If Jay comes back and wins 4?

[technokc]

Most people have written him as a lesser Mr. Olympia winner.  But after the way he looked last night if he can come back next year and win again with the same body or slightly improved how will people think about his history then?  Can we still really say he had one of the worst reigns if he does?  Obviously you wouldnt put him with coleman, yates, haney, and arnold, but after that where do you think his legacy will be?

[NarcissisticDeity]

Most people have written him as a lesser Mr. Olympia winner.  But after the way he looked last night if he can come back next year and win again with the same body or slightly improved how will people think about his history then?  Can we still really say he had one of the worst reigns if he does?  Obviously you wouldnt put him with coleman, yates, haney, and arnold, but after that where do you think his legacy will be?

He made history over the weekend , if he is dead on like this he could beat anyone who was there .

[ChristopherA]

He made history over the weekend , if he is dead on like this he could beat anyone who was there .

I am surprised you are so amored by him. Think the competition is just so iffy now that he wins by attrition.

[NarcissisticDeity]

I am surprised you are so amored by him. Think the competition is just so iffy now that he wins by attrition.

I'm not... I don't think he's that spectacular compared to Yates or Ronnie but he's the current best and if his conditioning is spot-on like it was there are only a few people who can beat him , I think an improved Kai most certainly can and a dead on Heath may give him a real run for his money

What he did was very impressive , hell I said I think his best days are behind him just a week ago

[Mr.1derful]

In a manner of speaking, his legacy is now more unique and storied than if he had not lost the title last year.  He made history by winning back the title, and in dominating fashion at that.  One need only read the boards to see how opinion of him quickly changed once people saw his condition Friday night.  Even the most ardent critics were praising him.  If he wanted, he could now retire on a high note, with the stain of last year's loss removed.  If he comes back to crush everyone for number 4, that will cement his legacy all the more.  

[monstercalves]

In a manner of speaking, his legacy is now more unique and storied than if he had not lost the title last year.  He made history by winning back the title, and in dominating fashion at that.  One need only read the boards to see how opinion of him quickly changed once people saw his condition Friday night.  Even the most ardent critics were praising him.  If he wanted, he could now retire on a high note, with the stain of last year's loss removed.  If he comes back to crush everyone for number 4, that will cement his legacy all the more.  

nicely put.

[ChristopherA]

I'm not... I don't think he's that spectacular compared to Yates or Ronnie but he's the current best and if his conditioning is spot-on like it was there are only a few people who can beat him , I think an improved Kai most certainly can and a dead on Heath may give him a real run for his money

What he did was very impressive , hell I said I think his best days are behind him just a week ago

Agreed. Hes simply the current best.If Victor could ever fulfill his potential he would hand Jay his ass but who knows if that will ever happen.Jay would struggle to get top five in any of Dorians wins

[Mr.1derful]

Agreed. Hes simply the current best.If Victor could ever fulfill his potential he would hand Jay his ass but who knows if that will ever happen.Jay would struggle to get top five in any of Dorians wins

Even still assuming 2001 as being Jay's best of all time, I feel that physique would account for itself very well during Dorian's era.  Perhaps not enough to beat Dorian at his very best, but easily good enough for top 3.  He'd wipe the floor with Shawn Ray and would likely beat Wheeler and Levrone, who were both very inconsistent with their showings at the O.  Nasser, as good as he was at times, would lose as well.  2001 Jay could be runner up, without problem.  So would 2009 Jay.  Against Dorian himself, he wouldn't be near as dry or detailed, but would have size enough to make things a bit interesting as a comparison.

[Hulkster]

I am surprised you are so amored by him. Think the competition is just so iffy now that he wins by attrition.

Jay is white and somewhat blocky.

so ND loves him, along with dorian and gunter.

[Hulkster]

Even still assuming 2001 as being Jay's best of all time, I feel that physique would account for itself very well during Dorian's era.  Perhaps not enough to beat Dorian at his very best, but easily good enough for top 3.  He'd wipe the floor with Shawn Ray and would likely beat Wheeler and Levrone, who were both very inconsistent with their showings at the O.  Nasser, as good as he was at times, would lose as well.  2001 Jay could be runner up, without problem.  So would 2009 Jay.  Against Dorian himself, he wouldn't be near as dry or detailed, but would have size enough to make things a bit interesting as a comparison.

your getting to be even dumber than ND..

Jay would get crushed by any of those guys in top shape:

take for example Ray, its not even close:

[Hulkster]

sorry Jay, you won because no one good is around anymore

[Hulkster]

you can see that although Jay is physically much bigger, the quality is severely lacking against someone like Shawn in top shape.

the same would hold true if Jay met Flex, hell, even Chris in his 99 Olympia shape would beat Jay (he should have beat him at the AC a few years ago as well)

Kevin in his top form (92) would likely win as well.

ronnie and dorian - well, we know Jay was not close to these two when in top form.

[240 is Back]

shawn ray would look like a little kid next to Jay though.

At the same size - Dex is a better bodybuilder.
in real life, next to each other, jay is just bigger.

[Hulkster]

size wise, yes. Jay outweighs him significantly.

but the quality was overwelming. shawn has beat many guys who outweighed him.

if this had stepped onstage at the Olympia, it would have won the contest with flying colours, even if he was only 215 pounds:

come on now. Jay is not in the same league as ronnie, dorian, shawn, flex etc. when they are in top form

thats just reality. not a knock on jay, just reality.

no sense in pretending Jay is something that he is not.

[Mr.1derful]

your getting to be even dumber than ND..

Jay would get crushed by any of those guys in top shape:

take for example Ray, its not even close:

Shawn only changed marginally over his entire career.  Where did Ray place in 2001, again?  You know, the year Jay beat Ronnie in both prejudging rounds.   2001/2009 Jay destroys Ray and makes him look like a child, just like happened to Dex on the weekend.  Pick any year of Shawn Ray you want, and Jay at his best rips Shawn a new one. There isn't enough Goat Whey in the world to change that. Case closed, over and out.  

[divcom]

have to agree with blockhead that the jacka$$es are on a role over this win by jay.  he did good but he isnt the greatest thing ever.  two weeks ago he was dogs##t.  94 Ray would beat 09 Jay if they stayed away from the BS judging and called it for bbing excellence.  Shit...Bob Chick and crew were calling it Kai's show after prejudging.  Problem is someone showed AMI's head guys the soft porn stuff.  anyway...jay did good but the odds are against him putting it together again.  probably get the 06-07 skin folds.  in 10 i dont see phil f##kin up, kai gets better, vic hopefully gets the legs straight, but again, it's still who they want.  this weekend u saw the good (old champ putting it together) and the bad (a guy with a couple of bones get downgraded).  anyway...Tanji was the one who really got ROBBED!

[phyxsius]

well, Ronnie won the titles a few times with a baby in his belly so why not Jay being a wide waist bodybuilder to be inducted into the "hall of fame"?

[Aerian]

size wise, yes. Jay outweighs him significantly.

but the quality was overwelming. shawn has beat many guys who outweighed him.

if this had stepped onstage at the Olympia, it would have won the contest with flying colours, even if he was only 215 pounds:

come on now. Jay is not in the same league as ronnie, dorian, shawn, flex etc. when they are in top form

thats just reality. not a knock on jay, just reality.

no sense in pretending Jay is something that he is not.

Hulk,

Normally I would agree.  I am a huge Ray fan and think he is one of the all time greats but the JAY we say on Saturday was very impressive.  It seemed everyone had the same type of shock they did when Ronnie steped out in 2003.  But this time I could easily see Ray being overlooked due to the sheer amount of musclemass that Jay has over him as well as the great conditioning.  That would really be an interesting comparison though.

[dyslexic]

Yeah buddy...

[divcom]

Yeah buddy...

couldnt pull this one off even if he painted the girdle the color of his protan and drew abs on it.

[dyslexic]

couldnt pull this one off even if he painted the girdle the color of his protan and drew abs on it.

Didn't think anyone would catch it... 



I know your'e right!

[Hulkster]

well, Ronnie won the titles a few times with a baby in his belly so why not Jay being a wide waist bodybuilder to be inducted into the "hall of fame"?

because Ronnie wasn't smooth from the waist up?

[Hulkster]

Pick any year of Shawn Ray you want, and Jay at his best rips Shawn a new one.

your even dumber than I thought you were..

yes, Jay beat Dex.

but Shawn easily beats them both:

[oldman]

Jay wont be back, he wanted three Os and he got them.  This leaves the door open for Kai.

[Royal Lion]

I think the 09 Jay was even better than the 2001 Jay, and the 2001 Jay beat Shawn Ray.  So unless 2001 was an off year for Shawn, he wouldn't beat Jay.  I agree Ray's quality was incredible, but the size difference is just too overwhelming IMO.