Trayvon Martin - Gun, Drugs, Fighting

[tu_holmes]

the lead detective disagrees with you on this.

Day 2, the top cop no longer playing defense lapdog.  He said zimm hung up and went fwd to confront trayvon, and DID NOT head back to his truck as stated.

He's credible, because ya loved him yesterday, but this is a big lie for zimm to tell, whether he was retreating or continuing his advance on trayvon.

How can he make the statement that Martin was moving towards Trayvon?

That's definite speculation. Did the Defense not object to it?

[240 is Back]

How can he make the statement that Martin was moving towards Trayvon?

That's definite speculation. Did the Defense not object to it?

No.  The detective laid out clearly why he felt this way, and he spent hours in a small room with zimm.  He knows the evidence.  I can't retype it as fast as he said it - someone will link article with summary - but he shut down omara fast.

based upon their interviews and re-enactments and 911 call and location of shooting, he said zimm was still very close to truck when he hung up - then he hung up and advanced.  He didn't "go back" as he claimed.

And this detective is a take-no-shit guy that zimm supporters loved yesterday when he shit all over trayvon and the prosecution.  Today, he's making a good case that zimmerman hung up and WANT TOWARD trayvon, not retreat.  He's calm and making a lot of sense.

If this is the case - and i doubt any of us knows the case better than him - then the whole zimmerman defense just kinda took a dump.

[Archer77]

No.  The detective laid out clearly why he felt this way, and he spent hours in a small room with zimm.  He knows the evidence.  I can't retype it as fast as he said it - someone will link article with summary - but he shut down omara fast.

based upon their interviews and re-enactments and 911 call and location of shooting, he said zimm was still very close to truck when he hung up - then he hung up and advanced.  He didn't "go back" as he claimed.

And this detective is a take-no-shit guy that zimm supporters loved yesterday when he shit all over trayvon and the prosecution.  Today, he's making a good case that zimmerman hung up and WANT TOWARD trayvon, not retreat.  He's calm and making a lot of sense.

If this is the case - and i doubt any of us knows the case better than him - then the whole zimmerman defense just kinda took a dump.

Unless he determine Zimmermans location from a contradiction in Zimmermans testimony, this seems extremely speculative.

[240 is Back]

Unless he determine Zimmermans location from a contradiction in Zimmermans testimony, this seems extremely speculative.

he's walked thru the shooting with zimm in person and on paper over and over.  there were lots of contradictions - listen to the interviews, there were a shitload of contradictions as his sotry evolved.

he pissed off the prosecution all day long today and yesterday - BUT - today the lead detective just said he wasn't where he claimed to be.

[Soul Crusher]

he's walked thru the shooting with zimm in person and on paper over and over.  there were lots of contradictions - listen to the interviews, there were a shitload of contradictions as his sotry evolved.

he pissed off the prosecution all day long today and yesterday - BUT - today the lead detective just said he wasn't where he claimed to be.

If he was not there - and not on the call itself - how the fuck he know that? 

[240 is Back]

If he was not there - and not on the call itself - how the fuck he know that?  

this is the detective that walked thru the crime scene with zimmerman and did 3 long ass interviews regarding the 911 call with him.  He knows every inch of that path, even second of those calls.  He spent months on this case full-time.  

That's how the fck he knows that.

The cop is highly credible - he puts the shooting itself solely upon trayvon's fault.  BUT he has punched a lot of holes in the zimmerman story of how he backtracked and then was jumped by a hiding trayvon - That part couldn't have happened how zimmerman claimed.


SO the cop really proved zimmerman right on the legal part of the shoot on the ground - but also showed zimm's lies in what led up to the shooting.  Take form it what you will, but there is nobody more well-versed in this shooting and zimm's multiple accounts of it - than this cop.  The same cop that wanted to charge him with manslaughter.

[Roger Bacon]

240 or Bust shows up at court, and throws down his briefcase like Mr. Brady proving Zimmermans guilt.

[Archer77]

Mr. 240 goes to Washington

[Shockwave]

this is the detective that walked thru the crime scene with zimmerman and did 3 long ass interviews regarding the 911 call with him.  He knows every inch of that path, even second of those calls.  He spent months on this case full-time.  

That's how the fck he knows that.

The cop is highly credible - he puts the shooting itself solely upon trayvon's fault.  BUT he has punched a lot of holes in the zimmerman story of how he backtracked and then was jumped by a hiding trayvon - That part couldn't have happened how zimmerman claimed.


SO the cop really proved zimmerman right on the legal part of the shoot on the ground - but also showed zimm's lies in what led up to the shooting.  Take form it what you will, but there is nobody more well-versed in this shooting and zimm's multiple accounts of it - than this cop.  The same cop that wanted to charge him with manslaughter.

the same detective that testified that his story didn't show any major inconsistencies? The same detective that said that they grilled him trying to make him slip up, and the few small slipups were well within normal bounds? That detective?

[240 is Back]

the same detective that testified that his story didn't show any major inconsistencies? The same detective that said that they grilled him trying to make him slip up, and the few small slipups were well within normal bounds? That detective?

Difference between major and minor inconsistencies.  Howevre, as the prosecution has shown, something minor such as location of zimmerman when phone call ends can completely unravel his story that he was attacked and not heading TOWARD trayvon after the phone call.

It makes a lot more sense too - he's in pursuit and admits trayvon is running. A minute later, one is shot dead.  I just find it hard to believe zimmerman gave up and turned around, and simultaneously, trayvon went from running away to pursuit.   Maybe one of these things, but BOTH happening at the same time?

Toss in the lead detective saying zimmerman did hang up and proceed after trayvon, well, it really destroys that one piece of the story that makes him NOt the aggressor.

[Soul Crusher]

Dude  once this trial is over - what on earth are you going to post aboujt?

Difference between major and minor inconsistencies.  Howevre, as the prosecution has shown, something minor such as location of zimmerman when phone call ends can completely unravel his story that he was attacked and not heading TOWARD trayvon after the phone call.

It makes a lot more sense too - he's in pursuit and admits trayvon is running. A minute later, one is shot dead.  I just find it hard to believe zimmerman gave up and turned around, and simultaneously, trayvon went from running away to pursuit.   Maybe one of these things, but BOTH happening at the same time?

Toss in the lead detective saying zimmerman did hang up and proceed after trayvon, well, it really destroys that one piece of the story that makes him NOt the aggressor.

[Archer77]

Difference between major and minor inconsistencies.  Howevre, as the prosecution has shown, something minor such as location of zimmerman when phone call ends can completely unravel his story that he was attacked and not heading TOWARD trayvon after the phone call.

It makes a lot more sense too - he's in pursuit and admits trayvon is running. A minute later, one is shot dead.  I just find it hard to believe zimmerman gave up and turned around, and simultaneously, trayvon went from running away to pursuit.   Maybe one of these things, but BOTH happening at the same time?

Toss in the lead detective saying zimmerman did hang up and proceed after trayvon, well, it really destroys that one piece of the story that makes him NOt the aggressor.

But you are willing to believe that same frightened kid engaged Zimmerman in a physical altercation and didnt just keep running?

[240 is Back]

Dude  once this trial is over - what on earth are you going to post aboujt?

whatever else is fun to discuss that week.  i think a lot of getbiggers take this way more seriously than I do.  I just like to argue and discuss.  I think by now you realize I don't care about being owned/wrong/pwned, etc.   I get shit wrong every day.  That's cool.  It's like watching a game with buddies and not being allowed to say "Oh, the Pats are coming back in the second half!"  

I dont sit there on monday morning embarassed and say "Oh shit, I suck, i'll never talk about football again".   I admit I got that one wrong and look fwd to the next game.  IT's on tv for entertainment.  Two idiots had it out on a rainy night, one got killed, one might go to jail.  Aside from that, everyone turning this into "the decisive racial issue of our time" is just drama queen shit.

[240 is Back]

But you are willing to believe that same frightened kid engaged Zimmerman in a physical altercation and didnt just keep running?

It is looking like trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck.  Trayvon sprinted, got around the corner by 20 or 30 feet, and strated walking.  At the same time, zimm hung up and cut thru yard then intercepted him on that pathway.  ZImm arrived tired as shit, trayvon had just caught his breath.  We don't know who started fight then, despite everyone wanting it to be - no proof there.  We just have one ran, one chased.  and the one chasing can't really claim self-defense.

[Archer77]

It is looking like trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck.  Trayvon sprinted, got around the corner by 20 or 30 feet, and strated walking.  At the same time, zimm hung up and cut thru yard then intercepted him on that pathway.  ZImm arrived tired as shit, trayvon had just caught his breath.  We don't know who started fight then, despite everyone wanting it to be - no proof there.  We just have one ran, one chased.  and the one chasing can't really claim self-defense.

Is there evidence for any of this.  The entire chase scene, the out of breath Zimmerman, Martin not seeing him....

[Soul Crusher]

It is looking like trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck.  Trayvon sprinted, got around the corner by 20 or 30 feet, and strated walking.  At the same time, zimm hung up and cut thru yard then intercepted him on that pathway.  ZImm arrived tired as shit, trayvon had just caught his breath.  We don't know who started fight then, despite everyone wanting it to be - no proof there.  We just have one ran, one chased.  and the one chasing can't really claim self-defense.

If Trayvon took off sprinting - wouldn't that give Zimm the idea that maybe he was intercepting a burglary in progress? 

[240 is Back]

If Trayvon took off sprinting - wouldn't that give Zimm the idea that maybe he was intercepting a burglary in progress? 

that would be speculative.   If some armed MMA fighter pulls up in a truck eyeballing me - and I'm a smoker twink junior in high school - I might run too.   Armed MMA fighters are scary!!

Why does everyone jump my ass every time I speculate, but you can do it?  lol

Is there evidence for any of this.  The entire chase scene, the out of breath Zimmerman, Martin not seeing him....

ZImmerman better hope that there is evidence - he's the one that killed someone.  I can't just blast someone and say "you can't PROVE I chased the mofo" then play a 911 tape showing he was running and i was chasing lol

The ENTIRE crux of the defense that keeps zimmerman out of jail is that he was NOT chasing after trayvon when the dispute happened.  That is EVERYTHING with him getting 25 years, or walking scot free.   IF he was walking back, and trayvon attacked him, then he's innocent.  If he was still pursuing trayvon (and cut thru yards to intercept) then he's going to prison.

it ALL comes down to that for FL self defense law - and there's no video or eyewitness to this.  Only zimm's words - and the lead detective did not believe that ONE part of the story.  It's a pretty big part though.  It'll all come down to which direction zimm was walking in when the fight started.   that's the whole case.

[Shockwave]

It is looking like trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck.  Trayvon sprinted, got around the corner by 20 or 30 feet, and strated walking.  At the same time, zimm hung up and cut thru yard then intercepted him on that pathway.  ZImm arrived tired as shit, trayvon had just caught his breath.  We don't know who started fight en, despite everyone wanting it to be - no proof there.  We just have one ran, one chased.  and the one chasing can't really claim self-defense.

You have zero evidence to support any of this. Now you're pinning your hopes on the fact that the situation took place a few yards from where he claimed it did. Pretty weak. But I guess its all you have left when pretty much everything else backfired, and the detective flat out said that his story was pretty much seamless.

[doison]

It is looking like trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck.  Trayvon sprinted, got around the corner by 20 or 30 feet, and strated walking.  At the same time, zimm hung up and cut thru yard then intercepted him on that pathway.  ZImm arrived tired as shit, trayvon had just caught his breath.  We don't know who started fight then, despite everyone wanting it to be - no proof there.  We just have one ran, one chased.  and the one chasing can't really claim self-defense.

How about...Trayvon didn't see him get out of the truck and took off on a jog because he was trying to get in shape.  Zimmerman tried to roll up his window but the door accidentally opened and he fell out.  Trayvon heard the commotion and hid behind some bushes.  Zimmerman was embarrassed and tried to play the fall off as "I meant to do that" and started doing some push ups to get a "club pump" in case he came across any ladies that evening.  Trayvon didn't see the push ups and thought Zimmerman must have took off in a different direction so Trayvon popped out of the bushes--continuing on his jog.  
Unfortunately for Trayvon, Zimmerman had finished his push ups and was off walking around to show off his club pump...a walk which put him right on a path with the jogging Trayvon as he leapt from his hiding place in the bushes.  
As they collided, an enraged Zimmerman resorted to his MMA training and pulled guard.  A frightened Trayvon repeatedly tried to get to his feet by pushing off with his hands--hands contracted into the shape of fists due to the cramping his jogging had caused (he had purchased juice and candy to help replace electrolytes at the store immediately prior).  
Zimmerman attempted to pull rubber guard but bashed his head against the ground instead.  Angered and confused by Trayvon's attempts to stand up and his own poor guard work, Zimmerman (who hated black people and no one can deny this) pulled his gun and shot Trayvon...knowing he could claim "stand your ground" and be home before his club pump wore off.

We don't know who started what and why they did, but we can all agree that Zimmerman was a beastly, bulging MMA fighter with a life-long hatred of innocent black children.  He lied at least 17 times too

[Archer77]

The dilemma I'm having a problem is with what exactly Zimmerman is guilt ly of but I know it's not murder 2

[240 is Back]

The dilemma I'm having a problem is with what exactly Zimmerman is guilt ly of but I know it's not murder 2

probably some bastardized version of menacing while possession of a firearm or something.  he created the situation.  But he didn't intend to murder anyone.  If 'manslaughter' was an option for the jury, it'd be a slam dunk.  but they got greedy going for murder.

Very rare is the person who said zimm did everything wrong that night, but he's not a murderer.  he's an idiot.

[Archer77]

probably some bastardized version of menacing while possession of a firearm or something.  he created the situation.  But he didn't intend to murder anyone.  If 'manslaughter' was an option for the jury, it'd be a slam dunk.  but they got greedy going for murder.

Very rare is the person who said zimm did everything wrong that night, but he's not a murderer.  he's an idiot.

I'm trying to work out whether he is guilty by the law or just ethically.  There is a difference.  I said this before but if I was forced to choose, negligent manslaughter is the only answer I can come up with.

[240 is Back]

More zimmerman statements now proven to be inconsistent:

"I reached down and My gun wasn't there"

"As soon as he broke my nose i started yelling for help"

"I was punched more than a dozen times in the head"

[240 is Back]

I'm trying to work out whether he is guilty by the law or just ethically.  There is a difference.  I said this before but if I was forced to choose, negligent manslaughter is the only answer I can come up with.

yeah, that would probably be perfect.   Maybe toss in obstruction, since his story has changed so many times on some things.  He wasn't honest about it when he said the 911 voice instructed him to go get that address, quite the opposite actually.

He should get a few years for causing the death and for being so dogshit stupid.   

[Archer77]

yeah, that would probably be perfect.   Maybe toss in obstruction, since his story has changed so many times on some things.  He wasn't honest about it when he said the 911 voice instructed him to go get that address, quite the opposite actually.

He should get a few years for causing the death and for being so dogshit stupid.   

If he doesn't get the max, we are all going to be hearing about it for a while.