Rosie O'Donnell Goes Public On 9/11

[The Enigma]

If it's on alert, on the hot pad, it should take minutes. 

But from parked to fully fueled, armed and checked?  Minutes?

It is MADATORY that 16's be on alert.

Do you actually believe we wait to fuel and arm the aircraft?

Not minutes............"a N.Y. minute."

[OzmO]

It is MADATORY that 16's be on alert.

Do you actually believe we wait to fuel and arm the aircraft?

Not minutes............"a N.Y. minute."

no, my point is, that if you  were talking about a F-16 in the hanger it would take some time.

From what i remember there was only 14 planes on alert that morning protecting hte entire east coast. 

Add that to the fact that all their training and response protocol were design for attacks coming from the ocean combined with the general confusion of what to do in the heat of the moment cause indecision.

It's easy fro us to look at it now and say they could have intercepted and shot one of those planes down, but in the mess of things as they were happening it either just didn't happen because they could get their act together in time or it wasn't possible.  Imagine getting the order...shot the US plane down in your own country.....   that's what they were talking about.

[Wombat]

Since Andrews is an Air Mobility Command base, I can't see how they would have an alert ramp. Langley is an ACCbase  where they have a fighter wing  and a base where they operate Alert ramps since 9/11 but Andrews is a airlift wing, so they operate C-5s and C-17s. I hate to punch holes in your CT but....

The planes from Mass had to have been on Alert. It is impossible to get a cold plane loaded and in the air in much under an hour. Also Langley would be more likely ot have a fighter on standby. I mean I know you probably know more about how the Air Force operates than me due to all the time you have spent on flightlines watching planes operate and all.....LOL

Are you actually saying that pre 9/11 if something was flying over the white house that it would take about an hour for someone at Andrews to get up in the sky???WTF

[240 is Back]

Are you actually saying that pre 9/11 if something was flying over the white house that it would take about an hour for someone at Andrews to get up in the sky???WTF

hahahahaha yeah, that's about as realistic as a dem with a spine or a repub with a conscience.

[240 is Back]

Bill O'Reilly suggests that had someone like Cuban attempted to distribute a film like Loose Change during World War Two, FDR would have "thrown his butt in jail".

O'Reilly then whines about how people like Cuban, Sheen and O'Donnell should not be given any airtime or attention, whilst this is his third or fourth segment on the same issue.

Billo says he has never watched Loose Change. 

(PP)

[The Enigma]

no, my point is, that if you  were talking about a F-16 in the hanger it would take some time.

From what i remember there was only 14 planes on alert that morning protecting hte entire east coast. 

Add that to the fact that all their training and response protocol were design for attacks coming from the ocean combined with the general confusion of what to do in the heat of the moment cause indecision.

It's easy fro us to look at it now and say they could have intercepted and shot one of those planes down, but in the mess of things as they were happening it either just didn't happen because they could get their act together in time or it wasn't possible.  Imagine getting the order...shot the US plane down in your own country.....   that's what they were talking about.

Your arguement is weak and flaccid.

It's the Military's job to be ready at a moments notice. Just as they were when Payne Stewart's Lear went off course. Jets scrammbled at lightning speed, to avoid a possible crash in a populated area.

Those Jumbo jets on 9-11 were off course for OVER AN HOUR with communications from the cockpit's that the planes were taken over from the airline pilots.

What more do you need? A permission slip from the hijackers to escort the planes? 

[24KT]

Your arguement is weak and flaccid.

It's the Military's job to be ready at a moments notice. Just as they were when Payne Stewart's Lear went off course. Jets scrammbled at lightning speed, to avoid a possible crash in a populated area.

Those Jumbo jets on 9-11 were off course for OVER AN HOUR with communications from the cockpit's that the planes were taken over from the airline pilots.

What more do you need? A permission slip from the hijackers to escort the planes? 

Apparently so, ...Cheney was in charge that morning.

[240 is Back]

Apparently so, ...Cheney was in charge that morning.

For many years, the pres, VP, Sec of Defense, and generals all had the authority to shoot down planes that were hijacked.

For some reason, in summer of 2001, they passed a bill which put this power ONLY in Bush/CHeney's hands. 

On 9/11, those at NORAD (who the FAA records show were informed at 8:21 about the first hijacking) had NO power to shoot down any planes, as they flew at their targets for the next 19 minutes.

You have to wonder why they would pass this bill, whose sole purpose was to remove that power from the generals...

[The Enigma]

For many years, the pres, VP, Sec of Defense, and generals all had the authority to shoot down planes that were hijacked.

For some reason, in summer of 2001, they passed a bill which put this power ONLY in Bush/CHeney's hands. 

On 9/11, those at NORAD (who the FAA records show were informed at 8:21 about the first hijacking) had NO power to shoot down any planes, as they flew at their targets for the next 19 minutes.

You have to wonder why they would pass this bill, whose sole purpose was to remove that power from the generals...

240....BINGO!!!  You and I might be on the opposite side of the isle ......but we agree on a lot of the objective information available.

IMO, Cheney is just another ChickenHawk, Warmonger w/ 5 deferments from Vietnam......who was quoted saying:  "I had better thing's to do at the time, than go to Vietnam."

Bush and Cheney are truely evil bastards, who hide behind organized Religion as their smokescreen, then create Mayhem.

[240 is Back]

On 9/11, those at NORAD (who the FAA records show were informed at 8:21 about the first hijacking) had NO power to shoot down any planes, as they flew at their targets for the next 19 minutes.

Sorry for my typo - to clarify:

On 9/11, those at NORAD (who the FAA records show were informed at 8:21 about the first hijacking) had NO power to shoot down any planes, as they flew at their targets for the next 109 minutes.

Almost two hours those birds were in the air. 

Bush, well aware that only two men in the country (he and cheney) could stop those planes, didn't act.  FAA records show he knew about 3 of the hijackings and one crash before entering that room at 9 am.  Why didn't he give the order?  WHy read with children, then give a press conference, which lasted until, coincidentally, the pentagon hit, then get in the limo?

Cheney, well aware that only he and Bush could shoot down planes, was sitting in a capitol bunker.  He was repeatedly asked "if the orders stood" as the plane approached, and he said yes.  He knew where dubya was (you know, on CNN talking at the time), and he didn't act to shoot down the planes.


Very fishy.  And a nearly indefensible position for anyone here.  Please, anyone, defend the actions to remove power from the generals, then refusal to act on 911/

[OzmO]

Your arguement is weak and flaccid.

It's the Military's job to be ready at a moments notice. Just as they were when Payne Stewart's Lear went off course. Jets scrammbled at lightning speed, to avoid a possible crash in a populated area.

Those Jumbo jets on 9-11 were off course for OVER AN HOUR with communications from the cockpit's that the planes were taken over from the airline pilots.

What more do you need? A permission slip from the hijackers to escort the planes? 

Comparing Payne Stewarts situation with that of  the events of 9/11 is speculative at best and filled with conjecture.

Saying it's the military's job to be ready at a moments notice is true, in theory, but in practice it's not always true. 

After formulating just how they could pull this off, add the number of people who would have have to be in the loop to know we purposely let the 2nd plane crash into the tower.   Paint the whole picture and try not to believe it's a summer block buster.

[The Enigma]

Comparing Payne Stewarts situation with that of  the events of 9/11 is speculative at best and filled with conjecture.

Saying it's the military's job to be ready at a moments notice is true, in theory, but in practice it's not always true. 

After formulating just how they could pull this off, add the number of people who would have have to be in the loop to know we purposely let the 2nd plane crash into the tower.   Paint the whole picture and try not to believe it's a summer block buster.

You only needed two people, Bush and Cheney.

These two men could have stopped the hijacked aircraft from hitting the WTC.

They chose NOT to.

I never implied our government set up 9-11.

They (see above) chose not to stop it.

[240 is Back]

Oz,

Enigma is right about this -

Only two men in our nation had the power to stop those planes form hitting the buildings.  And they knew it, as they had just (inexplicably!) changed the law to take away this ability from the generals. 

One of those men was reading a children's book and talking to reporters.
One was in a bunker telling his staff "The orders stand!" as nothing was done to stop a plane (shootdown was an easy option also) they saw coming for 48 minutes.

It doesn't have to be some big conspiracy.  It can be two men who handcuffed their generals from acting, then chose not to act.

[OzmO]

You only needed two people, Bush and Cheney.

These two men could have stopped the hijacked aircraft from hitting the WTC.

They chose NOT to.

I never implied our government set up 9-11.

They (see above) chose not to stop it.

i somewhat suspect that.  Not sure it will ever be proved.   

[240 is Back]

i somewhat suspect that.  Not sure it will ever be proved.  

Well, they obviously refused to testify, only engaging in a secret narrative with the 911 commissioners where nothing was recorded.

Officially, everyone blamed the "system". 

Everyone knows the pentagon can shoot down a plane if it wants to.  They have, and had, the technology.  Hell, the night of sept 10, Bush's hotel had a missile battery on the ROOF as part of his security.  Does anyone really believe that the pentagon didn't have missiles that day?

History will prove it.  No one will go to jail, but we'll all know.  And hopefully, we'll be smart enough to not vote in any of the Bush "ilk".  ANd hopefully, god forbid any future attack, we'll think twice before rubber stamping a blank check for a prez under which an attack happens.

[The Enigma]

i somewhat suspect that.  Not sure it will ever be proved.   

I seriously doubt it.

[OzmO]

I seriously doubt it.

I don't think that when they complete a 2nd investigation that even if they find BUSH and Cheney intentionally held back the F-16's that they will ever make that public because it will damage the identity of the office and damage the credibility of our government to the point that it might not be recoverable for years to come. 

Nothing will be done.  What they will make public is evidence of incompetence during that day.

[240 is Back]

I don't think that when they complete a 2nd investigation that even if they find BUSH and Cheney intentionally held back the F-16's that they will ever make that public because it will damage the identity of the office and damage the credibility of our government to the point that it might not be recoverable for years to come. 

Nothing will be done.  What they will make public is evidence of incompetence during that day.

while i agree nothing will be done, i think the credibility of that office is currently zero.

The involvement of past admins in "dirt" has come out quite frequently.  Their inaction on 911 will be noted, 40 years after the fact, like it was with JFK's Dod (62 northwoods) and LBJ (67 USs liberty).

LBJ was transcribed saying "I want that boat at the bottom of the g*ddamn sea" - referring to an AMERICAN ship.  It was quietly declassified. 

[OzmO]

while i agree nothing will be done, i think the credibility of that office is currently zero.

The involvement of past admins in "dirt" has come out quite frequently.  Their inaction on 911 will be noted, 40 years after the fact, like it was with JFK's Dod (62 northwoods) and LBJ (67 USs liberty).

LBJ was transcribed saying "I want that boat at the bottom of the g*ddamn sea" - referring to an AMERICAN ship.  It was quietly declassified. 

Only blind loyalist are left firing accusing bolts of treason to all those who see the light.

[kh300]

Something to ponder......when PGA golfer Payne Stewart's Lear jet went off it's flight plan, military jets were "scrambled" within 10 mins after going of course. The jets proceded to follow Stewart's plane until it unfortunately crashed........away from the public.

How did 757 jumbo jets go off course for over an HOUR.........with no scramble?

Thing's that make you go .........hummmmmmm? 

do yourself a favor,, loked it up.. it is not policy to do what they did.. those jets intercepted the plane because they were doing maneuvers in the area.. how many planes in history have been intercepted? only a few.. give me one more example of another plane being intercepted

[240 is Back]

how many planes in history have been intercepted? only a few.. give me one more example of another plane being intercepted

I believe there were 100 planes intercepted in the 365 calendar days before 9/11.  I will check.

This is a regular occurence when they lose radio contact, fly off course, or behave erratically.

kh300, I'm a little surprised by your statement here.  "Only a few planes in history" have been intercepted?  That is off by an incredible margin, and makes me question your understanding of our air defenses, and background in this area.  "Only a few in history"?  Wow...

[Wombat]

hahahahaha yeah, that's about as realistic as a dem with a spine or a repub with a conscience.

And to think that a Jumbo jet can drop down and unload 200 plus passengers,refuel, load meals, load luggage and load 200 plus people back on and be up in the air in under an hour in some cases...

[240 is Back]

And to think that a Jumbo jet can drop down and unload 200 plus passengers,refuel, load meals, load luggage and load 200 plus people back on and be up in the air in under an hour in some cases...

LOL!!  They can refill the kosher meals and load up with 200 slow, inefficient people and take back off, in an hour...

But they can't get one pilot in a fighter and off the ground.



Incredible how some people have such oddly low expectations.  I guess if it makes their story work...

[kh300]

I believe there were 100 planes intercepted in the 365 calendar days before 9/11.  I will check.

This is a regular occurence when they lose radio contact, fly off course, or behave erratically.

kh300, I'm a little surprised by your statement here.  "Only a few planes in history" have been intercepted?  That is off by an incredible margin, and makes me question your understanding of our air defenses, and background in this area.  "Only a few in history"?  Wow...

1 domestic flight in the last 10 years.

[240 is Back]

1 domestic flight in the last 10 years.

Wow.

Just, wow.







Wow.