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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: madmullah on December 24, 2005, 07:08:45 PM
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i personally never get tired of looking at arnold's physique ,i believe there has never been or will be a more pleasing physique to look at.today's bodybuilders are not pleasing to look at.who,s physique do you most admire.
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i personally never get tired of looking at arnold's physique ,i believe there has never been or will be a more pleasing physique to look at.today's bodybuilders are not pleasing to look at.
Exactly, Bodybuilding is basically a male beauty contest. So why should a huge blocky or big gutted guy win just because his back or any other body part is just huge ??? I think the pleasing physiques should be rewarded but not overshadow the main BB standards.
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lack of beauty in the physique is what is killing this great sport.
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when the judges got corrupt, it got corrupt
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when i think of ugly i think art atwood, how could he ever win a show ???
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when i think of ugly i think art atwood, how could he ever win a show ???
yeah lol i called him pinhead 6 years ago and we all yucked it up
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in the ugly department greg kovacs in contest shape is hard to beat
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If a magic genie was to grant me any physique....
Arnold 74' era upper body down to the waist....Dorian from the thighs down to the calves.
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in the ugly department greg kovacs in contest shape is hard to beat
Well when it comes to 3 tier BB's they are almost all ugly, but art atwood has actually won a show and that is just hard to believe considering that he has a very ugly physique that looks like a really big king kamali.
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If a magic genie was to grant me any physique....
Arnold 74' era upper body down to the waist....Dorian from the thighs down to the calves.
I'd take vintage Sergio physique over anyone.
EVER.
DIV
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I'd take vintage Sergio physique over anyone.
EVER.
DIV
Does that have anything to do with the fact that he had a great overall package that is both large and pleasing with a wispy waist?
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Does that have anything to do with the fact that he had a great overall package that is both large and pleasing with a wispy waist?
Best combination of size and aesthetics.....
Look at Sergio, then look at Arnold, then look at Sergio again......
I don't understand what people who back Arnold are seeing.....
DIV
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sergio lost out in the cuts department,but had better legs.check out arnold at his best in 74,unbeatable.
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I'd take vintage Sergio physique over anyone.
EVER.
DIV
No way
Arnold had a better chest, back, & biceps peak.
I'll take sergios waist & maybe thighs....but they are not much different than arnolds.
Calves...I'll still go with Arnold. I like the shape better....although I think Sergios were thicker.
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it is a very close call between arnold and sergio just comparing raw physique,iam talking about the beauty of arnold's physique,sergio does not come close.
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it is a very close call between arnold and sergio just comparing raw physique,iam talking about the beauty of arnold's physique,sergio does not come close.
I would have to say that is mostly because arnold was a great poser and knew how to hit every shot to his advantage.
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it is very important when we have view on a bodybuilder' physique that we do not bring their personality into it.sergio is a wonderful person,arnold is not so wonderful,but give respect to their physiques separately.
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it is a very close call between arnold and sergio just comparing raw physique,iam talking about the beauty of arnold's physique,sergio does not come close.
Well, I don't judge the "beauty" of another man's physique. I'm saying if I would choose one to have, it'd be Sergio.
It's all perception......
DIV
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it is very important when we have view on a bodybuilder' physique that we do not bring their personality into it.sergio is a wonderful person,arnold is not so wonderful,but give respect to their physiques separately.
whats wrong with Arnolds personality?
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whats wrong with Arnolds personality?
Very true...it's his personality thats got him to where's he at.
He's a little sketchy at times...but his personality is very a strong/
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i agree that oliva was genetically the greatest bber ever...no one has had his combo of size, shape, structure, completeness...however i would probably take arnold's physique because he is taller and was damn near perfect himself
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arnold didnot respect many of his fellow bodybuilders.he used foul language against them.search around and you will see what i mean.
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i agree that oliva was genetically the greatest bber ever...no one has had his combo of size, shape, structure, completeness...however i would probably take arnold's physique because he is taller and was damn near perfect himself
Exactly......I wouldn't want to be that tall.
There's not a whole lot of difference between them, like checks and balances.
Regardless of which one you like it's not like either is miles ahead of the other in any way.
DIV
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The "Golden 3" in the shape they were in.... in order....
1) Arnold '74 Olympia
2) Sergio Oliva '72 Olympia (should've beaten Arnold)
3) Flex Wheeler '93 Arnold Classic
'nuff said ;D
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slick vic,i agree with you.
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It's a tossup, more a matter of personal taste.
Problem is there are very few shots in circulation of Sergio in his best shape in '72, so Arnold has a huge edge in perception given the number of widely available pics of him. Big advantage.
IMO Sergio in '72 was Arnold's motivation or fear for getting in his best shape in '73-'74. He expected Sergio to compete those years, particularly following the Mr. International situation.
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Another thing that gave Arnold a different look than alot of the current pro's is his height. Arnold is 6'2".
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Most pleasing..a statue.
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The "Golden 3" in the shape they were in.... in order....
1) Arnold '74 Olympia
2) Sergio Oliva '72 Olympia (should've beaten Arnold)
3) Flex Wheeler '93 Arnold Classic
'nuff said ;D
ronnie at his pre-gut best belongs in the top few as well. He would rank much much higher than that overrated Dorian yates. :)
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sorry no disrespect but he had poor legs
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(http://digilander.libero.it/sergenubret/nub34.jpg)
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He would rank much much higher than that overrated Dorian yates. :)
Totally with ya on that one.
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ronnie at his pre-gut best belongs in the top few as well. He would rank much much higher than that overrated Dorian yates. :)
His calves were even worse then
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The "Golden 3" in the shape they were in.... in order....
1) Arnold '74 Olympia
2) Sergio Oliva '72 Olympia (should've beaten Arnold)
3) Flex Wheeler '93 Arnold Classic
'nuff said ;D
not bad, not bad at all.
By the way, as far as upper body only shot goes, the front double biceps shot that Gustavo has is much more pleasing than Jays or Ronnies. Check out the pics !!!
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mohammed makkawy was almost perfection
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Sergio's best shape was equivalent to Arnold, it's just a matter of preference.
Sergio's best '72 shape wasn't the day of the Olympia.
Arnold's '73 shape was equal to '74.
Nubret takes most pleasing-i didn't say his legs balanced perfectly, though they were solid.
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not bad, not bad at all.
By the way, as far as upper body only shot goes, the front double biceps shot that Gustavo has is much more pleasing than Jays or Ronnies. Check out the pics !!!
Especially when you dont look at the biceps :)
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there are thousands of bbs with great upper bodies but the most important thing is the complete package
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art artwood is huge
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huge and ugly
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Sergio's best shape was equivalent to Arnold, it's just a matter of preference.
Sergio's '72 peak wasn't the day of the Olympia.
Arnold's '73 shape was equal to '74.
Sergio's shape was a match to Arnie-matter of preference-but Arie's conditioning was light years ahead of Sergio's..........
If Sergio could hang with a diet for a month or two it might have been a different story at the 72 O.
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i personally never get tired of looking at arnold's physique ,i believe there has never been or will be a more pleasing physique to look at.today's bodybuilders are not pleasing to look at.who,s physique do you most admire.
http://ironage.us/yabbse/
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Arnold and Sergio were BOTH magnificent. No need to put one down simply to praise the other.
How strange that possiby the best two bodybuilders ever competed in the same era.
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debatable...
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Arnold and Sergio were BOTH magnificent. No need to put one down simply to praise the other.
How strange that possiby the best two bodybuilders ever competed in the same era.
Picture of Arnold is it photoshopped? He's big :o
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he's even bigger pumped up
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It all depends on what you like.
Sergio looks more like a freak. But i feel his huge arms overpower the rest of his body.
Arnold's physique looks more pleasing to me, and more balanced. He's taller too, so i'd pick him.
His only "weakness" were his lower abs.
Perhaps Olivia had more potential, but from what i've seen its Arnold. Todays bbers quads overpower everything else if you ask me.
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By the way, as far as upper body only shot goes, the front double biceps shot that Gustavo has is much more pleasing than Jays or Ronnies.
I know. I was surprised! Gustavo is ranking up there.... quick!
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I'd take vintage Sergio physique over anyone.
EVER.
DIV
The Myth is the greatest bodybuilder ever. End of story.
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72 was an awesome years for body building and sports cars
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it is very important when we have view on a bodybuilder' physique that we do not bring their personality into it.sergio is a wonderful person,arnold is not so wonderful,but give respect to their physiques separately.
Madmullah, didn't Sergio's wife shoot him after taking years of his abuse? I am pretty sure its true. That wouldn't make him a "wonderful person".
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Sergio looks unpolished next to Arnold. On their best days Arnold is better due to his superior conditioning, skin tone and presentation. Muscle wise Sergio has a very slight edge that Arnie more than makes up for with the previously mentioned attributes. Sergio was a dope, and it showed on contest day. He would go onstage completely unprepared compared to Arnold, who was the consumate professional and looked like a million bucks
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In what ways was he unprepared? Sergio in top shape looked plenty polished, enough so that the general concensus is that he won in '72. So much for polish.
Being big wouldn't have been enough-he was in condition in some instances, not in many others-but there aren't many pictures of him in top condition. There are many pictures of Arnold in top condition. Big difference.
Also keep in mind that most of that shit Arnold's proud to perpetuate ad nauseum about psyching out opponents has no basis in fact. Who has ever corroborated Schwarzenegger's claims? Mentzer and Oliva never substantiated any of this, but the uninformed eat it up.
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I know I will get flamed for this, but ronnie really DID used to have a "pleasing" physique:
(http://www.bigroncoleman.com/media/1999_03LG.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/Coleman18.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mrolympia2/rc102.jpg)
(http://www.ronniecoleman.net/bwcoleman0edecbab.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=910&stc=1)
other than his calves, he had near perfect balance at one point..
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Flex was 100% Steriods man. He looks like total boiled shit without the juice! Thats how he made himself, and fuked himself. Arnold and Serge had great genetics and are not comparable to Flex. You live by the juice, u die by the juice.
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as great as ronnie coleman is i prefer flex's physique,less oil.
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Most of the current guys are clearly less pleasing! Coleman's awesome but i wouldn't say most pleasing, even back in the day.
Melvin Anthony & Martinez are the exceptions; as aesthetic as anyone from any era.
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as great as ronnie coleman is i prefer flex's physique,less oil.
Your an idiot aren't you, i mean really i was actually gonna flame Hulster for once again brining up ronnie in a arnold thread about a pleasing physique but seriously what you said has to be by far the most retarded thing i have ever read at this site. To say ronnie has more/any oil is like saying that Dave Henry is a mass monster, do you even follow bodybuilding ???
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Most of the current guys are clearly less pleasing! Coleman's awesome but i wouldn't say most pleasing, even back in the day.
Melvin Anthony & Martinez are the exceptions; as aesthetic as anyone from any era.
Ahmed Haider looks great
(http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/2003/arnold2003_24.jpg)
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....i was actually gonna flame Hulster for once again brining up ronnie in a arnold thread about a pleasing physique....
Do that anyway. ;D
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Do that anyway. ;D
Hulkster is it possible that and i am serious but maybe ronnie coleman isnt the best at everything. It seems that no matter who is being talked about or being admired in a thread that you have to bring up ronnie coleman, like do you ever not have his cock balls deep into your mouth. Has it ever come across you mind that maybe some bodybuilders look better then him and also why is it when you bring him up its always his old pics when he was smaller, well that is unless somone is talking about size and then its time for his gutmaster 2003-now contest size. Dont get me wrong ronnie is great and hands down Mr. O but it gets old when it seems all you say is hes the all time best at everything.
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In what ways was he unprepared? Sergio in top shape looked plenty polished, enough so that the general concensus is that he won in '72. So much for polish.
Being big wouldn't have been enough-he was in condition in some instances, not in many others-but there aren't many pictures of him in top condition. There are many pictures of Arnold in top condition. Big difference.
Also keep in mind that most of that shit Arnold's proud to perpetuate ad nauseum about psyching out opponents has no basis in fact. Who has ever corroborated Schwarzenegger's claims? Mentzer and Oliva never substantiated any of this, but the uninformed eat it up.
Maybe there aren't a lot of pics of Sergio in top shape BECAUSE HE CAME IN OUT OF SHAPE MOST OF THE TIME. You'll get no argument out of me about 72, he looked great, altough I think Arnold was better. But that is only one year. Arnold was in shape every year. I'm well aware that Arnold was the chose one back then, but the dude more than held up his end of the bargain.
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Hulkster is it possible that and i am serious but maybe ronnie coleman isnt the best at everything. It seems that no matter who is being talked about or being admired in a thread that you have to bring up ronnie coleman, like do you ever not have his cock balls deep into your mouth. Has it ever come across you mind that maybe some bodybuilders look better then him and also why is it when you bring him up its always his old pics when he was smaller, well that is unless somone is talking about size and then its time for his gutmaster 2003-now contest size. Dont get me wrong ronnie is great and hands down Mr. O but it gets old when it seems all you say is hes the all time best at everything.
He is like a drug addict , he just can't help himself. ???
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Maybe there aren't a lot of pics of Sergio in top shape BECAUSE HE CAME IN OUT OF SHAPE MOST OF THE TIME. You'll get no argument out of me about 72, he looked great, altough I think Arnold was better. But that is only one year. Arnold was in shape every year. I'm well aware that Arnold was the chose one back then, but the dude more than held up his end of the bargain.
Arnold could sell more magazines when he was on the cover than Sergio. The Wieders were businessman. Plain and simple. Arnold was smart, glib, white, and good looking. Sergio had none of those attributes. Sergio was built better than Arnold.
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Exactly; for selling mags, a more charismatic BB who was white such as Arnold was a no-brainer, they had to back Arnold. Sergio was pushed aside in the early 70s and off the pages of Weider's mag for the most part. No more pics.
Maybe there aren't a lot of pics of Sergio in top shape BECAUSE HE CAME IN OUT OF SHAPE MOST OF THE TIME.
You're just speculating. In the era of his best conditioning-early 70s, then again in the late 70s, he was on the outs with Weider and wasn't featured in Weider's mag. Weider had the best photographers and budget. Simply not a lot of widely available pics taken then of Sergio-he was by then appearing in Iron Man and Lurie mags.
You'll get no argument out of me about 72, he looked great, altough I think Arnold was better. But that is only one year. Arnold was in shape every year.
Do some research, you're inaccurate. In each case there were windows when they were in their peak all-time condition-Sergio '72 and almost as good '71,'73,'74 and late 70s, Arnold '73-'74. At other times, neither had it entirely together. Arnold was not at his best in '72 and '80.
Since you know so much...If Arnold was better, why didn't he come out of the audience to answer Sergio's challenge at the Mr. International? It wasn't a Weider event and Arnold might have lost.
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me personally I agree with faust. i dont like the size of todays pros legs. if i had to pic a physique it would be bill pearle.
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anrold or sergio, who was better is not the issue.the issue is who's physique could you look at and prefer.
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Give me Sergios physique over any current pro.As ive said before i look at the male physique like a motor car.
Sergio/ Lambourghini
Flex/Ferrari
Dorian/GTO
Ronster/Dodge Viper
Kamali/Taxi cab
Womens bodybuilders looks like a transexual pagent.
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me personally I agree with faust. i dont like the size of todays pros legs. if i had to pic a physique it would be bill pearle.
Bill Pearl
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thanks for the pic ND.
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Ahmed Haider looks great
(http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/2003/arnold2003_24.jpg)
haidar looks awesome man
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you can still admire the old physiques,they have stood the test of time.can we say the same about today's pros?more importantly in years to come.
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Hulkster is it possible that and i am serious but maybe ronnie coleman isnt the best at everything. It seems that no matter who is being talked about or being admired in a thread that you have to bring up ronnie coleman, like do you ever not have his cock balls deep into your mouth. Has it ever come across you mind that maybe some bodybuilders look better then him and also why is it when you bring him up its always his old pics when he was smaller, well that is unless somone is talking about size and then its time for his gutmaster 2003-now contest size. Dont get me wrong ronnie is great and hands down Mr. O but it gets old when it seems all you say is hes the all time best at everything.
why don't you flame the people who brought up Sergio or anyone else in an Arnold Thread too ::)
After all, no one else has the right to be mentioned in an 'arnold thread' ::)
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Sergio was built better than Arnold.
No he wasn't. Everybody talks about how big Sergio Arm's were but I think they were nothing special. THey remind me of Mike Mentzer's arms. Forearms are too big, NO peak on the bi's and no detail in the tri's. Bigger isn't always better.
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why don't you flame the people who brought up Sergio or anyone else in an Arnold Thread too ::)
After all, no one else has the right to be mentioned in an 'arnold thread' ::)
It's just that you pop up in so many threads with all your ronnie tea bagging and shit. I don't really notice anyone else who consistantly shows up in threads and post about a specific bodybuilder 24/7. :D
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It's just that you pop up in so many threads with all your ronnie tea bagging and shit. I don't really notice anyone else who consistantly shows up in threads and post about a specific bodybuilder 24/7. :D
He's right Hulkster. You need to break the seal and remove your lips from Ronnie's O-ring every once in a while.
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Also keep in mind that most of that shit Arnold's proud to perpetuate ad nauseum about psyching out opponents has no basis in fact. Who has ever corroborated Schwarzenegger's claims? Mentzer and Oliva never substantiated any of this, but the uninformed eat it up.
Actually, in the DVD, Arnold: The Early Years, there's footage from the 1970 Mr. Olympia where Arnold "psyched" Sergio into leaving the stage. Sergio has admitted this.
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Now, who has the most unpleasing physique?
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Now, who has the most unpleasing physique?
Ronnie ;D
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Bill Pearl
yes bill pearl
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in the DVD, Arnold: The Early Years, there's footage from the 1970 Mr. Olympia where Arnold "psyched" Sergio into leaving the stage. Sergio has admitted this.
Where have you seen him admit this? There are no other verifiable examples either.
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No he wasn't. Everybody talks about how big Sergio Arm's were but I think they were nothing special. THey remind me of Mike Mentzer's arms. Forearms are too big, NO peak on the bi's and no detail in the tri's. Bigger isn't always better.
Sergio's arms were nothing special? You lost all your credibility with that statement. Arnold has said himself Sergio had the greatest arms in bodybuilding history.
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Bill Pearl
Extremely rugged.
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i personally never get tired of looking at arnold's physique ,
fag
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fag
do you like seeing the same tv shows over and over again too ?
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Where have you seen him admit this? Any other examples? I doubt it.
:::sigh::: I don't know what else it's gonna take to make you a believer. ::) There's proof on video. I've conversed with Sergio at the Arnold Classic, one of 'em being that issue. The only thing that Sergio called bullshit on was at the '72 Mr. O. when Arnold won because of a "black" background trick.
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What it'll take is some content-what proof is on video? Any other examples?
Sergio's got some of the best tris ever.
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What it'll take is some content-what does the video show? Any other examples? Sounds like more of Arnold's revisionist history that has lived on for decades.
Sergio's got some of the best tris ever.
Nah. That was the only "trick" you see between the two. You see Arnold and Sergio on stage together. Arnold whispers into Sergio's ear and then walks off stage. Arnold throws his arms up as if to signal that Sergio quit. As for Sergio's triceps? Hell, his whole arm was awesome! Unbelievable! :o
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So much for psyching out opponents if that's the only example! He tricked him, not the same thing. Another hollow claim similar to the stuff made up in PI. Interesting that for in all these years none of the "journalists" in the sport have questioned this.
That makes them even-Sergio psyched Arnold out at the Mr. International when Schwarzenegger didn't have the balls to come out of the audience in a non-Weider show. Columbu took a beating instead.
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I know I will get flamed for this, but ronnie really DID used to have a "pleasing" physique:
hahahah.. yeah right
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Sergio's arms were nothing special? You lost all your credibility with that statement. Arnold has said himself Sergio had the greatest arms in bodybuilding history.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Personally I don't like Sergio's look and that includes his ugly arms. Just because Sergio had a small waist doesn't mean he was aesthetically pleasing. He reminds me of Ronnie Coleman back in the mid 90's. Huge muscle bellies,tiny waist but it all just doesn't flow . Not to me anyways.
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Aesthetics:
Nubret > Schwarzenegger > Oliva
Great:
Oliva = Schwarzenegger
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Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Personally I don't like Sergio's look and that includes his ugly arms. Just because Sergio had a small waist doesn't mean he was aesthetically pleasing. He reminds me of Ronnie Coleman back in the mid 90's. Huge muscle bellies,tiny waist but it all just doesn't flow . Not to me anyways.
what? sergio's physique doesn't flow? i've heard criticisms of sergio before, but i've never heard that before. sergio's only flaw was his conditioning. for everything else, he was basically perfect.
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Oliva & Schwarzenegger were the best. Beyond that it's just personal preference.
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Oliva & Schwarzenegger were the best. Beyond that it's just personal preference.
They were the best duo to compete side by side for the olympia 8)
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This thread is a joke. First time I saw footage of Flex at the 93 arnold classic I had to do a double take....he looked unreal. 235lbs, 5'10, perfect symmetry, perfect amount of mass, and shredded. Too bad everything was downhill for him after that...you really have to wonder what could have been if he didn't have the kidney condition and the car wreck.
As for all of this talk about Sergio and Arnold, they were good, but it's more "nostalgia" than anything ;)
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Oliva & Schwarzenegger were the best. Beyond that it's just personal preference.
Word. >:(
DIV
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Huge muscle bellies,tiny waist but it all just doesn't flow . Not to me anyways.
???
sergio oliva was the very definition of 'flow'.
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This thread is a joke. First time I saw footage of Flex at the 93 arnold classic I had to do a double take....he looked unreal. 235lbs, 5'10, perfect symmetry, perfect amount of mass, and shredded. Too bad everything was downhill for him after that...you really have to wonder what could have been if he didn't have the kidney condition and the car wreck.
As for all of this talk about Sergio and Arnold, they were good, but it's more "nostalgia" than anything ;)
Flex was lucky if he was 215lbs at the 93 ASC but I think that condition is among the very best ever of anyone .
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As for all of this talk about Sergio and Arnold, they were good, but it's more "nostalgia" than anything ;)
I hope your kidding with that statement. ???
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Its too bad Flex never looked that good again, He did become Mr O
il and lost alot of respect :-\ But if you havnt noticed Arnold and Sergio were healthier after 40 then flex was before 40 and i would have to say their physiques were more complete the flex's ever was.
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Its too bad Flex never looked that good again, He did become Mr Oil and lost alot of respect :-\ But if you havnt noticed Arnold and Sergio were healthier after 40 then flex was before 40 and i would have to say their physiques were more complete the flex's ever was.
Flex's health was due to a genetic disease, so your statement really isn't applicable.
Also, flex in 93 had perfect proportion and symmetry, something Arnold or Oliva never had. Arnold's needed more leg mass. Oliva's arms overpowered everything and he had no back detail.
People can disagree, but flex at the arnold classic 93 was the finest ever seen on stage. From that point on where could the IFBB go? Aesthetics had reached its peak and mass had to take over. Flex gets in the car wreck, his kidneys won't allow him to get in his best shape, plus he has to deal with mass monsters Yates and Coleman. Flex trained like a pussy compared to those two. So he had to turn to oil. The judging standards forced him into it.
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Flex's health was due to a genetic disease, so your statement really isn't applicable.
Also, flex in 93 had perfect proportion and symmetry, something Arnold or Oliva never had. Arnold's needed more leg mass. Oliva's arms overpowered everything and he had no back detail.
People can disagree, but flex at the arnold classic 93 was the finest ever seen on stage. From that point on where could the IFBB go? Aesthetics had reached its peak and mass had to take over. Flex gets in the car wreck, his kidneys won't allow him to get in his best shape, plus he has to deal with mass monsters Yates and Coleman. Flex trained like a pussy compared to those two. So he had to turn to oil. The judging standards forced him into it.
Flex had structural flaws as well. There has never been a perfect BBer.
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It's true, don't present Flex as somehow better than Sergio or Arnold. Better than Haney or Yates i'd consider.
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Flex's health was due to a genetic disease, so your statement really isn't applicable.
Also, flex in 93 had perfect proportion and symmetry, something Arnold or Oliva never had. Arnold's needed more leg mass. Oliva's arms overpowered everything and he had no back detail.
People can disagree, but flex at the arnold classic 93 was the finest ever seen on stage. From that point on where could the IFBB go? Aesthetics had reached its peak and mass had to take over. Flex gets in the car wreck, his kidneys won't allow him to get in his best shape, plus he has to deal with mass monsters Yates and Coleman. Flex trained like a pussy compared to those two. So he had to turn to oil. The judging standards forced him into it.
You're high if you think Flex had " perfect proportion " I'm a huge Flex Wheeler fan but perfect proportions is something he didn't have , he had superheavyweights arms and a middleweights torso , structually he was narrow , and from a proprtion standpoint his muscles didn't compliment each other with perfection in the Chris Comier sense or a Lee Labrada sense , what made Flex perfect that contest was the combo of size/shape and conditioning .
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Flex's health was due to a genetic disease, so your statement really isn't applicable.
Seems alot of pros have "genetic kidney problems" :-\
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comparing Sergio to Flex for aesthetics in my opinion isn't even worthwhile
And while were at it, everyone talks about how big Sergio was....and how he could rival pros today or even exceed them in size...well, that's becuase his contest condition from back then was bascially what most pros today would call "offseason". He was soft as a donut...
(http://www.kulturistika.com/picturesweb/porovnani/porovnani11x.jpg)
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Flex's health was due to a genetic disease, so your statement really isn't applicable.
Also, flex in 93 had perfect proportion and symmetry, something Arnold or Oliva never had. Arnold's needed more leg mass. Oliva's arms overpowered everything and he had no back detail.
People can disagree, but flex at the arnold classic 93 was the finest ever seen on stage. From that point on where could the IFBB go? Aesthetics had reached its peak and mass had to take over. Flex gets in the car wreck, his kidneys won't allow him to get in his best shape, plus he has to deal with mass monsters Yates and Coleman. Flex trained like a pussy compared to those two. So he had to turn to oil. The judging standards forced him into it.
You make it seem like flex at the 93 asc was the best body ever displayed in the ifbb.
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comparing Sergio to Flex for aesthetics in my opinion isn't even worthwhile
And while were at it, everyone talks about how big Sergio was....and how he could rival pros today or even exceed them in size...well, that's becuase his contest condition from back then was bascially what most pros today would call "offseason". He was soft as a donut...
I didnt know bodybuilders today sported such a small waist in the offseason ::)
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You make it seem like flex at the 93 asc was the best body ever displayed in the ifbb.
it was in my opinion. Catch some video from the show and see for yourself.
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You chose a bad pic to compare Sergio with Ron. If you knew anything you'd have found something better than what Iron Age in their wisdom came up with.
Neither guy's in his best shape there, so the comparison's weak. How can you bring up Sergio's conditioning and then post a pic that has Ron with a bloated waist! He's the one who looks like he's been eating donuts! A better shot of Sergio would've been smarter as well.
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You chose a bad pic to compare Sergio with Ron. If you knew anything you'd have found something better than what Iron Age in their wisdom came up with.
Neither guy's in his best shape there, so the comparison's weak. Anyway, take a look and notice that Ron's waist is huge compared to Sergio's. Anway, a better shot of Sergio would've been smarter.
It's not really in my interest to compare bodybuilders from different eras, but with all the blatant arnold and sergio "nostalgia" in this thread I thought I would put my two cents in. Sergio was equivalent in his time to what Ronnie is today in terms of the mass game. But to call Segio or Arnold the most aesthic BBs of all time is absurd considering they both had many more flaws than Flex.
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You chose a bad pic to compare Sergio with Ron. If you knew anything you'd have found something better than what Iron Age in their wisdom came up with.
Neither guy's in his best shape there, so the comparison's weak. How can you bring up Sergio's conditioning and then post a pic that has Ron with a bloated waist! He's the one who looks like he's been eating donuts! A better shot of Sergio would've been smarter as well.
Or he could compare sergio with somone other then ronnie the biggest hardest freak ever in the ifbb.
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You chose a bad pic to compare Sergio with Ron. If you knew anything you'd have found something better than what Iron Age in their wisdom came up with.
Neither guy's in his best shape there, so the comparison's weak. How can you bring up Sergio's conditioning and then post a pic that has Ron with a bloated waist! He's the one who looks like he's been eating donuts! A better shot of Sergio would've been smarter as well.
Ronnie's conditioning in that picture is spot on. He is dry and shredded. His gut is in no way indicative of his conditioning. It's a result of the drugs and the pure amount of food he has to eat everyday. Where is the peak on Sergio's biceps? Where is the quad separation? Where are the striations?
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Neither of the pics is flattering, invest in some glasses.
None of the guys mentioned are the most aesthetic, this has become who's the best.
Some would argue with some justification that the guys from the 70s looked better. They were smaller, but so were their waists.
Just a matter of taste with no answer.
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Or he could compare sergio with somone other then ronnie the biggest hardest freak ever in the ifbb.
Ronnie is far from the hardest or best conditioned BB of all-time.
(http://www.lifeinwidescreen.com/siihp/flex05.jpg)
If you can find any Sergio picture that rival's this go ahead and post it up.
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Ronnie is far from the hardest or best conditioned BB of all-time.
(http://www.lifeinwidescreen.com/siihp/flex05.jpg)
If you can find any Sergio picture that rival's this go ahead and post it up.
You are becoming Flex's Hulkster, Lips wraped firmly around his cock balls deep, everyone one here knows what i am talking about ;)
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Or maybe that's just your sad response if you have nothing better to post. I firmly believe that Flex is better aesthetically than arnold or oliva - and easily at that. If you want to protest it, put up some pictures of Oliva to prove me wrong. Otherwise, maybe you should take a second to read the forum rules before you click to enter.
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Get some good pics if you're relying on them to prove your point. For the new year get some glasses.
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Or maybe that's just your sad response if you have nothing better to post. I firmly believe that Flex is better aesthetically than arnold or oliva - and easily at that. If you want to protest it, put up some pictures of Oliva to prove me wrong. Otherwise, maybe you should take a second to read the forum rules before you click to enter.
Dude your trying way to hard :) If you knew what i was talking about you would have thought it funny and laughed but i can see that you take yourself a little to seriously and maybe your not ready for this board, either way theres no way to argue opinions and be right or wrong and thats why i am not gonna sit here and post pictures and argue about this discussion all night.
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Ronnie is far from the hardest or best conditioned BB of all-time.
On average, no, but Ronnie at the 98 Olympia (his dryest ever) could at least tie for that distinction:
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/Coleman08.jpg)
I don't think I have ever seen pecs quite this striated
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=43892.0;id=45835;image)
when a bodybuilder has the "skeleton face "look, you know he is about as dry as you can get..
(http://www.beyondrelief.com/images/colemanback.jpg)
you won't find a back shot that was dryer that this.
Perhaps only munzer was dryer.
and yes, that ironager comparison is a really, really bad shot of BOTH Ronnie and Sergio.
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On average, no, but Ronnie at the 98 Olympia (his dryest ever) could at least tie for that distinction:
I don't think I have ever seen pecs quite this striated
when a bodybuilder has the "skeleton face "look, you know he is about as dry as you can get..
you won't find a back shot that was dryer that this.
Perhaps only munzer was dryer.
and yes, that ironager comparison is a really, really bad shot of BOTH Ronnie and Sergio.
This back shot matches at minimum that back shot of Ronnie
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So does this one.
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True, but Ron displayed that dryness and detail about 50 lbs. heavier than Samir and 35 lbs. heavier than flex. Now if you spin them around, Flex beats Ron for the same reason Arnold beat Sergio.......he's just put together better.
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no they don't- for two reasons: hams and glutes.
Hell, even Ronnie's shitty calves are super-cut in that shot!
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I think Shawn Ray ala 94 Olympia is also one of the most pleasing physiques of all time.
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Dianne Bennett is quoted in Jon Hotten's excellent book 'Muscle' as saying that if you had to show an alien race of people who had never seen what man looked like the ideal image, there would only be one person for the job..........Flex Wheeler.
Yes he never won the olympia.
Yes Ronnie carries more muscle
Yes Dorian smashed him mentally
However if the general public had to choose 1 BB who they would want to resemble 99.9% would say Flex.
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I think from a purely aesthetic standpoint no one could top Steve Reeves , no one.
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Vince Taylor; didn't win the big one but was fantastic-an athletic look most don't have now.
Reeves good but kind of a yawn-barely looks like a BB. Today that's more of a rower's bod.
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Dianne Bennett is quoted in Jon Hotten's excellent book 'Muscle' as saying that if you had to show an alien race of people who had never seen what man looked like the ideal image, there would only be one person for the job..........Flex Wheeler.
Yes he never won the olympia.
Yes Ronnie carries more muscle
Yes Dorian smashed him mentally
However if the general public had to choose 1 BB who they would want to resemble 99.9% would say Flex.
i must be part of the .01% that wouldn't
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Flex totally; didn't win the big one but was fantastic-an athletic look most don't have now.
Reeves good but kind of a yawn-barely looks like a BB. Today that's a swimmer's bod.
Show me a swimmer with a 54" chest and a 29" waist ;) as a matter of fact show me ANY bodybuilder who weights 215lbs with a 54" chest and a 29" waist and calves , arms and neck that all measure exactly the same .
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Show me a swimmer with a 54" chest and a 29" waist ;) as a matter of fact show me ANY bodybuilder who weights 215lbs with a 54" chest and a 29" waist and calves , arms and neck that all measure exactly the same .
but when your calves, arms and neck are all 16 inches, that is not necessarily a good thing ;)
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but when your calves, arms and neck are all 16 inches, that is not necessarily a good thing ;)
Agreed.
Those ideals are archaic, people have progressed past that point a long time ago.
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Show me a swimmer with a 54" chest and a 29" waist ;) as a matter of fact show me ANY bodybuilder who weights 215lbs with a 54" chest and a 29" waist and calves , arms and neck that all measure exactly the same .
Frank Zane
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Agreed.
Those ideals are archaic, people have progressed past that point a long time ago.
That's debatable.
GH guts, synthol, implants, multiple organ failure, changes to facial features etc, are hardly the signs of progress.
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Well of course Iron Age always sees things in black & white.
Reeves is fine but given the vast history now and decades of competitors, it's also kinda safe, lazy and lacking in imagination to have to resort to someone from 50 years ago. Someone suggesting Reeves is basically saying there's no one worthwhile in the last 50 years...***yawn***.
Pleasing and good or better:
Melvin Anthony
Martinez
Nubret
Vince Taylor
Padilla
Bob Birdsong
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That's debatable.
GH guts, synthol, implants, multiple organ failure, changes to facial features etc, are hardly the signs of progress.
What I mean is those proportions were the Greek ideal. Just a little outdated. There was no such thing as bodybuilding as we know it back then. they also thought that the sun revolved around the earth but wev'e managed to get past that one. I agree that in the last ten years or so BBing has taken a nosedive. Ever since guys started stepping onstage at 250+ proportions and detail have suffered
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On average, no, but Ronnie at the 98 Olympia (his dryest ever) could at least tie for that distinction:
i was actually waitin for you to come and back me up about ronnie for once :D
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i was actually waitin for you to come and back me up about ronnie for once :D
the pre-gut Ronnie was always dry as can be - so dry, in 98 in fact, that he was about as conditioned as you can get onstage. But it was the post-gut Ronnie that had problems (eg. 2000, 2001, 2002 and 2004 Olympias). If Ronnie's conditioning hadn't taken an average turn for the worse, people would be saying he was one of the most well conditioned bodybuilders ever. But, instead, we are saying that he was for a few years only.
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Ronnie was intensely cut, but I wouldn't say dry. Serious density is one of the only things he's never had.
Dry would be Jay in some shows, Yates at his best-that was his strength, Taylor, Columbu, Robinson-not that many.
Seems less common today, probably the drugs.
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i personally never get tired of looking at arnold's physique ,i believe there has never been or will be a more pleasing physique to look at.today's bodybuilders are not pleasing to look at.who,s physique do you most admire.
Arnold's physique is appealing because it's complete, with long muscle bellies. He's also tall with a highly masculine face, which makes him charismatic.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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physique is appealing because she's tall with a highly masculine face.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Sounds like somthin S Ray would say ;D j/k
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Sounds like somthin S Ray would say ;D j/k
Tall men, with masculine faces, are the most charismatic; most Hollywood leading men have these characteristics. Men with pretty faces, like Leo DiCaprio and Jude Law may make teenage girls and gay guys swoon with lust, but they usually don't conquer many male fans. Get my drift?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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This is the most pleasing physique out of any so far posted
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This is the most pleasing physique out of any so far posted
no no no. Her tits, arms and ass cheeks are not all the same size! :)
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but when your calves, arms and neck are all 16 inches, that is not necessarily a good thing ;)
They were all 18" ;) and Ronnie has those measurements as well , 54" gut 18" calves :P
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That's debatable.
GH guts, synthol, implants, multiple organ failure, changes to facial features etc, are hardly the signs of progress.
Excellent point !!
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They were all 18" ;) and Ronnie has those measurements as well , 54" gut 18" calves :P
Obviously you're joking unless you seriously believe reeves had calves as big as rons
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This is the most pleasing physique out of any so far posted
I've seen better
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What I mean is those proportions were the Greek ideal. Just a little outdated. There was no such thing as bodybuilding as we know it back then. they also thought that the sun revolved around the earth but wev'e managed to get past that one. I agree that in the last ten years or so BBing has taken a nosedive. Ever since guys started stepping onstage at 250+ proportions and detail have suffered
Ok, I hear you. That's a fair point.
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Bob Paris also needs a mention if pleasing lines and aesthetic quality are the guide.
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here he is
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Gotta love these two. 8)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/gallery/musclegallery2/m287.jpg)
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this one for those who say arnold had weak legs.
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this one for those who say arnold had weak legs.
I sure hope that you are showing us that pic to show that Arnold truly DOES have weak legs, since his quads have almost no sweep at all at that time.
And, if he turned to the side, his legs would have disappeared.
Arnold legs, even at their best, were detailed, and thats about it.
little sweep, little size- well out of balance with his upper body.
however, this cannot be held against him because this was very common back in the day.
What is more correct is to say that Arnold had weak legs in comparison to modern standards.
He did not necessarily have weak legs in comparison to his fellow competitiors at the time.
And this is why people like ND are totally retarded if they ever even once say that Arnolds legs were better than ronnie coleman's! ;)
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this one for those who say arnold had weak legs.
hmmmm arnold's legs look alot like kovacs so fuckin overrated so many better then him in that day how about nubret totally lost based on race and before you people bitch i am white
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...And, if he turned to the side, his legs would have disappeared.....
.....little sweep, little size- well out of balance with his upper body....
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(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=49246.0;id=52251;image)
thanks for the pic, Gord. As we can see here, Arnold's arms are almost bigger than his quads.. :-\
see, all these arnold shots of him in isolation look good - you say, that looks fairly balanced....until you compare it to someone who has balanced quads for their upper body: then you say whoaa! Arnold was not very balanced..
(http://digilander.libero.it/mrolympia2/so14.jpg)
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Well you won't get me dissing Sergio's physique, because the guy was great, and I agree that he had a slightly better upper/lower body balance. But frankly there wasn't much in it and Arnold (to my eyes) countered by having the better muscle shape and flow. I also think if Sergio could ever match Arnold's best conditioning, he would've also had to sacrifice some mass in the process.
Anyway, a couple of comparison pics from the 1972 Olympia. Sergio was my pick (just) for that show, but you can still see that upper/lower balance difference between them was not significant, even though Sergio was/is generally acknowledged to be at his best that year and Arnold not at his.
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Arnold's legs don't look out of balance there, and have good shape.
In some other shots or footage from other angles, especially from the sides, they can look a little light for the upper body.
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You could always agrue in those day legs were generally under developed, but on the other hand, you could also argue that these days legs are overdeveloped. It's all subjective.
Another Arnold side shot (this time from 1974). Side leg not that shabby for that era. ;)
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I have always thought that Arnolds calves were too big for his quads. Seriously. Look at that last shot.
Arnold's calves were almost too good. They were amazing.
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Without the calves the thighs would've been a bigger problem. Calves drew attention away from the slight lack of thigh and ham size.
All depends on the angle, in some shots the thighs are more obviously lacking just a little, but still good shape and great calves.
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(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=49246.0;id=52251;image)
thanks for the pic, Gord. As we can see here, Arnold's arms are almost bigger than his quads.. :-\
see, all these arnold shots of him in isolation look good - you say, that looks fairly balanced....until you compare it to someone who has balanced quads for their upper body: then you say whoaa! Arnold was not very balanced..
(http://digilander.libero.it/mrolympia2/so14.jpg)
THese two pics Illustrate clearly why Arnold is superior to Sergio. Arnold looks like perfection... BIG and put together perfectly, while Sergio looks like less than the sum of his parts. Kinda like pre -Olympia Ronnie.
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Yep, the guy had some calves.
One thing about Arnold's physique progress that gets forgotten is that he really gave up serious training and competitive bodybuilding after the 1974 Olympia when he was only 27 (forget the 1975 and 1980 shows, which he did mainly for film publicity reasons and never trained properly for).
These days, hardly anyone turns pro before they are 30. Nowadays most pros hit their best in their 30s, never mind being a multi-Olympia winner by the age 27. Even Sergio was 31, at his 1972 best.
Just imagine if Arnold had carried on training and competing for another 7 or 8 years, non-stop. His physique was in effect still developing, he was a work in progress, when he retired from serious competition. I don't think we ever actually saw Arnold hit his full potential.
Anyway, another pic of those calves, from 1971 (I think) when he was only 24 years old.
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Just a matter of taste. Equally great.
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Just a matter of taste. Equally great.
I agree.
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hmmmm arnold's legs look alot like kovacs so fuckin overrated so many better then him in that day how about nubret totally lost based on race and before you people bitch i am white
serge nubret had terrible legs,thats why he posed them turned slightly side ways in most poses.
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serge, do you agree?
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I'd take vintage Sergio physique over anyone.
EVER.
DIV
I'm assuming you're a negro?
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I'm assuming you're a negro?
worse...a fat mexican.