Unbelievable White Man Genetics...

[NarcissisticDeity]

thats what im saying, look at a few of the pics Nd and i posted.....he was fameous for having dense, thick spinal erectors


look again at how fuckin thick this back is

at one point his back needed improvement and he really improved , I believe this is from his Nationals contest and you can see the difference

[bigbobs]

There are a lot of things you don't understand about bodybuilding old news , hype? he turned pro in 1993 and then proceded to win his first four pro shows beating many seasoned pros in the process

He did better in the spring shows and always came in off during the later ones , if he never got sick he would have surely won more contests

and he was only ' overrated ' because he kicked Nasser's ass at the NOC and Nasser was in good shape too so of course as usual it can't be Nasser was not good enough , no , it had to be politics and bullshit  it must suck living your life full of excuses and denial

So Muscletime is also "full of excuses and denial" when they posted this?  

"Mike Francois won the show with Nasser El Sonbaty in second. (Everbody in the industry knew that Nasser should have won, but he was a newcomer and for some reason he was placed in second"

You know there are opinions that differ from judges in a subjective "sport" without having to be labelled as being "bullshit," "excuses," etc.

He had a good four years but even at his best there's at least 6 guys who he could never beat when they were in their top shape.

You will always blindly say that judges are 100% correct in every show because that's the only way you can justify Dorian winning all 6 of his Mr. Olympias

[bigbobs]

Yup its "bullshit" to say that Francois' 94 NOC victory was deserved and anyone who thinks otherwise is "full of excuses and denial" LOL:

[NarcissisticDeity]

So Muscletime is also "full of excuses and denial" when they posted this?  

"Mike Francois won the show with Nasser El Sonbaty in second. (Everbody in the industry knew that Nasser should have won, but he was a newcomer and for some reason he was placed in second"

You know there are opinions that differ from judges in a subjective "sport" without having to be labelled as being "bullshit," "excuses," etc.

He had a good four years but even at his best there's at least 6 guys who he could never beat when they were in their top shape.

You will always blindly say that judges are 100% correct in every show because that's the only way you can justify Dorian winning all 6 of his Mr. Olympias

wow Mucletime huh? they had Levrone winning in 1992 lol don't use them as a source oh and they had Heath winning too , see a pattern here of Muscltimes opinions?

Just another example of you can't admitting the obvious , your hero wasn't good enough a common theme with you

if Dorian and Mike won fixed contests than all of Nassers wins were fixed as well you can't have it both ways. you're stuck in chasing your tail in circles with this pathetic logic of every single contest being fixed except Nasser's wins it's sad to see you make excuses for a guy who was never and never will be as good as you made him out to be

[beefcakeblake]

So Muscletime is also "full of excuses and denial" when they posted this?  

"Mike Francois won the show with Nasser El Sonbaty in second. (Everbody in the industry knew that Nasser should have won, but he was a newcomer and for some reason he was placed in second"

You know there are opinions that differ from judges in a subjective "sport" without having to be labelled as being "bullshit," "excuses," etc.

He had a good four years but even at his best there's at least 6 guys who he could never beat when they were in their top shape.

You will always blindly say that judges are 100% correct in every show because that's the only way you can justify Dorian winning all 6 of his Mr. Olympias

with the exception of 97 I think Dorian dominated every year and deserved straight firsts.

you can have 97 Dorian looked gross as fuck (esp from front)

Dorian shoulda been knocked off to second IMO for his gut, seeing how Nasser was in decent shape.

If Nasser showed up in 97 like he did in 95 I think the judges would have had no choice but to give Nasser the title

[bigbobs]

wow Mucletime huh? they had Levrone winning in 1992 lol don't use them as a source oh and they had Heath winning too , see a pattern here of Muscltimes opinions?

Just another example of you can't admitting the obvious , your hero wasn't good enough a common theme with you

if Dorian and Mike won fixed contests than all of Nassers wins were fixed as well you can't have it both ways. you're stuck in chasing your tail in circles with this pathetic logic of every single contest being fixed except Nasser's wins it's sad to see you make excuses for a guy who was never and never will be as good as you made him out to be

All I'm saying is in a subjective "sport" there are biases, and in shows like 94 NOC, 97 Olympia, 2007 Olympia, some others - the biases show pretty clearly!

[bigbobs]

with the exception of 97 I think Dorian dominated every year and deserved straight firsts.

you can have 97 Dorian looked gross as fuck (esp from front)

Dorian shoulda been knocked off to second IMO for his gut, seeing how Nasser was in decent shape.

If Nasser showed up in 97 like he did in 95 I think the judges would have had no choice but to give Nasser the title

So in other words you agree that judges are not always 100% correct, in other words you disagree with ND on that.

[beefcakeblake]

So in other words you agree that judges are not always 100% correct, in other words you disagree with ND on that.

well looking at what the judges were looking for dorian was the winner  but im just saying for the sport, nasser shoulda won, looks bad when your champ looks like that, and runner up looks basically as good with out gut.

[Grape Ape]

So Muscletime is also "full of excuses and denial" when they posted this?  

"Mike Francois won the show with Nasser El Sonbaty in second. (Everbody in the industry knew that Nasser should have won, but he was a newcomer and for some reason he was placed in second"

Nasser was a newcomer in his 4th pro show, but Francois wasn't in his 2nd?

[bigbobs]

well looking at what the judges were looking for dorian was the winner  but im just saying for the sport, nasser shoulda won, looks bad when your champ looks like that, and runner up looks basically as good with out gut.

Fair opinion.  I think most people agree that judges do have their biases, ND is the only one who seems to insist every show is 100% fair.

[Parker]

Francois looked better than Nasser. The first bodybuilding Mag a i ever bought was a Ironman mag that had the contest in it. I was a Francois fan after that. Francois won it fair and square. Better aesthetics than Nasser, better conditioning and better back. In fact, Alq Gurley should have placed ahead of Nasser as well.

[bigbobs]

Nasser was a newcomer in his 4th pro show, but Francois wasn't in his 2nd?

Was one of Nasser's first shows in the U.S.  Francois was competing in the U.S. Nationals, was much more known than Nasser was at the time, and the cards were on him before the show started.

[bigbobs]

They also had a Flex mag photoshoot scheduled for the morning after the show together - Nasser and Francois.  Francois "conveniently" did not show up, probably didn't want to have more comparison pics in Flex mag where people would question his victory.

[NarcissisticDeity]

All I'm saying is in a subjective "sport" there are biases, and in shows like 94 NOC, 97 Olympia, 2007 Olympia, some others - the biases show pretty clearly!

You all you're saying is Nasser was better than he was and the judges disagree , I'm sure guys who competed in contests Nasser won felt there were biases as well does that make them right?

[bigbobs]

Francois looked better than Nasser. The first bodybuilding Mag a i ever bought was a Ironman mag that had the contest in it. I was a Francois fan after that. Francois won it fair and square. Better aesthetics than Nasser, better conditioning and better back. In fact, Alq Gurley should have placed ahead of Nasser as well.

Better back yes, and Nasser had him on every other bodypart as well as overall condition and aesthetics.  Just look at the pictures.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Fair opinion.  I think most people agree that judges do have their biases, ND is the only one who seems to insist every show is 100% fair.

The judges simply ranked the competitors on a sheet of paper, awarding the best man one point, the second two and so on. It was a simple

method in which the lowest score won. DeMilia had devised a system where the computer randomly selected one judge per round as an alternate,

thus eliminating their score. It then removed the three highest and the three lowest scoring judges. From the twelve judges, then, just five papers

counted in any one round, and the judges were unaware of which they were, " To fix a contest, definitely beyond a shadow of a doubt, Wayne had

told me, somewhat gleefully, ' you gotta buy off nine judges. I figured this out mathematically. You gotta buy off nine judges. In our sport, with all

the big mouths and gossips and everything else, you think nine judges could keep their mouths shut? And lets face it, you gotta go to nine

judges and one says ' I don't wanna do it, ' you gotta go to number ten...You think that one other guy ain't gonna talk? ' Hey he tried to buy me

off, but I didn't take it. He didn't offer me enough money..." how much money is it gonna take.?"



Learn how contests are judged and then come to your senses , Nasser wasn't as good as you think he was facts prove this

[bigbobs]

You all you're saying is Nasser was better than he was and the judges disagree , I'm sure guys who competed in contests Nasser won felt there were biases as well does that make them right?

Nope, in fact they are entitled to their opinion, but when someone argues that every judging decision is 100% perfect that's just silly, and I know the reason you insist on that is to justify all of Dorian's wins.

[beefcakeblake]

Was one of Nasser's first shows in the U.S.  Francois was competing in the U.S. Nationals, was much more known than Nasser was at the time, and the cards were on him before the show started.

I think judging by the pics you posted it coulda went either way, but i'm a little nasser biased so who knows.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Nope, in fact they are entitled to their opinion, but when someone argues that every judging decision is 100% perfect that's just silly, and I know the reason you insist on that is to justify all of Dorian's wins.

See above with this information to claim contests are fixed is ignorant and lame , in fact let me post it again

The judges simply ranked the competitors on a sheet of paper, awarding the best man one point, the second two and so on. It was a simple

method in which the lowest score won. DeMilia had devised a system where the computer randomly selected one judge per round as an alternate,

thus eliminating their score. It then removed the three highest and the three lowest scoring judges. From the twelve judges, then, just five papers

counted in any one round, and the judges were unaware of which they were, " To fix a contest, definitely beyond a shadow of a doubt, Wayne had

told me, somewhat gleefully, ' you gotta buy off nine judges. I figured this out mathematically. You gotta buy off nine judges. In our sport, with all

the big mouths and gossips and everything else, you think nine judges could keep their mouths shut? And lets face it, you gotta go to nine

judges and one says ' I don't wanna do it, ' you gotta go to number ten...You think that one other guy ain't gonna talk? ' Hey he tried to buy me

off, but I didn't take it. He didn't offer me enough money..." how much money is it gonna take.?"

[bigbobs]

The judges simply ranked the competitors on a sheet of paper, awarding the best man one point, the second two and so on. It was a simple

method in which the lowest score won. DeMilia had devised a system where the computer randomly selected one judge per round as an alternate,

thus eliminating their score. It then removed the three highest and the three lowest scoring judges. From the twelve judges, then, just five papers

counted in any one round, and the judges were unaware of which they were, " To fix a contest, definitely beyond a shadow of a doubt, Wayne had

told me, somewhat gleefully, ' you gotta buy off nine judges. I figured this out mathematically. You gotta buy off nine judges. In our sport, with all

the big mouths and gossips and everything else, you think nine judges could keep their mouths shut? And lets face it, you gotta go to nine

judges and one says ' I don't wanna do it, ' you gotta go to number ten...You think that one other guy ain't gonna talk? ' Hey he tried to buy me

off, but I didn't take it. He didn't offer me enough money..." how much money is it gonna take.?"



Learn how contests are judged and then come to your senses , Nasser wasn't as good as you think he was facts prove this

Yup, and if Wayne D said it it must be true lol

[NarcissisticDeity]

Yup, and if Wayne D said it it must be true lol

There you go , when faced with facts looks for a way out. That's exactly how contests are judged if you claim a contest was fixed you would have to buy off 9 judges NINE !!

you can't offer up a cognizant response so question Wayne  you're in a perpetual state of denial and making excuses , if contexts are fixed Nasser's wins were fixed you can't have it any other way

[bigbobs]

There you go , when faced with facts looks for a way out. That's exactly how contests are judged if you claim a contest was fixed you would have to buy off 9 judges NINE !!

you can't offer up a cognizant response so question Wayne  you're in a perpetual state of denial and making excuses , if contexts are fixed Nasser's wins were fixed you can't have it any other way

Obviously Wayne is not going to admit that his judging system has flaws lol - you make it sound like its blasphemy to question one man's claims about a judging system under him. 

And at times you seem intelligent then I wonder why its so hard for you to understand (and I have to keep repeating myself) - I never said all contests are "fixed" just that many judges have biases and the majority of people would agree with me on that.  Sure someone can claim that biases favoured Nasser if they like, I'd argue that the pictures show otherwise.

[beefcakeblake]

Obviously Wayne is not going to admit that his judging system has flaws lol - you make it sound like its blasphemy to question one man's claims about a judging system under him. 

And at times you seem intelligent then I wonder why its so hard for you to understand (and I have to keep repeating myself) - I never said all contests are "fixed" just that many judges have biases and the majority of people would agree with me on that.  Sure someone can claim that biases favoured Nasser if they like, I'd argue that the pictures show otherwise.

true judges are humans, biases for a certain look that is not in line with the system can occur

[flinstones1]

at one point his back needed improvement and he really improved , I believe this is from his Nationals contest and you can see the difference

there is one reason and one reason that he got that back only.

he worked with Louie Simmons and westsidebarbell club and they lived on good mornings,reverse hypers, all lower back work I read about it a while ago..

[Skeletor]

They used to say that in bodybuilding the best back usually wins  

Nasser might have been bigger and better in some poses but he had absolutely no back in these pics.