is not free. How are they going to get to the library? I say give them a free car, free gas, a free computer and free internet service.
You can get vouchers from the city if you're homeless and looking for a job, moron. ::)
-
You can get vouchers from the city if you're homeless and looking for a job, moron. ::)
Vince, what's with the name calling? When have I called you names?
Happy New Year to you and your family!
-
Public transportation is not free. How are they going to get to the library? I say give them a free car, free gas, a free computer and free internet service.
Not sure how sarcastic your suggestions are but a possible solution that's being tried in Brazil right now (called Bolsa Familia) is to give the the poor cash money -- with some strings attached, of course.
Under the Bolsa Familia program, as I understand it, money is given to women only and to keep receiving the money, the women must make sure their kids are up-to-date on vaccinations and are attending school. No school, no money. There are some other conditions, too, I think. (I read the article earlier this week so I'm hazy about the details at this point.)
This program is maybe more suited to serving the needs of the desperately poor (close to starving) than the poor in the USA but it seems to me that there are some intriguing logistical advantages to giving the poor money instead of food or shelter. Money transfers also provide a nice economic boost to the businesses that are patronized by the poor.
I couldn't find the article I originally read about the program but here's a link that pretty informative:
http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/opinion/2013/11/04/bolsa-familia-Brazil-quiet-revolution (http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/opinion/2013/11/04/bolsa-familia-Brazil-quiet-revolution)
-
Not sure how sarcastic your suggestions are but a possible solution that's being tried in Brazil right now (called Bolsa Familia) is to give the the poor cash money -- with some strings attached, of course.
Under the Bolsa Familia program, as I understand it, money is given to women only and to keep receiving the money, the women must make sure their kids are up-to-date on vaccinations and are attending school. No school, no money. There are some other conditions, too, I think. (I read the article earlier this week so I'm hazy about the details at this point.)
This program is maybe more suited to serving the needs of the desperately poor (close to starving) than the poor in the USA but it seems to me that there are some intriguing logistical advantages to giving the poor money instead of food or shelter. Money transfers also provide a nice economic boost to the businesses that are patronized by the poor.
I couldn't find the article I originally read about the program but here's a link that pretty informative:
http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/opinion/2013/11/04/bolsa-familia-Brazil-quiet-revolution (http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/opinion/2013/11/04/bolsa-familia-Brazil-quiet-revolution)
This is the solution the USA should have used to stimulate the economy, ...instead they gave it to the rich. :-\