The ABBF is suspended by the IFBB : CORRUPTION ?

[Schmoe Buster]

MY FRIEND,

THERE IS NO INTERNATIONAL FEDERATION REGISTERED OR RECOGNIZED BY INTERNATIONAL OLYMPIC COMMITTEE ( IOC ) WITH THE NAME OF IFBB. AS I TOLD IT IS REGISTERED AS CORPORATION.

ABBF WILL NEVER RESPECT, AND FOLLOW THE IFBB CORPORATION CONSTITUTION, OR OBEY THEIR CHEATING RULES.

Fair point, how does this effect the IFBB Worlds in November, will Asian feds not send any athletes?

[G o a t b o y]

Actually, no one here gives a shit about the ABBF or Rafael's IFBB...   this board is about professional men in thongs, as well as the non-drug-tested american NPC.   

[dickmclaren]

From: Sugree Supawarikul <seabbf@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: IFBB THREATS BY WILLIAM TIERNERY AND HIS BOSS RAFAEL SANTONJA
To: abbfasia@yahoo.com.sg
Cc: "Douglas Latchford" <skanda@loxinfo.co.th>
Date: Sunday, 7 June, 2009, 12:26 AM


Dear ABBF Members,
 
The Thailand Bodybuilding Association wish to register its great disappointment with the barbaric and uncouth behaviour of the so called "ifbb" officers.
 
We are members of ABBF and we recognise its existence and we are organising the Asian Championships and an International Invitational Competition to celebrate  the 50th Anniversary founding of this great continental federation.
 
The IFBB is trying to dictate terms and harassing us,  and we will not bow to their threats. 
 
They refuse to reply all our emails and they have the audacity to write to us and warn us.  This is ridiculous and unimaginable...
 
William Tierney and his boss Rafael Santonja together with his JUNIOR officers are picking on everyone and this is no good for Bodybuilding's image.  You ask question, you get either suspended or expelled.  Where is DEMOCRACY in the so called "ifbb".
 
THAILAND will not give way to their threats and intimidation's....we will not give way to the IFBB because they are hiding and playing dirty tactics to destroy the Asian Bodybuilding and Fitness Federation.  Come what may we will fight and see that justice is done.
 
We will be writing a strong letter to IOC, OCA, GAISF and IWGF about the behaviour of IFBB and their junior officers.  They have no right to control us from promoting the sport, we obtained this sanction from the continental federation which is the ABBF and they are recognised by the Olympic Council of Asia.
 
We PROTEST strongly this kind of bullying tactics by the so called "ifbb" and their puppets.
 
Sugree Suprawakul
General-Secretary- Thailand Bodybuilding Association
Secretary-General, South East Asian Bodybuilding and Fitness Federation
Vice-President, Asian Bodybuilding and Fitness Federation
 
c.c. Sir Douglas Latchford, President TBBA
 
Note:  Datuk Paul Chua, kindly send this email to all members of the ABBF as well to all the IFBB members because Rafael Santonja and William Tierney are going over board and they must be stopped for their tyranny behaviour.

[Sir Humphrey]

Can you blame these horny old schmoes for fighting to the death over who gets first dibs on the tanned, oiled, thong-wearing musclemen? 

I had settled this thread a page ago. Horny old schmoes who run these different federations should just get together and resolve their differences over a few buff muscle hunks.

[Sir Humphrey]

That's not an IFBB senior official with an ambitious young muscleman!

[Cleanest Natural]

That's not an IFBB senior official with an ambitious young muscleman!

[ibfasport]

From: Sugree Supawarikul <seabbf@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: IFBB THREATS BY WILLIAM TIERNERY AND HIS BOSS RAFAEL SANTONJA
To: abbfasia@yahoo.com.sg
Cc: "Douglas Latchford" <skanda@loxinfo.co.th>
Date: Sunday, 7 June, 2009, 12:26 AM


Dear ABBF Members,
 
The Thailand Bodybuilding Association wish to register its great disappointment with the barbaric and uncouth behaviour of the so called "ifbb" officers.

pygmy santonja a barbarian? 

[Milos_Sarcev]

I defend whats right, whether it be on Milos' behalf, or Lee Priest, or whoever...as I've stated from the start of all this....I have no horse in this race.

My "job" in this particular case concerning Milos, was to insure that he was given fair and equitable treatment, and that the rules were followed on the side of the IFBB in reference to the disciplinary action taken.

Oh boy...your job in this particular case was TO INSURE THAT I WAS GIVEN FAIR AND EQUITABLE TREATMENT, and that the rules were followed on the side of the IFBB in reference to disciplinary action taken?!

And WHAT DID YOU DO EXACTLY?

You insured - WHAT?

I got investigated for my conduct (as I was reporting INTERNATIONAL CRIME) rather than Paul Chua, Asian Games judges, doping control group, official weigh-inn results, official score sheets…etc?

I reported directly from Doha to IFBB AMATEUR president (Rafael) – after first and before second day of the competition – with possibility to MAKE A DIFFERENCE - IF I was given a chance…and authority to collect my “proof”…

Upon my return I personally reported each and every detail to IFBB PRO president (Jim) and in our conversation he told me he doesn’t doubt me – but he can’t do nothing about it unless I have a proof…

I told him that proof is in:
1) score sheets
2) doping test
3) official weigh in results

and  certainly, I could not request for these documents – BUT HE COULD…And Jim promised that he would contact Rafael and directly ask him for it.
As I was checking with Jim – my documents never came – and he told me – Rafael never sent it…!?!

Yet – I got suspended – exactly when I was ready to make a comeback – in possibly the very best shape of my life (I planned to enter EVERY CONTEST that would be organized throughout a year – as I did many times in my career – 1991, 92, 97, 99…

My photo with Jay was in Romania at 2006 Euro tour – 4 months before the Ironman 2007…that I was eager to enter.
Your boss Russ De Luca was kind enough to offer me financial help + taping of my preparation for Ironman/Arnold Classic

Jim Lorimer invited me to compete – but suggested that I “straighten-out” things with the IFBB – so I could step on the stage…and maybe EARN MY LIVING…

As you mentioned FAIRNESS AND EQUATIBLE TREATMENT you supposedly have INSURED FOR ME…can you elaborate on that for a moment?

Not just that I was denied to compete for over 2 and a half years now…I was NOT allowed to make my living in my chosen profession and my Federation – WORLD WIDE – as Mr. Paul Chua made sure he calls every promoter I had scheduled appearance or some work…July 2007 in Japan (trip scheduled and organized BEFORE my suspension) with up to 8 appearances - was absolute disaster – as I was there – yet NOT ALLOWED to even show my face in the audience…

Same goes for some of my US and European IFBB related business opportunities – that I had to CANCEL – BECAUSE…?

Fairness and equitable treatment you are saying?

To top everything OFF – I lost my 15-year publication endorsement contract with Weider…and than couple of months later I even lost my 5 or 6 years long “gym contract" – for FLEX photo-shoots!

Additionally – loss of IFBB PRO STATUS caused me NOT to be considered for otherwise certain money-making opportunities…

Now, can you remind me WHAT DID YOU DO FOR ME?

As you are constantly "putting a foot in your mouth" - claiming exactly the OPPOSITE of what you are actually doing...I will let you explain here to me (and others) PARTICULARS of your "given " job?

Maybe "first particular" that most of us would really want to know is: HOW and WHY our President - Mr. Jim Manion made that "shocking twist" and changed the rules regarding the IFBB PRO ATHLETES REPRESENTATIVE....?

As you were not the IFBB professional (back in 1991,2,3,4...7,8,9)  you probably don't know about all the "fights" between Wayne on one side and Shawn and myself on the other...regarding the formation of the OFFICIAL IFBB PRO REP position (pro athlete representing pro athletes - makes sense, don't you think?) - who would represent ALL OF US - THE ATHLETES (OUR NEEDS, WISHES, IDEAS...etc) and be our voice in the "Office"...How do you explain your position and/or job? Athlete for Officials? Hmmm?

For years, Wayne successfully managed to keep us unorganized and apart from each other - making sure that we don't get the Union...and start actually asking for some advances...(OMG !) and - better things!?

He made us aware that IN ORDER for us to have a "voice"/ athletes representative in the ifbb office - we have to come up with 51% of the total votes...

Now - how did you get your title? And what IS the title anyway?

Vince rightfully gave you devoted OOR title - possibly even before me (?) I am not sure...Vince - do you remember who called our "Bobby" the puppet - DEVOTED (in true sense of that word) OFFICIAL IFBB OFFICIALS REP?

Instead of athletes being represented in officials offices (adding officially - makes it more official!) - so.... instead of having official athletes rep in officials offices with possibility to demand/requests favorable changes for athletes - we got official officials representative who is "sneaking in" every wish, change, rule and/or demand coming from head office...EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE of what we all need...

[Stavios]

Oh boy...your job in this particular case was TO INSURE THAT I WAS GIVEN FAIR AND EQUITABLE TREATMENT, and that the rules were followed on the side of the IFBB in reference to disciplinary action taken?!

And WHAT DID YOU DO EXACTLY?

You insured - WHAT?

I like Bob but I have to agree here

[Schmoe Buster]

Bob failed Milo's in every way, Bob's title should not be athletes rep it should be office rep,

[Van_Bilderass]

Milos dropped out of that show (see pic) because he had to apply bronzer on Jay. Story sounds fishy to me. Never heard that one before.

[Milos_Sarcev]

I can only speculate about what Ben knew or didn't know....

Only speculate?

How about grass being green - only speculate?
Sky being blue - only speculate?

Check your nose Pinocchio - and call Guinness...you'll make good money breaking all the records in many years to come...

You are so full of shit - you must take some Government job...

But, I can only speculate about you not knowing what is that Ben knew or didn't know....

I can only speculate that nobody cared to ask Ben if he knows, wants to know, can't remember that he know or that he doesn't know...Bo knows...but Bo is old news and probably half of the getbigger guard would not know - I speculate that also...

[Milos_Sarcev]

Milos dropped out of that show (see pic) because he had to apply bronzer on Jay. Story sounds fishy to me. Never heard that one before.

FISHY?

Well than here -

[WEIBK]

and  certainly, I could not request for these documents – BUT HE COULD…And Jim promised that he would contact Rafael and directly ask him for it.
As I was checking with Jim – my documents never came – and he told me – Rafael never sent it…!?!


[/quote]

HI MILOS I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU AND YOU SUFFERED A LOT, RAFAEL, JIM, AND ALL OTHERS ALL THE MOST CORRUPT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD.

[timfogarty]

HI MILOS I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU AND YOU SUFFERED A LOT, RAFAEL, JIM, AND ALL OTHERS ALL THE MOST CORRUPT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD.

yet the one Milos was calling corrupt was your friend Paul Chua.

as I've written before, years and years ago I was being told stories of Chua's corruption. 

[Chick]

Oh boy...your job in this particular case was TO INSURE THAT I WAS GIVEN FAIR AND EQUITABLE TREATMENT, and that the rules were followed on the side of the IFBB in reference to disciplinary action taken?!

And WHAT DID YOU DO EXACTLY?

You insured - WHAT?

I got investigated for my conduct (as I was reporting INTERNATIONAL CRIME) rather than Paul Chua, Asian Games judges, doping control group, official weigh-inn results, official score sheets…etc?

I reported directly from Doha to IFBB AMATEUR president (Rafael) – after first and before second day of the competition – with possibility to MAKE A DIFFERENCE - IF I was given a chance…and authority to collect my “proof”…

Upon my return I personally reported each and every detail to IFBB PRO president (Jim) and in our conversation he told me he doesn’t doubt me – but he can’t do nothing about it unless I have a proof…



And PROOF is what YOU failed to provide...three times over.  YOU were the one who decided to take matters into your own hands, and was subsequently suspended for it.  Had you followed proper procedure....it may have been a much quicker route to fact finding. Instead, all you managed to do was alert Chua that there would be inquiries made into his practices and possible wrong doing.  You were (and are)...your own worst enemy.  I didn't have to DO anything....I have nothing to do with Raphael, the Asian Games, Paul Chua....


I told him that proof is in:
1) score sheets
2) doping test
3) official weigh in results

and  certainly, I could not request for these documents – BUT HE COULD…And Jim promised that he would contact Rafael and directly ask him for it.
As I was checking with Jim – my documents never came – and he told me – Rafael never sent it…!?!


Sounds like you have a problem with Jim...I suggest you take it up with HIM.  I requested all of what you wrote in your official appeal which I submitted on your behalf at your request



Yet – I got suspended – exactly when I was ready to make a comeback – in possibly the very best shape of my life (I planned to enter EVERY CONTEST that would be organized throughout a year – as I did many times in my career – 1991, 92, 97, 99…


You got suspended for not following protcol, and not providing proof of allegations..that was YOUR choice.  You could have achieved the same thing without being suspended had you done so.  Because you're a hothead and cant control your mouth...the consequences were a direct result of your OWN actions

My photo with Jay was in Romania at 2006 Euro tour – 4 months before the Ironman 2007…that I was eager to enter.
Your boss Russ De Luca was kind enough to offer me financial help + taping of my preparation for Ironman/Arnold Classic

My boss Russ was kind enough...but it was MY idea to film your prep...which you have no idea of. Who do you think was going to do it, Russ?

Jim Lorimer invited me to compete – but suggested that I “straighten-out” things with the IFBB – so I could step on the stage…and maybe EARN MY LIVING…

As you mentioned FAIRNESS AND EQUATIBLE TREATMENT you supposedly have INSURED FOR ME…can you elaborate on that for a moment?


Absolutely...the IFBB played their hand, and suspended you for failing to provide proof. They did it by the book.  Had you presented the proof you insisted you had...they would have had no choice but to NOT suspend you. You failed to provide said proof...end of story.  There was nothing I could do for you


Not just that I was denied to compete for over 2 and a half years now…I was NOT allowed to make my living in my chosen profession and my Federation – WORLD WIDE – as Mr. Paul Chua made sure he calls every promoter I had scheduled appearance or some work…July 2007 in Japan (trip scheduled and organized BEFORE my suspension) with up to 8 appearances - was absolute disaster – as I was there – yet NOT ALLOWED to even show my face in the audience…

Same goes for some of my US and European IFBB related business opportunities – that I had to CANCEL – BECAUSE…?

Fairness and equitable treatment you are saying?

To top everything OFF – I lost my 15-year publication endorsement contract with Weider…and than couple of months later I even lost my 5 or 6 years long “gym contract" – for FLEX photo-shoots!

Additionally – loss of IFBB PRO STATUS caused me NOT to be considered for otherwise certain money-making opportunities…

Now, can you remind me WHAT DID YOU DO FOR ME?


Why do you keep asking what I could do for you?  I never said I could do ANYTHING for you, other than what I did....YOU made the allegations, YOU failed to provide proof, YOU failed to aid in your own appeal....It's your OWN actions that led to your suspension...how about taking responsibility for your OWN decisions?



As you are constantly "putting a foot in your mouth" - claiming exactly the OPPOSITE of what you are actually doing...I will let you explain here to me (and others) PARTICULARS of your "given " job?


I've claimed nothing I haven't done...as for putting one's "foot in their mouth"...you're the undisputed KING

Maybe "first particular" that most of us would really want to know is: HOW and WHY our President - Mr. Jim Manion made that "shocking twist" and changed the rules regarding the IFBB PRO ATHLETES REPRESENTATIVE....?


No rules were changed as there werent any rules set forth about the position other than what Wayne put together....who was REPLACED.  I took over when Shawn decided to step down...If you have such a problem with it, I suggest you get reinstated and run against me for the position....as I openly invite anyone else to do

As you were not the IFBB professional (back in 1991,2,3,4...7,8,9)  you probably don't know about all the "fights" between Wayne on one side and Shawn and myself on the other...regarding the formation of the OFFICIAL IFBB PRO REP position (pro athlete representing pro athletes - makes sense, don't you think?) - who would represent ALL OF US - THE ATHLETES (OUR NEEDS, WISHES, IDEAS...etc) and be our voice in the "Office"...How do you explain your position and/or job? Athlete for Officials? Hmmm?

I'll put my record up any day of the week for the changes made over the last 3 years....as for all your "fights"...you managed to accomplish NOTHING except fighting....no union, no rep position....ZERO. You were nowhere to be found in any form at the union meeting I organized, and have contributed NOTHING by way of proposals, ideas, etc....a lot of TALK and pissing in the wind....just like the old days, right?.....you know....back in 1991,2,3,4...7,8,9 when I wasn't a pro

For years, Wayne successfully managed to keep us unorganized and apart from each other - making sure that we don't get the Union...and start actually asking for some advances...(OMG !) and - better things!?


WRONG.....YOU successfully managed to keep YOURSELVES unorganized and apart from each other, making sure you didn't get a union


He made us aware that IN ORDER for us to have a "voice"/ athletes representative in the ifbb office - we have to come up with 51% of the total votes...

Now - how did you get your title? And what IS the title anyway?

Title is "Athletes Representative"...and how I got it was showing an interest in it....you know...something you've NEVER done, or tried...just a whole lot of hot air

Vince rightfully gave you devoted OOR title - possibly even before me (?) I am not sure...Vince - do you remember who called our "Bobby" the puppet - DEVOTED (in true sense of that word) OFFICIAL IFBB OFFICIALS REP?

Instead of athletes being represented in officials offices (adding officially - makes it more official!) - so.... instead of having official athletes rep in officials offices with possibility to demand/requests favorable changes for athletes - we got official officials representative who is "sneaking in" every wish, change, rule and/or demand coming from head office...EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE of what we all need...


Why not ask the athletes if the proposals I've gotten passed are "exactly the opposite" of what we need....more money, health coverage, more qualifying, a 202 division, increased per diem, etc....lets see a list from YOU of "what we need"....

[Sir Humphrey]

yet the one Milos was calling corrupt was your friend Paul Chua.

as I've written before, years and years ago I was being told stories of Chua's corruption. 

Do tell!

[Schmoe Buster]

yet the one Milos was calling corrupt was your friend Paul Chua.

as I've written before, years and years ago I was being told stories of Chua's corruption. 

Ive also heard about Chua's corruption before from different people, if Chua and his friends are calling Rafael,William Tierney and Jim Manion corrupted then its really a case of the pot calling the kettle black

[noworries]

Whats funny is how Manion can't defend himself ever.  He found Chic who he tells what to say.  Manion has no backbone or he would come on here and set the record straight or at least explain a little what's going on.  Manion is as corrupt as the Weiders. 

[Vince B]

What is undeniable is that Milos was punished for speaking out against an IFBB official. The IFBB cleverly kept all the documents to themselves so Milos ended up without any official evidence. What about the photos from the questionable contest? Had Milos been allowed to compete we can safely predict that he would have been placed 8th no matter how good he looked!

If any educated person were to read this thread they would shake their head at the amateur organization called the IFBB. It is nothing more than a business. They could care less about the bodybuilders and others associated with the Iron game. When Ben transferred the presidency the bottom soon fell out of the whole shebang. After Ben died there was no one to control the infighting and we are witnessing a collapse like what happened after the dictator in Yugoslavia died.

Bob C is an extraordinary stooge and puppet. There he is defending the IFBB to the end. Bob and the IFBB are innocent of ALL charges and according to him Milos and Lee got what they deserved for speaking out. This is a lesson for all bodybuilders. You don't mess with the IFBB  or Pro League because you will be sorry. Why the muscleheads don't vote for someone else to represent them is a mystery. Oh, I forgot, anyone who speaks out against an appointed official will be punished. Bob, Jim, Paul and Rafael made sure of that. What really pisses me off is that so many of the officials of the IFBB don't work out any more and many never have. They are not bodybuilders and have no right to be associated with the sport.

[kmhphoto]

From: Sugree Supawarikul <seabbf@yahoo.com>

c.c. Sir Douglas Latchford, President TBBA
 
Note:  Datuk Paul Chua, kindly send this email to all members of the ABBF as well to all the IFBB members because Rafael Santonja and William Tierney are going over board and they must be stopped for their tyranny behaviour.

The title "Sir" is one of the highest honors awarded to outstanding people by the Queen of England. If you are a citizen of the United Kingdom you are allowed to use the title If not, then you receive and Honorary Knighthood - example would be  RUDOLPH GIULIANI -  but cannot use the title.

Douglas Latchford has received neither a Knighthood or an Honorary Knighthood.

[Switznegger]

WOW Milos really likes Chick, Seems Chick was the one responsable for getting Milos back in the IFBB.Things that make you go Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm m.

[timfogarty]

The title "Sir" is one of the highest honors awarded to outstanding people by the Queen of England. If you are a citizen of the United Kingdom you are allowed to use the title If not, then you receive and Honorary Knighthood - example would be  RUDOLPH GIULIANI -  but cannot use the title.

Douglas Latchford has received neither a Knighthood or an Honorary Knighthood.

Datuk is an honorific title too, and Chua, too, has been criticized for using it inappropriately.

[Vince B]

Seems to me bodybuilding attracts the same personalities. Dreamers and wannabes who want to transcend themselves and be someone more than they are. Ben Weider had an honorary PhD but claimed that degree. Melvin Goodrum got his PhD in metaphysics through a donation to a religious college. Same delusion.

Paul Graham used to wrestle as Lord Paul, Mr Australia. He never won that title. He won two awards in a Southern Mr Universe contest (best abs and arms) and when he wrestled he liked to give the impression that he won the Mr Universe title twice. Talk about exaggerating. Now he runs the IFBB in Australia and is a vice-president of the IFBB. Appointed as usual. He was elected once but has had no elections since that I am aware of. The IFBB knows the type to pick to represent them. The first quality is absolute loyalty. Those who obey are rewarded with the spoils and awards. The egocentric bodybuilders are so desperate to win titles that they learn to kiss butt early and not go against those running the contests. Seems to me Ben Weider knew exactly how to control the slow-witted muscleheads. There are still treated like sheep at contest. Line up, right turn, and more crap. Is there no end to the nonsense associated with this sport?

[webcake]

Seems to me bodybuilding attracts the same personalities. Dreamers and wannabes who want to transcend themselves and be someone more than they are. Ben Weider had an honorary PhD but claimed that degree. Melvin Goodrum got his PhD in metaphysics through a donation to a religious college. Same delusion.

Paul Graham used to wrestle as Lord Paul, Mr Australia. He never won that title. He won two awards in a Southern Mr Universe contest (best abs and arms) and when he wrestled he liked to give the impression that he won the Mr Universe title twice. Talk about exaggerating. Now he runs the IFBB in Australia and is a vice-president of the IFBB. Appointed as usual. He was elected once but has had no elections since that I am aware of. The IFBB knows the type to pick to represent them. The first quality is absolute loyalty. Those who obey are rewarded with the spoils and awards. The egocentric bodybuilders are so desperate to win titles that they learn to kiss butt early and not go against those running the contests. Seems to me Ben Weider knew exactly how to control the slow-witted muscleheads. There are still treated like sheep at contest. Line up, right turn, and more crap. Is there no end to the nonsense associated with this sport?

Apparently Paul Graham is a prick. What is your take on this?