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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: theworm on July 31, 2016, 04:19:23 PM
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My hdl on cycke drops like a rock. I use test and deca and in the past ran arimidex. I know AI crashes lipids and nolva increase them. But what's the best option for gyno prevention but less on hdl? Femara? Other options?
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My hdl on cycke drops like a rock. I use test and deca and in the past ran arimidex. I know AI crashes lipids and nolva increase them. But what's the best option for gyno prevention but less on hdl? Femara? Other options?
you could copy and paste your thread title into google and get your answer on the first page. Anyway
Exemestane/aromasine is the best for lipids but you already knew that since you ask the same since ~2008. Hope this helps.
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you could copy and paste your thread title into google and get your answer on the first page. Anyway
Exemestane/aromasine is the best for lipids but you already knew that since you ask the same since ~2008. Hope this helps.
Can u get a doc to scribe that? It does help
How was I asking about this since 08 when I only became concerned about my hdl 2 months ago? No need to be dicks, we are all here to help each other out.
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Exemestane - Aromasin. All Aromatase Inhibitors will have a negative impact on your lipids. The one that does so the least is Aromasin, followed by Anastrozole - Arimidex, and lastly Femara - Letrozole. They all have their uses, time and place. Aromasin is a suicide inhibitor, unlike Letro and Adex, it will not cause any estrogenic rebound that may cause gynocomastia, acne and other side effects to suddenly flare up. It is harder to crash your Estradiol (E2) with Aromasin. It is the prefered AI nowadays, which makes it more costy and harder to get. I hope this helps. Maybe other members could shine in on the half life because I don't really remember about that from the top of my head. I will have to look that up again
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Exemestane - Aromasin. All Aromatase Inhibitors will have a negative impact on your lipids. The one that does so the least is Aromasin, followed by Anastrozole - Arimidex, and lastly Femara - Letrozole. They all have their uses, time and place. Aromasin is a suicide inhibitor, unlike Letro and Adex, it will not cause any estrogenic rebound that may cause gynocomastia, acne and other side effects to suddenly flare up. It is harder to crash your Estradiol (E2) with Aromasin. It is the prefered AI nowadays, which makes it more costy and harder to get. I hope this helps. Maybe other members could shine in on the half life because I don't really remember about that from the top of my head. I will have to look that up again
Very helpful, thanks. I thought nolva was best for hdl since it raises it...
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Can u get a doc to scribe that? It does help
How was I asking about this since 08 when I only became concerned about my hdl 2 months ago? No need to be dicks, we are all here to help each other out.
There are some good labs that produce it. If you manage to get a script, that would be much better. Pharma Asin from the middle east costed me 250$ CAD for 30x25mg pills.
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Very helpful, thanks. I thought nolva was best for hdl since it raises it...
Nolvadex doesn't reduce the total amount of estrogen in the body. It only blocks the receptors in the breast area to prevent gynocomastia to form. It basically parks in the receptor, so when the estrogen comes to bind, the receptor is already occupied. Thus, disabling it to bind. Where Adex, Letro, and Asin actually reduce the total amount of estrogen in the body. Helping you control the amount of aromatase in the body, and bringing your estrogen levels down to baseline. I don't know which is less harsh on your lipids though. This is a good question. Right now, I am combining both as I am very prone to gynocomastia and acne. I use 12.5mg Asin ED and 20mg of Nolvadex.
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Nolvadex doesn't reduce the total amount of estrogen in the body. It only blocks the receptors in the breast area to prevent gynocomastia to form. It basically parks in the receptor, so when the estrogen comes to bind, the receptor is already occupied. Thus, disabling it to bind. Where Adex, Letro, and Asin actually reduce the total amount of estrogen in the body. Helping you control the amount of aromatase in the body, and bringing your estrogen levels down to baseline. I don't know which is less harsh on your lipids though. This is a good question. Right now, I am combining both as I am very prone to gynocomastia and acne. I use 12.5mg Asin ED and 20mg of Nolvadex.
I know, I'm using .5 arimidex twice a week and nolva every day I'm not taking the arimidex
As I'm getting older, lipids become more important ;). Gyno, I can always have that shit cut out...
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I would really like to see how much worse arimidex is for your lipids compared to arimidex
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Aromasin is still bad for HDL... I was thinking about rolaxafin?
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dude. please do some research on what you put into your body... for your own sake...
you really have no clue about what an AI or a SERM does, even though it has been explained to you 300 times now...
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dude. please do some research on what you put into your body... for your own sake...
you really have no clue about what an AI or a SERM does, even though it has been explained to you 300 times now...
I know exactly what they do. WTF? I'm seeing which lowers HDL the least. I don't need an explanation on how they work, that wasn't the question. The question is about HDL. Please read the thread before making an ignorant comment.
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I would really like to see how much worse arimidex is for your lipids compared to arimidex
I think the question should be, would injectible arimidex not lower HDL as much? I think that's going to be my answer to this. The pharmacy is able to compound this for me and I'm going to check my hdl again a month after switching to the inject version. Hopefully it's not as bad, but I'm not sure because I think HDL suffers from low estrogen rather than the oral admin of the AI...
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I think the question should be, would injectible arimidex not lower HDL as much? I think that's going to be my answer to this. The pharmacy is able to compound this for me and I'm going to check my hdl again a month after switching to the inject version. Hopefully it's not as bad, but I'm not sure because I think HDL suffers from low estrogen rather than the oral admin of the AI...
The second half of your last sentence is correct.
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I know exactly what they do. WTF? I'm seeing which lowers HDL the least. I don't need an explanation on how they work, that wasn't the question. The question is about HDL. Please read the thread before making an ignorant comment.
you dont even know the difference between SERMs and AIs, nor do you know how they function. you also cant spell either.
I think the question should be, would injectible arimidex not lower HDL as much? I think that's going to be my answer to this. The pharmacy is able to compound this for me and I'm going to check my hdl again a month after switching to the inject version. Hopefully it's not as bad, but I'm not sure because I think HDL suffers from low estrogen rather than the oral admin of the AI...
injectable arimidex ::) oh brother
the pathway of administration has absolutely no connection to your HDL, except for the difference in bioavailability. low estrogen = low HDL. thats it.
injectable pharmaceutical arimidex does not exist.
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you dont even know the difference between SERMs and AIs, nor do you know how they function. you also cant spell either.injectable arimidex ::) oh brother
the pathway of administration has absolutely no connection to your HDL, except for the difference in bioavailability. low estrogen = low HDL. thats it.
injectable pharmaceutical arimidex does not exist.
How come I have it right in front of me if it didn't exist? Do some research before you make ignorant comments. My HRt doc says his patients HDL doesn't drop as much on it, but I can't find any other research on the topic of injectible arimidex. His theory is that people need less via injectible route, so less decrease in HDL. Also, my hdl is 41, yours is 9, so I must know something ;) You on your period today Jiz?
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post a pic of your injectable arimidex
ive never ever seen or heard of injectable adex. you sure its not a research liquid? lol
nolvadex and raloxifene are SERMs, they dont do ANYTHING to combat estrogen.
your HDL point is funny as fuck though lol
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post a pic of your injectable arimidex
ive never ever seen or heard of injectable adex. you sure its not a research liquid? lol
nolvadex and raloxifene are SERMs, they dont do ANYTHING to combat estrogen.
your HDL point is funny as fuck though lol
it's probably custom made from the pharmacy using the tablets. who knows what method they use. only reserchsites offer it as injectables.
there is no injectable pharm grade anastrozole/arimidex to buy. not in germany and not in the US and A.
as for HDL/LDL I heard niacin, cardarine, fishoil helps
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it's probably custom made from the pharmacy using the tablets. who knows what method they use. only reserchsites offer it as injectables.
there is no injectable pharm grade anastrozole/arimidex to buy. not in germany and not in the US and A.
as for HDL/LDL I heard niacin, cardarine, fishoil helps
I'll post a pic tonight, it's call compounding. It's 200 mg test cyp and 1 mg arimidex per ml, 10 ml total from a USA pharmacy. It is a available in the USA.
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I'll post a pic tonight, it's call compounding. It's 200 mg test cyp and 1 mg arimidex per ml, 10 ml total from a USA pharmacy. It is a available in the USA.
yeah the pharmacy is doing it for you. It's a special compound but not a product you can buy regularly i guess
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thats pretty cool though
fucked up dosage for any normal person lol but kind of cool nonetheless
brb putting all my AAS, supps, AIs, t3, GH and slin into 1 bottle to inject
(not srs)
(maybe srs, ive done so with orals already)
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Worm have you tried taking cholesterol medication before? If your concerned about your hdl I would recommend just staying away from orals in general and just blasting injectables that arent horrible for your hdl. I don't know if you take alot of time off between blasts but you could always try that to. Maybe even lowering your trt dose could help and trying to get it to a point where you don't need an AI I've seen people do it with the help of the supplement DIM and with lower end testosterone levels like 600 to 800.
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Come on bro...nolvadex!
Actually beneficial on lipids.
Niacin is good for lipids.
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Come on bro...nolvadex!
Actually beneficial on lipids.
Niacin is good for lipids.
Correct on both counts. Just don't run Nolvadex on tren, it might just give you gyno!
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Damn ive heard of this compounding from an old timer powerlifter friend who used to have it done for him in the early 90s. I do not remember what gear we were discussing its been a few years since the talk and have since lost contact with him
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Photo too large to attach. Jiz, send me a pm so I can email u the pic of test with arimidex in vial
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Correct on both counts. Just don't run Nolvadex on tren, it might just give you gyno!
thats broscience, ive explained it on here before
also nolva doesnt do anything to lower estrogen. it just prevents you from getting titties..
high estrogen can also cause cardiovascular issues.. thats why estrogen replacement therapy for females has been disestablished after the first studies...
too much estrogen is just as bad as too little. and with nolvadex and no AI you will always have excess estrogen if youre prone too it.
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thats broscience, ive explained it on here before
also nolva doesnt do anything to lower estrogen. it just prevents you from getting titties..
high estrogen can also cause cardiovascular issues.. thats why estrogen replacement therapy for females has been disestablished after the first studies...
too much estrogen is just as bad as too little. and with nolvadex and no AI you will always have excess estrogen if youre prone too it.
Jizmo, bro science or not, EVERY TIME I add Nolvadex on tren, even when not on any aromatising steroids, in an attempt to improve my HDL, I start getting gyno symptoms and when I stop the nolva the gyno symptoms stop. I believe it is something to do with increasing prolactin. This has genuinely happened to me every time I've added nolva in with tren and it tends to start after about a fortnight.
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Damn ive heard of this compounding from an old timer powerlifter friend who used to have it done for him in the early 90s. I do not remember what gear we were discussing its been a few years since the talk and have since lost contact with him
Compounding pharmacist make a ton of money, not to mention they go to school for about as long as a specialized plastic surgeon.
Jizmo, bro science or not, EVERY TIME I add Nolvadex on tren, even when not on any aromatising steroids, in an attempt to improve my HDL, I start getting gyno symptoms and when I stop the nolva the gyno symptoms stop. I believe it is something to do with increasing prolactin. This has genuinely happened to me every time I've added nolva in with tren and it tends to start after about a fortnight.
Take B6 when taking tren it helps with the gyno.
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Compounding pharmacist make a ton of money, not to mention they go to school for about as long as a specialized plastic surgeon.
Take B6 when taking tren it helps with the gyno.
Thanks, yes I take P-5-P.
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Jizmo, bro science or not, EVERY TIME I add Nolvadex on tren, even when not on any aromatising steroids, in an attempt to improve my HDL, I start getting gyno symptoms and when I stop the nolva the gyno symptoms stop. I believe it is something to do with increasing prolactin. This has genuinely happened to me every time I've added nolva in with tren and it tends to start after about a fortnight.
nolva upregulates prolactin/progesterone receptors for a very short time frame in some individuals (happens to a few), but over time it downregulates them for everyone
there is a study on this out there but im too lazy to dig it out right now
bottom line start your nolva 2 weeks before hopping on tren and you wont have any issues :)
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nolva upregulates prolactin/progesterone receptors for a very short time frame in some individuals (happens to a few), but over time it downregulates them for everyone
there is a study on this out there but im too lazy to dig it out right now
bottom line start your nolva 2 weeks before hopping on tren and you wont have any issues :)
Well that makes sense. I may try this again in the hope of better lipids!
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nolva upregulates prolactin/progesterone receptors for a very short time frame in some individuals (happens to a few), but over time it downregulates them for everyone
there is a study on this out there but im too lazy to dig it out right now
bottom line start your nolva 2 weeks before hopping on tren and you wont have any issues :)
Is the interaction between adex and novla significant ? Im tempted to run nolva + an AI, to avoid having to use ungodly amount of AIs with high test.
What about the interaction with letro and asin ? I think it doesnt interract with asin at all right ?
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Is the interaction between adex and novla significant ? Im tempted to run nolva + an AI, to avoid having to use ungodly amount of AIs with high test.
What about the interaction with letro and asin ? I think it doesnt interract with asin at all right ?
ive heard about AIs interfering with SERMs in general.. i think the whole thing was not overly significant though... like 1/3 reduction in bioavailability of AIs with the concurrent use of SERMs or something along these lines... so maybe dose your AI a bit higher if youre taking a SERM with it.
i think the reduction in availability was only with really CONCURRENT dosing though, so by taking your AI in the morning and your SERM at night you could possibly avoid these issues completely
that being said, i always run raloxifene and when im on higher test i always use an AI too (and take them both at the same time)
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ive heard about AIs interfering with SERMs in general.. i think the whole thing was not overly significant though... like 1/3 reduction in bioavailability of AIs with the concurrent use of SERMs or something along these lines... so maybe dose your AI a bit higher if youre taking a SERM with it.
i think the reduction in availability was only with really CONCURRENT dosing though, so by taking your AI in the morning and your SERM at night you could possibly avoid these issues completely
that being said, i always run raloxifene and when im on higher test i always use an AI too (and take them both at the same time)
I take them both as well.
Another question: how soon does HDL drop on orals? 2 weeks?
After reading a lot about bill Roberts 2 weeks on, 4 off, seems very interesting. I.e. Stop the oral before the hdl drops...
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you take an oral your HDL starts to go down
that happens instantly, not after a certain timeframe... your body doesnt work mechanically like a clock, it reacts to certain things ;)
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I switched from .5mg mwf adex to 12.5mg/day aromasin this week
Had labs with shit hdl while on adex and orals, might have been under 20 can't remember
I'll get a new blood test in a month and let you guys know
Already feel like I need to bump up aromasin to 25mg/day to compare to old adex dose
Always run 60mg raloxifene
Might add .5mg 2x week caber bc I dropped eq and now on deca
Keep you posted on hdl
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I switched from .5mg mwf adex to 12.5mg/day aromasin this week
Had labs with shit hdl while on adex and orals, might have been under 20 can't remember
I'll get a new blood test in a month and let you guys know
Already feel like I need to bump up aromasin to 25mg/day to compare to old adex dose
Always run 60mg raloxifene
Might add .5mg 2x week caber bc I dropped eq and now on deca
Keep you posted on hdl
Same ... I was on .5 adex mwf while on 2,5 g gear and was ok .. I decided to try aromasin since everyone say is better but i using 25 mg ed for 1 month and my estro not crashed .. Is 38
Weird but for me adex seem stronger than aromasin
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Adex is much stronger than aromasin (for my body). I feel puffier and fuller. Started at 12.5 and had to bump up to a full cap at 25mg and this is pharma grade exemestane. BUT MY JOINTS FEEL GOOD. Could also be the deca kicking in.
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SERM: 10mg Nolvadex will help with blood lipids (half a tab ed)
AI: best for lipids and in general is Aromasin
If you need to get even better lipid profile use BERBERINE HCL 1500mg ed (3x500mg, you can buy it on amazon), 1 pill before breakfast, 1 pill before lunch, 1 pill before dinner.
Also you insulin sensitivity will improve a lot, it's ideal to take when you stop using slin, or just to have a better lipid profile.
Also TUDCA will help but it's more for liver.
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garlic is supposed to help to raise HDL by about 10-15%: http://examine.com/supplements/Garlic/
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depending on how bad your hdl is and how high your ldl is i would just go to a cardiologist and get a cardiac calcium score done and see if you are actually building any plaque in your arteries. Just bc your hdl is low and ldl is high doesnt mean you are building plaque, its genetic.
also you should limit orals and drink red wine, 2 glasses per day ( always heard that and just thought it was a myth but its true and works). I have recently worked with the best cardiologist in the country so if you are worried there is was to get answers.
What is your hdl and ldl?
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depending on how bad your hdl is and how high your ldl is i would just go to a cardiologist and get a cardiac calcium score done and see if you are actually building any plaque in your arteries. Just bc your hdl is low and ldl is high doesnt mean you are building plaque, its genetic.
also you should limit orals and drink red wine, 2 glasses per day ( always heard that and just thought it was a myth but its true and works). I have recently worked with the best cardiologist in the country so if you are worried there is was to get answers.
What is your hdl and ldl?
My HDL was 17, LDL was 183, on oxandrolone and arimidex and test
One month off, 2 glasses red wine a day , HDL 41, LDL 98
Keep hearing good things about raloxifine
For jizmo: or others, think I can get away with just raloxifine 30 mg daily if only running 400mg of test per week? Yes, have mild existing gyno...
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I would give raloxifine a shot for sure.
also avoid orals until you get your system worked out, plus it will make it easier to see what is hurting and what is helping.
you could also just run 200mg test per week and then run other compounds that wont cause gyno.
it doesnt take much nolva to keep gyno away, i use to just take 10mg on shot days or the day after. especially at only 400mg per week (its just person specific tho). it would probably have less of an impact on your hdl also if you are only taking it twice per week than taking adex every day or every other.
do you drink the red wine on cycle also?
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I would give raloxifine a shot for sure.
also avoid orals until you get your system worked out, plus it will make it easier to see what is hurting and what is helping.
you could also just run 200mg test per week and then run other compounds that wont cause gyno.
it doesnt take much nolva to keep gyno away, i use to just take 10mg on shot days or the day after. especially at only 400mg per week (its just person specific tho). it would probably have less of an impact on your hdl also if you are only taking it twice per week than taking adex every day or every other.
do you drink the red wine on cycle also?
I don't drink on cycle... Love to do non aromatizing gear but can only get oxandrolone, test and deca (long story)... I know Ox doesn't aromatize but it's an oral that drops my HDL
But last time I checked my HDL I was on oxandrolone plus arimidex
I'm going to get on lower test, raloxifine and oxandrolone and check while I'm running that
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raloxifene actually has many health benefits... it gives most the positives of estrogen (bone density, HDL increase etc) with none of the negatives.
i run 20-30mg year round for the health benefits (bone density also is a plus since i run t3 year round too), plus it gives the plus of additional gyno prevention... never had an itching nipple ever since i run it, and i run 3g of gear regularly (2g of that being 19nors). obviously using adex too. but in the past ive had issues without additional caber.
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raloxifene actually has many health benefits... it gives most the positives of estrogen (bone density, HDL increase etc) with none of the negatives.
i run 20-30mg year round for the health benefits (bone density also is a plus since i run t3 year round too), plus it gives the plus of additional gyno prevention... never had an itching nipple ever since i run it, and i run 3g of gear regularly (2g of that being 19nors). obviously using adex too. but in the past ive had issues without additional caber.
You are still blasting 1g TestE 1g TrenE 1g Deca? ;)