Anyone who says that Bodybuilding contests are fixed......

[kiwiol]

Must read this post by 240

the media is gonna love this story.

the video of cali's governor handing victor a check, just days before they start investigating vic for that orlando bs?

My guess is that the cheese eating DEA will see Vic as a nice fat target in that now, and maybe pursue him where they wouldn't have before. 

The connection with the arnold will get them more media coverage, which allows them to extort their bosses/taxpayers for a bigger budget. 

Or even stop and think about it for a second. If contests could be fixed, then in this years AC, Arnold could have easily gotten Dexter or anyone else to win it other than Victor, esp. given that the contest wasn't one where the winner was so indisputably dominant over the rest of the field like Ronnie in 2004 or Dorian in 1993.

Bodybuilding is a subjective 'sport' and sometimes, when it's close, the judges are going to make a call that's going to leave a lot of people crying 'fixed'. But in reality, it's ridiculous to think that a whole panel of people, some of whom drift away from the judging or even the bodybuilding scene itself, can be bought. How is it that not a single one of them have stepped forward to blow the whistle?

I've never accepted the hypothesis that IFBB contests are fixed. Pick any contest and no matter how many arguments you can come up with to say that the person who won shouldn't have, you'll find an equal number of arguments to support the notion otherwise.

[bigmc]

contests aren't fixed

its a sport of opinions

which is why there is so many bad decisions

[Your MAAAAaaaa]

Some people take things they see and think in terms of what else it could mean.

Some things in life should just be taken at face value because before you know it you don't believe anything and everyone is a liar. See 240

LIFE MUST BE HARD OVER ANALYSING EVERYTHING!


TA TA

[tu_holmes]

Well, now I do think the fix has been in at times, but let's be honest here... In this instance, if there was a fix in... Victor would certainly not have won...

He's got lots of strikes against him... The latest drug issue, the fact he's an MD guy and not a AMI guy... definitely would be easy to say "No win for Vic".

Instead, he took it to the house and pulled off the 2nd biggest win this year... Definitely says something about the IFBB.

[kiwiol]

contests aren't fixed

its a sport of opinions

which is why there is so many bad decisions

Exactly! But try telling that to the plethora of people out there who say that lots of contests, if not just about every damn one of them in the IFBB is fixed

[tu_holmes]

Exactly! But try telling that to the plethora of people out there who say that lots of contests, if not just about every damn one of them in the IFBB is fixed

Nah... it's not a large majority that are fixed... Maybe the O from time to time... 1980 anyone?

But by and large, it's just what the judges think about the guys on stage... that's all.

[GoneAway]

contests aren't fixed

its a sport of opinions

which is why there is so many bad decisions

I think 90% of contests aren't fixed. Some are harder to tell than others, but it's not as corrupt as some people think.

[kiwiol]

Nah... it's not a large majority that are fixed... Maybe the O from time to time... 1980 anyone?

But by and large, it's just what the judges think about the guys on stage... that's all.

How do you know 1980 was fixed? Given Arnie's position nowadays, if someone knew about such a deal (and a few people would have known it for it to have been successfully pulled off), don't you think at least one of them would have stepped forward by now and made a big deal about it, esp. given what a scandal it'd turn out to be? Nah, don't see the 1980 Mr O being fixed in any way. You could tell yourself that to justify a result you probably resent or disagree with, but that doesn't mean it really happened. Presume innocence until something or someone's proven guilty.

[tu_holmes]

How do you know 1980 was fixed? Given Arnie's position nowadays, if someone knew about such a deal (and a few people would have known it for it to have been successfully pulled off), don't you think at least one of them would have stepped forward by now and made a big deal about it, esp. given what a scandal it'd turn out to be? Nah, don't see the 1980 Mr O being fixed in any way. You could tell yourself that to justify a result you probably resent or disagree with, but that doesn't mean it really happened. Presume innocence until something or someone's proven guilty.

Hey, I'm not saying it was fixed... I said "maybe".

I personally have looked at photos from that O and even I think it was a pretty close event and have no problem with the outcome... 81, well...yes, I think that was fixed... because I really don't think Franco looked good enough to win that one.

Arnold looked good that year, so I was just pointing towards one of the more contraversial Olympias as a possibility.

I do not believe that the general "fix" is in though... I believe though that slight directions from the top dogs have influenced judges thoughts, but not in a way to say they ordered someone to win.

I remember looking at the Women's pumping iron and they had the precontest meeting with the judges and the weider boys were mentioning how we must keep women being women and so on in this sport.

So I don't think it's a "fix", but perhaps a general feeling of who would be best for the sport at certain times.

That's all.

[Dballn247]

But wasn't it fixed in 2001 when Ronnie beat Jay.  Jay was clearly in better shape.  But Mr. O's don't lose on stage they retire, Then enter 2006, Ronnie tries the same shit believeing that he can pull out the win because he's Mr. O and He loses.

I'll have to check into this but Is Ronnie Coleman the first defending Mr. O to be defeated on stage?

[kiwiol]

But wasn't it fixed in 2001 when Ronnie beat Jay.  Jay was clearly in better shape.  But Mr. O's don't lose on stage they retire, Then enter 2006, Ronnie tries the same shit believeing that he can pull out the win because he's Mr. O and He loses.

I'll have to check into this but Is Ronnie Coleman the first defending Mr. O to be defeated on stage?

I don't think it was fixed in 2001 at all. Jay looked better from the front in a couple of poses, the Abs-thighs being the most notable one, but he couldn't hang in with Ronnie in from the back or even from the side. And you can't say a reigning Mr Olympia can't or doesn't lose cause it's happened with Sergio, Samir and now Ronnie. For sure, if it's very close, the defending champ does have an advantage (justified or not), but if it's a clear cut case, then the best man does win. And when I say best man, I of course mean from the judges' perspective.

TBH, I do think that the IFBB judges do a great job most of the times. Because it's a subjective sport, they're going to make calls that will be laughed at or even angrily opposed from time to time, but Cest la vie

[lonewolf]

I have been around bodybuilding long enough to know that while contests are not fixed per se, there is a situation
that should be noted. During a competition one or two judges will make the majority of the call outs. These two people are usually the head judge and the judge most closely seated to him. They make their call outs in the order  that they perceveive the order of finish should be in that particular round. This places a strong influence on the rest of the judging panel, so that their placings reflect the results of the calls made by the head judge. While this is not fixing it comes awfully close................... The Wolf

[kiwiol]

I have been around bodybuilding long enough to know that while contests are not fixed per se, there is a situation
that should be noted. During a competition one or two judges will make the majority of the call outs. These two people are usually the head judge and the judge most closely seated to him. They make their call outs in the order  that they perceveive the order of finish should be in that particular round. This places a strong influence on the rest of the judging panel, so that their placings reflect the results of the calls made by the head judge. While this is not fixing it comes awfully close................... The Wolf

Makes sense.

[Dballn247]

I don't think it was fixed in 2001 at all. Jay looked better from the front in a couple of poses, the Abs-thighs being the most notable one, but he couldn't hang in with Ronnie in from the back or even from the side. And you can't say a reigning Mr Olympia can't or doesn't lose cause it's happened with Sergio, Samir and now Ronnie. For sure, if it's very close, the defending champ does have an advantage (justified or not), but if it's a clear cut case, then the best man does win. And when I say best man, I of course mean from the judges' perspective.

TBH, I do think that the IFBB judges do a great job most of the times. Because it's a subjective sport, they're going to make calls that will be laughed at or even angrily opposed from time to time, but Cest la vie

Word...Thanks for clearing that up for me, I did'nt know that Sergio and Samir both lost on stage.  I agree, the reigning Mr. O has a huge advantage, Ronnie better come in good shape or hope that Jay get's aids or something.  Not bashing ronnie, but the Praise Jesus and collapse before accepting the trophy was kind of a joke, Could understand the first time but by eight you'd think he would have someone designated from his possie to collect his award.

I wonder what the Europeans think of him on the GPX tours and if he does the same things when he wins.  They've never seen a southern baptist, so if he collapsed over there, they'd prolly call a medic.

[bmacsys]

Do you really think Arnold would take a chance with all he has to lose by fixing a contest? No way. I doubt he even cares who wins the Arnold Classic. The IFBB on the otherhand would. Who outside of bodybuilding would care to question an IFBB contest? They had everything to gain with Arnold beating Sergio in 1972 and Frank Zane beating Robby Robinson in 1977. They had nothing to lose.

[240 is Back]

I don't think the 2007 Arnold Classic was fixed at all.

Do I think the 1980 Mr O was fixed?  Of course.

But you make a good point - Vic M has been in the news this week and there probably is a small % chance that some prick somwhere, whether it be a DA or the media wanting a story, to connect the two.

It's bullshit of course, but it's the way things are.  The Vic M story is nothing for a state or national level media outlet until there is a chance to tap into Arnold's star power.

Another thing to consider is that arnold fixing a contest might be an even bigger story than the winner having some baggage.  To fix the Idaho Pro means nothing more than fudging sheets that only 5 people saw, 5 of which are on your payroll.  To change the arnold results might be messier.

[240 is Back]

Some things in life should just be taken at face value because before you know it you don't believe anything and everyone is a liar. See 240

Nah, I'm not like that.  Sure, I believe 3 or 4 major historical events are not as they were depicted to us, and the evidence says that too.

In everyday life though, I look at events and see what inside or outside parties could imagine to exploit the situation.  Is it possible that media outlets and prosecutors can advance their own interests by tying a nobody like Vic M to a star like Arnold?  Of course.  Is it likely?  I don't know.  Depends how ambitious they are.  Hopefully nothing will come of it.  I'm just saying it wouldn't surprise me, given the motives of most people to advance at the expense of others.

[Mr. Intenseone]

He's got lots of strikes against him... The latest drug issue, the fact he's an MD guy and not a AMI guy... definitely would be easy to say "No win for Vic".

It wouldn't have made a difference, the "industry" thrives off of felons, drug abusers and in Victors case...thieves!

[240 is Back]

He's got lots of strikes against him... The latest drug issue, the fact he's an MD guy and not a AMI guy... definitely would be easy to say "No win for Vic".

Didn't MD sponsor the Arnold Classic this year?

[onlyme]

Certain contests are fixed at times.  Not all just some.  I've been told how it is done and it makes compete sense when explained.  I'm sure you know who told me and it has been supported by a couple others in the IFBB.  Not just people who think it happens but by people who were either part of it or personally seen it.  And promoters have NO part in it.  Competitors, or commentators know nothing of it.  Just judges.

[AVBG]

Didn't MD sponsor the Arnold Classic this year?

They were the official magazine sponsor this year, I think they are aiming for 2008 to be the overall sponsor.

[kiwiol]

Certain contests are fixed at times.  Not all just some.  I've been told how it is done and it makes compete sense when explained.  I'm sure you know who told me and it has been supported by a couple others in the IFBB.  Not just people who think it happens but by people who were either part of it or personally seen it.  And promoters have NO part in it.  Competitors, or commentators know nothing of it.  Just judges.

Has a contest of the calibre of the Mr Olympia or the AC been fixed to your knowledge, Keith?

[onlyme]

Has a contest of the calibre of the Mr Olympia or the AC been fixed to your knowledge, Keith?

Was never told anything about the AC but the Olympia YES 100% guaranteed.  Not all the time.  And other shows.  And being sponsored by a major company that supports the IFBB and NPC is a very big deal.  Money ALWAYS plays an important part.

[Special Ed]

I would think just the opposite would be true. If the contest were fixed, a deserving Vic would have lost because of the controversy, not in spite of it.

SE