Overtraining??

[kcballer]

Okay so i'm looking to continue increasing strength and explosiveness.  I'm natural and have lifted for about 3 years now.  I played top level basketball for a long time but since i've moved to a new country i've backed off that and now only play once maybe twice a week socially. 

My current training split is 2 days a week Tuesday and Friday evening trainings.  The exercises are done in a similar fashion to DC style with one working set and 2 rest pause to failure.  I've found great strength gains thus far on this style.  The workouts look like this -
Tues - Shoulder Press D/B
Barbell Row
D/B Chest Press
Deadlift
Close Grip Bench Press

Fri - Incline D/B Press
Pull Ups
Smith Machine Shoulder Press
Squats
Bicep Curls

I am thinking about adding in a third day and going Mon, Wed, Fri.  Monday will be Tuesdays workout but without Triceps, Friday will be the same but without Biceps.  Wednesday will be as follows -
Plyometric Push Up
Smith Machine Shoulder Press Throw
Medicine Ball Jump shot (increase power in jumper)
Box Jumps
Lunge Jump with alternating legs in the air
hamstring and glute raises (using diagonal back extension equipment but with the pad low so it works more glutes/hams than lower back)
Tricep Close Press
Barbell Curl

I haven't figured out sets and reps for the plyometric days but most likely starting out with one to two sets of 4-6 reps and a decent rest inbetween. 

What are the thoughts on this?

[biceps]

Okay so i'm looking to continue increasing strength and explosiveness.  I'm natural and have lifted for about 3 years now.  I played top level basketball for a long time but since i've moved to a new country i've backed off that and now only play once maybe twice a week socially. 

My current training split is 2 days a week Tuesday and Friday evening trainings.  The exercises are done in a similar fashion to DC style with one working set and 2 rest pause to failure.  I've found great strength gains thus far on this style.  The workouts look like this -
Tues - Shoulder Press D/B
Barbell Row
D/B Chest Press
Deadlift
Close Grip Bench Press

Fri - Incline D/B Press
Pull Ups
Smith Machine Shoulder Press
Squats
Bicep Curls

I am thinking about adding in a third day and going Mon, Wed, Fri.  Monday will be Tuesdays workout but without Triceps, Friday will be the same but without Biceps.  Wednesday will be as follows -
Plyometric Push Up
Smith Machine Shoulder Press Throw
Medicine Ball Jump shot (increase power in jumper)
Box Jumps
Lunge Jump with alternating legs in the air
hamstring and glute raises (using diagonal back extension equipment but with the pad low so it works more glutes/hams than lower back)
Tricep Close Press
Barbell Curl

I haven't figured out sets and reps for the plyometric days but most likely starting out with one to two sets of 4-6 reps and a decent rest inbetween. 

What are the thoughts on this?

I don't believe in overtraining, if you rest and eat correctly and take the proper supplements ( I am not talking about anabolic) you will get stronger, I head many training partners in my life and they all changed their mind about overtraining, is all mental, you have to program your self for very hard core training. Tow thing I am recommending, the reps should be 8 to 10 and you need to incorporate negatives. 

[PANDAEMONIUM]

I don't believe in overtraining, if you rest and eat correctly and take the proper supplements 

That line about "there's no such thing as overtraining, just undereating" is a load of horseshit.  If you want proof, try doing 2 *hard* workouts per day for a full week.  I think you'll find that you don't recover nearly as well as you'd think you might.  This just applies to natties.  If you're a natty, you have to accept your limitations.  No amount of protein, supps, etc. will save you in the situation I just described.

[webcake]

Yeah for any natty, overtraining is very likely, regardless of calories and supps and protein intake.
When your on gear its another story. I think you will find that it is more that just a mental thing, its physical.

[Petrucci]

That line about "there's no such thing as overtraining, just undereating" is a load of horseshit.  If you want proof, try doing 2 *hard* workouts per day for a full week.  I think you'll find that you don't recover nearly as well as you'd think you might.  This just applies to natties.  If you're a natty, you have to accept your limitations.  No amount of protein, supps, etc. will save you in the situation I just described.

agree 100% with you...i tried (stupid move) to train 2 times a day, for like 2 weeks just to see how it was....I was just on suplements and food at the time and man, 1- the workouts didnt have the same intensity as before 2- after like 3 days, i felt like a walking dead and this feeling continued until i stoped to do this...

[webcake]

Right now im actually training twice a day, but am only training 6 times all up a week. Its due to HST, so its different than normal training, and the only reason why i do it is because doing a whole body workout all at once takes too long.

[biceps]

agree 100% with you...i tried (stupid move) to train 2 times a day, for like 2 weeks just to see how it was....I was just on suplements and food at the time and man, 1- the workouts didnt have the same intensity as before 2- after like 3 days, i felt like a walking dead and this feeling continued until i stoped to do this...

Take 1 to 1 1/2 nap betwen the 2 workout and you will know what I am talking about, you guys need to anderstand that the high Cortisol ( stres hormone) level stops the faster recovery, the nap and 100 to 200 mg Humanofort will make a huge difference, I been working out for 40 years nowdaily. I will explane more on this subject this afternoon after my workout and my nap.

[mass 04]

Take 1 to 1 1/2 nap betwen the 2 workout and you will know what I am talking about, you guys need to anderstand that the high Cortisol ( stres hormone) level stops the faster recovery, the nap and 100 to 200 mg Humanofort will make a huge difference, I been working out for 40 years nowdaily. I will explane more on this subject this afternoon after my workout and my nap.

of course you have to take a nap, you're a dinosaur. 

[biceps]

Yeah for any natty, overtraining is very likely, regardless of calories and supps and protein intake.
When your on gear its another story. I think you will find that it is more that just a mental thing, its physical.

Using mental focus and visualisation can be a powerful tool in creating a fertile environment for growth through  resistance exercise. Of course, you can get along without it.
If you think about overtraining you will fill overtraining ,is all about mental adaptation it takes about 8 weeks to adapt you mind to no overtraining mentality. If you have a 24 hour rest and the proper nutrition you can train the same body part agent. For example is you doing squats with 300 lbs 5 set of 6 reps with 5 minutes rest betwen and the 5 minutes is inapt time to recover betwen sets than resting 24 hours should be more than inapt for a full mental recovery. Just look in to Eastern Europeans Olympic weight lifters training,  they do train their lags every day, when I was involved in Olympic weight lifting I was doing front squats on Monday, squats behind the neck Tuesday, lunges Wednesday and Thursday front squats agent and Friday squats behind neck agent.

It is up to each individual how far they want to go to test their limits.  And how much you dedicated and disciplined to go to the next limit. I did it and I loved it.

[pumpster]

Overtraining can happen but is not usually a factor with the less is more, less frequent training frequencies that are in vogue now, including yours of only twice weekly.

You're only training twice a week, so my first reaction is that there is plenty of time in between to add another session. Also, the plyometrics will take something out of you but are only to be done once weekly, which will help avoid overtraining.

Instead of asking and getting different opinions, all of which will vary depending on experience, age, individual differences, etc. you should try the 3-day thing for a while, a few weeks minimum and see how your energy and workouts go. Use that as the gauge; if after a few weeks or a month you're not too exhausted after doing this and feel you're getting good results, continue. Stop once in a while to assess, continue if the signs are good.

In general i'd say thrice weekly shouldn't be a problem based on your routine, which is not too lengthy, and the fact that plyometrics are only done once a week.