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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Eldon on June 25, 2008, 05:02:34 AM
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"The truth is most American don't want much " - Michelle Obama
"someone is going to have to give up a piece of their pie, so someone else can have more " - Michelle Obama
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leave it to that stupid fuckhead to take her note on what is required for univeral health care to work and translate it into her supporting a complete redistrubution of wealth... ::) Jesus Glenn is a fucking retard. You didn't just post this and want us to take it serious? I guess the post office and highway systems and public school system and water systems etc are all communist systems we need to purge America of? ::) Gee, I just can't wait until every last aspect of our lives are subject to The Corporation ::) It'll be so much cheaper than paying tax money for a few basic resources... BWHAHAhahahaha!!! You're an idiot if you believe that. Right now we pay more than other countries for one of the worst health care systems in the world. It's down there on the list, don't remember how far if someone can post it, please do. So actually, you and Glenn should sit the fuck down and listen instead of trying to make it sound like Obama is raising the communist flag. ::)
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Well, well, well, the village idiot has made another worthless post.
Thanks for popping in with your irrelevant garbage.
It's starry-eyed pusses like you Ozark that haven't a clue how anything works in the world but you think you're a rugged libertarian individual with a real understanding how things should work. Don't you ape?
Come on Ozark, I've seen your BS before. Faced with the fact that Universal Healthcare in Britain is more effective than the US's privatized system and 40% cheaper, this pimplyfaced fatass screams "socialism". And then repeats it a dozen times like he split the atom.
You, Ozark, are what's wrong with this country.
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Yep irrelevent huh...what in this guys' past makes u believ that he doesn't want a redistribution of wealth. U guys really oughta get out more. He's the most liberal guy out there. He wants my money to give to poor people, welfare cases...and other drains on society. It is not our governments job to be all things to all people. U wanna hug from government...move. My uncle doesn't give hugs...he tells u work hard.
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::)
I don't think it's her place to tell me that I don't want much and that I need to give a piece of my pie to some bum, so he can live for free
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Its the Libs who want to tell what u can have, where u can live, what u can drive. They want to tell u what to eat, to smoke or not to smoke etc. These morons are talking about banning drive throughs in Wisconsin, because of global warming.
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Yep irrelevent huh...what in this guys' past makes u believ that he doesn't want a redistribution of wealth. U guys really oughta get out more. He's the most liberal guy out there. He wants my money to give to poor people, welfare cases...and other drains on society. It is not our governments job to be all things to all people. U wanna hug from government...move. My uncle doesn't give hugs...he tells u work hard.
Hey HH.
Every president redistributes the nation's wealth.
Government redistributes money. That's one of its prime functions.
Does it bother you that our government spends billions annually on R&D that benefits rich corporations? It's supposedly in the national interest.
Clinton was the most liberal. Gore was the most liberal. Kerry was the most liberal. Obama was the most liberal.
Do you see a trend and for the matter at hand, so what?
Reagan and both Bush's were disasters for this country's economic well-being. It was during the Clinton administration that the Reagan/Bush mistakes were addressed. The deficit was eliminated and the debt was being paid down.
It seems 'liberals' are much more effective at governing than republicans when it comes to the economy.
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Its the Libs who want to tell what u can have, where u can live, what u can drive. They want to tell u what to eat, to smoke or not to smoke etc. These morons are talking about banning drive throughs in Wisconsin, because of global warming.
In Wisconsin? I live in Milwaukee and I haven't heard this.
Come on HH, the Libs tell you where to live, drive etc? Your government does tell you where to live--you're in the military.
As far as I can tell, nobody has a gun to your head telling you where or how to live.
And it was Reagan that ran with the drug war nonsense telling all AMericans they can't smoke a little weed.
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Weed is scheduled drug....yeah when was the last time we heard about heating our homes or what we drove from a Repub. We're told we have to "cut back" or that people around the world havea problem with our lifestyle. Sorry obama...but u can die in a fire. I won't be lectured by some worthless Lib, who hasn't done shit.
First it was a proposed ban on plastic bags.
Now, a member of the influential Madison Plan Commission wants to ban the restaurant drive-through -- or at least restrict the ubiquitous symbol of America's auto-centric lifestyle.
"Given the concern about all the carbon going into the atmosphere, I'm not sure we should be building more places for people to sit idling in their cars," says Eric Sundquist, who was appointed to the citizen panel by Mayor Dave Cieslewicz this spring.
A former newspaper reporter in Atlanta now working as a researcher at the UW-Madison's Center on Wisconsin Strategy, Sundquist notes that several cities in Canada have recently moved to ban the drive-through coffee shop or stand-alone fast food restaurant (www.ecospace.cc/culture/drive-thru-ban.htm).
"Bans haven't gotten as far in the U.S., although I know San Luis Obispo, Calif., has one," he says.
The issue came up last week during discussions over a conditional use permit for a new Starbucks coffee shop along a congested frontage road across from East Towne Mall.
The site at 4302 E. Washington Ave., in front of the Crowne Plaza Hotel, formerly housed the Frame Workshop retail store but has been vacant for more than a year. Property owner Tim Neitzel now wants to lease half of the 3,300 square foot retail building for a Starbucks that will also feature indoor and outdoor seating.
To facilitate the drive-through, developers are using a portion of the Crowne Plaza parking lot. Drivers picking up their morning coffee will have to make a circle route through the property to avoid potential traffic backups.
But nearby business owners are concerned about bringing more cars through the already congested intersection of East Washington and Continental Lane. The owner of a gas station on the frontage road said it's not uncommon for cars to wait through three traffic signal cycles to get across East Washington.
East Towne area Ald. Joe Clausius admitted the intersection is a problem and said with the Starbucks it "could get very backed up." Still, he said the corridor is badly in need of some redevelopment.
"I'm constantly getting peppered with questions from people about what is happening there and when will it happen," he says.
City officials have given their lukewarm support to the Starbucks, which is scheduled for a November opening. They say it could help create a more pedestrian-friendly atmosphere near the Crowne Plaza.
"While many future customers will likely be driving automobiles, hotel guests and residents to the north represent a potential walking customer," says city planner Heather Stouder.
Sundquist voted for the Starbucks but is planning to bring the issue up before the city's Long Range Transportation Planning Commission on which he also serves.
"I know a ban might be difficult so a better approach might be to restrict them," he says, noting an ordinance in Davis, Calif., puts a number of restrictions on drive-throughs, including one relating to air pollution.
Middleton hotel
There are no signs of economic distress in Middleton, where developers continue to pursue major projects.
The latest is from Central Place Real Estate, which is proposing an ambitious redevelopment of the 3.9-acre former Prefinished Millwork site at the southwest corner of University Avenue and the Beltline.
A concept plan submitted to the city of Middleton earlier this month calls for demolishing the existing buildings and replacing them with a six-story, 125-room hotel built over 32,000 square feet of retail space. A three-story office building would anchor the other end of the project.
Parking would be provided in 130 underground spaces and 150 surface stalls.
Given the poor soil and water table conditions, developers have been talking with the city about TIF assistance, according to Central Place president Rob Zache.
Northgate update
The Madison-based Alexander Company is currently finalizing purchase of the venerable Northgate Shopping Center on North Sherman Avenue, home of Dorn Hardware and the Frugal Muse Bookstore, in addition to 19 other tenants.
Currently owned by the Northgate Partnership, the property is assessed at $4.1 million.
The purchase would be the first foray into Madison's north side for the Alexander Company, which has specialized in urban infill redevelopment projects.
Detailed plans for the center haven't been released but could include building and site improvements, Randall Alexander told the Northside News recently.
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Its the Libs who want to tell what u can have, where u can live, what u can drive. They want to tell u what to eat, to smoke or not to smoke etc. These morons are talking about banning drive throughs in Wisconsin, because of global warming.
Oh yea right, ::) Rightwingers have gotten pretty fracking intrusive lately bubba ::) Seems they want to tell people what they can and can't do just as much if not more and usually in areas of greater importance like that crap you psychos pulled with that brain dead lady. Consitutional amendments for marriage, oh brother... on and on...
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Weed is scheduled drug....yeah when was the last time we heard about heating our homes or what we drove from a Repub. We're told we have to "cut back" or that people around the world havea problem with our lifestyle. Sorry obama...but u can die in a fire. I won't be lectured by some worthless Lib, who hasn't done shit.
No one had a gun to your head making you "cut back" even though conservation was the sensible route back then and still is today.
The Europeans drive tiny cars b/c they don't subsidize with their tax dollars their nation's oil companies like we do. And typical dumb ass americans are burning through oil, a scarce resource, like it's air.
And then they complain about the cost of gas going up. That is not conservative behavior HH.
If we act like indulgent children, we'll reap the rewards of such behavior--exhausting oil, high priced gas, and worldwide scorn for our excesses.
First it was a proposed ban on plastic bags.
Now, a member of the influential Madison Plan Commission wants to ban the restaurant drive-through -- or at least restrict the ubiquitous symbol of America's auto-centric lifestyle.
"Given the concern about all the carbon going into the atmosphere, I'm not sure we should be building more places for people to sit idling in their cars," says Eric Sundquist, who was appointed to the citizen panel by Mayor Dave Cieslewicz this spring.
A former newspaper reporter in Atlanta now working as a researcher at the UW-Madison's Center on Wisconsin Strategy, Sundquist notes that several cities in Canada have recently moved to ban the drive-through coffee shop or stand-alone fast food restaurant (www.ecospace.cc/culture/drive-thru-ban.htm).
"Bans haven't gotten as far in the U.S., although I know San Luis Obispo, Calif., has one," he says.
The issue came up last week during discussions over a conditional use permit for a new Starbucks coffee shop along a congested frontage road across from East Towne Mall.
The site at 4302 E. Washington Ave., in front of the Crowne Plaza Hotel, formerly housed the Frame Workshop retail store but has been vacant for more than a year. Property owner Tim Neitzel now wants to lease half of the 3,300 square foot retail building for a Starbucks that will also feature indoor and outdoor seating.
To facilitate the drive-through, developers are using a portion of the Crowne Plaza parking lot. Drivers picking up their morning coffee will have to make a circle route through the property to avoid potential traffic backups.
But nearby business owners are concerned about bringing more cars through the already congested intersection of East Washington and Continental Lane. The owner of a gas station on the frontage road said it's not uncommon for cars to wait through three traffic signal cycles to get across East Washington.
East Towne area Ald. Joe Clausius admitted the intersection is a problem and said with the Starbucks it "could get very backed up." Still, he said the corridor is badly in need of some redevelopment.
"I'm constantly getting peppered with questions from people about what is happening there and when will it happen," he says.
City officials have given their lukewarm support to the Starbucks, which is scheduled for a November opening. They say it could help create a more pedestrian-friendly atmosphere near the Crowne Plaza.
"While many future customers will likely be driving automobiles, hotel guests and residents to the north represent a potential walking customer," says city planner Heather Stouder.
Sundquist voted for the Starbucks but is planning to bring the issue up before the city's Long Range Transportation Planning Commission on which he also serves.
"I know a ban might be difficult so a better approach might be to restrict them," he says, noting an ordinance in Davis, Calif., puts a number of restrictions on drive-throughs, including one relating to air pollution.
Middleton hotel
There are no signs of economic distress in Middleton, where developers continue to pursue major projects.
The latest is from Central Place Real Estate, which is proposing an ambitious redevelopment of the 3.9-acre former Prefinished Millwork site at the southwest corner of University Avenue and the Beltline.
A concept plan submitted to the city of Middleton earlier this month calls for demolishing the existing buildings and replacing them with a six-story, 125-room hotel built over 32,000 square feet of retail space. A three-story office building would anchor the other end of the project.
Parking would be provided in 130 underground spaces and 150 surface stalls.
Given the poor soil and water table conditions, developers have been talking with the city about TIF assistance, according to Central Place president Rob Zache.
Northgate update
The Madison-based Alexander Company is currently finalizing purchase of the venerable Northgate Shopping Center on North Sherman Avenue, home of Dorn Hardware and the Frugal Muse Bookstore, in addition to 19 other tenants.
Currently owned by the Northgate Partnership, the property is assessed at $4.1 million.
The purchase would be the first foray into Madison's north side for the Alexander Company, which has specialized in urban infill redevelopment projects.
Detailed plans for the center haven't been released but could include building and site improvements, Randall Alexander told the Northside News recently.
Fucking liberals. Madison is a liberal haven. Milwaukee is not.
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HH6, you fellas sure know how to put on a major production by putting your own context to something said. Why don't you idiots just go all out tell us how we'll be a fully communist state in 4 years under Obama ::) Make sure to put in all the gory christian brain sucking and satan worship and homosexual orgies that will take place. Toss in some Nazi shit and genocide for good measure. As long as you're making crap up, might as well go all out. You guys really don't give a crap about the truth do you?
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HH6, you fellas sure know how to put on a major production by putting your own context to something said. Why don't you idiots just go all out tell us how we'll be a fully communist state in 4 years under Obama ::) Make sure to put in all the gory christian brain sucking and satan worship and homosexual orgies that will take place. Toss in some Nazi shit and genocide for good measure. As long as you're making crap up, might as well go all out. You guys really don't give a crap about the truth do you?
Sure they do!
Obama lied in his commercial about extending healthcare for veterans.
You will see a littany of BS trotted out that 'indict' Obama.
What you won't see are detailed criticisms of his tax plan, healthcare plan or economic platform.
Why discuss substantive things when the man's middle name is Hussein?
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Repubs:
Give $ to military spending.
(Rich people like it because they can invest in companies to profit from this)
(Poor people hate it because they cannot benefit from it)
Dems:
Give $ to poor people.
(Rich people hate it because they cannot benefit from it.)
(Poor people like it because they get checks and profit from it)
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Repubs:
Give $ to military spending.
(Rich people like it because they can invest in companies to profit from this)
(Poor people hate it because they cannot benefit from it)
Want a strong country for future generations
Dems:
Give $ to poor people.
(Rich people hate it because they cannot benefit from it.)
(Poor people like it because they get checks and profit from it)
Don't care about the strength of the country
Added a bit
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This is going to be a blast. Stupid of me to think that we might have some actual debates on important issues this election year. I see we're going to be swiming in the normal sewer of "He's a commie, he's a terrorist, we'll be attacked if you vote for for him, Gay Marriage! Flag Burning FEAR FEAR!!! Osama Obama God God Terror FEAR FEAR!!! OH THE DYING BABIES... COMMIE COMMIE!!!!! BROWWWWNNNNPEOPLE EVERYWHERE!!!!!!! THERE'S A PAKI ON YOUR PORTCH!!!"
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"someone is going to have to give up a piece of their pie, so someone else can have more " - Michelle Obama
Obama in a nutshell.
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Obama in a nutshell.
Why did you vote for Clinton if you knew he was going to raise taxes?
Every president redistributes the nation's wealth as he sees fit.
And welcome back Beach Bum.
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Obama in a nutshell.
Why do you want to pay more out of your pocket to a corporation for a basic nessecity? You shut down government, which is what you want to do by eliminating taxes and you'll find yourself paying big bucks for shit like water. They'll do stupid shit like make it illegal to collect rain water. You let these corporations own the whole show and I guarantee way more people will find they're fucked.
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Why did you vote for Clinton if you knew he was going to raise taxes?
Every president redistributes the nation's wealth as he sees fit.
And welcome back Beach Bum.
I already told you why I voted for Clinton (twice). And he didn't say he would raise taxes like Obama while running for office. Clinton wasn't a liberal.
Thanks. Good to be home. :)
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Why do you want to pay more out of your pocket to a corporation for a basic nessecity? You shut down government, which is what you want to do by eliminating taxes and you'll find yourself paying big bucks for shit like water. They'll do stupid shit like make it illegal to collect rain water. You let these corporations own the whole show and I guarantee way more people will find they're fucked.
With Obama in office we will all pay more for goods and services. He will attack "the corporations" (i.e., the businesses on which we all rely) and "the corporations" will pass those increased costs along to consumers (us).
I don't know that anyone favors the elimination of all taxes.
Business doesn't run the whole show. Business is already heavily regulated.
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I already told you why I voted for Clinton (twice). And he didn't say he would raise taxes like Obama while running for office. Clinton wasn't a liberal.
Thanks. Good to be home. :)
Their tax plans are extremely similar: a tax hike for highend earners and targeted tax relief for middle/lower class people. I'm not sure if Obama
Clinton wasn't a liberal. But any democrat in today's political climate is a putative 'liberal'.
Barack Obama's Plan
Provide Middle Class Americans Tax Relief
Obama will cut income taxes by $1,000 for working families to offset the payroll tax they pay.
Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama will create a new "Making Work Pay" tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The "Making Work Pay" tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.
Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/
OBAMA: So the general principle of raising taxes on higher-income Americans like myself, and providing relief to those who haven't benefited as much from this new global economy, I think, is a sound one. And keep in mind on all of these proposals, what I have said is, let's make sure that we define the well-off so that we're not hitting the middle class. I generally define well-off as people who are making $250,000 a year or more, and that means, for example, if we raise the capital gains tax, I would exempt people who are essentially small investors, and really capture the -- those who have done very, very well over the last two decades.
Looks a lot like Bill Clinton's tax plan.
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With Obama in office we will all pay more for goods and services. He will attack "the corporations" (i.e., the businesses on which we all rely) and "the corporations" will pass those increased costs along to consumers (us).
I don't know that anyone favors the elimination of all taxes.
Business doesn't run the whole show. Business is already heavily regulated.
LOL what rock have you been hiding under for the past 8 years :D Do you have any concept of how much deregulation has taken place! I guess not! Do you have any concept of how the corporations have taken over our government? They have a much bigger hand in what gets put into a bill than the people do infact much of the wording comes right from corporate headquarters. It's a coup and nobody noticed! and when government is reduced to a withered shell, YOU WILL PAY MORE and most WILL get fucked. The power is bigtime tipped in the corporation's favor right now.
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Their tax plans are extremely similar: a tax hike for highend earners and targeted tax relief for middle/lower class people. I'm not sure if Obama
Clinton wasn't a liberal. But any democrat in today's political climate is a putative 'liberal'.
Barack Obama's Plan
Provide Middle Class Americans Tax Relief
Obama will cut income taxes by $1,000 for working families to offset the payroll tax they pay.
Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama will create a new "Making Work Pay" tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The "Making Work Pay" tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.
Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/
OBAMA: So the general principle of raising taxes on higher-income Americans like myself, and providing relief to those who haven't benefited as much from this new global economy, I think, is a sound one. And keep in mind on all of these proposals, what I have said is, let's make sure that we define the well-off so that we're not hitting the middle class. I generally define well-off as people who are making $250,000 a year or more, and that means, for example, if we raise the capital gains tax, I would exempt people who are essentially small investors, and really capture the -- those who have done very, very well over the last two decades.
Looks a lot like Bill Clinton's tax plan.
I do not support "targeted tax cuts," which are nothing more than code words for class warfare.
Attacking people who make $250K a year? As if they don't work hard for their money and get soaked by the government. Raising capital gains taxes on millions of Americans? This is guy is a disaster waiting to happen.
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LOL what rock have you been hiding under for the past 8 years :D Do you have any concept of how much deregulation has taken place! I guess not! Do you have any concept of how the corporations have taken over our government? They have a much bigger hand in what gets put into a bill than the people do infact much of the wording comes right from corporate headquarters. It's a coup and nobody noticed! and when government is reduced to a withered shell, YOU WILL PAY MORE and most WILL get fucked. The power is bigtime tipped in the corporation's favor right now.
I've been in the trenches for the past eight years. Where have YOU been? :) The government regulates business up the ying yang.
We just raised the general excise tax a few years ago, which was immediately passed on to consumers. That's how it always works. Punishing business punishes consumers.
Lobbying is a different issue. Anyone, corporation or individual, with a lot of money gets a seat at the table. That's the way the system works. Unfortunately. That's completely different from whether the government should be trying overtax and/or punish business.
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I've been in the trenches for the past eight years. Where have YOU been? :) The government regulates business up the ying yang.
We just raised the general excise tax a few years ago, which was immediately passed on to consumers. That's how it always works. Punishing business punishes consumers.
Lobbying is a different issue. Anyone, corporation or individual, with a lot of money gets a seat at the table. That's the way the system works. Unfortunately. That's completely different from whether the government should be trying overtax and/or punish business.
BB, you're just flat out making up your own reality here. Yup, big business agrees with you 100% To bad it's pure BS.
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BB, you're just flat out making up your own reality here. Yup, big business agrees with you 100% To bad it's pure BS.
Just stating the facts. If you are in business, heavy government regulation is a fact.
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I do not support "targeted tax cuts," which are nothing more than code words for class warfare.
Right. Let's just ignore the flaming class distinctions that surpass those of the 1920s. The old 'head in the sand' approach won't work here.
Attacking people who make $250K a year? As if they don't work hard for their money and get soaked by the government. Raising capital gains taxes on millions of Americans? This is guy is a disaster waiting to happen.
Taxing someone is not attacking them.
Has the debate over marginal tax rates debased to the point that any talk of taxation is an attack or class warfare? That's not productive.
Did you know that most Americans pay capital gains taxes on the sale of their homes? Did you know that $250-500,000 of that sales price is exempt from capital gains?
Further did you know that most rich people make their money from capital gains and not income and that the capital gains tax rates are lower than most of the marginal income tax rates?
The more we learn, the more his plan looks like a sensible measure.
I mean what's the alternative? Senator McCain's extra tax cuts on top of the extension of the irresponsible Bush tax cuts into perpetuity?
That's just horrible economics. McCain shouldn't have flipped on Bush's tax cuts--the expiration date was put in so Bush could campaign on the low cost of his 'temporary' tax cuts.
McCain knows that.
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Just stating the facts. If you are in business, heavy government regulation is a fact.
NO IT'S NOT!!!!! JESUS BB, YOU CAN'T BE SERIOUS. WILL YOU TELL ME FOR A FACT THAT THERE HASN'T BEEN HUGE DEREGULATION UNDER BUSH? GO AHEAD, IT'LL BE A BOLD FACED FUCKING LIE.
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Right. Let's just ignore the flaming class distinctions that surpass those of the 1920s. The old 'head in the sand' approach won't work here.
Taxing someone is not attacking them.
Has the debate over marginal tax rates debased to the point that any talk of taxation is an attack or class warfare? That's not productive.
Did you know that most Americans pay capital gains taxes on the sale of their homes? Did you know that $250-500,000 of that sales price is exempt from capital gains?
Further did you know that most rich people make their money from capital gains and not income and that the capital gains tax rates are lower than most of the marginal income tax rates?
The more we learn, the more his plan looks like a sensible measure.
I mean what's the alternative? Senator McCain's extra tax cuts on top of the extension of the irresponsible Bush tax cuts into perpetuity?
That's just horrible economics. McCain shouldn't have flipped on Bush's tax cuts--the expiration date was put in so Bush could campaign on the low cost of his 'temporary' tax cuts.
McCain knows that.
Attacking "the rich" is a liberal mantra and has been for decades. That’s precisely what Obama is doing. Pitting groups against each other. "The rich" by and large earned their money through hard work, saving, investing, and living below their means. The government has no business trying to "target" them for a further disproportionate tax burden.
Also, it isn’t just “the rich” who pay capital gains taxes. And people who make $250K and up aren’t necessarily “rich.”
Many liberals have the mindset that people can be successful, but just not too successful, or the government will take what you have and give to the have nots. That's just wrongheaded. The government should be trying to reduce everyone's burden and should not punish success.
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NO IT'S NOT!!!!! JESUS BB, YOU CAN'T BE SERIOUS. WILL YOU TELL ME FOR A FACT THAT THERE HASN'T BEEN HUGE DEREGULATION UNDER BUSH? GO AHEAD, IT'LL BE A BOLD FACED FUCKING LIE.
Now now Hugo. Take a deep breath. lol. :)
I did not say there has not been deregulation. I said business is heavily regulated.
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Now now Hugo. Take a deep breath. lol. :)
I did not say there has not been deregulation. I said business is heavily regulated.
what were they before all the deregulation? AND THERE HAS BEEN A LOT!!! Shackled in the dungeon whipped daily by some liberal femdom master? Seems they did ok then so what's the big deal? You have to play by some rules. I've heard Bush say so many times, "we'll let the corporation determine when, how, if bla bla...." and of course we all know what that means ::)
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Attacking "the rich" is a liberal mantra and has been for decades. That’s precisely what Obama is doing. Pitting groups against each other. "The rich" by and large earned their money through hard work, saving, investing, and living below their means. The government has no business trying to "target" them for a further disproportionate tax burden.
I am not an apologist for the wealthy. They do fine for themselves.
Also, it isn’t just “the rich” who pay capital gains taxes. And people who make $250K and up aren’t necessarily “rich.”
I have to disagree with you on this one. 1.5% of the US population earns $250,000 or more a year. That's a fairly select neighborhood worthy of the terminology "rich".
Many liberals have the mindset that people can be successful, but just not too successful, or the government will take what you have and give to the have nots. That's just wrongheaded. The government should be trying to reduce everyone's burden and should not punish success.
Many conservatives ignore the costs of society and wrongly try to attribute their own success to only their own efforts. That's very selfish.
As for the have-nots, I like to call them the widows, the elderly, the disabled, the orphans, and the disenfranchised.
Of course we could go back to the days of debtor prisons, the stockades, or indentured servitude to right the ship of state but we are supposed to be an advanced civil society.
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what were they before all the deregulation? AND THERE HAS BEEN A LOT!!! Shackled in the dungeon whipped daily by some liberal femdom master? Seems they did ok then so what's the big deal? You have to play by some rules. I've heard Bush say so many times, "we'll let the corporation determine when, how, if bla bla...." and of course we all know what that means ::)
Business was heavily regulated before Bush took office and is heavily regulated today. Keep in mind that much of the regulation occurs at the state level.
Who do you mean by "they"? Are you referring to Fortune 500 companies? Business that earn over a certain threshold?
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I am not an apologist for the wealthy. They do fine for themselves.
I have to disagree with you on this one. 1.5% of the US population earns $250,000 or more a year. That's a fairly select neighborhood worthy of the terminology "rich".
Many conservatives ignore the costs of society and wrongly try to attribute their own success to only their own efforts. That's very selfish.
As for the have-nots, I like to call them the widows, the elderly, the disabled, the orphans, and the disenfranchised.
Of course we could go back to the days of debtor prisons, the stockades, or indentured servitude to right the ship of state but we are supposed to be an advanced civil society.
Wealth is defined by net worth, not income. A person who earns $250K a year, who lives in L.A., has a mortgage, a couple or three kids, etc. isn't necessarily "rich."
Setting some arbitrary income level and attacking people over that level will not help this country. It will divide people.
We already take care of the elderly, disabled, orphans, disenfranchised, etc.
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Wealth is defined by net worth, not income. A person who earns $250K a year, who lives in L.A., has a mortgage, a couple or three kids, etc. isn't necessarily "rich."
I'm sorry, but $250,000+ per year is rich and does result in wealth. Now irresponsible spending/living is another matter.
Setting some arbitrary income level and attacking people over that level will not help this country. It will divide people.
1.5% of the population v. 98.5%. I'll take those odds in a class war...which this isn't.
We already take care of the elderly, disabled, orphans, disenfranchised, etc.
Yes and it is the flat payroll tax that does the bulk of that heavy lifting. Evryone shares that burden the same...except those earning in excess of the social security wagebase of $105,000. Only the meager medicare tax extends to the full range of earnings.
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Well, well, well, the village idiot has made another worthless post.
Thanks for popping in with your irrelevant garbage.
It's starry-eyed pusses like you Ozark that haven't a clue how anything works in the world but you think you're a rugged libertarian individual with a real understanding how things should work. Don't you ape?
Come on Ozark, I've seen your BS before. Faced with the fact that Universal Healthcare in Britain is more effective than the US's privatized system and 40% cheaper, this pimplyfaced fatass screams "socialism". And then repeats it a dozen times like he split the atom.
You, Ozark, are what's wrong with this country.
Hello Hypocrite !!
nothing like a few facts to prove our fellow GetBig hypocrite wrong again.
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/socialized.html#britain
Great Britain's National Health Service (NHS) was created on July 5, 1948. As with all government programs, bureaucrats underestimated initial cost projections. First-year operating costs of NHS were 52 million pounds higher than original estimates1 as Britons saturated the so-called free system.
Many decades of shortages, misery and suffering followed until 1989, when some market-based health care competition was reintroduced to the British citizens2.
Unfortunately for those requiring care, a mostly socialist health care system still has problems. The articles and commentaries in this section identify some disasters caused by government intervention in the British health care system.
Pensioner, 76, forced to pull out own teeth after 12 NHS dentists refuse to treat her
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukdental3.html
Patient 'removed' from waiting list to meet target
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukremoved.html
One in eight patients waiting over a year for treatment, admits minister
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukoneineight.html
The drugs the NHS won't give you
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukdrugswont.html
UK lagging behind on cancer drug access, study finds
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uklagbehind.html
UK lagging behind on cancer drug access, study finds
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uklagbehind.html
Specialist stroke care 'lottery'
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uklottery.html
Smokers and the obese banned from UK hospitals
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukobese.html
Cancer patients told life-prolonging treatment is too expensive for NHS
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcancertx.html
Heart patients dying due to poor hospital care, says report
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukheartdelay2.html
NHS dentistry loses almost a million patients after new dentists' contract
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukdental4.html
Private healthcare managers could be sent to turn round failing NHS hospitals
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukfailnhs.html
Cancer patients ‘betrayed’ by NHS
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcancerdrugs.html
NHS scandal: dying cancer victim was forced to pay
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcancerdie.html
Dental patients face care lottery
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukdental2.html
Lung patients 'condemned to death as NHS withdraws their too expensive drugs'
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uklungpatient.html
Women in labour turned away by maternity units
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukwomeninlabor.html
Health inequality has got worse under Labour, says government report
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukinequality.html
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continued.....
UK health service "harms 10 percent of patients"
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukharms2.html
5,000 elderly 'killed each year' by lack of care beds
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcarebeds.html
Dental Socialism in Britain
http://www.lewrockwell.com/rockwell/british-dentistry.html
Pay for nurses and surgeons doubles NHS overspend
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukpay.html
The money addicts: it's your cash they are gambling with
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukaddicts2.html
NHS chiefs get luxury car deals
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukluxury.html
Secret NHS plan to ration patient care
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uksecret.html
British Healthcare To Be Rationed
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukration.html
British body rejects EPO drugs for cancer patients
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukrejects.html
National Health Service - Grappling with Deficits
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukrejects.html
Hundreds wait to register as another dentist quits the NHS
http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/47523.html
Life-saving cancer drugs 'kept from NHS patients by red tape'
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article568605.ece
NHS slides into the red despite record increases in health care spending
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=P8&xml=/health/2005/09/20/nhs17.xml
Alzheimer's sufferers hit by further delay in NHS approval for vital drugs
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/
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Ozark, you're insane.
And your insane postings mean nothing to me.
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continued......
2,000 British doctors out of work
http://washingtontimes.com/upi/20050814-015326-4906r.htm
NHS faces rising bill for negligence claims
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e1b34ac2-07a7-11da-a742-00000e2511c8.html?nclick_check=1
British boy to go to India for operation
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukbritishboy.html
Top crimewriter funds drugs for cancer victim refused by NHS
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcrime.html
Report says NHS is mired in huge debts
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukmired.html
U.K. set to restrict smoking
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukrestrictsmok.html
NHS ‘fund bias’ against men may cost 2,500 lives a year
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukfundbias.html
Doubts on funding NHS 'monuments'
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/27ab0ab8-d94c-11d9-8403-00000e2511c8.html
17 million reasons why we must improve hospital meals
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukmeals.html
Figures show more patients waiting for operations
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2005/jun/03/politics.publicservices
Scarcity of NHS dental treatment is revealed
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/
800 queue for NHS dentists
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=P8&targetRule=10&xml=/health/2005/05/05/ndent03.xml
British health service facing nurse exodus
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uknursesperyear.html
NHS debts soar to over £1bn
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/
British taxpayers foot $26.5 million bill for abortion tourists
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=36592
U.K. Liberal Democrats Would Raise Taxes to Pay for Health Care
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000102&sid=af4fx9hNVduw&refer=uk
'£500m hole' in hospital budgets
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/
NHS waiting list rises
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2005/feb/11/politics.publicservices
Tumour patients hit by NHS shortages
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2005/feb/06/NHS.medicineandhealth
'No strategy' on NHS waiting time
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/4173073.stm
Heart patients die on waiting lists
http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/personalfinance/s/133/133762_heart_patients_die_on_waiting_lists.html
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Insanity: doing the same thing over and expecting different results.
Ozark, you are insane.
Your bullshit mass postings are as persuasive and legitimate as GW Bush at a MENSA meeting.
You are insane.
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Insanity: doing the same thing over and expecting different results.
Ozark, you are insane.
Your bullshit mass postings are as persuasive and legitimate as GW Bush at a MENSA meeting.
You are insane.
Hello Hypocrite !
almost as pathetic as your hypocrisy in supporting John Edwards, who voted to send our troops off to War, while at the same time you talk trash on GetBig about our troops !
keep squirimng hypocrite :o :o :o :o
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Hello Hypocrite !
almost as pathetic as your hypocrisy in supporting John Edwards, who voted to send our troops off to War, while at the same time you talk trash on GetBig about our troops !
keep squirimng hypocrite :o :o :o :o
You're insane Ozark/Eldon
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Oh I think we've proven that this crap won't work. According to u guys we're loosing Iraq...yet u want Uncle Sam to control health care..can't have it both ways gents.
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Oh I think we've proven that this crap won't work. According to u guys we're loosing Iraq...yet u want Uncle Sam to control health care..can't have it both ways gents.
Waging a bad war is no indictment of UHC.
Soc. Sec. is the most successful government program in the country's history. I think UHC could rival program that if republicans and Big Insurance don't sabotage the effort.
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more facts for our fellow hypocrite Decker, who is full of shit :o
Gaps in care cost £7bn, says charity
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2004/oct/04/medicineandhealth.NHS
NHS excluding poor people, UK
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/13458.php
Smokers 'should not get NHS care'
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/smokers2.html
Waiting list row blights Brighton
http://society.guardian.co.uk/nhsperformance/story/0,8150,1297061,00.html
Patients are denied the last rites under data protection law
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/rites.html
Shortage of dentists to double by 2011
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/dentists.html
Britain's stiff upper lip gives way to a snarl
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/stiff.html
Hospital Overcrowding A Cause of Superbug Infections
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/superbug.html
Hospital Crisis: Fallen Angels
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/uknurses.html
Study finds British hospitals are still austere, cold, smelly and poorly maintained
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/ukcold.html
Discrimination Rampant In British Health Care
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/rampant.html
PERIPATETICS—To the Medical Socialists of All Parties
http://www.fee.org/publications/the-freeman/article.asp?aid=5112
Creeping Privatization?
http://www.lewrockwell.com/watson/watson13.html
Socialized Medicine in Great Britain: Lessons for the Oregon Health Plan
http://www.cascadepolicy.org/spiers.htm
The Sickbed Which is Socialized British Medicine
http://www.ncpa.org/health/pdh57.html
The British Way of Withholding Care
http://server.fee.org/publications/the-freeman/article.asp?aid=2640
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You're insane Ozark/Eldon.
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You're insane Ozark/Eldon.
our fellow Hypocrite does not like the facts ?
Go look at your auto graphed photo of John Edwards some more.
:o
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our fellow Hypocrite does not like the facts ?
Go look at your auto graphed photo of John Edwards some more.
:o
You're insane.
Your amalgam of articles proves nothing and your analyisi as fractured as your mind Ozark/Eldon.
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You're insane.
Your amalgam of articles proves nothing and your analyisi as fractured as your mind Ozark/Eldon.
Facts not important to a hypocrite...? Who would have thought ::)
but since you asked :
Only six potency pills per month to be covered by Social Insurance Institution
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/potency.html
Hospitals on the verge of a breakdown
http://www.swissinfo.org/eng/index.html?siteSect=105&sid=4059652
Sweden Edges Toward Free-Market Medicine
http://www.ncpa.org/pub/ba/ba369/
Netherlands aims to tackle health divide
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/neth.html
A Hard Lesson About Socialized Medicine
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=6293
Paying The Price For Drugs In Europe
http://www.ncpa.org/pi/health/pd072100a.html
(http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/techgraph.gif)
Surgery postponed indefinitely for 1,000 Kelowna patients
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/cansurgery3.html
Majority of Que. dentists quit health-care system
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candentist2.html
Wait times for surgery, medical treatments at all-time high: report
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/cansurgery4.html
The Ugly Truth About Canadian Health Care
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canuglytruth.html
Cancer patients question why PET scan not covered
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/cancancer.html
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You and your 'facts' are insane Eldon/Ozark.
-
nothing like a few facts to upset a hypocrite :o
but sine you mentioned it, here are a few more for you hypocrite :
BC Medical Association: Waiting Too Long for Hip and Knee Surgery Costs $10,000 Per Patient-Maximum Wait Times Should Be No Longer Than 6 Months
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canwait3.html
Ont. physician turns away patient for being 55+
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canage.html
Canada inches toward private medicine
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/caninching.html
Doctor defends private cancer clinic
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candoctordefends.html
Dogma trumps truth in health-care issues
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candogman.html
Why Canadians Purchase Private Health Insurance
http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=4271
Doctor welcomes health ruling
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canwelcomes2.html
Patients shouldn't wait more than 8 weeks for cardiac defibrillator: experts
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candefib.html
Grads fail to slow doctor shortage
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candgradsfail.html
Canada's drug tab reaches $22 billion, report suggests
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candrugcost.html
Canadian health care is free and first-class -- if you can wait
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canfreeandfirst.html
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You Ozark/Eldon are a madman....nope, you're just insane.
But you're catalog of links is impressive....hahahahha
You're such a fucking loser.
You do realize that everyone in the civilized world is laughing at you and your proof.
Why?
You're insane.
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You Ozark/Eldon are a madman....nope, you're just insane.
But you're catalog of links is impressive....hahahahha
You're such a fucking loser.
You do realize that everyone in the civilized world is laughing at you and your proof.
Why?
You're insane
.
keep dreaming hypocrite !
and to think you are an attorney :o :o
LMAO !!!!
-
.
keep dreaming hypocrite !
and to think you are an attorney :o :o
LMAO !!!!
And you, why you're insane... Ozark/Eldon/Legion
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And you, why you're insane... Ozark/Eldon/Legion
Wait a minute.....
a pathetic hypocrite slinging nothing but personal attacks in his defense ;D
who would have thought it ? :o :o :o
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Wait a minute.....
a pathetic hypocrite slinging nothing but personal attacks in his defense ;D
who would have thought it ? :o :o :o
You are insane Eldon/Ozark.
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just a few more facts for our fellow hypocrite Decker ;D
Access to specialists difficult: study
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canspecdifficult.html
Doctor shortages, frustrations vary from region to region, survey shows
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/candocshortage3.html
Montreal leads the country in offering private health care
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canmontrealprivate.html
Canada falling short on medical imaging
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canfallingshort.html
Creative incentives required to retain older doctors
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canretain.html
MRI gap defies cash fix
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canMRIgap.html
A boy's plight, a nation's problem
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canboysplight.html
Where's proof private clinics cost more?
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canproof.html
Surgery backlog tops 5,500 at kids' hospitals; One-year waits common
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/canbacklog.html
Hospital wait lists to get worse, Carriere says
http://www.liberty-page.com/issues/healthcare/cangetworse.html
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Let me guess, you're the "author" of "Liberty Page"...hahahha
You and your insanity prove your sadness
Eldon/Ozark, you are insane.
-
Holy Shit you are insane. Liberty-page is a lunatic site full of extremist libertarians.
Scrap the IRS!
Scrap the Code!
Learn economics at the feet of the Austrian School of Thought...as taught at Adolf Hitler High school!
Ayn Rand is deep and provocative!
Does your tinfoil hat chafe?
Not only a paranoid Schizoid but also a lunatic "patriot."
Ozark/Eldon, you are insane.
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Let me guess, you're the "author" of "Liberty Page"...hahahha
You and your insanity prove your sadness
Eldon/Ozark, you are insane.
Holy Shit you are insane. Liberty-page is a lunatic site full of extremist libertarians.
Scrap the IRS!
Scrap the Code!
Learn economics at the feet of the Austrian School of Thought...as taught at Adolf Hitler High school!
Ayn Rand is deep and provocative!
Does your tinfoil hat chafe?
Not only a paranoid Schizoid but also a lunatic "patriot."
Ozark/Eldon, you are insane.
Nice try hypocrite :o
One very little problem though...... those facts are from many sources, including :
timesonline.co.uk
telegraph.co.uk
washingtontimes.com
financial times
Bloomberg
guardian
BBC
Manchester
medicalnewstoday.com
Toronto star
and many others.
but nice try hypocrite !!!!!! :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
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Nice try hypocrite :o
One very little problem though...... those facts are from many sources, including :
timesonline.co.uk
telegraph.co.uk
washingtontimes.com
financial times
Bloomberg
guardian
BBC
Manchester
medicalnewstoday.com
Toronto star
and many others.
but nice try hypocrite !!!!!! :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
Do you hear laughing? You might...who knows what goes on in that crowded twisted mind of yours.
Your 'proof by a thousand links' is meaningless. So I'll teach you how to debate properly.
"Despite spending more than $6,000 per person per year on health care, the United States continues to rank last among six nations in a study comparing access, quality, efficiency, equity and healthy lives."
"The study, "Mirror, Mirror on the Wall: An International Update on the Comparative Performance of American Health Care" (PDF file: 40 pages / 504 KB. More about PDFs.) by the Commonwealth Fund, is an update of studies in 2004 and 2005. It concludes "the U.S. health system is the most expensive in the world, but comparative analyses consistently show the United States underperforms relative to other countries on most dimensions of performance.""
"According to the study's authors, "Among the six nations studied -- Australia, Canada, Germany, New Zealand, the United Kingdom, and the United States -- the U.S. ranks last, as it did in the 2006 and 2004 editions of 'Mirror, Mirror.' Most troubling, the U.S. fails to achieve better health outcomes than the other countries, and as shown in the earlier editions, the U.S. is last on dimensions of access, patient safety, efficiency, and equity.""
This summary of the study is from the AMERICAN ACADEMY OF FAMILY PHYSICIANS.
http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/publications/news/news-now/health-of-the-public/20070531usranking.printerview.html
Wow. A study that actually compares the different health systems of the world and the US comes out dead last yet is at least twice expensive as the competition.
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Yep irrelevent huh...what in this guys' past makes u believ that he doesn't want a redistribution of wealth. U guys really oughta get out more. He's the most liberal guy out there. He wants my money to give to poor people, welfare cases...and other drains on society. It is not our governments job to be all things to all people. U wanna hug from government...move. My uncle doesn't give hugs...he tells u work hard.
Well if Beck's claims are valid, then that would put you in the top wealthiest percentile. Is that your claim?
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Eldon, what a joke... you will find problem in any system. If you're looking for perfection, it won't happen. This isn't a fucking fantasy. What is fact is that we pay way more for a system that's bottom rated. rap your mind around that. Now rap your mind around places like Taiwan kicking our ass in healthcare. shit, these days are we number one in anything anymore... makes me wonder...
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I already told you why I voted for Clinton (twice). And he didn't say he would raise taxes like Obama while running for office. Clinton wasn't a liberal.
Thanks. Good to be home. :)
Yes he did. I remember watching him the night he played the sax on the Arsenio Hall show, and Arsenio endorsing him, and Clinton came straight out and said "you do know I'm going to raise taxes on guys like you making your kind of money don't you?" and Arsenio responded with "I know it"
-
WTF is an Arsenio ???
-
WTF is an Arsenio ???
black guy, supposed to be funny