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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Bindare_Dundat on December 11, 2008, 08:26:43 PM
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THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE.
WASHINGTON (AP) — A $14 billion emergency bailout for U.S. automakers collapsed in the Senate Thursday night after the United Auto Workers refused to accede to Republican demands for swift wage cuts.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said he was "terribly disappointed" about the demise of an emerging bipartisan deal to rescue Detroit's Big Three.
He spoke shortly after Republicans left a closed-door meeting where they balked at giving the automakers federal aid unless their powerful union agreed to slash wages next year to bring them into line with those of Japanese carmakers.
Republican Sen. George V. Voinovich of Ohio, a strong bailout supporter, said the UAW was willing to make the cuts — but not until 2011.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081212/ap_on_go_co/congress_autos
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how did obama vote?
how did the dems vs repubs vote?
how did mccain vote?
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Anyone think trading will be halted tomarrow?
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Change has to happen. The pyramid scheme called "unbridled capitialism" is collapsing.
I say no to the bailout. It'll hurt but it will be a lesson for future corrupt CEO'S.
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Bank bailout funds could be used for Detroit.
Sources: White House warning GOP senators Wall Street bailout funds might be used for automakers now that auto loan package has failed.
The proposal to loan $14 billion to Detroit's struggling automakers collapsed late Thursday night but the Big Three may get some money anyway.
Bush officials warned wavering GOP senators that if they didn't support the legislation, the White House will likely be forced to tap the Wall Street bailout to lend them money, two Republican congressional officials told CNN earlier.
This is a noteworthy change since the White House and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson have previously refused to use bank bailout funds to help General Motors (GM, Fortune 500), Ford Motor (F, Fortune 500) and Chrysler LLC.
The sources asked not to be named because of the sensitivities of private conversations.
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Ha ha. What a fantastic chess game this is.
Dude, I'd laugh too if it wasnt so, pathetic.
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A deal on $14 billion in aid to Detroit's Big Three automakers fell apart Thursday night in the Senate despite intense negotiations on Capitol Hill between lawmakers, union officials and representatives from the three companies.
The bailout died after failing 52-35 on a Senate procedural vote.
Earlier in the evening, the talks appeared to have produced a breakthrough, with Democratic leaders "hopeful" that an agreement had been reached that would be acceptable to Senate Republicans, who have resisted the aid package. But Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid came back later to report the effort had failed, adding he was "terribly disappointed."
The White House said it was evaluating its options in light of the breakdown.
"It's disappointing that Congress failed to act tonight," a White House statement said. "We think the legislation we negotiated provided an opportunity to use funds already appropriated for automakers and presented the best chance to avoid a disorderly bankruptcy while ensuring taxpayer funds only go to firms whose stakeholders were prepared to make difficult decisions to become viable."
Republicans, after reviewing the latest version of the proposal in a closed-door meeting, balked at giving automaker federal aid unless their powerful union agreed to slash wages next year to bring them into line with those of Japanese carmakers.
Republican Sen. George V. Voinovich of Ohio, a strong bailout supporter, said the United Auto Workers was willing to make the cuts, but not until 2011.
The collapse of the latest negotiations came as the Wall Street Journal reported Thursday evening that General Motors had hired lawyers and bankers to consider whether to file for bankruptcy, a prospect made more likely by the outcome of Thursday's talks.
A procedural vote is scheduled Thursday night but it is expected to be little more than a formality.
"We just don't have the votes," Reid said. "I dread looking at Wall Street in the morning."
Democratic leaders and the White House made final pleas for the bill's passage on Thursday, but the two sides in the Senate failed to forge a compromise.
The House approved the plan late Wednesday on a vote of 237-170. It would infuse money within days into cash-starved General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC. Ford Motor Co., which has said it has enough cash to make it through 2009, would also be eligible for federal aid.
The plan would also create a government "car czar," to be named by President Bush to dole out loans, with the power to force the carmaker into bankruptcy next spring if they didn't cut quick deals with labor unions, creditors and others to restructure their businesses and become viable.
But the legislation has met strong opposition from many Republicans -- including Minority Leader Mitch McConnell -- who claim it does not require enough accountability from auto makers. The Republicans planned to filibuster the legislation to prevent its passage in the U.S. Senate.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2008/12/11/auto-bailout-collapses-senate-despite-intense-negotiations/
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It is a no brainer to lower wages. Say they go bankrupt. There is still a market out there for US cars so a new company will be formed and then they would take over the plants and hire a new bunch that will most likely be the old big 3 employees anyway.
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It is a no brainer to lower wages. Say they go bankrupt. There is still a market out there for US cars so a new company will be formed and then they would take over the plants and hire a new bunch that will most likely be the old big 3 employees anyway.
I refuse to by an american made car made by union workers.
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I refuse to by an american made car made by union workers.
I am with you on that one Coach.
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Bush is a moron. We just witnessed how the U.S. Government should work. The Republican senators listened to the people. Most people were against an auto bailout. So Bush is once again going to subvert democracy and do whatever the fuck he wants. What a democratic president he is. ::)
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I am with you on that one Coach.
Its not that its Union made cars, its that they are not reliable and dont retain any value compared to foregin cars like Toyota or Honda.
These stupid companies dont realize that the consumers are not buying their lies anymore.
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Bush is a moron. We just witnessed how the U.S. Government should work. The Republican senators listened to the people. Most people were against an auto bailout. So Bush is once again going to subvert democracy and do whatever the fuck he wants. What a democratic president he is. ::)
Well said.
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Well, well. Wouldn't you know it, there's exacly 15 billion dollars left of the first 350 billion dollar TARP program that could now be used for the auto bailout. Isn't that convieniant? All this bullshit of a bailout even after the Treasury said the money shouldnt be used for such things and now they are even changing their tune. These people think we can't connect the dots, what a scam.
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Bush is a moron. We just witnessed how the U.S. Government should work. The Republican senators listened to the people. Most people were against an auto bailout. So Bush is once again going to subvert democracy and do whatever the fuck he wants. What a democratic president he is. ::)
and what makes you think the general person knows whats good for their country
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and what makes you think the general person knows whats good for their country
By the people, for the people.
Please elaborate your statement...there has been a lot of statements that are blatantly going against what this country was founded upon.
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and what makes you think the general person knows whats good for their country
Its called freedom, the freedom to succeed, or the freedom to fail.
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By the people, for the people.
Please elaborate your statement...there has been a lot of statements that are blatantly going against what this country was founded upon.
Get serious..............peo ple who voted for Obama didn't even know his policies.
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Its called freedom, the freedom to succeed, or the freedom to fail.
Just like the idiots that protested in NYC against the bailout of AIG......They had no clue of the ramifications if that company would have failed.
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Just like the idiots that protested in NYC against the bailout of AIG......They had no clue of the ramifications if that company would have failed.
We are heading for a depression either way.
The Paulson doom and gloom scenario was going to happen anyway, its just that he allowed his buddies one last hurrah at the till.
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We are heading for a depression either way.
The Paulson doom and gloom scenario was going to happen anyway, its just that he allowed his buddies one last hurrah at the till.
Thats not confirmed, nobody knows that.............but what increased the odds was electing this socialist government
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Repub senators got this one right!
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Repub senators got this one right!
Thats cause the Democrates were trying to repay a favour to the Auto Union with the bailout................. .....
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Get serious..............peo ple who voted for Obama didn't even know his policies.
You could also say that McCain supporters are racists war mongers...for the people by the people.
Ron Paul will be right about this one too...this is just prolonging the inevitable.
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You could also say that McCain supporters are racists war mongers...for the people by the people.
Ron Paul will be right about this one too...this is just prolonging the inevitable.
Bailing out these companies is delaying the inevitable unless they restructure and figure out a way to sell many more cars at a profit.
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You could also say that McCain supporters are racists war mongers...for the people by the people.
Ron Paul will be right about this one too...this is just prolonging the inevitable.
You're really reaching with that one, get back to me when you make some sense...........
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Bailing out these companies is delaying the inevitable unless they restructure and figure out a way to sell many more cars at a profit.
Give me a goddamn break. And where the fuck is the restructuring at AIG, CITIBANK, and the other WallStreet banks and financial houses? HUH? Aren't we delaying the inevitable bailing their asses out? I mean shit.............not only did the banks and financial companies fuck over Americans with bad debt they managed to sell it the world over.
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Good!
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You're really reaching with that one, get back to me when you make some sense...........
As in would it have been any better if McCain would have been elected vs. the "socialist" government we have now?
Like I have said before...I am more open to a bailout for these manufacturing companies, I just don't agree what is being done about it. Don't even get me started on these con men known as bank CEOs.
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When someone starts with McCain voters are racists and war mongers, its hard to take them serious
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Give me a goddamn break. And where the fuck is the restructuring at AIG, CITIBANK, and the other WallStreet banks and financial houses? HUH? Aren't we delaying the inevitable bailing their asses out? I mean shit.............not only did the banks and financial companies fuck over Americans with bad debt they managed to sell it the world over.
Yes we are delaying the inevitable. I was against the original bailout as well.
I think people from Wall Street need to be shot for what they did, not bailed out, but also feel the same about the auto copmpanies.
If a company cant produce a product or service at a profit, it should declare bankrupcy or figure out a way to become profitable, not bailed out.
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When someone starts with McCain voters are racists and war mongers, its hard to take them serious
It was a tongue in cheek statement. It was not serious in anyway. I should have clarified...I apologize.
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How is Bush not a quasi-socialist?
I think all these bailouts are generally a bad idea, particularly the financial bailout (without a detailed restructuring plan before the loans/money was given). Sounded like the UAW president and the republican leader from Tenn made some reasonable compromises though...but then it tanked when the UAW president couldn't give a date when employee wages would be more on par with wages from Toyota, Nissan, BMW, etc.
Everyone has to take a cut IMO. Retirees, executives, the UAW and workers.
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How is Bush not a quasi-socialist?
I think all these bailouts are generally a bad idea, particularly the financial bailout (without a detailed restructuring plan before the loans/money was given). Sounded like the UAW president and the republican leader from Tenn made some reasonable compromises though...but then it tanked when the UAW president couldn't give a date when employee wages would be more on par with wages from Toyota, Nissan, BMW, etc.
Everyone has to take a cut IMO. Retirees, executives, the UAW and workers.
\they had no choice, they had too........its kinda like the scenario where your neighbours house is on fire, you help to put it out cause you don't want your house to catch on fire
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Bailing out these companies is delaying the inevitable unless they restructure and figure out a way to sell many more cars at a profit.
I totally agree with you.
If there's a bailout, the tax payers money needs to be given out as conditional loans with thorough control.
Conditional loans where a certain amount has to be used for development of alternative cars to free USA of the oil dependancy.
Because lets face it - right now there are enough of gasoline driven cars in USA.
The car buying frenzy of the last 8 years have largely been fueled by generous - that's right - mortgage deals.
Those have got to go.
So people are more likely to buy used cars, ie trade cars from the existing car park.
Car companies needs to offer something different if they are to survive.
And that sure ain't cars running on gasoline.
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Thats cause the Democrates were trying to repay a favour to the Auto Union with the bailout................. .....
Truth.
Most of what the Dems in regards to auto industry bailouts is payment to the organized crime union organizations.