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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Dos Equis on September 27, 2021, 11:28:28 AM
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Whiskey Tango Foxtrot. Somebody let them know this ain't China or North Korea. >:(
IRS would track all bank transactions over $600 under Biden plan; Businesses revolt
by Casey Harper, The Center Square
September 27, 2021
A major component of President Joe Biden’s plan to raise revenue to pay for his trillions of dollars in new federal spending is now under fire from trade associations across the country.
The Biden administration has made clear its plan to beef up IRS auditing by expanding the agency’s funding and power. Biden’s latest proposal would require banks to turn over to the Internal Revenue Service bank account information for all accounts holding more than $600.
In a sharp pushback against the proposal, more than 40 trade associations, some of which represent entire industries or economic sectors, signed a letter to U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., and Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, R-Calif., raising the alarm about the plan.
The letter, which includes the support of several banking coalitions, calls on Congress to reject that requirement, saying it violates customer privacy and would create an incredibly expensive and elaborate reporting requirement for the banks.
“While the stated goal of this vast data collection is to uncover tax dodging by the wealthy, this proposal is not remotely targeted to that purpose or that population,” the letter said. “In addition to the significant privacy concerns, it would create tremendous liability for all affected parties by requiring the collection of financial information for nearly every American without proper explanation of how the IRS will store, protect, and use this enormous trove of personal financial information. We believe that this program is costly for all parties, not fit for purpose, and loaded with potential for unintended and serious negative consequences.”
The groups argue it would target "almost every American" and question whether the IRS could keep that information secure from hackers and bad actors.
“The undersigned associations representing a cross-section of financial and business interests write to express our strong opposition to a proposal under consideration as part of the reconciliation package that would establish an expansive new tax information reporting regime that would directly impact almost every American and small business with an account at a financial institution," the letter said. "This proposal would create significant operational and reputational challenges for financial institutions, increase tax preparation costs for individuals and small businesses, and create serious financial privacy concerns. We urge members to oppose any efforts to advance this ill-advised new reporting regime."
Some reports indicate that Democrats hope to raise the $600 threshold, but that has not yet materialized.
Biden proposed giving an extra $80 billion to the IRS earlier this year for auditing, saying the agency would more than make back those funds. House Democrats’ have so far indicated they plan to fulfill that request.
“There’s a 99 percent compliance rate on wages – because wage earners get their earnings reported to the IRS,” a fact sheet says that was handed out by the White House to lawmakers to sell them on the plan. “But the super wealthy who get their income from unreported sources are able to hide their income and avoid paying the tax they owe. In fact, each year the top 1 percent chooses not to pay more than $160 billion in taxes.”
Republicans on the House Ways and Means Committee have scheduled a virtual roundtable Wednesday entitled, “Weaponization of the IRS: A Sordid History and the Need for Taxpayer Protections” to discuss these concerns.
“The meeting will highlight the efforts of congressional Democrats to nearly double the size of the IRS with a massive funding increase while doing nothing to address the weaponization of the IRS, including the massive, criminal leak of taxpayer information to ProPublica in June of this year,” Texas Republican Rep. Kevin Brady’s office said.
This isn’t the only business community criticism to be levied at the $3.5 trillion bill in recent days.
The U.S. Chamber of Commerce officially condemned the bill this week, calling it an “existential threat” to the economy.
“This reconciliation bill is effectively 100 bills in one representing every big government idea that’s never been able to pass in Congress,” U.S. Chamber of Commerce President and CEO Suzanne Clark said. “The bill is an existential threat to America’s fragile economic recovery and future prosperity. We will not find durable or practical solutions in one massive bill that is equivalent to more than twice the combined budgets of all 50 states. The success of the bipartisan infrastructure negotiations provides a much better model for how Congress should proceed in addressing America’s problems.”
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/politics/irs-would-track-all-bank-transactions-over-600-under-biden-plan-businesses-revolt
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All accounts with balances exceeding $600.
Anybody with half a brain knows not to deposit under the table money to leave a trail for the IRS so this is a waste of time.
This is why they want to go to a cashless economy...to prevent tax evasion.
So, if you approve of people cheating on their taxes then a cashless economy will not be for you.
Do you approve of tax evasion/cheating?
"Biden’s latest proposal would require banks to turn over to the Internal Revenue Service bank account information for all accounts holding more than $600."
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This seems like it's being billed as something as a way to tax the wealthy. I don't see that happening. They don't audit the superrich very often. Its just another way to spend a bunch of money. I also think you will see a bunch of people not put a lot of money in the bank. Would that cause a rise in crime?
If they really wanted to tax the rich they could a lot more.
This is likely a way to squeeze more out of the middle class.
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Is this leading to the idea of a wealth tax...a tax on assets in addition to a tax on income?
That was an idea of that annoying female Senator law professor who ran for Prez.
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In Australia they track + $ 10K transactions , but not $ 9999 ones :D
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Like they already don't. ::)
When it comes to information they have access to all of it.
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In Australia they track + $ 10K transactions , but not $ 9999 ones :D
They have been doing it in the U.S. for many years. Supposedly to track drug money.
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They have been doing it in the U.S. for many years. Supposedly to track drug money.
Patriot Act allowed far more than most realize. Now it's all bets off. They have unlimted access and storage.
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In Australia they track + $ 10K transactions , but not $ 9999 ones :D
You only have to do a Currency Transaction Report for amounts of $10k or more, but the banks still report some transactions less than that amount.
But $600? That's crazy. Big Brother on the sauce.
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The headline said "transactions" but the article said "balances".
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The headline said "transactions" but the article said "balances".
Good point. I think it applies to both. Here is an excerpt from the IRS Commissioner's Congressional testimony:
"This requirement would apply to all business and personal accounts from financial institutions, including bank, loan, and investment accounts, with the exception of accounts below a low de minimis gross flow threshold of $600 or fair market value of $600."
https://www.finance.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/2021%20Final%20CPR%20testimony%20SFC%20BUDGET%20060821%20-1.pdf
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Good point. I think it applies to both. Here is an excerpt from the IRS Commissioner's Congressional testimony:
"This requirement would apply to all business and personal accounts from financial institutions, including bank, loan, and investment accounts, with the exception of accounts below a low de minimis gross flow threshold of $600 or fair market value of $600."
https://www.finance.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/2021%20Final%20CPR%20testimony%20SFC%20BUDGET%20060821%20-1.pdf
This is what it says (my interpretation):
The IRS will have access to the transaction info of all accounts $600 and above.
What is even more intrusive is the reporting of all purchases made via these accounts. It sounds like this may also include credit card purchases and investment/mutual fund accounts.
Likely this info will be collected and stored for future analysis if needed during an investigation.
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"This proposal would create a comprehensive financial account information
reporting regime. Financial institutions would report data on financial
accounts in an information return. The annual return will report gross inflows
and outflows with a breakdown for physical cash, transactions with a foreign
account, and transfers to and from another account with the same owner.
This requirement would apply to all business and personal accounts from
financial institutions, including bank, loan, and investment accounts, with
the exception of accounts below a low de minimis gross flow threshold of
$600 or fair market value of $600. Other accounts with characteristics
similar to financial institution accounts will be covered under this information
reporting regime. In particular, payment settlement entities would collect
Taxpayer Identification Numbers (TINs) and file a revised Form 1099-K
expanded to all payee accounts (subject to the same de minimis threshold),
reporting not only gross receipts but also gross purchases, physical cash,
as well as payments to and from foreign accounts, and transfer inflows and
outflows. Similar reporting requirements would apply to crypto asset
exchanges and custodians. Separately, reporting requirements would apply
in cases in which taxpayers buy crypto assets from one broker and then
transfer them to another broker, and businesses that receive crypto assets
in transactions with a fair market value of more than $10,000 would have to
report such transactions. The Secretary would be given broad authority to
issue regulations necessary to implement this proposal. The proposal would
be effective for tax years beginning after December 31, 2022."
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This is what it says (my interpretation):
The IRS will have access to the transaction info of all accounts $600 and above.
What is even more intrusive is the reporting of all purchases made via these accounts. It sounds like this may also include credit card purchases and investment/mutual fund accounts.
Likely this info will be collected and stored for future analysis if needed during an investigation.
>
"This proposal would create a comprehensive financial account information
reporting regime. Financial institutions would report data on financial
accounts in an information return. The annual return will report gross inflows
and outflows with a breakdown for physical cash, transactions with a foreign
account, and transfers to and from another account with the same owner.
This requirement would apply to all business and personal accounts from
financial institutions, including bank, loan, and investment accounts, with
the exception of accounts below a low de minimis gross flow threshold of
$600 or fair market value of $600. Other accounts with characteristics
similar to financial institution accounts will be covered under this information
reporting regime. In particular, payment settlement entities would collect
Taxpayer Identification Numbers (TINs) and file a revised Form 1099-K
expanded to all payee accounts (subject to the same de minimis threshold),
reporting not only gross receipts but also gross purchases, physical cash,
as well as payments to and from foreign accounts, and transfer inflows and
outflows. Similar reporting requirements would apply to crypto asset
exchanges and custodians. Separately, reporting requirements would apply
in cases in which taxpayers buy crypto assets from one broker and then
transfer them to another broker, and businesses that receive crypto assets
in transactions with a fair market value of more than $10,000 would have to
report such transactions. The Secretary would be given broad authority to
issue regulations necessary to implement this proposal. The proposal would
be effective for tax years beginning after December 31, 2022."
I don't see how anyone can support this kind of intrusive government overreach.
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I don't see how anyone can support this kind of intrusive government overreach.
All possible thanks to tech.
Pretty soon they'll be logging your toilet flushes.
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All possible thanks to tech.
Pretty soon they'll be logging your toilet flushes.
sooner than you think
https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/interiors/alexa-analyse-my-bowel-movement-will-every-home-soon-have-a-smart-toilet-1.4681838
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$600 to tax the rich? LMAO
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sooner than you think
https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/interiors/alexa-analyse-my-bowel-movement-will-every-home-soon-have-a-smart-toilet-1.4681838
In order to differentiate between users, Izen developed a scanner that can recognise the physical characteristics of whoever is sitting on the toilet – or, in the words of the researchers, “the distinctive features of their anoderm” (the skin of the anal canal). Apparently, your “analprint”, like your fingerprints, is unique.
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Whiskey Tango Foxtrot. Somebody let them know this ain't China or North Korea. >:(
IRS would track all bank transactions over $600 under Biden plan; Businesses revolt
by Casey Harper, The Center Square
September 27, 2021
A major component of President Joe Biden’s plan to raise revenue to pay for his trillions of dollars in new federal spending is now under fire from trade associations across the country.
The Biden administration has made clear its plan to beef up IRS auditing by expanding the agency’s funding and power. Biden’s latest proposal would require banks to turn over to the Internal Revenue Service bank account information for all accounts holding more than $600.
In a sharp pushback against the proposal, more than 40 trade associations, some of which represent entire industries or economic sectors, signed a letter to U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., and Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, R-Calif., raising the alarm about the plan.
The letter, which includes the support of several banking coalitions, calls on Congress to reject that requirement, saying it violates customer privacy and would create an incredibly expensive and elaborate reporting requirement for the banks.
“While the stated goal of this vast data collection is to uncover tax dodging by the wealthy, this proposal is not remotely targeted to that purpose or that population,” the letter said. “In addition to the significant privacy concerns, it would create tremendous liability for all affected parties by requiring the collection of financial information for nearly every American without proper explanation of how the IRS will store, protect, and use this enormous trove of personal financial information. We believe that this program is costly for all parties, not fit for purpose, and loaded with potential for unintended and serious negative consequences.”
The groups argue it would target "almost every American" and question whether the IRS could keep that information secure from hackers and bad actors.
“The undersigned associations representing a cross-section of financial and business interests write to express our strong opposition to a proposal under consideration as part of the reconciliation package that would establish an expansive new tax information reporting regime that would directly impact almost every American and small business with an account at a financial institution," the letter said. "This proposal would create significant operational and reputational challenges for financial institutions, increase tax preparation costs for individuals and small businesses, and create serious financial privacy concerns. We urge members to oppose any efforts to advance this ill-advised new reporting regime."
Some reports indicate that Democrats hope to raise the $600 threshold, but that has not yet materialized.
Biden proposed giving an extra $80 billion to the IRS earlier this year for auditing, saying the agency would more than make back those funds. House Democrats’ have so far indicated they plan to fulfill that request.
“There’s a 99 percent compliance rate on wages – because wage earners get their earnings reported to the IRS,” a fact sheet says that was handed out by the White House to lawmakers to sell them on the plan. “But the super wealthy who get their income from unreported sources are able to hide their income and avoid paying the tax they owe. In fact, each year the top 1 percent chooses not to pay more than $160 billion in taxes.”
Republicans on the House Ways and Means Committee have scheduled a virtual roundtable Wednesday entitled, “Weaponization of the IRS: A Sordid History and the Need for Taxpayer Protections” to discuss these concerns.
“The meeting will highlight the efforts of congressional Democrats to nearly double the size of the IRS with a massive funding increase while doing nothing to address the weaponization of the IRS, including the massive, criminal leak of taxpayer information to ProPublica in June of this year,” Texas Republican Rep. Kevin Brady’s office said.
This isn’t the only business community criticism to be levied at the $3.5 trillion bill in recent days.
The U.S. Chamber of Commerce officially condemned the bill this week, calling it an “existential threat” to the economy.
“This reconciliation bill is effectively 100 bills in one representing every big government idea that’s never been able to pass in Congress,” U.S. Chamber of Commerce President and CEO Suzanne Clark said. “The bill is an existential threat to America’s fragile economic recovery and future prosperity. We will not find durable or practical solutions in one massive bill that is equivalent to more than twice the combined budgets of all 50 states. The success of the bipartisan infrastructure negotiations provides a much better model for how Congress should proceed in addressing America’s problems.”
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/politics/irs-would-track-all-bank-transactions-over-600-under-biden-plan-businesses-revolt
Are they talking about checking, savings or investment accounts? Regardless, I guess I'll need an 'off shore' account. Are you sure it isn't $600,000 or $6 million?
When I bought lunch the other day at Panda Express a sign on the front door looking for job applicants read that they pay over $20. per hour for well-qualified applicants. If they pay their employees every two weeks, as I suspect they do and an employee has their paycheck direct deposited....well, that person is screwed if they cheat on their taxes....and who doesn't? Mostly, just the folks who take the standard deduction. :o :o :o
One more thought. The IRS is woefully understaffed, so audits are extremely rare these days unless there is something glaringly off with a person's taxes. Pretty much, unless you announce that you are a tax objector who refuses to pay taxes, they leave you alone.
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Are they talking about checking, savings or investment accounts? Regardless, I guess I'll need an 'off shore' account. Are you sure it isn't $600,000 or $6 million?
When I bought lunch the other day at Panda Express a sign on the front door looking for job applicants read that they pay over $20. per hour for well-qualified applicants. If they pay their employees every two weeks, as I suspect they do and an employee has their paycheck direct deposited....well, that person is screwed if they cheat on their taxes....and who doesn't? Mostly, just the folks who take the standard deduction. :o :o :o
One more thought. The IRS is woefully understaffed, so audits are extremely rare these days unless there is something glaringly off with a person's taxes. Pretty much, unless you announce that you are a tax objector who refuses to pay taxes, they leave you alone.
Biden is trying to double the IRS wokeforce. Amazing how little those that voted for these very things know about them.
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I don't see how anyone can support this kind of intrusive government overreach.
Most getbiggers won't be effected as 600 is a good $595 over their max transaction.
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Are they talking about checking, savings or investment accounts? Regardless, I guess I'll need an 'off shore' account. Are you sure it isn't $600,000 or $6 million?
When I bought lunch the other day at Panda Express a sign on the front door looking for job applicants read that they pay over $20. per hour for well-qualified applicants. If they pay their employees every two weeks, as I suspect they do and an employee has their paycheck direct deposited....well, that person is screwed if they cheat on their taxes....and who doesn't? Mostly, just the folks who take the standard deduction. :o :o :o
One more thought. The IRS is woefully understaffed, so audits are extremely rare these days unless there is something glaringly off with a person's taxes. Pretty much, unless you announce that you are a tax objector who refuses to pay taxes, they leave you alone.
I'm sure the IRS Commissioner said $600. I quoted and linked his comments.
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Are they talking about checking, savings or investment accounts? Regardless, I guess I'll need an 'off shore' account. Are you sure it isn't $600,000 or $6 million?
When I bought lunch the other day at Panda Express a sign on the front door looking for job applicants read that they pay over $20. per hour for well-qualified applicants. If they pay their employees every two weeks, as I suspect they do and an employee has their paycheck direct deposited....well, that person is screwed if they cheat on their taxes....and who doesn't? Mostly, just the folks who take the standard deduction. :o :o :o
One more thought. The IRS is woefully understaffed, so audits are extremely rare these days unless there is something glaringly off with a person's taxes. Pretty much, unless you announce that you are a tax objector who refuses to pay taxes, they leave you alone.
That is income reported as wages on a W-2. The IRS has had wage info like that info for many decades. Under-reporting W-2 income would be a moron move.
The type of unreported income they are looking for is from self-employed people or those paid as independent contractors, i.e., non W-2 reported income.
It would be foolish to deposit unreported income into a bank and leave a trail for the IRS. That type of money goes into the mattress and is spent as cash.
The IRS primarily looks for two things: under-reported income and over-stated expenses.
Robbing a bank and then going on a spending spree flashing cash is a no-no. The money should be hidden away for a length time and even then only spent sparingly and cautiously.
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>:(
Yellen defends IRS rule requiring banks to report all transactions over $600
By Callie Patteson
October 5, 2021
Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen is defending a Biden administration proposal that would require banks to report data to the Internal Revenue Service on transactions over $600, calling the collection of information “routine,” after taking heat for the idea that is widely seen as an unprecedented invasion of privacy.
During an interview on CNBC’s “Squawk Box” on Tuesday, Yellen was pressed on whether the IRS has the “wherewithal” to collect more information about taxpayers and bank accounts including cash flows, something many Republicans have called invasive.
“Well, of course they do,” Yellen said. “Right now, on every bank account that earns more than $10 a year in interest, the banks report the interest earned to the IRS. That’s part of the information base that includes W2’s and reports on dividends in other income that taxpayers earned. So collection of information is routine.”
Yellen cited the “enormous tax gap” in the US as the reason behind the proposed tax hikes and information collecting, blaming the gap on places where information on income “can be hidden.”
Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen defended President Joe Biden's plan to have banks inform the IRS of transactions that are $600 or more as simply "routine."
“It’s just a few pieces of information about individual bank accounts, nothing at the transaction level that would violate privacy,” the secretary said.
The collected information would ostensibly help the Treasury Department determine which high-income wealthy individuals may be concealing transactions and income, and “these would be helpful indicators of where it would make sense for auditing to occur,” she added.
“So, it is not reporting of individual transactions or anything of the like. And it would be a simple thing for banks and other payment providers to provide along with the other information they’re already providing.”
Under the proposal, banks would be required to turn over aggregate inflow and outflow numbers annually to the IRS and would cover bank accounts with at least $600 or at least $600 worth of transactions, according to the Wall Street Journal.
The proposal has been slammed by Republicans as an invasion of privacy. Last week, Sen. Cynthia Lummis (R-Wyo.) slammed the Treasury secretary during a Senate Banking, Housing, and Urban Development Committee hearing, asking if she was aware of “how unnecessary this regulatory burden is?”
“Do you distrust the American people so much that you need to know when they bought a couch? Or a cow?” the Republican senator asked.
“There are obvious privacy concerns for all Americans here and this represents a dramatic new regulatory burden for community banks and credit unions in Wyoming and elsewhere,” Lummis added.
“Bank customers are not subjects to the federal government. Banks do not work for the IRS.”
Yellen defended the plan, telling the senator, “Banks already report directly to the IRS the interest that they pay on accounts when it exceeds $10, and this is not a proposal to provide detailed transaction-level data by banks to the IRS.”
“Well, $600 threshold is not usually where you’re going to find the massive amount of tax revenue you think Americans are cheating you out of,” Lummis fired back.
‘Do you need to know when they bought a couch?’ Senator rips Yellen over Biden IRS plan
“That’s correct,” Yellen admitted, “but it’s important to have comprehensive information so that individuals can’t game the system and have multiple accounts.”
Several states have also expressed concern over the proposal, including Nebraska, which slammed the information collection as a violation of Americans’ constitutional right to privacy and said the costs associated with banks, credit companies and other financial institutions complying with the requirement would be passed on to consumers.
“This could lead to a tremendous invasion of privacy the likes of which our country has never seen. Millions of law-abiding Americans would suddenly have their bank accounts opened to federal investigators for no more reason than buying a refrigerator. This is simply unconscionable. To make matters worse, under this proposal, saving for college could put an American family on the IRS’s radar, costs that most likely will be passed on to the public,” Nebraska state Treasurer John Murante said in the statement released last month.
https://nypost.com/2021/10/05/janet-yellen-defends-bidens-irs-proposal/
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Government employees dodge taxes all the time.
In the military, a lot of people re-enlist overseas in combat theater, so they get ALL of their re-enlistment bonus (along with tax-free pay, imminent danger pay).
Plus your overall salary is called Entitlements, which is broken up into pay and allowances. Pay is taxed; but allowances (i.e. housing and food) are not.
And, as many of you know, it doesn't matter where you're physically stationed. It matters where your home of record is. I know firsthand. Even though I was stationed in places with state/commonwealth income tax, I didn't pay any of it because my home of record is Florida.
Dollars to donuts, politicians have a similar set up (especially in DC).
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Greedy As F liberals love this. They don't make real money from real jobs and love the idea of stealing others' $$$$
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I'm sure the IRS Commissioner said $600. I quoted and linked his comments.
Maybe there is a mix up. The Washington Examiner's article says transactions as does this tread title. However, the body of the article reads accounts 'holding' over $600. Other articles about this also say transactions. So I am not sure which is correct or if it makes any difference.
If you draw a regular paycheck it's pretty hard to cheat on your taxes. The IRS knows how much you make because it's right there on your W-2 or in my situation, 1099R forms. The IRS has much less information on people who own businesses or rental properties or have other sources of income.
The $600. threshold doesn't seem feasible to me or apparently to the banks since they have commented negatively about it. Supposedly, the IRS is understaffed. If they don't have enough employees to efficiently process income tax now, adding this....well, it just doesn't seem possible for them to handle.
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Maybe there is a mix up. The Washington Examiner's article says transactions as does this tread title. However, the body of the article reads accounts 'holding' over $600. Other articles about this also say transactions. So I am not sure which is correct or if it makes any difference.
If you draw a regular paycheck it's pretty hard to cheat on your taxes. The IRS knows how much you make because it's right there on your W-2 or in my situation, 1099R forms. The IRS has much less information on people who own businesses or rental properties or have other sources of income.
The $600. threshold doesn't seem feasible to me or apparently to the banks since they have commented negatively about it. Supposedly, the IRS is understaffed. If they don't have enough employees to efficiently process income tax now, adding this....well, it just doesn't seem possible for them to handle.
It's only confusing if you want it to be. I posted the comments from the IRS Commissioner. I posted comments from the Treasury Secretary. They both said the same thing: it applies to balances and transactions.
This is a massive government overreach and invasion of privacy.
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Maybe there is a mix up. The Washington Examiner's article says transactions as does this tread title. However, the body of the article reads accounts 'holding' over $600. Other articles about this also say transactions. So I am not sure which is correct or if it makes any difference.
If you draw a regular paycheck it's pretty hard to cheat on your taxes. The IRS knows how much you make because it's right there on your W-2 or in my situation, 1099R forms. The IRS has much less information on people who own businesses or rental properties or have other sources of income.
The $600. threshold doesn't seem feasible to me or apparently to the banks since they have commented negatively about it. Supposedly, the IRS is understaffed. If they don't have enough employees to efficiently process income tax now, adding this....well, it just doesn't seem possible for them to handle.
Willful ignorance, level 100. Data mining isn't people aren't sitting in cubicles looking at papers FFS.
Again, they are only asking permission for things they've been doing for a long time. Everything is about data collection and how it is being used is not beneficial to anyone but those in power - and we willfully provide it all. We traded privacy for ease of use and "protection from evil sand people".
HTH
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Willful ignorance, level 100. Data mining isn't people aren't sitting in cubicles looking at papers FFS.
Again, they are only asking permission for things they've been doing for a long time. Everything is about data collection and how it is being used is not beneficial to anyone but those in power - and we willfully provide it all. We traded privacy for ease of use and "protection from evil sand people".
HTH
Nobody said data mining required hoards of IRS employees. The implication is that any single bank transaction of $600 or more would trigger further investigation. Just how that investigation is handled isn't clear. Currently, only 1% of Americans get audited a year. The majority of those who are audited are people in a higher income bracket, although anyone can be audited. The IRS claims it is currently understaffed. Unless the $600 trigger has no impact on the number of audits requiring human interaction, there would be a need for additional staff.
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Nobody said data mining required hoards of IRS employees. The implication is that any single bank transaction of $600 or more would trigger further investigation. Just how that investigation is handled isn't clear. Currently, only 1% of Americans get audited a year. The majority of those who are audited are people in a higher income bracket, although anyone can be audited. The IRS claims it is currently understaffed. Unless the $600 trigger has no impact on the number of audits requiring human interaction, there would be a need for additional staff.
You think this is just for the purpose of an IRS audit?
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/SWoRKslHVtqEasqYCJ/giphy.gif)
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It's unlikely a $600 transaction will trigger an audit. It's info that could be utilized in case of an audit.
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WTF!!!
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Democrats to scale back Treasury’s IRS bank reporting plan amid GOP uproar
Jeff Stein
October 19, 2021
Senate Democrats on Tuesday will unveil a scaled-back version of a Biden administration proposal to crack down on wealthy tax cheats after conservative groups and the bank industry raised major privacy concerns, three people with knowledge of the coming announcement said.
Initially, the Department of Treasury and Senate Democrats had proposed requiring financial institutions to provide the Internal Revenue Service with additional information on bank accounts with more than $600 in annual deposits or withdrawals.
After a backlash, the new proposal will instead require the provision of additional information for accounts with more than $10,000 in annual deposits or withdrawals, a measure Democrats have been considering for weeks but have not formally endorsed, the people said.
The revised version of the bank reporting proposal will also weaken its scope by exempting all wage income from counting toward the $10,000 threshold withdrawal, intending to ensure it applies to only larger account holders, the people said. The Biden administration has signed off on the changes and is expected to support the new plan, a potentially key source of new revenue to pay for Democrats’ multi-trillion-dollar economic package. The people spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss a matter not yet made public.
The weakening of the reporting requirements reflects Democrats’ sensitivity to the increasingly explosive politics of the issue as Republicans, conservative groups and industry lobbyists attempted to label the initial proposal as representing a major expansion of snooping by the IRS into taxpayers’ private information. Treasury Secretary Janet L. Yellen has adamantly rejected this criticism, arguing the new reporting rules amount to an essentially technical set of changes that will only impact wealthy tax evaders. But even many Democrats privately concede that the proposal gave Republicans an opening to attack them on the issue, provoking a fury of opposition among conservative groups.
Treasury Dept. and IRS push House Democrats to expand crackdown on tax cheats
Banks already report to the IRS information for the interest earned in their customers’ accounts. (Stockbrokers also already report dividends and capital gains of their customers to the IRS.) Treasury’s proposal is aimed at requiring banks to also report total deposits and withdrawals to the IRS as well. The totals would be reported once a year — not every time a transaction above a certain number has occurred.
The provision is aimed at giving the IRS more visibility into the cash flow of the bank’s customers, especially businesses. Wage earners, who represent the vast majority of the American public, already have their wages reported to the IRS on their W-2 forms. Treasury wants additional data for Americans earning business income as well, although exactly which accounts should be subject to the new rules has been the subject of a fierce debate.
White House officials believe that the IRS could better target tax evasion if they have access to the way money flows in and out of accounts.
“I don’t know why they thought $600 would be a good number. $10,000 is definitely an improvement,” said John Koskinen, who served as commissioner of the IRS under both President Barack Obama and President Donald Trump. Koskinen said the threshold should be raised even higher to a number like $50,000. “The vast majority of people won’t be affected, but it will pick up more than just the idle rich.”
Democratic aides in both the House and Senate are still skeptical whether the bank reporting requirement will be included in the final version of Biden’s Build Back Better package, even with the changes. Democrats supportive of the proposal have pointed out that well-funded business lobbyists and Republican lawmakers have mounted an all-out campaign against the measure that has sometimes exaggerated or outright fabricated the extent of the changes. But opposition to the measure is not limited to Wall Street, and has extended to community banks influential with much of the congressional Democratic caucus.
Republican attorneys general in more than a dozen states have written Biden and Yellen saying the plan is “unacceptable, illegal, and contrary to the well-founded constitutional principles against illegal searches and seizures.”
Sens. Mike Crapo (R-Idaho) and Patrick J. Toomey (R-Pa.), the top Republicans on the finance and banking committees, have led the charge on the plan and are expected to hold a news conference about it on Tuesday. Senate Finance Chair Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) and Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) are involved in the revised bank reporting proposal.
“I think [Democrats are] still likely to not get much traction with this,” said Doug Holtz-Eakin, a Republican policy expert formerly at the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office.
Conservative groups mount opposition to increase in IRS budget, threatening White House infrastructure plan
The bank reporting requirement emerged as part of the Biden administration’s wider effort to crack down on wealthy tax cheats and bring in more revenue as a way to fund the president’s infrastructure and social spending packages. Biden has pledged to shield Americans earning less than $400,000 per year from new tax hikes, instead focusing on raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans and large corporations. The proposals to raise taxes on the rich, however, have struggled to gain traction in Congress, with centrist Democrats balking at leveling the extent of new tax hikes necessary to fund Biden’s proposal.
The difficulty in raising taxes has fueled lawmakers’ interest in closing the “tax gap,” or the difference between what taxpayers owe the IRS and what is actually collected in new revenue. Treasury has said the tax gap amounts to roughly $7 trillion over 10 years. Estimates by Treasury officials have found that roughly $160 billion goes unpaid in taxes by the richest 1 percent of taxpayers every year.
“High-income individuals with opaque sources of income that are not reported to the IRS. There’s a lot of tax fraud and cheating that’s going on, and all that’s involved in this proposal is a few aggregate numbers about bank accounts — the amount that was received in the course of the year, the amount that went out in the course of a year,” Yellen told CBS earlier this month.
Some nonpartisan tax experts have questioned whether the Biden plan would effectively raise as much revenue as Yellen has claimed. Most rich Americans are able to lower their payments to the IRS by hiring advisers who aggressively exploit loopholes in the existing tax laws, said Steve Rosenthal, a tax policy expert at the Tax Policy Center, a nonpartisan think tank. Democrats need to rewrite the tax laws to make it harder for rich Americans to legally lower their tax payments, Rosenthal said, arguing that the Treasury plan was more likely to lead to more paperwork for the government and a more aggressive crackdown on small businesses such as corner grocery stores and dry cleaners.
“I think it’s a step in the right direction, but I don’t think it will help much. It’s still a deeply flawed proposal,” Rosenthal said. “Even at $10,000, the Biden bank proposal is still too sweeping, throws a net very wide, and it’s hard to see what fish they want to catch here.”
Treasury officials have rejected that claim, saying the administration will limit its enforcement action to wealthier taxpayers.
“Any additional IRS scrutiny will be focused on the high end of the income distribution, where it belongs, given the distribution of the tax gap,” said Natasha Sarin, deputy assistant secretary for economic policy at Treasury. “In fact, audit rates will not rise relative to recent years for anyone making less than $400,000 per year.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/democrats-to-scale-back-treasury-e2-80-99s-irs-bank-reporting-plan-amid-gop-uproar/ar-AAPFE2r?ocid=uxbndlbing
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Democrats can all go to fng hell.
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Good job Senator Manchin.
Manchin: I Convinced Biden That IRS Monitoring $600 Bank Transactions Is "Screwed Up" And Won't Be In The Final Bill
Posted By Tim Hains
On Date October 26, 2021
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/10/26/manchin_i_convinced_biden_that_irs_monitoring_600_bank_transactions_is_screwed_up_and_wont_be_in_the_final_bill.html
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Good job Senator Manchin.
Manchin: I Convinced Biden That IRS Monitoring $600 Bank Transactions Is "Screwed Up" And Won't Be In The Final Bill
Posted By Tim Hains
On Date October 26, 2021
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/10/26/manchin_i_convinced_biden_that_irs_monitoring_600_bank_transactions_is_screwed_up_and_wont_be_in_the_final_bill.html
Manchin is playing good cop while the dems act like they are trying to deliver what they promised the radical left. Manchin is in no danger politically and you notice the squad is not calling for him to leave the party.
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Manchin is playing good cop while the dems act like they are trying to deliver what they promised the radical left. Manchin is in no danger politically and you notice the squad is not calling for him to leave the party.
I do not trust him overall, but he got this one right. He did admit the other day that he was thinking about leaving the party, but that he would still caucus with Democrats if he did leave.
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https://nypost.com/2021/10/28/white-house-in-talks-to-pay-millions-to-families-separated-at-border
But illegals to get 450k.
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Wake me when 50% of the country has pitchforks and torches....
otherwise.... stop freakin complaining about crap online..
its useless
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Wake me when 50% of the country has pitchforks and torches....
otherwise.... stop freakin complaining about crap online..
its useless
Stop freakin telling us to stop complaining about crap online.
It's useless. :)
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This is more of a foot in the door to target the poor and middle class to gain access to their accounts more than anything. Doesn’t seem logical to set a number as low as $600