Question for Christians

[Necrosis]

no Im suggesting that if God was all loving that he would not want suffering and if he was all powerful than he would not allow suffering...logically that is, im not saying that his not all loving or not all powerful but logically this wouldnt happen if you assume the first two premises...I was brought up to believe that what God does cannot be understood at times by us...but i believe that alot of people use this as a crutch to close their minds and plug their ears in the face of conflicting views instead of trying to understand and interpret them

yes all loving and suffering are contradictory, also, perfection and worship are also contradictory. these simple premises dismiss his beleifs.

[OTHstrong]

no Im suggesting that if God was all loving that he would not want suffering and if he was all powerful than he would not allow suffering...logically that is, im not saying that his not all loving or not all powerful but logically this wouldnt happen if you assume the first two premises...I was brought up to believe that what God does cannot be understood at times by us...but i believe that alot of people use this as a crutch to close their minds and plug their ears in the face of conflicting views instead of trying to understand and interpret the

Sorry, I don't see the logic...

yes all loving and suffering are contradictory, also, perfection and worship are also contradictory. these simple premises dismiss his beleifs.

Loving and suffering are not contradictory. In fact In many cases suffereing can make you grow and love can cause you to accept pain. Haven't you heard of the word passion. I love my son and I inflict pain on him as I see fit (disciplinary reasons). You don't know Gods intentions.

[tonymctones]

Sorry, I don't see the logic

Ok if God is All powerful and God is All loving then the all loving premise would reason that God would not want creatures to feel lets just say physical pain for example, now God is all powerful as well so if he is all powerful and also all loving he in reason would not want physical pain and then being all powerful would not allow it.

[OTHstrong]

OK if God is All powerful and God is All loving then the all loving premise would reason that God would not want creatures to feel lets just say physical pain for example, now God is all powerful as well so if he is all powerful and also all loving he in reason would not want physical pain and then being all powerful would not allow it.

This is your way of thinking and I don't agree, but i respect your opinion. Going to sleep, but tomorrow I'll be back to issue a challenge to all the evolutionist. 

[Necrosis]

Sorry, I don't see the logic...Loving and suffering are not contradictory. In fact In many cases suffereing can make you grow and love can cause you to accept pain. Haven't you heard of the word passion. I love my son and I inflict pain on him as I see fit (disciplinary reasons). You don't know Gods intentions.

wrong omni-loving would indicate that lack of capacity for non-loving acts.

[Butterbean]

Christians will say that people had no concept of morals before God gave it to them.  Not only were murder, purgery, rape and adultery permitted, they were the favorite past times of all ancient civilizations.

No, I'd say that God's desires and laws were pretty much written on the hearts of Adam and Eve.  For instance, although the 10 commandments had not yet been given in the way we see in Exodus, when Adam and Eve sinned they knew they had done something "wrong."

Even before Cain murdered Able scripture shows that God was talking about what was right and wrong...even sin.

Gen 1:6-7

Then the LORD said to Cain, "Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast?  If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it."

[Butterbean]

Ok if God is All powerful and God is All loving then the all loving premise would reason that God would not want creatures to feel lets just say physical pain for example, now God is all powerful as well so if he is all powerful and also all loving he in reason would not want physical pain and then being all powerful would not allow it.

So are you saying that God should take away some of our free will?

For instance, I remember a neighbor kid shoving leaves up her nose.  (why do kids do that  )
She started bleeding and crying...as evidently it hurt and was becoming more difficult to breathe. 

Do you think that God should have stopped her from putting the leaves in her nose?

wrong omni-loving would indicate that lack of capacity for non-loving acts.

I'm not sure what you're saying here....do you think ONetimehard's disciplining his child is a non-loving act?

[tonymctones]

So are you saying that God should take away some of our free will?

For instance, I remember a neighbor kid shoving leaves up her nose.  (why do kids do that  )
She started bleeding and crying...as evidently it hurt and was becoming more difficult to breathe. 

Do you think that God should have stopped her from putting the leaves in her nose?

no im not saying God should take away our free will, All im saying is that logically creatures should have never have felt physical pain for example if you assume that God is all loving and that God is all powerful

lol leaves up her nose??? From this i would gather that no God should allow her to do what she wants in free will but she should feel no pain logically that is.

[Butterbean]

no im not saying God should take away our free will, All im saying is that logically creatures should have never have felt physical pain for example if you assume that God is all loving and that God is all powerful

So is physical pain what you are mainly questioning here?  Pain can actually help us.  I read about some kid one time that felt no pain...something to do w/his nerves or something and he'd accidentally burn himself all the time.  He'd broken a bunch of bones etc.  He was a mess.

lol leaves up her nose??? From this i would gather that no God should allow her to do what she wants in free will but she should feel no pain logically that is.

Yes!  Her name was Karen   but I've heard of kids putting beans and m&m's etc. up there too!

Now if she didn't have physical pain w/the leaves who knows when she would have stopped shoving more and more in there!  The ordeal was pretty embarrassing for her and her parents had to take her to the hospital.  So there was emotional pain and financial "pain." Do you feel other pains are more acceptable than physical pain?

[Dos Equis]

Reminds me of the time my friend and I had to rush her aunt to the hospital.  She was having severe stomach pains.  We all thought she was dying.  Turned out to be gas.   

[tonymctones]

So is physical pain what you are mainly questioning here?  Pain can actually help us.  I read about some kid one time that felt no pain...something to do w/his nerves or something and he'd accidentally burn himself all the time.  He'd broken a bunch of bones etc.  He was a mess.

Ive heard of cases like this as well and yes pain can teach us things but God being all loving and all powerful logically he would keep us from feeling pain, physical pain for this example...you said earlier in another post that God can reveal anything he wants to anybody at anytime, well being all loving wouldnt he reveal that the guy was about to burn himself?

Yes!  Her name was Karen   but I've heard of kids putting beans and m&m's etc. up there too!

Now if she didn't have physical pain w/the leaves who knows when she would have stopped shoving more and more in there!  The ordeal was pretty embarrassing for her and her parents had to take her to the hospital.  So there was emotional pain and financial "pain." Do you feel other pains are more acceptable than physical pain?

I was just using physical pain as an example i assume that you could lump emotional pain in there as well probably not financial pain, In a round about way if God is all loving and all powerful we would logically live in a utopia and there would be no hell

[tonymctones]

Reminds me of the time my friend and I had to rush her aunt to the hospital.  She was having severe stomach pains.  We all thought she was dying.  Turned out to be gas.   

when i was younger i was drinking a glass of milk and my chest started to hurt really bad, I started freaking out and thought i was having a heart attack i was only about 9 or so and called my mom and told her "i think im having a heart attack" turns out i had just swallowed some air when drinking the milk

[Dos Equis]

when i was younger i was drinking a glass of milk and my chest started to hurt really bad, I started freaking out and thought i was having a heart attack i was only about 9 or so and called my mom and told her "i think im having a heart attack" turns out i had just swallowed some air when drinking the milk

lol.  Sounds like my daughters everytime they get "hurt."  Little drama queens.