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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Soul Crusher on September 14, 2009, 04:27:39 AM
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From Biggovernment.com
This thing is blowing up. NYC plus 5 more cities to come.
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'Pimp' & 'hooker' catch ACORN staff
By JEREMY OLSHAN
www.nypost.com
Last Updated: 6:58 AM, September 14, 2009
Posted: 3:30 AM, September 14, 2009
The scandal surrounding the left-wing activist organization ACORN has spread to New York, with employees at its Brooklyn office caught on video helping supposed ladies of the night get loans for their dream houses of ill repute.
Rather than reminding the women that prostitution is dangerous and illegal and advising them to change their careers, counselors at the social-services group shockingly offer suggestions on how they can launder their earnings.
"Honesty is not going to get you the house," a loan counselor at the offices told two activists posing as a mortgage-seeking pimp and prostitute.
"You can't say what you do for a living."
VIDEO: PROSTITUTION SCANDAL AT ACORN
ACORN workers in two other cities, Baltimore and Washington, DC, had already fallen hooker, line and sinker for the hidden-camera sting operation by two conservative activists.
Four ACORN employees have been fired as a result of the earlier videos, and last Friday the Census Bureau severed its ties with the group, whose members had been hired to do canvassing during the 2010 census.
In an unrelated outrage, ACORN was accused of widespread voter fraud during the 2008 presidential election by helping unqualified voters to register.
As in prior videos released by the filmmaking team of James O'Keefe, 25, and Hannah Giles, 20, employees of the group -- which specializes in housing and voter activism -- were eager to dispense advice on gaming the system and skirting the law.
"You know, what goes on in the house we don't care," one counselor said. "We just help you with the mortgage."
O'Keefe and Giles were garishly dressed as a stereotypical pimp and prostitute. O'Keefe was decked out in excessively snazzy flesh-peddler couture, and Giles, going by the name "Eden," wore almost nothing.
The ACORN workers were not the slightest bit judgmental or put off by the request for help in getting financing for a brothel.
Counselor Volda Albert freely offered financial advice to the young couple, and held back on giving out any life advice.
"I can't tell you don't do it, because you won't listen to me," Albert said.
For tax and banking purposes, and to establish a legitimate income and credit history, Giles was told she needed to start saying she was a "freelancer."
"Don't say that you're a prostitute thing or whatever," she said.
Albert also suggested that Giles open two accounts at separate banks, depositing no more than $500 each a week to ensure few eyebrows are raised.
As for the rest of the money she earned from turning tricks, Albert told her to hide it away.
"When you buy the house with a back yard. You get a tin . . . and bury it down in there, and you put the money right in, and you put grass over it, and you don't tell a single soul but yourself where it is," she said.
Albert even had advice on protecting O'Keefe from getting tied by authorities to Giles' prostitution.
Her illegally obtained revenue could be given to O'Keefe through an intermediary, and then he could use it for a down payment on the house by applying for a "no doc" loan.
In the earlier videos, counselors offered similar suggestions to a "prostitute," telling her to list her occupation as "performance artist," and even offering advice on how to claim as dependants underage girls recruited for the business.
Milagros Rivera, the Brooklyn office administrator advised Giles, "don't get caught -- it's against the law what you are doing, and there's a chance you'll get caught."
Before bidding them good luck, Albert offered two final suggestions.
"Save for a rainy day," she said. "And live well."
O'Keefe, who majored in philosophy at Rutgers University, said he and Giles funded the project themselves. This kind of undercover, guerrilla tactic is the "future of investigative journalism and political activism," he said.
Inspired by "Rules for Radicals," Saul Alinsky's bible for rabble-rousing, more often associated with the left, O'Keefe said he has been targeting and exposing the "absurdities of the enemy by employing their own rules and language."
"If you can make impossible demands on your enemy, you can destroy them," he said.
So he began using a hidden camera "in a location I'd rather not disclose" and started visiting ACORN offices around the Northeast.
As with a series of videos O'Keefe made in 2008, in which Planned Parenthood employees agreed to earmark his donations for the abortions of African-American babies, he said he expected ACORN would yield maybe "a few gotcha moments."
"But we never imagined they would all comply -- it's just disgusting they didn't just throw us out of the office," he said.
In a statement released Saturday, ACORN said that it could not defend the actions of its employees but that what O'Keefe and Giles did was criminal.
"And, in fact, a crime it was -- our lawyers believe a felony -- and we will be taking legal action against Fox and their co-conspirators," the statement said.
Fox News aired the Baltimore and Washington tapes.
O'Keefe said, "ACORN wants it both ways."
"You can't fire the employees and then say I have defamed them," he said.
jeremy.olshan @nypost.com
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I wonder how many fraudulent loans these savages pushed through on the banks under the CRA?
This is disgusting. ACORN needs to go asap.
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I heard ACORN scandal was even bigger. Two million cities to come. It was reported on ABC.
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I heard ACORN scandal was even bigger. Two million cities to come. It was reported on ABC.
Your a real jack ass.
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Your a real jack ass.
hey, i'm just playing man. Despite the 2 mil number claim, which seemed insanely high, I do admire you. You give a shit about things, and that is a good thing.
smile man, if you can't laugh at this political shit, what cna you do?
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hey, i'm just playing man. Despite the 2 mil number claim, which seemed insanely high, I do admire you. You give a shit about things, and that is a good thing.
smile man, if you can't laugh at this political shit, what cna you do?
Hey 240 - I have a good idea for you.
I went to the gun show in NY this weekend. it was freaking packed and people were there with $$$$ to drop.
I think someone would make a lot of $$$ if they had sort of a tea party table.
Sell DTOM shirts, flags, magnets, etc. You could sell all sorts of crap like that. There was none of that at this show and I was hoping to buy a shirt or something like that.
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ACORN= OBAMA.
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Hey 240 - I have a good idea for you.
I went to the gun show in NY this weekend. it was freaking packed and people were there with $$$$ to drop.
I think someone would make a lot of $$$ if they had sort of a tea party table.
Sell DTOM shirts, flags, magnets, etc. You could sell all sorts of crap like that. There was none of that at this show and I was hoping to buy a shirt or something like that.
that's actually a damn good idea. But I don't want to end up on obama's bad side ;)
it is weird... we're seeing unity on the right like we saw on the lef tin late 2008. Remember the Obama rallies? tens of thousands of people who seriously used their hatred of Bush to come together. We're seeing it now, only it's united in the hatred for obama. People don't change - or work hard - until they have to. Repubs didn't mobilize and rally in 2008 because, hey, they already ran the white house. And I think most of us had a sick feeling that mccain would somehow find a way to steal the election, if Bush didn't cancel elections in the first place.
Can the R's keep this momentum going for another 14 months (for the 2010 elections?) I guess we'll find out.
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What do you expect from an organization of "Community Organizers"? They are simply agitators, thats what they do, anything to buck the system.
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The "Lying and Scamming" philosophy of ACORN is very similar to the Chicago political system that spawned Obama. No big surprises here.
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This thing is blowing up.
Your last prediction didn't pan out so well with the dramatics and hysterics did it? :)
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The "Lying and Scamming" philosophy of ACORN is very similar to the Chicago political system that spawned Obama. No big surprises here.
These guys are pure as the driven snow compared to the Chicago Political Machine.
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Your last prediction didn't pan out so well with the dramatics and hysterics did it? :)
This thing is unfolding by the day you idiot. The original reaction of the media and ACORN was that it was an isolated incident. Now it is proven that this is a pattern and course of business for this disgusting organization.
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How many days until it reaches the number you stated?
or years?
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Definitely not isolated. There has been a pattern of ACORN corruption for years now....but these 3 taped incidents show how the continued corruption, illegal advice and inability to train their people.
There should be a federal investigation. We all must agree that ACORN is a disaster. This goes beyond politics, we can't condone illegal shit like this.
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This goes beyond politics, we can't condone illegal shit like this.
I dont think anyone on getbig is condoning illegal activity, no matter what the party, right?
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When does ACORN start yelling racism?
I give it 2 more days ;D
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When does ACORN start yelling racism?
I give it 2 more days ;D
hahahahah let get some odds and bet on this
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Definitely not isolated. There has been a pattern of ACORN corruption for years now....but these 3 taped incidents show how the continued corruption, illegal advice and inability to train their people.
There should be a federal investigation. We all must agree that ACORN is a disaster. This goes beyond politics, we can't condone illegal shit like this.
240 doesn't believe a if it isn't from Obama and he will believe anything that is from Obama :-\
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240 doesn't believe a if it isn't from Obama and he will believe anything that is from Obama :-\
did you miss the many posts where i said the crooked ass ACORN workers belong behind bars?
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did you miss the many posts where i said the crooked ass ACORN workers belong behind bars?
Its not the workers. Its the entire organization 240. Where did all these workers learn these criminal activities?
dont you think it is strange how they all give the same advice to cover illegal activities in each of these offices? And the filmmaker said there are at least 5 more cities to come.
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Its not the workers. Its the entire organization 240. Where did all these workers learn these criminal activities?
dont you think it is strange how they all give the same advice to cover illegal activities in each of these offices? And the filmmaker said there are at least 5 more cities to come.
So you're telling me all 400,000 member of acorn are committing crimes?
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So you're telling me all 400,000 member of acorn are committing crimes?
No, Im telling you that ACORN in itself is a fraudulent organization whose very existence is to promote illegal activities and fraud, whether it be vote fraud, mortgage fraud, tax evasion, etc. .
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No, Im telling you that ACORN in itself is a fraudulent organization whose very existence is to promote illegal activities and fraud, whether it be vote fraud, mortgage fraud, tax evasion, etc. .
How many of its 400,000 employees are criminal?
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How many of its 400,000 employees are criminal?
Probably a good portion from what i can tell.
I think every mortgage application and tax return they prepared needs to be scrutinized for fraud.
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Probably a good portion from what i can tell.
at least 200,000 of them, then?
What evidence do you have, to accuse 200,000 people of being criminals?
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at least 200,000 of them, then?
What evidence do you have, to accuse 200,000 people of being criminals?
They probably do not even realize they are involved in crime because it is a way of life for these people.
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They probably do not even realize they are involved in crime because it is a way of life for these people.
These people?
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These people?
The entire enterprise is based on criminal activity.It doresnt matter what percent of its workers are criminals,the entire thing is criminal,from registering fake people to vote for trying to set up tax free brothels.Their existance is crime.
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These people?
Yes 240 - anyone who works for a fraudulent organization like ACORN is "these people".
Typical rabble rousing street scum.
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did you miss the many posts where i said the crooked ass ACORN workers belong behind bars?
I missed the part where you DARE to question the involvement of them in voter fraud and the past affiliations of Digustobama with them.
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I missed the part where you DARE to question the involvement of them in voter fraud and the past affiliations of Digustobama with them.
I thought ACORN caught their own ppl cheating, and made a really big deal about it when they fired them? maybe i'm mistaken.
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Its not the workers. Its the entire organization 240. Where did all these workers learn these criminal activities?
dont you think it is strange how they all give the same advice to cover illegal activities in each of these offices? And the filmmaker said there are at least 5 more cities to come.
This is where I disagree with you. It's not like this is some esoteric advic1ce. It's all pretty obvious.
So, here's a little story. While I was in college and for a few years afterwards, I did a lot of volunteer work. Among the places I volunteered were a drop-in center on e. 77th and an outreach center on 40th and 9th. I started out doing labor and administrative stuff at both, but at the midtown location, I eventually became a counselor. Here's the thing about working with poor people: you are not surprised when you learn that they make their money illegally. So many of my former clients worked off the books that I didn't even blink when they told me how they earned money. My primary duties as a counselor involved helping to get people into programs and helping people find rooms for the night. For certain programs, you had to be really fucked up, so I would let my clients know in a roundabout way, that they'd only be accepted if they showed up high or drunk (or at least appeared to be so) and hadn't showered for a few day. A lot of the young ladies who showed up at the center were prostitutes looking for a room for the evening. Other than some basic literature explaining the dangers of prostitution, we basically just told them not to let house staff know what they did and don't bring any johns back to the room if they stayed there on a long term basis. Once, some girl that had moved here from the midwest visited us but told us she was afraid of staying in shelters, so another counselor advised her to call an ambulance and spend the night in an emergency room.
When I was about 25, I had this client who was about 23 or 24 who was having some problems getting id. He had an off the books job, but he couldn't rent a room or get a legitimate job without state id. We went through several processes and then decided the most expedient measure would be getting a public benefits card because it provided the four proofs of identity he needed and didn't have to apply for a state id. When we met after he got his benefits card, he told me about how the welfare counselor told him about a few holes in the system when he explained to her that he didn't think he'd be able to use the card since he didn't have a home.
I know this is a long post that will go mostly ignored, but my point is that the homeless centers I worked in and NYS welfare office aren't organized criminal enterprises. If you want to describe the behavior I wrote about above as immoral, I wouldn't even bother to dispute that. But, realistically, when you work with the poor or homeless, you weigh the cost of helping them (or what you consider helping them) vs. the cost of strictly following the letter of the law. While I have no issues with the fact that these workers have been fired, nor do I have much pity for them, from experience, I can understand their motivations and I don't see this as some sort of villainous racket.
So, there's the anecdotal portion of my post. Here's the analytical:
I think the mainr difference in how we are reacting to this scandal is that you are viewing it through the prism of possible election fraud and the fact that this validates what you've been led to believe. The fact of the matter is that the "election fraud" ACORN is so often accused of simply doesn't exist and the registration scandal could never result in widespread voter fraud.
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I thought ACORN caught their own ppl cheating, and made a really big deal about it when they fired them? maybe i'm mistaken.
Almost all convictions that resulted from fraudulent voter registrations related to ACORN have been due to actions ACORN initiated.
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This is where I disagree with you. It's not like this is some esoteric advic1ce. It's all pretty obvious.
So, here's a little story. While I was in college and for a few years afterwards, I did a lot of volunteer work. Among the places I volunteered were a drop-in center on e. 77th and an outreach center on 40th and 9th. I started out doing labor and administrative stuff at both, but at the midtown location, I eventually became a counselor. Here's the thing about working with poor people: you are not surprised when you learn that they make their money illegally. So many of my former clients worked off the books that I didn't even blink when they told me how they earned money. My primary duties as a counselor involved helping to get people into programs and helping people find rooms for the night. For certain programs, you had to be really fucked up, so I would let my clients know in a roundabout way, that they'd only be accepted if they showed up high or drunk (or at least appeared to be so) and hadn't showered for a few day. A lot of the young ladies who showed up at the center were prostitutes looking for a room for the evening. Other than some basic literature explaining the dangers of prostitution, we basically just told them not to let house staff know what they did and don't bring any johns back to the room if they stayed there on a long term basis. Once, some girl that had moved here from the midwest visited us but told us she was afraid of staying in shelters, so another counselor advised her to call an ambulance and spend the night in an emergency room.
When I was about 25, I had this client who was about 23 or 24 who was having some problems getting id. He had an off the books job, but he couldn't rent a room or get a legitimate job without state id. We went through several processes and then decided the most expedient measure would be getting a public benefits card because it provided the four proofs of identity he needed and didn't have to apply for a state id. When we met after he got his benefits card, he told me about how the welfare counselor told him about a few holes in the system when he explained to her that he didn't think he'd be able to use the card since he didn't have a home.
I know this is a long post that will go mostly ignored, but my point is that the homeless centers I worked in and NYS welfare office aren't organized criminal enterprises. If you want to describe the behavior I wrote about above as immoral, I wouldn't even bother to dispute that. But, realistically, when you work with the poor or homeless, you weigh the cost of helping them (or what you consider helping them) vs. the cost of strictly following the letter of the law. While I have no issues with the fact that these workers have been fired, nor do I have much pity for them, from experience, I can understand their motivations and I don't see this as some sort of villainous racket.
So, there's the anecdotal portion of my post. Here's the analytical:
I think the mainr difference in how we are reacting to this scandal is that you are viewing it through the prism of possible election fraud and the fact that this validates what you've been led to believe. The fact of the matter is that the "election fraud" ACORN is so often accused of simply doesn't exist and the registration scandal could never result in widespread voter fraud.
I appreciate your post, but that is not what has been captured on these videos in these ACORN videos.
Additionally, these people prepare taxes and mortgage applications, a far cry from the work you did.
They were counseling these people how to commit crime and ACORN gets 40% of their funding from you an me.
If this guy has videos from 8 cities of ACORN offices where they all did this, there will be a move in the congress to cut off all funding from this organization as it obviously is out of control.
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Almost all convictions that resulted from fraudulent voter registrations related to ACORN have been due to actions ACORN initiated.
Sure it was, I wonder what excuse you'll find for them after this story will reach full proportions.
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I appreciate your post, but that is not what has been captured on these videos in these ACORN videos.
Additionally, these people prepare taxes and mortgage applications, a far cry from the work you did.
They were counseling these people how to commit crime and ACORN gets 40% of their funding from you an me.
If this guy has videos from 8 cities of ACORN offices where they all did this, there will be a move in the congress to cut off all funding from this organization as it obviously is out of control.
My point wasn't that there was a direct correlation between what I did and these workers' duties at ACORN. I was disputing your claim that because more than one worker behaved in this manner that proves it was the policy of the organization. Obviously, it wouldn't be too difficult for these workers to come to these conclusions themselves. The filmmaker admitted that he was turned away from more offices than he was counseled.
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Sure it was, I wonder what excuse you'll find for them after this story will reach full proportions.
It's true.