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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: mesmorph78 on November 04, 2009, 03:50:45 AM
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Pics can be decieving but..
The video doesnt lie...
of all the madatory poses
I have jay wining
ab and thigh
and side tri (because coleman doesnt know how to do it)
the rest of the poses coleman Dominated jay
size was just too much
jay ddid look good that yr though very good
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For some of us that actually attended the show, LIVE action does not lie. Jay's conditioning was second to none (when it comes to big men) and Ronnie was off from his all time best. Ronnie did have a slight size advantage but it shouldn't have been enough to beat Cutler that night.
I will say this, I have been to many IFBB pro bodybuilding events, and I never felt crowd energy like the 2001 "O"
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Jay is conditioned
but the size difference is quite obvious
and copied with muscle shape which is genetic Coleman dominated
aside from ab and thigh and side tri Coleman dominated every other pose fact culter was at his all time best. I think that shocked people and added monementum but the slight conditioning advantage was not enough to beat Coleman size and genetic muscle shape equals winner front double bi most muscular front lat spread Coleman won handily we won't even talk about or mention the rear poses
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the difference in quality was far too noticeable from the back
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jay looks like a child next to ronnie
and why does everyone seem to forget the only reason the fridge got into that condition was he took diuretics, which were banned that year
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(because coleman doesnt know how to do it)
::)
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jay looks like a child next to ronnie
and why does everyone seem to forget the only reason the fridge got into that condition was he took diuretics, which were banned that year
yes but they had qualified nasser in 1996 for the same reason and didnt do it with jay!!.. why??.. i dont know!..
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For some of us that actually attended the show, LIVE action does not lie. Jay's conditioning was second to none (when it comes to big men) and Ronnie was off from his all time best. Ronnie did have a slight size advantage but it shouldn't have been enough to beat Cutler that night.
I will say this, I have been to many IFBB pro bodybuilding events, and I never felt crowd energy like the 2001 "O"
I respect that you were at the show but also realise that people always root for an upset cos it's more exciting. The fact that Ron was off from his all time best, and Jay was at his all time best, doesn't mean anything if Ron still looks better than Jay. The fact Ron can carry some water and still have way more definition in the back, glutes and hamstrings is testament to his dominance. When they turn around it's like Dorian vs Nasser all over again; one has 3D thickness and separation, the other has mountains of blurry muscle and skin that kind of blends together. Ronnie got the shape and the separation and despite the layer of water still has superior conditioning from the back, which judges pretty much see as vital.
Jay got the calves, which he exploits to good effect in a couple of poses, but both back shots go to Ron, front double bi, front lat spread, side chest, that's already enough. Jay had great abs and thigh, but you can see Ronnie's superior waist and structure in the video, even if his abs are worse. Plus his whole upper body has a layer of detail and size that Jay will never have.
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I respect that you were at the show but also realise that people always root for an upset cos it's more exciting. The fact that Ron was off from his all time best, and Jay was at his all time best, doesn't mean anything if Ron still looks better than Jay. The fact Ron can carry some water and still have way more definition in the back, glutes and hamstrings is testament to his dominance. When they turn around it's like Dorian vs Nasser all over again; one has 3D thickness and separation, the other has mountains of blurry muscle and skin that kind of blends together. Ronnie got the shape and the separation and despite the layer of water still has superior conditioning from the back, which judges pretty much see as vital.
Jay got the calves, which he exploits to good effect in a couple of poses, but both back shots go to Ron, front double bi, front lat spread, side chest, that's already enough. Jay had great abs and thigh, but you can see Ronnie's superior waist and structure in the video, even if his abs are worse. Plus his whole upper body has a layer of detail and size that Jay will never have.
Jay won the prejudging.
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Jay won the prejudging.
Bingo. That video was from PJing, so it's kind of a moot point.
Ronnie was off, but I still think he won, but not just from the back. He was doing a lot of little things in between poses, and certain things he did within the poses (bring out striations in the pecs while doing the lat spread, for example) could have taken the judges eyes of Jay...
...but again, Jay won the pre-judging so no matter what argument you can/will bring bring up; it's null and void. Post a video from the night show and then you can argue as if it were the "truce thread."
I'm not sure, but was this the year that Ronnie claimed the baby food screwed up his prep, or was it the time he said he felt bad during PJing and downed an entire gallon of water in "one breath" after he got back from the venue? I think it was the latter.
yes but they had qualified nasser in 1996 for the same reason and didnt do it with jay!!.. why??.. i dont know!..
I think Jay threatened to sue, and possibly use Nasser as an example. I remember it being pretty suspicious and that Ruhl also failed his test yet did not regain his placing.
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Jay from the front
Ronnie from the back
Nobody beats a top shape Ronnie from the back.
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I was at the show and this is how it was....
Although Jay was at his best, his structural flaws kept him from beating Coleman. As you can tell when they hit back shots a 90% Coleman always beats a 100% Cutler. The problem I had at the show was that the talking heads said Coleman came back during the posedown...A round which wasn't scored at the time. In order to cover it all up, Jay test positive for diuretics... ::) and they use that to try to DQ him. Jay threatens to sue and the IFBB drops it.
What a great sportinf event just full of intergrity. ::)
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The problem I had at the show was that the talking heads said Coleman came back during the posedown...A round which wasn't scored at the time.
I thought it was just at the night show in general that Coleman came back to win, not the posedown in particular?
But Jay won the PJing, and anyone that's been around BBing long enough, knows that's where the show is won or lost...and the points from the night show are virtually useless.
Either way, I'm in 100% agreement with you that it seemed fishy that Coleman came back and won the contest after already losing the PJing. And honestly, I never thought of the other facet you threw in there; as a cover up they DQ'd Jay for diuretics. Interesting theory, certainly plausible too.
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I thought it was just at the night show in general that Coleman came back to win, not the posedown in particular?
But Jay won the PJing, and anyone that's been around BBing long enough, knows that's where the show is won or lost...and the points from the night show are virtually useless.
Either way, I'm in 100% agreement with you that it seemed fishy that Coleman came back and won the contest after already losing the PJing. And honestly, I never thought of the other facet you threw in there; as a cover up they DQ'd Jay for diuretics. Interesting theory, certainly plausible too.
I'm certain it was the posedown because I thought to myself, "the posedown isn't even scored?"
The whole DQ thing def put up by bullshit flag.
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Hard to tell how conditioned they were from the vid, but at a glance I still think Ronnie wins easy.
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I'm certain it was the posedown because I thought to myself, "the posedown isn't even scored?"
The whole DQ thing def put up by bullshit flag.
Here's the link from MattC's site (subtract the space between bodybuilding and pro):
http://www.bodybuilding pro.com/2001mrolympiascorecard.html
We're both right. ;)
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Here's the link from MattC's site (subtract the space between bodybuilding and pro):
http://www.bodybuilding pro.com/2001mrolympiascorecard.html
We're both right. ;)
In that case, it's doubly fucked... ;D
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Wow good thing we keep up on current events here ::)
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Wow good thing we keep up on current events here ::)
be careful, otherwise they might start discussing arnolds 1980 win...
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The only real size difference I see is that Ronnie is taller, and his stomach is much bigger. Jay more than holds his own. Ronnie had a real distention problem that year essentially every year thereafter. It was close though as the scorecards reflected.
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Ron please allow links for me site on here again. :( I promise I won't spam again.
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Pics can be decieving but..
The video doesnt lie...
of all the madatory poses
I have jay wining
ab and thigh
and side tri (because coleman doesnt know how to do it)
the rest of the poses coleman Dominated jay
size was just too much
jay ddid look good that yr though very good
Which is exactly why you don't know much about professional bodybuiding .
it wasn't close? Jay outright beat Ronnie in the entire prejudging and Ronnie only squeaked by him by vastly improving in the night show. 3 points separated Ronnie and Jay that's as close as it gets.
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Ron please allow links for me site on here again. :( I promise I won't spam again.
How many chances (at anything on here) would you like to be given?
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Wow good thing we keep up on current events here ::)
Everything in the past affects everything now. ;)
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How many chances (at anything on here) would you like to be given?
Yeah don't push your luck MattC >:(
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The size difference is very apparent the scorecard means nothng to me I use my own eyes to make my own judgements the if we go by the scorecard how many bbers have been screwed over time
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The size difference is very apparent the scorecard means nothng to me I use my own eyes to make my own judgements the if we go by the scorecard how many bbers have been screwed over time
Yeah why would the scorecard matter ::) judges should judge contests on the internet who needs to be live & in person ::)
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Which is exactly why you don't know much about professional bodybuiding .
it wasn't close? Jay outright beat Ronnie in the entire prejudging and Ronnie only squeaked by him by vastly improving in the night show. 3 points separated Ronnie and Jay that's as close as it gets.
you keep saying that bodybuilding
I think u even suggesting Dorian is a great bodybuilder yuck with a great physique ludicrious but I don't tell you you don't know about bbing because that's your opinion I don't suggest ignorance so I would appreciate if u stop dong so
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The size difference is very apparent the scorecard means nothng to me I use my own eyes to make my own judgements the if we go by the scorecard how many bbers have been screwed over time
I only used the score card in order to show Wiggs that Ronnie came back during both night show rounds, that's all.
And like anything, if you know how the system works, you can easily manipulate it thus rendering it useless.
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Ron please allow links for me site on here again. :( I promise I won't spam again.
your skating on thin ice after your last spam venture
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you keep saying that bodybuilding
I think u even suggesting Dorian is a great bodybuilder yuck with a great physique ludicrious but I don't tell you you don't know about bbing because that's your opinion I don't suggest ignorance so I would appreciate if u stop dong so
The old saying is you're entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts. facts is 2001 was an extremely close contest regardless of how you see it
And looking for a way out to Dorian? which has absolutely nothing to do with the 2001 Mr Olympia
and you can tell me I don't know about bodybuilding I could care less but your statements 9 times out of 10 contradict reality which proves you're ignorant , and being ignorant isn't a bad thing well it is when you're trying to pass it off as facts
Ronnie was very lucky in 2001 and that's a fact
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yes but they had qualified nasser in 1996 for the same reason and didnt do it with jay!!.. why??.. i dont know!..
Because the wizard of oil wasn't smart enough to hire a lawyer.
Quick question, why is your head so big? Genetic?
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Didn't they both weigh 270lbs? Jay is 2 inches shorter too.
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Didn't they both weigh 270lbs? Jay is 2 inches shorter too.
I think they were both 265 !
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Epic being able to squat with the bar set at incline height for a normal-sized human
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=304472.0;attach=346161;image)
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The old saying is you're entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts. facts is 2001 was an extremely close contest regardless of how you see it
And looking for a way out to Dorian? which has absolutely nothing to do with the 2001 Mr Olympia
and you can tell me I don't know about bodybuilding I could care less but your statements 9 times out of 10 contradict reality which proves you're ignorant , and being ignorant isn't a bad thing well it is when you're trying to pass it off as facts
Ronnie was very lucky in 2001 and that's a fact
I used your devoted following of Dorian as an example
so I take it as I think Dorian looked repulsive with small arms and you think he's the greatest bber ever :-\
using your theory Its fair for me to call you ignorant
If I said jay should have won or doriaan is a great bber (oh brother) then I would be less ignorant listen bbing is based on opinion if you don't realise it then with respect perhaps it's you that is ignorant
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I used your devoted following of Dorian as an example
so I take it as I think Dorian looked repulsive with small arms and you think he's the greatest bber ever :-\
using your theory Its fair for me to call you ignorant
If I said jay should have won or doriaan is a great bber (oh brother) then I would be less ignorant listen bbing is based on opinion if you don't realise it then with respect perhaps it's you that is ignorant
I used your devoted following of Dorian as an example
so I take it as I think Dorian looked repulsive with small arms and you think he's the greatest bber ever :-\
using your theory Its fair for me to call you ignorant
WRONG I never said he was the greatest bb ever and I have facts to back me up , you have what exactly? I know how bodybuilding is judged you don't , you base your opinion on preference , bias and ignorance , I don't
If I said jay should have won or doriaan is a great bber (oh brother) then I would be less ignorant listen bbing is based on opinion if you don't realise it then with respect perhaps it's you that is ignorant
bodybuilding is based on a set of criteria and on a group of many different men who all reach a unanimous decision based on that criteria and ultimately their opinion counts and yours don't
wow you said Dorian wasn't great , man you certainly negated the facts that contradict that ::) Dorian was better than ALL your heros this is a fact , he's one of the greatest and most dominate bodybuilders to ever step on-stage and history has proven this regardless of what you think
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Yeah why would the scorecard matter ::) judges should judge contests on the internet who needs to be live & in person ::)
According to the judges Ronnie won.
HTH
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According to the judges Ronnie won.
HTH
Please find me where I said otherwise ;)
I agree with Ronnie edging him out , however facts are facts and the fact is it was close and Ronnie was lucky.
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Not sure the judges decide unianimously do they? That suggests they all have the same guy in first, second etc. which is seldom true, no?
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Not sure the judges decide unianimously do they? That suggests they all have the same guy in first, second etc. which is seldom true, no?
Yes and NO the high scores & lows are tossed out and the scores left determine who wins
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I suppose that's unanimous-ish?
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I suppose that's unanimous-ish?
It is when all things are considered
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This has been done many times. Ronnie destroyed him
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Which is exactly why you don't know much about professional bodybuiding .
it wasn't close? Jay outright beat Ronnie in the entire prejudging and Ronnie only squeaked by him by vastly improving in the night show. 3 points separated Ronnie and Jay that's as close as it gets.
you make the mistake of assuming that the scoring was accurate.
the video clearly shows it wasn't.
ronnie wins easily. not barely like the score card would lead one to believe.
when are you going to stop looking at the numbers and start looking at the contests? ::) ::)
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This has been done many times. Ronnie destroyed him
exactly.
despite the judges thinking otherwise with jay winning the prejudging.. ::)
what the scores say and what actually transpired onstage are two totally different things.
on paper - Ronnie loses the prejudging.
in real life, Ronnie owns jay during the prejudging.
typical IFBB BS to stir up some interest in the sport.
ronnie dominating, fans getting bored, so lets overscore jay and generate some buzz.
worked like a charm.. ::)
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Ronnies back double bi is ridiculous :o
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Jay should just stick with that first MM.
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Epic being able to squat with the bar set at incline height for a normal-sized human
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=304472.0;attach=346161;image)
;D
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Epic being able to squat with the bar set at incline height for a normal-sized human
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=304472.0;attach=346161;image)
i dont think it's big for my body idiot, may be the angle of the pic., here is a normal one :-X
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exactly.
despite the judges thinking otherwise with jay winning the prejudging.. ::)
what the scores say and what actually transpired onstage are two totally different things.
on paper - Ronnie loses the prejudging.
in real life, Ronnie owns jay during the prejudging.
typical IFBB BS to stir up some interest in the sport.
ronnie dominating, fans getting bored, so lets overscore jay and generate some buzz.
worked like a charm.. ::)
x2
not close as the scorecard would suggest
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you make the mistake of assuming that the scoring was accurate.
the video clearly shows it wasn't.
ronnie wins easily. not barely like the score card would lead one to believe.
when are you going to stop looking at the numbers and start looking at the contests? ::) ::)
jay always stands more forward then ronnie (at every olympia) see here 2005, but when they are right next to each other (ronnie pawns him)
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you make the mistake of assuming that the scoring was accurate.
the video clearly shows it wasn't.
ronnie wins easily. not barely like the score card would lead one to believe.
when are you going to stop looking at the numbers and start looking at the contests? ::) ::)
No Ronnie ' dominated ' according to you ::) trying to rewrite history again huh stupid?
Ronnie knew it was close in fact he thought he was second
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This has been done many times. Ronnie destroyed him
bullshit he did and he knows it
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No Ronnie ' dominated ' according to you ::) trying to rewrite history again huh stupid?
Ronnie knew it was close in fact he thought he was second
may be it was the victory sign ;D
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looks like a peace sign to me ???
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No Ronnie ' dominated ' according to you ::) trying to rewrite history again huh stupid?
Ronnie knew it was close in fact he thought he was second
he did say in flex that he was saying hello to somebody, but who knows?
E
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may be it was the victory sign ;D
It's a " I know I lost sign " he lucked out in 01 and he knows it
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As long as man in thong wins I'm happy with that.
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yes but they had qualified nasser in 1996 for the same reason and didnt do it with jay!!.. why??.. i dont know!..
If I recall...I think it went something like this:
He threatened to sue the Weiders claiming the test didn't was IOC-certified and they apparently didn't want to go into court against Jay.
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;)
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2005 was much closer that I realized....Jay looked awesome.
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2005 was much closer that I realized....Jay looked awesome.
yes and ronnie was not at all close to his best!..