Attn: ALL you Steroid Monkeys... you disgust and sadden me.

[Stark]

steroid induced meltdown.

I lolled

[BM OUT]

Well,being around drug use for all those years,I think I have a better idea then you of what the risks are.Unlike you,I don't have to read it,or hear it,I live it.You are a jerk with a computer,who believes dummies like Don HOOTEN and the steroid fear crowd.

I don't know ONE SINGLE SOLITARY person that has EVER had a problem from steroids.NOT ONE,NOT EVER!!!!!That doesn't come off my internet,or out of some second rate magazine,thats called seeing it,living it for myself.Ive known HUNDREADS and HUNDREADS of guys who have juiced for years and years and NOT ONE has had problems.You know better though.

By the way,I included my kid and wife because you did the same exact thing trying to prove you weren't gay.Sorry,it didn't work.I still think your gay and fairly silly.You hate drugs but post on a bodybuilding board.A sport that is dominated by drug use.Very odd.I guess you think your like THE VOICE CRYING OUT IN THE WILDERNESS.

[PANDAEMONIUM]

Well,being around drug use for all those years,I think I have a better idea then you of what the risks are.Unlike you,I don't have to read it,or hear it,I live it.You are a jerk with a computer,who believes dummies like Don HOOTEN and the steroid fear crowd.

I don't know ONE SINGLE SOLITARY person that has EVER had a problem from steroids.NOT ONE,NOT EVER!!!!!That doesn't come off my internet,or out of some second rate magazine,thats called seeing it,living it for myself.Ive known HUNDREADS and HUNDREADS of guys who have juiced for years and years and NOT ONE has had problems.You know better though.

By the way,I included my kid and wife because you did the same exact thing trying to prove you weren't gay.Sorry,it didn't work.I still think your gay and fairly silly.You hate drugs but post on a bodybuilding board.A sport that is dominated by drug use.Very odd.I guess you think your like THE VOICE CRYING OUT IN THE WILDERNESS.

This post is a PERFECT example of why you are the most hated man in powerlifting--bar none.

[Arnold jr]

You have only one life, and you spend most of your money your effort and time on getting simply bigger never mind what it will cost.
All you wannabe Pro's who juice and get no where you disgust me even more.
You need to wake up and smell the coffee FOLKS, there is more to life than looking big, bodybuilding is much more.

It's time for you to get back to the roots and discover the spirituality of Bodybuilding once again.

You're right, a chunk of money is spent on these items...but it's less then many natural BB's spend on OTC supplements. In general, AAS is not that expensive, and I'm talking about human grade not bunk UG.

As for time spent on the whole endeavour, I would imagine that for the most part, natural or not, the same amount of time is spent by both groups...referring to those who would fall into the hardcore trainer category.

Last off, I've got no problem with anyone pursuing BB and remaining natural...hey, good for them. Honestly though, who cares either way. That said, my biggest pet peeve has always been when natural BB's wave their glorious natural flag...you rarely ever hear the AAS user bashing the natural guy for his decision to not use. Yes, there are those AAS users who are assholes and will act like idiots when the subject is brought up...but not nearly as often as the reverse.

Think about it. How many threads have been started on this board and every other board out there where natural BB's put themselves up on a pedestal? More then you can count. How many AAS users start threads praising their use and bashing naturals? You could probably count the threads on one hand...see the problem?

[Camel Jockey]

There are tons of juicers who don't get into trying to be a pro and just generally enjoy standing out. Juicers also tend to be the most educated of any drug users. I think eople have the right to do whatever without your ass supervising them. And honestly, if you're so disgusted by this place's atmosphere, then leave.

People shooting up nubain, 2 grams of test, slin, gh and whatnot make me sick too. But remember that there a lot of juicers who aren't like this.

Plus, Arnold and many pro athletes do/did it.. They're sucessful millionaires.

[Arnold jr]

There are tons of juicers who don't get into trying to be a pro and just generally enjoy standing out. Juicers also tend to be the most educated of any drug users. I think eople have the right to do whatever without your ass supervising them. And honestly, if you're so disgusted by this place's atmosphere, then leave.

People shooting up nubain, 2 grams of test, slin, gh and whatnot make me sick too. But remember that there a lot of juicers who aren't like this.

Plus, Arnold and many pro athletes do/did it.. They're sucessful millionaires.

Wait a minute...are you saying there are people who have used performance enhancing drugs and have gone on to live long successful lives? I'm flabbergasted!

[medz zeppelin]

Well,being around drug use for all those years,I think I have a better idea then you of what the risks are.Unlike you,I don't have to read it,or hear it,I live it.You are a jerk with a computer,who believes dummies like Don HOOTEN and the steroid fear crowd.

I don't know ONE SINGLE SOLITARY person that has EVER had a problem from steroids.NOT ONE,NOT EVER!!!!!That doesn't come off my internet,or out of some second rate magazine,thats called seeing it,living it for myself.Ive known HUNDREADS and HUNDREADS of guys who have juiced for years and years and NOT ONE has had problems.You know better though.

By the way,I included my kid and wife because you did the same exact thing trying to prove you weren't gay.Sorry,it didn't work.I still think your gay and fairly silly.You hate drugs but post on a bodybuilding board.A sport that is dominated by drug use.Very odd.I guess you think your like THE VOICE CRYING OUT IN THE WILDERNESS.

How's arthur prince?

[Camel Jockey]

Wait a minute...are you saying there are people who have used performance enhancing drugs and have gone on to live long successful lives? I'm flabbergasted!

I am just saying that only in bodybuilding do many people go down the drain using performance using drugs.

Look at the movie/music industry, the sports industry and even business. There was an article in the NY Post a few years back about corporate people who worked in downtown and midtown using performance enhancing drugs. And no, I'm not joking or pulling anyone's leg.

Everyone's still hung over from the Superbowl, as they should be.   But does anyone honestly think that many of those linemen could be that big and athletic without drugs?

Everyone uses drugs. Even alcohol is a drug.

[Triple-H_2005]

They sure do...  So what's the big deal?

[Stark]

Guys seriously, you are always soooo quick to point out that you know a lot of people who have
been juicing and never ever had any health issue.
Even with my limited actual Steroid knowledge I know that most "Complications" will become obvious when you get older,
but by than you can always say, well he was 50 years old many people have a heart attack with 50, or Flex Wheeler... well his kidney failed... happens to many people.
You don't need to be a scientist like Mr Arnold here or a Doctor to figure out that if you take a lot of Insuline and god knows what else you damage your body.
The reason you guys never know or don't want to talk about people that have been damaged by irresponsible (that word is important inn my opinion) Steroid use (I include HG and insulin in that category) is that these people tend to "fade" away.
Hey were is Karl... uh Karl don't feel so good, he has some issues with the Kidneys... yeah a birth defect, he can't train no more.. ANYWAYS  you heard the latest...
See what I mean? The initial problem with Steroid use is that it's so hard to prove that they actually harm you, god damit if somebody could prove to me without the shadow of a doubt that they don't harm you.. I be the first to take some.
But until than i find it incredible stupid and irresponsible to use them (and I do not mean the guys who make money of it nana) I mean the average wannabe gym rat.


And Camel Jockey don't even get me started on Alcohol... that fucking shit makes me so angry.

[emn1964]

Guys seriously, you are always soooo quick to point out that you know a lot of people who have
been juicing and never ever had any health issue.
Even with my limited actual Steroid knowledge I know that most "Complications" will become obvious when you get older,
but by than you can always say, well he was 50 years old many people have a heart attack with 50, or Flex Wheeler... well his kidney failed... happens to many people.
You don't need to be a scientist like Mr Arnold here or a Doctor to figure out that if you take a lot of Insuline and god knows what else you damage your body.
The reason you guys never know or don't want to talk about people that have been damaged by irresponsible (that word is important inn my opinion) Steroid use (I include HG and insulin in that category) is that these people tend to "fade" away.
Hey were is Karl... uh Karl don't feel so good, he has some issues with the Kidneys... yeah a birth defect, he can't train no more.. ANYWAYS  you heard the latest...
See what I mean? The initial problem with Steroid use is that it's so hard to prove that they actually harm you, god damit if somebody could prove to me without the shadow of a doubt that they don't harm you.. I be the first to take some.
But until than i find it incredible stupid and irresponsible to use them (and I do not mean the guys who make money of it nana) I mean the average wannabe gym rat.


And Camel Jockey don't even get me started on Alcohol... that fucking shit makes me so angry.

Who is this Karl of which you speak?

[kiwiol]

I wonder what guys like Stark and others who do nothing but consistently bash and insult bodybuilders are doing on a site like this. It's one thing to take potshots at a particular bodybuilder for something they did (like Kai Greene and 'The grapefruit incident'), but something else altogether to simply bash bodybuilders as a whole simply because they juice, which is in their right to do.

Stark and others like Howie - are you saying you are sick of the rampant steroid use thats 'ruining the sport'? Give me a f*cking break. Go and post in some other forum where you see nothing but natural bodybuilders who have 16" arms and weigh 170 lbs shredded. No one is asking you guys to post here. It's OK to have a few laughs here and there, but I'm sure I'm not the only guy who is tired of seeing / hearing guys who do nothing but tear down an already ridiculed sport here in this forum that's about bodybuilding in the first place.

BB has more than it's share of bashers and people who ridicule it (cause the morons who put it down don't know / understand what it's about) as it is. Guess what Stark - if you want to reform the sport along with guys like Howie, go start your own federation and make sure you only get natties to compete, so you can 'save' bodybuilding from the clutches of all the evil steroids

The funniest thing is that the guys who bash the sport are FAAAAAAAAAAR from perfect themselves. If I was one of you guys, I'd look into sorting my life out first. Are you saying your life's great already? Fine then, STFU

Hahahaha that's my meltdown of the day

[DK II]

Who is this Karl of which you speak?

karl the great you fucking idiot.

[Van_Bilderass]

I still think your gay and fairly silly.You hate drugs but post on a bodybuilding board.A sport that is dominated by drug use.Very odd.I guess you think your like THE VOICE CRYING OUT IN THE WILDERNESS.

Haha yes, Stark thinks he is the single SANE voice crying out in the wilderness! LOL

[Van_Bilderass]

I wonder what guys like Stark and others who do nothing but consistently bash and insult bodybuilders are doing on a site like this.

Exactly, no one gives a flying fuck about true natural bodybuilders, including guys like Stark. Because there is nothing to see. Steroids have desensitized everyone in society to the point that no one can even recognize an elite natural physique if they saw one. People have seen so much steroid induced muscle through popular media, throughout their lives, that even someone who doesn't follow bodybuilding at all doesn't give a second glance to a true elite natural physique, because there is 'nothing' to see.

[kiwiol]

Haha yes, Stark thinks he is the single SANE voice crying out in the wilderness! LOL

He is not the only one and I'm sure he means well. What I fail to see is how it's anyone's business whether Joe bodybuilder is taking Insulin or Test or 50 IUs or 100 IUs

The way I see it, there's a difference between staying alive for the sake of being alive and feeling alive because of what you do. Bodybuilders in general make a choice - they choose to risk their health and all the implied benefits just to attain a certain look. Whether they do it because of a noble / loafty vision or just plain insecurity is up to them and isn't anyone else's problem - I'm sure the reasons run the whole gamut from high to low.

[Krankenstein]

Just curious.....do you compete at all?

Never got an answer.....bump for response

[kiwiol]

Exactly, no one gives a flying fuck about true natural bodybuilders, including guys like Stark. Because there is nothing to see. Steroids have desensitized everyone in society to the point that no one can even recognize an elite natural physique if they saw one. People have seen so much steroid induced muscle through popular media, throughout their lives, that even someone who doesn't follow bodybuilding at all doesn't give a second glance to a true elite natural physique, because there is 'nothing' to see.

Very true. Lee Labrada once said that people go to the zoo to see lions and tigers, not cats and dogs. Imagine how incredibly moronic one must be to go to the zoo and demand they get rid of all the big animals (that are the star attraction) and replace them with mediocrity the small ones that you can see anywhere.

What's sad is that I hear that the reason the guys want to get rid of steroids in the sport is because they are concerned about the health of the athletes who "are dying because of it". ROFL - everyone dies someday. The question is, did you do what you want when you were alive? Someone who is really concerned about the health of athletes should put their own money up and start a federation where only guys who are all about health can compete - would probably look like the Billy Gunns Vs Vince Goodrum posedown if it happened

[DK II]

Very true. Lee Labrada once said that people go the zoo to see lions and tigers, not cats and dogs. Imagine how incredibly moronic one must be to go to the zoo and demand they get rid of all the big animals (that are the star attraction) and replace them with mediocrity the small ones that you can see anywhere.

What's sad is that I hear that the reason the guys want to get rid of steroids in the sport is because they are concerned about the health of the athletes who "are dying because of it". ROFL - everyone dies someday. The question is, did you do what you want when you were alive? Someone who is really concerned about the health of athletes should put their own money up and start a federation where only guys who are all about health can compete - would probably look like the Billy Gunns Vs Vince Goodrum posedown if it happened

kiwi, you juice?

[kiwiol]

kiwi, you juice?

I haven't even tried PH and don't think I will ever - just don't see the point in doing it given I don't compete and aren't interested in competing either. The reason I got a bit worked up is because I consider myself a fan of the sport and Getbig's one of the few places where I can talk about BB with others who enjoy it as an activity.

Because of my build, nearly every person I see / meet start talking about bodybuilding and I can't tell you if I feel angry or sad or indignant or feel like laughing at some of the things they say (about them not wanting to do juice cause they don't want to look like Arnold and so on ). So it's cool to come here and see others who know about the sport discuss stuff in a knowledgeable way. Which is why when guys like Stark start bashing the sport, I'm thinking 'give me a f*cking break'.

Of course, I have a choice not to read the threads and / or refrain from responding, but if it's Stark's right to bash the sport he loves, then I suppose it's mine to defend it to some sort of extent for the very same reason

[DK II]

But we agree there's no point in juicing to look good at the beach or in a club. Do we?

[_bruce_]

Good post Kiwi  

[Captain Equipoise]

Stark and Croatch should start team Anti Juice...

[kiwiol]

Oh, and bigmc's probably going to post my 8 month old pic, so here's something that shows me as I am now

[kiwiol]

But we agree there's no point in juicing to look good at the beach or in a club. Do we?

No, don't agree

Because what X, Y, Z choose to do with their body is none of my business and shouldn't be. If someone juices cause they want to look good when they go clubbing, it's in their right to do so. Some juice cause it's a short cut / replacement for hard work or to overcome their genetics or whatever. Others do it for a more serious reason, like the pros for example.

If you are personally getting affected adversely by someone else juicing, you'd be fair to say that they shouldn't be doing it, but that's never the case. Guys who have domestic incidents are going to have them anyway - juicing doesn't change a person's character in a fundamental way and turn good people into bad people. I'd say it's  far less harmful compared to alcohol or smoking, both of which I have nothing against either.