is it true mike mentzer didnt train anything like "H.I.T." to get his body?

[anabolichalo]

i ready on elite fitness once a wall of text on how it was a scam and he actually used HST training or something like that

?

?

?

[Figo]

I heard he did crossfit

[kimo]

what is a hst .

[French]

of course, it's like to say, "I'm natural" or "it's just the finishing touch".

[snx]

Hi Bluto,

Yes, this is true. Mike was pushing HIT to move his 7-figure mail order business (true story). At one point, he was making more money in mail order for himself and Weider than Arnold was. A coup, to be sure.

At least he can say (posthumously, I reckon) that he did beat Arnold at something.

[Raymondo]

Hi Bluto,

Yes, this is true. Mike was pushing HIT to move his 7-figure mail order business (true story). At one point, he was making more money in mail order for himself and Weider than Arnold was. A coup, to be sure.

At least he can say (posthumously, I reckon) that he did beat Arnold at something.

Built 90% of his physique before he was 19 doing the traditional high rep, twice a day in the gym workouts... also ate a lot of d-bol

[anabolichalo]

Built 90% of his physique before he was 19 doing the traditional high rep, twice a day in the gym workouts... also ate a lot of d-bol

holy shiyt

[kimo]

high sets workouts didnt do much for his chest . . a waek point forhim like arnold thighs .

[Raymondo]

high sets workouts didnt do much for his chest . . a waek point forhim like arnold thighs .

His chest looked fairly decent in the offseason... nothing like arnold's but you wouldn't call it a weak point.

The thing is Mike dieted like a retard... 500 cals a day. So, his chest would deflate and gut would protrude slightly.

[Viking11]

i ready on elite fitness once a wall of text on how it was a scam and he actually used HST training or something like that

?

?

?

HST did not even exist in the 1970s- or 80s.  He did 3 times a week full body from age 12 to 15- going from 95 lbs to 165 over that time.  From age 15 to age 19 he kept increasing his volume til he was up to 3 hours a day, 6 days a week and stalled out at 190 lbs. He was pretty good then in the arms and legs- good enough for 10th in the 1971 Mr. America where he met Casey Viator..

[anabolichalo]

getbig know all about the biographies over every ifbb legends

[_bruce_]

I heard he did crossfit

x2

[tommywishbone]

What the fuck is HST?

[anabolichalo]

What the fuck is HST?

hypertrophy specific training

i think it's pretty much the pumping bodybuilding way

[tommywishbone]

Thanks.  Never actually heard that term.  Carry on.

[anabolichalo]

seems complex http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_index.html

i aint reading that shit

[oldtimer1]

seems complex http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_index.html

i aint reading that shit

Cliff notes for HST. Train your whole body three times a week like almost everyone did back in the day. He throws in variable reps according to the cycle to put his own stamp on an age old training method. 

[oldtimer1]

Cliff notes for Mentzer training. Started with volume with split routines.

 Met Viator and was influenced by Arthur Jones. Switched to whole body routines three times a week. Used a mix of Nautilus and conventional weights.

From there he went to splitting his body in half training four days a week. One day was thighs, chest and triceps. The other was back, delt and bicep. About 5 work sets per body part.

He then switched to using the above two way split to a rotation that he learned from Frank Calta Mr. Florida. He would train say on Monday Thighs, chest and triceps. Wednesday would be Back, delt and bicep. On Friday he would be back to thighs, chest and tricep again. The weekend was off. Next week he would start with Back, delt and bicep.

When he stopped competing after being away from the game for a long time he came up with these consolidated routines  that he never used when he was competing. He also didn't believe in cardio anymore but he use to bike and slow jog when he was competing.

A few credible guys have trained with Mentzer back in his prime who say he used more sets than what he wrote in print. Were they warm ups for the heavy work sets? I don't know.

[doriancutlerman]

A few credible guys have trained with Mentzer back in his prime who say he used more sets than what he wrote in print. Were they warm ups for the heavy work sets? I don't know.

I knew Mike, too.  I asked him about the reports of some high-set workouts he and Ray did, like their "squat party nights."  I even read him some of the supposed "excuses" he told other folks to justify catching him doing higher volume.

He basically just laughed and said those people were morons who took things out of context.  He admitted he and Ray would occasionally do what he called "crazy shit" like 15 sets/bodypart to failure.  

But that wasn't his standard routine, and why would he lie?  As he used to say (heavily paraphrased, because it has been many years): "People think I just want to make money by saying, 'do less, do just one hard set'; but then, people don't want to hear that -- they think I'm crazy.  I'd sell much BETTER if I said, just do a little less than Arnold, but do forced reps, drop sets and rest-pause; the kiddies would think that's more hard-core and my books would sell faster than pancakes.  But I don't give a shit how well they really sell.  I'm already making a comfortable living and I'm not that greedy."

The reason Mike sometimes did lots of sets to failure was multi-fold as I understood it.  

A.  He'd overtrain on purpose before a long vacation, during which time he wouldn't lift.
B.  Back in the day, he understood that you could overreach for a while and gain, but you'd eventually have to back off.  That's something he never really wrote about but we discussed it at length.  It was his form of cycling training volume, back before he advocated taking 1-2 wk. layoffs.
C.  Mike also thought that beating the piss out of a muscle the day before a photoshoot could be a good thing (severe edema so you wouldn't have to "pump up," plus you were so sore you could feel the muscle contracting to better pose/show them off.

But generally, he told me he rarely did more than two hard sets per exercise.  Behind-neck press might be 95x5, 115x5, 185x3, then 225x10.  After that, he might go up to 245, get 6 on his own and four forced reps.  

People can stamp their feet, whine and complain all they like, but if you really consider those first three real "sets," you might as well keep track of the steps you take upstairs to the weight room, raising your arms over your head, etc.  At some point we've gotta draw a line  

[oldtimer1]

I knew Mike, too.  I asked him about the reports of some high-set workouts he and Ray did, like their "squat party nights."  I even read him some of the supposed "excuses" he told other folks to justify catching him doing higher volume.

He basically just laughed and said those people were morons who took things out of context.  He admitted he and Ray would occasionally do what he called "crazy shit" like 15 sets/bodypart to failure.  

But that wasn't his standard routine, and why would he lie?  As he used to say (heavily paraphrased, because it has been many years): "People think I just want to make money by saying, 'do less, do just one hard set'; but then, people don't want to hear that -- they think I'm crazy.  I'd sell much BETTER if I said, just do a little less than Arnold, but do forced reps, drop sets and rest-pause; the kiddies would think that's more hard-core and my books would sell faster than pancakes.  But I don't give a shit how well they really sell.  I'm already making a comfortable living and I'm not that greedy."

The reason Mike sometimes did lots of sets to failure was multi-fold as I understood it.  

A.  He'd overtrain on purpose before a long vacation, during which time he wouldn't lift.
B.  Back in the day, he understood that you could overreach for a while and gain, but you'd eventually have to back off.  That's something he never really wrote about but we discussed it at length.  It was his form of cycling training volume, back before he advocated taking 1-2 wk. layoffs.
C.  Mike also thought that beating the piss out of a muscle the day before a photoshoot could be a good thing (severe edema so you wouldn't have to "pump up," plus you were so sore you could feel the muscle contracting to better pose/show them off.

But generally, he told me he rarely did more than two hard sets per exercise.  Behind-neck press might be 95x5, 115x5, 185x3, then 225x10.  After that, he might go up to 245, get 6 on his own and four forced reps.  

People can stamp their feet, whine and complain all they like, but if you really consider those first three real "sets," you might as well keep track of the steps you take upstairs to the weight room, raising your arms over your head, etc.  At some point we've gotta draw a line  

Good point about warm up sets. I have this debate about Dorian with guys online. I tell them he does non taxing warm up sets prior to that one set to failure. If he uses 415 for 7 reps his warms ups could be 135, 225, 315 before loading up the bar. They don't understand that he is not taxing himself but trying to avoid injury.

[arce1988]

  that looks damn good for 19

[Palpatine Q]

I knew Mike, too.  I asked him about the reports of some high-set workouts he and Ray did, like their "squat party nights."  I even read him some of the supposed "excuses" he told other folks to justify catching him doing higher volume.

He basically just laughed and said those people were morons who took things out of context.  He admitted he and Ray would occasionally do what he called "crazy shit" like 15 sets/bodypart to failure.  

But that wasn't his standard routine, and why would he lie?  As he used to say (heavily paraphrased, because it has been many years): "People think I just want to make money by saying, 'do less, do just one hard set'; but then, people don't want to hear that -- they think I'm crazy.  I'd sell much BETTER if I said, just do a little less than Arnold, but do forced reps, drop sets and rest-pause; the kiddies would think that's more hard-core and my books would sell faster than pancakes.  But I don't give a shit how well they really sell.  I'm already making a comfortable living and I'm not that greedy."

The reason Mike sometimes did lots of sets to failure was multi-fold as I understood it.  

A.  He'd overtrain on purpose before a long vacation, during which time he wouldn't lift.
B.  Back in the day, he understood that you could overreach for a while and gain, but you'd eventually have to back off.  That's something he never really wrote about but we discussed it at length.  It was his form of cycling training volume, back before he advocated taking 1-2 wk. layoffs.
C.  Mike also thought that beating the piss out of a muscle the day before a photoshoot could be a good thing (severe edema so you wouldn't have to "pump up," plus you were so sore you could feel the muscle contracting to better pose/show them off.

But generally, he told me he rarely did more than two hard sets per exercise.  Behind-neck press might be 95x5, 115x5, 185x3, then 225x10.  After that, he might go up to 245, get 6 on his own and four forced reps.  People can stamp their feet, whine and complain all they like, but if you really consider those first three real "sets," you might as well keep track of the steps you take upstairs to the weight room, raising your arms over your head, etc.  At some point we've gotta draw a line  

call me crazy but i count two warmup sets and three work sets, same fuckng thing i do....LOLOL

[Mr Nobody]

He trained 7-8 days a week.

[Griffith]

Cliff notes for Mentzer training. Started with volume with split routines.

 Met Viator and was influenced by Arthur Jones. Switched to whole body routines three times a week. Used a mix of Nautilus and conventional weights.

From there he went to splitting his body in half training four days a week. One day was thighs, chest and triceps. The other was back, delt and bicep. About 5 work sets per body part.

He then switched to using the above two way split to a rotation that he learned from Frank Calta Mr. Florida. He would train say on Monday Thighs, chest and triceps. Wednesday would be Back, delt and bicep. On Friday he would be back to thighs, chest and tricep again. The weekend was off. Next week he would start with Back, delt and bicep.

When he stopped competing after being away from the game for a long time he came up with these consolidated routines  that he never used when he was competing. He also didn't believe in cardio anymore but he use to bike and slow jog when he was competing.

A few credible guys have trained with Mentzer back in his prime who say he used more sets than what he wrote in print. Were they warm ups for the heavy work sets? I don't know.

Interesting post, thanks!

[Viking11]

call me crazy but i count two warmup sets and three work sets, same fuckng thing i do....LOLOL

Where do you get 3 work sets?  (Note the 185 x 3 isn't- not a maximal weight or effort, he probably could have got 15 reps with that. It was primarily for  neuromuscular facilitation- priming the pump- getting set for the heavy sets to failure. This was exactly what he did with his training clients-pecs would be Machine Incline press- light weight x a bunch of reps- til you started warming up, medium weight x 6-10 , heavier weight x 3. THEN he would walk you over to the pec dec, have you perform strict reps to failure - plus a static later on-  run you back across Gold's to the Incline press tor a heavy set to failure or beyond.  Pecs done.