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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: CC973 on August 14, 2010, 07:18:25 AM
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Good job by Obama.
Obama supports plan for mosque near ground zero
At a Ramadan dinner at the White House, the president breaks his silence on the issue, framing it as one of religious freedom.
President Obama addresses guests at an iftar dinner, the meal that breaks the dawn-to-dusk fast for Muslims during the holy month of Ramadan, at the White House. (J. Scott Applewhite / Associated Press)
Reporting from Washington — President Obama on Friday took a strong stand in favor of building a mosque near the site where Muslim terrorists flew airplanes into the World Trade Center on Sept. 11, 2001, breaking his silence on a political tempest that has left the country divided.
Speaking at a White House dinner celebrating Ramadan, Obama framed the issue as one of religious freedom.
Muslims "have the same right to practice their religion as everyone else in this country," Obama said, according to a White House transcript. "That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in Lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances."
The uproar over the proposed mosque has rekindled a debate over religious tolerance in a post-Sept. 11 society. Some relatives of Sept. 11 victims have come out against the mosque, as have prominent politicians.
Republican Rep. Peter T. King of New York said Friday that Obama was wrong.
"It is insensitive and uncaring for the Muslim community to build a mosque in the shadow of ground zero," King said in a statement. "While the Muslim community has the right to build the mosque, they are abusing that right by needlessly offending so many people who have suffered so much.…Unfortunately the president caved into political correctness."
A majority doesn't want to see the mosque built, national surveys show. A CNN/Opinion Research poll earlier this month showed 68% opposed plans to build the mosque, with 29% in favor. Count as part of the minority New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who recently gave a speech defending the planned Islamic center.
In a statement released Friday night, Bloomberg said: "As I said last week, this proposed mosque and community center in Lower Manhattan is as important a test of the separation of church and state as we may see in our lifetime, and I applaud President Obama's clarion defense of the freedom of religion tonight."
As the debate raged, Obama stayed out of it. As recently as last week, his press secretary, Robert Gibbs, described the matter as one "for New York City and the local community to decide."
But the White House's Ramadan celebration, held in the State Dining Room with about 90 guests, presented a unique moment for Obama to make his position known.
"Now, we must all recognize and respect the sensitivities surrounding the development of Lower Manhattan," he said, according to the White House transcript. "The 9/11 attacks were a deeply traumatic event for our country. And the pain and the experience of suffering by those who lost loved ones is just unimaginable. So I understand the emotions that this issue engenders."
That said, he added: "This is America. And our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakeable."
Supporting the mosque is a dicey proposition for Obama. Polls have shown a certain percentage of Americans mistakenly view him as a Muslim. He is Christian. Defending the mosque invites suspicion that he is overly sympathetic to the Muslim faith. At the same time, Obama has taken pains to reach out to the Muslim world. He gave a major speech in Cairo last year calling for "a new beginning" between the U.S. and Muslims.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-obama-mosque-20100814,0,7153887.story
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Obama is a freakin idiot!
This situation would be like a memorial dedicated to Adolf Hitler being built near a Jewish Holocaust shrine!
Its true what they say, black people have no intelligence!!
Worst President in American History!
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The Coach will not respond to this topic, he stopped talking politics!
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Obama is a freakin idiot!
This situation would be like a memorial dedicated to Adolf Hitler being built near a Jewish Holocaust shrine!
Its true what they say, black people have no intelligence!!
Worst President in American History!
2 bad his harvard law class was bring up the rear. anyway...the most culturally diverse president in culturally ignorant north american history.
(http://online.wsj.com/media/obama_cuba_ssh_20080523153153.jpg)
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Obama is a freakin idiot!
This situation would be like a memorial dedicated to Adolf Hitler being built near a Jewish Holocaust shrine!
Its true what they say, black people have no intelligence!!
Worst President in American History!
The people who were responsible for what took place at ground zero do not represent Islam. The atrocities they committed actually place them outside the fold of the faith. Islam is a religion of peace. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and a few million of them are Americans (those numbers actually went up significantly after 911 because people actually studied the religion and read the Quran for themselves. There are plenty of crazy Christians out there who claim Christianity but their actions say otherwise. We should never judge or condemn an entire religion based on the actions of a small group of nutjobs.
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The Coach will not respond to this topic, he stopped talking politics!
I was just going to say that the Coach is going to have a field day with this one :D
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of course Obama supports the mosque. hell, he probably lost a couple of brothers in those planes
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You guys are political idiots.
Actually you guys are just idiots.
Stay out of the polls.
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The Coach will not respond to this topic, he stopped talking politics!
I already said he was a traitor and hates America. I don't think I need to reiterate it.
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The people who were responsible for what took place at ground zero do not represent Islam. The atrocities they committed actually place them outside the fold of the faith. Islam is a religion of peace. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and a few million of them are Americans (those numbers actually went up significantly after 911 because people actually studied the religion and read the Quran for themselves. There are plenty of crazy Christians out there who claim Christianity but their actions say otherwise. We should never judge or condemn an entire religion based on the actions of a small group of nutjobs.
x2
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Let's be realistic here: any decision Obama would have made would have made him look unamerican. If he was against building the Mosque, then he is unamerican because he is denying people their rights (we all know America is about freedom and rights, blah, blah, blah). If he is in favor of building the mosque, that makes him unamerican because he will be labeled a traitor.
The guy can't win.
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If they really wanted to show what America is about they should build a big building that all religions can meet together in. Come up with something new. Not a Mosque that is barred to anyone that is not Muslim.
This is planed, they want animosity and division between different groups of people.
Nations, Languages, Religions, Wars is what the people behind NWO build their control on. If everyone got together they would be powerless.
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Obama is a freakin idiot!
This situation would be like a memorial dedicated to Adolf Hitler being built near a Jewish Holocaust shrine!
Its true what they say, black people have no intelligence!!
Worst President in American History!
No, if you REALLY wanted to compare this situation to the holocaust..... you would say this situation is like a Church being built near a jewish holocaust shrine... (because Adolf Hilter was Christian)....
So your statement is pretty idiotic.
And btw there are a few churches right next to the Auschwitz Memorial in the Polish provinces, one being literally right across the street!
And like 8 churches next to the Holocaust Museum in Washington DC, again one of them being directly in front of it!
If you're gonna argue about this you'd better re-think your arguments and don't just spew shit out of your mouth!
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Let's be realistic here: any decision Obama would have made would have made him look unamerican. If he was against building the Mosque, then he is unamerican because he is denying people their rights (we all know America is about freedom and rights, blah, blah, blah). If he is in favor of building the mosque, that makes him unamerican because he will be labeled a traitor.
The guy can't win.
We have a lot of mosques in this country but backing one thats at the site of 9/11 is too much and over the top. The government also paid for middle east trip for the leader of that mosque. Do you think they would do that for lets say Billy or Franklyn Graham?
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The people who were responsible for what took place at ground zero do not represent Islam. The atrocities they committed actually place them outside the fold of the faith. Islam is a religion of peace. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and a few million of them are Americans (those numbers actually went up significantly after 911 because people actually studied the religion and read the Quran for themselves. There are plenty of crazy Christians out there who claim Christianity but their actions say otherwise. We should never judge or condemn an entire religion based on the actions of a small group of nutjobs.
Islam is not a religion of peace.
Its a religion about being submissive to Allah. And if you are not submissive, its about being forced to be submissive by way of war or death.
When the so called prophet Mohammed lived , he would have Holy Wars called Jihads, if you didnt follow "Allah" you would be considered an infadel and deserved to be put to death.
Know your facts...their Holy Quran teaches this...religion of peace my a$$
Islam is not a religion of peace and it does not tolerate other religions....their religion teaches this
. I dare you...move to a Muslim country and tell me if its a religion of peace...
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We have a lot of mosques in this country but backing one thats at the site of 9/11 is too much and over the top. The government also paid for middle east trip for the leader of that mosque. Do you think they would do that for lets say Billy or Franklyn Graham?
you actually make a good point (can't believe I'm actually agreeing with you politically) even though not all muslims are terrorists when looked at from an EMOTIONAL side many people cannot differentiate the two, but the problem is.... if you are willing to say to the muslims, you can build a mosque anywhere but not here.... who's to say this situation will not be able to be taken advantage of in the future?
I mean, if the US stands by religious equality for everyone... then it should apply for everyone and everywhere!!! You can't pick and choose or else people will take advantage of it all the times in the future.... oh no you can't build a synogogue here because there is a church across the street, etc etc.... The country needs to have a firm stance on the issue, are you allowing for religious freedom or are you going to monitor it and control it like other fundamentalistic countries!
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Islam is not a religion of peace.
Its a religion about being submissive to Allah. And if you are not submissive, its about being forced to be submissive by way of war or death.
When the so called prophet Mohammed lived , he would have Holy Wars called Jihads, if you didnt follow "Allah" you would be considered an infadel and deserved to be put to death.
Know your facts...their Holy Quran teaches this...religion of peace my a$$
Islam is not a religion of peace and it does not tolerate other religions....their religion teaches this
. I dare you...move to a Muslim country and tell me if its a religion of peace...
I lived in a muslim country for many years and my family is actually muslim and even though I was raised a muslim I personally don't practice islam anymore but I also don't practice any other religion either....
Islam is no different than any other religion... Look deep into christianity... I have a well learned christian friend who specificlly discussed with me how christianity does not tolerate other religions... What about the Crusades??? Wow such a peaceful christian event ::)
The religions are very close... as stated I was raised a muslim... but I like to learn about other faiths, so I attended catholic church (sunday mass) for 6 weeks as a learning experience, and I tell you, the experience was almost identical to going to friday prayer in a mosque!
Here you are bashing islam, but have you ever set foot in a mosque, as I did in a church?
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you actually make a good point (can't believe I'm actually agreeing with you politically) even though not all muslims are terrorists when looked at from an EMOTIONAL side many people cannot differentiate the two, but the problem is.... if you are willing to say to the muslims, you can build a mosque anywhere but not here.... who's to say this situation will not be able to be taken advantage of in the future?
I mean, if the US stands by religious equality for everyone... then it should apply for everyone and everywhere!!! You can't pick and choose or else people will take advantage of it all the times in the future.... oh no you can't build a synogogue here because there is a church across the street, etc etc.... The country needs to have a firm stance on the issue, are you allowing for religious freedom or are you going to monitor it and control it like other fundamentalistic countries!
What I dont agree with is the president Barak "Osama" doesnt have common sense... he is not attruned to the feelings of those whose families died on 9/11.
I agree with what one poster has said on this thread, they should make a organization for religious tolereance. But Islam wil never be tolerant of other religions...never!
Again,I know BigAch that you are probably muslim so you will defend your religion but your religion is not a religion of peace. Your religion teaches to treat women like second class citizens, it teaches mercy killings, it condones brutalizing those who arent of the same religion as you.
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I lived in a muslim country for many years and my family is actually muslim and even though I was raised a muslim I personally don't practice islam anymore but I also don't practice any other religion either....
Islam is no different than any other religion... Look deep into christianity... I have a well learned christian friend who specificlly discussed with me how christianity does not tolerate other religions... What about the Crusades??? Wow such a peaceful christian event ::)
The religions are very close... as stated I was raised a muslim... but I like to learn about other faiths, so I attended catholic church (sunday mass) for 6 weeks as a learning experience, and I tell you, the experience was almost identical to going to friday prayer in a mosque!
Here you are bashing islam, but have you ever set foot in a mosque, as I did in a church?
Why would I want to set foot in a Mosque and learn about a religion that treats women like servants and second class citizens and condones wars to spread their religion?
I know that their are a lot of hypocrites in the christian churches..I myself am One of them but the Bible actually teaches you to love your neighbor and treat others as you would yourself...it doe4snt tell you like the Quran to kill those who arent of your beliefs....
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If you read my post above you will I see I don't practice any religion.....
My point is that islam is no different than any other relgion....
Muslims have Jihad.... Christians had the Crusades....
None are really "peaceful" Did you read my post, did I say I think Islam is peaceful??
Obama can't put a ban or stop on the building of this mosque because the US has a clear separation of church and state!!! This is how the country is founded!!!
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Why would I want to set foot in a Mosque and learn about a religion that treats women like servants and second class citizens and condones wars to spread their religion?
I know that their are a lot of hypocrites in the christian churches..I myself am One of them but the Bible actually teaches you to love your neighbor and treat others as you would yourself...it doe4snt tell you like the Quran to kill those who arent of your beliefs....
Dude I was told by a priest straight to my face that I will burn in hell because at the time I was practicing another religion!
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If you read my post above you will I see I don't practice any religion.....
My point is that islam is no different than any other relgion....
Muslims have Jihad.... Christians had the Crusades....
None are really "peaceful" Did you read my post, did I say I think Islam is peaceful??
Obama can't put a ban or stop on the building of this mosque because the US has a clear separation of church and state!!! This is how the country is founded!!!
But the actual fundementals and beliefs of Jesus Teachings are peace and love not war. For those so called people that killed other people in the name of christianity ..their beliefs were wrong...the crusades were wrong. If Jesus was there at that time, he would have told them they were wrong...if Mohammed was still alive, he would be a non comapssionate dictator spreading fear and hate and killing those who are not Muslims...
Thats the difference there why I will never fol Islam or believ it is a religion of peace.... The Quran teaches that the workld needs to be submissive to Allah and if you arent, you should be put to death...
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Ok... I will post this once and for all and then go get my hair cut... my post is not to state whether islam is a peaceful religion or not...... my post is just to say that the US is founded upon a separation of church and state and allowing religious equality and freedom to everybody...
So the president cannot take a stance against it.... If the muslims are following the laws and have the proper paper work they can build a mosque where ever they want..
With that being said.... I DO BELIEVE its in poor taste to build it right next to the WTC site and AT THIS TIME... its too soon from an emotional point of view!!! People are still hurt and in their minds they cannot differentiate muslims from terrorists.
In summary:
From an emotional side: Not cool to build
From a legal and political side: Build
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But the actual fundementals and beliefs of Jesus Teachings are peace and love not war. For those so called people that killed other people in the name of christianity ..their beliefs were wrong...the crusades were wrong. If Jesus was there at that time, he would have told them they were wrong...if Mohammed was still alive, he would be a non comapssionate dictator spreading fear and hate and killing those who are not Muslims...
Thats the difference there why I will never fol Islam or believ it is a religion of peace.... The Quran teaches that the workld needs to be submissive to Allah and if you arent, you should be put to death...
I honestly can't disagree with you.... But I will say this... part of the reason I do not practice any religion now is because the koran (as well as other scriptures) are soooo obscure and are interpreted in sooo many different ways...
When I was growing up and raised as a muslim, I was taught by my parents as well as different Imams (muslim priests) that the religion is about love and to respect people of all religions, and I practiced this as much as I possibly could... some of my bestest bestet friends are jewish and others... never once was I taught to hate or to kill or anything like that.. and I came from a practicing family, we prayed, fasted during ramadan, etc... as I grew up and studied the scriptures (both islam and others) on my own, I found them to be so vage so obscure with so many different meanings and such un clear answers... so this is when I turned away from everything...
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The people who were responsible for what took place at ground zero do not represent Islam. The atrocities they committed actually place them outside the fold of the faith. Islam is a religion of peace. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and a few million of them are Americans (those numbers actually went up significantly after 911 because people actually studied the religion and read the Quran for themselves. There are plenty of crazy Christians out there who claim Christianity but their actions say otherwise. We should never judge or condemn an entire religion based on the actions of a small group of nutjobs.
A small group of nutjobs? Be serious. Every single day, whether it is in Indonesia, Africa, the Phillipines, The Middle east, there are Muslims committing Terrorist acts. Blowing themselves up..placing car bombs, slaughtering people. There are literally hundreds of thousands of Jihadists. No other religion comes close in modern society to having the multitude of terrorists that Islam has. And while there may be many so-called moderate muslims that will congregate at the new mosque, mathematically the odds are heavily in favor that there will be plenty of Muslims who are more radical. And to have a building at ground zero that houses even one of these lunatics is an abomination. Obama is shooting himself in the foot and dooming the future of the democrats by endorsing this Mosque lunacy against the will of 70% of Americans.
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I will end and say Barak Osama is a freakin idiot!
He is leading this country to ruin. He is nto a christian..he is a muslim and is trying to turn this country into a muslim nation:
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Obama is the only American President to bow before a Muslim king... he is not a true american or Christian!
By bowing before a muslim king, Obama made it a statement that Islam is above everything the United States stands for...he is damn idiot!
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Your religion teaches to treat women like second class citizens, it teaches mercy killings, it condones brutalizing those who arent of the same religion as you.
Really? Lets look at what Islam really has to say regarding the status of women...
In a truely Islamic society women have the following rights in Islam:
1. The right and duty to obtain education.
2. The right to have their own independent property.
3. The right to work to earn money if they need it or want it.
4. Equality of reward for equal deeds.
5. The right to express their opinion and be heard.
6. The right to provisions from the husband for all her needs and more.
7. The right to negotiate marriage terms of her choice.
8. The right to obtain divorce from her husband, even on the grounds that she simply can't stand him. (pls note that God deeply frowns upon divorce as a solution unless there is hardly any other alternative but it does not mean that men have more right to divorce their wives than women do.)
9. The right to keep all her own money (she is not responsible to maintain any relations).
10. The right to get sexual satisfaction from her husband.
11. custody of their children after divorce.
12. to refuse any marriage that does not please them
and more...
http://www.themodernreligion.com/women/w_rights_summary.htm
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Really? Lets look at what Islam really has to say regarding the status of women...
In a truely Islamic society women have the following rights in Islam:
1. The right and duty to obtain education.
2. The right to have their own independent property.
3. The right to work to earn money if they need it or want it.
4. Equality of reward for equal deeds.
5. The right to express their opinion and be heard.
6. The right to provisions from the husband for all her needs and more.
7. The right to negotiate marriage terms of her choice.
8. The right to obtain divorce from her husband, even on the grounds that she simply can't stand him. (pls note that God deeply frowns upon divorce as a solution unless there is hardly any other alternative but it does not mean that men have more right to divorce their wives than women do.)
9. The right to keep all her own money (she is not responsible to maintain any relations).
10. The right to get sexual satisfaction from her husband.
11. custody of their children after divorce.
12. to refuse any marriage that does not please them
and more...
http://www.themodernreligion.com/women/w_rights_summary.htm
Oh really?
Islam allows the hiusband to beat the wife to make her subserviant so she doesnt practice her rights :)
Ypu post the things above to make people believe it is a religion of equality and peace but its not
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A small group of nutjobs? Be serious. Every single day, whether it is in Indonesia, Africa, the Phillipines, The Middle east, there are Muslims committing Terrorist acts. Blowing themselves up..placing car bombs, slaughtering people. There are literally hundreds of thousands of Jihadists. No other religion comes close in modern society to having the multitude of terrorists that Islam has. And while there may be many so-called moderate muslims that will congregate at the new mosque, mathematically the odds are heavily in favor that there will be plenty of Muslims who are more radical. And to have a building at ground zero that houses even one of these lunatics is an abomination. Obama is shooting himself in the foot and dooming the future of the democrats by endorsing this Mosque lunacy against the will of 70% of Americans.
Yes a small group of radical nutjobs who don't represent the true teachings of the faith. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and the vast majority are not looking to blow stuff up or start holy wars in the name of Allah. The same applies for christianity. How much blood has been shed has taken place in the name of christianity? Just as we should never judge christianity by the actions of christians,don't judge islam in that manner either.
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the new yorkers are going to tear that place up. lol.
whats funny is that the head of a huge canadian muslim association has even spoke out publicly about it.
they feel it is insensitive to build a muslim community center/mosque so close to the location where "members of their own faith" (his words) killed so many innocent people.
and I think they are right.
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Yes a small group of radical nutjobs who don't represent the true teachings of the faith. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and the vast majority are not looking to blow stuff up or start holy wars in the name of Allah. The same applies for christianity. How much blood has been shed has taken place in the name of christianity? Just as we should never judge christianity by the actions of christians,don't judge islam in that manner either.
But their own religion teaches to use force against the infidels (non muslims). It also teaches death to anyone that isnt a muslim.
The Bible says to do good deeds and it says the evils you do in secret will be made evident one day but in the end God will be the judge but the Quran teaches that anyone could be put to death and each muslim has the right to put non muslims to death who dont believe what they believe...read the darn Quran..dont say it is a religion pof peace when it is Islamic law to put people death who arent muslims
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Why would I want to set foot in a Mosque and learn about a religion that treats women like servants and second class citizens and condones wars to spread their religion?
I know that their are a lot of hypocrites in the christian churches..I myself am One of them but the Bible actually teaches you to love your neighbor and treat others as you would yourself...it doe4snt tell you like the Quran to kill those who arent of your beliefs....
not quite true.
Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
this is ' gentle Jesus ' saying this BTW
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The people who were responsible for what took place at ground zero do not represent Islam. The atrocities they committed actually place them outside the fold of the faith. Islam is a religion of peace. There are about 1.8 billion Muslims in the world and a few million of them are Americans (those numbers actually went up significantly after 911 because people actually studied the religion and read the Quran for themselves. There are plenty of crazy Christians out there who claim Christianity but their actions say otherwise. We should never judge or condemn an entire religion based on the actions of a small group of nutjobs.
Apparently, your reading comprehension isn't very good than if you believe for a second that the Qu'ran teaches Islam as being a religion of peace. This is one of the most blatantly stupid posts I have seen in quite awhile.
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Oh really?
Ypu post the things above to make people believe it is a religion of equality and peace but its not
That is not what Islam teaches.
Statistics prove that Muslim homes are not havens for domestic violence. Domestic violence is not more prominent in Islam, or any religion or race.
Islam has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world, would it not make sense that if so many women were being mistreated that Muslim marriages would have higher divorce rates?
"O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them happiness, that ye may take away part of the dower [i.e money given by the husband to the wife for the marriage contract] ye have given them, except where they have been guilty of open lewdness: on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brigns about through it a great deal of good" [The Quran, 4:19]
"If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them" [Quran, 4:124]
Narrated Mu'awiyah al-Qushayri: "I went to the Apostle of Allah and asked him: what do you say (command) about our wives? He replied: Give them food what you have for yourself, and clothe them by which you clothe yourself, AND DO NOT BEAT THEM" [Sunnah Abu Dawood, Book 11, Marriage, Number 2139]
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not quite true.
Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
this is ' gentle Jesus ' saying this BTW
This is a parable. It's about the servant who hides the money the master gives him and does not invest it wisely. The parable is not literal, it means that, whatever God gives us in the way of talent or resources, we should use it wisely in His service.
Jesus was telling a story to illustrate a point, and the ruler in the story was the one who said that. It's not at all out of character for rulers in those days - or these, for that matter.
The parable is about judgment day. Reread the whole thing with that in mind and see if it makes sense to you.
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Ronnie is still better.
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Why don't the build it in Afghanistan. I sure the Taliban need a peaceful place to worship.
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That is not what Islam teaches.
Statistics prove that Muslim homes are not havens for domestic violence. Domestic violence is not more prominent in Islam, or any religion or race.
Islam has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world, would it not make sense that if so many women were being mistreated that Muslim marriages would have higher divorce rates?
"O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them happiness, that ye may take away part of the dower [i.e money given by the husband to the wife for the marriage contract] ye have given them, except where they have been guilty of open lewdness: on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brigns about through it a great deal of good" [The Quran, 4:19]
"If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them" [Quran, 4:124]
Narrated Mu'awiyah al-Qushayri: "I went to the Apostle of Allah and asked him: what do you say (command) about our wives? He replied: Give them food what you have for yourself, and clothe them by which you clothe yourself, AND DO NOT BEAT THEM" [Sunnah Abu Dawood, Book 11, Marriage, Number 2139]
This is because the women live in fear. WHen a muslim woman divorces, she loses everything and is cast out on the streets.
Be honest for a chnage...stop ting pretty picturesd to make people believe that Islam treats females great..it doesnt
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not quite true.
Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
this is ' gentle Jesus ' saying this BTW
Parable.......Completely out of context. Taking one line and using it to make a point is not good without context.
We will all be judged at the end, but He never tells us to go around killing everyone who doesn't believe as we do. Not even close. We all have plenty of opportunity to come to Him throughout our lifetimes. In the end, however, if you do not believe then you will be judged and held accountable.
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not quite true.
Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
this is ' gentle Jesus ' saying this BTW
Can't remember the last time I've seen a Christian strap on a bomb and kill innocent people.
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This is a parable. It's about the servant who hides the money the master gives him and does not invest it wisely. The parable is not literal, it means that, whatever God gives us in the way of talent or resources, we should use it wisely in His service.
Jesus was telling a story to illustrate a point, and the ruler in the story was the one who said that. It's not at all out of character for rulers in those days - or these, for that matter.
The parable is about judgment day. Reread the whole thing with that in mind and see if it makes sense to you.
Exactly.
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This is a parable. It's about the servant who hides the money the master gives him and does not invest it wisely. The parable is not literal, it means that, whatever God gives us in the way of talent or resources, we should use it wisely in His service.
Jesus was telling a story to illustrate a point, and the ruler in the story was the one who said that. It's not at all out of character for rulers in those days - or these, for that matter.
The parable is about judgment day. Reread the whole thing with that in mind and see if it makes sense to you.
The old it's a parable plea ::) keep cherry picking what you think should be taken literally and what we should just take as a parable either it's the inherent word of God or it's just a bunch of parables , philosophy and tales you can't have it both ways
people can ' interpret ' that to mean Jesus wants everyone who wont follow him to be killed that's the problem with these Holy books people can't bend them to fit their agendas
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That is not what Islam teaches.
Statistics prove that Muslim homes are not havens for domestic violence. Domestic violence is not more prominent in Islam, or any religion or race.
Islam has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world, would it not make sense that if so many women were being mistreated that Muslim marriages would have higher divorce rates?
"O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them happiness, that ye may take away part of the dower [i.e money given by the husband to the wife for the marriage contract] ye have given them, except where they have been guilty of open lewdness: on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brigns about through it a great deal of good" [The Quran, 4:19]
"If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them" [Quran, 4:124]
Narrated Mu'awiyah al-Qushayri: "I went to the Apostle of Allah and asked him: what do you say (command) about our wives? He replied: Give them food what you have for yourself, and clothe them by which you clothe yourself, AND DO NOT BEAT THEM" [Sunnah Abu Dawood, Book 11, Marriage, Number 2139]
"The 18-year-old, identified only as Bibi Aisha (Miss Aisha), told Time that her nose and ears were cut off by her abusive husband — with Taliban approval — to punish her for running away".
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Parable.......Completely out of context. Taking one line and using it to make a point is not good without context.
We will all be judged at the end, but He never tells us to go around killing everyone who doesn't believe as we do. Not even close. We all have plenty of opportunity to come to Him throughout our lifetimes. In the end, however, if you do not believe then you will be judged and held accountable.
Yes and you will burn in Hell for eternity if you don't follow him ::) real peace & love right there ::) so if he doesn't preach to kill non-believers in this life he'll get you in the afterlife
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Can't remember the last time I've seen a Christian strap on a bomb and kill innocent people.
Christians never killed innocent people? or just not recently? or you haven't seen much of it? how about Fundy Christians murdering abortion doctors?
there are many fundy christians in this country that would love to turn this country into a Christian Theocracy and start killing ALL non-Christians there just as deluded as the fundy Muslims
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Hi guy, i'm french, the muslim country, and barack "hussein" Obama fuck all the real american in the ass with the mosquee at ground zero, it's a real shame, i'm not american but i can fell the pain it create in heart of real american.
This decision astound me, i can't understand.
For all sissi "democrat" of getbig, islam is not a religion of piece, islam is not only a religion, it's a politico-religious thing, you can't comapre with catolisism.
The onlu goal of islam is domination at any cost, here in france pork meat is banned from all administration, school, everything is "hallal" now.
french traditionnal butcher selling pork are victim of agression and forced to close shop in muslim area, in the town where i work there is muslim library, muslim clothes shop sellin burka, muslim butcher etc etc, everything is muslim.EVERYTHING.
Islam control all the level of the life of people, there 's no politic in islamic country, the only political choice is islam, islam in all aspect of the life, watching tv, listenning radio, thinking about sex is blasphem because when you think about it you don"t think about allah.
Barak hussein is fooling you.
in one decision he make worst than all political french in 30 years.
PERIOD.
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That is not what Islam teaches.
Statistics prove that Muslim homes are not havens for domestic violence. Domestic violence is not more prominent in Islam, or any religion or race.
Islam has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world, would it not make sense that if so many women were being mistreated that Muslim marriages would have higher divorce rates?
"O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them happiness, that ye may take away part of the dower [i.e money given by the husband to the wife for the marriage contract] ye have given them, except where they have been guilty of open lewdness: on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and God brigns about through it a great deal of good" [The Quran, 4:19]
"If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them" [Quran, 4:124]
Narrated Mu'awiyah al-Qushayri: "I went to the Apostle of Allah and asked him: what do you say (command) about our wives? He replied: Give them food what you have for yourself, and clothe them by which you clothe yourself, AND DO NOT BEAT THEM" [Sunnah Abu Dawood, Book 11, Marriage, Number 2139]
i live in France, i know islam and muslim, stop telling lies muslim asshole.
stop your propagande.
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Really? Lets look at what Islam really has to say regarding the status of women...
In a truely Islamic society women have the following rights in Islam:
1. The right and duty to obtain education.
2. The right to have their own independent property.
3. The right to work to earn money if they need it or want it.
4. Equality of reward for equal deeds.
5. The right to express their opinion and be heard.
6. The right to provisions from the husband for all her needs and more.
7. The right to negotiate marriage terms of her choice.
8. The right to obtain divorce from her husband, even on the grounds that she simply can't stand him. (pls note that God deeply frowns upon divorce as a solution unless there is hardly any other alternative but it does not mean that men have more right to divorce their wives than women do.)
9. The right to keep all her own money (she is not responsible to maintain any relations).
10. The right to get sexual satisfaction from her husband.
11. custody of their children after divorce.
12. to refuse any marriage that does not please them
and more...
http://www.themodernreligion.com/women/w_rights_summary.htm
PROPAGANDE PROPAGANDE PROPAGANDE
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PROPAGANDE PROPAGANDE PROPAGANDE
As stated-----------"The 18-year-old, identified only as Bibi Aisha (Miss Aisha), told Time that her nose and ears were cut off by her abusive husband — with Taliban approval — to punish her for running away".
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The thing is there are BILLIONS of non-radical muslim families that practice a peaceful version of islam, that do no want to go kill eveyone in site, that are brought up with a sense of love, who treat women as equals who respect them etc etc, how come you guys are discounting them?
Whether they are practicing the true version of islam or a more lenient (say a modernized version of the religion), they are still there, and are peaceful loving people. Why are they being discounted in this discussion? I'm a bit confused, enlighten me getbig!
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The thing is there are BILLIONS of non-radical muslim families that practice a peaceful version of islam, that do no want to go kill eveyone in site, that are brought up with a sense of love, who treat women as equals who respect them etc etc, how come you guys are discounting them?
Whether they are practicing the true version of islam or a more lenient (say a modernized version of the religion), they are still there, and are peaceful loving people. Why are they being discounted in this discussion? I'm a bit confused, enlighten me getbig!
The problem is that these billions of cool muslim don't criticize the bad muslim.
Don't be stupid guy, if one day a religion war happen, cool muslim or bad muslim = muslim.
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the new yorkers are going to tear that place up. lol.
whats funny is that the head of a huge canadian muslim association has even spoke out publicly about it.
they feel it is insensitive to build a muslim community center/mosque so close to the location where "members of their own faith" (his words) killed so many innocent people.
and I think they are right.
I never thought I'd agree with Hulkser. :)
(P.S. Dorian is bettter)
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The problem is that these billions of cool muslim don't criticize the bad muslim.
You couldn't be more wrong in that statement. Believe me I've lived in a muslim country in the past, there are very harsh criticisizms. These muslim countries in themselves have been victims of fundamentalistic islamic attacks, bomb attacks, etc.... Egypt (a muslim country) has been battling fundementalistic islam far before the US ever considered it a problem.... And believe me there is a ZERO tolerance policy in regards to that, if the Egyptian government for a second believes you to be a religous radical your ass is going in a cell faster than you can blink!
Jon Cole, how many Muslims do you actually know, how many muslim countries have you actually visited? There are peaceful muslims out there and they do criticize the extremists, believe me I know MUSLIM friends who have lost family members as a result of radical islamic terrorist attacks, they have very harsh words for those "bad" muslims.
Look... I don't know if the the religion in itself is a peaceful one or not because
1. The scriptures are so obscure and has been interpreted in so many different ways some have said its not peaceful some have said it is.
2. I don't practice islam or any organized religion any more... and
3. I have my own questions about the religion... But with all that being said... PEACEFUL MUSLIMS DO EXIST and they exist in a large quantity, whether they are practicing the true form of islam or not, and yes I know the radicals are there too and also in large quantities, but many on here are looking at only the negative side and ignoring the positive....
And let me tell you something else... if Obama had banned the building of that mosque, then America would be no better than a country like Saudi Arabia which does strictly enforce islamic law nation wide!
Do you want to live in a nation where religion/places of worship is in the hand of the government? or do you want to live in the land of the free and the home of the brave?
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But their own religion teaches to use force against the infidels (non muslims). It also teaches death to anyone that isnt a muslim.
The Bible says to do good deeds and it says the evils you do in secret will be made evident one day but in the end God will be the judge but the Quran teaches that anyone could be put to death and each muslim has the right to put non muslims to death who dont believe what they believe...read the darn Quran..dont say it is a religion pof peace when it is Islamic law to put people death who arent muslims
The problem is that people take bits and pieces of verses and interpret them in a way that suits their own agenda. The overwhelming message of the Quran is that peace is to be found through submission, faith, and justice among fellow human beings. Terms like holy war and jihad get misinterpreted to mean something other than what the Quran teaches. The verses that do speak of violence are only justified in terms of self defense...The Quran tells Muslims to stick up for themselves in a defensive battle -- i.e. if an enemy army attacks, then Muslims are to fight against that army until they stop their aggression. All of the verses that speak about fighting/war in the Qur'an are in this context. There are some specific verses that are very often "snipped" out of context, either by critics of Islam discussing "jihadism," or by misguided Muslims themselves who wish to justify their aggressive tactics.
Example.....
One verse (in its snipped version) reads: "slay them
wherever you catch them" (Qur'an 2:191). But who is this referring to?
Who are "they" that this verse discusses? The preceding and following
verses give the correct context:
"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress
limits; for God loves not transgressors. And slay them wherever you
catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out; for
tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter... But if they cease, God
is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful... If they cease, let there be no
hostility except to those who practice oppression" (2:190-193).
It is clear from the context that these verses are discussing a
defensive war, when a Muslim community is attacked without reason,
oppressed and prevented from practicing their faith. In these
circumstances, permission is given to fight back -- but even then
Muslims are instructed not to transgress limits, and to cease fighting
as soon as the attacker gives up. Even in these circumstances, Muslim
are only to fight directly against those who are attacking them, not
innocent bystanders or non-combatants.
Nowhere in the Qur'an can be found support for indiscriminate slaughter, the killing of non-combatants, or murder of innocent persons in 'payback' for another people's alleged crimes.
The Islamic teachings on this subject can be summed up in the following
verses (Qur'an 60:7-8):
"It may be that God will grant love (and friendship) between you and
those whom ye (now) hold as enemies. For God has power (over all
things), and God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
God does not forbid you, with regard to those who fight you not for
(your) faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and
justly with them: for God loves those who are just"
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Let's be realistic here: any decision Obama would have made would have made him look unamerican. If he was against building the Mosque, then he is unamerican because he is denying people their rights (we all know America is about freedom and rights, blah, blah, blah). If he is in favor of building the mosque, that makes him unamerican because he will be labeled a traitor.
The guy can't win.
Losers can't win. Obama is a loser.. Come on 2012... Get this asshead out of office.
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I, as a patriotic american, am all in favor of building this mosque. I cant think of anything which more clearly illustrates why we are the most evolved nation on Earth.
Besides, its about time we got to blow up something of theirs.
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I support the killing of muslims.
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I, as a patriotic american, am all in favor of building this mosque. I cant think of anything which more clearly illustrates why we are the most evolved nation on Earth.
Besides, its about time we got to blow up something of theirs.
;D
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Obama must have run across Jimmy Carter's foreign policy notes hidden away in the Oval Office.
good position, Barry.......see ya in 2012.......