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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: militarymuscle69 on March 21, 2007, 11:25:39 AM
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In recent weeks, a new focus has been placed on securing Baghdad and on preparing the Iraqi military to eventually take over national defense. Two of the five extra brigades involved in the 20,000-troop “surge” have arrived in-country, and coalition forces’ ROEs have been adjusted to correct for the needlessly unproductive restrictions on troop movement and on the engagement of sectarian fighters. Gen. David Petraeus, the new commander of Multinational Forces in Iraq, has pointed out the ample cause for optimism, saying: “By early June, we should then have everyone roughly in place -- and that will allow us to establish the density in partnership with Iraqi security forces that you need to really get a good grip on the security situation.”
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Liar! Link please. :D
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Liar! Link please. :D
oops forgot......warning it is a conservative link again.....not someone as credible as CNN/NBC/CBS etc....
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=19900
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They got the go-ahead from Halliburton.
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In recent weeks, a new focus has been placed on securing Baghdad and on preparing the Iraqi military to eventually take over national defense. Two of the five extra brigades involved in the 20,000-troop “surge” have arrived in-country, and coalition forces’ ROEs have been adjusted to correct for the needlessly unproductive restrictions on troop movement and on the engagement of sectarian fighters. Gen. David Petraeus, the new commander of Multinational Forces in Iraq, has pointed out the ample cause for optimism, saying: “By early June, we should then have everyone roughly in place -- and that will allow us to establish the density in partnership with Iraqi security forces that you need to really get a good grip on the security situation.”
You can paint that turd any way you please.
You have had 4 years to beat down 2000 illiterate insurgents with Aks and you have failed.
So share your article, write a song about it, maybe give your buddy a tugaround. Then, when you're done and you feel better about yourself, go do you fcking job. thanks in advance
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You have had 4 years to beat down 2000 illiterate insurgents with Aks and you have failed.
That's because the insurgents know what they're fighting for and our kids don't.
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You can paint that turd any way you please.
You have had 4 years to beat down 2000 illiterate insurgents with Aks and you have failed.
So share your article, write a song about it, maybe give your buddy a tugaround. Then, when you're done and you feel better about yourself, go do you fcking job. thanks in advance
right, cause the insurgents fight us face to face. Shut up idiot
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right, cause the insurgents fight us face to face. Shut up idiot
And they have more than "AKs." ::)
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Liar! Link please. :D
Beach please. You're a grown man.
No one's calling anyone a liar. But who would accept anything as fact because it's posted on a message board by a stranger? How can you expect anyone to even discuss anything if you don't provide a link so people can read more and formulate an opinion. ::)
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right, cause the insurgents fight us face to face. Shut up idiot
How many men DIED in your arms for Bush's lies MM?
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right, cause the insurgents fight us face to face. Shut up idiot
They do. but don't we have a slight advantage in
- air supremacy
- satellite everything
- our team running the country
- 200 mil a day to spend
- a 130,000 to 2,000 man ratio
- superior training, logistical support, etc
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How many men DIED in your arms for Bush's lies MM?
Enigma - sorry to bug you, but I find you to be a contrast to MM69 this board needs.
At what point did you realize the war in Iraq was based on lies? And what changed your mind from being pro-Bush to anti.?
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Beach please. You're a grown man.
No one's calling anyone a liar. But who would accept anything as fact because it's posted on a message board by a stranger? How can you expect anyone to even discuss anything if you don't provide a link so people can read more and formulate an opinion. ::)
That's debatable. Just ask my kids. ;D
C'mon Deedee. Lighten up. I was joking.
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Enigma - sorry to bug you, but I find you to be a contrast to MM69 this board needs.
At what point did you realize the war in Iraq was based on lies? And what changed your mind from being pro-Bush to anti.?
By summer of 2004, myself and MANY C.O.'s (Commanding officers) were beginning to question ourselves about the war and it's REAL purpose.
Many top level brass believe Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld are TOTALLY clueless and LIARS.
Opinions in the Military are swept under the rug......period.
Honestly, it felt like a war with NO DIRECTION..........just death. Kids, women, old men and women. Horrible.
Being a lifelong republican, it was difficult to turn away from "my party", but one must confront the truth in his or her own mind, and ask "what the fvck are we doing here" ?
I'm now totally convinced that "Bloodbath" Bush lacks the level of intelligence necessary to be President.
BTW....at the same time Bloodbath was touting the WMD crap.....OUR military was using DU rounds. (depleted uranium) Nuclear rounds w/ a "half life" of approx. 3 billion yrs.
IMO.........Bush, Cheney and Co. are evil and used 9-11 as an excuse to invade Iraq for it's plentiful oil. Bin Laden was never really persued...........just more lies.
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They do. but don't we have a slight advantage in
- air supremacy
- satellite everything
- our team running the country
- 200 mil a day to spend
- a 130,000 to 2,000 man ratio
- superior training, logistical support, etc
sure if we were allowed to use it. We try to use our air superiority but if one civilian dies you guys want the pilot hung the next day.
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sure if we were allowed to use it. We try to use our air superiority but if one civilian dies you guys want the pilot hung the next day.
Dear Mr. Air Force,
This made up war CANNOT be won from the Air. YOU wouldn't understand this concept since your Air Force. Ha Ha Ha Ha
Why not join the Navy MM69, and get even further away from the REAL action??????
MM69= Zero war credibility.
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Dear Mr. Air Force,
This made up war CANNOT be won from the Air. YOU wouldn't understand this concept since your Air Force. Ha Ha Ha Ha
Why not join the Navy MM69, and get even further away from the REAL action??????
MM69= Zero war credibility.
Think as you want Enigma.......I wish the Air Force didn't have to come on Army convoys to cover for Army shortages...I wish that as an Air Force engineer I didn't have to leave the base to pick up Army engineering slack........But well...they have people like you
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Think as you want Enigma.......I wish the Air Force didn't have to come on Army convoys to cover for Army shortages...I wish that as an Air Force engineer I didn't have to leave the base to pick up Army engineering slack........But well...they have people like you
Thank God they have people like me saving lives.......while you sit on you AF ass and tell the world how great Bloodbath Bush is and how wonderful the war is going.
MM69= Zero war credibility.
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mm69 has been in the military for what, 10 years now? He has stated he supports waterboarding and using nukes in Iraq to stop those 2000 insurgents our 130,000 men couldn't kill in 4 years.
He has his role - puppet, tool, whatever you want to call it. He's a low grade subject and his purpose is to parrot official line and never question anything.
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mm69 has been in the military for what, 10 years now? He has stated he supports waterboarding and using nukes in Iraq to stop those 2000 insurgents our 130,000 men couldn't kill in 4 years.
He has his role - puppet, tool, whatever you want to call it. He's a low grade subject and his purpose is to parrot official line and never question anything.
the usual factless slandering of 240...it never ends
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mm69 has been in the military for what, 10 years now? He has stated he supports waterboarding and using nukes in Iraq to stop those 2000 insurgents our 130,000 men couldn't kill in 4 years.
He has his role - puppet, tool, whatever you want to call it. He's a low grade subject and his purpose is to parrot official line and never question anything.
240....ignore MM69, he knows NOTHING.
Trust me......he is a Chickenhawk.
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240....ignore MM69, he knows NOTHING.
Trust me......he is a Chickenhawk.
Don't worry...240 ignores everyone that doesn't say the same thing he says. He is to weak minded to hear both sides and be able to make his own decisions so he ignores the oposition. He was also to weak to serve his country. I give him credit though. He obviously wouldn't ask anyone to do anything he wasn't willing to do himself.
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240....ignore MM69, he knows NOTHING.
Trust me......he is a Chickenhawk.
how long you been in enigma?
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Don't worry...240 ignores everyone that doesn't say the same thing he says. He is to weak minded to hear both sides and be able to make his own decisions so he ignores the oposition. He was also to weak to serve his country. I give him credit though. He obviously wouldn't ask anyone to do anything he wasn't willing to do himself.
LOL @ calling me weak-minded. I'll debate any event or topic for hours here, and I give you evidence and cites.
You say broad idiotic things like "polls are useless" and "bush lying about anything is nonsense".
honestly if we were in a room, with a crowd, I would straight fucking embarass you point by point until you would either swing on me out of frustration or you'd wake the fck up to the bullshit you'ev been fed.
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how long you been in enigma?
Too long!! Active duty for approx 10 yrs..........In real life, I'm a surgeon.
Never thought I'd be back "in the mix". Shit happens......we MUST respond.
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LOL @ calling me weak-minded. I'll debate any event or topic for hours here, and I give you evidence and cites.
You say broad idiotic things like "polls are useless" and "bush lying about anything is nonsense".
honestly if we were in a room, with a crowd, I would straight fucking embarass you point by point until you would either swing on me out of frustration or you'd wake the fck up to the bullshit you'ev been fed.
LOL right....you can run "evidence" and "cites" at me all day, to bad you dont' use credible ones!! lol Polls are useless and I showed you like a dozen reasons they can be misleading...what was your response "oh yeah right"......and if you value polls so much why do you discredit polls that don't agree with your opinion case in point...
1. Poll shows 51% of iraqis are happier since the war..your response "sure with a gun to their head"
2. Poll says congress approval rating lower than Bush's...never saw you mention that one in your posts
3. You discount the FACT that 30,000 war supporters showed up as opposed to 10,000 war protesters and say it doesn't mean anything......Need I go on?
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LOL right....you can run "evidence" and "cites" at me all day, to bad you dont' use credible ones!! lol Polls are useless and I showed you like a dozen reasons they can be misleading...what was your response "oh yeah right"......and if you value polls so much why do you discredit polls that don't agree with your opinion case in point...
1. Poll shows 51% of iraqis are happier since the war..your response "sure with a gun to their head"
2. Poll says congress approval rating lower than Bush's...never saw you mention that one in your posts
3. You discount the FACT that 30,000 war supporters showed up as opposed to 10,000 war protesters and say it doesn't mean anything......Need I go on?
I'll let you guys argue.......I have a Surg. procedure shortly.
Have a great day!!!
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Thats great the libs love when the military guys fight among themselves....Yeah we all know the war is fucked up but giving some of the left wing losers on this board ammuntion is to much..behave yourselves boys... :P
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Thats great the libs love when the military guys fight among themselves....Yeah we all know the war is fucked up but giving some of the left wing losers on this board ammuntion is to much..behave yourselves boys... :P
In reading most everyone's post here, i might be wrong, but i only see 2 true libs on this board regarding politics: Jag and Rib.
So i don't know dude.
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In reading most everyone's post here, i might be wrong, but i only see 2 true libs on this board regarding politics: Jag and Rib.
So i don't know dude.
240 maybe and Beserker but yes I would agree otherwise
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240 has a few lib ideas or more he doesn't trust the current repubs..at this point u can't blame him. Berserk has some as well but there are only a few who qualify as libs i guess. Most just don't trust the current administration. They won't trust the next one either.
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240 has a few lib ideas or more he doesn't trust the current repubs..at this point u can't blame him. Berserk has some as well but there are only a few who qualify as libs i guess. Most just don't trust the current administration. They won't trust the next one either.
I'm a repub/conservative on most domestic issues. And I understand the need for the US to take Iraqi oil so that CHI/RUS cannot. I actually support the US agenda to control mid east resources because I believe economically and globally, it's very necessary.
I disagree with blowing up buildings #1-7 to justify it. I disagree with the domestic controls of the patriot act (designed as a control mechanism to stop public rebellion should 911 ever come out). I disagree with Haliburton's fraud and exploitation. I disagree with our men patrolling Iraqi cities when both the UN, and Iraqi govt, have offered.
When people call me a lib, I laugh. Half of them voted for Clinton and half of them support something they don't understand. Stupid people making blanket stupid statements. And above all, I hate those pussy repubs who don't have the moral spine to admit the real reasons we have 130,000 men in that country.
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I'm a repub/conservative on most domestic issues. And I understand the need for the US to take Iraqi oil so that CHI/RUS cannot. I actually support the US agenda to control mid east resources because I believe economically and globally, it's very necessary.
I disagree with blowing up buildings #1-7 to justify it. I disagree with the domestic controls of the patriot act (designed as a control mechanism to stop public rebellion should 911 ever come out). I disagree with Haliburton's fraud and exploitation. I disagree with our men patrolling Iraqi cities when both the UN, and Iraqi govt, have offered.
When people call me a lib, I laugh. Half of them voted for Clinton and half of them support something they don't understand. Stupid people making blanket stupid statements. And above all, I hate those pussy repubs who don't have the moral spine to admit the real reasons we have 130,000 men in that country.
We repubs know the real reason we are in Iraq....and it isn't solely oil
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We repubs know the real reason we are in Iraq....and it isn't solely oil
So you admit oil was a part of it?
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So you admit oil was a part of it?
I never said it wasn't. You say it is the SOLE reason
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I never said it wasn't. You say it is the SOLE reason
Oh, sweet gravy, no.
We wanted saddam out.
We wanted to export capitalism and democracy.
We wanted to create new strategic alliances over there.
But the point here, is that is even ONE PERCENT of the reason we attacked Iraq was OIL, then a huge problem emerges: You are fighting a war to - partly - take a resource from another nation which isn't yours.
I just want you to admit it... Admit you are shooting people and part of the reason is because you want to take the oil they own. Can you admit that?
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Oh, sweet gravy, no.
We wanted saddam out.
We wanted to export capitalism and democracy.
We wanted to create new strategic alliances over there.
But the point here, is that is even ONE PERCENT of the reason we attacked Iraq was OIL, then a huge problem emerges: You are fighting a war to - partly - take a resource from another nation which isn't yours.
I just want you to admit it... Admit you are shooting people and part of the reason is because you want to take the oil they own. Can you admit that?
I never said we were stealing the oil, we are helping Iraq to preserve being able to do buisness with them
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In reading most everyone's post here, i might be wrong, but i only see 2 true libs on this board regarding politics: Jag and Rib.
So i don't know dude.
>:(
I'm a commie pinko too!
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>:(
I'm a commie pinko too!
;D sorry forgot ya!
Your posts usually make too much sense to be either liberal or conservative ;)
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I never said we were stealing the oil, we are helping Iraq to preserve being able to do buisness with them
Damn. Now that's some serious spin.
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I never said we were stealing the oil, we are helping Iraq to preserve being able to do buisness with them
Documents show the US is setting the oil prices we will buy for. Ribo posted them.
Think about that.
You're shooting people, partly because you want to tell them what price you'll pay for their oil.
If I punch you in the eye and tell you I'll give you $50 for your truck, is that stealing? Yes.
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;D sorry forgot ya!
Your post usually make too much sense to be either liberal or conservative ;)
:).
What do Americans call themselves when their views are splat in the middle between dem and repub?
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:).
What do Americans call themselves when their views are splat in the middle between dem and repub?
Well i try and call myself a moderate. There are things i like and dislike about both ideologies. Some call themselves a independent.
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Well i try and call myself a moderate. There are things i like and dislike about both ideologies. Some call themselves a independent.
Independent sounds a little lonely. I like moderate, although usually refer to myself as a semi-dem.
Have really grown fond of the moniker commie pinko though... reminds me of women in "dungarees" and checkered shirts.
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:).
What do Americans call themselves when their views are splat in the middle between dem and repub?
Confused?
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Confused?
Or you could say: "not subject to the extreme unrealistic views of either ideology"
Or "confused" would do I guess. ;D
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Or you could say: "not subject to the extreme unrealistic views of either ideology"
Or "confused" would do I guess. ;D
Either one works. :) I think many people believe the views they disagree with are unreasonable.
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Either one works. :) I think many people believe the views they disagree with are unreasonable.
you could also say "practical"
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you could also say "practical"
Maybe. I don't believe people who don't belong to a particular political party or strictly adhere to a particular philosophy are necessarily practical or reasonable. They might be confused. Might be practical. Might be uninterested. Might value their independence.
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Maybe. I don't believe people who don't belong to a particular political party or strictly adhere to a particular philosophy are necessarily practical or reasonable. They might be confused. Might be practical. Might be uninterested. Might value their independence.
Or, as most ordinary people will say when confronted with how they wold vote, democrat or republican: "Depends on the issue"
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Or, as most ordinary people will say when confronted with how they wold vote, democrat or republican: "Depends on the issue"
You're assuming most ordinary people do not consider themselves Democrat or Republican. I know lots of people who vote for their party.
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Independent sounds a little lonely. I like moderate, although usually refer to myself as a semi-dem.
Have really grown fond of the moniker commie pinko though... reminds me of women in "dungarees" and checkered shirts.
The one thing that I think defines an independent (my preferred term) or moderate is an unwillingness to either believe or spew party line rhetoric. Look at this board for example, are there not posters on here that will defend their parties view no matter what? Even in the face of overwhelming evidence? I'm not singling anyone out because both Democrats and Republicans do it. The current Republican Administration is just such a disgrace that the conservatives are the ones showing it the most right now but when there is a Democratic Administration in the White House the Liberals will be doing the same thing.
To me it makes more sense to vote by your opinion of individual politicians than it does to vote by party lines. It's the same with political views, why not look at each issue independently rather than simply following what a party line says?
I would bet if everyone did that the majority of people would find that they're fiscal conservatives and socially liberal.
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You're assuming most ordinary people do not consider themselves Democrat or Republican. I know lots of people who vote for their party.
Well, did most of the eligible voters vote in the last election?
I don't know for sure, but i think it wasn't the majority of them.
I'm sure most people consider themselves one of the other, but i think a great many of them, most, will vote based on the issue and not out of party loyalty.
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The one thing that I think defines an independent (my preferred term) or moderate is an unwillingness to either believe or spew party line rhetoric. Look at this board for example, are there not posters on here that will defend their parties view no matter what? Even in the face of overwhelming evidence? I'm not singling anyone out because both Democrats and Republicans do it. The current Republican Administration is just such a disgrace that the conservatives are the ones showing it the most right now but when there is a Democratic Administration in the White House the Liberals will be doing the same thing.
To me it makes more sense to vote by your opinion of individual politicians than it does to vote by party lines. It's the same with political views, why not look at each issue independently rather than simply following what a party line says?
I would bet if everyone did that the majority of people would find that they're fiscal conservatives and socially liberal.
I wouldn't be surprised by that.
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Well, did most of the eligible voters vote in the last election?
I don't know for sure, but i think it wasn't the majority of them.
I'm sure most people consider themselves one of the other, but i think a great many of them, most, will vote based on the issue and not out of party loyalty.
I don't remember the numbers, but we have one of the worst voter turnouts in the industrialized world. It's pathetic.
If we're talking about the people who actually vote, I think the vast majority of them are solid party voters, probably 40 percent each. That middle approximately 20 percent are the ones who really control the elections. (I am making assumptions.)
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That middle approximately 20 percent are the ones who really control the elections. (I am making assumptions.)
you're pretty close. something like the same 10% of people have decided every election for decades. They voted for reagan, then clinton, then split in 2000 and 2004.
the 40% right and the 40% left don't do anything but argue on message boards trying to convince the middle 20% their party is slightly less evil.
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you're pretty close. something like the same 10% of people have decided every election for decades. They voted for reagan, then clinton, then split in 2000 and 2004.
the 40% right and the 40% left don't do anything but argue on message boards trying to convince the middle 20% their party is slightly less evil.
I pretty much agree. That's why I voted for Clinton twice and Bush twice. I have the power. :) It's still early, but I will likely vote for a Republican this election too.
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you're pretty close. something like the same 10% of people have decided every election for decades. They voted for reagan, then clinton, then split in 2000 and 2004.
the 40% right and the 40% left don't do anything but argue on message boards trying to convince the middle 20% their party is slightly less evil.
LMAO!
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The one thing that I think defines an independent (my preferred term) or moderate is an unwillingness to either believe or spew party line rhetoric. Look at this board for example, are there not posters on here that will defend their parties view no matter what? Even in the face of overwhelming evidence? I'm not singling anyone out because both Democrats and Republicans do it. The current Republican Administration is just such a disgrace that the conservatives are the ones showing it the most right now but when there is a Democratic Administration in the White House the Liberals will be doing the same thing.
To me it makes more sense to vote by your opinion of individual politicians than it does to vote by party lines. It's the same with political views, why not look at each issue independently rather than simply following what a party line says?
I would bet if everyone did that the majority of people would find that they're fiscal conservatives and socially liberal.
I'm inclined to agree with you... there are many people here who start off their posts with an insult directed toward the other party before they've even thought out the point they want to make. Others force party associations when the issue being discussed has nothing to with anything but common sense, or sometimes, common decency. Two party systems tend to polarize people... although, occasionally it is amusing to note just how closely some people fit the stereotypes associated with either party.
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I pretty much agree. That's why I voted for Clinton twice and Bush twice. I have the power. :) It's still early, but I will likely vote for a Republican this election too.
I'm up in the air. I want to see corruption end. mcCain has aligned himself to be the next haliburton puppet. The others have not. I don't want corporations running the nation anther 4 years.
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Documents show the US is setting the oil prices we will buy for. Ribo posted them.
Think about that.
You're shooting people, partly because you want to tell them what price you'll pay for their oil.
If I punch you in the eye and tell you I'll give you $50 for your truck, is that stealing? Yes.
well considering if Saddam was still in power all the money would be in his pocket I think we have a little right to be able to set a price
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well considering if Saddam was still in power all the money would be in his pocket I think we have a little right to be able to set a price
And shouldn't we the people be benefiting from that?
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And shouldn't we the people be benefiting from that?
No shit!!! I don't get that part
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well considering if Saddam was still in power all the money would be in his pocket I think we have a little right to be able to set a price
It's nice to see everyone having an intelligent conversation w/o insults.
Great job guys....and girls!!
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No shit!!! I don't get that part
Okay.
1) You admit we're benefitting from it?
2) Are you admitting we are getting oil for less-than-market value?
3) Are you agreeing with it?
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Okay.
1) You admit we're benefitting from it?
2) Are you admitting we are getting oil for less-than-market value?
3) Are you agreeing with it?
I don't know if we are getting it less than market value, The prices are awful high if we are. But like I said, the money we give them for oil now will be shared amongst the 3 sects. Before only one person got it. We are the reason they are getting it so why can't we dictate the price?
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I don't know if we are getting it less than market value, The prices are awful high if we are. But like I said, the money we give them for oil now will be shared amongst the 3 sects. Before only one person got it. We are the reason they are getting it so why can't we dictate the price?
To tell a soverign nation at what price they will sell oil to you is stealing.
Try that in real life. Walk into Walmart and tell them you'll take this basket of groceries and you'll pay them $5 for all of it. After all, you kept the place safe while you were there. You SHOULD be able to set the price, right?
Nope. It's stealing. Sooner you admit that, sooner you will admit to yourself that *part* of the reason we're there is to steal oil.
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To tell a soverign nation at what price they will sell oil to you is stealing.
Try that in real life. Walk into Walmart and tell them you'll take this basket of groceries and you'll pay them $5 for all of it. After all, you kept the place safe while you were there. You SHOULD be able to set the price, right?
Nope. It's stealing. Sooner you admit that, sooner you will admit to yourself that *part* of the reason we're there is to steal oil.
What is walmart was being held up by a bunch of robbers, they had hostages and what not...I go in and save them and save the store...You think they might give me a discount?
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What is walmart was being held up by a bunch of robbers, they had hostages and what not...I go in and save them and save the store...You think they might give me a discount?
If they OFFERED you a discount, that's splendid.
But if they didn't offer - and you INSISTED on paying $5 for those groceries at gunpoint - would that be stealing?
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What is walmart was being held up by a bunch of robbers, they had hostages and what not...I go in and save them and save the store...You think they might give me a discount?
See - they WANT to sell it at market price!
We won't let them. They have to sell it to us at a far lower price. So they lose money.
If you don't see forced discounts as stealing, I don't know what to tell ya.
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See - they WANT to sell it at market price!
We won't let them. They have to sell it to us at a far lower price. So they lose money.
If you don't see forced discounts as stealing, I don't know what to tell ya.
What do have that says we are FORCING them, You don't think they are willing to sell it to us cheaper out of thanks?
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What do have that says we are FORCING them, You don't think they are willing to sell it to us cheaper out of thanks?
oh.
my.
god.
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oh.
my.
god.
serious, if Maliki hates us so bad why doesn't he just say "fuck you get your oil somewhere else" I mean there is no way he is happy to just be getting some money.......as opposed to Saddam getting it all.
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serious, if Maliki hates us so bad why doesn't he just say "fuck you get your oil somewhere else" I mean there is no way he is happy to just be getting some money.......as opposed to Saddam getting it all.
what do you think would happen if tomorrow morning, maliki woke up and said:
1) Please leave, USA
2) We will no longer sell you oil at a discount
?
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what do you think would happen if tomorrow morning, maliki woke up and said:
1) Please leave, USA
2) We will no longer sell you oil at a discount
?
lol, so we are turning to conjecture again. Why do you always turn to this when I show that you can't back what you say... priceless
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lol, so we are turning to conjecture again. Why do you always turn to this when I show that you can't back what you say... priceless
I don't that it's is all conjecture. Look at the situation. America set this up. American gave him power. There are 130k plus troops in his country. You think we are going to do all that just to let him tell us to go get screwed? I think we learned from Castro.
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I don't that it's is all conjecture. Look at the situation. America set this up. American gave him power. There are 130k plus troops in his country. You think we are going to do all that just to let him tell us to go get screwed? I think we learned from Castro.
So we would overthrow Maliki if he told us no more oil?
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So we would overthrow Maliki if he told us no more oil?
He won't.
He's either paid off well enough not to ever try it. and or we have enough leverage on him to prevent him from doing so.
It's a very violent place in Baghdad sometimes isn't? People are getting killed and kidnapped all the time. Even high level government officials.
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He won't.
He's either paid off well enough not to ever try it. and or we have enough leverage on him to prevent him from doing so.
It's a very violent place in Baghdad sometimes isn't? People are getting killed and kidnapped all the time. Even high level government officials.
ah who knows, I don't think we are really bullying the iraqis inot lower oil prices
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ah who knows, I don't think we are really bullying the iraqis inot lower oil prices
Then why are they selling it below market value? That doesn't make any sense. none what so ever. business is business.
Maybe we are talking in a vacuum here.
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Then why are they selling it below market value? That doesn't make any sense. none what so ever. business is business.
Maybe we are talking in a vacuum here.
I still think they might look at it as repayment....not everyone is as greedy as americans. I remember in New Orleans a few weeks after Katrina. There was a unit from Maine staying in NO. They were a search and rescue unit with dogs. They came home from work and the hotel said they didn't have a room anymore because the state of Maine hadn't sent the next payment. So they team went back to Maine. You would have thought that NO residents and buisnessmen would have footed the bill since these people were there to help. I think maybe in Iraq, they realize that there is a huge price to pay for their freedom and they are paying it by selling oil for cheaper. I know you guys want to believe that America is a bully but maybe it could be the other way this time?
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I still think they might look at it as repayment....not everyone is as greedy as americans. I remember in New Orleans a few weeks after Katrina. There was a unit from Maine staying in NO. They were a search and rescue unit with dogs. They came home from work and the hotel said they didn't have a room anymore because the state of Maine hadn't sent the next payment. So they team went back to Maine. You would have thought that NO residents and buisnessmen would have footed the bill since these people were there to help. I think maybe in Iraq, they realize that there is a huge price to pay for their freedom and they are paying it by selling oil for cheaper. I know you guys want to believe that America is a bully but maybe it could be the other way this time?
Well, then who's getting it? Who's getting this money? Exxon? Haliburton? shouldn't it be paying the price tag of their freedom? (410 billion and counting) That's why it doesn't make sense to me. If they were doing something like that wouldn't they make it public? that would be BIG time PR mileage they could get.
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here's the problem.
mm69 believes that iraq is losing money by selling the oil to the US at a discount because:
they want to. they feel they owe it to us. They want to repay the kindness.
240 believes that they are doing it against their own will. That whether specific or implied, the leaders know their ability to lead depends upon us getting the hookup. They don't like it, and they'd much rather make billions more selling it at market value. But we won't let them.
Currently, we have nothing but history and common sense to back up our beliefs, as maliki hasn't committed suicide by come fwd and demanded we leave.
Historically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
Common sensically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
But, if it makes you feel good to think that as you shoot and plunder for their oil, you run with that theory.
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here's the problem.
mm69 believes that iraq is losing money by selling the oil to the US at a discount because:
they want to. they feel they owe it to us. They want to repay the kindness.
240 believes that they are doing it against their own will. That whether specific or implied, the leaders know their ability to lead depends upon us getting the hookup. They don't like it, and they'd much rather make billions more selling it at market value. But we won't let them.
Currently, we have nothing but history and common sense to back up our beliefs, as maliki hasn't committed suicide by come fwd and demanded we leave.
Historically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
Common sensically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
But, if it makes you feel good to think that as you shoot and plunder for their oil, you run with that theory.
How much under market value are we buying this oil?
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How much under market value are we buying this oil?
Ribo, do you have the link?
Whether it's 1% of 99% less than market value, the moral dilemma is the same.
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Well, then who's getting it? Who's getting this money? Exxon? Haliburton? shouldn't it be paying the price tag of their freedom? (410 billion and counting) That's why it doesn't make sense to me. If they were doing something like that wouldn't they make it public? that would be BIG time PR mileage they could get.
I agree I don't know where the savings are
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here's the problem.
mm69 believes that iraq is losing money by selling the oil to the US at a discount because:
they want to. they feel they owe it to us. They want to repay the kindness.
240 believes that they are doing it against their own will. That whether specific or implied, the leaders know their ability to lead depends upon us getting the hookup. They don't like it, and they'd much rather make billions more selling it at market value. But we won't let them.
Currently, we have nothing but history and common sense to back up our beliefs, as maliki hasn't committed suicide by come fwd and demanded we leave.
Historically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
Common sensically - NO country sells oil cheaper than value because it feels good.
But, if it makes you feel good to think that as you shoot and plunder for their oil, you run with that theory.
just out of curiosity, what did we pay Kuwait for oil after the first gulf war...was it market value? That is the only other "historical" time when we have liberated an oil rich country. I know you wouldn't make a statement without having researched it like maybe your "who controls the guard" comment?
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just out of curiosity, what did we pay Kuwait for oil after the first gulf war...was it market value? That is the only other "historical" time when we have liberated an oil rich country. I know you wouldn't make a statement without having researched it like maybe your "who controls the guard" comment?
I don't know. But since you asked, I assume you know.
What is the answer?
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I don't know. But since you asked, I assume you know.
What is the answer?
I know you aren't an english major, but when someone says "was it market value?"... the question mark usually is a signal that it is a question...it's not called a statement mark
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I know you aren't an english major, but when someone says "was it market value?"... the question mark usually is a signal that it is a question...it's not called a statement mark
So you don't know either?
And are you using the answer to a question that neither of us know, to strengthen your position?
Jesus, dude. A debate team teacher would bounce your ass from the room, right about now.
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So we would overthrow Maliki if he told us no more oil?
Maliki is our stooge......we put him in power.
In 1982 Maliki and his Shia army tried to murder Saddam, the attempt failed, but Maliki was able to FLEE Iraq before being caught.
Fast foward to 2003........we invade Iraq on lies of WMD's and mushroom clouds in America.
We capture Saddam and GUESS who comes out of hiding in Syria to be APPOINTED P.M. of Iraq???
Wow.......I wonder how that happened???
A republican 4 life.
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So you don't know either?
And are you using the answer to a question that neither of us know, to strengthen your position?
Jesus, dude. A debate team teacher would bounce your ass from the room, right about now.
I must have gotten that trick from you and Cardio...so it is ok for you to use a scenario that you don't know the answer to so you can strengthen your position, but when I turn the same scenario on you it is a trick???
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I must have gotten that trick from you and Cardio...so it is ok for you to use a scenario that you don't know the answer to so you can strengthen your position, but when I turn the same scenario on you it is a trick???
mm, can you please tell us one time in history that a nation gave another nation reduced oil because they just wanted to show them love?
Pathetic. this one backfired on you. You're almost obsolete here dude.
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mm, can you please tell us one time in history that a nation gave another nation reduced oil because they just wanted to show them love?
Pathetic. this one backfired on you. You're almost obsolete here dude.
Since there has only been one other oil rich nation that we have liberated can you show us that they didn't?
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Since there has only been one other oil rich nation that we have liberated can you show us that they didn't?
I asked you for evidence.
Your evidence is that I can't prove a negative?
You are seriously saying "you can't prove they didn't do this before"
Also, are you sure Kuwait was the only oil nation we've liberated? ;)
Damn you are looking like a middle schooler getting facefucked by a college professor now, chump.
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I asked you for evidence.
Your evidence is that I can't prove a negative?
You are seriously saying "you can't prove they didn't do this before"
Also, are you sure Kuwait was the only oil nation we've liberated? ;)
Damn you are looking like a middle schooler getting facefucked by a college professor now, chump.
wait wait,,,,,you made the original statement, and I am the one with the burden of proof? Ok smart guy which other oil rich nation did we liberate?
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wait wait,,,,,you made the original statement, and I am the one with the burden of proof? Ok smart guy which other oil rich nation did we liberate?
you wanna move to a 3rd argument after the second two stalled, huh? ;)
i don't like to call other grown men names, I really don't. But you're starting to deserve it.
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you wanna move to a 3rd argument after the second two stalled, huh? ;)
i don't like to call other grown men names, I really don't. But you're starting to deserve it.
You brought up the 3rd argument fool.LOL I'll go back to the first. In order to make a "strong" argument, you cite history as proof that no country sells oil cheap. I mean like you always say your "debate history" is always backed up with sources...don't say shit like that and then not be able to provide sources