Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: Monster_Everything on May 29, 2007, 01:31:53 PM
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Or give out bad 'advices' to your children ??
dicuss bizatches..
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I rarely drink milk anymore.
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No milk,milk is for babies...men drink beer.
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Milk is the best food around for building mass.
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Drink malk, it's much better for you.
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I give the wrong advices.
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Milk is garbage unless it's raw milk.
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I usually will have a 1 scoop protein, 1 cup skim milk w/ sugary cereal, and some other carb source pwo. Contrary to popular belief, casein shows clinically superior results than whey pwo.
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Pasteurization exposes milk to very high temperatures. This exposure renders the milk’s amino acids, vitamins, calcium and many other minerals/trace minerals virtually useless and unavailable to the body. There is now also evidence that the heating process alters the milk sugar (lactose) making it more available to the body, suggesting the strong link between avid processed milk drinkers and diabetes.
Finally, pasteurization destroys all of milk’s natural enzymes. These enzymes were there originally to help the body assimilate all of the vitamins, minerals and nutrients previously mentioned, including calcium. This is the reason why you can drink all the processed milk you want and not only still develop osteoporosis but perhaps encourage it!
Homogenization is no help either. This is the process that forces fat particles through tiny strainers under great pressure so as to make them small enough that they remain suspended and thus, do not rise to the top. Because homogenized fats are much more susceptible to rancidity and oxidation, they have recently been linked to heart disease. Homogenization has also been found to cause incomplete protein digestion in the small intestine, leading to milk allergy and intolerance.
The same can be said for virtually all processed dairy products (i.e., cheese, yogurt, butter, cream, etc.). Many of them are packed with other chemicals such as emulsifiers, extenders, phosphates and hydrogenated oils and should be completely avoided as well. If you eat dairy, eat it organic and/or raw or not at all.
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Pasteurization exposes milk to very high temperatures. This exposure renders the milk’s amino acids, vitamins, calcium and many other minerals/trace minerals virtually useless and unavailable to the body. There is now also evidence that the heating process alters the milk sugar (lactose) making it more available to the body, suggesting the strong link between avid processed milk drinkers and diabetes.
Finally, pasteurization destroys all of milk’s natural enzymes. These enzymes were there originally to help the body assimilate all of the vitamins, minerals and nutrients previously mentioned, including calcium. This is the reason why you can drink all the processed milk you want and not only still develop osteoporosis but perhaps encourage it!
Homogenization is no help either. This is the process that forces fat particles through tiny strainers under great pressure so as to make them small enough that they remain suspended and thus, do not rise to the top. Because homogenized fats are much more susceptible to rancidity and oxidation, they have recently been linked to heart disease. Homogenization has also been found to cause incomplete protein digestion in the small intestine, leading to milk allergy and intolerance.
The same can be said for virtually all processed dairy products (i.e., cheese, yogurt, butter, cream, etc.). Many of them are packed with other chemicals such as emulsifiers, extenders, phosphates and hydrogenated oils and should be completely avoided as well. If you eat dairy, eat it organic and/or raw or not at all.
Where did you get this info from mate, I ask because i do drink about a 1/2 liter of slim milk a day with shakes etc. I'd be willing to go to water but I always thought I was getting more benefit from having the milk with it?
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Where did you get this info from mate, I ask because i do drink about a 1/2 liter of slim milk a day with shakes etc. I'd be willing to go to water but I always thought I was getting more benefit from having the milk with it?
You can go to:
www.mercola.com
www.realmilk.com
Read: The Untold Story of Milk by Ron Schmid
or
Milk the Deadly Poison by Robert Cohen
The pasteurization process also:
* Promotes rancidity of unsaturated fatty acids.
* Destroys vitamins. Vitamin C loss is usually more than 50%, while the loss of other water soluble vitamins can be as high as 80%, and Vitamin B12 is totally destroyed.
* Reduces availability of minerals such as Ca, Cl, Mg, P, K, Na and S.
* May alter lactose, making it more readily absorbable (aiding in lactose intolerance).
* Puts unnecessary strain on the pancreas to produce digestive enzymes, which may be why milk consumption has been linked to diabetes.
* Destroys all enzymes, making Ca from milk difficult to absorb.
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I usually will have a 1 scoop protein, 1 cup skim milk w/ sugary cereal, and some other carb source pwo. Contrary to popular belief, casein shows clinically superior results than whey pwo.
Things you should consider in light of the frequent use of casein in protein powder and protein bar supplements are:
* Some people are allergic to casein, which is one of the most difficult proteins for the body to digest.
* Butter and cream contain little lactose or casein.
* Fermented or soured butter and cream are easier to digest.
* Casein has also been found to act as an enzyme inhibitor.
There was an article published on www.mercola.com (Discover Magazine 8/00 by Dr. T. Colin Campbell) that expressed some concerns regarding casein consumption. Campbell conducted a series of experiments at Cornell University and Virginia Tech that found rats given a brief initial exposure to aflatoxin, a carcinogen produced by mold growth, tended to develop liver cancer when fed casein, the main protein in milk. “We could turn on or turn off the cancer growth by increasing or decreasing the amount of casein.” Campbell also did research by feeding casein to rats (15-20% of their diet - by weight - from casein). He found that the threshold amount of casein required for switching on tumor growth averaged around 10% of the diet.
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Cheers D I'm gona have a bit of a look at those sites :).
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Pasteurization exposes milk to very high temperatures. This exposure renders the milk’s amino acids, vitamins, calcium and many other minerals/trace minerals virtually useless and unavailable to the body. There is now also evidence that the heating process alters the milk sugar (lactose) making it more available to the body, suggesting the strong link between avid processed milk drinkers and diabetes.
Finally, pasteurization destroys all of milk’s natural enzymes. These enzymes were there originally to help the body assimilate all of the vitamins, minerals and nutrients previously mentioned, including calcium. This is the reason why you can drink all the processed milk you want and not only still develop osteoporosis but perhaps encourage it!
Homogenization is no help either. This is the process that forces fat particles through tiny strainers under great pressure so as to make them small enough that they remain suspended and thus, do not rise to the top. Because homogenized fats are much more susceptible to rancidity and oxidation, they have recently been linked to heart disease. Homogenization has also been found to cause incomplete protein digestion in the small intestine, leading to milk allergy and intolerance.
The same can be said for virtually all processed dairy products (i.e., cheese, yogurt, butter, cream, etc.). Many of them are packed with other chemicals such as emulsifiers, extenders, phosphates and hydrogenated oils and should be completely avoided as well. If you eat dairy, eat it organic and/or raw or not at all.
So, is organic milk not pasteurized or homogenized, or does it just mean that it's produced without synthetic chemicals, hormones or antibiotics?
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So, is organic milk not pasteurized or homogenized, or does it just mean that it's produced without synthetic chemicals, hormones or antibiotics?
It " supposedly" means it's made without any chemicals, hormones and antibiotics but it is still pasteurized. Anything sold in stores; dairy or juice must be pasteurized.
http://www.mercola.com/blog/2005/nov/10/any_difference_between_organic_pasteurized_milk
In California, you can get Raw Milk and Raw Milk products in the store.
Horizon was just busted for false practices:
http://v.mercola.com/blogs/public_blog/The-Deception-Behind--quot-Organic-quot--Milk-9444.aspx
To find raw milk in your area, look here:
http://www.realmilk.com/where1.html
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Milk/Dairy has no place for human consumption, milk is designed for baby cows, mothers milk is designed for humans. There's a reason too that we are weened at toddler years. It gave us what we needed, antibodies from infection, fatty acids for brain and eye development, and calories and other nutrients to make us grow. Dairy also causes an abundance of mucous in GI tract.
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I've heard go things about Soy Milk, but I've never tried it
does it taste good?
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I've heard go things about Soy Milk, but I've never tried it
does it taste good?
I like it. It is lower in sugar and calories than milk and has more protein.
I've also heard that sunlight destroys a lot of the nutrients hence why you should only buy it in the cardboard or solid plastic (non-see through) containers.
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I like it. It is lower in sugar and calories than milk and has more protein.
I've also heard that sunlight destroys a lot of the nutrients hence why you should only buy it in the cardboard or solid plastic (non-see through) containers.
cool
so THAT'S why the milk i bought the other day had the big "Sunproof container" text on it, i was wondering what that meant
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I've heard go things about Soy Milk, but I've never tried it
does it taste good?
I know I am going to get a lot of slack about this but
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!! DO NOT EAT SOY!!
I CAN NOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH HOW BAD IT IS FOR YOU!!
SOY IS NOT HEALTHY FOR YOU!!!!
IT'S THE MOST MARKETED " HEALTH" PRODUCT OUT THERE!!
It is loaded with phyto-estrogens which is an estrogen hormone. It's a trypsin inhibitor, meaning it prevents protein to be broken down in your body. Soy foods can cause deficiencies in calcium and vitamin D.The isoflavones are phyto-endocrine disrupters. At dietary levels, they can prevent ovulation and stimulate the growth of cancer cells. Eating as little as 30 grams (about 4 tablespoons) of soy per day can result in hypothyroidism with symptoms of lethargy, constipation, weight gain and fatigue.
I can go on about this but if you need info, PM me or ask me here.
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Milk/Dairy has no place for human consumption, milk is designed for baby cows, mothers milk is designed for humans. There's a reason too that we are weened at toddler years. It gave us what we needed, antibodies from infection, fatty acids for brain and eye development, and calories and other nutrients to make us grow. Dairy also causes an abundance of mucous in GI tract.
Well said.
It only causes musous if it's pasteurized though, which everyone is drinking by the way.
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I know I am going to get a lot of slack about this but
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!! DO NOT EAT SOY!!
I CAN NOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH HOW BAD IT IS FOR YOU!!
SOY IS NOT HEALTHY FOR YOU!!!!
IT'S THE MOST MARKETED " HEALTH" PRODUCT OUT THERE!!
It is loaded with phyto-estrogens which is an estrogen hormone. It's a trypsin inhibitor, meaning it prevents protein to be broken down in your body. Soy foods can cause deficiencies in calcium and vitamin D.The isoflavones are phyto-endocrine disrupters. At dietary levels, they can prevent ovulation and stimulate the growth of cancer cells. Eating as little as 30 grams (about 4 tablespoons) of soy per day can result in hypothyroidism with symptoms of lethargy, constipation, weight gain and fatigue.
I can go on about this but if you need info, PM me or ask me here.
whoa. PM sent
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I discovered I was allergic to Soy,,,,had to be rushed to hospital because throat was closing up...scary scary shit, I drank 8 oz...next thing my throat starts itching real bad. drank water, itching getting worse, more water, breathing is funny, more water, nose starts flaring due to lungs working overtime, Ambulance picks me up at my work (embarrassing as shit). I totally stay away from any nut milks, rice milk, etc. If I do have a craving for cereal I'll put Apple juice or white grape juice, although it goes better with shredded wheat than say trix or honey smacks.
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Dr. D. You said it's fine to drink Organi milk but isn't organic milk subjected to the same BS regular milk is? Wouldn't the bioavailability be zilch?
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Dr. D. You said it's fine to drink Organi milk but isn't organic milk subjected to the same BS regular milk is? Wouldn't the bioavailability be zilch?
I meant you should drink only Raw, Organic Milk...my error with the post.Thanks for pointing that out.
Yes, the bio-availibilty would be zilch now matter if you are drinking regular or organic milk that has been pasteurized.
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What are your thoughts about yoghurt and cottage cheese?
Personally i think milk isn't poison, but it isn't the best food you can eat either. I don't think anybody has proven a link between cancer and dairy in humans.
Furthermore adding dairy products helps to lose weight. The insulin intolerance, i believe there is just a low correlation.
Personally i think yoghurt (healthy bacteria) and cottage cheese (lot of protein, very handy) are still good options for bodybuilders. I think the lactose in that is mostly eaten by the bacteria cause they can be used by lactose intolerant people.
I don't really believe that dairy isn't a good protein source either. Whey has the best availability and casein is pretty good as well.
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What are your thoughts about yoghurt and cottage cheese?
Personally i think milk isn't poison, but it isn't the best food you can eat either. I don't think anybody has proven a link between cancer and dairy in humans.
Furthermore adding dairy products helps to lose weight. The insulin intolerance, i believe there is just a low correlation.
Personally i think yoghurt (healthy bacteria) and cottage cheese (lot of protein, very handy) are still good options for bodybuilders. I think the lactose in that is mostly eaten by the bacteria cause they can be used by lactose intolerant people.
I don't really believe that dairy isn't a good protein source either. Whey has the best availability and casein is pretty good as well.
Do you know anything about the history of whey? While most people don’t realize it, whey - until very recently - was considered a waste product by the dairy industry, and dairy farmers usually fed it to their pigs. It was only after having dumped untold millions of gallons of whey into rivers and even on roads that the cheese industry investigated making whey protein from the waste product. Through trial and error, milk derivatives such as butter, cream, ice cream, yogurt, keffir, buttermilk and many types of cheese have been made primarily from sheep, goats and cows to supplement the human diet. Most recently whey, a byproduct of cheese making, has resulted in the production of whey protein powders and bars.
The quality is only good as the source. If I gave you something that was loaded with chemicals and toxins, been cooked to death and denatured of all it's nutrients..what value would it add to you? You simply can’t make health giving, high quality whey products from sick cows!
Yogurt is great, yes, but again, is it raw or pasteurized? People that are so called "Lactose Intolerant" are really " Pasteurization Intolerant" because when you pasteurize milk, you kill the digestive enzyme, Lactase, that people need to help digest it.
Pasteurization means the milk is heated to kill potentially harmful bacteria,that is much as most people know but that’s about as far as their understanding goes. I wish it were that simple, but there is so much more to be concerned with in regard to pasteurization, and understanding the process is vital when choosing a whey protein product.
The pasteurization process involves heating milk for 30 seconds at 63º C (~145º F), for 15 seconds at 72º C (~162º F) or for one second at 89º C (192º F). Milk is declared pasteurized when the chemist finds no enzymes present in the milk!
Now, to really begin to get a sense of what it means to pasteurize a food such as milk or juice, you must define what an enzyme is. An enzyme is a complex protein produced by living cells that promotes a specific biochemical reaction by acting as a catalyst. An understanding of the pasteurization process is very important because by the very definition, pasteurization means the complete obliteration of enzymes. What does that mean to you and your choice of whey protein, you may wonder? Well, to begin with, by referring to the definition of an enzyme, enzymes are complex proteins; therefore, the pasteurization process can and does kill and damage proteins! Keep in mind that the more dead something is when you consume it, the more energy it takes your body to enliven it or make it transmutable to human tissue! In addition to killing all the enzymes or in essence removing life from the product, the pasteurization process has been shown to have the following effects on milk (which is the source of cheap industry whey protein powders and supplements):
* We are told pasteurization is a good thing, a method of protecting us from bacteria and disease, yet all outbreaks of salmonella from contaminated milk in recent decades (and there have been many) occurred in pasteurized milk. One example arose in Illinois during 1985 where 14,000 people were infected, and at least one death occurred.
* Raw milk contains lactic-acid producing bacteria that protect against pathogens, and pasteurization kills these helpful organisms. Therefore, pasteurized milk has no protective mechanism if undesirable bacteria contaminate the supply. Raw milk will turn sour, while pasteurized milk will putrefy (commonly referred to as rotten or soured milk). Do you know that pasteurized milk turns a dark gray and then add yellow dye#6 into it to make it white again?....sounds yummy!!!
* Heat alters amino acids in milk (lysine and tyrosine), making the whole complex of proteins less available.
* If you have a weak digestive systems, which is sadly very common today, pasteurized milk passes through, not fully digested, and can build up around the tiny villi of the small intestine, preventing absorption of nutrients and promoting uptake of toxic substances. The result is allergies, chronic fatigue and degenerative diseases.
* Chemicals such as synthetic vitamin supplements D2 (toxic and linked to heart disease) or D3 (hard to absorb) are commonly added during pasteurization of milk to suppress odor and restore taste.
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What does that mean to you and your choice of whey protein, you may wonder? Well, to begin with, by referring to the definition of an enzyme, enzymes are complex proteins; therefore, the pasteurization process can and does kill and damage proteins! Keep in mind that the more dead something is when you consume it, the more energy it takes your body to enliven it or make it transmutable to human tissue!
I was with you until you stated the above. The body's digestive process destroys complex proteins routinely. Ingested proteins (including enzymes) aren't just denatured but ripped apart so as to produce amino's, di- and tri-peptides for absorption into the blood.
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I know I am going to get a lot of slack about this but
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!! DO NOT EAT SOY!!
I CAN NOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH HOW BAD IT IS FOR YOU!!
SOY IS NOT HEALTHY FOR YOU!!!!
IT'S THE MOST MARKETED " HEALTH" PRODUCT OUT THERE!!
It is loaded with phyto-estrogens which is an estrogen hormone. It's a trypsin inhibitor, meaning it prevents protein to be broken down in your body. Soy foods can cause deficiencies in calcium and vitamin D.The isoflavones are phyto-endocrine disrupters. At dietary levels, they can prevent ovulation and stimulate the growth of cancer cells. Eating as little as 30 grams (about 4 tablespoons) of soy per day can result in hypothyroidism with symptoms of lethargy, constipation, weight gain and fatigue.
I can go on about this but if you need info, PM me or ask me here.
Yeah, PLUS, IT MAKES YOU A DIRTY STINKIN HIPPIE. And we all know what it means if you're a hippy. It means you SUCK.
And thats how it was.
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If milk seemed so bad...y did Arnold take it during his bodybuilding career especially during the off-season?
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I was with you until you stated the above. The body's digestive process destroys complex proteins routinely. Ingested proteins (including enzymes) aren't just denatured but ripped apart so as to produce amino's, di- and tri-peptides for absorption into the blood.
This is the best thing I read in this thread so far. Sorry folks but proteins are not destroyed or killed by pasteurization, they are denatured as mental-masurbator said. If proteins/amino acids were destroyed by pasteurization then we would all be suffer from Kwashakor/Marasmus due to protein malnutrition. Remember people our stomach is a highly acidic enviroment (pH 2) containing hydrochloric acid used to denature the proteins that we eat so that our bodies can actually use them for building enzymes, proteins, muscle, etc.
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When I travel, on flights I have started asking for 2% fat milk as my beverage. It is the only drink you can order with protein, particluarly important because you cannot take RTD shakes on a plane anymore.
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fat free organic milk is not bad for you in any way, its actually good for you to drink once in a while and is a good source of protein.
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When I travel, on flights I have started asking for 2% fat milk as my beverage. It is the only drink you can order with protein, particluarly important because you cannot take RTD shakes on a plane anymore.
maybe you can stick a baggie of whey in your pocket
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maybe you can stick a baggie of whey in your pocket
A bag of white powder, on a plane? uh uh no thank you, I don't want a 10 hour detention while security figures out what it is!
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A bag of white powder, on a plane? uh uh no thank you, I don't want a 10 hour detention while security figures out what it is!
oh my whey is brown
in any case, i guess you may as well just bring some whole foods
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oh my whey is brown
in any case, i guess you may as well just bring some whole foods
"oh my"???
my vanilla flavored whey is white, but I don't think security would care about the color- the point is powder and planes don't mix.
Good point on the whole foods, I travel with beef jerkey or turkey jerkey.
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"oh my"???
my vanilla flavored whey is white, but I don't think security would care about the color- the point is powder and planes don't mix.
Good point on the whole foods, I travel with beef jerkey or turkey jerkey.
forgot the comma
"oh, my whey is brown"
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Do you know that pasteurized milk turns a dark gray and then add yellow dye#6 into it to make it white again?....sounds yummy!!!
If this were the case, why is it not listed in the ingredients listed on the label?
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If this were the case, why is it not listed in the ingredients listed on the label?
Because it's called " GRAS" by the FDA....that means " General Regarded As Safe".
They don't have to put in on the label under this BS law.
Read about it here:
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/grasguid.html
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Because it's called " GRAS" by the FDA....that means " General Regarded As Safe".
They don't have to put in on the label under this BS law.
Read about it here:
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/grasguid.html
Interesting.
Both Vitamin A,D are on the list but listed as ingredients. Also I have found that most lables have artifical color listed if found in the food.
None the less, I guess the law says they do not have to be listed.
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Interesting.
Both Vitamin A,D are on the list but listed as ingredients. Also I have found that most lables have artifical color listed if found in the food.
None the less, I guess the law says they do not have to be listed.
Underneath the natural and artificial flavours, an abundance of chemicals are hidden. There is nothing illegal going on here. This is all within the law. Likewise with food labels, they too can include all these ingredients and place them under the umbrella term of ‘flavourings’. It’s really rather frightening.
The strawberry shake syrup in a Burger King Milkshake contains: corn syrup, water, high fructose corn syrup, citric acid, artificial flavour, sodium benzoate (preservative) and coloured with red #40. For a simple food like a milkshake, this list is nothing short of monumental. But if you take a closer look it contains the all too familiar ‘flavour’, both natural and artificial.
In his book Fast Food Nation, Eric Schlosser looks at the typical ingredients in a Burger King strawberry milkshake: amyl acetate, amyl butyrate, amyl valerate, anethol, anisyl formate, benzyl acetate, benzyl isobutyrate, butyric acid, cinnamyl isobutyrate, cinnamyl valerate, cognac essential oil, diacetyl, dipropyl ketone, ethyl acetate, ethyl amyl ketone, ethyl butyrate, ethyl cinnamate, ethyl heptanoate, ethyl heptylate, ethyl lactate, ethyl methylphenyl-glycidate, ethyl nitrate, ethyl propionate, ethyl valerate, heliotropin, hydroxyphenyl-2-butanone, a-ionone, isobutyl anthranilate, isobutyl butyrate, lemon essential oil, maltol, 4-methylacetophenone, methyl anthranilate, methyl benzoate, methyl cinnamate, methyl heptine carbonate, methyl naphthyl ketone, methyl salicylate, mint essential oil, neroli essential oil, nerolin, neryl isobutyrate, orris butter, phenethyl alcohol, rose, run ether, y-undercalctone, vanillin and solvent. These ingredients fall under the " GRAS Law" and doesn't have to be on the label because they say they are in such a small amounts that it won't harm anyone.... ::)
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In his book Fast Food Nation, Eric Schlosser
Is the movie of the same name based on that book?
The scene with Bruce Willis is chilling.
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Interesting.
Both Vitamin A,D are on the list but listed as ingredients. Also I have found that most lables have artifical color listed if found in the food.
None the less, I guess the law says they do not have to be listed.
If Milk is pasteurized all valuable enzymes and vitamins are destroyed (lactase for the assimilation of lactose; galactase for the assimilation of galactose; phosphatase for the assimilation of calcium).
Literally dozens of other precious enzymes are destroyed in the pasteurization process. Without them, milk is very difficult to digest. The human pancreas is not always able to produce these enzymes; over-stress of the pancreas can lead to diabetes and other diseases.
The butterfat of commercial milk is homogenized, subjecting it to rancidity. Even worse, butterfat may be removed altogether. Skim milk is sold as a health food, but the truth is that butter-fat is in milk for a reason.
Without it the body cannot absorb and utilize the vitamins and minerals in the water fraction of the milk. Along with valuable trace minerals and short chain fatty acids, butterfat is America's best source of preformed vitamin A.
Synthetic vitamin D, known to be toxic to the liver, is added to replace the natural vitamin D complex in butterfat. Butterfat also contains re-arranged acids which have strong anti-carcinogenic properties.
Non-fat dried milk is added to 1% and 2% milk. Unlike the cholesterol in fresh milk, which plays a variety of health promoting roles, the cholesterol in non-fat dried milk is oxidized and it is this rancid cholesterol that promotes heart disease.
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Dr D,
I have found that as the fat content of store-bought milk increases, so does my intestinal discomfort. :-[ So I don't seem to be lactose intolerant (since lactose is present in milk of varying fats?), but rather milk-fat intolerant. Am I reading my reaction correctly? Do you believe this is caused by pasteurization and wouldn't afflict me so much with raw milk?
Also, raw milk in Western Aus is required to be "filtered"
http://www.agric.wa.gov.au/servlet/page?_pageid=449&_dad=portal30&_schema=PORTAL30&p_start_url=/pls/portal30/docs/FOLDER/IKMP/AAP/DC/MILK/F03999.HTM
I assume this is different from homogenization?
At any rate, I'm going to do some looking around for raw milk and give it a shot. Thanks for your posts!
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Dr D,
I have found that as the fat content of store-bought milk increases, so does my intestinal discomfort. :-[ So I don't seem to be lactose intolerant (since lactose is present in milk of varying fats?), but rather milk-fat intolerant. Am I reading my reaction correctly? Do you believe this is caused by pasteurization and wouldn't afflict me so much with raw milk?
Also, raw milk in Western Aus is required to be "filtered"
http://www.agric.wa.gov.au/servlet/page?_pageid=449&_dad=portal30&_schema=PORTAL30&p_start_url=/pls/portal30/docs/FOLDER/IKMP/AAP/DC/MILK/F03999.HTM
I assume this is different from homogenization?
At any rate, I'm going to do some looking around for raw milk and give it a shot. Thanks for your posts!
you could be allergic to casein. I am unfortunately. All my clients who go with raw milk, never have any problems whatsoever.It's most likely you lack the enzymes for digestion. I would go with raw or none at all.
look here for milk in AUS.
http://www.realmilk.com/where-other.html#aus
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Unfortunately, there aren't any sources in Western Aus listed. I followed a link to a site which said:
Unlike many parts of Europe, the UK and USA, Real Milk is currently illegal to produce or sell in Australia. This website is dedicated to the campaign for the regulated production of Real Milk in Australia. :o
Some google searching has turned up some promising sources tho, so I'll give 'em a call tomorrow. Some full cream milk is gonna taste daaaamn good. :P So if all else fails, I'll ask the guy with dreads that I get MJ from every now and then, or just hijack a tanker like Mad Max. 8)
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My parents were hippies and I grew up drinking unpasteurized goats milk. I remember it had this pungent aroma. I wonder now if I derived health benefits from it later in life?
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I love me some whole milk. That's the one thing I find hard to give up. I like the full feeling I get from it and ti's loaded with good shit or so the food pyramid tells me! ;D It takes less of it to cook with and to add with cereals or shakes because of it's fat content.
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My parents were hippies and I grew up drinking unpasteurized goats milk. I remember it had this pungent aroma. I wonder now if I derived health benefits from it later in life?
I was drinking goat's milk from the farmer I get all my stuff from. The stuff was pungent but it was great for my stomach because the enzymes are more suited for humans than cow's milk. I would make my own shakes with goat's milk, raw peanut butter, coconut oil and a banana...still could taste pungency!!! :P
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I'm not tying to be a dick Dr. D but your sources are horrible. After looking for about 3 minutes i found that both of the books you recommended were written by Naturopathic Doctors (fake doctors). I'm sorry but I personally don't believe a thing you've written in this particular thread. Dr. Cohen apparently has taken a few courses at an unnamed college in long island and has worked in real estate. No where on Dr. Ron Schmid's website does it say that he attended ANY college. Everybody is always looking for a conspiracy but i do not believe MILK is one sorry. I am not doubting that raw milk has worked for you Dr. D but i'll keep on drinking my regular old milk until you can find a real doctor or real scientific proof of the claims you have made.
http://www.drrons.com/drrons-biography.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturopathic
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Dr. D, could you please react to copacetic's post, because im very curious to your response...
Peace
D
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I'm not tying to be a dick Dr. D but your sources are horrible. After looking for about 3 minutes i found that both of the books you recommended were written by Naturopathic Doctors (fake doctors). I'm sorry but I personally don't believe a thing you've written in this particular thread. Dr. Cohen apparently has taken a few courses at an unnamed college in long island and has worked in real estate. No where on Dr. Ron Schmid's website does it say that he attended ANY college. Everybody is always looking for a conspiracy but i do not believe MILK is one sorry. I am not doubting that raw milk has worked for you Dr. D but i'll keep on drinking my regular old milk until you can find a real doctor or real scientific proof of the claims you have made.
http://www.drrons.com/drrons-biography.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturopathic
How are Naturopathic Doctors fake? Oh because they didn't spend 8 years in school and getting a license to prescribe medications? That's small minded. You don't need to go to a college to get a Naturopathic education, there are schools for that alone to get certified.
I can go on an argue about the whole milk thing forever but obviously you won't believe any of it, so it is a waste of my time and energy.
If you want solid evidence , go find the research work of Dr. Weston A.Price ( he was an actual licensed doctor/ dentist and researcher in the 1930's) and his book, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration. There are a lot of big words in it but it does have pictures so you might understand it. Look for the research work of Dr. J. R. Crewe, of the Mayo Foundation, forerunner of the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, MN or Thomas Cowan M.D.. You can google plenty info on all this to find evidence,
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I never said that your post's were invalid. I just feel that your opinion should be stated as just that your opinion rather than true scientific evidence. You should not misrepresent yourself as a doctor and your sources as doctors when they are not. I personally do not know the effect of raw milk on lactose intolerant individuals and it is generally accepted that Pasteurization kills off some good bacteria and vitamins. However, unpasteurized milk can harbor harmful disease-causing bacteria such as tuberculosis, brucellosis, salmonella, diphtheria, and escherichia coli. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk). My problem with your statements is mostly "If you eat dairy, eat it organic and/or raw or not at all.". I personally believe that i get many good benefits from milk and can process it quite well the assertion that it is not doing me any good is just crazy. If you are of Northern European or Arab decent go ahead drink your milk its good for you otherwise you probably shouldn't because you are most likely lactose intolerant. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactose_intolerance). One final thing is "That's small minded. You don't need to go to a college to get a Naturopathic education, there are schools for that alone to get certified." this statement is utterly flawed what is stopping me from saying that my bedroom right here right now is a Naturopathic college and what is stopping me from handing out Naturopathic medical degrees right now. Nothing that is the problem with them. I'm not saying you shouldn't post i'm not saying what you say is invalid i just felt that the people who are reading what you said and taking it as true scientific fact should be informed that your sources suck. I will fade into obscurity now my muscles are puny.
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I never said that your post's were invalid. I just feel that your opinion should be stated as just that your opinion rather than true scientific evidence. You should not misrepresent yourself as a doctor and your sources as doctors when they are not. I personally do not know the effect of raw milk on lactose intolerant individuals and it is generally accepted that Pasteurization kills off some good bacteria and vitamins. However, unpasteurized milk can harbor harmful disease-causing bacteria such as tuberculosis, brucellosis, salmonella, diphtheria, and escherichia coli. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk). My problem with your statements is mostly "If you eat dairy, eat it organic and/or raw or not at all.". I personally believe that i get many good benefits from milk and can process it quite well the assertion that it is not doing me any good is just crazy. If you are of Northern European or Arab decent go ahead drink your milk its good for you otherwise you probably shouldn't because you are most likely lactose intolerant. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactose_intolerance). One final thing is "That's small minded. You don't need to go to a college to get a Naturopathic education, there are schools for that alone to get certified." this statement is utterly flawed what is stopping me from saying that my bedroom right here right now is a Naturopathic college and what is stopping me from handing out Naturopathic medical degrees right now. Nothing that is the problem with them. I'm not saying you shouldn't post i'm not saying what you say is invalid i just felt that the people who are reading what you said and taking it as true scientific fact should be informed that your sources suck. I will fade into obscurity now my muscles are puny.
First off,Dr. Ron Schmid, the author of " The Untold Story of Milk" is a graduate of MIT and the National College of Naturopathic Medicine.He has taught in all 4 American accredited naturopathic medical schools and served as the first Clinic Director and Chief Medical Officer at the University of Bridegport College of Naturopathic Medicine. Sounds pretty much like a certified doctor to me.
If the man doesn't want to post his credentials on his website, it's fine by me.I don't care what the person has at the end of their name, either be a MD, ND, or CA. I just gather the facts, do my research and come to my conclusions. If you truly feel that a licensed doctor has the final say, then you are heading for wall sooner or later. All my facts are based on scientific studies as well as other's people's research. I gave you 3 doctors who are true doctors who will back up the same claims on Raw Milk as I do. I have been drinking raw milk for 4 years and never once have I gotten sick or ill in anyway. There is many people in my area who drink it as well, again, I never heard of anyone getting sick. We have been drinking raw milk for centuries until we started pasteurizing it and most people can't tolerate it then.
I never gave you a person who misrepresents themselves, not even myself. I back my stuff up, have the literature, sources and data to confirm. Don't even try to debate this subject with me because you will get nowhere. Just ignore it and go on your way!!
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hell no! it's gotta have at least 1% fat in it. and no, children should get whole milk, no fat free shit!
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If he truly graduated from M.I.T please back that up with some sort of source please. The National College of Natural Medicine is alma mater to over 1500 alumni who practice in nearly every state and Canadian province as well as in many foreign countries. Over 50% of the licensed naturopathic physicians practicing in the United States are graduates of NCNM.(http://www.ncnm.edu/about/ncnm_history.php). This hardly gives me much faith in "naturopathic medicine". Some modalities used in naturopathy are controversial. Medical doctors often cite the large differences among naturopathic practitioners and the lack of scientific documentation of the safety and efficacy of their practices in order to justify limiting naturopathic scope. Skeptics label certain modalities of naturopathy as pseudoscience and criticise successful government legislation to license and accredit naturopaths and their organizations as giving those modalities unwarranted credibility.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturopathic_medicine). Raw milk works for you and thats great and i never disputed the fact that Raw milk may be better than good old Homogenized Pasteurized milk but there are risks associated with Raw milk that are not found in good old milk. I find your most recent attack on me with no sources(If you have valid sources please post them none of the sources you have posted so far have any scientific proof to back them up) prove that you are a bit of a bullshitter(i just think that there is NO WAY this guy graduated from M.I.T) You can continue to use sources that have no validity that is your choice but when you get cancer/A.I.D.S one day I'm willing to bet that you will go to a real doctor and not rely on naturopathy to save your life. I feel its important that someone point out that your sources suck and that you are not a real MD. You are misrepresenting yourself as a real doctor spouting real facts when you are in fact not. You are representing Dr. Ron Schmid as a real doctor when he is not. When asked for sources this is what you responded with not scientific proof you represented it as scientific proof and that is wrong. I'm just saying from now on think twice about what Dr. D says and realize that he is not a real doctor he is someone who believes in quackery. Oh by the way you gave me 2 real doctors both of whom died in the 1950's and wrote their articles in the 1930's.
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... find a real doctor...
FWIW :-\ most Drs. know jack about nutrition and supplements.
Okay... carry on ;)
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FWIW :-\ most Drs. know jack about nutrition and supplements.
Okay... carry on ;)
this isn't about nutrition and supplements this is about the fact that milk is surely digestible by those who are lactose tolerant we still produce lactase in our bodies and can easily digest the milk possibly not as well as raw milk true but that fact is backed by no science there is also no proof that organic is better and organic is usually not even really organic unfortunately Dr. D is on this forum representing himself as a real doctor and his sources as creditable even though they are not. Dr. D has made a number of sweeping assertions which are simply based in opinon.
Some modalities used in naturopathy are controversial. Medical doctors often cite the large differences among naturopathic practitioners and the lack of scientific documentation of the safety and efficacy of their practices in order to justify limiting naturopathic scope. Skeptics label certain modalities of naturopathy as pseudoscience and criticise successful government legislation to license and accredit naturopaths and their organizations as giving those modalities unwarranted credibility.[11] Advocates claim that naturopathic practitioners find it difficult to obtain financing for research due to the lack of prior research in many areas. Proponents state that this is slowly changing as naturopathic physicians develop research programs to help build up a foundation for evidence based treatment.
Conventional medicine is required to undergo rigorous scientific testing; drug trials often last for a decade. A criticism of alternative therapies is that they are not subject to detailed safety assessment. Advocates of naturopathy respond that many of their therapeutic interventions have been safely used for hundreds and in some cases thousands of years, claiming what is lost in formal study design is more than made up for by the breadth and depth of human experience with the interventions in question. Also of concern is the ambiguity of the word "natural" and poor agreement as to its meaning; 'natural' does not necessarily mean beneficial, or even benign.
Naturopathic modalities may be controversial (e.g. homeopathy), or have proven effectiveness only for very specific conditions (eg acupuncture, aromatherapy). Some naturopaths may use these modalities as panaceas or to improve the patient's quality of life, and some are known to be harmful to a patient rather than helpful. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturopathic_medicine)
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I love a good discussion about nutrition, so i'm not gettin inbetween you two, but try not to insult eachother and keep it civilised.
Peace
D
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Now now. Remember. Milk is babies, men drink beer!
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Now now. Remember. Milk is babies, men drink beer!
And ladies drink wine ;)
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FWIW :-\ most Drs. know jack about nutrition and supplements.
Okay... carry on ;)
no shit....but they sure know how to give you a pill to take care of EVERY problem
cuh cuh, perks like golf, free lunches, not to mention financial perks
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FWIW :-\ most Drs. know jack about nutrition and supplements.
Okay... carry on ;)
Agreed.
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Although I'm not expert on the matter, I would have to agree with Copacetic. I wouldn't take a doctor's advice on nutrition from the 1950's let alone the 1930's.