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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: spinnis on January 09, 2011, 11:04:47 AM
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so they basically told him "post a pic or gtfo"
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Owned into oblivion :D
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so he was seduced by the simple minds of a tribe, who like animals are too shallow to to see anything that is not right in front of their eyes. awesome. ::)
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so he was seduced by the simple minds of a tribe, who like animals are too shallow to to see anything that is not right in front of their eyes. awesome. ::)
I used to weave fair tale into reality to candidizzle. Its a hard reality to come to terms with. Many can't handle not knowing the answers.
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so he was seduced by the simple minds of a tribe, who like animals are too shallow to to see anything that is not right in front of their eyes. awesome. ::)
Or smart enough... :)
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give me one piece of logic that indicates God isnt necessary. :) (existence demands a creator)
cause-->effect
without a cause, there is no effect.
if something exists, it was caused.
8)
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I used to weave fair tale into reality to candidizzle. Its a hard reality to come to terms with. Many can't handle not knowing the answers.
no. a reality without god, although impossible, woudl be a much easier reality to live with. unless you are arrogant enough to think that God would allow you entrance into his kingdom.
my reality, the real reality, is one where space is vast, and so cold. where i will freeze in the dark night of nothingness for all of eternity. im not worthy of gods kingdom.
in an athiest reality, death is nice, peaceful, you feel no pain, no cold, no loneliness, no boredom.
life is hard, death is either easy or hard... in the case of the athiest death is easy, in the case of the theist death is hard.
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cause-->effect
without a cause, there is no effect.
if something exists, it was caused.
8)
No. Spontaneous (uncaused) existence happens in nature.
The end.
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No. Go back to school.
;D ok mr smarty pants... how about this
existence is infinitely complex. make sense of the fact that every bit of matter is infinitely divisible and that the bounds of space have absolutely no limit.
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No. Spontaneous (uncaused) existence happens in nature.
The end.
Where did nature come from?
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Where did nature come from?
there you go. finally using a little bit of logic coach. :) no matter what answers anyone ever gives you, keep up with that line of questioning. it reveals the truth.
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Tdizzle learned so much in that 6 months in community collage
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Where did nature come from?
Krishna did it, 6000 years ago ;D
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Logic, hahahaha thats right, God is logical lololol
Bwahahahaha religious nuts
:'(
my reality, the real reality, is one where space is vast, and so cold. where i will freeze in the dark night of nothingness for all of eternity. im not worthy of gods kingdom.
in an athiest reality, death is nice, peaceful. you feel no pain, no cold, no loneliness, no boredom.
life is hard. death is either easy or hard. in the case of the athiest death is easy, in the case of the theist death is hard.
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No. Spontaneous (uncaused) existence happens in nature.
The end.
???
I think this is yet to be proven. There is no empirical evidence for the above.
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I can always count on getbig to unlock the secrets of the universe.
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give me one piece of logic that indicates God isnt necessary. :) (existence demands a creator)
cause-->effect
without a cause, there is no effect.
if something exists, it was caused.
8)
The concept of infinity is hard to wrap out minds around. It has most likely always been here
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Where did nature come from?
where did god come from?
or is logical to say god always existed, yet somehow illogical to say nature always existed
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there you go. finally using a little bit of logic coach. :) no matter what answers anyone ever gives you, keep up with that line of questioning. it reveals the truth.
But because we don't know the answer to the question doesn't mean filling in God with the blank is the answer. There are alot of things we don't know. That's why we study them.
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where did god come from?
or is logical to say god always existed, yet somehow illogical to say nature always existed
;D spot on
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What the hell are you talking about "death life hard easy blablabla" lololol
(http://cache2.artprintimages.com/p/LRG/27/2755/BZ9TD00Z/art-print/albert-einstein-religion.jpg)
xerxez what is on the inside of an atom? what makes up the outer layer of the atom? what material is that? what is it made of? and what is the substance that the material that makes up the outer layer of an atom made of? how is it made, and what is IT made of? ;)
But because we don't know the answer to the question doesn't mean filling in God with the blank is the answer. There are alot of things we don't know. That's why we study them.
and you will keep on finding answers. on top of answers. on top of answers. one thing you can not deny is that you will never find THE ANSWER with science alone. ;)
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where did god come from?
or is logical to say god always existed, yet somehow illogical to say nature always existed
Maybe God didnt always exist. I actually think that he created himself. which implies that there was a period of non-existence, and then god created himself... got lonely, and created existence. :)
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If there was a god then Tbombz would actually look decent after juicing the last three years straight..
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IRRELEVANT
(http://www.defaithed.com/system/files/u1/motivator3917766.jpg)
its not irrelevant. dont group me into the people who dont accept the authority of modern science.
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give me one piece of logic that indicates God isnt necessary. :) (existence demands a creator)
(http://www.gifsoup.com/view2/1572351/you-can-t-handle-the-truth-o.gif)
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If there was a god then Tbombz would actually look decent after juicing the last three years straight..
Steriods , HGH, powerbars
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Maybe God didnt always exist. I actually think that he created himself. which implies that there was a period of non-existence, and then god created himself... got lonely, and created existence. :)
The point is infinity actually exists which means there will always be infinite wisdom to acquire. God doesn't solve any problem. Faith is taking accepting a belief as fact. How fucked up of a world would it be if i believed the world was going to end in 2012 and i was the president?
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Hahahaha God didn't exist in the period of non existence and then created himself, even though he didn't exist he still managed to create himself!! Hahahahahahaha
I think if he ever comes to our realization and comes back to read these posts he will be utterly humiliated
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Mind-blowing.
if existence is eternal, it would make since that somewhere along the line a race of beings would have evolved somewhere in the universe that would have had enough time and enough resources in order to develop the technology necessary in order to travel to distant parts of space, reach other planets, communicate with them, etc.
if existence is eternal, then there has already been an infinite amount of planets out there who have developed life as intelligent if not more intelligent than we are. odds are that if existence was eternal that we would already know about it.
:)
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if existence is eternal, it would make since that somewhere along the line a race of beings would have evolved somewhere in the universe that would have had enough time and enough resources in order to develop the technology necessary in order to travel to distant parts of space, reach other planets, communicate with them, etc.
if existence is eternal, then there has already been an infinite amount of planets out there who have developed life as intelligent if not more intelligent than we are. odds are that if existence was eternal that we would already know about it.
:)
Pure generation nothingness...No improvement over 6 years on massive amounts of steroids..
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if existence is eternal, it would make since that somewhere along the line a race of beings would have evolved somewhere in the universe that would have had enough time and enough resources in order to develop the technology necessary in order to travel to distant parts of space, reach other planets, communicate with them, etc.
if existence is eternal, then there has already been an infinite amount of planets out there who have developed life as intelligent if not more intelligent than we are. odds are that if existence was eternal that we would already know about it.
:)
We don't know that.... Our species has only been on this planet for a short time..
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(http://www.gifsoup.com/view2/1572351/you-can-t-handle-the-truth-o.gif)
right back at ya stud ;D
athiests are a bunch of clowns to scared to admit to themselves that all of their wrong doings have been witnessed by a higher power, to scared to realize that they face a terrible afterlife. they instead choose ignorance and a belief that death will be comfortable, no pain, no boredom, no loneliness.
who cant handle the truth? atheists cant handle the truth.
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We don't know that.... Our species has only been on this planet for a short time..
your helping prove my point. :) we have only existed for a short period of time here on earth. imagine if we were able to continue existing and progressing for the next million years. imagine if we could existence for another 100 million years. what would our capabilities be at that point? we can already travel through space and we are already sending out messages deep into all parts of space to see if there is life elsewhere.
if existence is eternal, then probability dictates that every possible possibility has already occured. :)
and that means life somewhere in the universe able to cdommunicate and travel to all other parts of the universe, set up shop on othe rplanets that are inhabitable, spread their seed throughout all of existence for eternity.
we would know if existence was eternal.
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right back at ya stud ;D
athiests are a bunch of clowns to scared to admit to themselves that all of their wrong doings have been witnessed by a higher power, to scared to realize that they face a terrible afterlife. they instead choose ignorance and a belief that death will be comfortable, no pain, no boredom, no loneliness.
who cant handle the truth? atheists cant handle the truth.
You are assuming atheists are bad people why? My ex boss was a christian that was addicted to coke, divorced his wife, sleeping with his bosses wife and joking about murdering him. He once created an AFF account where he slept with numerous women taking naked pictures of the mall and showing them to coworkers. He stole money from the company. When he got fired he then threatend to sue my boss for firing him and not his wife (they weren't married) for discrimination. He recently died from and drug OD. Yet i guarantee you he was in church every sunday. This story is common for many religious people i know. If these are the kind of people who are going to heaven then id rather rott in hell with my family and loved ones. Watch this cartoon...
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i never said atheists are bad people. i said they are clowns who dont want to accept the fact that all of their wrong doings have been witnessed by a higher power.
i never said people who accepted the existence of god were good people either.
this discussion is about the logical necessity for god. not whether a belief in god will save you.
i already said that i am not fit for gods kingdom
the fact of the matter is that everyone does wrong, atheists and believers alike.
is it possible for an atheists to get into gods kingdom? absolutely. at least i think so. i dont see any reason why they couldnt. i do realize that alot of people are afraid of dying, wish there was a god, but just dont see enough proof in front of their eyes. these people, if they lead a good life, will still have proved themslevs to god.
does believing in god make a serial killer worthy of gods kingdom? no.
whether or not you gain entrance is base upon how you lived your life, not what you believed in.
that being said, what good is a belief in god anyways? well, if you can understand the logical nessissity of him, then it can scare you into acting right. otherwise, you live in ignorance, pretending life after death will be comfortbale... when you should realise that if you dont live a good life it will be very uncomfortbale.
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i never said atheists are bad people. i said they are clowns who dont want to accept the fact that all of their wrong doings have been witnessed by a higher power.
i never said people who accepted the existence of god were good people either.
this discussion is about the logical necessity for god. not whether a belief in god will save you.
i already said that i am not fit for gods kingdom
the fact of the matter is that everyone does wrong, atheists and believers alike.
is it possible for an atheists to get into gods kingdom? absolutely. at least i think so. i dont see any reason why they couldnt. i do realize that alot of people are afraid of dying, wish there was a god, but just dont see enough proof in front of their eyes. these people, if they lead a good life, will still have proved themslevs to god.
does believing in god make a serial killer worthy of gods kingdom? no.
whether or not you gain entrance is base upon how you lived your life, not what you believed in.
that being said, what good is a belief in god anyways? well, if you can understand the logical nessissity of him, then it can scare you into acting right. otherwise, you live in ignorance, pretending life after death will be comfortbale... when you should realise that if you dont live a good life it will be very uncomfortbale.
I don't need fear to act moral. I don't derive my morals from god. People in general don't derive their morals from god. Fact
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i never said atheists are bad people. i said they are clowns who dont want to accept the fact that all of their wrong doings have been witnessed by a higher power.
i never said people who accepted the existence of god were good people either.
this discussion is about the logical necessity for god. not whether a belief in god will save you.
i already said that i am not fit for gods kingdom
the fact of the matter is that everyone does wrong, atheists and believers alike.
is it possible for an atheists to get into gods kingdom? absolutely. at least i think so. i dont see any reason why they couldnt. i do realize that alot of people are afraid of dying, wish there was a god, but just dont see enough proof in front of their eyes. these people, if they lead a good life, will still have proved themslevs to god.
does believing in god make a serial killer worthy of gods kingdom? no.
whether or not you gain entrance is base upon how you lived your life, not what you believed in.
that being said, what good is a belief in god anyways? well, if you can understand the logical nessissity of him, then it can scare you into acting right. otherwise, you live in ignorance, pretending life after death will be comfortbale... when you should realise that if you dont live a good life it will be very uncomfortbale.
just curious, are you christian or what? or are these your own personal convictions?
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just curious, are you christian or what? or are these your own personal convictions?
Obviously his own because a denier of god (atheist) cannot go to heaven.
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Obviously his own because a denier of god (atheist) cannot go to heaven.
well that would be the traditional christian belief. I'm not sure if every christian believes that way.
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He made up his own prophecy of how god came to be in this thread, listen to tbombz the prophet and he will save your godforsaken soul!!
No dongz but tdongz!
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well that would be the traditional christian belief. I'm not sure if every christian believes that way.
They do but they don't. That is the paradox of christianity. You can thank Martin Luther for that and King Henry. You don't like what the church says? Break off and start your own denomination. We have lesbians and gays getting married when the bible prohibits it. That's why i don't like chrisitianity. They always try to adapt. Atleast with the catholics they try to stay firm and see the hypocrisy in their own religion which is why i believe many atheists come out of Catholicism.
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listen assholes ;D im just trying to shed some light upon your dark philosophies. the fact of the matter is that there will never be a scientific explanation for existence. that is the ONLY fact that can not be doubted. every other fact, besides facts that are circular or self-referencing, are open to doubt. neither induction or deduction are valid forms for finding certainty. (cant based the future off the past, and youll never have a sufficient sample pool. ) and you criticise god because arguments for him tend to be circular? the only thing you can trust is circular.
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listen assholes ;D im just trying to shed some light upon your dark philosophies. the fact of the matter is that there will never be a scientific explanation for existence. that is the ONLY fact that can not be doubted. every other fact, besides facts that are circular or self-referencing, are open to doubt. neither induction or deduction are valid forms for finding certainty. (cant based the future off the past, and youll never have a sufficient sample pool. ) and you criticise god because arguments for him tend to be circular? the only thing you can trust is circular.
Like when you let other men shed light in your rectum?
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I don't need fear to act moral. I don't derive my morals from god. People in general don't derive their morals from god. Fact
who is this "god" that you speak of? i thought you said no such being existed? ;D
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listen assholes ;D im just trying to shed some light upon your dark philosophies. the fact of the matter is that there will never be a scientific explanation for existence. that is the ONLY fact that can not be doubted. every other fact, besides facts that are circular or self-referencing, are open to doubt. neither induction or deduction are valid forms for finding certainty. (cant based the future off the past, and youll never have a sufficient sample pool. ) and you criticise god because arguments for him tend to be circular? the only thing you can trust is circular.
You are giving an over simplification of the universe that fits your mind. A simplification that is horrifically incorrect. Why one god? Why not 10? Why not Zeus and Hera? Why is the bible so strong with you? Saying there will never be an answer is not an answer either. We can accumulate a better understanding of nature. We once though the earth was flat. Who would dare go sail off that map? We cannot disprove Santa Clause. Why do we choose not to believe in him. What about a talking tea pot orbiting between mars and earth? I can't disprove that.
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They do but they don't. That is the paradox of christianity. You can thank Martin Luther for that and King Henry. You don't like what the church says? Break off and start your own denomination. We have lesbians and gays getting married when the bible prohibits it. That's why i don't like chrisitianity. They always try to adapt. Atleast with the catholics they try to stay firm and see the hypocrisy in their own religion which is why i believe many atheists come out of Catholicism.
Unlike what is thought there was no established christian religion to begin with... a unified chrisitanity wasn't established until hundreds of years after jesus. So its hard to say what true christianity really is.
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who is this "god" that you speak of? i thought you said no such being existed? ;D
Again another christian argument. Because i use the word god in a sentence does not mean i believe in a ubiquitous deity. I remember say jesus christ once so my coworker assumed that meant i believed ::). Some people do not understand the concept of a phrase of speech.
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Saying there will never be an answer is not an answer either. We can accumulate a better understanding of nature. We once though the earth was flat.
your flip flopping. can we find the answer, or can we not. 8)
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Again another christian argument. Because i use the word god in a sentence does not mean i believe in a ubiquitous deity. I remember say jesus christ once so my coworker assumed that meant i believed ::). Some people do not understand the concept of a phrase of speech.
i was just giving you a hard time. :)
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that being said, what good is a belief in god anyways? well, if you can understand the logical nessissity of him, then it can scare you into acting right. otherwise, you live in ignorance, pretending life after death will be comfortbale... when you should realise that if you dont live a good life it will be very uncomfortbale.
Im not sure you grasp the concept of Atheism. There is no pretending, there is no "uncomfortable" afterlife. There is alive...and DEAD. Period. No cloud floating with angels, nor brimstone and hellfire. Just worm dirt. There is no heaven, no hell, no limbo, no God, no devil.
But you did bring up a valid point unknowingly. Religion is based in fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of reprisal, fear into "morality".
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Unlike what is thought there was no established christian religion to begin with... a unified chrisitanity wasn't established until hundreds of years after jesus. So its hard to say what true christianity really is.
I'm an atheist. And you are...?
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listen assholes ;D im just trying to shed some light upon your dark philosophies. the fact of the matter is that there will never be a scientific explanation for existence. that is the ONLY fact that can not be doubted. every other fact, besides facts that are circular or self-referencing, are open to doubt. neither induction or deduction are valid forms for finding certainty. (cant based the future off the past, and youll never have a sufficient sample pool. ) and you criticise god because arguments for him tend to be circular? the only thing you can trust is circular.
well from your line of reasoning it seems to be that you cannot prove/disprove god with certainty because you are limited by induction/deduction.
I've never taken a philosophy course, so I'm assuming your line of reasoning with its jargon to argue the above.
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best part about "Christians" is they would be the first to label Jesus as a fucking weirdo....
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Im not sure you grasp the concept of Atheism. There is no pretending, there is no "uncomfortable" afterlife. There is alive...and DEAD. Period. No cloud floating with angels, nor brimstone and hellfire. Just worm dirt. There is no heaven, no hell, no limbo, no God, no devil.
But you did bring up a valid point unknowingly. Religion is based in fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of reprisal, fear into "morality".
absolutely. for an atheists there is no pain, no cold, no loneliness in death. sounds pretty nice to me :)
Ignorance is bliss.
yes, for the atheist it truly is.
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well from your line of reasoning it seems to be that you cannot prove/disprove god with certainty because you are limited by induction/deduction.
I've never taken a philosophy course, so I'm assuming your line of reasoning with its jargon to argue the above.
:)
"inference to best explanation" ---> "abductive reasoning"
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absolutely. for an atheists there is no pain, no cold, no loneliness in death. sounds pretty nice to me :)
yes, for the atheist it truly is.
ummm, there is no difference in death between a believer in God and an athiest. I think you have it backwards. If anything, death for an atheist would be worse because of the realization that once you are dead....thats it. That is a reality check. If you are a believer, you get to go to heaven...isnt that one of the reasons why you believe? to go to heaven when you die?
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Im not sure you grasp the concept of Atheism. There is no pretending, there is no "uncomfortable" afterlife. There is alive...and DEAD. Period. No cloud floating with angels, nor brimstone and hellfire. Just worm dirt. There is no heaven, no hell, no limbo, no God, no devil.
But you did bring up a valid point unknowingly. Religion is based in fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of reprisal, fear into "morality".
Actually, there is some thought given to what happens when we are dead. I'm an atheist and find it at times quite disconcerting to realize that when I'm dead, that's it. Nothing. The hope that Christians have doesn't belong to me and in a way I envy them that. As for fear, yup. Fear has a lot to do with religion but nothing to do with faith. I choose not to believe in a God, god or gods. I choose to not believe and refuse to belittle those that have a genuine faith in Jesus that they not only profess but live.
Believe me, there are plenty of fake Christians that are assholes, but there's more than enough atheists that are fucktards as well. The former are liars and the latter are just being, well, fucktards. I haven't a clue as to what tbombz really believes but can guarantee its not in the Christ because if you're a man and suck the dick, you lose the kingdom. And that is the word of Sam Kinison.
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He made up his own prophecy of how god came to be in this thread, listen to tbombz the prophet and he will save your godforsaken soul!!
Tbombz is just the know-it-all prophet of the God known as Google. Bow down before its algorithmic power!
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We are all born atheists .
I hope this helps.
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give me one piece of logic that indicates God isnt necessary. :) (existence demands a creator)
cause-->effect
without a cause, there is no effect.
if something exists, it was caused.
8)
I wonder who or what created God?
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ummm, there is no difference in death between a believer in God and an athiest. I think you have it backwards. If anything, death for an atheist would be worse because of the realization that once you are dead....thats it. That is a reality check. If you are a believer, you get to go to heaven...isnt that one of the reasons why you believe? to go to heaven when you die?
nah, at this point in my life i feel like death for me will be cold, lonely, empty, and horrible. i believe simply because i see the logical nessecity for god. and also because i witness his magnificence on a daily basis.
btw there hasnt been one decent argument against god in this whole threade. please someone come up with some decent logical arguments. i like discussing this but yall just suck. you even put much thought into your beliefs? wait, you dont have a belief, yall have lack of belief. and that requires no thought at all. LOL ;D
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We are all born atheists .
I hope this helps.
well we are all born unable to feed ourselves as well. :)
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well we are all born unable to feed ourselves as well. :)
OK ???
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OK ???
we are also born unable to talk. unable to walk.
if we are born without knowledge of god, but we come to learn of him. does this mean he is not real? if we are born without knowledge of how to eat, does this mean that the ability to eat is not necessary for our survival? ;)
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nah, at this point in my life i feel like death for me will be cold, lonely, empty, and horrible. i believe simply because i see the logical nessecity for god. and also because i witness his magnificence on a daily basis.
btw there hasnt been one decent argument against god in this whole threade. please someone come up with some decent logical arguments. i like discussing this but yall just suck. you even put much thought into your beliefs? wait, you dont have a belief, yall have lack of belief. and that requires no thought at all. LOL ;D
I will not make fun of a person's genuine faith in Jesus. Neither will I argue against such faith, what I do is simply state what I hold to be true and allow comparison between opposing lines of thought. You and I disagree on somethings, but I am curious as to what it is you have chosen to believe in with regard to religion or better, faith?
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:)
"inference to best explanation" ---> "abductive reasoning"
same argument was used to deny evolution where there wasnt enough information to say where the complexity in life came from. The best possible explanation can only be as good as the available information.
We really could go into more detail about this, but I dont really have the time (and to an extent the interest) to do a more thorough discussion. My apologies.
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I will not make fun of a person's genuine faith in Jesus. Neither will I argue against such faith, what I do is simply state what I hold to be true and allow comparison between opposing lines of thought. You and I disagree on somethings, but I am curious as to what it is you have chosen to believe in with regard to religion or better, faith?
if you think that homoseuxality is morally wrong, then you are way too far behind for me to talk about such subjects with you. you still need to learn basic logic.
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Unlike what is thought there was no established christian religion to begin with... a unified chrisitanity wasn't established until hundreds of years after jesus. So its hard to say what true christianity really is.
Since you must have missed it, again. I am atheist and your beliefs or lack thereof are...?
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Since you must have missed it, again. I am atheist and your beliefs or lack thereof are...?
Sorry. thought we went over this before, I'm Muslim.
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haha basic logic haha....logic has no place in your religious dogma...
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same argument was used to deny evolution where there wasnt enough information to say where the complexity in life came from. The best possible explanation can only be as good as the available information.
We really could go into more detail about this, but I dont really have the time (and to an extent the interest) to do a more thorough discussion. My apologies.
i think you misunderstood me. but we seem to be on the same page, just different sides of it. (were both believers, your just a bit more skeptical of our ability to draw certain conclusions). its all good bruddah
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if you think that homoseuxality is morally wrong, then you are way too far behind for me to talk about such subjects with you. you still need to learn basic logic.
Ok. By omission you are not Christian or Hebrew. New Age hocus pocus, or what? By the way, I find homosexuality, either male or female, to be both disgusting and illogical. Your words read as though you desire to rationalize homosexuality. Every major "religion", even that espoused by the Dali Lama himself, finds homosexuality to be wrong and/or undesirable. Don't like it? Get used to disappointment.
And if you can't talk about such subjects with me it is only because you will not like the answer(s) I may or may not provide. Simple really.
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Sorry. thought we went over this before, I'm Muslim.
What are your thoughts on violence against People of the Book, even when espoused by an imam?
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xerxez what is on the inside of an atom? what makes up the outer layer of the atom? what material is that? what is it made of? and what is the substance that the material that makes up the outer layer of an atom made of? how is it made, and what is IT made of? ;)
God of gaps. Try harder.
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Ok. By omission you are not Christian or Hebrew. New Age hocus pocus, or what? By the way, I find homosexuality, either male or female, to be both disgusting and illogical. Your words read as though you desire to rationalize homosexuality. Every major "religion", even that espoused by the Dali Lama himself, finds homosexuality to be wrong and/or undesirable. Don't like it? Get used to disappointment.
And if you can't talk about such subjects with me it is only because you will not like the answer(s) I may or may not provide. Simple really.
my religion is logic, and logic indicates to me that god is necessary. logic also indicates to me that there can be no wrong in a behavior that does not cause anyone or anything harm. morality is defined by helping and hurting others. if no one is hurt, then there is no wrongdoing.
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God of gaps. Try harder.
LOL nope, i was alluding to the fact that matter is infinitely divisible.
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my religion is logic, and logic indicates to me that god is necessary. logic also indicates to me that there can be no wrong in a behavior that does not cause anyone or anything harm. morality is defined by helping and hurting others. if no one is hurt, then there is no wrongdoing.
TBombz , It is you who hasn't made any logical argument for any statement you have made.
Hahha Oh brother
''Maybe God didnt always exist. I actually think that he created himself. which implies that there was a period of non-existence, and then god created himself... got lonely, and created existence''
TBombz
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Easily qoute of the year, almost new thread worthy!! ;D
;D
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boom
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Tbombz, I'm guessing you just took your first philosophy class at that community college you're attending.
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my religion is logic, and logic indicates to me that god is necessary. logic also indicates to me that there can be no wrong in a behavior that does not cause anyone or anything harm. morality is defined by helping and hurting others. if no one is hurt, then there is no wrongdoing.
So, if you run a red light, even when there is no valid, (e.g. an emergency) need and no one sees you do it, it's not against the law? A very simple analogy, but one that is definitely applicable in this case. What I see is that you desire to do that which you desire. You are uncomfortable with the idea of a divine judgement, so you substitute "logic" for "God" because logic is more palatable, i.e., nonjudgmental. I submit that you have zero faith in "God" or even as you profess above, "logic" and in typical human fashion have substituted your own desires. There are plenty of people that do so, but that doesn't make it any less disgusting with regard to, shall we say, certain practices.
As Cartman would say, "Science be praised!"
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Tbombz, I'm guessing you just took your first philosophy class at that community college you're attending.
That's what i was guessing...
The kid tries so hard.. ;D
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You blind religious nuts hahaha
Let me save you the trouble of typing. Just copy & paste after each atheist post
" Since I dont know the answer...It must be god's creation"
I'm a catholic atheist.
Take a step back & take a look at religion critically over a period of time. Oh wait, religious nuts can't handle that concept.
Just because science does not have an answer to a particular concept or question ...it does not mean it fails, it means that not enough data is known about the subject. ...it does not mean that science is a crock and therefore it proves God's existence.
I wish people looked at all religions and saw the bullshit and hypocrisy on each one.
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give me one piece of logic that indicates God isnt necessary. (existence demands a creator)
cause-->effect
without a cause, there is no effect.
if something exists, it was caused.
objection 1: some effects do not require a cause. Quantum mechanics tells us that particles at the sub-atomic level behave without causation. You claim something must be responsible. However, no evidence for sub-quantum forces has ever been found. The forces ARE the result of quantum particles (e.g. strong forces are caused by gluons, not vice versa).
objection 2a: if everything that happens must have a cause, then each cause must have an earlier cause and so on. This means the chain of causes of your future actions extend backwards to before you were born. In essence, your whole life is predetermined and free will doesn't exist. If you object that any of these causes is an isolated event, then you are implying an uncaused cause which violates the "law of cause and effect."
objection 2b: if everything that happens must have a cause, then each cause must have an earlier cause and so on. This chain of causes may be traced back to the first cause. A familiar paradox arises - what caused the first cause? According to the "law of cause and effect," every cause must be caused by something else. If we assume there is an uncaused cause, then its premise is violated and the whole argument fails.
objection 3: the "law of cause and effect" postulates that a specific cause always leads to a specific effect (i.e. there may be some attribute X which always leads to some attribute Y). However, we have never observed two instances of X which led to two instances of Y. Every X is different in some respect from every other X. Likewise, every Y is different from every other Y. If you object that we may infer the same outcome when each X is exactly the same, then you are creating a definition for cause and effect that cannot be falsified. Since all you would have to do whenever someone challenges you is propose additional 'unknown' causes, this is not really a valid argument. It would be like me claiming "the universe was created by a giant shit I took that traveled back in time. We just don't understand all the factors that were involved" no matter how many objections are raised. Although this argument can never be falsified, it doesn't necessarily follow that it's true.
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where did god come from?
or is logical to say god always existed, yet somehow illogical to say nature always existed
That's basically the difference between Christians and atheists. Apparently, BOTH believe in an ever-existing entity. The former believes that entity to be a sentient being; the latter believes it's non-sentient matter.
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You blind religious nuts hahaha
Let me save you the trouble of typing. Just copy & paste after each atheist post
" Since I dont know the answer...It must be god's creation"
I'm a catholic atheist.
Take a step back & take a look at religion critically over a period of time. Oh wait, religious nuts can't handle that concept.
Just because science does not have an answer to a particular concept or question ...it does not mean it fails, it means that not enough data is known about the subject. ...it does not mean that science is a crock and therefore it proves God's existence.
I wish people looked at all religions and saw the bullshit and hypocrisy on each one.
Does that include the religion of humanism/atheism, or simply man worshipping HIMSELF?
Heck, they're even coming up with (what I like to call) "un-churches"....that is, humanist centers where people go on Sundays, as a counterpart to Christians going to church.
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That's basically the difference between Christians and atheists. Apparently, BOTH believe in an ever-existing entity. The former believes that entity to be a sentient being; the latter believes it's non-sentient matter.
Wrong.
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I was going to join this debate but then I realized that there's no point. It's a never ending argument that leads nowhere. I'm just really glad this religious crap very rarely haunts me in real life.
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I was going to join this debate but then I realized that there's no point. It's a never ending argument that leads nowhere. I'm just really glad this religious crap very rarely haunts me in real life.
Yup. Thats what RELIGION is, Religion is without a doubt the most CONTROVERSIAL Topic there is.
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Yup. Thats what RELIGION is, Religion is without a doubt the most CONTROVERSIAL Topic there is.
After "who is better: ronnie or dorian"
Men in thongs = serious bussiness :-X
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objection 1: some effects do not require a cause. Quantum mechanics tells us that particles at the sub-atomic level behave without causation. You claim something must be responsible. However, no evidence for sub-quantum forces has ever been found. The forces ARE the result of quantum particles (e.g. strong forces are caused by gluons, not vice versa).
objection 2a: if everything that happens must have a cause, then each cause must have an earlier cause and so on. This means the chain of causes of your future actions extend backwards to before you were born. In essence, your whole life is predetermined and free will doesn't exist. If you object that any of these causes is an isolated event, then you are implying an uncaused cause which violates the "law of cause and effect."
objection 2b: if everything that happens must have a cause, then each cause must have an earlier cause and so on. This chain of causes may be traced back to the first cause. A familiar paradox arises - what caused the first cause? According to the "law of cause and effect," every cause must be caused by something else. If we assume there is an uncaused cause, then its premise is violated and the whole argument fails.
objection 3: the "law of cause and effect" postulates that a specific cause always leads to a specific effect (i.e. there may be some attribute X which always leads to some attribute Y). However, we have never observed two instances of X which led to two instances of Y. Every X is different in some respect from every other X. Likewise, every Y is different from every other Y. If you object that we may infer the same outcome when each X is exactly the same, then you are creating a definition for cause and effect that cannot be falsified. Since all you would have to do whenever someone challenges you is propose additional 'unknown' causes, this is not really a valid argument. It would be like me claiming "the universe was created by a giant shit I took that traveled back in time. We just don't understand all the factors that were involved" no matter how many objections are raised. Although this argument can never be falsified, it doesn't necessarily follow that it's true.
thats a very good post. your very informed :)
the law of cause and effect is very real, even if not so at the "sub-atomic" level. but i would say that just because theres no evidence for "sub-quantum" forces, doesnt mean there isnt. the term "sub quantum" is a bit of a misnomer, in fact labeling anything as "quantum" is outright idiotic :) what do scientists think a photon is made of? what is on the inside of it? what is on the inside of that? ;) me thinks science will one day find the cause for these "uncaused" happenings.. and then say that they found the truly uncaused prime material.. and then go on to found out again that they were wrong and that was caused too.. and so on and so on. in fact basic logic would dictate that would be the case.
no such thing as free will? free will is very real, and one of the best evidences for God's existence.
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thats a very good post. your very informed :)
the law of cause and effect is very real, even if not so at the "sub-atomic" level. but i would say that just because theres no evidence for "sub-quantum" forces, doesnt mean there isnt. the term "sub quantum" is a bit of a misnomer, in fact labeling anything as "quantum" is outright idiotic :) what do scientists think a photon is made of? what is on the inside of it? what is on the inside of that? ;) me thinks science will one day find the cause for these "uncaused" happenings.. and then say that they found the truly uncaused prime material.. and then go on to found out again that they were wrong and that was caused too.. and so on and so on. in fact basic logic would dictate that would be the case.
no such thing as free will? free will is very real, and one of the best evidences for God's existence.
You obviously didn't read point 2a.
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You blind religious nuts hahaha
Let me save you the trouble of typing. Just copy & paste after each atheist post
" Since I dont know the answer...It must be god's creation"
I'm a catholic atheist.
Take a step back & take a look at religion critically over a period of time. Oh wait, religious nuts can't handle that concept.
Just because science does not have an answer to a particular concept or question ...it does not mean it fails, it means that not enough data is known about the subject. ...it does not mean that science is a crock and therefore it proves God's existence.
I wish people looked at all religions and saw the bullshit and hypocrisy on each one.
pluck, can you post some details on the turning point(s) from being a Catholic to being an atheist?
Also, what type of science other than macroevoltion do you feel is at odds with the bible?
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so he was seduced by the simple minds of a tribe, who like animals are too shallow to to see anything that is not right in front of their eyes. awesome. ::)
a word change or two would describe people that believe in religion
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a word change or two would describe people that believe in religion
Which words?
And are you including Christianity when you talk about "religion?"