Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Livewire on July 20, 2007, 10:43:32 AM
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A nice look at the run of Olympia champs from Larry Scott, up to Arnold, then a nice descent since then to today's winners.
This "sport" peaked 30 years ago.
http://www.getanabolics.com/2007/07/jay-cutler-vs-ronnie-coleman.html
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I would say the sport peaked around 94' than it went to total shit with everyone trying to catch Ronnie and destroying their bodies in the process
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cool video...no disrespect to the other champions, but if I could have Larry's physique for the rest of my life...I could die happy. ;D
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IF i wasnt competing then i would want arnies physique, but competing i would want modern champoins
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A nice look at the run of Olympia champs from Larry Scott, up to Arnold, then a nice descent since then to today's winners.
This "sport" peaked 30 years ago.
http://www.getanabolics.com/2007/07/jay-cutler-vs-ronnie-coleman.html
from the looks of that video everything started to go strange from Dorian onwards...
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I agree -1994 was the beginning of the end..
things rebounded a bit following dorian's reign with Ronnie looking amazing in 98/99 (along with Cormeir) but then Ronnie did exactly what dorian did:
went for total size and ruined his look..
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As ZachG_85 has asked before, how the fuck else did you expect bodybuilding to evolve? The ironage delusion of pros of that era growing without their stomachs and waists growing proportionally is pure BS. It can't happen. Is there something about that someone is unclear on? Bodybuilding had two choices: go the path it did now, or not progress at all. There is NO other option.
PS - to Hulkster, show me how 287 pounds of shredded muscle could EVER look better than it did on Ronnie in 2003.
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-Roid stacks in the 60-70 were fine. The result looked great.
-Roids + GH in the 80s still looked good, the only difference from before was genetics. None of the top guys including Haney were genetically comparable overall to earlier BBs.
-Roids + GH + slin cocktail = unnatural frankenstein look. I give you "the keg". Thank you for the gh/slin look.
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PS - to Hulkster, show me how 287 pounds of shredded muscle could EVER look better than it did on Ronnie in 2003.
don't get me wrong - for the size that he was in 2003, ronnie looked unreal.
but his 99 form still had much more detail and a smaller waist that looked much better IMO.
lots of people on the internet think ronnie's 2003 form was his best ever...until you show them what he looked like in 1999 LOL
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The "sport" peaked with Arnold and died a death from the 1980's onwards when the public strted to realise steroids were involved. By then Arnold had gotten out of the game and moved on to acting.
There was a fitness "boom" in the eighties but strangely bodybuilding couldn't capitalise on it. Then into the 90's through Dorian's era and then Ronnie from 98 onwards, the sport became so freaky that only the hardcore fans remained loyal.
There were no "personalities" after Arnold and so the sport might have had a Mr Olympia, but no real figurehead - the Weiders are responsible for that - keeping too much of a stranglehold on the athletes.
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The "sport" peaked with Arnold and died a death from the 1980's onwards when the public strted to realise steroids were involved. By then Arnold had gotten out of the game and moved on to acting.
There was a fitness "boom" in the eighties but strangely bodybuilding couldn't capitalise on it. Then into the 90's through Dorian's era and then Ronnie from 98 onwards, the sport became so freaky that only the hardcore fans remained loyal.
There were no "personalities" after Arnold and so the sport might have had a Mr Olympia, but no real figurehead - the Weiders are responsible for that - keeping too much of a stranglehold on the athletes.
The sport could've been much more interesting and competitive after Schwarzenegger except for the behind the scenes hijinks that resulted in most of the top guys leaving or retiring around the beginning of the 80s. It wasn't all predicated on Arnold.
Some of those guys also had personalities, guys like Szkalak and Mentzer. They weren't around long enough or promoted well enough to develop that generation to the public as well as it could've been, hence the hodge-podge of winners in the late 70s with banal personas and so-so physiques from a historical perspective.
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haney was the last great mr o.
Haney was far too flawed to compare to a late-90s Coleman. Torso overpowering mediocre arms & legs, two-thirds of his physique, don't make a superstar. If he'd had good balance he'd have been great.
His problem wasn't the drug look of today, it was just genetics.
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haney was the last great mr o.
The Mr. Olympia should go back to awarding small waistlines like Haney's, but I don't think Haney was as overpowering as they made him out to be...I think Haney just had outstanding proportions...
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The Mr. Olympia should go back to awarding small waistlines like Haney's, but I don't think Haney was as overpowering as they made him out to be...I think Haney just had outstanding proportions...
His lack of balance was actually his biggest weakness. Nothing else compared to the torso, if it had then he'd have been great as claimed. Too many are fooled by the numbers of Olympias, when he never beat any superstars doing it.
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Compared to today's standards, Lee Haney just looks ordinary. He wasn't even that much far ahead of the competitors he competed against - they were all small guys like Labrada and Gaspari whose conditioning were just as good. Haney had to do a runner when Dorian appeared - he realised Dorain would take it to the next level.
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Dorian in 93 is the absolute pinnacle of bodybuilding perfection. Downhill ever since, the last 3 years being particularly dreadful.
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Bodybuilding surely has evolved...for the worse. :-[
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Cool vid, Ronnie lifts insane weight.
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LOok you morons, bbing had to evolve or it would have gotten boring and the sport would have died. And in bbing tradition bigger has always been better, you talk about arnold, scott, haney, and dorian as have very pleasing physiques, you need to remember that in there day they were the mass monsters. All those guys were the jay, and ronnie's of there day. The sport had to become better, it had to improve and size has always been the way it goes.
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matt C - Bodybuilding COULD have improved from 1994.
You take away gh and insulin.
Guys get more and more ripped.
Guys with better genes win.
Jason Cutler shouldn't be Mr Olympia. It should be a guy with the best genetics for shape.
Now, they give it to the BIGGEST guy - no matter how terrible his symmetry/shape is, or how soft he looks.
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Yeah, Dorian doesn't look good at all here.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=159945.0;attach=182503;image)
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[quoteNow, they give it to the BIGGEST guy - no matter how terrible his symmetry/shape is, or how soft he looks.][/quote]
and all that started with 94...
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It peaked with Lee Haney, him and his fellow competitors had no GH guts
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It peaked with Lee Haney, him and his fellow competitors had no GH guts
IMO it peaked with levrone or vince taylor, a little more advanced than haney with no guts.
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cool vid, this years O will be a good one!!!
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cool vid, this years O will be a good one!!!
no doubt. I honestly think they're gonna let the best man win it.
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well, if thats true, my congrats go out to Ronnie, who is soon to be a 9 time Mr. O. 8)
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well, if thats true, my congrats go out to Ronnie, who is soon to be a 9 time Mr. O. 8)
actaully he is soon to embarrass hismself further as being a bitter racist former mr olympia who didn't know when to quit.
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don't get me wrong - for the size that he was in 2003, ronnie looked unreal.
but his 99 form still had much more detail and a smaller waist that looked much better IMO.
lots of people on the internet think ronnie's 2003 form was his best ever...until you show them what he looked like in 1999 LOL
hulkster and his pathetic crusade with ronnie from 99.
everyone was around when ronnie won in 99 and it was just another olympia - nothing special.
i'm asked you at least 10 times to document ANYTHING from 99 or 2000 saying ronnie's form that year was the best ever.
you cant bc there is nothing.
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LOok you morons, bbing had to evolve or it would have gotten boring and the sport would have died. And in bbing tradition bigger has always been better, you talk about arnold, scott, haney, and dorian as have very pleasing physiques, you need to remember that in there day they were the mass monsters. All those guys were the jay, and ronnie's of there day. The sport had to become better, it had to improve and size has always been the way it goes.
Wrong. The sport is dying as we speak. The amount of drugs and pursuit for size is killing the sport imo
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Wrong. The sport is dying as we speak. The amount of drugs and pursuit for size is killing the sport imo
people have been saying that for decades.
but more people are bodybuilding than ever.
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these are the highlights:
'67 Oliva
'74 Arnold
'83 Bannout
'86 Haney
'93 Dorian
'98 Coleman
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the bottom line is that the "sport" needs to re-invente itself. The criteria for what a mr. o is today seems to be totally different than what it was 25 years ago. Lots of people wouldn't like it and I feel bad for a guy like Jay who busted his ass to give the judges what they want but award the guys who present a body that fits the original criteria..your melvins, your victors, dexters, etc.
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hulkster and his pathetic crusade with ronnie from 99.
everyone was around when ronnie won in 99 and it was just another olympia - nothing special.
i'm asked you at least 10 times to document ANYTHING from 99 or 2000 saying ronnie's form that year was the best ever.
you cant bc there is nothing.
you are very bitter that getbig thinks you are stupid, aren't you?
in case you have not noticed, many people feel that Ronnie in his 99 shape was unbeatable onstage.. ::)
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the bottom line is that the "sport" needs to re-invente itself. The criteria for what a mr. o is today seems to be totally different than what it was 25 years ago. Lots of people wouldn't like it and I feel bad for a guy like Jay who busted his ass to give the judges what they want but award the guys who present a body that fits the original criteria..your melvins, your victors, dexters, etc.
how can you give the trophy to a guy THIRTY POUNDS LIGHTER than coleman?
you cant.
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bodybuilding is interesting, yes. We're kinda conditioned to the guts and most of us don't mind em. I can imagine new fans might find them to be repulsive from minute one though. There aren't many people who would look at the swollen belly and say "I want to look like that".
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flex wheeler is the PEAK of bodybuilding in terms or shape, lines, symetry, and flow. he also was fucking MASSIVE, and had great conditioning. arguable one of the top 5 best conditioned pros of all time.
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Personaly i like the freaks of today though in saying that my favourite bodybuilder was Sergio Oliva.
The chemical enhanced freaks are unbelievable to look at they are disgusting yet i cannot take my eyes off them ;D
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people have been saying that for decades.
but more people are bodybuilding than ever.
Maybe more people are working out, but I dont know many people who consider themselves bodybuilders. The attendance at shows seems to be getting weaker.
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I agree with some of the others here who say the peak was in the 80's. That I think was the best combination of size and aesthetics. The 90's could have been the best if people like Levrone, Flex, and Shawn Ray actually won instead of Dorian who looked unbelievably poor in comparison; he was just a stack of bricks. Not to intentionally piss people off, but I think that Dorian is the worst Mr. O ever.
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I agree with some of the others here who say the peak was in the 80's. That I think was the best combination of size and aesthetics. The 90's could have been the best if people like Levrone, Flex, and Shawn Ray actually won instead of Dorian who looked unbelievably poor in comparison; he was just a stack of bricks. Not to intentionally piss people off, but I think that Dorian is the worst Mr. O ever.
Dorian might be the worst. Cutler might be the worst too.
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LOL cue Icecold on the defensive about dorian lol
ah... the minority opinion...hahahhaaha
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Yates + 90's buddies = required huge amount of drugs to achieve the look. Burned out like sugar flies.
Ron + Jay + Dex + Vic = use about half of what the Dorian regime used. That's why Ron is still around, that's why Jay is in for the long run and so is Vic.
Current Pros > 90's pros -therefore-> Better genetics.
So We're not regressing.
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Yates + 90's buddies = required huge amount of drugs to achieve the look. Burned out like sugar flies.
Ron + Jay + Dex + Vic = use about half of what the Dorian regime used. That's why Ron is still around, that's why Jay is in for the long run and so is Vic.
Current Pros > 90's pros -therefore-> Better genetics.
So We're not regressing.
Ron's still around because he started gear late. And Jay? He just turned 34 and he looks like he's 45.
Attendance says it all - and less people go to shows now.
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these are the highlights:
'67 Oliva
'74 Arnold
'83 Bannout
'86 Haney
'93 Dorian
'98 Coleman
'07 Freeman
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Not to intentionally piss people off, but I think that Dorian is the worst Mr. O ever.
in some of his post tear forms, he might be.
but he did look good in 93.
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The Reason the sport has suffered is simple. Arnold and Lee were both on the Presidental Council of Fitness and pushed fitness thru the governement. They provided the Governement people guide lines and information on general fitness. That is were your Boom came from - Once Dorian won the Olympia Title - he returned to Britain for 6 years -during that 6 years - not Flex, Shawn or Kevin or anyone stepped into those shoes to contiue what arnold and Lee did....
Once Ronnie won it was another 8 years of no involvment in educating the world on the science of bodybuilding and the princeiples. To Date I do not see Jay doing it either. So once we were the leaders now we are the circus freaks.
However - the United states has no guidance on fitness - Oprah , Dr. Phil and some people on over night TV are promoting products and providing the US the gudiance for staying in shape. Results - They are fatter than ever and more lost.
Take our sport back to a respective level - attend shows and share good information and let them know that bodybuilding is a science not just a freak show. Pros need to take responsability and stay in better shape year round. Judges need to stick to guidelines they set and judge for the man for the day. supplement companies need to sell supplements and stop trying to be agents.
Drugs will always be present and always was - simple - go to the doctor and get a perscription and then there is no problem - if not just bodybuild and diet and do cardio.
TRUE STORY
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It's all about preferences. Some guys look past the gut and care only about being the largest, freakiest person on stage. Other care about the most beautiful physique. You'll never find an answer everyone agrees with as its a subjective sport.
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Ron's still around because he started gear late.
he started "gear" late.... How do you know how "late" he started? Are you his best buddie?
And Jay? He just turned 34 and he looks like he's 45.
calling the "old looking" (getbig sheeps) every chance they get...
Attendance says it all - and less people go to shows now.
Not true. Last Arnold was a record attendance and so what the O before that.
Check out your facts bitch.
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Check out your facts bitch.
I'm better looking than you.
This is a fact.
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silvio needs to get some of the excess tissue from his face in the off season.
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silvio needs to get some of the excess tissue from his face in the off season.
Didn't seem to hurt him at the Europa.
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You take away gh and insulin.
Guys get more and more ripped.
This is FACT!
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I'm better looking than you.
This is a fact.
Prove it. ;D
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b37/alexgauthier23/IMAGE_00028.jpg)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b37/alexgauthier23/IMAGE_00010.jpg)
Plus my physique crushes you. I have it all.
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b37/alexgauthier23/FinalCountdown_Feb1.jpg)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b37/alexgauthier23/IMAGE_00007.jpg)
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LOok you morons, bbing had to evolve or it would have gotten boring and the sport would have died. And in bbing tradition bigger has always been better, you talk about arnold, scott, haney, and dorian as have very pleasing physiques, you need to remember that in there day they were the mass monsters. All those guys were the jay, and ronnie's of there day. The sport had to become better, it had to improve and size has always been the way it goes.
I completely disagree, all bodybuilding contests are supposed to be judged by who looks best on the day period. It was the judges who rewarded an overly freaky dorian, they didn't have to. There was absolutely no need to glorify mass at all costs and boy has it cost us! Bodybuilding was big in the 70's because of arnold, back then girls were attracted to guys with muscles. That's all changed and we get weirdos as pros BECAUSE there is no money and women go nowhere near bodybuilders THEREFORE the ones we do get are usually either gay or have mental problems. If the sport hadn't gotten too crazy with the drugs and rippedness, chicks would still be sort of into it and there would be a greater caliber of athletes out there. As is most people won't touch it. And this didn't have to happen, the competitors dont have to always get bigger! Just doesn't work that way. WHen dorian and nasser started the freak revolution they could have been shunned and we wouldnt even be having this conversation. The last 2 great bodybuilders were dennis newman and kevin levrone, nobody has come around that can touch either at his best since. They were handsome, marketable good bodybuilders and still attractive to women. GG bodybuilding.
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mike, you are correct.
They curbed the women getting too muscular, and started rewarding shape and lines. women stopped getting shredded.
if they curbed the guts, men would adapt to get prize money, and we'd see more aesthetics and less fridges up there.