In your opinion, what are the minimum strength levels to start juicing?

[Stavios]

no offense guys but swedish sounds like such an ugly language  

[BB]

I agree with the 3-5 years natural training rec, or if you want numbers, figure 1.5x bw Bench, 2-2.5x Deadlift, 2x squat. Anyone that is a smart natural trainer should be able to reach those naturally. It's important to have a decent natural base in my estimation so that you atleast understand how to train to maintain some of the gains once off, and so you resist some of that things that young trainers do when on, like running up the numbers too quickly.

Now in terms of the strength sports and hobbies, you will be better off if you start training and using early in bodybuilding and Olympic Lifting. You can start a bit later in Strongman and Powerlifting because the window to be good in those sports is much longer.

[tbombz]

I'm waiting till I reach about that till I start, how much was you military with a bb?

strict form..  175 for sets of 8-10..

[Van_Bilderass]

I could bench over 160kg (350lbs) and curl 80lb dumbells before I popped my first dbols. I just came home from the gym where I did db curls with 35lb dumbells for 10 reps to failure! A few days ago I did 5 reps with 220lbs on the bench to failure. 15 years of cycling! 

I think that if you feel you have trained "seriously" for 2 years using a sane program then you're ready for juice. You will have maxed out pretty much, again if you have been doing everything reasonably right wrt training and eating. I'm talking about muscle size. Strength is something that you can continue to develop into your 40s or 50s training natural but it wont make you muscles much bigger.

How strong you should be before juice is so individual. It has so much to do with genetics that it would be stupid to put numbers on it that fit everyone. A heavy juicer might have trouble deadlifting 500lbs whereas a natural might be able to hit 660lbs, even if both are doing everything right.

[tbombz]

I could bench over 160kg (350lbs) and curl 80lb dumbells before I popped my first dbols. I just came home from the gym where I did db curls with 35lb dumbells for 10 reps to failure! A few days ago I did 5 reps with 220lbs on the bench to failure. 15 years of cycling! 

I think that if you feel you have trained "seriously" for 2 years using a sane program then you're ready for juice. You will have maxed out pretty much, again if you have been doing everything reasonably right wrt training and eating. I'm talking about muscle size. Strength is something that you can continue to develop into your 40s or 50s training natural but it wont make you muscles much bigger.

How strong you should be before juice is so individual. It has so much to do with genetics that it would be stupid to put numbers on it that fit everyone. A heavy juicer might have trouble deadlifting 500lbs whereas a natural might be able to hit 660lbs, even if both are doing everything right.

if a heavy juicer cant deadlift 500 its because they havent paid any attention to deadlifts.

[Van_Bilderass]

if a heavy juicer cant deadlift 500 its because they havent paid any attention to deadlifts.

Depends on what you mean by "attention". I'm a deadlift training maniac, analyzed the lift up and down, trained it up to 4 times a week, 19 years of deadlifting in all, coached juicers on it etc. Some just have poor structures for it. Sure 500 anyone can do but some would really have to concentrate on it, not just put it last in the back workout for a few sets. One guy who I helped has been juicing for over a decade, advanced bb, only had a 440lb deadlift despite doing the lift on his own. We've been working on it for a couple of years and he's at a bit over 600... took a lot of concentrated work. Lots of technique analysis, also aided by a world class competitive powerlifter.

Ben White's numbers sucked ass a couple of years ago, despite being a juice monkey known for his strength. Maybe he had never seriously deadlifted before. But the numbers were pathetic at the Olympia.

[MAXX]

does it really matter?

Arnold started when he was 14 or so. Same with many bodybuilders. Doubt Arnold was maxed out naturally or could bench 315 naturally at 14.

[MAXX]

Never used and naturally able to do the following for a few reps:

Bench 485
Hack Squat 800
Military Press 330
Lying Extension 265
Db Curl 100s
Db Hammer Curls 105s
Bent Over Rows 405
Db Side Laterals 85s
Db Front Laterals 90s

Now these are some of my best lifts, but all done without bb chemicals.....took years and years of training to get there.

I'd like to see that. Those lifts sounds unbelievable for a natural.

[gh15]

lol,, if you wait to be the strongest around to start juicing...something very sad is going in your bodybuild life,, lol

bodybuilding is NOT power lifting,,

if strength was the key i woulod be mr o 15 years in a raw and still going ,,kevin would be mr o 15 years himself

gh15 approved

[el numero uno]

As Dk II said, for bodybuilding it doesn't matter, what do you need is a good couple years of natural training. Plus, everyone is different, so saying you need to bench at least xxx or squat xxx before juicing is bs IMO.

[DK II]

lol,, if you wait to be the strongest around to start juicing...something very sad is going in your bodybuild life,, lol

bodybuilding is NOT power lifting,,

if strength was the key i woulod be mr o 15 years in a raw and still going ,,kevin would be mr o 15 years himself

gh15 approved

 

[lowkey9]

i was deadlifting around 435lbs for reps and squatting over 3 plates for reps @ 160lbs before i decided to jump on.  that took a bit over a year.  ymmv.

[Man of Steel]

I'd like to see that. Those lifts sounds unbelievable for a natural.

Well, I think most guys give up trying naturally way too soon.  Now, I'm not saying I'm some diehard weight trainer, but I pushed myself hard (vomiting, almost blacking out, etc...). I don't recommend that LOL (and I was also in my early twenties), but I did train harder than almost everyone in every gym I frequented.  Again, almost everyone...there were other men and women busting it as hard or harder.  I killed it though....gave it everything, everytime....it wasn't easy either but at least everything I've done.....welll....I've done.

[Dr Dutch]

no offense guys but swedish sounds like such an ugly language  

It sound funny, because everybody in Sweden is always happy....

[MAXX]

Well, I think most guys give up trying naturally way too soon.  Now, I'm not saying I'm some diehard weight trainer, but I pushed myself hard (vomiting, almost blacking out, etc...). I don't recommend that LOL (and I was also in my early twenties), but I did train harder than almost everyone in every gym I frequented.  Again, almost everyone...there were other men and women busting it as hard or harder.  I killed it though....gave it everything, everytime....it wasn't easy either but at least everything I've done.....welll....I've done.

yeah well I've trained that way too from age 18-26 but I was not close to benching that.

485 bench for a natural. Really find it hard to believe.

[dr.chimps]

Forget strength levels. A Mr. Getbig title puts you at the front of the juice line.

[chaos]

I know a guy that does 465-475 natural, and 540 in a shirt. MOS is a monster, not too hard to believe. If he was shredded and 200#'s I would doubt it...*cough*mesmorph*cough*

[Bobby]

315 bench at least.
You need to know how to build a body before going on. Otherwise it's like putting NOS in a car with only 100hp

[Bobby]

It sound funny, because everybody in Sweden is always happy....

Hardly, they only have sunshine 4 months out of the year.

[local hero]

315 bench at least.
You need to know how to build a body before going on. Otherwise it's like putting NOS in a car with only 100hp

ha ha yeh right, probly a handfull of people in each gym capable of doing 3 plates plus naturaly

[flinstones1]

315 bench at least.
You need to know how to build a body before going on. Otherwise it's like putting NOS in a car with only 100hp

 

[DK II]

315 bench at least.
You need to know how to build a body before going on. Otherwise it's like putting NOS in a car with only 100hp

 


It's bodybuilding, you're not putting NO2 in a car with 100hp, you are putting a big big NO2-Sticker on the side of the car so that it LOOKS fast.

It will never run a race, always be parked and maybe stand on exhibitions a few times, so who gives a fuck if is has NO2 in it or not, it has to LOOK LIKE it has NO2.

[Xerxes]

 


It's bodybuilding, you're not putting NO2 in a car with 100hp, you are putting a big big NO2-Sticker on the side of the car so that it LOOKS fast.

It will never run a race, always be parked and maybe stand on exhibitions a few times, so who gives a fuck if is has NO2 in it or not, it has to LOOK LIKE it has NO2.

translation = I did 135lbs for 4-5 reps before hitting the sauce

[jr]

If you haven't made any gains in strength or size in the past year or two, even though you are training and eating right, maybe it is time for steroids. Why do you need a minimum level of strength to juice? Doesn't make sense.

[DK II]

translation = I did 135lbs for 4-5 reps before hitting the sauce

LOL, well not 135lbs, but i am not strong, and i probably never will be.

I have very small joints, which is great for BB but sucks for strength. I also never go below 6 reps, i don't bother how strong i am, as long as i grow. With time and more juice, i will get stronger anyways.

But for BB, it's a side effect and not important.