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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: Necrosis on May 09, 2014, 03:09:18 AM
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http://scitechdaily.com/scientists-engineer-first-living-organism-expanded-genetic-alphabet/
Basically they created a living organism with unique DNA bases (amongst the common) this shows that creating life is easy peasy and that there is nothing special about our DNA, nor the bases, life can form in a infinite amount of ways (conjecture here).
We are gods.
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Great evidence against religious folks. That was actually their most solid evidence for god; that it's so hard to create life. Guess that argument is moot.
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God does exist, cos my parents brain washed me and took to me chruch since I can ever remember, now I'm an adult there's no way in hell I am able to question this belief, I just know as Ive been told, end of story. Science is all lies despite all the substantiated hard evidence, the hear-say book from 2000 years ago is the TRUTH.
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The weirdest fantasy novel ever written, and cult like trolls follow it and pray to a magic man in the sky.
Whatever floats their boat.
2000 religions and gods, and each one thinks theirs is the one and only.. Lemmings...
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The weirdest fantasy novel ever written, and cult like trolls follow it and pray to a magic man in the sky.
Whatever floats their boat.
2000 religions and gods, and each one thinks theirs is the one and only.. Lemmings...
But lemmings all jumping off different cliffs, which makes it entertaining.
Also, giving lemmings a bad rap, as they are smarter than this.
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Yeah, what the hell was I thinking? It makes so much sense that humans spontaneously generated from random cells. ::)
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lol we are just re-entering the times of babylon where they genetically engineerd all shorts of weird shit. if anything this is even more proof that we all were engineered many years ago, kinda frightening but interesting
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i have a feeling we are a mixture of something from Earth and something from another planet, i don't know, we're just so different
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I read about this. Pretty interesting stuff.
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http://scitechdaily.com/scientists-engineer-first-living-organism-expanded-genetic-alphabet/
Basically they created a living organism with unique DNA bases (amongst the common) this shows that creating life is easy peasy and that there is nothing special about our DNA, nor the bases, life can form in a infinite amount of ways (conjecture here).
We are gods.
this is the foundation for what's to come...
thanks for the post-----fascinating
...and fuck all those psychos who believe in an imaginary man in the sky
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Yeah, what the hell was I thinking? It makes so much sense that humans spontaneously generated from random cells. ::)
It doesn't have to make sense, a persona sky daddy living in a unreachable place using magic to create the world makes more sense.
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i have a feeling we are a mixture of something from Earth and something from another planet, i don't know, we're just so different
There is some evidence we are a hybrid species, that we are a cross between ape and pig, it explains our shit fertility, illnesses, pig grafts working etc. there is some solid evidence for this.
Read about hybrid species it's interesting.
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There is some evidence we are a hybrid species, that we are a cross between ape and pig, it explains our shit fertility, illnesses, pig grafts working etc. there is some solid evidence for this.
Read about hybrid species it's interesting.
x-files, battlestar galactica etc...
it's been a theme in a million sci fi books too
seems very feasible to me-----makes a lot more sense than the "adam and eve" garbage
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what's coach opinion about this sorcery?
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what's coach opinion about this sorcery?
he can't hear you
(http://www.getbullish.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/ostrich-head-in-sand.jpg)
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There are no religious or moral implications to scientific findings.
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There are no religious or moral implications to scientific findings.
tell litle taco bell this
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There are no religious or moral implications to scientific findings.
Well said.
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There are no religious or moral implications to scientific findings.
haha maybe you're the one w your head in the sand
no implications ???
look at all the fuss a little sheep named dolly made----or the whole stem cell issue (with bush banning research etc)
of course people react to these things---they fundamentally change our lives
whether that's "sane" or not doesn't matter
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haha maybe you're the one w your head in the sand
no implications ???
look at all the fuss a little sheep named dolly made----or the whole stem cell issue (with bush banning research etc)
of course people react to these things---they fundamentally change our lives
whether that's "sane" or not doesn't matter
Most of the uproar was ignorant overreaction
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Maybe we can create alien life because God wanted to let us to that .. lets wait for our taco bell thinker before derailing this thread further into facts, logic and science
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OK let us believe we originated from Adam and Eve.... ::) so who put us here? look at Reptiles that have survived millions of years..have they evolved much...NO. Has Man..YES. Do you really think we evolved because of micro organisms? Which have not evolved as we have.
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Most of the uproar was ignorant overreaction
oh I absolutely agree with you on that fact
I don't agree with you that science is in a "vacuum"---people religious or not react morally to new technology, medical procedures etc
I know what tapeworm is trying to say, but that statement he wrote is false
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haha maybe you're the one w your head in the sand
no implications ???
look at all the fuss a little sheep named dolly made----or the whole stem cell issue (with bush banning research etc)
of course people react to these things---they fundamentally change our lives
whether that's "sane" or not doesn't matter
Sure, people react to things in all sorts of kooky ways. Doesn't mean there are religious implications inherent in the findings. It's just people bending themselves out of shape. Like those who think The Theory of Relativity means moral relativity and I'm like
(http://www.titaniumteddybear.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/carl-sagan-dude-what.jpg)
Science isn't responsible for how athiests/christians/whoever react and how emotional they become. It just wants the facts.
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I thought Ronnie Coleman was already proof of that... and here at Getbig it's Adam &
schmoeSteve
Now with this Dna manipulation I think these scientist( whiteman/asianman) will eliminate Baldness & micropenis altogether!!
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I thought Ronnie Coleman was already proof of that... and here at Getbig it's Adam & schmoeSteve
Now with this Dna manipulation I think these scientist( whiteman/asianman) will eliminate Baldness & micropenis altogether!!
QED. People: always with the agenda. This unfortunate fellow seems preoccupied with alopecia and micropenisitis for whatever reason.
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Sure, people react to things in all sorts of kooky ways. Doesn't mean there are religious implications inherent in the findings. It's just people bending themselves out of shape. Like those who think The Theory of Relativity means moral relativity and I'm like
(http://www.titaniumteddybear.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/carl-sagan-dude-what.jpg)
Science isn't responsible for how athiests/christians/whoever react and how emotional they become. It just wants the facts.
I know what you meant but your original statement was confusing----I totally agree with you on the issue, im a science man myself
imagine where we would be technologically if it wasn't for all the delusional religious psychos out there
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Simple and inoffensive way of looking at religion:
Religious people have an established guidebook that answers all of life's questions and mysteries with the definitive imprimatur of a deity as the fount of said book's knowledge. You don't need to focus on nuances in ethical behavior or scientific developments because they're already accounted for through the presence of your deity of choice.
Non-religious people have to establish their own guidebook as they go, editing out parts and rewriting others while making new entries based on personal experience and no rigidly-defined framework handed down from past generations of believers. You reinvent the wheel on a per-annum basis. The only regulations you have to abide by are those created by national legislators. The rest is up to you.
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i have a feeling we are a mixture of something from Earth and something from another planet, i don't know, we're just so different
Like the movie "Mission to Mars". Very cool premise.
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Like the movie "Mission to Mars". Very cool premise.
little off topic but just caught the end of "Sunshine" on TV -----great sci-fi flick
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Simple and inoffensive way of looking at religion:
Religious people have an established guidebook that answers all of life's questions and mysteries with the definitive imprimatur of a deity as the fount of said book's knowledge. You don't need to focus on nuances in ethical behavior or scientific developments because they're already accounted for through the presence of your deity of choice.
Non-religious people have to establish their own guidebook as they go, editing out parts and rewriting others while making new entries based on personal experience and no rigidly-defined framework handed down from past generations of believers. You reinvent the wheel on a per-annum basis. The only regulations you have to abide by are those created by national legislators. The rest is up to you.
I wrote a response to this, thought "meh" and deleted it. I'm happier with this reply.
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I wrote a response to this, thought "meh" and deleted it. I'm happier with this reply.
yeah when you believe in an imaginary guy in the sky and a person who was revived from death you don't have much of anything to stand on
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So they created something from literally nothing? Or did they alter something and spliced it together with something else to create something else altogether and that something else was "alive"? Or what?
If they took absolutely nothing and made a tangible something that lived and breathed and was sentient, well...Cool! If not, get back to me when they can do so and prove it. If we are going to play at being God, then we had best do as we demand from God.
Prove it. ;D
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yeah when you believe in an imaginary guy in the sky and a person who was revived from death you don't have much of anything to stand on
If I had a nickel.....
I actually thought this thread was gonna be out Big Ramy when I opened it LOL....my mistake.
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I know what you meant but your original statement was confusing----I totally agree with you on the issue, im a science man myself
imagine where we would be technologically if it wasn't for all the delusional religious psychos out there
I'm not a believer but that's a completely different can of worms to pop open. Again, I don't see any pro-religious or anti-religious conclusions to be drawn from scientific discovery or application.
And in the interest of offending both sides, I find it hilariously low-brow when someone latches onto one of these things and yells from the rooftops about how he was right all along. More often than not, opposing sides drape their bias across the exact same science and then volley it back and forth. But lo, after awhile the popcorn turns to dust in my mouth.
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So they created something from literally nothing? Or did they alter something and spliced it together with something else to create something else altogether and that something else was "alive"? Or what?
If they took absolutely nothing and made a tangible something that lived and breathed and was sentient, well...Cool! If not, get back to me when they can do so and prove it. If we are going to play at being God, then we had best do as we demand from God.
Prove it. ;D
How the fuck can they "take" a possesive word for a thing, "nothing" and create something? there has never been nothing, ever, for nothing would exist now.
We just proved it. the study is the proof. What you want is absurd and impossible.
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I'm not a believer but that's a completely different can of worms to pop open. Again, I don't see any pro-religious or anti-religious conclusions to be drawn from scientific discovery or application.
And in the interest of offending both sides, I find it hilariously low-brow when someone latches onto one of these things and yells from the rooftops about how he was right all along. More often than not, opposing sides drape their bias across the exact same science and then volley it back and forth. But lo, after awhile the popcorn turns to dust in my mouth.
The interesting part is if these base pairs which are not naturally occuring can produce meaningful codons which can participate in transcription, what would be the outcome? guess we will find out.
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If I had a nickel.....
I actually thought this thread was gonna be out Big Ramy when I opened it LOL....my mistake.
The thing is, if you're secure in your faith and your beliefs are only subject to change based on communication with the lord, then you shouldn't be provoked by people who don't follow your way of seeing things. A true believer is invincible to mere mortal questioning. Read your Bible. The subjects in it, for example Saul or Job, were tested by god many times and they resisted because their faith was unbreakable.
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;D saw this at wahlmart last week. seemed somewhat strange even for wahlmart.
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Simple and inoffensive way of looking at religion:
Religious people have an established guidebook that answers all of life's questions and mysteries with the definitive imprimatur of a deity as the fount of said book's knowledge. You don't need to focus on nuances in ethical behavior or scientific developments because they're already accounted for through the presence of your deity of choice.
Non-religious people have to establish their own guidebook as they go, editing out parts and rewriting others while making new entries based on personal experience and no rigidly-defined framework handed down from past generations of believers. You reinvent the wheel on a per-annum basis. The only regulations you have to abide by are those created by national legislators. The rest is up to you.
Well said. And we all know which group is easier to control, motivate, and tax their labor for our benefit. :D
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Well said. And we all know which group is easier to control, motivate, and tax their labor for our benefit. :D
Then again, even atheists witness miracles from time to time.
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ugh, I was hoping they'd wait another 100 years for reaching this level of technology.
Scientists at The Scripps Research Institute (TSRI) have engineered a bacterium whose genetic material includes an added pair of DNA “letters,” or bases, not found in nature. The cells of this unique bacterium can replicate the unnatural DNA bases more or less normally, for as long as the molecular building blocks are supplied.
That's just great. I've always imagined there would never be any virus that could wipe out 100% of life on earth... until we learned to create un-natural DNA. Horrifying to think they could create a non-earth organism that can replicate. Maybe it'll be like the BLOB, and just keep replicating, feeding on everything.
I don't get into the religious argument... we're all idiots, none of us knows ANYTHING, let's be honest. But creating DNA that can reproduce itself? scary.
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How the fuck can they "take" a possesive word for a thing, "nothing" and create something? there has never been nothing, ever, for nothing would exist now.
We just proved it. the study is the proof. What you want is absurd and impossible.
Don't like the premise? Too bad. Make something that lives from nothing. I mean absolutely nothing. It is, for the greater part, what most people that have a faith in God believe happened. So then, go ahead and create a living being and to make it easy it should be a single cell organism. But first make a livable planet and atmosphere. Now allow that single cell being to be, shall we say...fruitful and multiply. Let it adapt to its environment and give it time to evolve into what you see in the mirror. Better still, it has to adapt in many different ways so that from that first organism all life evolved into what we see now.
Take a billion years. I'll wait. ;D
Or take a cake mix, some eggs and a bit of milk. Now throw it all against a wall. "BIG BANG!" Come see me in a week and let me know if you've got a cake yet. Oh...You don't? You say you need someone who can successfully combing all those simple ingredients and then bake it just so, so that it becomes a cake? Someone "intelligent" enough to do so?
As asinine as some people are (and at times that would include myself ;D), I do find it very difficult to believe we are in fact, the "icing" on that cake known as the Earth. And by the way, for the sake of this discussion I allowed you to not have to create your ingredients yourself.
As for you assumption that there has never been "nothing, ever" that is all it is. An assumption. A guess. Neither you nor I can bear witness to the creation of all things. To the beginning of life and much less to the beginning of time. Don't flatter yourself. A guess is a guess, even if it happens to be an educated one.
Be well. But also be polite. ;D
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The thing is, if you're secure in your faith and your beliefs are only subject to change based on communication with the lord, then you shouldn't be provoked by people who don't follow your way of seeing things. A true believer is invincible to mere mortal questioning. Read your Bible. The subjects in it, for example Saul or Job, were tested by god many times and they resisted because their faith was unbreakable.
Thx for the suggestions. I just finished a study of Job fyi.
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Then again, even atheists witness miracles from time to time.
These people who intentionally get try to get fatter and fatter are absolutely disgusting. No respect for their bodies or life.
Sad when some others are given a raw deal in life with an deadly illness they have no control over.
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Thx for the suggestions. I just finished a study of Job fyi.
Sure, chief. I respect you on here and off. That your beliefs clash sharply with mine has no impact on that at all. At least you're humble.
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Sure, boss. I respect you on here and off. That your beliefs clash sharply with mine has no impact on that at all. At least you're humble when speaking upon it.
I totally agree about MOS. Hes a good soul.
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These people who intentionally get try to get fatter and fatter are absolutely disgusting. No respect for their bodies or life.
Sad when some others are given a raw deal in life with an deadly illness they have no control over.
what i want to know is how does she go to the toilet? i mean all that Food ... does she just lie there and shit in a bed pan ? someone cleans her ass ? :-X
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proof that life had to be created in a lab somewhere. that means us
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The thing is, if you're secure in your faith and your beliefs are only subject to change based on communication with the lord, then you shouldn't be provoked by people who don't follow your way of seeing things. A true believer is invincible to mere mortal questioning. Read your Bible. The subjects in it, for example Saul or Job, were tested by god many times and they resisted because their faith was unbreakable.
Yes make he more fundamental and unreachable. Shut off reason, don't listen to those around you, instead trust those way way before you.
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So they created something from literally nothing? Or did they alter something and spliced it together with something else to create something else altogether and that something else was "alive"? Or what?
If they took absolutely nothing and made a tangible something that lived and breathed and was sentient, well...Cool! If not, get back to me when they can do so and prove it. If we are going to play at being God, then we had best do as we demand from God.
Prove it. ;D
LOL. What did God come from?
The absurdity of God Botherers mocking the concept of something from nothing, yet that is there claim to how god came about! Just spontaneously appeared from absolutely nothing. The problem is God Believers can't actually see what it is they are saying, it's as if they are blind to themselves, shut off from who and what they are.
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Again, I don't see any pro-religious or anti-religious conclusions to be drawn from scientific discovery or application.
Please explain in great detail how the schema [religion x claims y, science proves z and not y] -- one instantiated many times in the history of discovery -- does not allow one to draw any conclusions about religion.
e.g.
"Islam claims Muhammad flew round the night's sky on a horse; science proves horses don't fly"
or
"Christianity claims all biological properties are designer properties of a mindful designer, science proves they are the result of the non-random survival of random genetic variation"
and so on, ad infinitum.
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ugh, I was hoping they'd wait another 100 years for reaching this level of technology.
Scientists at The Scripps Research Institute (TSRI) have engineered a bacterium whose genetic material includes an added pair of DNA “letters,” or bases, not found in nature. The cells of this unique bacterium can replicate the unnatural DNA bases more or less normally, for as long as the molecular building blocks are supplied.
That's just great. I've always imagined there would never be any virus that could wipe out 100% of life on earth... until we learned to create un-natural DNA. Horrifying to think they could create a non-earth organism that can replicate. Maybe it'll be like the BLOB, and just keep replicating, feeding on everything.
I don't get into the religious argument... we're all idiots, none of us knows ANYTHING, let's be honest. But creating DNA that can reproduce itself? scary.
LOL, that's what I am thinking, it's going to be like splice and fuck my wife in front of me while adrien brody video tapes.
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Don't like the premise? Too bad. Make something that lives from nothing. I mean absolutely nothing. It is, for the greater part, what most people that have a faith in God believe happened. So then, go ahead and create a living being and to make it easy it should be a single cell organism. But first make a livable planet and atmosphere. Now allow that single cell being to be, shall we say...fruitful and multiply. Let it adapt to its environment and give it time to evolve into what you see in the mirror. Better still, it has to adapt in many different ways so that from that first organism all life evolved into what we see now.
Take a billion years. I'll wait. ;D
Or take a cake mix, some eggs and a bit of milk. Now throw it all against a wall. "BIG BANG!" Come see me in a week and let me know if you've got a cake yet. Oh...You don't? You say you need someone who can successfully combing all those simple ingredients and then bake it just so, so that it becomes a cake? Someone "intelligent" enough to do so?
As asinine as some people are (and at times that would include myself ;D), I do find it very difficult to believe we are in fact, the "icing" on that cake known as the Earth. And by the way, for the sake of this discussion I allowed you to not have to create your ingredients yourself.
As for you assumption that there has never been "nothing, ever" that is all it is. An assumption. A guess. Neither you nor I can bear witness to the creation of all things. To the beginning of life and much less to the beginning of time. Don't flatter yourself. A guess is a guess, even if it happens to be an educated one.
Be well. But also be polite. ;D
Your stipulations make it impossible, so you want someone to create something out of thin air? withour starting materials? that's called magic, doesn't exist. Matter has alwyas existed, whether in the form of energy etc and the building blocks were always here. MATTER CANNOT BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED, SINCE IT EXISTS, IT HAS ALWAYS EXISTED SINCE IT CANNOT BE CREATED.
Explain how we have matter? God did it? why can't matter be eternal? why do you need intelligence?is a virus intelligent? is it alive?
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Please explain in great detail how the schema [religion x claims y, science proves z and not y] -- one instantiated many times in the history of discovery -- does not allow one to draw any conclusions about religion.
e.g.
"Islam claims Muhammad flew round the night's sky on a horse; science proves horses don't fly"
or
"Christianity claims all biological properties are designer properties of a mindful designer, science proves they are the result of the non-random survival of random genetic variation"
and so on, ad infinitum.
Exactly. Just look how shitty the eye is as well, fucking glasses are needed by nearly everyone, some great fucking design. Or how about our dicks? we fuck and excrete from the same hole, why? it's stupid. Dolphins don't worry about choking to death on food since they have a blow hole, humans, nope, many will die just from eating, BRILLIANT JESUS, good job.
I love the way he made the earth using tectonics, earthquakes are a joy of life!
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Your stipulations make it impossible, so you want someone to create something out of thin air? withour starting materials? that's called magic, doesn't exist. Matter has alwyas existed, whether in the form of energy etc and the building blocks were always here. MATTER CANNOT BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED, SINCE IT EXISTS, IT HAS ALWAYS EXISTED SINCE IT CANNOT BE CREATED.
Matter is easy to destroy, only energy cannot be destroyed. Probably you are conflating matter with subatomic particles?
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Matter is easy to destroy, only energy cannot be destroyed. Probably you are conflating matter with subatomic particles?
yes, in a sense, matter doesn't get destroyed the energy from the bonds are altered into another form. You are correct.
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LOL. What did God come from?
The absurdity of God Botherers mocking the concept of something from nothing, yet that is there claim to how god came about! Just spontaneously appeared from absolutely nothing. The problem is God Believers can't actually see what it is they are saying, it's as if they are blind to themselves, shut off from who and what they are.
Why hello, child.
I have no idea where God came from and I would be a fool to claim as much. Man you are one dumb ass. Unlike others here I don't work well with self made retards so run along whilst the adults discuss things that are way above your mental pay grade. Should you ever choose to behave then I will treat you as an adult. Until then, go take a nap.
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(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTfnCou5enL_P9nKxn_JdqIfY7hH3VOnlrEdopoy5QvatXX0say)
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Your stipulations make it impossible, so you want someone to create something out of thin air? withour starting materials? that's called magic, doesn't exist. Matter has alwyas existed, whether in the form of energy etc and the building blocks were always here. MATTER CANNOT BE CREATED NOR DESTROYED, SINCE IT EXISTS, IT HAS ALWAYS EXISTED SINCE IT CANNOT BE CREATED.
Explain how we have matter? God did it? why can't matter be eternal? why do you need intelligence?is a virus intelligent? is it alive?
Two hundred years ago, powered flight was impossible.
I cannot explain how we have matter, but does that really matter? No, but it would be fascinating to know, would it not? John told me once when scientists decided to explain the darkness of what appeared to be empty space, they (the scientists) called it "dark matter". John called it "doesn't matter". A supposition based upon a whim? Perhaps. Perhaps not but the reality of it is that it's dark in space. Is a closet with the door shut and the light off filled with "dark matter" or just void of light?
As for the other gentleman's comparison of dolphins having a blow hole and people don't so we choke on our food. Dolphins live in the ocean, men don't. Whales have the same setup as dolphins. Amazing, huh? I cannot explain everything in the world and while science may try and succeed (or fail) on many levels it cannot explain it all.
I have long thought the Bible was written for what I would call "children". Whoever started this mess we call Earth is so far above us that we are as babies to him/her/it (that's to keep the PC folks "happy". As if... ;D ). As I have said before, do we tell our children everything before their time? That is, before they have reached a level where they are capable of understanding what we are telling them?
No. They needed to gain in, shall we say, "intelligence". I will say this. "Religion" (which I don't have) has done much to keep mankind down, if you will. "Faith" has done much to inspire mankind as well as give us hope. How so? Man has always wondered at Creation and desired to know who started it all. Those with faith call this "God". Science calls it "chance".
I will not belittle those that believe in chance but that does not mean I must accept it as Scientific Gospel. Mankind seems to grow smarter with each generation or so. Perhaps one day soon within our lifetime we will know enough to be shown even more.
As before, be well and thanks for being civil. ;D I do appreciate it.
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(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTfnCou5enL_P9nKxn_JdqIfY7hH3VOnlrEdopoy5QvatXX0say)
(http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081209024015/memoryalpha/en/images/4/4e/Gav.jpg)
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LOL, that's what I am thinking, it's going to be like splice and fuck my wife in front of me while adrien brody video tapes.
that worry has kept me up many a night.
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Two hundred years ago, powered flight was impossible.
I cannot explain how we have matter, but does that really matter? No, but it would be fascinating to know, would it not? John told me once when scientists decided to explain the darkness of what appeared to be empty space, they (the scientists) called it "dark matter". John called it "doesn't matter". A supposition based upon a whim? Perhaps. Perhaps not but the reality of it is that it's dark in space. Is a closet with the door shut and the light off filled with "dark matter" or just void of light?
We simply don't know, space appears to be a superfluid (we are testing this now) so it's not empty nor a vaccum etc. Also, I side with reason, for example name one finding in history that the answer has been supernatural? none, zero, the universe behaves rationally, math works, we have laws in physics, you are suggesting that natural order was suspended despite all the evidence to the contrary ie all of human hisotry.
As for the other gentleman's comparison of dolphins having a blow hole and people don't so we choke on our food. Dolphins live in the ocean, men don't. Whales have the same setup as dolphins. Amazing, huh? I cannot explain everything in the world and while science may try and succeed (or fail) on many levels it cannot explain it all.
why can't we have blowholes? why can't we have a better design, the design is poor. If we were creating a robot, the human form would be a rough sketch.
I have long thought the Bible was written for what I would call "children". Whoever started this mess we call Earth is so far above us that we are as babies to him/her/it (that's to keep the PC folks "happy". As if... ;D ). As I have said before, do we tell our children everything before their time? That is, before they have reached a level where they are capable of understanding what we are telling them?
No. They needed to gain in, shall we say, "intelligence". I will say this. "Religion" (which I don't have) has done much to keep mankind down, if you will. "Faith" has done much to inspire mankind as well as give us hope. How so? Man has always wondered at Creation and desired to know who started it all. Those with faith call this "God". Science calls it "chance".
Science claims the exact opposite of chance, it says the world in understandable and events reproducible, chance isn't something that is embraced. Ever hear of alpha levels for statistical analysis? .05% chance of nuisance results, chance is miminized. You are mis representing science in the form of a straw man.
I will not belittle those that believe in chance but that does not mean I must accept it as Scientific Gospel. Mankind seems to grow smarter with each generation or so. Perhaps one day soon within our lifetime we will know enough to be shown even more.
No one beleives in chance, with the right conditions life appears inevitable. Life comes in many forms, the moon titan has a vast underwater ocean with hydrothermal vents, life probably exists their.
As before, be well and thanks for being civil. ;D I do appreciate it.
God could exist, but he isn't in on the joke, unless he is stupid.
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that worry has kept me up many a night.
splice monster was all like horny, wife's like what do you want, he says "inside you".
Extra DNA base pairs, not even once.
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Sure, chief. I respect you on here and off. That your beliefs clash sharply with mine has no impact on that at all. At least you're humble.
Well I think you're a good egg too.
I'm going through an unfortunate period now in which i'm completely ending all discussion with a select group on this board that I've been speaking with for years now. I won't name names....they know who they are. I don't prefer it but it's necessary for me. I keep the board members in general in my prayers and a few I speak to privately I pray for specifically. Lot of pain on this board. A lot of folks that belief that have spoken to me privately. I pray the Lord raises them up for his divine purposes. For others that disagree but are respectful (such as yourself) communication is wide open with me and welcome.
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Two hundred years ago, powered flight was impossible.
I cannot explain how we have matter, but does that really matter? No, but it would be fascinating to know, would it not? John told me once when scientists decided to explain the darkness of what appeared to be empty space, they (the scientists) called it "dark matter". John called it "doesn't matter". A supposition based upon a whim? Perhaps. Perhaps not but the reality of it is that it's dark in space. Is a closet with the door shut and the light off filled with "dark matter" or just void of light?
As for the other gentleman's comparison of dolphins having a blow hole and people don't so we choke on our food. Dolphins live in the ocean, men don't. Whales have the same setup as dolphins. Amazing, huh? I cannot explain everything in the world and while science may try and succeed (or fail) on many levels it cannot explain it all.
I have long thought the Bible was written for what I would call "children". Whoever started this mess we call Earth is so far above us that we are as babies to him/her/it (that's to keep the PC folks "happy". As if... ;D ). As I have said before, do we tell our children everything before their time? That is, before they have reached a level where they are capable of understanding what we are telling them?
No. They needed to gain in, shall we say, "intelligence". I will say this. "Religion" (which I don't have) has done much to keep mankind down, if you will. "Faith" has done much to inspire mankind as well as give us hope. How so? Man has always wondered at Creation and desired to know who started it all. Those with faith call this "God". Science calls it "chance".
I will not belittle those that believe in chance but that does not mean I must accept it as Scientific Gospel. Mankind seems to grow smarter with each generation or so. Perhaps one day soon within our lifetime we will know enough to be shown even more.
As before, be well and thanks for being civil. ;D I do appreciate it.
Lol!!! End of debate. 8)
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Looks good.
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So they spliced together dna from existing life and you guys act like they made something out of thin air? This is incredible scientific research, that will hopefully lead to something better for mankind, just like 40years ago when the first heart transplant took place. But you aren't conving any Christians with this. lol
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So, I hope that they have engineered a control or counter measure to fight this bacterium. You know, evolution is a tricky thing, just look at what is happening with the Tasmanian Devil and the cancers that are forming on specimens faces. They might be wiped out.
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They should take DNA fom some of the GBrs, that would be God like! lol
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Please explain in great detail how the schema [religion x claims y, science proves z and not y] -- one instantiated many times in the history of discovery -- does not allow one to draw any conclusions about religion.
e.g.
"Islam claims Muhammad flew round the night's sky on a horse; science proves horses don't fly"
or
"Christianity claims all biological properties are designer properties of a mindful designer, science proves they are the result of the non-random survival of random genetic variation"
and so on, ad infinitum.
Science proves z w/o disproving y?
No, I do think the horses flied.
How am I become the religion defender guy?
Yeah, displacing God from the gaps can errode particular religions' credibility but I don't equate that to proof of non-existence. Neither do I have data that demonstrates divine existence, so that's why my default position of non-belief.
It's always the same with this stuff. The athiests claim the science supports thier position, and the religious claim it supports theirs. I'm unable to draw any inferences about something super-physical from explanations of physical phenomena. Reasoning that tries to do so strikes me as unsound.
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So they spliced together dna from existing life and you guys act like they made something out of thin air? This is incredible scientific research, that will hopefully lead to something better for mankind, just like 40years ago when the first heart transplant took place. But you aren't conving any Christians with this. lol
No, in fact no one in the real world of thinking people cares about religion, they did this study and never once thought about god the implications etc. it's a fairy tale, no one wants to convince christians, you guys are out to lunch to be frank.
the emphasis was mine if ever it existed.
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http://scitechdaily.com/scientists-engineer-first-living-organism-expanded-genetic-alphabet/
Basically they created a living organism with unique DNA bases (amongst the common) this shows that creating life is easy peasy and that there is nothing special about our DNA, nor the bases, life can form in a infinite amount of ways (conjecture here).
We are gods.
Please explain to me professor retardo, how creating life off of the back of life, makes us gods ***rolls eyes***
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Well I think you're a good egg too.
I'm going through an unfortunate period now in which i'm completely ending all discussion with a select group on this board that I've been speaking with for years now. I won't name names....they know who they are. I don't prefer it but it's necessary for me. I keep the board members in general in my prayers and a few I speak to privately I pray for specifically. Lot of pain on this board. A lot of folks that belief that have spoken to me privately. I pray the Lord raises them up for his divine purposes. For others that disagree but are respectful (such as yourself) communication is wide open with me and welcome.
You have always been one of the better people to discuss the issue with MOS. Like you I have slowly drifted away from discussing the really heavy stuff anymore with anyone here. I think for me the process of doing so was to solidify what was already a strong position I held. I have got to the point where I am happy believing what I do, couldn't really give a fuck about what others believe, although I still throw in a condescending remark here and there (because I do think belief in God is ridiculous. not to mention pointless and on closer inspection borderline absurd), but there comes a time when you just have to live and let live.
Mind you, in the real world, when I meet people who have strong faith or are even rigidly evangelical, I make every attempt to avoid them and I do tend to view them with suspicion and a hint of derision. But that's just me, it's fortunate then I live in a pretty much atheist community who also views religion with contempt and ridicule. I think if I lived in a bible belt type of community I would either attempt to flee or neck myself, the thought of having to endure such a closed minded, rigid lifestyle scares the crap out of me, it's a good thing religious people don't know any better. I watched my best friend growing up endure a strict religious upbringing at it wan;t pretty, he barely survived it. Fortunately for him he become a devout atheist.
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Sure, people react to things in all sorts of kooky ways. Doesn't mean there are religious implications inherent in the findings. It's just people bending themselves out of shape. Like those who think The Theory of Relativity means moral relativity and I'm like
(http://www.titaniumteddybear.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/carl-sagan-dude-what.jpg)
Science isn't responsible for how athiests/christians/whoever react and how emotional they become. It just wants the facts.
And your like -dude what? - lol. You truly are a pussy. I mean you know like the thing chicks have -
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And your like -dude what? - lol. You truly are a pussy. I mean you know like the thing chicks have -
Dude. What?
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Sure, people react to things in all sorts of kooky ways. Doesn't mean there are religious implications inherent in the findings. It's just people bending themselves out of shape. Like those who think The Theory of Relativity means moral relativity and I'm like
(http://www.titaniumteddybear.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/carl-sagan-dude-what.jpg)
Science isn't responsible for how athiests/christians/whoever react and how emotional they become. It just wants the facts.
I agree. People become upset over a lot of things but that doesn't mean there is any objective to truth to their objection.
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Science proves z w/o disproving y?
No, I do think the horses flied.
How am I become the religion defender guy?
Yeah, displacing God from the gaps can errode particular religions' credibility but I don't equate that to proof of non-existence. Neither do I have data that demonstrates divine existence, so that's why my default position of non-belief.
It's always the same with this stuff. The athiests claim the science supports thier position, and the religious claim it supports theirs. I'm unable to draw any inferences about something super-physical from explanations of physical phenomena. Reasoning that tries to do so strikes me as unsound.
I cheated by using the word "prove," (too strong) but the point remains: religions -- especially the Abrahamic ones -- have for hundreds of years made claims about what we now call the 'physical' or 'natural' world that have been rendered false beyond a reasonable doubt. This reflects on the probable truth of these doctrines, which in turn allows us to reflect on the probable truth of the hypothesized super-physical entities as described by those doctrines (e.g., if a religion claims a super-physical entity is on call answering our prayers, we can dispute the existence of that entity with the knowledge that prayer doesn't work (http://web.med.harvard.edu/sites/RELEASES/html/3_31STEP.html)).
tl;dr Whilst we can't "prove" the non-existence of a super-physical entity, we can dispute doctrines that posit super-physical influence in the world and thus render specific conceptions of super-physical entities false (e.g., the prayer-answering kind); further, we can cast aside super-physical entities since there is, at present, no need to posit them to explain anything -- rather like invisible gnomes.
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Well I think you're a good egg too.
I'm going through an unfortunate period now in which i'm completely ending all discussion with a select group on this board that I've been speaking with for years now. I won't name names....they know who they are. I don't prefer it but it's necessary for me. I keep the board members in general in my prayers and a few I speak to privately I pray for specifically. Lot of pain on this board. A lot of folks that belief that have spoken to me privately. I pray the Lord raises them up for his divine purposes. For others that disagree but are respectful (such as yourself) communication is wide open with me and welcome.
I'm going through an unfortunate period now in which i'm completely ending all discussion with a select group on this board that I've been speaking with for years now.
So, in other words, you're throwing a temper tantrum because we do not believe what you do? You want us to roll over and just believe exactly what you do? Are you sure you're an adult because you act like a 4-year old.
Lot of pain on this board.
Why is there a lot of pain on this board? Because we do not believe in God? So those that do not believe in God are in a lot of pain? It must feel wonderful to tell yourself lies in order to justify your belief system.
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I cheated by using the word "prove," (too strong) but the point remains: religions -- especially the Abrahamic ones -- have for hundreds of years made claims about what we now call the 'physical' or 'natural' world that have been rendered false beyond a reasonable doubt. This reflects on the probable truth of these doctrines, which in turn allows us to reflect on the probable truth of the hypothesized super-physical entities as described by those doctrines (e.g., if a religion claims a super-physical entity is on call answering our prayers, we can dispute the existence of that entity with the knowledge that prayer doesn't work (http://web.med.harvard.edu/sites/RELEASES/html/3_31STEP.html)).
tl;dr Whilst we can't "prove" the non-existence of a super-physical entity, we can dispute doctrines that posit super-physical influence in the world and thus render specific conceptions of super-physical entities false (e.g., the prayer-answering kind); further, we can cast aside super-physical entities since there is, at present, no need to posit them to explain anything -- rather like invisible gnomes.
Not so fast, now. Yeah, particular claims made by particular religions can be pretty well dismissed by facts. On the other hand, purely secular misconceptions can be corrected by facts from the same source. (Don't press me for examples because I'm too lazy but secular people cling to belief systems too. Probably when they're profiting in some way. Godless bastards.) I'm hammering on the agendalessness[osity] of science here more than anything. Not it's most eloquent advocate, perhaps.
If I'm gonna play True Believer, I'd respond that those claims which are disproven were a misrepresentation of The Word, or that while something is unlikely, like parting an inland sea, you can't prove there wasn't a confluence of events which made it happen. I don't see it as much of a pressure point though, since I'm not a True Believer.
I've got my own bias and don't much see organized religion's dogma as The Word. Consequently, I can't make the stretch from science trumping religion on a single point of contention to eliminating any and all non-materialist points of view. As you know, I'm kinda hazy to the point of spiritualism when it comes to things like the nature of identity, consciousness, and volition. It's probably just ego but I'm not sold on the whole 'bag of chemicals, suitable structure, brain equals mind' thing, so I still resist an exclusively scientific reduction.
I rambled a bit but reckon science ought to simply present itself and let individuals draw their own conclusions about the divine. On this issue and gene work in general, I don't see anything that indicates design vs evolution one way or another.
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I'm going through an unfortunate period now in which i'm completely ending all discussion with a select group on this board that I've been speaking with for years now.
So, in other words, you're throwing a temper tantrum because we do not believe what you do? You want us to roll over and just believe exactly what you do? Are you sure you're an adult because you act like a 4-year old.
Lot of pain on this board.
He's transitioning away from the forums. I think he brought this up a couple of weeks ago. Given the things he considers interesting/important to talk about and the backlash they usually engender, I can entirely back him up in this decision. It doesn't seem like a kneejerk reflexive tantrum from what I'm seeing. More like his GB career is winding down.
Why is there a lot of pain on this board? Because we do not believe in God? So those that do not believe in God are in a lot of pain? It must feel wonderful to tell yourself lies in order to justify your belief system.
I'm almost positive that he doesn't mean it that way. On here's there's depressives, drunks, socially maladjusted ex-convicts, stalkers, drug-abusers, and generally unhappy people who are relatively young but aren't doing what they want in life, and come here to talk about it or ask for advice. It's fair to say that may be true of other websites as well, but it's hard to ignore the confluence of collective disappointment that prevails in the users here, myself included.
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I can't hate on the MOS. Our beliefs aren't the same but his wit is second to none and he seems like a good man for all these years. Can't see him ever turning a blind eye to someone's suffering or letting his ego overcome his reason, no matter what his mood. I can't say the same about myself.
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On the other hand, purely secular misconceptions can be corrected by facts from the same source. (Don't press me for examples because I'm too lazy but secular people cling to belief systems too. Probably when they're profiting in some way. Godless bastards.) I'm hammering on the agendalessness[osity] of science here more than anything. Not it's most eloquent advocate, perhaps.
My good man, I was merely responding to your claim that there aren't any "anti-religious conclusions" to be drawn from scientific findings. Certainly, there are excesses on the part of secularists as well.
Still, since most secularists have some stipulation in their doctrine to 'accept whatever science says,' it's hard to say science can correct secular misconceptions -- if they are sticking to their doctrine, there shouldn't be any inconsistency. The same can't be said for the prototypical religious disciple.
Meanwhile, I don't know whether science is inherently agenda free. It seems to me that science wants to understand the world in explicitly and exclusively natural terms, something antithetical to religion -- that might be construed as an agenda.
I've got my own bias and don't much see organized religion's dogma as The Word. Consequently, I can't make the stretch from science trumping religion on a single point of contention to eliminating any and all non-materialist points of view.
Point well taken. There isn't universal agreement that science leads to a materialist point of view; there is room to maneuver here. But that doesn't mean we have to be opinion-free on the import of scientific findings for religion.
As you know, I'm kinda hazy to the point of spiritualism when it comes to things like the nature of identity, consciousness, and volition. It's probably just ego but I'm not sold on the whole 'bag of chemicals, suitable structure, brain equals mind' thing, so I still resist an exclusively scientific reduction.
Very good; you are free to satisfy your preferences as you please. The verdict is out on whether full-blown reductionism is an appropriate way to understand scientific findings.
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We have the tech to create life. That neither proves nor disproves the existence of a god.
God to me would be like watching one of those electric football games from the 70's/80's. He sets the field, turns on the machine, and lets the figures move on their destined path.
If that path leads us to death by technology, well............ :-\
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We have the tech to create life. That neither proves nor disproves the existence of a god.
God to me would be like watching one of those electric football games from the 70's/80's. He sets the field, turns on the machine, and lets the figures move on their destined path.
If that path leads us to death by technology, well............ :-\
Happy 20,000 post shitso.
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We have the tech to create life. That neither proves nor disproves the existence of a god.
God to me would be like watching one of those electric football games from the 70's/80's. He sets the field, turns on the machine, and lets the figures move on their destined path.
If that path leads us to death by technology, well............ :-\
Problem with that is almost every religion makes god out to be not just all-powerful but also willing and likely to intervene divinely to strike down at those who defy His commandments/beliefs/Surahs/etc. The fact that no god has yet to do anything in response to any of the millions of evil acts that take place daily is what most atheists consider the litmus test for religion's lack of reality. Not the fact that men have achieved scientific breakthroughs that were supposedly god's sole responsibility.
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He's transitioning away from the forums. I think he brought this up a couple of weeks ago. Given the things he considers interesting/important to talk about and the backlash they usually engender, I can entirely back him up in this decision. It doesn't seem like a kneejerk reflexive tantrum from what I'm seeing. More like his GB career is winding down.
I'm almost positive that he doesn't mean it that way. On here's there's depressives, drunks, socially maladjusted ex-convicts, stalkers, drug-abusers, and generally unhappy people who are relatively young but aren't doing what they want in life, and come here to talk about it or ask for advice. It's fair to say that may be true of other websites as well, but it's hard to ignore the confluence of collective disappointment that prevails in the users here, myself included.
MOS has displayed, in my opinion, what appears to be very childish behavior. Debates often become very heated. Even in university based settings, debates may become heated. No one runs off in a hissy fit. I can guarantee you that if we all believed as he did, he would not be transitioning away from the forum. He is only transitioning away because he is constantly being challenged. Perhaps sometimes too harshly, however as stated, debates sometimes do reach this point.
Yes, but this board is known for its negativity and pessimism. I have a strange suspicion that many of the online personas on here are much different in real life. There may be a lot of pain, but most people that post here are just trying to get a rise out of people by being cynical or an asshole.
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^
All good points.
Problem with Christians and other religious people is their religious commitment forces them to take offense when their virtues are intrusively questioned or attacked. Because it becomes part of their identity. If you do it to an an atheist for being an atheist, the'll just laugh and tell you to be less uptight.
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MOS has displayed, in my opinion, what appears to be very childish behavior. Debates often become very heated. Even in university based settings, debates may become heated. No one runs off in a hissy fit. I can guarantee you that if we all believed as he did, he would not be transitioning away from the forum. He is only transitioning away because he is constantly being challenged. Perhaps sometimes too harshly, however as stated, debates sometimes do reach this point.
Yes, but this board is known for its negativity and pessimism. I have a strange suspicion that many of the online personas on here are much different in real life. There may be a lot of pain, but most people that post here are just trying to get a rise out of people by being cynical or an asshole.
MOS is a good man. I am the same here as I am in person with regard to pretty much everything including my faith. I have and will continue to speak with anyone regarding my faith that so desires, be it Atheists, asssholists and especially those I consider lying dirtbag ministers. I can respect a difference of opinion and lord knows I have them too. I loath the false doctrines of Islam, LDS and Catholicism. Those that are assholists and the aforementioned false ministers are contemptible and I have no problem giving either respect or verbal lambasting where due.
My faith is in the Christ. Jesus of Nazareth. Not the pope nor some worthless imam or the like. The Gospel is what I base that faith upon. If people don't care for it, so be it.
Be well. Or if you prefer, not. I prefer the former for all concerned. ;)
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MOS is a good man. I am the same here as I am in person with regard to pretty much everything including my faith. I have and will continue to speak with anyone regarding my faith that so desires, be it Atheists, asssholists and especially those I consider lying dirtbag ministers. I can respect a difference of opinion and lord knows I have them too. I loath the false doctrines of Islam, LDS and Catholicism. Those that are assholists and the aforementioned false ministers are contemptible and I have no problem giving either respect or verbal lambasting where due.
My faith is in the Christ. Jesus of Nazareth. Not the pope nor some worthless imam or the like. The Gospel is what I base that faith upon. If people don't care for it, so be it.
Be well. Or if you prefer, not. I prefer the former for all concerned. ;)
I can't be a Christian because other Christians ruin it for me. It suffices to talk to a "born again" type or to hear the hand wringing and waving in a megachurch where the congregation is in the hypnotic vice-like grip of the suit-wearing pastor to turn me off the people who believe in it. The shit they spew about everything and anything under the sun makes me want to just pretend half the country doesn't exist except in the movies.
I'd have to create my own Christianity and ban everyone else from being involved in it. But that goes against the teachings of the faith itself.
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^
All good points.
Problem with Christians and other religious people is their religious commitment forces them to take offense when their virtues are intrusively questioned or attacked. Because it becomes part of their identity. If you do it to an an atheist for being an atheist, the'll just laugh and tell you to be less uptight.
My issue is this:
People are CONSTANTLY be challenged in every sphere of academia. Biologists, chemists, sociologist, psychologists, literature, philosophers, mathematicians, , anthropologists, art and music historians, etc, etc. Now some of these people throw a hissy fit when challenged. However, no one is better at throwing a hissy fit than a religious person. I have been to numerous debates where it got very heated! No one ran off crying, saying, "You're taking away my rights (religious people love to say their religious rights are being taken away)." Religious people are notorious for getting all bent out of shape when people challenge their belief system. The thing is is that as time goes on, religion does not hold the special privilege it used to (hundreds of years ago you can get hanged for talking out against the church). Times are changing and religious people do not know how to handle it. They run off like MOS when challenged.
As for religion becoming part of their identity, this also happens in other areas as well. Hardcore biologists, chemists, writers, psychologists, all have very strong identities associated with their occupation. As stated, they do not whine and complain like MOS when challenged and run off (like most religious people).
At the end of the day, I would probably sit down and have a beer with MOS. I do not dislike the guy. However, I have every right to challenge his belief system if I want to.
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I can't be a Christian because other Christians ruin it for me. It suffices to talk to a "born again" type or to hear the hand wringing and waving in a megachurch where the congregation is in the hypnotic vice-like grip of the suit-wearing pastor to turn me off the people who believe in it. The shit they spew about everything and anything under the sun makes me want to just pretend half the country doesn't exist except in the movies.
I'd have to create my own Christianity and ban everyone else from being involved in it. But that goes against the teachings of the faith itself.
I have found that I cannot "read into" my faith. I can discern between right and wrong and this long before ever accepting the Christ. It is not difficult to do as Christ commanded of us but the problem for all of us is that it goes against our nature to be good. To be kind. To be forgiving. To love the sinner and hate the sin.
An example of how I deal with some things "thrown" at me if you will, by non-believers.
"Do you think the Earth is 6,000 years old?" - Nope. And I really don't care how old it really is! Not a concern of mine.
"What about dinosaurs, hmmmmmm?" - What about 'em? I'm just ecstatic they're extinct and we're not!
"What about ___________ sexuality?" - Not for me and I refuse to condone it. Don't care for my answer? What're you a heterophobe? ;D
And the list could go on but I don't wish to bore anyone more than I already have. My faith does not have "all the answers". Rather it has the answer to the one question that concerns me and anyone else that thinks, not just feels, as I do.
Jesus never harmed anyone. Contrast that with Mohammed and a myriad of Popes, priests, imams and dictators both atheist and false christian. Man's inhumanity to mankind is his own doing or rather undoing.
Be well.
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Sadly, you represent about 5% of Christians. Which is why it's a polluted religion. Sadly. Maybe when it first began to be written 2000 years ago, it was pure and consisted solely of those who adhered to it the way it had been intended to be. It's been warped out of all proportion by bigotry, sectarianism, cultism, violence, greed, etc. all done in Jesus's name.
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Sadly, you represent about 5% of Christians. Which is why it's a polluted religion. Sadly. Maybe when it first began to be written 2000 years ago, it was pure and consisted solely of those who adhered to it the way it had been intended to be. It's been warped out of all proportion by bigotry, sectarianism, cultism, violence, greed, etc. all done in Jesus's name.
Well, I really don't think any of us knows what percentage of the followers of the Nazarene I may or may not be indicative of, but I suspect it to be more than a mere 5%.
Violence done by men, no matter in whose name it is done is done by men. You can say it is done in the name of Jesus but if you look at what the Christ taught you would know (and doubtless already do) that it is not of Christ. Greed and the rest? All done in the name of men.
If it is bigoted to abhor sin, then I am a bigot but I think rather the term bigotry is used by those who desire only that their sins be made somehow sinless. Their desires, no matter how base they may be, be made pure. Lies turned into truth. Wrong is right and all this and more in the name of men.
It is no different. Men doing what they do for their own desires and naming them good. Christ condemns such and that is why the world turns its back on Him. There may well come a time when that which you call wrong will be deemed righteous and unless you bend your knee they will break your spirit and then your back. It has happened before and may well happen again.
One of the reasons I believe Christ to be true is that Apostles such as Peter died for their belief in Him. If that belief were based upon just collecting tithes and reciting a party line he did not truly follow why would he die for that faith? Why would he request to be crucified upside down (a request made because Peter felt he did not deserve to die exactly as did Jesus)? No man is so insane as to die for cause he knows false. I know I wouldn't.
The Apostles knew Jesus. They walked with Him. Were witness to His works and teachings. If those were false, then they would have denied Him upon pain of death. They did not.
I have said before that I am not come to make any wear the same shoes as I, much less any shoes. Our paths may differ but our final destination is the same. We shall just have to wait and see what comes next.
As always, be well.
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I only see things in terms of advantages and disadvantages. I guess that's why I'm an atheist. 8)
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I only see things in terms of advantages and disadvantages. I guess that's why I'm an atheist. 8)
Nothing wrong with that. It is your choice and your right to make it.
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Nothing wrong with that. It is your choice and your right to make it.
I wish god would strike me down. Why does he have to be so magnanimous and forgiving all the time?
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creating life is easy peasy
PTPS
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When I saw the title of this thread, I expected to see this when I opened it.
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I can't hate on the MOS. Our beliefs aren't the same but his wit is second to none and he seems like a good man for all these years. Can't see him ever turning a blind eye to someone's suffering or letting his ego overcome his reason, no matter what his mood. I can't say the same about myself.
This is correct. Even those that openly despise my beliefs, if they called on me with a need I'd help them the best I'm able to.
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My issue is this:
People are CONSTANTLY be challenged in every sphere of academia. Biologists, chemists, sociologist, psychologists, literature, philosophers, mathematicians, , anthropologists, art and music historians, etc, etc. Now some of these people throw a hissy fit when challenged. However, no one is better at throwing a hissy fit than a religious person. I have been to numerous debates where it got very heated! No one ran off crying, saying, "You're taking away my rights (religious people love to say their religious rights are being taken away)." Religious people are notorious for getting all bent out of shape when people challenge their belief system. The thing is is that as time goes on, religion does not hold the special privilege it used to (hundreds of years ago you can get hanged for talking out against the church). Times are changing and religious people do not know how to handle it. They run off like MOS when challenged.
As for religion becoming part of their identity, this also happens in other areas as well. Hardcore biologists, chemists, writers, psychologists, all have very strong identities associated with their occupation. As stated, they do not whine and complain like MOS when challenged and run off (like most religious people).
At the end of the day, I would probably sit down and have a beer with MOS. I do not dislike the guy. However, I have every right to challenge his belief system if I want to.
I've openly shared, defended and debated my faith with members of this board for about 4 solid years now.
For some of y'all the discussion with me is over. I've had so many folks - both believer and nonbeliever alike - that encouraged me (repeatedly) to stop engaging some of y'all 2 years ago. I finally arrived at the place with some where it's time to stop....simple as that.
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This is correct. Even those that openly despise my beliefs, if they called on me with a need I'd help them the best I'm able to.
What if the help was to formulate a plan to kill all christians? would you help me them?
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What if the help was to formulate a plan to kill all christians? would you help me them?
So you'd like to kill me and my family?
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So you'd like to kill me and my family?
That may have been a bit hyperbole :-X
First time I had a reason to use the word with a line through it to be honest, I seized an oppurtunity, hate the game bro.
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You have always been one of the better people to discuss the issue with MOS. Like you I have slowly drifted away from discussing the really heavy stuff anymore with anyone here. I think for me the process of doing so was to solidify what was already a strong position I held. I have got to the point where I am happy believing what I do, couldn't really give a fuck about what others believe, although I still throw in a condescending remark here and there (because I do think belief in God is ridiculous. not to mention pointless and on closer inspection borderline absurd), but there comes a time when you just have to live and let live.
Mind you, in the real world, when I meet people who have strong faith or are even rigidly evangelical, I make every attempt to avoid them and I do tend to view them with suspicion and a hint of derision. But that's just me, it's fortunate then I live in a pretty much atheist community who also views religion with contempt and ridicule. I think if I lived in a bible belt type of community I would either attempt to flee or neck myself, the thought of having to endure such a closed minded, rigid lifestyle scares the crap out of me, it's a good thing religious people don't know any better. I watched my best friend growing up endure a strict religious upbringing at it wan;t pretty, he barely survived it. Fortunately for him he become a devout atheist.
Thanks ???
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That may have been a bit hyperbole :-X
First time I had a reason to use the word with a line through it to be honest, I seized an oppurtunity, hate the game bro.
LOL, what game? Oh do you mean the game where you make a hilarious "joke" about killing Christians such as myself and my family?
Super duper funny.
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LOL, what game? Oh do you mean the game where you make a hilarious "joke" about killing Christians such as myself and my family?
Super duper funny.
:-X
jesus MOS in my excitement to use teh symbol I may have went overboard. You have to understand I rarely ever use this tool and clearly wasn't ready to prepared to use it.
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:-X
jesus MOS in my excitement to use teh symbol I may have went overboard. You have to understand I rarely ever use this tool and clearly wasn't ready to prepared to use it.
You went overboard and now you're in the deep end of poop pool. If you want to be pulled out, then take his hand in friendship. If not, continue on with what you started.
It's not that difficult to admit you were an ass and apologize. Again, if not just keep on braying.
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You went overboard and now you're in the deep end of poop pool. If you want to be pulled out, then take his hand in friendship. If not, continue on with what you started.
It's not that difficult to admit you were an ass and apologize. Again, if not just keep on braying.
Necrosis is a sarcastic fucker but hes not a dumb guy.
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Necrosis is a sarcastic fucker but hes not a dumb guy.
That's most likely true of many of us here. He just needs to apologize. Not too difficult and more than appropriate in this circumstance.
He may be sarcastic and he might not be dumb but if he's too stubborn to admit that what he said to MOS was totally inappropriate then he most definitely isn't an adult. We all make mistakes, that's part of growing up. Recognizing that and making right such missteps is the mark of someone that has grown up.
He will do as he sees fit, as his mentality dictates if you will.
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That's most likely true of many of us here. He just needs to apologize. Not too difficult and more than appropriate in this circumstance.
He may be sarcastic and he might not be dumb but if he's too stubborn to admit that what he said to MOS was totally inappropriate then he most definitely isn't an adult. We all make mistakes, that's part of growing up. Recognizing that and making right such missteps is the mark of someone that has grown up.
He will do as he sees fit, as his mentality dictates if you will.
I agree totally. MOS is a good guy and would never say anything like that to anyone
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You went overboard and now you're in the deep end of poop pool. If you want to be pulled out, then take his hand in friendship. If not, continue on with what you started.
It's not that difficult to admit you were an ass and apologize. Again, if not just keep on braying.
I was more concerned that the joke was a flop brah.. MOS knows I am fucking about.
when did this shit get all serious? sorry MOS put me back on the pray list.
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I agree totally. MOS is a good guy and would never say anything like that to anyone
Ok some context here. He stated that he would help anyone if they asked, I asked for something so absurd that he would not help, I was taking the piss. He suggested that his family was included on the kill list, I did not say I wanted to kill his family, they could be atheist or muslim ::)
MOS is a good cat, but if anyone takes anything on this board serious they need to get there head checked. If someone is actually carrying stuff from this board into real life, there is more to the issue then a message board.
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Ok some context here. He stated that he would help anyone if they asked, I asked for something so absurd that he would not help, I was taking the piss. He suggested that his family was included on the kill list, I did not say I wanted to kill his family, they could be atheist or muslim ::)
MOS is a good cat, but if anyone takes anything on this board serious they need to get there head checked. If someone is actually carrying stuff from this board into real life, there is more to the issue then a message board.
Okay...If I may? Stop beating around the burning bush (a clever religious reference given the forum we are in, eh? ;D) and simply say:
"I'm sorry for what I said. It was inappropriate and I really didn't mean it, so again, I apologize for my words."
But only say it if you mean it. Otherwise, it would be inappropriate and all because you didn't mean it.
Regardless of what you do/say next, be well.
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If someone is actually carrying stuff from this board into real life, there is more to the issue then a message board.
Also very true.
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Okay...If I may? Stop beating around the burning bush (a clever religious reference given the forum we are in, eh? ;D) and simply say:
"I'm sorry for what I said. It was inappropriate and I really didn't mean it, so again, I apologize for my words."
But only say it if you mean it. Otherwise, it would be inappropriate and all because you didn't mean it.
Regardless of what you do/say next, be well.
HAHA. I think I have said enough. you are a sensitive queen aren't ya?
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HAHA. I think I have said enough. you are a sensitive queen aren't ya?
Nope. Far from it. I'm just not an asshole. I like people and recognize while we all have our faults, not everyone is a diamond in the rough.
Again, be well.
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Nope. Far from it. I'm just not an asshole. I like people and recognize while we all have our faults, not everyone is a diamond in the rough.
Again, be well.
are you using test for you pct after this estrogen cycle?
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are you using test for you pct after this estrogen cycle?
;D ;D Sophomoric. By the way, that means childish or in your case, "immature".
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I've had people on these boards that hate that I'm a Christian that have told me they're gonna rape my wife and daughter, kill my family, that I should kill my daughter now before she's completely brainwashed and that they would kill me if given a chance. I've been hit with virtually every insult and taunt in the book and while I know that's all cowardice, posturing and ignorance I also know the anti-Christian agenda is fully scriptural.....the road promised will not be easy.
Do I think Necrosis wants to kill Christians? Kill me and my family because we're Christians? No. Do I wish him any ill will? Absolutely not.
This life we exist in is the time we "plead our case before Christ" and are given a choice - a divine opportunity - to accept or reject who he is and what he's done to free us from sin and bring us into righteousness.
When each of us exits this life many will immediately come to the terrifying reality that all this "stupid, religious nonsense MOS is spewing" is 100% accurate. All unbelievers will have left are three things: the memory of the life they freely chose to lead, the finality of judgement before God Almighty and the utter and complete separation from God and all that he is. Every divine aspect of who God is permanently removed and the eternal realization that you chose this state for yourself and that God honored that choice....you willingly traded his eternal will and glory for your own will and glory.
My humble, sincere desire is to help anyone that doesn't know Jesus Christ to be saved from God's divine, righteous, holy judgement and realize that a life dedicated to Christ is a difficult yet wonderful journey of serving his will and purposes while understanding his absolute, definite reality and love for you.
Romans 10:9
9 If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Micah 6:8
8 No, O people, the Lord has told you what is good,
and this is what he requires of you:
to do what is right, to love mercy,
and to walk humbly with your God.
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I've had people on these boards that hate that I'm a Christian that have told me they're gonna rape my wife and daughter, kill my family, that I should kill my daughter now before she's completely brainwashed and that they would kill me if given a chance. I've been hit with virtually every insult and taunt in the book and while I know that's all cowardice, posturing and ignorance I also know the anti-Christian agenda is fully scriptural.....the road promised will not be easy.
Do I think Necrosis wants to kill Christians? Kill me and my family because we're Christians? No. Do I wish him any ill will? Absolutely not.
This life we exist in is the time we "plead our case before Christ" and are given a choice - a divine opportunity - to accept or reject who he is and what he's done to free us from sin and bring us into righteousness.
When each of us exits this life many will immediately come to the terrifying reality that all this "stupid, religious nonsense MOS is spewing" is 100% accurate. All unbelievers will have left are three things: the memory of the life they freely chose to lead, the finality of judgement before God Almighty and the utter and complete separation from God and all that he is. Every divine aspect of who God is permanently removed and the eternal realization that you chose this state for yourself and that God honored that choice....you willingly traded his eternal will and glory for your own will and glory.
My humble, sincere desire is to help anyone that doesn't know Jesus Christ to be saved from God's divine, righteous, holy judgement and realize that a life dedicated to Christ is a difficult yet wonderful journey of serving his will and purposes while understanding his absolute, definite reality and love for you.
Romans 10:9
9 If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Micah 6:8
8 No, O people, the Lord has told you what is good,
and this is what he requires of you:
to do what is right, to love mercy,
and to walk humbly with your God.
Wait, what? People here made threats to you and your family like that? Animals.
Man of Steel, you have my support and my prayers. Great post, BTW!
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Wait, what? People here made threats to you and your family like that? Animals.
Man of Steel, you have my support and my prayers. Great post, BTW!
All idle threats from cowards.....not that I'm lookin for someone to manup and give it a shot LOL!
Most people are cool, but I seem to attract every hothead in the house.
I appreciate the prayers!
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ugh, I was hoping they'd wait another 100 years for reaching this level of technology.
Scientists at The Scripps Research Institute (TSRI) have engineered a bacterium whose genetic material includes an added pair of DNA “letters,” or bases, not found in nature. The cells of this unique bacterium can replicate the unnatural DNA bases more or less normally, for as long as the molecular building blocks are supplied.
That's just great. I've always imagined there would never be any virus that could wipe out 100% of life on earth... until we learned to create un-natural DNA. Horrifying to think they could create a non-earth organism that can replicate. Maybe it'll be like the BLOB, and just keep replicating, feeding on everything.
I don't get into the religious argument... we're all idiots, none of us knows ANYTHING, let's be honest. But creating DNA that can reproduce itself? scary.
I was seriously thinking the same thing. All religion aside, main stream scientists believe that humans are no better than all the already extinct species, and that all it takes is one unstoppable virus to wipe humans off the face of the earth forever. Our ability to fast travel around the world makes it even easier already. WTF are they thinking?
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That's most likely true of many of us here. He just needs to apologize. Not too difficult and more than appropriate in this circumstance.
He may be sarcastic and he might not be dumb but if he's too stubborn to admit that what he said to MOS was totally inappropriate then he most definitely isn't an adult. We all make mistakes, that's part of growing up. Recognizing that and making right such missteps is the mark of someone that has grown up.
He will do as he sees fit, as his mentality dictates if you will.
x100. That's what many of us are guilty of. If you say something fucked up, just apologize.
This place should never get serious.
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lmao ;D ;D
this thread, hahaha
Ok life created by scientist you bunch of ding dongs, woooooooooosh :D loollollollo
edit; didn't realize this was in the religious section, :-\
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lmao ;D ;D
this thread, hahaha
Ok life created by scientist you bunch of ding dongs, woooooooooosh :D loollollollo
edit; didn't realize this was in the religious section, :-\
Oh dear Onetimehard :-\ You arent the sturdiest shingle on the roof.
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Oh dear Onetimehard :-\ You arent the sturdiest shingle on the roof.
no i am not, I admit but if you believe this you are an idiot. That is if you believe humans can create life.
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no i am not, I admit but if you believe this you are an idiot. That is if you believe humans can create life.
Define life. Scientists can clone you right now. Is that life?
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Define life. Scientists can clone you right now. Is that life?
and I can have a baby too Einstein, that means jack. Creating life means gathering elements together and making something living out of them. Not intervening in what is an ''already working process'' then act like you had something to do with it.
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and I can have a baby too Einstein, that means jack. Creating life means gathering elements together and making something living out of them. Not intervening in what is an ''already working process'' then act like you had something to do with it.
You made my point. Scientists can create life.
You also laughed that scientists created life. Two different things.
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You made my point. Scientists can create life.
You also laughed that scientists created life. Two different things.
scientist can not create. That is not creating anything, that is called jumping into something that already has it's ways of processing life
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scientist can not create. That is not creating anything, that is called jumping into something that already has it's ways of processing life
"Jumping into something". Would that be the natural process of evolution/natural selection, or is it part of god's intelligent design?
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I will now add Onetimehard's scalp to my collection.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-boVsLgZpMko/UB3mS1cKBPI/AAAAAAAAGbg/q87TLbD7zlM/s1600/Scalping+engraving.jpg)
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Define life. Scientists can clone you right now. Is that life?
I can photocopy a book. Did I create the book?
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I can photocopy a book. Did I create the book?
Did god give those scientists the brain cells to achieve such breakthroughs? If so, is he playing a game with us?
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Who said anything about God? ???
I especially enjoyed how the mods took my 6 pages of belaboring that scientific endeavours are neither pro- nor anti-religious, that it has nothing to do with religion,
and moved it to the Religion Board. Wisenheimers.
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Who said anything about God? ???
I especially enjoyed how the mods took my 6 pages of belaboring that scientific endeavours are neither pro- nor anti-religious, that it has nothing to do with religion,
and moved it to the Religion Board. Wisenheimers.
I am sorry I did not hear your argument. Where do you stand?
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Out in my field.
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Out in my field.
Field of dreams?
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Ya Ray Liotta turned up and I was thinking shit he's a scary person I wish I hadn't built this baseball field now.
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Why is this in the religious section? has absolutely nothing to do with religion.
onetimehard wants you to fill a basket with elements and add some spice and create a human.
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Why is this in the religious section? has absolutely nothing to do with religion.
onetimehard wants you to fill a basket with elements and add some spice and create a human.
;D
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;D
I a mod and got fucked by my own kind :'(
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http://scitechdaily.com/scientists-engineer-first-living-organism-expanded-genetic-alphabet/
Basically they created a living organism with unique DNA bases (amongst the common) this shows that creating life is easy peasy and that there is nothing special about our DNA, nor the bases, life can form in a infinite amount of ways (conjecture here).
We are gods.
They did not create life. They inserted an assembled DNA base pair into a living cell (which they did not create), and succeeded in getting the cell to integrate it. No one has even come close to creating life from purely nonliving components. No one, except G-d.
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They did not create life. They inserted an assembled DNA base pair into a living cell (which they did not create), and succeeded in getting the cell to integrate it. No one has even come close to creating life from purely nonliving components. No one, except G-d.
we are made of non living components. The components themselves create an emergent phenomenon, ie sentience. The title was meant to get the Christians going.
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we are made of non living components. The components themselves create an emergent phenomenon, ie sentience. The title was meant to get the Christians going.
>:( >:( >:( >:(
eeeerrrrrrrr
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>:( >:( >:( >:(
eeeerrrrrrrr
it was a mixture, always the best threads.