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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Old_Rooster on May 02, 2007, 01:44:19 PM
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OH MY!
Pulling U.S. forces from Iraq could trigger catastrophe, CNN analysts and other observers warn, affecting not just Iraq but its neighbors in the Middle East, with far-reaching global implications.
Sectarian violence could erupt on a scale never seen before in Iraq if coalition troops leave before Iraq's security forces are ready. Supporters of al Qaeda could develop an international hub of terror from which to threaten the West. And the likely civil war could draw countries like Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Iran into a broader conflict.
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A rapid withdrawal of all U.S. troops would hurt America's image and hand al Qaeda and other terror groups a propaganda victory that the United States is only a "paper tiger," CNN terrorism analyst Peter Bergen said.
"It would also play into their strategy, which is to create a mini-state somewhere in the Middle East where they can reorganize along the lines of what they did in Afghanistan in the late '90s," Bergen told CNN.com.
It was in Afghanistan where Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda allied with the Taliban, and were allowed to run terror bases and plan the September 11, 2001 attacks against the United States.
Bergen says it is imperative that the United States not let that happen in Iraq.
"What we must prevent is central/western Iraq [from] becoming a Sunni militant state that threatens our interests directly as an international terror hub," he said.
Don Shepperd, a retired Air Force major-general and military analyst for CNN, agreed that Sunni Muslim fighters who support al Qaeda would seek an enclave inside a lawless Iraq likely riven along sectarian lines into Shiite, Sunni and Kurdish regions.
There would be "increasing attempts by terrorists to establish a training sanctuary in Iraq," Shepperd said.
That's one of the reasons why a fast withdrawal will not happen, whatever the politicians say, the analysts predict.
"Everyone wants the troops home -- the Iraqis, the U.S., the world -- but no one wants a precipitous withdrawal that produces a civil war, a bloodbath, nor a wider war in an unstable Mideast," Shepperd said, adding that the image of the United States was important too.
"And we do not want a U.S that is perceived as having been badly defeated in the global war on terror or as an unreliable future ally or coalition partner."
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OH MY!
Pulling U.S. forces from Iraq could trigger catastrophe, CNN analysts and other observers warn, affecting not just Iraq but its neighbors in the Middle East, with far-reaching global implications.
Sectarian violence could erupt on a scale never seen before in Iraq if coalition troops leave before Iraq's security forces are ready. Supporters of al Qaeda could develop an international hub of terror from which to threaten the West. And the likely civil war could draw countries like Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Iran into a broader conflict.
and whose fault is this?
saddam looking better every day eh...
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Shepperd said Iraq's neighbors would be drawn into the all-out civil war likely if U.S. forces left too quickly. Iran could move in to further strengthen its influence in southern Iraq; Turkey likely would move against the Kurds in the north; and Saudi Arabia would be inclined to take action to protect Sunnis in western Iraq, he said.
The oil sector could also get hit hard, with Iran potentially mining the Persian Gulf and attempting to close the Straits of Hormuz, putting a stranglehold on oil flow, Shepperd says.
"Oil prices would skyrocket," he said -- perhaps soaring from current prices of about $60 a barrel to more than $100 a barrel, with consequent rises at the gas pump.
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A rapid withdrawal of all U.S. troops would hurt America's image
2 late..
if and when you DO travel to ..well anywhere..say you r canadian.. :)
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and whose fault is this?
saddam looking better every day eh...
NOPE. FInishing the job looks better every day.
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What I haven't seen on here is how people think these CNN correspondents saying we can not leave will hurt the Democrats in "08 (if at all). We all know how the public is influenced by the media's opinion. How will it affect Democrats if they keep saying we have to leave, but the media says we have to stay. This could be one of the biggest stories heading into the election.
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NOPE. FInishing the job looks better every day.
That sounds nice.
But given the lack of any quantifiable achieved objectives, but very well documented death and money costs - Tell us why "finishing the job" looks better today than it did one year ago.
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"peachy keen"
:)
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NOPE. FInishing the job looks better every day.
Care to explain exactly what job you're referring to?
Four years in and Iraq isn't remotely close to being a functioning self sustaining democracy. Perhaps in another 10 years they'll actually have a viable police force.
The whole war is one giant clusterfuck without rhyme or reason and certainly without a coherent plan.
And when exactly are gas prices going to come down instead of continually rising. Gas is currently $3.00 a gallon for 87 octane here. If our oil companies are buying at a discounted price when if ever is that going to trickle down to the consumer?
Gas prices have risen about $.30 a gallon here in the last month or so.
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Care to explain exactly what job you're referring to?
Four years in and Iraq isn't remotely close to being a functioning self sustaining democracy. Perhaps in another 10 years they'll actually have a viable police force.
The whole war is one giant clusterfuck without rhyme or reason and certainly without a coherent plan.
And when exactly are gas prices going to come down instead of continually rising. Gas is currently $3.00 a gallon for 87 octane here. If our oil companies are buying at a discounted price when if ever is that going to trickle down to the consumer?
Gas prices have risen about $.30 a gallon here in the last month or so.
worried only about yourself. pity son. Us republicans can afford the gas hike!
And with that, time to blow these pythons up !
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NOPE. FInishing the job looks better every day.
soo ya think buish will finish the job before he leaves?
orrr hand over the headache to the next prez?
o btw..define "finishing the job" will ya :)
thanx
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soo ya think buish will finish the job before he leaves?
orrr hand over the headache to the next prez?
o btw..define "finishing the job" will ya :)
thanx
Was a "job" ever started?
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It's funny - Rooster repeated the same old standard line "Finish the job" and said it sounds better than ever - yet even after being quizzed by 4 getbiggers, he cannot put into words why.
Rooster, speak on this. Stop with the tired lines. When will this war be won?
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worried only about yourself. pity son. Us republicans can afford the gas hike!
And with that, time to blow these pythons up !
Excellent post.
I thank you for the well reasoned and well thought out response.
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LOL @ "Peachy King"
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Was a "job" ever started?
Just a snow job. :-\
We faired much better under Clinton with just a blow job. :D
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It's funny - Rooster repeated the same old standard line "Finish the job" and said it sounds better than ever - yet even after being quizzed by 4 getbiggers, he cannot put into words why.
Rooster, speak on this. Stop with the tired lines. When will this war be won?
I trust that you are asking "when" in jest 240 because you know no war is fought with a end date. However I think tonight I might research the wars that were enterd into in which the end date was known going in. Somthing interesting I found out was that a couple wars conviently ended when a presidents term was up:
WWII ended in 1945 FDR's last year
Korea ended in 53, Truman's last year
Will Iraq be the third one to end in the presiden't last year?
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Will Iraq be the third one to end in the presiden't last year?
The Pentagon already announced that Oct 2008 we will "win" and remove troops. The oil pipeline construction will coincidentally finish that month too. Coincidence?
This will give the dems the "victory" of pulling out, right about the time that Iraq turns to chaos for a period of time, which will coincidentally be the Nov 2008 elections. Nice, huh?
So pipeline built, we leave iraq, Dems left powerless and looking guilty for Iraqi chaos - all as Bush leaves office. LOL... it's almost comical how he's pwning everyone. The repubs are by no means stupid. They know the score. There will be slaughter in nov 2008 in Iraq, and dems will get all the blame. I betcha.
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And, if people are stupid enough to vote repub in 2008 because of an Iraqi mess in Nov 2008, what's next?
Following that will be the Rudy/Romney ticket, taking over in 2008 and leading the war against iran.
it's a series of conquests for oil, plain and simple.
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The Pentagon already announced that Oct 2008 we will "win" and remove troops. The oil pipeline construction will coincidentally finish that month too. Coincidence?
This will give the dems the "victory" of pulling out, right about the time that Iraq turns to chaos for a period of time, which will coincidentally be the Nov 2008 elections. Nice, huh?
So pipeline built, we leave iraq, Dems left powerless and looking guilty for Iraqi chaos - all as Bush leaves office. LOL... it's almost comical how he's pwning everyone. The repubs are by no means stupid. They know the score. There will be slaughter in nov 2008 in Iraq, and dems will get all the blame. I betcha.
Clinton warned the Dems before he left the WH about Bush not being a fool.
They didn't listen.
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And, if people are stupid enough to vote repub in 2008 because of an Iraqi mess in Nov 2008, what's next?
Following that will be the Rudy/Romney ticket, taking over in 2008 and leading the war against iran.
it's a series of conquests for oil, plain and simple.
It's more than oil, 240.
Iraq is a strategic foothold in the Middle East.
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It's more than oil, 240.
Iraq is a strategic foothold in the Middle East.
yeah i know. 20 permanent bases in Iraq in a perfect line along the pipeline route, facing indochina for any future conflict, plus ability to hit anything over there quickly. I know it's in the best interest of the US, so I don't disagree with the war anymore. It's funny though, how they're gonna blame the chaos on the dems, and people will be dumb enough to blame them.
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The Pentagon already announced that Oct 2008 we will "win" and remove troops. The oil pipeline construction will coincidentally finish that month too. Coincidence?
This will give the dems the "victory" of pulling out, right about the time that Iraq turns to chaos for a period of time, which will coincidentally be the Nov 2008 elections. Nice, huh?
So pipeline built, we leave iraq, Dems left powerless and looking guilty for Iraqi chaos - all as Bush leaves office. LOL... it's almost comical how he's pwning everyone. The repubs are by no means stupid. They know the score. There will be slaughter in nov 2008 in Iraq, and dems will get all the blame. I betcha.
If I had a bigger attention span (I hate searching the internet) I would really be interested in how WWII and Korea got wrapped up in those final years of FRD and Truman. Was it screaming along and then come to a halt? Or was it dying down naturally and just coincidence that they ended when they did.
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It's funny - Rooster repeated the same old standard line "Finish the job" and said it sounds better than ever - yet even after being quizzed by 4 getbiggers, he cannot put into words why.
Rooster, speak on this. Stop with the tired lines. When will this war be won?
I've said numerous times dude that perhaps this war was a mistake but now that we are there, how the fuck do you think we can just leave? The entire middle east will go up in flames. Fuck, I don't have the damn answer to how to win, you don't have the answer to how to correctly lose either. All I know is we can't at this point just fucking walk out, if we do the result of that will be a lot worse than continuing to fight on.
As much as I can't tell you how to win, you can't tell me how to lose either.
Stalemate. But we can't just vanish......and you know it.
Then again, i'm not the prez, so i don't make that decision, I have to trust my leaders.
And thank god you ain't in charge of anything either.
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I've said numerous times dude that perhaps this war was a mistake but now that we are there, how the fuck do you think we can just leave? The entire middle east will go up in flames. Fuck, I don't have the damn answer to how to win, you don't have the answer to how to correctly lose either. All I know is we can't at this point just fucking walk out, if we do the result of that will be a lot worse than continuing to fight on.
As much as I can't tell you how to win, you can't tell me how to lose either.
Stalemate. But we can't just vanish......and you know it.
Then again, i'm not the prez, so i don't make that decision, I have to trust my leaders.
And thank god you ain't in charge of anything either.
So far I have to say on most political issues I agree with what you say. All those who constantly question and oppose what we are doing are not helping to get anything done there or here rather they are nothing more then arm chair QB's.
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The war wasn't a mistake, if you look at it from longterm US energy and global position needs. It is going exactly according to plan. It takes 5 years to put in an oil processing system. We're in there just over 4 years now ;)
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The war wasn't a mistake, if you look at it from longterm US energy and global position needs. It is going exactly according to plan. It takes 5 years to put in an oil processing system. We're in there just over 4 years now ;)
I think you are correct. Think about it a moment. Is the Bush administration really as incompetent as it appears?
Or is the Bush administration just implementing national security/big business objectives while skirting (sometimes breaking) the law and simultaneously feeding the US citizenry a steady line of flag-waving, bible thumping and starry-eyed dreaming of democratizing the world.
The US is in Iraq to stay. We may scale back the troops but the bases have been built and the business interests are vested.
How can a president claim progress in battling terrorists when: worldwide terrorism has grown exponentially on his watch, US soldiers are dying as fast as they can be 'surged' into Iraq...the US illegally attacked a Iraq w/ no substantive ties Al Qaeda and which posed no threat, Iraq has devolved into civil war which the US is now policing?
He can't.
Either that is incompetence or we are right on schedule.
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there is progress - in our military strategic positioning, and energy resource procurement, goals.
we don't hear about it obviously, and the last time someone brought it up on the air (Dennis Kuscinich on MSNBC's Tucker a few months back), he suddenly developed "microphone issues" and they had to end the segment.
So yeah, it's taboo to talk about. I think that's because once Joe Bible learns he supports a war for theft, he's gonna pull support because it conflicts his religious beliefs. With the war teetering in public support, you lsoe the bible folks, and you're down to 10% approval rating.
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OH MY!
Pulling U.S. forces from Iraq could trigger catastrophe, CNN analysts and other observers warn, affecting not just Iraq but its neighbors in the Middle East, with far-reaching global implications.
I say we stay indefinitely.........jus t send more bodybags.
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About the whole "what about all the dead soldiers" and stuff like that, well putting in the matter that it's the government who decides they are there and not the commanders. Having said that I was talking to a few former service men from my gym, one has been a cop since he got out the other in the FBI for a while now somewhat retired. They said to me if they were a general over there they would be very happy with the way our military is doing, casualties are really not that high at all and for the most part we are keeping the area much much safer then it would be without our presence. Fuck what the media says and all that bullshit, these guys and friends of theirs still serving may not really want to be there (for political reasons or just for the sake of being away from home) but they feel very confident that they are in control of this and got things on lockdown there. It's now just waiting for the Iraqi security force to get built up and fully trained so they can train their own people.
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It's now just waiting for the Iraqi security force to get built up and fully trained so they can train their own people.
Didn't you hear the news that we are indefinitely suspending the training programs for Iraqi security forces and assuming that role?
Berserker, do you have the link you posted last week?
Bill Mauer made a huge deal about it - said it was essentially making it so they'll NEVER be able to take over.
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Didn't you hear the news that we are indefinitely suspending the training programs for Iraqi security forces and assuming that role?
Berserker, do you have the link you posted last week?
Bill Mauer made a huge deal about it - said it was essentially making it so they'll NEVER be able to take over.
Nah I didn't hear about that but either way the more of them we train the less of us that need to be there. I think the main goal here now is to just lower the levels of us there over the next few years, we may leave a decent number around since it is a "hot" spot.
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I say we stay indefinitely.........jus t send more bodybags.
You know, if we just start rounding up illegal immigrants and ship them to Iraq to fight for us we'll quickly take care of our illegal immigration problems. ;D
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You know, if we just start rounding up illegal immigrants and ship them to Iraq to fight for us we'll quickly take care of our illegal immigration problems. ;D
They'll impregnate Iraqi women, chug coronas and rebuild Baghdad, all for 6 bucks an hour.
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I trust that you are asking "when" in jest 240 because you know no war is fought with a end date. However I think tonight I might research the wars that were enterd into in which the end date was known going in. Somthing interesting I found out was that a couple wars conviently ended when a presidents term was up:
WWII ended in 1945 FDR's last year
Korea ended in 53, Truman's last year
Will Iraq be the third one to end in the presiden't last year?
Just more standard drivel from egj13.
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What I haven't seen on here is how people think these CNN correspondents saying we can not leave will hurt the Democrats in "08 (if at all). We all know how the public is influenced by the media's opinion. How will it affect Democrats if they keep saying we have to leave, but the media says we have to stay. This could be one of the biggest stories heading into the election.
egj.....how does it feel to be associated with the 28% Americans who still believe in Bloodbath Bush?