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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: Big Chiro Flex on April 27, 2014, 09:55:52 PM
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I have a million different guys telling me different protocols for my GH. Help me out GetBig, I need to know the best way.
I have 3IU a day of shitty generics to take, what's the best way? Lately I've been dosing 30 minutes pre workout because I love the wicked pumps I get.
Also, what's the rule in regards to taking it apart from food (insulin), because I hear some saying endogenous insulin wont affect it and others disagreeing.
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There are so many myths on when the best time to use HGH is and also many theories that it is almost pointless unless you are using a Insulin Portocol. I will say this and this is coming from me a guy who has used USA Serostim,Genotropin,Norditropin pens and Humatrope . I have also used Riptropin and the old school Jintropin from china b ut they were actually great HGH products. I def believe them to be 191-AA brainched chain amino Acid form.
You produce the most natural HGH durin your REM sleep basically your deepest sleep when you are dreaming. I think the best times to Inject HGH are right when you wake-up in the morning and also post work-out. If you have enough you could inject HGh Pre-work-out and Post-work-out but if I had to choose just one method I would go with right when you wake-up and right after you work-out. You still should get some good pumpsif you follow that protocol.
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There are so many myths on when the best time to use HGH is and also many theories that it is almost pointless unless you are using a Insulin Portocol. I will say this and this is coming from me a guy who has used USA Serostim,Genotropin,Norditropin pens and Humatrope . I have also used Riptropin and the old school Jintropin from china b ut they were actually great HGH products. I def believe them to be 191-AA brainched chain amino Acid form.
You produce the most natural HGH durin your REM sleep basically your deepest sleep when you are dreaming. I think the best times to Inject HGH are right when you wake-up in the morning and also post work-out. If you have enough you could inject HGh Pre-work-out and Post-work-out but if I had to choose just one method I would go with right when you wake-up and right after you work-out. You still should get some good pumpsif you follow that protocol.
excellent points.
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I have a million different guys telling me different protocols for my GH. Help me out GetBig, I need to know the best way.
I have 3IU a day of shitty generics to take, what's the best way? Lately I've been dosing 30 minutes pre workout because I love the wicked pumps I get.
Also, what's the rule in regards to taking it apart from food (insulin), because I hear some saying endogenous insulin wont affect it and others disagreeing.
There are different protocols because there are a lot of different qualities gh produces. Anti-aging alone is huge, fat reduction and muscle gains are present with requiring separate protocols.
A 212 pro I know who does not give a shit about being lean because he was born shredded and was shredded his entire life takes a protocol to cater to size and size only.
He takes his pre workout slin shot and his stimulants and sugars, amino acid and various protein during the work load, then cranks one huge gh shot post workout of 24 iu, that is it, no other gh time but his post workout, if he does not train, he does not do gh that day. This is to maximize muscle gains because that is all he wants out of the gh.
Others spread it ins 2 to 3 dose throughout the day for maximum fat loss effect.
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There are different protocols because there are a lot of different qualities gh produces. Anti-aging alone is huge, fat reduction and muscle gains are present with requiring separate protocols.
A 212 pro I know who does not give a shit about being lean because he was born shredded and was shredded his entire life takes a protocol to cater to size and size only.
He takes his pre workout slin shot and his stimulants and sugars, amino acid and various protein during the work load, then cranks one huge gh shot post workout of 24 iu, that is it, no other gh time but his post workout, if he does not train, he does not do gh that day. This is to maximize muscle gains because that is all he wants out of the gh.
Others spread it ins 2 to 3 dose throughout the day for maximum fat loss effect.
Yes, I've always heard that using GH for mass would entail splitting your weekly allotment into 3 doses, to be taken post-workout M-W-F. Using it in this fashion could feasibly signal growth mechanisms that stay active for 24+ hours, so no need to take it everyday.
Whether or not this holds true from a physiological standpoint, I always thought it was pretty cool regardless
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Yes, I've always heard that using GH for mass would entail splitting your weekly allotment into 3 doses, to be taken post-workout M-W-F. Using it in this fashion could feasibly signal growth mechanisms that stay active for 24+ hours, so no need to take it everyday.
Whether or not this holds true from a physiological standpoint, I always thought it was pretty cool regardless
small doses periodically through out the day is not as effective as one big mega blast post workout for muscle growth and slin makes it even greater.
so yes what you wrote in your post is correct, the bigger the blast in one setting the greater for potential muscle growth.
In fact some of the pros I have talked to claim gh will not even build muscle if the dose is not greater then 4 iu's at the very minimum (not sure if true or not), but nevertheless 8 iu in one setting for muscle growth is ideal.
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small doses periodically through out the day is not as effective as one big mega blast post workout for muscle growth and slin makes it even greater.
so yes what you wrote in your post is correct, the bigger the blast in one setting the greater for potential muscle growth.
In fact some of the pros I have talked to claim gh will not even build muscle if the dose is not greater then 4 iu's at the very minimum (not sure if true or not), but nevertheless 8 iu in one setting for muscle growth is ideal.
So My workout is done at 6pm....then when do I pin and when do I eat?
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So My workout is done at 6pm....then when do I pin and when do I eat?
Also doesn't hgh counteract slin? so wouldn't you want to separate the two, with slin taken after the workout saving hgh for bed?
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Also doesn't hgh counteract slin? so wouldn't you want to separate the two, with slin taken after the workout saving hgh for bed?
that is what most do, however a pre workout slin shot (has to be fast acting) and your gh shot 3.5 hours later is also common.
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that is what most do, however a pre workout slin shot (has to be fast acting) and your gh shot 3.5 hours later is also common.
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Like I was saying earlier there are so many crazy myths. OneTimeHard do you really buy into the concept that HGH is pointless or very weak unless you are also doing a Insulin Protocol?
I personally don"t belive it however I do think if you are doing both a insulin and HGH protocol you are likely going to buiild up more muscle however I do believe this is how guys are getting thoe big guts.
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Like I was saying earlier there are so many crazy myths. OneTimeHard do you really buy into the concept that HGH is pointless or very weak unless you are also doing a Insulin Protocol?
I personally don"t belive it however I do think if you are doing both a insulin and HGH protocol you are likely going to buiild up more muscle however I do believe this is how guys are getting thoe big guts.
oh hell no, gh is great without slin but slin is very powerful and without the gh taking slin would get you fat.
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oh hell no, gh is great without slin but slin is very powerful and without the gh taking slin would get you fat.
Yes that is one thing I have learned is if you use just Insulin without HGH you are likjely going to get bloated badly,however theirb are rare cases where some guys will gain decent muscle just using insulin but this is very rare. Insulin I believe is one of the most anabolic compounds. I would be satisfied just using high grade USA Pharmacy grade HGH. I think my top 3 brands I have tried is genotropin( a tad more water retention, makes hands swollen and puffy), Serostim( kind of the same deal a little less water but still made my hands swollen), Humatrope(this brand seemed to give me the most strength gains, same deal with the hands(made them swollen,puffy and they hurt even when writing my name).
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Yes that is one thing I have learned is if you use just Insulin without HGH you are likjely going to get bloated badly,however theirb are rare cases where some guys will gain decent muscle just using insulin but this is very rare. Insulin I believe is one of the most anabolic compounds. I would be satisfied just using high grade USA Pharmacy grade HGH. I think my top 3 brands I have tried is genotropin( a tad more water retention, makes hands swollen and puffy), Serostim( kind of the same deal a little less water but still made my hands swollen), Humatrope(this brand seemed to give me the most strength gains, same deal with the hands(made them swollen,puffy and they hurt even when writing my name).
I wish someone could explain this to me. How can one pharm gh differ in effect from another (solution not withstanding) test e is the same regard less of manufacture.All gh is the same molecule(except 192).im not believing till I get proof.
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So My workout is done at 6pm....then when do I pin and when do I eat?
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First thing upon rising with an empty stomach is the best for me. No food for 45 mins afterwards.
I've never cared for it post workout because A) I work out about 10:30am in the morning and work out fasted and B) I need food ASAP post workout and see no need to take GH afterwards when I am going to be eating immediately.
I always use Serostim since I have easy access to it through people that have scripts. I will say that if mass and size are your goals, then you need insulin as well. Serostim alone will only lean you up a good bit (except in the face) and kick the metabolism up. So unless you need to cut a bit, there is no reason to use it by itself.
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What are you looking for......fat-loss/quality of life or epic mass gains?
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What are you looking for......fat-loss/quality of life or epic mass gains?
yes, good questions, different goals and timing does matter, albeit marginally but for the price of gh you want to get the most out of it
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What are you looking for......fat-loss/quality of life or epic mass gains?
Good question, I should have clarified....
My yo-yo bulking/cutting days are done. I just like to maintain sub 10% BF year round. As long as I keep training hard, I still make slow and steady gains on pretty low doses.
Always wanted to try real GH, so I got 2 kits of generic yellow tops. Just curious how to maximize my product since it is very expensive.
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small doses periodically through out the day is not as effective as one big mega blast post workout for muscle growth and slin makes it even greater.
so yes what you wrote in your post is correct, the bigger the blast in one setting the greater for potential muscle growth.
In fact some of the pros I have talked to claim gh will not even build muscle if the dose is not greater then 4 iu's at the very minimum (not sure if true or not), but nevertheless 8 iu in one setting for muscle growth is ideal.
This is great info to know, i want to get the most out of my Seros when i really try to out on serious size.
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So My workout is done at 6pm....then when do I pin and when do I eat?
Pin the minute you get home and wait 1 hour to eat.
If you are only shooting once a day it should be post workout.
8)
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Pin the minute you get home and wait 1 hour to eat.
If you are only shooting once a day it should be post workout.
8)
Thanks brother!
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Pin the minute you get home and wait 1 hour to eat.
If you are only shooting once a day it should be post workout.
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Wouldn't it be better to pin it when you're getting changed after the gym and then by the time you've gotten ready and driven home, cooked etc it would be time to eat?
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I can do the cooler trick, that's no problem
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Oth and WW what would the timing be for size? Most likely you want to use slin with it.If you did pre workout slin do you do g.h. immed after training? Then how soon after can you do slin again? Or should you do g.h.by itself before bed? Or first thing in morning? Or does it not matter? What would be your size protocol with slin doing big shot g.h.3x week.do you still use slin on days off g.h. or will it just get you fat? Thanks
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Did the post workout dose the last 2 days then waited 75 mins to eat. I noticed my pump remained for far longer than normal. Completely anecdotal but this is what I saw.
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Always done mine before bed. If done during the day I just end up falling asleep.
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Oth and WW what would the timing be for size? Most likely you want to use slin with it.If you did pre workout slin do you do g.h. immed after training? Then how soon after can you do slin again? Or should you do g.h.by itself before bed? Or first thing in morning? Or does it not matter? What would be your size protocol with slin doing big shot g.h.3x week.do you still use slin on days off g.h. or will it just get you fat? Thanks
First off for optimal results you do want to be using HGH/Slin everyday and you honestly should be training almost 7 days a week anyway.When I am using HGH I use my heaviest dose in the morning usually it is just a 4IU shot after I wake-up. I honestly have never been a huge insulin user and this is due to health worrys. I think if you use Insulin def use it after your workout and learn how to eat properly and know how much sugars to take in as well.
I would also shoot more HGH after my workout. at least 2 IU so right there I would be at 6IU of Pharma grade right there. The reason I don;t use HGH at bedtime is because if you can still get some natural HGH from your body that is going to happen when you are in your REM sleep.
REM sleep is the few hours of sleep where you are totally out and dreaming that is when you are producing natural HGH production, using Insulin at night can screw that up mainly because you have to eat the right foods after you shoot insulin. If your shooting Insulin your going to have to take in more sugar so that is why I don"t like using Insulin plus even though HGH and Insulin have a great synergistic effect it just is on a nutty level I wouldn't even use and I do some crazy shit but even that is to crazy for me. Shooting Insulin is for diabetics and I def don"t want anything to backfire and wind up insulin dependent. I am already to dependent on too many other drugs.
Sounds kind of pussy but you do have to be careful especially when using Insulin. Bodybuilders get away without using HGH/Insulin protocols for years so they still can get away with it and more bodybuilders then you probably would think don;t use Insulin however it does have a amazing synergistic effect when your also shooting HGH. If I was just going balls to the walls for that pro card I would do anything it took but I am not into that goal. I just don;t have the natural genetics for it. I am a good lifter and have a good physique but I am not delusional! No way I would turn pro especially these days! Guys are just getting fucking huge these days!
But in a nutt-shell you would want to use HGH in the morning at least 2-4IU's plus your going to want to have a stock pile of both fast acting insulin and time released insulin I would use the fast acting Insulin in the morning. I am not sure what level you are at so not quite sue what dosage to tell you to use of the Insulin but if you have USA Pharma Grade HGH I don;t see any reason to use more then 8IU's a day.
Another real imprtnt shot would be your post workout shot of HGH and insulin.Def shoot your HGH first and eat a little before you shoot your Insulin. Make sure you have alot of pure anabolic foods o hand as well like grapefruits but treat them with respect don't get ole kai green on those Grapefruits-lol. Also make sure you have just 100% Grapefruit juice. Give me a little history of your gear and training history and your diet so I can name you off a good dose to use. also would nee your real wieght. You can PM it to me if you feel better doing it that way. just try to keep the insulin shot down to 3 a day. 4 won't hurt but the smallest you van get by with the more room you have to improve
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I have done mine every way you can imagine, I have finally settled on doing it first thing when I wake up, I dont run more than 5iu a day though, if I was I would split it am and pm. Most of the gurus recommend 1st thing in the am.
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I have done mine every way you can imagine, I have finally settled on doing it first thing when I wake up, I dont run more than 5iu a day though, if I was I would split it am and pm. Most of the gurus recommend 1st thing in the am.
Only thing I don't like is that Im dying to eat first thing when I wake up
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Yea me 2, I pin it then do 20mins light cardio, shower then pound down my first meal. Just started adding slin to my first meal
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shooting insulin is for diabetics.. well, that's true.. and it's true because their blood sugar is high and they take it to lower blood sugar.
i'd be willing to bet that most of you have never checked your blood sugar.. now if you're running 4-6iu/gh per day and you're 'afraid' of using insulin for fear of the health risks, you're afraid of the wrong thing. you should be afraid of the health risks of NOT using insulin, as if you'd check your blood sugar, you'll probably be surprised to see you're likely in the 130-140 range at least.
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I check my blood sugar regularly first thing in the am, usually is about 70-72, as well as get my blood level checked every 6 weeks and removed if needed due to high red blood count, which I had before ever taking any injectables.
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shooting insulin is for diabetics.. well, that's true.. and it's true because their blood sugar is high and they take it to lower blood sugar.
i'd be willing to bet that most of you have never checked your blood sugar.. now if you're running 4-6iu/gh per day and you're 'afraid' of using insulin for fear of the health risks, you're afraid of the wrong thing. you should be afraid of the health risks of NOT using insulin, as if you'd check your blood sugar, you'll probably be surprised to see you're likely in the 130-140 range at least.
Excellent post
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Wouldn't it be better to pin it when you're getting changed after the gym and then by the time you've gotten ready and driven home, cooked etc it would be time to eat?
Sure thing, if he has that option it's a great idea.
8)
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Oth and WW what would the timing be for size? Most likely you want to use slin with it.If you did pre workout slin do you do g.h. immed after training? Then how soon after can you do slin again? Or should you do g.h.by itself before bed? Or first thing in morning? Or does it not matter? What would be your size protocol with slin doing big shot g.h.3x week.do you still use slin on days off g.h. or will it just get you fat? Thanks
A pro I know does 5iu slin after breakfast and 5iu slin after lunch, 10 iu slin pre workout, 2 hour workout and post workout gh at 15 iu in one shot. This is off-season for size.
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A pro I know does 5iu slin after breakfast and 5iu slin after lunch, 10 iu slin pre workout, 2 hour workout and post workout gh at 15 iu in one shot. This is off-season for size.
If I had to do shit like that I would pack it in.
If I had to inject more than 4 times a week I would seriously consider my future.
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If I had to do shit like that I would pack it in.
If I had to inject more than 4 times a week I would seriously consider my future.
well you are not 270 with abs
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well you are not 270 with abs
Im not disappointed about that.
Point still remains if you need to be pinning upwards of 30-40 times a week its verging on lunacy.
Can you imagine these guys meeting a new girl, after a few weeks its time to let them in on the dirty secret of what it takes to look the way they look.
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A pro I know does 5iu slin after breakfast and 5iu slin after lunch, 10 iu slin pre workout, 2 hour workout and post workout gh at 15 iu in one shot. This is off-season for size.
back when I was using heavy insulin (well, at the time was considered heavy.. 14-15yrs ago before we had this "100-200iu/day" nonsense)
I'd run 15iu 30mins before breakfast, 5iu around noon, 12-15iu post workout, and 12-15iu before bed.... occasionally the breakfast and post workout doses were 18-20. don't believe I ever went over 22-25iu in 1 shot.
always preferred humulin R. hated Humalog, made me so tired I couldn't function. literally falling asleep sitting up post injection and meal... didn't mind the longer acting slins, such as L and N or even 70/30, but I wasn't using GH, just had to adjust the dosing with the longer ones.
looking back, I can't say I was too impressed with it.
every meal was heavy pastas (this was before the Vitagrow-type supps we have now).... so much carbs that it was difficult to get in enough protein.
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Im not disappointed about that.
Point still remains if you need to be pinning upwards of 30-40 times a week its verging on lunacy.
Can you imagine these guys meeting a new girl, after a few weeks its time to let them in on the dirty secret of what it takes to look the way they look.
You do not get it after all these years. ??? ??? ??? Climbing a mountain is lunacy, its Russian Roulette, people do because that is their desire and inner drive same with the guy that is 270 with abs. There is fulfillment involved, no different then why you just stepped on stage only his is more extreme, both are retarded to the average conservative Joe.
What is lunacy is that I have to explain this to a 50 year old man ;) ...Now if you want to get more precise his usage is way more profitable then your own. Consider his 40 injections bring him 80 grand per year, whereas your 4 injections (as you put it) bring you a big FAT NOTHING. :-\
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In case anyone thinks this reg
I occupy soooo much space in your mind.
how many pictures of me do you have on your hard drive?
you continue to post pics when I was in the 190's and claim that's what I look like on '6g year round!' ect... it's pathetic.
you're a sad and bitter old man.
you should really come to southern California sometime.. I'd love to spar with you. we can use Arces gym... bring a 'before' picture.
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shooting insulin is for diabetics.. well, that's true.. and it's true because their blood sugar is high and they take it to lower blood sugar.
i'd be willing to bet that most of you have never checked your blood sugar.. now if you're running 4-6iu/gh per day and you're 'afraid' of using insulin for fear of the health risks, you're afraid of the wrong thing. you should be afraid of the health risks of NOT using insulin, as if you'd check your blood sugar, you'll probably be surprised to see you're likely in the 130-140 range at least.
That is a problem you might become insulin dependent. I say if your not diabetic and have no chance of making money of your phsyique fuck using insulin. I shouldn"t really of posted much about insulin usage because I don"t do those kind of protocols. That is just nutty to me! I do some crazy shit but that is just even to crazy for me.
I think there are pros who have great physiques that are not using insulin protocols unless they are just lying. but I don"t know they are honest about using HGH but even some pros don't like the whole insulin protocol. It is actually pretty dangerous. you just don't want to fuck with your health like that unless you are getting super rich off doing it, even then if it take 25-35 years off your life is any amount of money worth that? Nothing wrong with just using Pharma HGH or top nothing chinese HGH. Were talking minimal diffrence here. Sure their will be a benefit that might make you place higher but remeber you have to be one of the top 10 Bodybuilders in the world to crack the millions otherwise your stuck selling supplements.
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I wish someone could explain this to me. How can one pharm gh differ in effect from another (solution not withstanding) test e is the same regard less of manufacture.All gh is the same molecule(except 192).im not believing till I get proof.
Because their is a 10% margin of error the FDA allows and some companys take advantage of that or they try their best but if it falls in that 10% margin of eror they can let it on the market.so if you take a look at upojohn test it could be as low as 180mg per ml and still be allowed to be sold. lets say watsons batch is 199mg per ml wich would you rather have?same goes with HGH it could be 10% underdosed or 10% overdosed going by FDA standards so technically all the brands some lots are stronger and some or weaker as long as it meets that 10% margin of error the company will release the product,Pharmaceutical companys are huge greedy cash cows. I have seen it done all the time. I have gotten some brands of the same medication and one is definately stronger even if it is just 1-2mg stronger I can tell.
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A pro I know does 5iu slin after breakfast and 5iu slin after lunch, 10 iu slin pre workout, 2 hour workout and post workout gh at 15 iu in one shot. This is off-season for size.
damn he must be going through a shit load of HGH kits. fuck thats like a kit a week? has to be chinese? I couldn't imagine anybody spending that much on HGH.
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You do not get it after all these years. ??? ??? ??? Climbing a mountain is lunacy, its Russian Roulette, people do because that is their desire and inner drive same with the guy that is 270 with abs. There is fulfillment involved, no different then why you just stepped on stage only his is more extreme, both are retarded to the average conservative Joe.
What is lunacy is that I have to explain this to a 50 year old man ;) ...Now if you want to get more precise his usage is way more profitable then your own. Consider his 40 injections bring him 80 grand per year, whereas your 4 injections (as you put it) bring you a big FAT NOTHING. :-\
Oh I do get it, thats just it, you may as well be a fucking heroin addict just sitting around pinning yourself all day.
Its meant to be a sport, a way of looking good and prolonging your life, yes, thats what its really about.
I train to look and feel good year round, not hide away in my house eating and shooting substances into my body every couple of hours.
As I said if you have to take over 2gms of gear , then its not for you, you are going to die sooner than you should.
You use the climbing a mountain analogy, its not a bad one, people climb mountains with minimum equipment and use their natural talents to do it, some get virtually carried up by sherpas.
See the similarities?
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I occupy soooo much space in your mind.
how many pictures of me do you have on your hard drive?
you continue to post pics when I was in the 190's and claim that's what I look like on '6g year round!' ect... it's pathetic.
you're a sad and bitter old man.
you should really come to southern California sometime.. I'd love to spar with you. we can use Arces gym... bring a 'before' picture.
The only space you occupy in my mind is the anticipation of you posting a picture looking better than the one I post.
As for sparring with you, you are likely to pull a gun on me if you start losing the argument, old habits die hard.
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Oh I do get it, thats just it, you may as well be a fucking heroin addict just sitting around pinning yourself all day.
Its meant to be a sport, a way of looking good and prolonging your life, yes, thats what its really about.
I train to look and feel good year round, not hide away in my house eating and shooting substances into my body every couple of hours.
As I said if you have to take over 2gms of gear , then its not for you, you are going to die sooner than you should.
You use the climbing a mountain analogy, its not a bad one, people climb mountains with minimum equipment and use their natural talents to do it, some get virtually carried up by sherpas.
See the similarities?
wrong big time^^, this is not what its about for them, your post just proved you DON'T GET IT AT ALL.
The mountain climber encounters danger and death, a small price they are willing to pay to sooth the soul, the wild beast living in them that desires ''fire'' ''sheer will'' ''glory'' , call it whatever, call it a journey, call it adventure, whatever but that is what they want. GET IT
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wrong big time^^, this is not what its about for them, your post just proved you DON'T GET IT AT ALL.
The mountain climber encounters danger and death, a small price they are willing to pay to sooth the soul, the wild beast living in them that desires ''fire'' ''sheer will'' ''glory'' , call it whatever, call it a journey, call it adventure, whatever but that is what they want. GET IT
I get it that its what motivates them (genetically incompetent bodybuilders), truth is its sad, its sad that they dont have the sense to realise its beyond their grasp, its not for them.
Mountains again, its like someone not fit enough to get to base camp keep buying increasingly more expensive boots and gear.
Its never going to happen.
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I get it that its what motivates them (genetically incompetent bodybuilders), truth is its sad, its sad that they dont have the sense to realise its beyond their grasp, its not for them.
Mountains again, its like someone not fit enough to get to base camp keep buying increasingly more expensive boots and gear.
Its never going to happen.
Bro don't be so bitter, wow, worry about yourself and what you want in life, don't worry about what others want just cause it ain't your cup of tea. To each their own
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Bro don't be so bitter, wow, worry about yourself and what you want in life, don't worry about what others want just cause it ain't your cup of tea. To each their own
Im not bitter Im just expressing an opinion, I tried snooker, I wasnt any good, I played football( goalkeeper = failed striker ;D) played rugby, quite successfully, although I didnt like the fact I wasn't in control of my success.
I then got into bodybuilding.
If nothing had happened when I started lifting and I didnt improve, Im not dumb enough to believe the answer lies in a syringe.
Which ever way you look at it, someone taking over 2 gms a week and still struggling to compete Nationally is a fool.
Sure, its their dream, its what defines them. ::)
Its about being realistic about your capabilities.
Each their own, yes of course, why not have major surgery to have all the muscles added and shoot synthol into them to win a plastic trophy?
Are you justifying that as acceptable?
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If they are happy as a person, why not
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If they are happy as a person, why not
Makes all the people attacking Halo about his child seem silly now doesnt it?
As long as people are happy what business is it of anyone else.
Doesn't stop people having an opinion now does it?
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Im not bitter Im just expressing an opinion, I tried snooker, I wasnt any good, I played football( goalkeeper = failed striker ;D) played rugby, quite successfully, although I didnt like the fact I wasn't in control of my success.
I then got into bodybuilding.
If nothing had happened when I started lifting and I didnt improve, Im not dumb enough to believe the answer lies in a syringe.
Which ever way you look at it, someone taking over 2 gms a week and still struggling to compete Nationally is a fool.
Sure, its their dream, its what defines them. ::)
Its about being realistic about your capabilities.
Each their own, yes of course, why not have major surgery to have all the muscles added and shoot synthol into them to win a plastic trophy?
Are you justifying that as acceptable?
In case you forgot the comments you made were in response with a post about what a pro does, so over 2 grams nationally? hmmmm how ironic you just chose to use a dose that you set your limits too but yet could only muster up an 8th place spot.
You should reconsider your position and it should say anyone competing nationally and taking less then 2 grams is delusional and a fool, like bringing a knife to a gun fight, if they think they can to anything with that dose at nationals.
BTW 8th nationals really sucks, nothing special
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In case you forgot the comments you made were in response with a post about what a pro does, so over 2 grams nationally? hmmmm how ironic you just chose to use a dose that you set your limits too but yet could only muster up an 8th place spot.
You should reconsider your position and it should say anyone competing nationally and taking less then 2 grams is delusional and a fool, like bringing a knife to a gun fight, if they think they can to anything with that dose at nationals.
BTW 8th nationals really sucks, nothing special
For the record, I didnt take 2gms, and I took advice from someone I thought knew better, never again will I go anywhere near a gram, total waste of time.
By the way, there was no need to make this personal, I discussed my dosages with you in a private PM.
Shame you felt you had to throw that information into the threads to try and prove a point.
Posters take note, this is how a mod behaves on an open forum.
Keep your cards close to your chest guys.
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For the record, I didnt take 2gms, and I took advice from someone I thought knew better, never again will I go anywhere near a gram, total waste of time.
By the way, there was no need to make this personal, I discussed my dosages with you in a private PM.
Shame you felt you had to throw that information into the threads to try and prove a point.
Posters take note, this is how a mod behaves on an open forum.
Keep your cards close to your chest guys.
I never revealed anything you wrote to me in PM, NOT A DAM THING.
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also you been clowning around this board for some time, not respecting OP's threads and putting pics up of other members for the purpose to make fun.
This behavior has to stop here on the steroid board and that is your warning
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I like you both and I didn't detect anything malicious posted by OTH.
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I like you both and I didn't detect anything malicious posted by OTH.
I assumed based on his previous post that his limit is 2 grams because he stated ''over 2 grams is a fool" .... that is a fair assumption on my behalf based on his post not pms.
He talked about stuff on pm but that was not on my mind at all, in fact just checked the pm and it does not say anything about 2 grams so his accusations are false. I do not discuss PMs unless the person would want me to, which they wouldn't 99% of the time
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also you been clowning around this board for some time, not respecting OP's threads and putting pics up of other members for the purpose to make fun.
This behavior has to stop here on the steroid board and that is your warning
Im putting pics up of other members because that said member keeps advocating huge fucking dosages and is encouraging readers here to believe thats an acceptable level of to take for a first time user (4gms in case you missed it while you were away)
Its only right they see what 6gms of gear gets you if you are genetically not cut out for bodybuilding.
I will stop posting in this section now and continue in the G&O.
You carry on posting huge dosages that all your genetically inferior friends are throwing down themselves to your hearts content.
You will have a lot of funerals to attend in the next few years if those dosages are true.
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I assumed based on his previous post that his limit is 2 grams because he stated ''over 2 grams is a fool" .... that is a fair assumption on my behalf based on his post not pms.
He talked about stuff on pm but that was not on my mind at all, in fact just checked the pm and it does not say anything about 2 grams so his accusations are false. I do not discuss PMs unless the person would want me to, which they wouldn't 99% of the time
You shouldnt make assumptions, they are seldom accurate.
hmmmm how ironic you just chose to use a dose that you set your limits too but yet could only muster up an 8th place spot.
That my friend is an accusation I have used 2gms whichever way you cut it.
8th place in a National level show after 17 years away from the stage isnt great, but it aint bad.
Lets see how you fair when you finally get the trunks on again.
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Im putting pics up of other members because that said member keeps advocating huge fucking dosages and is encouraging readers here to believe thats an acceptable level of to take for a first time user (4gms in case you missed it while you were away)
Its only right they see what 6gms of gear gets you if you are genetically not cut out for bodybuilding.
I will stop posting in this section now and continue in the G&O.
You carry on posting huge dosages that all your genetically inferior friends are throwing down themselves to your hearts content.
You will have a lot of funerals to attend in the next few years if those dosages are true.
funny, I knew pros 10 years ago, lots of them even back then and posted mega dosing back then as well and heard the same thing back then too. Guess what, have not attended one funeral.
As for your logic, it maybe sound but it is breaking rules here and rules that are put up for a reason.
I let esfitness talk about huge dosages because that is the freedom of the board,..... ww, overload and myself all agree that a beginner, new to juice would get tremendous results with 500mg per week.
Point being is for every one person recommending a beginner start with 3grams or more there are 100's of others saying 500 mg is plenty. Nobody is going to base their decision against 100 over 1.
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He talked about stuff on pm but that was not on my mind at all, in fact just checked the pm and it does not say anything about 2 grams so his accusations are false.
Not on your mind yet you knew I placed 8th? ;)
So not totally false.
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funny, I knew pros 10 years ago, lots of them even back then and posted mega dosing back then as well and heard the same thing back then too. Guess what, have not attended one funeral.
As for your logic, it maybe sound but it is breaking rules here and rules that are put up for a reason.
I let esfitness talk about huge dosages because that is the freedom of the board,..... ww, overload and myself all agree that a beginner, new to juice would get tremendous results with 500mg per week.
Point being is for every one person recommending a beginner start with 3grams or more there are 100's of others saying 500 mg is plenty. Nobody is going to base their decision against 100 over 1.
Shame the freedom of the board doesn't apply when I want to have my opinion, which is all I have done in this thread.
Because it doesnt fit in with your mindset you have been arguing against it.
but let loonies tell newbies to take 4gms, thats fine.
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I never revealed anything you wrote to me in PM, NOT A DAM THING.
8th place?
Feel free to apologise via PM or on the board.
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You shouldnt make assumptions, they are seldom accurate.That my friend is an accusation I have used 2gms whichever way you cut it.
8th place in a National level show after 17 years away from the stage isnt great, but it aint bad.
Lets see how you fair when you finally get the trunks on again.
I do not care what you took, whether it was 2 grams or 4 shots, whatever, you missed the point entirely. At national you are going against guys who are taking 4 + grams and you are bringing a knife to a gun fight.
Did you look good? yes you looked amazing, very crisp and dry but if you want to place higher, small dose at this particular level will not cut it.
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I do not care what you took, whether it was 2 grams or 4 shots, whatever, you missed the point entirely. At national you are going against guys who are taking 4 + grams and you are bringing a knife to a gun fight.
Did you look good? yes you looked amazing, very crisp and dry but if you want to place higher, small dose at this particular level will not cut it.
Thats just it, I dont care that they are taking huge dosages to win shows, do I want to look like the guy who won, not in a million fucking years.
I get onstage to compete with myself, I dont care where the judges place me, it was about showing people what I had done and proving to myself I could still get onstage and look OK at 48 years of age.
If I took 6gms of gear could I win the British title, no, of course not, my body just wont gain that amount of tissue, its not within my genetic limits.
Its the same reason you will always be a light heavy no matter what you take, we are stuck with what our parents gave us.
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8th place?
Feel free to apologise via PM or on the board.
you feel free to apologize for accusations you can not back up. 8th place? are you fucken kidding me, you think I got that info from a pm?
.......... back in Feb someone told me ukjeff is back and that he is simple Simon, then I was looking through some threads and there happened to be a fued going on between you and Sev and you told him you placed 8th in Mr. Britain so don't talk shit bro, this is public info you revealed on open forum. NOT ME GETTING IT FROM PM, wow, paranoid there buddy?
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Shame the freedom of the board doesn't apply when I want to have my opinion, which is all I have done in this thread.
Because it doesnt fit in with your mindset you have been arguing against it.
but let loonies tell newbies to take 4gms, thats fine.
wrong again, me disagreeing with your opinion is just my opinion, no harm in that, we can debate for 50 pages, what's the problem?
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Not on your mind yet you knew I placed 8th? ;)
So not totally false.
yes totally false, I read you got 8th on open forum during a fued with sev where you stated you placed 8th in Mr. Britain. whether you repeated it on PM is irrelevant.
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you feel free to apologize for accusations you can not back up. 8th place? are you fucken kidding me, you think I got that info from a pm?
.......... back in Feb someone told me ukjeff is back and that he is simple Simon, then I was looking through some threads and there happened to be a fued going on between you and Sev and you told him you placed 8th in Mr. Britain so don't talk shit bro, this is public info you revealed on open forum. NOT ME GETTING IT FROM PM, wow, paranoid there buddy?
are you saying I didnt send you a PM with me telling you how I placed and what I took?
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You two need to stop quarreling. You're both exceptional posters on this board, you're on the same side fellas. Dont take this that seriously. We need both of you here to make this board great.
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wrong again, me disagreeing with your opinion is just my opinion, no harm in that, we can debate for 50 pages, what's the problem?
You have earlier in this thread threatened me with a warning.
Whats to debate, I think anyone having to take 2gms to turn pro is wasting their time, you dont.
Im not going to change my mind and neither are you, so essentially there is no debate.
You jumping in telling me I'm wrong and hiding behind your mod status is pretty lame.
I really tried to get on with you this time around but I feel its never going to happen.
I think we better just avoid each other.
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are you saying I didnt send you a PM with me telling you how I placed and what I took?
it doesn't matter if you did, I discussed it because I had heard it on open forum by your writing, if you had not wrote that where 43 000 members can read it then I would not have mentioned it but guess what? YOU DID.
Like a guy telling the entire board that he is 200lb and then stating 50 things in a pm to me including that he is 200lb,... then I say he is 200lb and then he accuses me of revealing his pm, wtf are you fucken kidding me ???
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You have earlier in this thread threatened me with a warning.
Whats to debate, I think anyone having to take 2gms to turn pro is wasting their time, you dont.
Im not going to change my mind and neither are you, so essentially there is no debate.
You jumping in telling me I'm wrong and hiding behind your mod status is pretty lame.
I really tried to get on with you this time around but I feel its never going to happen.
I think we better just avoid each other.
your warning has nothing to do with our debate, it has to do wth you breaking the rules and clowning around
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You two need to stop quarreling. You're both exceptional posters on this board, you're on the same side fellas. Dont take this that seriously. We need both of you here to make this board great.
Sorry bro, just responding to the false accusation over a pm.
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Sorry bro, just responding to the false accusation over a pm.
Look mate , you made this personal, not me, you are supposed to be a moderator FFS.
In case you forgot the comments you made were in response with a post about what a pro does, so over 2 grams nationally? hmmmm how ironic you just chose to use a dose that you set your limits too but yet could only muster up an 8th place spot.
You should reconsider your position and it should say anyone competing nationally and taking less then 2 grams is delusional and a fool, like bringing a knife to a gun fight, if they think they can to anything with that dose at nationals.
BTW 8th nationals really sucks, nothing special
What has my placing in a show got to do with anything in this thread?
We can all get personal about other peoples achievements but thats not going to get us anywhere.
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Look mate , you made this personal, not me, you are supposed to be a moderator FFS.
What has my placing in a show got to do with anything in this thread?
We can all get personal about other peoples achievements but thats not going to get us anywhere.
lmao, you stating ''anyone over 2 grams is a fool'' is taking a personal stab at me if you are writing to me knowing full well I take more then 2 grams.
Don't turn this around or play dumb with your clever antics and despicable hypocrisy, you drew first and camouflaged it as ''indirect'' who the fuck you think you are talking to here? a fucken 5 year old.
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lmao, you stating ''anyone over 2 grams is a fool'' is taking a personal stab at me if you are writing to me knowing full well I take more then 2 grams.
Don't turn this around or play dumb with your clever antics and despicable hypocrisy, you drew first and camouflaged it as ''indirect'' who the fuck you think you are talking to here? a fucken 5 year old.
It was never about you, think what you like.
One last comment then Im done in this section, if you want to get personal.
"8th place Nationals really sucks, nothing special"
Just remind everyone where you placed in the Canadian Nationals. ;)
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It was never about you, think what you like.
One last comment then Im done in this section, if you want to get personal.
"8th place Nationals really sucks, nothing special"
Just remind everyone where you placed in the Canadian Nationals. ;)
You called me a fool for taking to much and I retaliated that you are a fool for not taking enough for the level you competed at since you landed 8th, it was me throwing one back at you. FAIR PLAY HERE
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You called me a fool for taking to much and I retaliated that you are a fool for not taking enough for the level you competed at since you landed 8th, it was me throwing one back at you. FAIR PLAY HERE
I never called you a fool at all, you just ASSUMED that, remember I explained "assumption" earlier in the thread.
If I had taken 10 grams I wouldn't have won that show, thats not how steroids work, if that was the case anyone could be Mr Olympia.
You have been known to take up to 5gms and have never got past LHW onstage at a local show.
The drugs are not where its at mate.
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I never called you a fool at all, you just ASSUMED that, remember I explained "assumption" earlier in the thread.
If I had taken 10 grams I wouldn't have won that show, thats not how steroids work, if that was the case anyone could be Mr Olympia.
You have been known to take up to 5gms and have never got past LHW onstage at a local show.
The drugs are not where its at mate.
first of all you are now a liar, I have never done 5 grams ever, in fact never even done 4 grams ever and second of all I last competed as a heavyweight, not a light heavy.
Now you need to lie to feel better? knock yourself out
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(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=239021.0;attach=279096;image)
That was you on 3.5 gms a week and 500gms of protein a week.
Now, if you took 6gms, what do you think would happen?
If I was mistaken about the 5gms then I apologise, I thought that had been established.
What weight did you compete at at heavy weight?
I take it this was your HW show?
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=402457.0;attach=442045)
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(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=239021.0;attach=279096;image)
That was you on 3.5 gms a week and 500gms of protein a week.
Now, if you took 6gms, what do you think would happen?
If I was mistaken about the 5gms then I apologise, I thought that had been established.
What weight did you compete at at heavy weight?
I take it this was your HW show?
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=402457.0;attach=442045)
the above picture and the bottom are not far apart, I had to gain some muscle back quickly as you can see the difference. I took the surgery for gyno that summer so had to whip it together for a show in Nov. I was 205lb and yes 3.5 sounds about right.
I can compete at 215 with an additional gram and half and 225 with an additional gram and half, gh and slin, maybe even 230, time is essential though.
Also I could never surpass that look with less gear.
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the above picture and the bottom are not far apart, I had to gain some muscle back quickly as you can see the difference. I took the surgery for gyno that summer so had to whip it together for a show in Nov. I was 205lb and yes 3.5 sounds about right.
I can compete at 215 with an additional gram and half and 225 with an additional gram and half, gh and slin, maybe even 230, time is essential though.
Also I could never surpass that look with less gear.
5gms to compete at 215???
6.5 to compete at 225???
and GH and slin to compete at 230????
Im actually lost for words.
I didnt realise it was that bad.
I maintain 220 at 10-12% on 250mgs of test E and could get down to 6/7% BF on that dose.
Shit, if I just upped the dose I could take Phil in a couple of years.
You seem to believe its all down to dosage, I know from experience it isnt, and TBH ,so do you.
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5gms to compete at 215???
6.5 to compete at 225???
and GH and slin to compete at 230????
Im actually lost for words.
I didnt realise it was that bad.
I maintain 220 at 10-12% on 250mgs of test E and could get down to 6/7% BF on that dose.
Shit, if I just upped the dose I could take Phil in a couple of years.
You seem to believe its all down to dosage, I know from experience it isnt, and TBH ,so do you.
I said 5 and I did not say more then 5, where did you get 6.5 from? you like making shit up?
5 for 215
5 + slin +gh for 230
where the fuck do you get 6.5?
Also I am 5.9, so 230 would be huge considering I am the type that gets told I look 240 in real life when I am 210, it's an illusion and your body structure is the opposite, if I recall correctly when you took those pics of you at 215, everyone thought you looked only 190, you have the athletic, elongated build, not stocky muscle belly build. Good build nevertheless, but big difference in illusion.
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I said 5 and I did not say more then 5, where did you get 6.5 from? you like making shit up?
5 for 215
5 + slin +gh for 230
where the fuck do you get 6.5?
Also I am 5.9, so 230 would be huge considering I am the type that gets told I look 240 in real life when I am 210, it's an illusion and your body structure is the opposite, if I recall correctly when you took those pics of you at 215, everyone thought you looked only 190, you have the athletic, elongated build, not stocky muscle belly build. Good build nevertheless, but big difference in illusion.
From a starting point of 3.5, it appeared to go up twice its the additional "and"
I was 205lb and yes 3.5 sounds about right.
I can compete at 215 with an additional gram and half and 225 with an additional gram and half, gh and slin, maybe even 230, time is essential though.
Its Canadian grammar ;D
You will NEVER be 230 onstage in good enough condition to win a national level show.
You need to face reality.
You dieted last time here and was barely 200lbs on 2gms +
You are a good light heavy competitor, thats your genetic limit, and no amount of grams of gear is ever going to change that.
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From a starting point of 3.5, it appeared to go up twice its the additional "and"
Its Canadian grammar ;D
You will NEVER be 230 onstage in good enough condition to win a national level show.
You need to face reality.
You dieted last time here and was barely 200lbs on 2gms +
You are a good light heavy competitor, thats your genetic limit, and no amount of grams of gear is ever going to change that.
we will see ;)
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we will see ;)
I hope you dont do yourself any long term harm trying to prove me wrong.
You have been a 200lb bodybuilder for at least 6 years despite all your efforts.
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That is a problem you might become insulin dependent. I say if your not diabetic and have no chance of making money of your phsyique fuck using insulin. I shouldn"t really of posted much about insulin usage because I don"t do those kind of protocols. That is just nutty to me! I do some crazy shit but that is just even to crazy for me.
I think there are pros who have great physiques that are not using insulin protocols unless they are just lying. but I don"t know they are honest about using HGH but even some pros don't like the whole insulin protocol. It is actually pretty dangerous. you just don't want to fuck with your health like that unless you are getting super rich off doing it, even then if it take 25-35 years off your life is any amount of money worth that? Nothing wrong with just using Pharma HGH or top nothing chinese HGH. Were talking minimal diffrence here. Sure their will be a benefit that might make you place higher but remeber you have to be one of the top 10 Bodybuilders in the world to crack the millions otherwise your stuck selling supplements.
when you're using a decent dose of hgh and your blood sugar is in the 130+ range, you ARE insulin dependant whether you use insulin or not.
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I hope you dont do yourself any long term harm trying to prove me wrong.
You have been a 200lb bodybuilder for at least 6 years despite all your efforts.
there has not been any effort, I train a few months out of the year, juice on and off, hell I have only been to the gym this year a few times
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there has not been any effort, I train a few months out of the year, juice on and off, hell I have only been to the gym this year a few times
mate, over 2gms a week is not "on and off" casual use.
This is how I see your next 12 months, hit the gym hard and up the dose, get to 250-260 and feel fantastic, however you will be over 20% BF at least.
You will post vids of you benching 500 and tell everone how well you are doing.
Now, you decide to diet, off comes the water(just like last time)
Of comes the fat(just like last time)
You will be down around 215, now its panic time, you are not going to be big enough to compete as a heavy unless you up the dose (totally wrong, but never mind)
You up the dose and due to a severe calorific reduction you cant really gain that much, do you up the cals or drop them further to get down to light heavy.
That will be your conundrum.
Oh, and all that hinges on if you actually do anything at all.
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You two need to stop quarreling. You're both exceptional posters on this board, you're on the same side fellas. Dont take this that seriously. We need both of you here to make this board great.
x 2
simon is very direct but thats how we talk in the uk
i dont believe is having a go at anyone he just has a strong opinion
him and oth are both very knowledgeable
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mate, over 2gms a week is not "on and off" casual use.
This is how I see your next 12 months, hit the gym hard and up the dose, get to 250-260 and feel fantastic, however you will be over 20% BF at least.
You will post vids of you benching 500 and tell everone how well you are doing.
Now, you decide to diet, off comes the water(just like last time)
Of comes the fat(just like last time)
You will be down around 215, now its panic time, you are not going to be big enough to compete as a heavy unless you up the dose (totally wrong, but never mind)
You up the dose and due to a severe calorific reduction you cant really gain that much, do you up the cals or drop them further to get down to light heavy.
That will be your conundrum.
Oh, and all that hinges on if you actually do anything at all.
actually I am on 1 shot a week of test e for trt and I will train once a week for the next 6 months as my son Isaac will be born in 2 weeks and the first 6 months of his life and all my spare time are fused together. ;)
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actually I am on 1 shot a week of test e for trt and I will train once a week for the next 6 months as my son Isaac will be born in 2 weeks and the first 6 months of his life and all my spare time are fused together. ;)
Great news about your son, puts all this bickering and bullshit into perspective. ;D
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Great news about your son, puts all this bickering and bullshit into perspective. ;D
;)
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when you're using a decent dose of hgh and your blood sugar is in the 130+ range, you ARE insulin dependant whether you use insulin or not.
130 range is not that bad. That is not diabetic range. Thats a little high but somewhat normal hell even a fasting blood sugar level of 100 is OK. 130 who gives a shit. Insulin can do some serious permanent harm. Like I said if your rolling in the dollars using it selling your physique winning shows "go for it" if not I would seriously reconsider. That small diffrence in your physique is not worth the possible long term damage. You can manipulate your body into getting insulin like gains using safer methods. It's not going to be 100% as effective but it will help. ESF no hate on you do whatever makes you happy.
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I maintain 220 at 10-12% on 250mgs of test E and could get down to 6/7% BF on that dose.
how tall are you ?
Do you diet to stage condition on 250mg ? you said to 6 - 7% but down to 4% are your doses the same
to maintain lean mass ? or do you add in other compounds ?
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how tall are you ?
Do you diet to stage condition on 250mg ? you said to 6 - 7% but down to 4% are your doses the same
to maintain lean mass ? or do you add in other compounds ?
5'10
If i intended competing i would add in other compounds
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130 range is not that bad. That is not diabetic range. Thats a little high but somewhat normal hell even a fasting blood sugar level of 100 is OK. 130 who gives a shit. Insulin can do some serious permanent harm. Like I said if your rolling in the dollars using it selling your physique winning shows "go for it" if not I would seriously reconsider. That small diffrence in your physique is not worth the possible long term damage. You can manipulate your body into getting insulin like gains using safer methods. It's not going to be 100% as effective but it will help. ESF no hate on you do whatever makes you happy.
i haven't used insulin 'seriously' in years.. probably not since '03/04... i tried giving it a go a couple years ago, but seems my body didn't respond to it the way it used to and it wasn't convenient. my blood sugar is fine, btw... between 85-95 on every test I've had in the past 8 or so years. zero lasting effects from blasting 40-60iu/day from 99-03/04.
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kinda old thread but i must ask why the fuck did you waste your money on generic gh to only run it at 3iu daily? might as well have taken your money and burned it the end result would be the same bud. should have spent that dolla on a few vials of tren
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kinda old thread but i must ask why the fuck did you waste your money on generic gh to only run it at 3iu daily? might as well have taken your money and burned it the end result would be the same bud. should have spent that dolla on a few vials of tren
Wanted to experiment. Many would say 3iu isn't a waste. I got some wicked pumps off of it at least :-\