Looks great & would beat Haney or Yates before losing to a late 90s Coleman.
2nd best BB of the last 2 decades behind Coleman.
Ronnie could barely beat him in 98 and he was no where near this good , this and 93 Ironamn is as good as he ever was , he would crush Ronnie and not by just 3 points like 98.
I've maintained this version of Flex would have beat Haney , Yates & Coleman at their best.
Using ND's screwy logic let's just with contest results:
Coleman > Wheeler
Wheeler's clearly better than Haney or Yates.
1998 Mr Olympia Ronnie Coleman just bareley beat Flex by the skin of his teeth in one of the closest Mr Olympia contests by 3 points !! and Flex was no where near as good as he was in 1993 , you compare Flex 98 to Flex 93 ASC 93 Ironman and its night & day , no way in fucking-hell would Ronnie beat a spot on Flex Wheeler
Bottom line, exercising ND's proven "logic" that relies only on historic results, in robotic fashion:Coleman > Wheeler.. ;D ;D ;D
Another 93 wheeler thread......... but, we can never get enough of that physique. It may have been the best ever.
ND's screwy logic of using contest results is irrelevent for many reasons.
first of which is that pretty much everyone in the IFBB beat Ronnie in the mid 90's, so according to that logic, they all could beat Ronnie.
secondly, had Ronnie had "contest momentum" going for him in 98, rather than being ignored until the second callout he might have won by a much heftier margin.
thirdly, there was a pretty substantial difference between Ronnie 98 and Ronnie 99.
In 99 he was 10 pounds bigger with improved hardess in all areas.
Flex was not wide enough to defeat a 99 Ronnie, who matched him in terms of detail and muscle shape, but with much more size:
if I'm not mistaken ( and I'm usually not )
(http://Ronnie looks like garbage compared to Flex ,)
::)
the whole board can see how dumb you are:
(http://body.builder.hu/imagebank/pictures/974028279.jpg)(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/coleman/rc230.jpg)
They are NOT simlar , you keep claiming these but they're not Flex has aesthetic and Ronnie doesn't , Ronie has an ugly phsyique and always has
hahahaahaha
the entire board would disagree with you on that one!
Clearly shows how much better Flex is !!
LOL well looks like I disproved ND yet again with the pics I just posted.
it is so easy to own ND because his hatred of Ronnie makes him stupid.
Ronnie looks like shit compared to flex.
Ronnie looks like shit compared to flex.
Ronnie has a monster gut, no aesthetics compared to Flex, bitch tits, horrible abs, oil filled calves, much wider waist, worse quad separation.
Flex 93AC destroys Ronnie if you want to play the aesthetics game ;)
Ronnie loses becuase of the gut alone, look at this pathetic shit, Ron's gut sticking out in the MM :-\
(http://www.mostmuscular.com/newmuscle.cx/olympia/coleman8.jpg)
Looks great & would beat Haney or Yates before losing to a late 90s Coleman.
2nd best BB of the last 2 decades behind Coleman.
can anyone see the difference?
::)
(http://www.mostmuscular.com/newmuscle.cx/olympia/coleman8.jpg)
are you refering to the same flex wheeler that never came close to beating dorian and in fact called dorian in 93, flex's best year in over 10 years of competition, untouchable.
yes, that is a quote from flex him self.
"dorian is untouchable".
flex himself said that. what more do you need?
is your opinion more valid than flex's about his fucking self?
even when the person of subject admits to it, you still dont believe them.
you truly are delusional.
LOL Flex in 2003 said Ronnie was by far the greatest bodybuilder ever and easily the greatest Mr. Olympia of all time in his MD 2003 Olympia coverage.
what do you think about Flex's opinion NOW
LOL
that means that Flex himself admits that Ronnie is better.
IMO Ronnie is the best. He is just fuckin fantastic, perfect combo between mass and shape. Ronnie was always alot bigger.
When we talk about shape and aesthetics this would be more interesting:
Flex vs Levrone vs Cormier vs Ray
exactly, the two pics I posted show that Ronnie and Flex were very similar in terms of QUALITY.
what they do not show was that in actual fact if Ronnie were standing beside flex, he would be a lot bigger with all of that same quality.
are you refering to the same flex wheeler that never came close to beating dorian and in fact called dorian in 93, flex's best year in over 10 years of competition, untouchable.
yes, that is a quote from flex him self.
"dorian is untouchable".
flex himself said that. what more do you need?
is your opinion more valid than flex's about his fucking self?
even when the person of subject admits to it, you still dont believe them.
you truly are delusional.
Flex never believed in himself. The man could have won the Olympia and said the same damn thing. and for Flex to say Dorian is "untouchable" is like Mario Andretti saying Kyle Petty is "untouchable", both are great drivers, but which one knows he's the better driver ;)
Flex never believed in himself. The man could have won the Olympia and said the same damn thing. and for Flex to say Dorian is "untouchable" is like Mario Andretti saying Kyle Petty is "untouchable", both are great drivers, but which one knows he's the better driver ;)
if ND is so sure that Flex would beat Ronnie, then lets look at this, shall we? starting with:
Flex 93 AC vs Ronnie 99 side chest:
Ronnie takes it.
if ND is so sure that Flex would beat Ronnie, then lets look at this, shall we? starting with:
Flex 93 AC vs Ronnie 99 side chest:
(http://body.builder.hu/imagebank/pictures/1000140425.jpg)(http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/1999britishgrandprix/31.jpg)
Ronnie takes it.
Mario Andtretti is the clearly better driver and why? because he's won in just about every form of motorsports and raced for decades and was very successful , CART , NASCAR , F1 , LE MANS , Sprint Mario did them all , Kyle Petty I mean get serious .
The list
1. Bob Paris
2. Steve Reeves
3. Frank Zane
4. Labrada
5. Wheeler
6. Charles Clairmonte
7. Milos
8. deMey
9. Samir
10. Makkawy
11. Shawn Ray
12. Cormier
13. Thierry Pastel
14. Mendenhall
15. Haney
16. Nubret
17. Padilla
18. Sergio
19. Sonny Schmidt
20. Melvin Anthony
I don't see Ronnie's name on the most aesthetic list , how could Ronnie & Flex be so similar and he's not even in the top 20? I'll tell you why , Ronnie has an ugly phsyique and always did .
LOL..Kyle Petty was a bad comparison.....Mario is clearly better than good ole Kyle.....but Mario was no Emerson Fitapaldi.
rear lat spread;
unable to find 93 pic of Flex, not sure what year this is from.
still, we all know what the outcome of this one will be:
this is where the supreme width advantage comes into play.
Who says the guy with the widest back would win? where is this fantasy criteria? Flex NEVER had a wider back than Ronnie yet managed to beat him consistantly
He's more of a match but Mario has more of a dirverse career and and longer ask 100 people on the street who Emo is and you're lucky to get 5 people who know and all 100 would know Mario .
He's more of a match but Mario has more of a dirverse career and and longer ask 100 people on the street who Emo is and you're lucky to get 5 people who know and all 100 would know Mario .
hahaha!!! OWNED again!!
Not to mention, Flex beat a 260lb Ronnie in 1996 when Flex was near, but not at his best. So an ON Flex would definitely beat a 99 Coleman. Every advantage Coleman had on Flex in 99 he had on him in 96. And what good did it do him? NOTHING. Flex beat him ;) ;)
Very true, Mario was really great at the business end of racing. Everyone knows the Andretti name, even nonrace fans. If I were looking for a F1 or CART driver, I'd take Emo over Mario myself. Anything else and you'd have to take Mario. I seriously doubt Emo would drive anything as barbaric as a stock car.
You lost me when you trying to prove a point using Dilletts back as an example. HAHA.
flex 93, ronnie 99:
(http://www.anabolandia.com/images/zoom/wheeler/foto-weeler-07.jpg)(http://kulturistika.com/gallery/1115026870_154.jpg)
God damn, Flex is just destroying Ronnie there. Look at Flex's FAR superior quad separation to Ronnie's none. Flex hands DOWN.
I mean seriously Shawn Ray beat , Paul Dillett who had a wider back , Levrone who had a wider back , Nasser who had a wider back , Ronnie who had a wider back , it means dick , he clings onto dear life with this nonsense ' advantage '
Hell look at Juan Pablo Montoya he's going to NASCAR wtf ? ???
Notice Ronnie hiding his stomach. Flex's legs werent so good.
God damn, Flex is just destroying Ronnie there. Look at Flex's FAR superior quad separation to Ronnie's none. Flex hands DOWN.
you are honestly trying to say that Ronnie's width is not an advantage against Flex?
::)
as I said, ND's hatred of ronnie makes him stupid:
(http://www.bigroncoleman.com/media/1998_12LG.jpg)
the man has no practical knowledge of how bodybuiding is actually judged.
for him, all that matters is numbers and quotes.
when comes to the reailty of the onstage comparisons, he is all but lost.
you are honestly trying to say that Ronnie's width is not an advantage against Flex?
::)
as I said, ND's hatred of ronnie makes him stupid:
the man has no practical knowledge of how bodybuiding is actually judged.
for him, all that matters is numbers and quotes.
when comes to the reailty of the onstage comparisons, he is all but lost.
Hulkster listen to me very carefully , Ronnie always had a wider back than Flex but that NEVER onced stopped Flex from beating Ronnie the widest back IS NOT i repeat for those who didn't know , the widest back IS NOT a prerequsite for beating someone , Shawn Ray beat many a men with a much wider and better latspreads than him , you don't need the widest back .
but this is what you still do not understand:
having more width is not the ONLY thing that matters, but when you are standing beside someone who is narrower than you, it DOES help.
ALL advantages are considered.
not just one.
this is something that you still cannot grasp.
but this is what you still do not understand:
having more width is not the ONLY thing that matters, but when you are standing beside someone who is narrower than you, it DOES help.
ALL advantages are considered.
not just one.
this is something that you still cannot grasp.
Again, Hulkser posting pictures of Flex off bigtime check the soft hams and glutes. Post 93AC pics against COleman, Flex destroys Ronnie ;)
ND. Please understand this. You don't post pictures of Wheelers back and say that he is clearly better than Ronnie. Ronnie OWNS Flex in back development. Seriously, Flex only has better abs...
ND. Please understand this. You don't post pictures of Wheelers back and say that he is clearly better than Ronnie. Ronnie OWNS Flex in back development. Seriously, Flex only has better abs...
as I have said and ND keeps proving:
his hatred of ronnie makes him stupid and shows that he is a true veteran with a novice knowledge of the sport.
width not an advantage/
please.
ND acts like he is brand new to the sport.
What are you silly? back development? please explain to me in detail what mucles are developed in Ronnie's back that are NOT In Flexs and I'm dying to hear this , Ronnie has width and at his heavier weights more thickness but Flex doesn't lack development .see what I mean?
Dude, Ronnie is about 3 times thicker and wider. Ronnies back is untouchable in the reardouble bi. BEST EVER.
see what I mean?
a novice's knowledge..
(http://www.ronniecoleman.net/comp0029.jpg)
you need thickness too.
Kid please explain to me how Shawn Ray & Flex Wheeler two men who didn't have the widest lats beat many men who did ,
flex was a great bodybuilder but common.
in the lineup ronnie makes him look like a little kid.
at his best ronnies level of muscularity and conditioning put him in a class by himself.
ronnie vs flex...lol...not even close.
DUDE, DONT YOU CONSIDER WIDTH AND THICKNESS DEVELOPMENT? WHAT ARE YOU, DEMENTED?
because they won based on the OTHER amazing merits of their physiques, dumbass.
as I said width HELPS but it is not the ONLY thing.
the point that you cannot grasp is this:
as others on thsi thread are trying to tell you:
ronnie can match flex in all other aspects of his physique with the exception of the ab department.
so when you do NOT have these OTHER advantages, the fact that you are narrow will be the kiss of death onstage.
I can't believe we have to explain basic concepts of competition to this "veteran"
::)
What an idiotic statement Flex was common? ::)
No you tryed to used this 'edge ' before and you failed , Flex has NO bitch-tits or GUT what advantages does he have? ugly size? Flex has size & aesthetics , he had muscle shape that Ronnie could only dream of , Ronnie can't touch Flex at his finest , very very few could.
DUDE, DONT YOU CONSIDER WIDTH AND THICKNESS DEVELOPMENT? WHAT ARE YOU, DEMENTED?
HE doesn't just match him. He's better.
Idiot , thickness is as the name implies , width is as the name implies it HAS NOTHING to do with the development of the muscle , Nasser had a thick back , and Dillett had a wide back and NEITHER had any fucking development within the muscles , jesus christ get with the program.
very true.
ND really has no clue.
once again, ND cannot contemplate that someone might have a combo of both detail AND thickness.
notice how he only seems to grasp one or the other but not both?
he still has so much to learn about how this sport is judged.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=92170.0;attach=100258;image)
Sure Dillett had a wide back. ::)
You think Ronnie with bitch-tits a GH gut and poor muscle shape can overcome Flex Wheeler 1993? lol kid wake up and smell the coffee
yes, and as you can see, everyone else thinks so too.
oh, sorry, I guess we are all wrong once again
::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
(http://www.bodybuilders.com/paul8.jpg)
Yeah, if only flex was this wide ::)
You're damn right you're all wrong
no...meant to say....flex was a great bodybuilder but come on.
dont compare him to ronnie.
are you refering to the same flex wheeler that never came close to beating dorian and in fact called dorian in 93, flex's best year in over 10 years of competition, untouchable.
yes, that is a quote from flex him self.
"dorian is untouchable".
flex himself said that. what more do you need?
is your opinion more valid than flex's about his fucking self?
even when the person of subject admits to it, you still dont believe them.
you truly are delusional.
ND, whats it like to be alone in your contentions in each and every thread?
Are you referring to the same flex wheeler who came on this board this year and admitted that coleman would own yates at both their peaks?
ND you truly are a delusional dumbass.
Hulkster you are so naive and ignorant.LOL no, that was a nimrod king seminar.
You have been to a king kamali seminar and you think you know everything.
ND is far more knowledgable than you.
Unless you show me a great Dillett latspread stop talking bs. His back looks decent from the front but from the back he looks like shit.
Ronnie was able to come in at his peak far better than Flex. Flex had a problem with his lower back, glute-ham tie ins. Something that became more of a problem when he got bigger, and stopped working with Joe McNeal. Flex's best yrs as a pro was 93, 97, and 98.
Ronnie is also able to carry more mass than Flex, that is in genetics. And it showed in 99-00. Flex couldn't hang and Ronnie past him. Flex was always a ectomorph. Ronnie could look at cornbread and grow.
If Flex were to have his same look as he did at the 93 ASC, but was about 230 pounds, Ronnie would not have been Mr. O. It was said if Flex just came in his 98 Arnold condition, he would have walked away with it. He didn't and.
Kinda like how Ferrari used to have an advantage over the F1 field (2yrs ago), but due to the fact they used tires like crazy (their own fault), and the rules changes to one set of tires, other teams (Renault) which were more frugal, beat Ferrari.
What I'm trying to say is that, Flex had the tools to win, but due to his own neglegance, and his genetic limitations, Ronnie surpassed Flex...
LOL no, that was a nimrod king seminar.
he is a pro that was competeting in the Mr O. no doubt long before you were even following the sport...
Sure, just a tad more synthol and he would own ronnie. ::)
(http://www.ifbb.com/contestresults/mrolympia/coleman/99coleman3.jpg)
(http://www.ifbb.com/contestresults/mrolympia/coleman/99coleman8.jpg)
(http://www.ifbb.com/contestresults/mrolympia/coleman/99coleman10.jpg)
Please stop.
Just a perfect blend of size & aesthetics
According to you, aesthetics don't matter in a bodybuilding competition and he lacks size compared to Ronnie. So how exactly would Ronnie lose to Flex? ???
Pay attention to me , I never said they don't matter I said they didn't apply to Dorian Yates , he didn't need aesthetics to beat guys with aesthetics , Flex is down size compared to Ronnie but he's way up in terms of shape , his muscle shape in unrivaled by Ronnie and he doesn't have bitch tits , a gut , overdeveloped glutes , Ronnie never faced Flex at his best and Flex still beat him , despite being lighter ever wonder why?
Sure, just a tad more synthol and he would own ronnie. ::)
Pay attention to me , I never said they don't matter I said they didn't apply to Dorian Yates , he didn't need aesthetics to beat guys with aesthetics , Flex is down size compared to Ronnie but he's way up in terms of shape , his muscle shape in unrivaled by Ronnie and he doesn't have bitch tits , a gut , overdeveloped glutes , Ronnie never faced Flex at his best and Flex still beat him , despite being lighter ever wonder why?
you say Flex was 'on another level than Ronnie"
well, we would all like to know why he was.
shape wise, ronnie can easily compare.
detail wise, same.
size wise, way above flex...
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/coleman/rc229.jpg)
Flex has a more overall pleasing shape , Ronnie's phsyique is ugly , Flex is on another level in terms of shape , asesthetics , Ronnie's size is beatable Flex done in many times
LOL
you are so full of shit:
I can only lead you to water but I can't make you drink !! Arnold said Flex was the best ever ;)
but this is what you still do not understand:
having more width is not the ONLY thing that matters, but when you are standing beside someone who is narrower than you, it DOES help.
ALL advantages are considered.
not just one.
this is something that you still cannot grasp.
why do you have this fetish with taking a persons opinion over real pics that compare people?
it is really stupid ans shows your desperation.
Arnold said Flex was the best ever
Glad you brought that up. Arnold also said Yates took BB in the wrong direction & looked like a powerlifter.
Wrong !! Arnold said yates didn't do enough to promote the sport and he never said he looked like a powerflifter thats your added bullshitSelective memory; he mentioned both things.
ND bad pic to use since I have already posted 2 pics of Ronnie doing the same pose and looking just as detailed, but much thicker overall.
sorry sport, but as others on this thread have told you:
Flex was fantastic, but he was no Ronnie
Selective memory; he mentioned both things.
Oh no one is claiming Flex is thicker Flex has his strenghts to overcome Ronnie's thickness and he doesn't have a gut or bitch tits ;)
hahaha what was that about strengths overcoming weaknesses?
sorry ND, but it looks like you are alone once again...
Flex 93 AC vs Ronnie 99 Olympia:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/diablo86/flex%20Wheeler/40.jpg)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=106860.0;attach=119351;image)(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=90805.0;attach=98361;image)
IF THE MUSIC MAN'S READY, POSEDOWN!
LOL
flex's calves have been fake from the getgo.
Look at this , seriously Ronnie isn't this good , size , shape and aesthetics
maybe not in 2006 or 2001 but in 1999 he certainly was
(http://www.ronniecoleman.net/comp9917.jpg)
Flex just doesn't compare in terms of lats, quads, chest..great but noticably smaller more compact in some areas. Coleman didn't have enough weakness for Wheeler to make up the difference.
When Coleman was in shape and lighter, there wasn't much different in aesthetics. Hardly any, vs. Wheeler's clear deficiencies.
(http://body.builder.hu/imagebank/pictures/1000138263.jpg)(http://www.ronniecoleman.net/bwcolemanca78f7ff.jpg)
Hmmm bitch tits & a GH gut are more than enough to lose on that alone ! and Ronnie does have advantages but couple Flex's advantages with Ronnie's weaknesses and Flex would beat Ronnie like he always did .
Flex has aesthetics , Haney had aesthetics , Cormier had aesthetics Ronnie never had mentionable aesthetics even at his best.
In the late 90s shots, not many would agree with that assessment about Coleman.
In the late 90s shots, not many would agree with that assessment about Coleman.
not many agree with anything ND says about Coleman period...
A quick scan of musclememory.com reveals that Flex beat Ronnie 5 times in 2 years (1996 and 1997)
Ronnie beat Flex in 1996 and from 1998 on for the rest of his career.
Ronnie has the more dominant win record by far in terms of Flex vs. Ronnie.
so, it should be "Ronnie would beat flex, like he always did" not the other way around 8)
Actually I think you're wrong I think both beat each other 8 times each , and again we're talking about Flex 1993 thats as good as he ever was.
The aesthetics list
1. Bob Paris
2. Steve Reeves
3. Frank Zane
4. Labrada
5. Wheeler
6. Charles Clairmonte
7. Milos
8. deMey
9. Samir
10. Makkawy
11. Shawn Ray
12. Cormier
13. Thierry Pastel
14. Mendenhall
15. Haney
16. Nubret
17. Padilla
18. Sergio
19. Sonny Schmidt
20. Melvin Anthony
where's Coleman?
yes, 8 times each looks right.
so you can't say either one would win based on dominance.
so, you have to look to the physiques,
and that one's easy:
8)
I'm glad discredited his objectivity by posting the Flex "aesthetics" list. Almost everyone on getbig made fun of it when it came out, except a Flex shill like ND. Ridiculous choices..Nubret & Padilla only 16 & 17 instead of very close or at the top for example, is ludicrous to anyone who really knows BB:
Damn I'm always right lol !! anyway I did look at the physiques and Flex doesn't have bitch tits or a gut he has enough size , outstanding shape , aesthetics , conditioning , much better midsection , calves , Flex has to many positives , clear cut winner.
yawn Reeves should have been first ! again NO Coleman why? there is a huge reason.
Utter lack of objectivity, only discussing Flex's attributes. Can you say one-sided & delusional?
ND why are you stating Flex's calves as an advantage?
they have always looked like water balloons.
suspect right from day one.
at least Ronnie's had detail:
as far as the list goes, the question is this:
everyone in bodybuilding (except for ND) will tell you that Ronnie 98/99 was the BEST COMBO of size, detail and aesthetics ever seen.
if I had a dollar for everytime I have seen that said, I could retire.
Problem is, later in his career, all that aesthetics went out the window with his monstous obliques, and puffy, 295 pound look.
Question is, had Ronnie maintained that look and image, would he have been somewhere (probably near the bottom few) on the list?
look at that side chest shot!
its amazing someone who is recognized as being so well balanced and aesthetic can have such massive arms and no chest :-\
not very balanced at all..
Everybody in bodybuilding you say?
The list
1. Bob Paris
2. Steve Reeves
3. Frank Zane
4. Labrada
5. Wheeler
6. Charles Clairmonte
7. Milos
8. deMey
9. Samir
10. Makkawy
11. Shawn Ray
12. Cormier
13. Thierry Pastel
14. Mendenhall
15. Haney
16. Nubret
17. Padilla
18. Sergio
19. Sonny Schmidt
20. Melvin Anthony
Where is Coleman? ??? ??? ;)
notice I said COMBO of size and aesthetics.
Ronnie was 257 in 1999. the average person's weight on that list is 200 pounds at best. Only haney and sergio weigh more.
the whole point of the post was this:
had Ronnie not totally altered his physique in the later years of his career, would he have been remember and considered an aesthetic bodybuilder?
I say probably.
look at the difference:
No his calves weren't always fucked-up look at 92/93 we're not talking Yates' calves but they are better than RonniesOnly cos of his baby quads. And Chris does appear to have some gyno in that shot, so that probably wasn't the best example pic.
Only cos of his baby quads. And Chris does appear to have some gyno in that shot, so that probably wasn't the best example pic.
How ironic of ND to post a pic of Chris showing visible gyno on his left pec ::)
great post, ND :-\