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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: Get SWOLE!! on November 11, 2008, 09:13:24 AM
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In recent weeks I have been looking into the world of aas, something I had never considered before. I've done tons of research, rented Bigger, Faster, stronger, prowled multiple boards and websites. But I'm wondering if I should. Here are my reasons for wondering if I should:
I am 28 and really got into the bodybuilding side of fitness after leaving the Marines in 2002. I was in great shape but very skinny, 150 lbs. I started working out with a buddy in college just to pass the time. After I graduated I took about a Yr off, 2005-2006, and then got back into it. In 2007 I became very serious about it and am now considering competing next year. I am currently 203, 17.5" arms, 45" chest, 17" calves, not sure about the rest, and I'm at approx 13% bf according to my electronic reader. I don't know if I would truly consider myself natural since I have done all kinds of OTC supps like 1-test to my recent p-plex cycle. I've been doing good on these types of supps along with my workout and diet, gaining almost 30 lbs since 2007, 2" to my arms and 3" to my chest in that time. So the reason I ask if I should go to the darkside is because I get good gains from OTC and have not reached a plateau. Hell I pressed 405 last week.
So what do all of you experienced bros think? I'm nervous about it to be sure, I've made great progress from the 150 lbs bonebag that I was, but I want to continue to grow.
Thanks in advance
Semper Fi
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That's a very hard question to answer...it's really something that you have to make your mind up about and no one else.
If you're still making progress naturally then staying natural would be fine. Sure, your progress will be greater if you use AAS and to the extent you want to take that is again really up to you.
Use your own judgment, weigh the risk/reward factor and go from there.
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I def understand what you are saying. Thanks for the reply.
I was looking at test e for 12 wks at 500 using dbol for a kick off at 4 wks.
But I guess I have more thinking to do on it. Just seems that at least I know more what I'm getting this way and seems to be safer than running all of the OTC methyls
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I def understand what you are saying. Thanks for the reply.
I was looking at test e for 12 wks at 500 using dbol for a kick off at 4 wks.
But I guess I have more thinking to do on it. Just seems that at least I know more what I'm getting this way and seems to be safer than running all of the OTC methyls
Yes, it would be much safer then the OTC stuff.
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DON'T DO IT!!!!
Its one of those things where you need to be 100 percent in or 100 percent out. Once you jump in, there is no getting out, and you will (even though you say "no way not me") be cycling off and on for the next several years with no end in site.
one cycle may go on for a half a year, or then a year, the forever.... its a fun ride, but a hard one to stop.
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DON'T DO IT!!!!
Its one of those things where you need to be 100 percent in or 100 percent out. Once you jump in, there is no getting out, and you will (even though you say "no way not me") be cycling off and on for the next several years with no end in site.
one cycle may go on for a half a year, or then a year, the forever.... its a fun ride, but a hard one to stop.
He is right. Once you start turning back is very hard to do. at first it's simply because you're not going to want to. There are those though that do it, run a cycle or two and that's it, but I'd be willing to bet my life on it that they are less then 5% of all AAS users.
Now this isn't to scare you off, but I'll give you a little taste of hard truth...this probably belongs in my "The Truth" thread.
I started using when I was 24, and for the first two years or so I did the basics. Basic cycles, all around 12-16wks, test as a base and deca or tren in most of them, with a mix of various orals for 4-6wks in most of them, along with proper PCT. The next 4 years was a different story. Longer harsher cycles that turned into not cycles at all but more or less not coming off or coming off for only 4-5wks at a time maybe once a year.
This past winter/spring I came off everything altogether and stayed off for the first time in 4 years. What happened? I came off with proper PCT and all that, but it should have been a much longer one and even then I don't know if it would have done the trick. After about a month of being off all my PCT meds I began to crash hard. Energy was in the tank, drive was in the tank, body fat started going up, my sexual desire was way down and keeping an erection became very difficult and sometimes impossible.
So now what? I have not been doing any "Real" cycling. I run 250mg/wk of test-e every 7-10 days. That seems to be just right to keep everything normal...it fixed all my problems. My point, I am now 30 years old and may never be able to come off test for the rest of my life. If I get to a point where I can't afford it I could end up being screwed.
I have spoken to a Dr. who believes that if I do come off everything that with about a year of proper medication and staying off, I could get back to normal. However, I have yet to decide when I will do that simply because I know I probably have a few more really good cycles under my belt and have some desire to do some more bodybuilding related things. Once that's said and done, I'm done, no more cycling at all, no more nothing. I may get on HRT again when I get a little older since I am a firm believer in that but we'll see.
As of now though, no major health problems, no liver problems, no BP problems, no kidney problems...perfect health.
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Thanks for all of the persepective....You all have def given me a lot to think about...And you are right, I need to either be 100% with it or not at all
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He is right. Once you start turning back is very hard to do. at first it's simply because you're not going to want to. There are those though that do it, run a cycle or two and that's it, but I'd be willing to bet my life on it that they are less then 5% of all AAS users.
Now this isn't to scare you off, but I'll give you a little taste of hard truth...this probably belongs in my "The Truth" thread.
I started using when I was 24, and for the first two years or so I did the basics. Basic cycles, all around 12-16wks, test as a base and deca or tren in most of them, with a mix of various orals for 4-6wks in most of them, along with proper PCT. The next 4 years was a different story. Longer harsher cycles that turned into not cycles at all but more or less not coming off or coming off for only 4-5wks at a time maybe once a year.
This past winter/spring I came off everything altogether and stayed off for the first time in 4 years. What happened? I came off with proper PCT and all that, but it should have been a much longer one and even then I don't know if it would have done the trick. After about a month of being off all my PCT meds I began to crash hard. Energy was in the tank, drive was in the tank, body fat started going up, my sexual desire was way down and keeping an erection became very difficult and sometimes impossible.
So now what? I have not been doing any "Real" cycling. I run 250mg/wk of test-e every 7-10 days. That seems to be just right to keep everything normal...it fixed all my problems. My point, I am now 30 years old and may never be able to come off test for the rest of my life. If I get to a point where I can't afford it I could end up being screwed.
I have spoken to a Dr. who believes that if I do come off everything that with about a year of proper medication and staying off, I could get back to normal. However, I have yet to decide when I will do that simply because I know I probably have a few more really good cycles under my belt and have some desire to do some more bodybuilding related things. Once that's said and done, I'm done, no more cycling at all, no more nothing. I may get on HRT again when I get a little older since I am a firm believer in that but we'll see.
As of now though, no major health problems, no liver problems, no BP problems, no kidney problems...perfect health.
Good post.
Gear is addictive plus you will find you may end up spending a bunch of money on it too.
But to be JACKED?....................Pric eless...
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He is right. Once you start turning back is very hard to do. at first it's simply because you're not going to want to. There are those though that do it, run a cycle or two and that's it, but I'd be willing to bet my life on it that they are less then 5% of all AAS users.
Now this isn't to scare you off, but I'll give you a little taste of hard truth...this probably belongs in my "The Truth" thread.
I started using when I was 24, and for the first two years or so I did the basics. Basic cycles, all around 12-16wks, test as a base and deca or tren in most of them, with a mix of various orals for 4-6wks in most of them, along with proper PCT. The next 4 years was a different story. Longer harsher cycles that turned into not cycles at all but more or less not coming off or coming off for only 4-5wks at a time maybe once a year.
This past winter/spring I came off everything altogether and stayed off for the first time in 4 years. What happened? I came off with proper PCT and all that, but it should have been a much longer one and even then I don't know if it would have done the trick. After about a month of being off all my PCT meds I began to crash hard. Energy was in the tank, drive was in the tank, body fat started going up, my sexual desire was way down and keeping an erection became very difficult and sometimes impossible.
So now what? I have not been doing any "Real" cycling. I run 250mg/wk of test-e every 7-10 days. That seems to be just right to keep everything normal...it fixed all my problems. My point, I am now 30 years old and may never be able to come off test for the rest of my life. If I get to a point where I can't afford it I could end up being screwed.
I have spoken to a Dr. who believes that if I do come off everything that with about a year of proper medication and staying off, I could get back to normal. However, I have yet to decide when I will do that simply because I know I probably have a few more really good cycles under my belt and have some desire to do some more bodybuilding related things. Once that's said and done, I'm done, no more cycling at all, no more nothing. I may get on HRT again when I get a little older since I am a firm believer in that but we'll see.
As of now though, no major health problems, no liver problems, no BP problems, no kidney problems...perfect health.
wow that must really suck aj...im assuming your natural test levels are really low? what kind of post cycle therapy did you use?
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He is right. Once you start turning back is very hard to do. at first it's simply because you're not going to want to. There are those though that do it, run a cycle or two and that's it, but I'd be willing to bet my life on it that they are less then 5% of all AAS users.
Now this isn't to scare you off, but I'll give you a little taste of hard truth...this probably belongs in my "The Truth" thread.
I started using when I was 24, and for the first two years or so I did the basics. Basic cycles, all around 12-16wks, test as a base and deca or tren in most of them, with a mix of various orals for 4-6wks in most of them, along with proper PCT. The next 4 years was a different story. Longer harsher cycles that turned into not cycles at all but more or less not coming off or coming off for only 4-5wks at a time maybe once a year.
This past winter/spring I came off everything altogether and stayed off for the first time in 4 years. What happened? I came off with proper PCT and all that, but it should have been a much longer one and even then I don't know if it would have done the trick. After about a month of being off all my PCT meds I began to crash hard. Energy was in the tank, drive was in the tank, body fat started going up, my sexual desire was way down and keeping an erection became very difficult and sometimes impossible.
So now what? I have not been doing any "Real" cycling. I run 250mg/wk of test-e every 7-10 days. That seems to be just right to keep everything normal...it fixed all my problems. My point, I am now 30 years old and may never be able to come off test for the rest of my life. If I get to a point where I can't afford it I could end up being screwed.
I have spoken to a Dr. who believes that if I do come off everything that with about a year of proper medication and staying off, I could get back to normal. However, I have yet to decide when I will do that simply because I know I probably have a few more really good cycles under my belt and have some desire to do some more bodybuilding related things. Once that's said and done, I'm done, no more cycling at all, no more nothing. I may get on HRT again when I get a little older since I am a firm believer in that but we'll see.
As of now though, no major health problems, no liver problems, no BP problems, no kidney problems...perfect health.
Nice post I can't believe I missed it.
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He is right. Once you start turning back is very hard to do. at first it's simply because you're not going to want to. There are those though that do it, run a cycle or two and that's it, but I'd be willing to bet my life on it that they are less then 5% of all AAS users.
Now this isn't to scare you off, but I'll give you a little taste of hard truth...this probably belongs in my "The Truth" thread.
I started using when I was 24, and for the first two years or so I did the basics. Basic cycles, all around 12-16wks, test as a base and deca or tren in most of them, with a mix of various orals for 4-6wks in most of them, along with proper PCT. The next 4 years was a different story. Longer harsher cycles that turned into not cycles at all but more or less not coming off or coming off for only 4-5wks at a time maybe once a year.
This past winter/spring I came off everything altogether and stayed off for the first time in 4 years. What happened? I came off with proper PCT and all that, but it should have been a much longer one and even then I don't know if it would have done the trick. After about a month of being off all my PCT meds I began to crash hard. Energy was in the tank, drive was in the tank, body fat started going up, my sexual desire was way down and keeping an erection became very difficult and sometimes impossible.
So now what? I have not been doing any "Real" cycling. I run 250mg/wk of test-e every 7-10 days. That seems to be just right to keep everything normal...it fixed all my problems. My point, I am now 30 years old and may never be able to come off test for the rest of my life. If I get to a point where I can't afford it I could end up being screwed.
I have spoken to a Dr. who believes that if I do come off everything that with about a year of proper medication and staying off, I could get back to normal. However, I have yet to decide when I will do that simply because I know I probably have a few more really good cycles under my belt and have some desire to do some more bodybuilding related things. Once that's said and done, I'm done, no more cycling at all, no more nothing. I may get on HRT again when I get a little older since I am a firm believer in that but we'll see.
As of now though, no major health problems, no liver problems, no BP problems, no kidney problems...perfect health.
I'm 25, almost 26 and I'm where you were a few years back. Only done one real cycle, about to start my second (this one for a comp) and obviously since I'm so green I still have great health. I plan to keep a close eye on everything and do it right.
Now I do have plans that if everything goes well, I may start to stay on longer and longer if I feel it is worth it.
I want to have kids someday and one of my biggest concerns is loosing that ability. When you say you have perfect health, did you have your sperm count checked as well? Just curious if that has been affected at all. I know everyone is different and some have even gotten a girl pregnant while on gear, but one more piece of evidence from someone who is straight up about things would be nice.
As of right now my boys do just fine. Ex. The first time I ever had sex the girl got pregnant. :o That'll scare the crap out of any 15 yr old.
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Good post.
Gear is addictive plus you will find you may end up spending a bunch of money on it too.
But to be JACKED?....................Pric eless...
Hell I don't know if it would be any more expensive than what I pay OTC. All this crap is so under dosed you have to buy multiple bottles. 3-ad for 6 weeks at a decent dosage cost about $175. Gained 14 lbs in 6 weeks, lost half with PCT. So some of the prices I've seen with beginner doses of aas maybe cheaper
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wow that must really suck aj...im assuming your natural test levels are really low? what kind of post cycle therapy did you use?
Yes, low indeed, but the HRT takes care of everything.
I used the same PCT I have been using for the past 3 years or so, but for the past 3 years when I ran a PCT I was only actually off for a very short period of time.
My PCT for the most part looked like this:
HCG 1000iu/ed for 10 straight days followed by nolva and clomid
wk 1: clomid 300mg/ed
wk 2: clomid 100mg/ed
wk 3: clomid 50mg/ed, nolva 40mg/ed
wk 4: nolva 40mg/ed
wk 5: nolva 30mg/ed
wk 6: nolva 20mg/ed
I'm 25, almost 26 and I'm where you were a few years back. Only done one real cycle, about to start my second (this one for a comp) and obviously since I'm so green I still have great health. I plan to keep a close eye on everything and do it right.
Now I do have plans that if everything goes well, I may start to stay on longer and longer if I feel it is worth it.
I want to have kids someday and one of my biggest concerns is loosing that ability. When you say you have perfect health, did you have your sperm count checked as well? Just curious if that has been affected at all. I know everyone is different and some have even gotten a girl pregnant while on gear, but one more piece of evidence from someone who is straight up about things would be nice.
As of right now my boys do just fine. Ex. The first time I ever had sex the girl got pregnant. :o That'll scare the crap out of any 15 yr old.
Never have had my sperm count checked, but it is something I have thought about because I would imagine it is on the low side right now.
As for getting a girl pregnant while on cycle, I got my girl friend pregnant while on cycle when I was 25...she ended up losing the bay though do to getting extremely sick and ending up in the hospital.
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As for getting a girl pregnant while on cycle, I got my girl friend pregnant while on cycle when I was 25...she ended up losing the bay though do to getting extremely sick and ending up in the hospital.
I'm sorry to hear that man. I have friends who went through a similar experience. Their pregnancy was planned though so it was extremely hard. They are pregnant again though and so far so good, expecting in a couple months.
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Yes, low indeed, but the HRT takes care of everything.
I used the same PCT I have been using for the past 3 years or so, but for the past 3 years when I ran a PCT I was only actually off for a very short period of time.
My PCT for the most part looked like this:
HCG 1000iu/ed for 10 straight days followed by nolva and clomid
wk 1: clomid 300mg/ed
wk 2: clomid 100mg/ed
wk 3: clomid 50mg/ed, nolva 40mg/ed
wk 4: nolva 40mg/ed
wk 5: nolva 30mg/ed
wk 6: nolva 20mg/ed
Never have had my sperm count checked, but it is something I have thought about because I would imagine it is on the low side right now.
As for getting a girl pregnant while on cycle, I got my girl friend pregnant while on cycle when I was 25...she ended up losing the bay though do to getting extremely sick and ending up in the hospital.
that is my worst fear to lose my natural test production...so far i havent had any issues...but i dont go on for more then 18 weeks and only do one cycle a year...mayb an extra winter mini cycle but thats about it...can AAS make you permenantly sterile?
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that is my worst fear to lose my natural test production...so far i havent had any issues...but i dont go on for more then 18 weeks and only do one cycle a year...mayb an extra winter mini cycle but thats about it...can AAS make you permenantly sterile?
Permanently for life? Doubtful, but it can cause problems for a good while and can take some serious time to get over.
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where you using mega doses all year around?
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where you using mega doses all year around?
Somewhat.
Ran 1350mg/test/wk for 6 months at one point, cut back down to 750m/wk for say 3 or 4 months, and then went back up to 250mg/eod, which is what I did for about a year and a half before coming off back this past March.
I can't remember the exact numbers of everything, but I know at a few points I ran 3000+ total mg/wk combined with everything I took for long stints. Was also running HGH for a large portion of that time, but never over 4iu/ed but that wouldn't effect what we're talking about but it was part of my bag...along with lots of clen and t-3.
There was a time when every time I would take a hot shower my nose would bleed and I mean bleed a lot. At that point I cut my deca dose down and it seemed to take care of it for the most part.
Had a nose bleen once while doing heavy squats which is kind of bad ass in a really sick way, lol! But in retrospect it's idiotic.
Best I ever looked I wasn't running too much compared to what I had run in the past, that was the summer of 2007. In 2006 I took the month of December off everything, and got back on test in Jan. just test at 250mg/eod and ran that up until April and then added the HGH back in. In May I started a contest cycle:
test-e 250mg/eod
eq 300mg/eod
clen and t-3 ramping up slowly
hgh 4iu/ed
that was the first half, the 2nd half:
Test prop 200mg/ed
tren-a 75mg/ed
winny 50mg/ed
clen and t-3 ramping up slowly
hgh 4iu/ed
Towards the back of the second half I bumped the tren-a up to 100mg/ed and the winny up to 100mg/ed and took 40mg of halo every day.
2wks out from my show I was running a 104 degree fever, was dehydrated so badly that all the capillaries in my legs from the knees down busted. I also passed out cold at work one day. At the 2wk out mark I looked worse then i did at 3wks out...looked like I was back 5 or so wks...looked bloated and really weird.
Now I don't attribute my mess that happened last summer to AAS per say, more due to the stress of doing way too many things. At that time I was still working in construction in one of the hottest summers we've ever had, working as a personal trainer as well, also I was still trying to get my witting career off the ground combined with training and dieting for a show with 2 a day cardio sessions...it just became too much and my body said no more and simply shut down.
At that time I was working with Dave P. on my contest diet and he advised I take a few wks off altogether and do another show that was in late Oct. But at that point my mind was out of it, I was out of it and I had to lay aside the bodybuilding stuff and concentrate on work more because I was pissing off a lot of people at that point and not helping my overall situation.
I stayed on test after I stopped the diet and would do some other things during the fall winter as far as drugs go but on a smaller scale compared to previous runs. But when the spring started approaching that's when I decided I really needed to put my full attention into other things, and give bodybuilding a full rest for at least a year. Yes, I still train and train hard...not as hard as I used to but still consistently and well. No exact plans for the future but I have my eye and mind on a few things I want to do so time will tell.
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In recent weeks I have been looking into the world of aas, something I had never considered before. I've done tons of research, rented Bigger, Faster, stronger, prowled multiple boards and websites. But I'm wondering if I should. Here are my reasons for wondering if I should:
I am 28 and really got into the bodybuilding side of fitness after leaving the Marines in 2002. I was in great shape but very skinny, 150 lbs. I started working out with a buddy in college just to pass the time. After I graduated I took about a Yr off, 2005-2006, and then got back into it. In 2007 I became very serious about it and am now considering competing next year. I am currently 203, 17.5" arms, 45" chest, 17" calves, not sure about the rest, and I'm at approx 13% bf according to my electronic reader. I don't know if I would truly consider myself natural since I have done all kinds of OTC supps like 1-test to my recent p-plex cycle. I've been doing good on these types of supps along with my workout and diet, gaining almost 30 lbs since 2007, 2" to my arms and 3" to my chest in that time. So the reason I ask if I should go to the darkside is because I get good gains from OTC and have not reached a plateau. Hell I pressed 405 last week.
So what do all of you experienced bros think? I'm nervous about it to be sure, I've made great progress from the 150 lbs bonebag that I was, but I want to continue to grow.
Thanks in advance
Semper Fi
If you're pressing 405lbs. without AAS, then it's more a matter of goals.
Do you want more size, more strength?
Are you just going for aesthetics?
Less is more, so I'd use the least amount necessary if you want to cross over to the Darkside of the force.
DIV
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Somewhat.
Ran 1350mg/test/wk for 6 months at one point, cut back down to 750m/wk for say 3 or 4 months, and then went back up to 250mg/eod, which is what I did for about a year and a half before coming off back this past March.
I can't remember the exact numbers of everything, but I know at a few points I ran 3000+ total mg/wk combined with everything I took for long stints. Was also running HGH for a large portion of that time, but never over 4iu/ed but that wouldn't effect what we're talking about but it was part of my bag...along with lots of clen and t-3.
There was a time when every time I would take a hot shower my nose would bleed and I mean bleed a lot. At that point I cut my deca dose down and it seemed to take care of it for the most part.
Had a nose bleen once while doing heavy squats which is kind of bad ass in a really sick way, lol! But in retrospect it's idiotic.
Best I ever looked I wasn't running too much compared to what I had run in the past, that was the summer of 2007. In 2006 I took the month of December off everything, and got back on test in Jan. just test at 250mg/eod and ran that up until April and then added the HGH back in. In May I started a contest cycle:
test-e 250mg/eod
eq 300mg/eod
clen and t-3 ramping up slowly
hgh 4iu/ed
that was the first half, the 2nd half:
Test prop 200mg/ed
tren-a 75mg/ed
winny 50mg/ed
clen and t-3 ramping up slowly
hgh 4iu/ed
Towards the back of the second half I bumped the tren-a up to 100mg/ed and the winny up to 100mg/ed and took 40mg of halo every day.
2wks out from my show I was running a 104 degree fever, was dehydrated so badly that all the capillaries in my legs from the knees down busted. I also passed out cold at work one day. At the 2wk out mark I looked worse then i did at 3wks out...looked like I was back 5 or so wks...looked bloated and really weird.
Now I don't attribute my mess that happened last summer to AAS per say, more due to the stress of doing way too many things. At that time I was still working in construction in one of the hottest summers we've ever had, working as a personal trainer as well, also I was still trying to get my witting career off the ground combined with training and dieting for a show with 2 a day cardio sessions...it just became too much and my body said no more and simply shut down.
At that time I was working with Dave P. on my contest diet and he advised I take a few wks off altogether and do another show that was in late Oct. But at that point my mind was out of it, I was out of it and I had to lay aside the bodybuilding stuff and concentrate on work more because I was pissing off a lot of people at that point and not helping my overall situation.
I stayed on test after I stopped the diet and would do some other things during the fall winter as far as drugs go but on a smaller scale compared to previous runs. But when the spring started approaching that's when I decided I really needed to put my full attention into other things, and give bodybuilding a full rest for at least a year. Yes, I still train and train hard...not as hard as I used to but still consistently and well. No exact plans for the future but I have my eye and mind on a few things I want to do so time will tell.
that must have been a rough road my friend....most guys would have quit training after going through all of that...hope your health is all good...im assuming you get regular blood tests done? how is your liver and kidneys?
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see, i do not want to be completely depended like that... where i now need test injections every week.
i think one key to this would be to use low dose cycles for short time.... ie. like 500 test only for 12-14 weeks, then use PCT and I bet you can keep your own test levels afterwards and not be completely depended on exogenous test injections...
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see, i do not want to be completely depended like that... where i now need test injections every week.
i think one key to this would be to use low dose cycles for short time.... ie. like 500 test only for 12-14 weeks, then use PCT and I bet you can keep your own test levels afterwards and not be completely depended on exogenous test injections...
Yes very moderate use would be best for your overall health.
But then if you wanna be out of the ordinary...
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If you're pressing 405lbs. without AAS, then it's more a matter of goals.
Do you want more size, more strength?
Are you just going for aesthetics?
Less is more, so I'd use the least amount necessary if you want to cross over to the Darkside of the force.
DIV
Im not so much worried about strength, my goal was to bench double my body weight and I achieved that with the 405, but of course after that there is a new goal, 500...There aren't a lot of ppl in my gym that really throw serious weight, so I don't have a lot to compare my 405 bench to...But there will always be a new strength goal no matter what I reach...But I want size and a look more than anything else...Compared to a lot of ppl I know they think Im big, but I look in the mirror and dont see it...I see "damn I need a few more inches on my arms, my chest needs some size, damn need to hit the legs more"...Maybe this is how all of you guys felt...But maybe that is what it is that sets us apart.
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that must have been a rough road my friend....most guys would have quit training after going through all of that...hope your health is all good...im assuming you get regular blood tests done? how is your liver and kidneys?
All my organs are fine...I don't have any other problems. Yes, I get my blood work done
Im not so much worried about strength, my goal was to bench double my body weight and I achieved that with the 405, but of course after that there is a new goal, 500...There aren't a lot of ppl in my gym that really throw serious weight, so I don't have a lot to compare my 405 bench to...But there will always be a new strength goal no matter what I reach...But I want size and a look more than anything else...Compared to a lot of ppl I know they think Im big, but I look in the mirror and dont see it...I see "damn I need a few more inches on my arms, my chest needs some size, damn need to hit the legs more"...Maybe this is how all of you guys felt...But maybe that is what it is that sets us apart.
It can be hard to do, but if the "The Look" is what's most important to you, then the first thing you need to do is stop worrying yourself with the weight you move. Moving big weight is a lot of fun, but it's the wrong mindset when "The Look" is what you're after.
...this is not to say you can't still push some impressive numbers.
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So whats the best way to get 'The Look" AJ?
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So whats the best way to get 'The Look" AJ?
When it comes to the lifting aspect you have to train like a bodybuilder, not a power lifter or strength athlete. Ever noticed that although Olympic lifters possess amazing strength, most of them are not much to look at. And I am not referring to the fat ass ones, there are a lot of these strong guys who although they do look strong at the same time they don't have much to look at in the physique department.
Intense training is the biggest key IMO. Right now I train more like a normal human being, but when I am really into it, I have to take my training to another place. (Notice I didn't say "take training to another level" cause I hate that term, lol!) Keep rest in between sets minimal, don't dick around with fifty sets per body part. You should be able to train any body part in an hour tops, even less if you're doing it perfect. There is no reason on this earth if you're doing things right that you can't get in there and destroy your chest in 30 min.
Diet and cardio are probably the two biggest keys though. Which most people realize but very few follow. Too many guys let cardio slip in the off season and it takes a toll on their physique.
Something some of you might be interested in. As you know I am working hard on the new probodybuilding.com website. One of the features that will be there is a full in depth guideline and outline on training and diet. Every topic and every question you could have will be answered for beginners, intermediate, and advanced for both male and female for off-season and contest prep.
Before it is posted up it will be reviewed by several of the most well known respected trainers in the world and IMO will be the best piece of info like this anywhere on the net in a book or any other place you get info for this topic.
And yes, it will be 100% free of charge to look at.
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most bodybuilding diets are set up for maximum growth while adding zero fat
but there is something to be said for a diet which is set up for maximum growth without worrying about fat gains
id like to see some articles differentiating the two, arnold
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most bodybuilding diets are set up for maximum growth while adding zero fat
but there is something to be said for a diet which is set up for maximum growth without worrying about fat gains
id like to see some articles differentiating the two, arnold
Sorry, there is no such thing as "Maximum Growth" while adding zero body fat.
Yes, you can train and eat right and gain lean muscle tissue, but in terms of "Maximum Growth" this isn't possible, even with AAS.
I'll give you this info about these outlines.
In the beginners section, when it comes to the diet itself, it is designed with these purposes first and foremost.
1. learning how to eat properly
2. learning how to utilize nutrients to their full benefit
3. learning proper meal planning.
4. learning what works best for you, because there is no diet on earth that is perfect for every person
Yes, this diet does focus on gaining muscle mass, but it's primary focus is learning how to do it the correct way, learning how to do it without putting on more body fat then needed. A lot of people don't realize how detrimental the excess fat is to their bodybuilding goals in the long run.
There is also a section for the hard gainer but it is strongly emphasized that many who think they are hard gainers are not; they are simply doing things incorrectly and when they start eating like a hard gainer they end up making things worse then they should be.
It pretty much covers the whole spectrum very thoroughly. A lot of guys would be far better off if they took a step back and began on a beginners diet like this...because most do not have a good handle on the 4 things I mentioned above.
The beginners training section as well, many would be far better suited to step back to this level of training.
So many people jump into higher levels of training and diet before they are ready, way before they have mastered the basics. And it's a shame because the basics are more important then anything else. People lack patience, which is the name of the game if you're going to do it right. And when I say a lot of people I am talking about "MOST" people. I'd bet my life on it that less then 25% of people do things correctly and move at the proper speed when it comes to taking their training and diet into more advanced levels...maybe even less then 10% of people.
As a trainer myself, I'd say well over half my business comes from people who have been working out and trying to eat right for at least a year or longer...I'm talking about both bodybuilders and regular Joe's. And the other half who don't come, they're the ones with too much pride, most of them anyway. So they continue to do things the wrong way, making very slow progress, slower then it should be if any is made at all. They gain less muscle then they have to, they gain more fat then they should, they do everything wrong simply out of pride.
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Im not so much worried about strength, my goal was to bench double my body weight and I achieved that with the 405, but of course after that there is a new goal, 500...There aren't a lot of ppl in my gym that really throw serious weight, so I don't have a lot to compare my 405 bench to...But there will always be a new strength goal no matter what I reach...But I want size and a look more than anything else...Compared to a lot of ppl I know they think Im big, but I look in the mirror and dont see it...I see "damn I need a few more inches on my arms, my chest needs some size, damn need to hit the legs more"...Maybe this is how all of you guys felt...But maybe that is what it is that sets us apart.
My goals are purely strength related..........not size or aeshetics.
If I get any larger, the clothes won't fit and it's not very economical to lift simply for size's sake.
I lift for functional muscle, not to be a side of beef.....
If you're looking to be a bodybuilder, you'll need to think about turning to the Darkside.
DIV
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My goals are purely strength related..........not size or aeshetics.
If I get any larger, the clothes won't fit and it's not very economical to lift simply for size's sake.
I lift for functional muscle, not to be a side of beef.....
If you're looking to be a bodybuilder, you'll need to think about turning to the Darkside.
DIV
Yes and no...depends on the level you want. Look at guys like Eric Broser...I know for fact that he is natural and has a very good bodybuilding physique. But yes you're right, if you want Ronnie type muscle then AAS is the only way.
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Yes and no...depends on the level you want. Look at guys like Eric Broser...I know for fact that he is natural and has a very good bodybuilding physique. But yes you're right, if you want Ronnie type muscle then AAS is the only way.
Remember Skip LaCour? ;D
I see guys like him at the gym, they don't lift much, but then again, they're naturals.
DIV
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you are def right about how you train and the impact. I've put on more size in the last year then in the previous 3 years of training. But I have been soon tons of reading, research and talking to ppl so that I can learn. Dieting right is def the hardest part for me to get down on what works the best. I've even gone so far as to hire a pro bodybuilder who is a friend of a friend to work with me on dieting and addressing my weak areas.
All of you guys have been great and have provided good info. I appreciate the candor and honesty.
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Sorry, there is no such thing as "Maximum Growth" while adding zero body fat.
Yes, you can train and eat right and gain lean muscle tissue, but in terms of "Maximum Growth" this isn't possible, even with AAS.
uummmmm
eeeerrrrr
weellllllllll
you mis read or misunderstood my post
every article written on nutrition for bodybuilders is set up to maximize muscle gorwth with minimal body fat accumulation.
but you never see any nutrition experts writing articles about maximum growth without worrying about adding body fat.
and there is a huge difference between the two.
take dave palumbos off season diet for example. isnt it some lik this = 6 meals per day, 50 g protein, 25g fat, 50g carb per meal ? thats set up for minimum fat accumulation with maximum growth.
however a diet soemthing tlike this = 100g protein , 100 g carb x 5 meal per day + one cheat meal everyday consisting of binging on pizza or ice cream or whatever.
the rate of growth in that second diet is astonishly faster than the rate of growth in that first diet. yes you will add alot more fat but also a ton more muscle.
so id like to see soome good articles written on off season bulking for maximum growth without regards to adding bodyfat.
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uummmmm
eeeerrrrr
weellllllllll
you mis read or misunderstood my post
every article written on nutrition for bodybuilders is set up to maximize muscle gorwth with minimal body fat accumulation.
but you never see any nutrition experts writing articles about maximum growth without worrying about adding body fat.
and there is a huge difference between the two.
take dave palumbos off season diet for example. isnt it some lik this = 6 meals per day, 50 g protein, 25g fat, 50g carb per meal ? thats set up for minimum fat accumulation with maximum growth.
however a diet soemthing tlike this = 100g protein , 100 g carb x 5 meal per day + one cheat meal everyday consisting of binging on pizza or ice cream or whatever.
the rate of growth in that second diet is astonishly faster than the rate of growth in that first diet. yes you will add alot more fat but also a ton more muscle.
so id like to see soome good articles written on off season bulking for maximum growth without regards to adding bodyfat.
Yes, I did misunderstand your earlier comments.
That said, the type of diet you're talking about is simple. Eat everything in sight and keep eating. If that's not what you're getting at then I still don't understand what you're asking.
One thing is for certain, eating to gain and not being concerned with the fat gain is the worst mistake any bodybuilder could make. The added muscle will not be worth it at all. Yes, you would have more muscle, but when it came time to diet you would have so much extra fat, more fat then you should have and you will have to diet even harder. Because of that, you will lose more muscle on your diet then you would have if you had bulked cleaner. This also means when the diet is over, you will have less lean muscle tissue on your frame when it's all said and done. If you had bulked conservatively then you would have more lean muscle tissue on your frame when the diet is over. That's just the way it works...AAS or no AAS.
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not eating everything in sight. eating clean bodybuilding foods all day long with one cheat meal every day. with hard training and maybe some morning cardio, you shouldnt get too fat, and the rate of muscle growth i astonishingly fatsre with this kind of diet than with a diet thatt is barely reaching caloric suplus via all 'clean foods'.
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not eating everything in sight. eating clean bodybuilding foods all day long with one cheat meal every day. with hard training and maybe some morning cardio, you shouldnt get too fat, and the rate of muscle growth i astonishingly fatsre with this kind of diet than with a diet thatt is barely reaching caloric suplus via all 'clean foods'.
OK, now I understand what you're saying a little more clearly.
I ate sort of like you're talking about for a period, 2006-through the spring of 2007. When I did it I ate clean meals all day long and then what I called a semi-cheat meal once per day, and then a full blown cheat meal on the wk end, maybe two. By semi-cheat meal in my case that would mean some extra carbs and a little leeway with one of the meals like going out to dinner and having something on the menu that was not one of the worst things on the menu...make sense?
For myself, this was a very bad mistake...if you read some of my old post about that year I got way to fat. Yes I was carrying more muscle mass then I ever have before but I ended up having to diet so hard that I ended up getting in some serious trouble with my health.
I do believe that there are some people that can benefit from eating like you're talking about. I do not believe though that most people can or should. This is talked about in those outlines that will be at probodybuilding.com....l ike I said, every aspect is covered, even this one.
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cool, thats what i was hoping for.
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Remember Skip LaCour? ;D
I see guys like him at the gym, they don't lift much, but then again, they're naturals.
DIV
what kinda weights you pushing? are you a powerlifter or strongman?
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I'm 25, almost 26 and I'm where you were a few years back. Only done one real cycle, about to start my second (this one for a comp) and obviously since I'm so green I still have great health. I plan to keep a close eye on everything and do it right.
Now I do have plans that if everything goes well, I may start to stay on longer and longer if I feel it is worth it.
I want to have kids someday and one of my biggest concerns is loosing that ability. When you say you have perfect health, did you have your sperm count checked as well? Just curious if that has been affected at all. I know everyone is different and some have even gotten a girl pregnant while on gear, but one more piece of evidence from someone who is straight up about things would be nice.
As of right now my boys do just fine. Ex. The first time I ever had sex the girl got pregnant. :o That'll scare the crap out of any 15 yr old.
If this statement is true then you better be using HCG while "ON" cycle. HCG will protect your balls, for future use.
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what kinda weights you pushing? are you a powerlifter or strongman?
Not a powerlifter persay because I do negatives, and I don't use wraps.
If you must classify me, probably a strength athlete.
Bodybuilder, not so much..... :-X
DIV