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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: 240 is Back on September 29, 2008, 11:06:16 AM
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
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I need to get a gun fast.
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oh the impurity of light shall touch the black
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Dow plummets as House votes
The House, following four hours of heated and emotional debate, is voting on a sweeping $700 billion bailout of the nation's financial system. Investors are watching the vote closely. The Dow plummeted more than 700 points as votes against the bill mounted.
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This may be a good thing though.
Firms will realize they aren't going to get a pile of federal money to solve all their problems. They're going to have to solve their own problems - cut spending, lay off unnecessary people, and cut CEO bonuses.
This was Bush's last big money grab before leaving office. So far, Congress isnt' falling for it.
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This may be a good thing though.
Firms will realize they aren't going to get a pile of federal money to solve all their problems. They're going to have to solve their own problems - cut spending, lay off unnecessary people, and cut CEO bonuses.
This was Bush's last big money grab before leaving office. So far, Congress isnt' falling for it.
It's never unnecessary people that get laid off, it's always the once that cannot muster a full attacke the socialy poor and working class.
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It's never unnecessary people that get laid off, it's always the once that cannot muster a full attacke the socialy poor and working class.
In most firms I've worked, you have people who spend 1-2 hours a day chatting, playing online, taking long lunches, wasting time.
If firms made people work more and goof off less, they can cut 1 in 5 employees.
Those people can go back to school, open a busienss, or ask themselves why they fcked around 2 hours a day at work.
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They want the dow to drop a bit.
Everyone in the house sold thier stocks,
and will buy before they put it through
when the market will surely go up.
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In most firms I've worked, you have people who spend 1-2 hours a day chatting, playing online, taking long lunches, wasting time.
If firms made people work more and goof off less, they can cut 1 in 5 employees.
Those people can go back to school, open a busienss, or ask themselves why they fcked around 2 hours a day at work.
It's the job of Supevisors and managers to ensure that.
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Now's a great time to invest. When the market is down, that's when you should be buying. Only poor stupid people pull their money out when the market is down. The rich are buying like madmen.
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It's the job of Supevisors and managers to ensure that.
many of them are slackers as well.
Now's a great time to invest. When the market is down, that's when you should be buying. Only poor stupid people pull their money out when the market is down. The rich are buying like madmen.
Agreed. I'm spending some $ today :)
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I can't believe the original bill was going to give some of the profits (if there were any) to ACORN. How f-cking stupid does the gov thing we are? Thankfully, senators looked at the bill more carefully this weekend.
Community groups like ACORN, the urban league & others, in combination with the government, pushing sub-prime loans to people who didn't have the financials or responsibility to pay on these loans is one of the reasons we're in this mess.
I also want to see some regulation on CEO profits if banks are loosing $. The captains must go down with the ship if its sinking.
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Power to the people!
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This may be a good thing though.
Firms will realize they aren't going to get a pile of federal money to solve all their problems. They're going to have to solve their own problems - cut spending, lay off unnecessary people, and cut CEO bonuses.
This was Bush's last big money grab before leaving office. So far, Congress isnt' falling for it.
LMAO. Do you REALLY think that's going to happen? Seriously? Companies have run themselves into the ground and continued to give CEO bonuses. What's different now?
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I heard one great idea today.
Put $700 billion into a US transportation system. Something of an advanced, above ground subway that gets you places fast. you'd solve the fuel crisis really fast.
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From what I read (i dabble in stocks a little, nothing too serious), this is what the bill failing to pass has done/caused:
1. as 240 said, it'll bring back responsibility into these companies, knowing there's no "golden parachute"
2. shit companies will go under
3. we won't turn into communist China
4. the markets will rally sooner than if the bill passed, because the government would've cut a check for 700B for "assets" that are worth 0 essentially
5. it will stop,slow down, and possibly even raise the value of the dollar
6. the "bailout" would've caused a massive inflation due to the decreased value of the dollar
7. the "people" for once will win, meaning we won't have to pay for irresponsible lending fuckups
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Power to the people!
X2
The opposition tot he bailout- a bailout of millionaire and billionaire Wall Street brokers- was running 300-2 in So Cal.
I have herd similar numebrs all across the US-and there was a HUGE FU rally last friday at 5PM opn Wall Street by everyday folks.
Those Wall Street idiots made this mess and got rich over it-I sure the fuck am not going to fork over $2,300 (from every man, woman and child in the US) to fix their fucked up mess.
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I heard one great idea today.
Put $700 billion into a US transportation system. Something of an advanced, above ground subway that gets you places fast. you'd solve the fuel crisis really fast.
what's your thoughts on a 700B public works project? something along the lines of creating another city of Phoenix or what not? Picking a random spot in bumblefuck Idaho and creating a metropolis?
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LMAO. Do you REALLY think that's going to happen? Seriously? Companies have run themselves into the ground and continued to give CEO bonuses. What's different now?
ALL you have to do to STOP the bullshit CEO "bonuses" is to stop allowing them to be tax deductable-BOOM! Problem solved.
I say pay as much as they want to, or can afford to pay-but with NO tax deductions on it.
Free market baby.
Take away the tax deductions and the bullshit inflated CEO pay problem solves itself overnight.
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
Thank God for republicans in the house.It once again shows how absolutely pathetic Pelosi is as speaker of the house.If she had any pull at all she could have gotten it through.Think republicans would have gone against Tom Delay like that?
Fairly amusing that it was the dems that protected Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac,wouldnt try to corral them,fought any attempt to reign them in,and now THEY want to have us believe that they can save us.
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what's your thoughts on a 700B public works project? something along the lines of creating another city of Phoenix or what not? Picking a random spot in bumblefuck Idaho and creating a metropolis?
I dunno... it's intriguing.
Maybe use the $700 billion to completely "Defeat oil".
Use a few millions bucks as award money, and let the scientists have two years to come up with something better than oil/gas, and a converter to make it work on existing cars.
Then use the remaining $699 billion to develop it.
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I dunno... it's intriguing.
Maybe use the $700 billion to completely "Defeat oil".
Use a few millions bucks as award money, and let the scientists have two years to come up with something better than oil/gas, and a converter to make it work on existing cars.
Then use the remaining $699 billion to develop it.
did you know that in the early 80's Chrysler went bankrupt and was bailed out by the Fed, much like today, (i think it was 3B back then), and one of the terms of the bailout was that they had to develop an alternative energy car or else they wouldn't get the funds?
Almost 30 years later, those alternative energy Chryslers that are all over the road today sure are nice to drive. BTW, the bailout was never paid back.
I honestly think until the oil is tapped dry, whether it's in Saudi Arabia or your backyard, we won't see any significant progress in this arena. Unless you want sails on your pickup.
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I heard one great idea today.
Put $700 billion into a US transportation system. Something of an advanced, above ground subway that gets you places fast. you'd solve the fuel crisis really fast.
Barney Frank was a huge proponent of doing something similar, rebuilding the nations infrastructure and roads, when the "stimulus package" was being developed last year.
really, its the best way to get the economy going. we learned that in the new deal from the ccc & tva (shoot my memory is wincing as i recalled those abbreviations from high school history classes ;D ).
yet the government keeps throwing money at the problem in all the wrong ways.
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Thank God for republicans in the house.
Agreed. Thank goodness for people in BOTH parties that stood up to bush.
It once again shows how absolutely pathetic Pelosi is as speaker of the house.
Eh, face it... John Boener couldn't rally the repubs to obey him. And mccain, their leader, is hiding. Mccain claimed to be the republican leader of the party... yet he's AWOL on this deal.
Both parties are split on this issue. mocking pelosi when john boenner couldn't get Bush's own part to back him... weak.
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Let's be honest guys - and talk all the repub/dem issue out of it.
Bush got to borrow $4.5 trillion bucks over the last 7 years, most of which went to military spending firms and foreign banks.
Bush got to "lose" 2.3 trillion on 9/10/2001 that nobody mentioned.
Bush got his patriot act and his 2 wars (maybe 3 if he hits iran when obama wins)
Bush didn't get his way on this issue, a nice golden parachute/blank check for all his coroprate interests. Perhaps congress is finally wise to him. They wanna keep their jobs...
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Agreed. Thank goodness for people in BOTH parties that stood up to bush.
Eh, face it... John Boener couldn't rally the repubs to obey him. And mccain, their leader, is hiding. Mccain claimed to be the republican leader of the party... yet he's AWOL on this deal.
Both parties are split on this issue. mocking pelosi when john boenner couldn't get Bush's own part to back him... weak.
The house republicans DONT want it,never wanted it,never will want it.Its socialism.Let the market fail for a few months.Yeah,we go into recession,but with this dumb deal,we will be looking at a depression for 10 years.KEEP THE FREAKING GOVERNMENT OUT OF BUISINESS!!!!!!
This is what happens when you try to give stuff to people who dont work for it.Loans to people who cant pay them back,all in the name of "helping".Im so sick of hearing these goof balls saying "they deserve the American dream".NO THEY DONT!!!!YOU WORK FOR YOUR DREAM.Its not given to you by the government.
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
This is most excellent. :) Are you happy about this Rob?
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This is most excellent. :) Are you happy about this Rob?
Yes.
The fact that paulson admitted he has NO basis for why he chose $700 billion, and the fact that Bush would have controlled the money with no oversight... whew!
Rush is right, i'm listening now, and he says this is great because it means wall street will be encouraged. They know the dollar will be STRONGER now.
It wasn't a terrible bailout, but the fact Bush allowed for zero oversight... that was bullshit. He said "trust me!" on WMD. We tried that.
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Rob, are you saying that Nancy Pelosi's a huge twat?
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Rob, are you saying that Nancy Pelosi's a huge twat?
Why yes, sir, I am.
But Repubs couldn't control their own party either. Mccain was AWOL after claiming he was the LEADER of his party.
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Why yes, sir, I am.
I'm not sure what she said, but after her speech / before the vote, she somehow managed to turn 95 democrats to vote against the bill.
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Im so sick of hearing these goof balls saying "they deserve the American dream".NO THEY DONT!!!!YOU WORK FOR YOUR DREAM.Its not given to you by the government.
Post of the day for you Sir!
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If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
The US dollar is cooked and not for a short time. We are running record deficits with no where to go. No solutions.
The standard of living in this country is going to drop like a stone. It's a fitting end to the worst presidency ever.
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did you know that in the early 80's Chrysler went bankrupt and was bailed out by the Fed, much like today, (i think it was 3B back then), and one of the terms of the bailout was that they had to develop an alternative energy car or else they wouldn't get the funds?
Almost 30 years later, those alternative energy Chryslers that are all over the road today sure are nice to drive. BTW, the bailout was never paid back.
Your facts are so far off base it is not even funny.
Chrysler did NOT go BK, but were close.
The US lent Chrysler $900 million in 78, and Lee Iachoca stepped in and got the company back up-at $1 a year plus stock options.
The $900 million was PAID BACK EARLY! 2 years early if memory serves me.
This is MUCH different than Chrysler. This was an intentional fraud by big business.
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This may be a good thing though.
Firms will realize they aren't going to get a pile of federal money to solve all their problems. They're going to have to solve their own problems - cut spending, lay off unnecessary people, and cut CEO bonuses.
This was Bush's last big money grab before leaving office. So far, Congress isnt' falling for it.
Bill passes. McCain takes credit and Palin moves closer to being Pres. Even 2/3 Repubs saws this coming. You have a MBA. The USA will be around without this bill after the elections in 5 weeks
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The house republicans DONT want it,never wanted it,never will want it.Its socialism.Let the market fail for a few months.Yeah,we go into recession,but with this dumb deal,we will be looking at a depression for 10 years.KEEP THE FREAKING GOVERNMENT OUT OF BUISINESS!!!!!!
This is what happens when you try to give stuff to people who dont work for it.Loans to people who cant pay them back,all in the name of "helping".Im so sick of hearing these goof balls saying "they deserve the American dream".NO THEY DONT!!!!YOU WORK FOR YOUR DREAM.Its not given to you by the government.
Billy, you're a fucking idiot.
The republicans voted against the scam because Pelosi dissed them in puiblic, if not for that idiot Pelosi this scam would be a done deal by now.
Just in case you have not figured it out yet Einstein, BOTH the dems and repubs are bought and paid for by Big Business.
BTW Billy , Randall "Duke" Cunningham is in the Big House for 8.8 years, on bribery charges in the biggest corruption case in the history of the US. Congres.
Duke was a republican.
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Perhaps with the day off to soak it in - if markets don't get in too much trouble - we'll all realize that giving Bush $700 bil wasn't necessary after all
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This is most excellent. :) Are you happy about this Rob?
This is a free market correction.
Time to take our medicine.
It will be painful lesson in the short term, but healthy in the long term.
Fuck Paulson. He is one of the idiots that caused this mess.
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Bill passes. McCain takes credit and Palin moves closer to being Pres. Even 2/3 Repubs saws this coming. You have a MBA. The USA will be around without this bill after the elections in 5 weeks
I;d still put it at 75/25 that it'll pass eventually.
BUT - if everyone digests the impact for the next 48 hours (no congress tomorrow due to holiday), maybe they'll realize they did the right thing.
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percentage wise today's drop isn't even in the top 10 of all time.
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The US dollar is cooked and not for a short time. We are running record deficits with no where to go. No solutions.
The standard of living in this country is going to drop like a stone. It's a fitting end to the worst presidency ever.
We are running, and have been for 30 years, HUGE trade AND budget deficits. The twin spirals of death.
And printing money like it was toilet paper-and that is about what the dollar is worth today.
Bush has been a disater for America. But there is plenty of blame to go around going back to when we first started running the huge twin deficits of trade and budget starting in 1982.
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Billy, you're a fucking idiot.
The republicans voted against the scam because Pelosi dissed them in puiblic, if not for that idiot Pelosi this scam would be a done deal by now.
Just in case you have not figured it out yet Einstein, BOTH the dems and repubs are bought and paid for by Big Business.
BTW Billy , Randall "Duke" Cunningham is in the Big House for 8.8 years, on bribery charges in the biggest corruption case in the history of the US. Congres.
Duke was a republican.
Sorry,I dont listen to 220lbs pieces of shit lifters who cant bench their bodyweights and dont compete.Come back when you break the 250 mark.
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maybe the republican party should be rounded up and put into extermination camps so they cant fuck up the country anymore. COUNTRY FIRST!!!!
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maybe the republican party should be rounded up and put into extermination camps so they cant fuck up the country anymore. COUNTRY FIRST!!!!
94 Dems voted no on it too.
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Guys, get passed the partisan bullshit. This is a failure of big business and government combined. Without some of the key republican leaders, an even worse version of this bill would have been passed on Friday.
I'm glad the bailout failed. I don't want to protect greedy CEOs, nor do I want the gov to be so involved with the market. There were good repubs and democrats that voted against this bill.
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i still think a smaller bailout is going to pass, something like 350-400 billion.
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FYI- Ron Paul was against this bailout from day 1. Did we screw up by the masses and networks not giving him more credibility and time? We need someone who will reform spending policies in washington.
Can we replace McCain for Romney now?
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maybe the republican party should be rounded up and put into extermination camps so they cant fuck up the country anymore. COUNTRY FIRST!!!!
If its such a great bill and IT MUST BE PASSED to save the country.Just tell Pelosi to get the democrats in line and pass it.The republicans cant stop it.Thats whats so amusing.The democrats and the president claim we need to pass it right away,but if they want it passed,pass it.
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I need to get a gun fast.
talk about waiting till the last minute.
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Sorry,I dont listen to 220lbs pieces of shit lifters who cant bench their bodyweights and dont compete.Come back when you break the 250 mark.
Actually 220# was when I was in shape-now I am about as fat as you ;D
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haha nobody really knows a damn thing about this situation, everybody trying to sound all intellectual when in reality there are probably only a handful of experts in the nation who really fully understand the situation. hahahaha
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Guys, get passed the partisan bullshit. This is a failure of big business and government combined. Without some of the key republican leaders, an even worse version of this bill would have been passed on Friday.
I'm glad the bailout failed. I don't want to protect greedy CEOs, nor do I want the gov to be so involved with the market. There were good repubs and democrats that voted against this bill.
Bingo. Big Business owns both parties-it is really stupid to say the dems did this, the repubs did that.
Untill both parties put OUR country first- we are screwed.
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haha nobody really knows a damn thing about this situation, everybody trying to sound all intellectual when in reality there are probably only a handful of experts in the nation who really fully understand the situation. hahahaha
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i think the only "people" who know is the market. we'll see how it reacts. from these last few weeks, we've realized that no one knows shit about how this is gonna pan out.
all i can personally say is "america always wins in the end". so i hope.
buy stocks!!! (or invest in the Bank of Under the Mattress, that one's not going under).
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From what I read (i dabble in stocks a little, nothing too serious), this is what the bill failing to pass has done/caused:
1. as 240 said, it'll bring back responsibility into these companies, knowing there's no "golden parachute"
2. shit companies will go under
3. we won't turn into communist China
4. the markets will rally sooner than if the bill passed, because the government would've cut a check for 700B for "assets" that are worth 0 essentially
5. it will stop,slow down, and possibly even raise the value of the dollar
6. the "bailout" would've caused a massive inflation due to the decreased value of the dollar
7. the "people" for once will win, meaning we won't have to pay for irresponsible lending fuckups
I'm no economist either, but from what I understand about it, I think you're right on 100%
Fucck those greedy bastards
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haha nobody really knows a damn thing about this situation, everybody trying to sound all intellectual when in reality there are probably only a handful of experts in the nation who really fully understand the situation. hahahaha
You sell the public short.
Most people know this fiasco came about over bogus mortgage loans, fueled by lax oversight and greed.
This is not rocket science and the average GED educated citizen knwos it is all about greed, greed allowed to run wild by a Congress bought an paid for by Big Business.
Why do you think Americans are against this bailout 100 to 1???????
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haha nobody really knows a damn thing about this situation, everybody trying to sound all intellectual when in reality there are probably only a handful of experts in the nation who really fully understand the situation. hahahaha
That I agree with.I have no idea where this money will go,how it will be handed out,what it goes to.All we hear is "bailout" ,to tell the truth,I dont have a freaking clue what that means or what it consists of.All I know is that both sides blame each other,but if the democrats like the bill,pass it,they dont need one republican vote to get it through.I also find Pelosi to be a fool.Here she wants republicans on board and then insults them before the vote.She is so arrogant its amazing.The congress has a 17% approval rating and she thinks she has enough power to insult people "she needs".
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Actually 220# was when I was in shape-now I am about as fat as you ;D
Let me give a piece of advise.NEVER EVER say "Im fat".ALWAYS go by the theory that there is no such thing as fat,there is only big.
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That I agree with.I have no idea where this money will go,how it will be handed out,what it goes to.
Nobody does. That will be done solely at Hank Paulson's discretion. THAT is the scary thing. No oversight, no controls. He can send $500 billion to European banks tomorrow and we cnanot do a thing to stop it.
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Nobody does. That will be done solely at Hank Paulson's discretion. THAT is the scary thing. No oversight, no controls. He can send $500 billion to European banks tomorrow and we cnanot do a thing to stop it.
How is that even legal?
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
You know fuck them , lets give them 700 Billion and no oversite on how it's going to go spent ::) thats how they got into this mess to begin with , let them take the hit .
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Nobody does. That will be done solely at Hank Paulson's discretion. THAT is the scary thing. No oversight, no controls. He can send $500 billion to European banks tomorrow and we cnanot do a thing to stop it.
Let me ask you this.According to many ,including Ron Paul,this isnt legal.Do you think,if they strike a deal,that it will be challenged in court?Can it be challenged?Also,if the next president comes in and gets rid of Paulson and names a new guy,does he get the same power.It seems that they are almost establishing a new branch of government that consists of one guy.
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haha, what if he just puts it in his own bank account and says 'thanks guys' and retires? technically no one could stop him loloololollool
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In most firms I've worked, you have people who spend 1-2 hours a day chatting, playing online, taking long lunches, wasting time.
If firms made people work more and goof off less, they can cut 1 in 5 employees.
Those people can go back to school, open a busienss, or ask themselves why they fcked around 2 hours a day at work.
Cha ching Rob. Lots of "wasted" money by companies from employees who goof off. Take breaks on your own time, but if it's slow, why not at least be constructive at work. Most people think that they've "earned" the right to goof off.
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haha, what if he just puts it in his own bank account and says 'thanks guys' and retires? technically no one could stop him loloololollool
you not to bright huh.
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I'm telling ya, the best way for the Bail out to work is to just give the 700 billion to existing homeowners to pay off or down their current mortgages. That will leave the homeowner more of their own money to buy shit or invest in the market.
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Cha ching Rob. Lots of "wasted" money by companies from employees who goof off. Take breaks on your own time, but if it's slow, why not at least be constructive at work. Most people think that they've "earned" the right to goof off.
It has become the "American way". Just do enough to keep your job....no such thing as work ethic anymore. Zero pride.
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
Nothing like taking political and economical advises from someone that lives in a trailer park.
Please enlighten us.
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Glad so many of us are in agreement.
Your right Matrix, we may not get all the finer details that only the higher level economists understand but those of us that have been reading and learning have a good general idea that this plan is not in our best interest for several reasons. One huge reason is as 240 pointed out....all our trust in Paulson with no specific plan or oversight?
Shareholders need to hold their CEO's accountable. The gov also should not force lending institutions to unwisely lend to people who don't qualify for the loans...which is exactly what happened, along with the corporate greed.
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In the end, the average American might look at this as a victory. Unfortunately, winning a small battle means losing the war. Having our banks, and businesses fail right now, is only going to hurt the common man very badly. The wall street fat cats will have their millions no matter what and can leave the country laughing in their private jets. We will lose our jobs, and standards of living. No easy way out of decades of abuse. Should have kept the gold standard.
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In the end, the average American might look at this as a victory. Unfortunately, winning a small battle means losing the war. Having our banks, and businesses fail right now, is only going to hurt the common man very badly. The wall street fat cats will have their millions no matter what and can leave the country laughing in their private jets. We will lose our jobs, and standards of living. No easy way out of decades of abuse. Should have kept the gold standard.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601085&sid=a66YJ5rkOUPM&refer=europe
Europe is bailing out their banks as we speak. If we don't do something then we're fucked. Something has to be done, but there needs to be some oversight to where and how this money gets spent.
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You know fuck them
It's not f-them, it's f-us. In the end we'll suffer. Big politics and big business have much deeper pockets then Joe American. This isn't a Wall street issue, it's a global issue.
The bailout not passing today has everything to do with the upcoming election, not protecting Joe Ameica who isn't well informed and has little idea of how economics work.
In the end, we are born with nothing and we can't take it with us at death. Have fun, enjoy your health. We are in for some very difficult times ahead.
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haha nobody really knows a damn thing about this situation, everybody trying to sound all intellectual when in reality there are probably only a handful of experts in the nation who really fully understand the situation. hahahaha
Best post of this thread.
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A must watch.
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Let me ask you this.According to many ,including Ron Paul,this isnt legal.Do you think,if they strike a deal,that it will be challenged in court?Can it be challenged?Also,if the next president comes in and gets rid of Paulson and names a new guy,does he get the same power.It seems that they are almost establishing a new branch of government that consists of one guy.
Any law passed by Congress can be challenged in court.
The problem is UNLESS it has to something do with race, gender, ethinicity, or orgin you're going to lose.
Economic laws, as long as there is a rational for them, will be upheld.
Paulson made $500 million with Goldman Sachs before he came on board at Treasury, he was one of the leeches making the big dough off the poor and middle class-I would NOT do ANYTHING he aks for.
I am glad the bailout failed.
If the millionaire and billionaire Wall Street brokers want a bailout-they can pay for it.
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A must watchttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dmPchuXIXQh
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Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watc... Part 2 http:/...
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Sorry,I dont listen to 220lbs pieces of shit lifters who cant bench their bodyweights and dont compete.Come back when you break the 250 mark.
LOUD NOISES!!!
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There we go
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I need to get a gun fast.
I'm from texas, i just need to buy more ammo ;D
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That movie has so many errors. People do your own research. ::)
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go goat
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
Good. Why should I pay to bail out thos scumbag lending companies who took advantage of people?
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I bought today near the bottom. There was an overreaction today, and there will be a big correction once a bill, any bill, passes. This shit is so predictible it's like dealing with 5-year-olds. ::)
Dont be surprised to see the market go up 500 points tomorrow!
go goat
X2
I was looking to buy FLM (fat lesbian midget), but I couldn't find that issue listed.
If you don't mind a cock and set of balls DA will sell you some of his "ASSets" :D
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Everything has a down turn. The Economy surged in the 90's and after 2003 it seemed to take off again.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out what went wrong. The Federal government under both Clinton and Bush wanted to deregulate lending laws and create new provisions to help spurt the economy, like 'minority loan programs'. Plus we also had a run and gun Federal Reserve chairman by the name of Allen Greenspan, who was all for banks lending out money without credit checks, employment checks and even collateral. Banks lent out tons of dough and the US economy soared. Dow hit 14,000 and Lloyd Blankfein got his 56 million payout, and I remind you this surge took place despite rising prices, weak dollar, war and every other crap that would normally slow down an economy.
On top of that, the Investment Banks bought from the banks billions upon billions of mortgages only to securitize them; meaning they issued securities such as notes and bonds who's interest parables were backed by the interest receivables on the mortgages. When people started defaulting, they no longer could back their securities. Write offs on the mortgages ensued to the point where the banks not only were losing a lot of money, but credit/financial ratios such as debt to equity ratio got higher and higher. This effected the banks' debt convenants(restrictions placed on a company by creditors), causing their credit ratings to drop. When this happens, creditors want collateral, or want the loan/note's principal amount back. Companies then struggled to raise cash for the collateral(as in the case with AIG having to put up 15 billion in collateral), but couldn't because they were not able to borrow anymore due to their poor credit ratings and performance ratios, and they couldn't exactly finance through issuing stock because no one in the public was willing to buy stock of a sinking company.
It is pretty simple, but the sad thing is that the average American still has no clue. Epic inability too make sense of free information.
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its all just monopoly money anyway
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Oh, no we're all doomed!!!!!!!
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mccain can't stop blaming obama for this whole mess.
obama is just letting mccain talk. everyone knows mccain punked out on the debate, then didn't do shit on the bill. When Obama and Bush and Mcain were in the room, Obama laid out his points, then said to mccain "What do you think, Sen Mccain", daring him to take a position. McCain remained silent and never committed to a position.
A wise man told me "don't argue with fools, cause people from a distace can't tell who's who".
Obama is letting mccain talk. Everyone know what happened. Mcain owned himself then STFU when put in a position to answer the Q.
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mccain can't stop blaming obama for this whole mess.
obama is just letting mccain talk. everyone knows mccain punked out on the debate, then didn't do shit on the bill. When Obama and Bush and Mcain were in the room, Obama laid out his points, then said to mccain "What do you think, Sen Mccain", daring him to take a position. McCain remained silent and never committed to a position.
A wise man told me "don't argue with fools, cause people from a distace can't tell who's who".
Obama is letting mccain talk. Everyone know what happened. Mcain owned himself then STFU when put in a position to answer the Q.
Agreed Obama is just sitting back and letting Mccain run his mouth right out of the election....I know what wise man you speak of.
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Whilst I don't really doubt that the situation is dire, there has been a lot of fear mongering about what happens if the bailout bill is not accepted. In fact, when the bill was first announced it was being pushed through on a platform of fear.
Earlier this week - when Wachovia got into dire straits, Citibank was able to step in & save the day.
If there's no bailout, or a much smaller bailout - will it really be as bad as the press & the politicos make out ?
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will it really be as bad as the press & the politicos make out ?
No. If Bush sells this, he'll control 700 billion, any way he wants.
Congress and USA doesn't trust him. Can't blame a guy for trying. But after WMD, 911, etc... nobody assigns any credibility to him.
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Bingo. Post of the day. CJ -- you know your stuff, my friend.
Now, on to the $25K question? Did the US create lax regs on lending specifically to create this problem, in order to eventually slow economic growth and the out-of-control housing market, artifically depress the value of US currency, and attract foreign-moving manufacturing industry back into the US?
Why make your weapons in a third world country with a comparatively weak dollar? Why, those folks might steal the weapons, or make them work against the US. Better to get that stuff built by American unionized labor where it can be better controlled. Only way that happens is if you make it ridiculously attractive for biz to set up shop in the US and create foreign direct investment thanks to an artificially depressed currency.
That, or maybe everyone just wanted to get filthy rich and didn't think the ride would end.
If this does pass, then it could give the government a significant equity stake in the companies that it chooses to buy mortgages from. Could lead to huge future profits for the Treasury in future should the economy surge, but how of that gain if any will be given back to the tax payer?
And there's the question to whether this will EVEN WORK. I mean, we haven't even received info to how much the government will pay on each loan.. .60 cents per dollar? We don't even know how the 700 billion figure was calculated. ::)
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No. If Bush sells this, he'll control 700 billion, any way he wants.
Congress and USA doesn't trust him. Can't blame a guy for trying. But after WMD, 911, etc... nobody assigns any credibility to him.
It's way more than 700 billion, bro! The power he's asking for will put taxpayers on the hook into the trillions.
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Fucking media (cnn) is making the house out to be loonies, with pseudo financial analysts who couldn't even read a balance sheet predicting doomsday for everyday America.
They want this fucking bill passed, but hopefully America has enough intestinal fortitude to oppose it, as do their elected officials in the form of house conservative Republicans, until there are enough provisions in it to drastically alter it from Bush' original, and until the dollar figure is reduced and matched to something the explains why such a figure is needed in the first place.
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If only we had this man..
He could have solved it for us. He was behind the government intervention in the great depression. A real thinking man who understood consequences totally unlike that short-term kike mofo named Allen Greenspan.
(http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/04_15/art04_15/0415_20innova.jpg)
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i want to know why congress takes a day off for a fucking jew holiday? what a disgrace...
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So we, the tax payers, are in effect forced into being shareholders of usa.com only there will be no dividends with this one.
It's all becoming a pretty sad joke. Bail-out or not, this is a free market and market forces will ultimately win out either way.
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(http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/04_15/art04_15/0415_20innova.jpg)
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i want to know why congress takes a day off for a fucking jew holiday? what a disgrace...
STFU you nazi anti semite.
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Thank God for republicans in the house.It once again shows how absolutely pathetic Pelosi is as speaker of the house.If she had any pull at all she could have gotten it through.Think republicans would have gone against Tom Delay like that?
Fairly amusing that it was the dems that protected Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac,wouldnt try to corral them,fought any attempt to reign them in,and now THEY want to have us believe that they can save us.
Nancy Pelosi and Barney Frank and Bush and Paulson, should all resign immediately. They are not competent and not doing the work of the people.
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STFU you nazi anti semite.
sigh... don't take a moral stand for some stupid way of life.. judaism, christianity .. all that shit.. pointless in our history - just gets in the way of life.
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Nobody does. That will be done solely at Hank Paulson's discretion. THAT is the scary thing. No oversight, no controls. He can send $500 billion to European banks tomorrow and we cnanot do a thing to stop it.
I am a republican, but do not agree with this bailout.
1. Why the figure 700 billion?
2. Why do we need to buy toxic deadbeat mortgages to free up credit?
3. How much is the government paying for these things and are they even real?
4. Why give so much power to one person who might be there for only 4 months? WTF is up with that?
5. The government screwed this mess up and cant be trusted to fix it.
6. The housing bubble needs to burst so homes can become more affordable again. The housing bubble was created by cheap and easy financing.
7. Where is my bailout?
8. Who is going to run the auctions and sales of these properties?
9. How do we even know these properties are still in decent shape?
10. How many of these loans were to illegal aliens?
The government is your enemy. It is even a worse enemy when they are in bed with Wall Street.
No Bailout.
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Is this gonna effect the orange crop.I have an inside tip :)
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Because if no credit is available, businesses can't get loans. If businesses can't get loans, they can't operate, at least not in the long term. Then they start laying off employees en masse. These employees can't get new jobs, because no new businesses are starting and existing businesses aren't expanding because no credit is available. These unemployed workers stop spending, which causes reduced sales at businesses which leads to further layoffs, and the cycle keeps feeding on itself. End result? 1929 (or worse). If you say the current situation isn't our problem, then I hope you like bread lines and soup kitchens. Credit is the very basis of a capitalistic economy.
I could see if the govt wanted to provide money for new loans based upon sound lending principles to make new credit available. Bailing out these greedy slobs on wall street for toxic mortgages makes no sense to me on any level and is only throwing good money after bad.
The govt can provide liquidity for new loans. Why not start there?
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Because if no credit is available, businesses can't get loans. If businesses can't get loans, they can't operate, at least not in the long term. Then they start laying off employees en masse. These employees can't get new jobs, because no new businesses are starting and existing businesses aren't expanding because no credit is available. These unemployed workers stop spending, which causes reduced sales at businesses which leads to further layoffs, and the cycle keeps feeding on itself. End result? 1929 (or worse). If you say the current situation isn't our problem, then I hope you like bread lines and soup kitchens. Credit is the very basis of a capitalistic economy.
Something needs to be done. I agree, but the plan as proposed is just nonsensical to me on every level.
There are many other ways to free up money than paying off the banks for greedy decisions they made.
If new loans need to be made, the govt can help back those loans, but buying subprime loans who are backed by declining assets seems bizarre.
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Because if no credit is available, businesses can't get loans. If businesses can't get loans, they can't operate, at least not in the long term. Then they start laying off employees en masse. These employees can't get new jobs, because no new businesses are starting and existing businesses aren't expanding because no credit is available. These unemployed workers stop spending, which causes reduced sales at businesses which leads to further layoffs, and the cycle keeps feeding on itself. End result? 1929 (or worse). If you say the current situation isn't our problem, then I hope you like bread lines and soup kitchens. Credit is the very basis of a capitalistic economy.
Goat laying down an economy 101 ownage.
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Goat laying down an economy 101 ownage.
How so? No one is saying that credit markets need help, but I don't see how buying bad debt does that.
If the banks want and need to give out new loans, the govt can help with that and does not have to stick the tax payer with a trillion dollar tab for declining assests that were not worth the paper they were written on even at the time they were generated.
Many of these mortgages were based on inflated appraisals and are almost worthless now. Is that what you want to sign up for?
The doom and gloom is just silly. There are better ways out of this jam than sticking the taxpayer with the bad decisions of greedy bankers and govt incompetents.
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/financial_meltdown (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/financial_meltdown)
Never before has a President so exposed himself as not caring whatsoever about what the American people think. This bill was torpedoed because the American people got on the phone and computer and bombarded their House Representative with calls and emails. The overwhelming majority of Americans DO NOT WANT THIS BILL PASSED.
But King George just doesn't care about what we have to say. Our will is completely irrelevant.
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It isn't just about buying bad mortgages, but also a matter of confidence. Banks would be a lot more confident and willing to lend out money if they had someone to unload their bad balance sheet items on, and in this case they would unload on the government.
I'm glad congress shot down Paulson's proposal. They need to modify it to their terms, and to the terms of the American tax payer.
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One of the huge problems is this bailout plan was pushed onto congress by a man who was a Wall Street executive, and a president with a 20% approval rating. Then you had McCain creating drama by trying to play the hero. You also had people like Nancy Pelosi taking the public for granted, and the house Republicans growing a pair and reverting back to their conservative roots. ;D
I hope their is some sort of solution, even be it on the tax payer's tab. Credit is not only slow in the US, but also in Europe and Asia. People are worried there too.
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what i dont understand is:
if a bill gets voted down
they just reword it a little
keep pushing it
and re-vote on it
repeat, till it gets passed.
what's the point of even having a vote then, if they are just going to keep pushing the bill till it gets passed? we may as well just become a dictatorship
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One of the huge problems is this bailout plan was pushed onto congress by a man who was a Wall Street executive, and a president with a 20% approval rating. Then you had McCain creating drama by trying to play the hero. You also had people like Nancy Pelosi taking the public for granted, and the house Republicans growing a pair and reverting back to their conservative roots. ;D
I hope their is some sort of solution, even be it on the tax payer's tab. Credit is not only slow in the US, but also in Europe and Asia. People are worried there too.
i have a feeling there was an ulterior motive to voting no, rather than 'growing a pair'. this bailout has a provision that gives paulson even more power, he's like a financial dictator.
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what i dont understand is:
if a bill gets voted down
they just reword it a little
keep pushing it
and re-vote on it
repeat, till it gets passed.
what's the point of even having a vote then, if they are just going to keep pushing the bill till it gets passed? we may as well just become a dictatorship
Well, if there is no big economy crash, maybe congress will realize they did the right thing in not giving Bush a blank check for $700 billion with zero restrictions.
I'm all for helping stimulate the economy, but they just pulled that number out of their ass and demanded zero oversight. They didn't tell us how they'd use it.
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The DOW dropped 700 points instantly (then recovered some - only down 500 points at the moment.)
Turn on CNN or MSNBC. If you own stock, you are having a bad day. Republicans are refusing to give corporate welfare to big companies. Bush wants $700 billion and refuses to tell us how he'll spend it.
If the bill fails, dollar will suffer for a short time, but may be stronger in the long run.
Haha. Its time to organize the war as usual for aiding this economic situation ;D
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i have a feeling there was an ulterior motive to voting no, rather than 'growing a pair'. this bailout has a provision that gives paulson even more power, he's like a financial dictator.
That's true.. Plus a huge number of them are facing tough elections, so naturally they would listen to the public.
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i have a feeling there was an ulterior motive to voting no, rather than 'growing a pair'. this bailout has a provision that gives paulson even more power, he's like a financial dictator.
Do your part. I did mine and called my congresswoman and two senators and told them NO BAILOUT!
This plan is atrocious. BTW - Pelosi is going to probably put the acorn provision back in there.
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Is this gonna effect the orange crop.I have an inside tip :)
Bet you a dollar it won't.
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Here's great government for us....its a jewish holiday and everyone is off, in the middle of a major crisis. In a private business, this would be unacceptible. Pathetic. The economy is tanking and they all take a holiday.
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Because if no credit is available, businesses can't get loans. If businesses can't get loans, they can't operate, at least not in the long term. Then they start laying off employees en masse. These employees can't get new jobs, because no new businesses are starting and existing businesses aren't expanding because no credit is available. These unemployed workers stop spending, which causes reduced sales at businesses which leads to further layoffs, and the cycle keeps feeding on itself. End result? 1929 (or worse). If you say the current situation isn't our problem, then I hope you like bread lines and soup kitchens. Credit is the very basis of a capitalistic economy.
You're really smart (a lot moreso than that fucking idiot TRUE ADONIS), but you are somewhat wrong about credit being the basis of capitalism. The fact is, it wouldn't be necessary if not for the stranglehold that the Federal Reserve and the Jewish bankers have on the economy. So, in the bastardized sense of the word capitalism, you are correct, but in terms of true capitalism as detailed by Adam Smith, no, credit is not a basis.
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This should show us that we cannot give more power to the federal gov whether repubs or democrats are in charge. They fight & argue their partisan bullshit. Pelosi is among the worst, she needs to step down.
We can thank some real conservative republicans and some democrats for rejecting this recent version of the bill. It needs to be re-worked and other options need to be on the table. Bush is not a conservative. get rid of the neocons and the big spending liberals (the kind that support ACORN too) and give the gov back to hard working moderates of both parties, caring conservatives and people who follow the principles of the constitution Bloomberg hit it right on Meet the press...the right is getting farther right and the left farther left.
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Vote on the revised bailout:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=238695.0