Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Disgusted on October 08, 2014, 02:20:57 PM
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Through out the years we have definitely seen a change not only in the size of BBers but also the shape and conditioning too. Today it’s very common for guys to “miss their peak”. Years ago this rarely happened at the top level. Todays look has the top guys looking very big and full almost like their muscle were inflated with air. Yes we do see some striations of the muscle groups mainly the glutes and triceps. We see some good separation but long gone are the deep claw like striations that appeared in the shoulders and chest like the guys from the 70’s, 80’s and the early 90’s. They had a granite type look to them. It was a different look back then and I’m guessing that human evolution has little to do with the fact that they look so much different today. ;) Enter in GH and insulin. I’ve been around this sport for longer than I care to admit been around the heart of it all growing up near Pittsburgh which is NPC country. I’ve trained a few pros and plenty of amateurs over the last 30 years. I say this only to qualify little about what I speak of. OK so back on point and I am going to keep this briefer than what I normally would since I am on this site and don’t really know the text limit.
I’ll first talk briefly about Insulin. Insulin is an aging hormone that also promotes fat storage mainly visceral fat. Normally in in a regular person when they start dieting the first fat to go is the visceral fat or the fat that is mainly stored behind the abdominal wall. If one is using insulin this visceral fat will not go away first and will be very resistant to being used as energy The distended guts that we see so much today is actually fat behind the abdominal wall not enlarged organ growth. If an organ was that inflamed as to make the stomach stick out that far number 1 we would not see it done in such an even manner through out the ab region and number 2 I suspect this person would not live very long simply because such an enlarged organ would not function properly.
So why is it that we are seeing such unevenly distributed amounts of fat on the current guys today? Well there it is a two fold issue. We are seeing striated glutes right? These guys must be dieting hard right? Well in fact most of them are so it has to be genetics right? In a word NO! Look at it this way, when you go to the store to buy a cut of meat some cuts are leaner than others. Some cuts are very void of fat. I’m not talking about the part that the butcher trims off I am talking about the inner part that is marbleized with fat through out the entire cut. Some parts of the cow are leaner than other because of the fat receptors within the muscle itself. It’s the same in a human, certain parts of our anatomy as far as out musculature has a different density and fat receptors within.
With all the insulin that is being used today it is nearly impossible to get completely shredded. Remember earlier when I said that insulin promotes fat storage well it does and it does so in a non discriminatory way. Hence the ripped glutes striated triceps but to a lesser degree more marbilized fat storage within other muscle groups mainly in the torso area and the distended stomachs we commonly see today. So no it is not genetics that allows a person to get down to a very low level of body fat. So yes it really is easier for someone who is natural or has only used steroids to get a more striated look.
To touch upon GH breifly. At first GH does seems to help put on size and make one look better, but if you have noticed after years of long term high dose use a lot of the pros are unable to get back to their extremely lean ripped look they first had in their career. The one thing that GH will do after years of use is thicken the skin. Do I really need to say anymore on that matter? In fact that is one of the main benefits of GH as peoples skin gets thinner as they age.
One last thing about genetics. With all things being equal as far as fat levels go the part that is genetic about striations is the actual pattern of the muscle fibers themselves. Each person will have not only have a certain number of visible rows of fibers but the actual rows themselves will sometimes be more straight and this may make one appear to be more ripped or make a flexed muscle look more impressive while flexed. You see this a lot in the glute tricep and delt area. This is one of the main reasons Doug Miller looks so impressive with a low level of body fat. He was blessed not only with a pleasing muscle shape, but also good muscle fiber placement.
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Great read...thanks for sharing Disgusting
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thread should be stickied with noone's
question from another thread:
for clean/nattie guys, do you think dieting without carbs can be done without looking like a string bean due to losing fullness in the muscles? are there any differences to your methods leaning down a nattie vs a juicer?
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thread should be stickied with noone's
question from another thread:
for clean/nattie guys, do you think dieting without carbs can be done without looking like a string bean due to losing fullness in the muscles? are there any differences to your methods leaning down a nattie vs a juicer?
NO difference and if dieting correctly no loss of mass. At times fullness will not be 100% depending on amount of glycogen in the muscle.
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NO difference and if dieting correctly no loss of mass. At times fullness will not be 100% depending on amount of glycogen in the muscle.
+1
and great read, thanks for that.
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+1
and great read, thanks for that.
Thanks :)
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see. this is great shit. opinion based on experience. how can you debate an opinion based on experience. you just cant. thats what makes experience so powerful. you can always have differing opinions based on differing experiences but neither will be 'wrong'.
to touch on disgusted last paragraph- that bodies way of holding fat differs from person to person as well. some guys look very impressive and even leanish, despite having higher bodyfat levels. thats the guy who once he tries to diet down, often finds himself shrinking away to nothing. he chalks it up to cardio eating his muscle, the diet being too low on protein or another myriad of excuses that he uses to salve the fact that he never really had that uch tissue to begin with. he just had a a lot of fat masquerading as muscle.
one of two things happens at this point. he pulls the plug on his diet, and decides to be a permabulker his whole life, or he guts it out, takes his lumps and grinds out the diet until the actual shape of his body finally starts to come in.
which are you going to be?
to speak on gh, i stopped using it about a year and a half ago. what i find gh does it volumises the cell. it blows you up. when you go off that disappears. they say gh creates new fiber. ok, then why when you go off does that 3d look go with it? if thats really fiber and tissue your creating where did it go? new tissue doesnt just go away. you cant take something and make it nothing. lol
so then whats the deal? i think gh is an expensive way to look full and 3 dimensional. much like with anabolics you are strictly renting that look for as long as you maintain that dosage. so to those of you thinking about doing it, but dont have the budget, be forewarned.
i think someone can look absolutely amazing without the need for gh. in fact if your not going to compete, save your money. there are compounds that will give you similar fullness but not the 3d effect- i think thats strictly the realm of gh. npp and real anavar come to mind.
this leads me to another point. the 3d look. how do you get that 'roundness' ,that 3dness without gh. for the most part thats the realm of gh and genetics. black guys in the inner cities who live on basketball courts have the genetics for roundness. thats not gh. thats genetics. as a white dude is it possible to get the same kind of roundness if you dont have the genetics for it. i 100% believe that you can. but your sure as fuck never going to get it training one body part a day for a half assed hour.
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bump
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bump
no kidding.
i sometimes wonder how many serious lifters actually post here when a thread like this goes largely unnoticed.
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see. this is great shit. opinion based on experience. how can you debate an opinion based on experience. you just cant. thats what makes experience so powerful. you can always have differing opinions based on differing experiences but neither will be 'wrong'.
to touch on disgusted last paragraph- that bodies way of holding fat differs from person to person as well. some guys look very impressive and even leanish, despite having higher bodyfat levels. thats the guy who once he tries to diet down, often finds himself shrinking away to nothing. he chalks it up to cardio eating his muscle, the diet being too low on protein or another myriad of excuses that he uses to salve the fact that he never really had that uch tissue to begin with. he just had a a lot of fat masquerading as muscle.
one of two things happens at this point. he pulls the plug on his diet, and decides to be a permabulker his whole life, or he guts it out, takes his lumps and grinds out the diet until the actual shape of his body finally starts to come in.
which are you going to be?
to speak on gh, i stopped using it about a year and a half ago. what i find gh does it volumises the cell. it blows you up. when you go off that disappears. they say gh creates new fiber. ok, then why when you go off does that 3d look go with it? if thats really fiber and tissue your creating where did it go? new tissue doesnt just go away. you cant take something and make it nothing. lol
so then whats the deal? i think gh is an expensive way to look full and 3 dimensional. much like with anabolics you are strictly renting that look for as long as you maintain that dosage. so to those of you thinking about doing it, but dont have the budget, be forewarned.
i think someone can look absolutely amazing without the need for gh. in fact if your not going to compete, save your money. there are compounds that will give you similar fullness but not the 3d effect- i think thats strictly the realm of gh. npp and real anavar come to mind.
this leads me to another point. the 3d look. how do you get that 'roundness' ,that 3dness without gh. for the most part thats the realm of gh and genetics. black guys in the inner cities who live on basketball courts have the genetics for roundness. thats not gh. thats genetics. as a white dude is it possible to get the same kind of roundness if you dont have the genetics for it. i 100% believe that you can. but your sure as fuck never going to get it training one body part a day for a half assed hour.
So true on the renting concept.. you could expand that definition to include higher doses of gear and all the rest. These days I am good with just living life and cruising on HRT doses... for most sane people, the older you get, the more absurd the concept of jeopardizing your health for rented muscle becomes.
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cliffs
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Impressive post, seems like you know your stuff. I still think Doug is on the juice though
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Nice observation.. But please differentiate Inflammation from actual Hyperplasia of organs... Inflammation of organs would mean there is an immune response being triggered within the particular organ spoken of. Hyperplasia is a completely different mechanism that will be triggered via Abuse of Growth Hormone.. As it is seen in individuals of Acromegaly. Hyperplasia of bone densities, soft tissue, organs, etc. are inevitable consequences of GH - FACT ! Not Inflammation.. I am not speaking of the the genetic allocation of adipocytes.(which is partially correct in your observation). But in a GH abuser> Organs ARE going through hyperplasia.. Paranchymal receptors of all these tissues, organs, etc. have a binding affinity to GH , which will eventually trigger the cascade events of Gene Transcription within that particular cell. Further, this will induce the proliferation of these targeted cells via enzyme construction, scaffolding of new tissue, and all other necessary proteins involved in creating growth. Once again, organs that are inflamed exhibit a completely different mechanism in comparison to cell proliferation via hyperplasia(where there are actual cells dividing and increasing in #) Hypertrophy (if you guys are getting confused w/ terminology) is increase in Size of that particular cell i.e/ skeletal muscle fiber ... We can have hypertrophy of skeletal muscle but not hyperplasia
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I just beat noone in nutrition discussion so I am enjoying the victory right now, the next step is to beat you in steroid discussion but we will get to that soon enough.
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So basically pros need to stick to steroids and get rid of gh and insulin to look good.
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great article disgusted
one quick question do you feel , anyone can get reasonably cut, im not saying contest cut, but say like stallone looked like in the 90's like for cliffhanger, and the specialist, or is that
level of leaness unattainable without drugs, thanks for answering my question.
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Listen to me disgusted
If you are caught with steroids it means you are busted
But I wonder if your advice can really be trusted
My flow is sweet like when a cake is crusted
MC trainer in da house.
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Good points by Disgusted.
Something I mentioned before as the reason for lack of cuts in the delts in particular
is site injections, particularly with UG gear. Most pros' delts are completely fucked by repeated injections. Tons of scar tissue and lumps and bumps.
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When my stomach is falt, my arms and legs become dry and veiny!
When my friends stomach is flat his armes and legs are just bulky! I have seen several people with this bodytype, bulky arms and legs while stomach flat. Guess they have the fatmuscles...nice to fry! Bad for bb stage!
I guess Big Ramys leg are fatmuscles! He cant get the cuts and ryness! Dorian was pure muscle! And....MUNZER : )
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Nice observation.. But please differentiate Inflammation from actual Hyperplasia of organs... Inflammation of organs would mean there is an immune response being triggered within the particular organ spoken of. Hyperplasia is a completely different mechanism that will be triggered via Abuse of Growth Hormone.. As it is seen in individuals of Acromegaly. Hyperplasia of bone densities, soft tissue, organs, etc. are inevitable consequences of GH - FACT ! Not Inflammation.. I am not speaking of the the genetic allocation of adipocytes.(which is partially correct in your observation). But in a GH abuser> Organs ARE going through hyperplasia.. Paranchymal receptors of all these tissues, organs, etc. have a binding affinity to GH , which will eventually trigger the cascade events of Gene Transcription within that particular cell. Further, this will induce the proliferation of these targeted cells via enzyme construction, scaffolding of new tissue, and all other necessary proteins involved in creating growth. Once again, organs that are inflamed exhibit a completely different mechanism in comparison to cell proliferation via hyperplasia(where there are actual cells dividing and increasing in #) Hypertrophy (if you guys are getting confused w/ terminology) is increase in Size of that particular cell i.e/ skeletal muscle fiber ... We can have hypertrophy of skeletal muscle but not hyperplasia
I am talking about visceral fat behind the abdominal wall being the culprit in the case of distended stomachs we see on stage not inflammation nor hyperplasia of any giving organ. For example, I have seen up close someone with an inflamed liver from sclerosis and it's not in anyway a symmetrical look like you see from these guy on stage. He had an extremely lumpy look almost like a bowling ball was sticking out from under his lower rib cage.
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great article disgusted
one quick question do you feel , anyone can get reasonably cut, im not saying contest cut, but say like stallone looked like in the 90's like for cliffhanger, and the specialist, or is that
level of leaness unattainable without drugs, thanks for answering my question.
Any level of leanness can be achieved through diet. Drugs have nothing to do with it.
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GREAT read !!
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Awesome!
GH in low dosages do u recommend?
It's the high dosages obviously that's contributing to the look but with low 2-5 IUS daily serious sides shouldn't happen right? Even after yrs of use?
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Good factoid about fullness from real var. I noticed that as well running 40mg/daily, fullness and vascularity were crazy even though im not very lean.
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Disgusted,
Thank you for sharing, very informative. I just have one concern regarding your gh statement.
To touch upon GH breifly. At first GH does seems to help put on size and make one look better, but if you have noticed after years of long term high dose use a lot of the pros are unable to get back to their extremely lean ripped look they first had in their career. The one thing that GH will do after years of use is thicken the skin. Do I really need to say anymore on that matter? In fact that is one of the main benefits of GH as peoples skin gets thinner as they age.
If you say long use of gh will make things bad and it won't be possible to achieve that same look from years before, how come then we see Dexter still competing, or Tony Freeman? How old are they.... pushing 50? They look phenomenal - of course not their best BEST, but amazingly beating much much younger guys on stage.
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Awesome thread!!
Threads like this is the reason I started reading here on getbig in the first place.
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Disgusted,
Thank you for sharing, very informative. I just have one concern regarding your gh statement.
If you say long use of gh will make things bad and it won't be possible to achieve that same look from years before, how come then we see Dexter still competing, or Tony Freeman? How old are they.... pushing 50? They look phenomenal - of course not their best BEST, but amazingly beating much much younger guys on stage.
Well, I have spoken to Joe on occasion and he did train King for two shows and he did NOT have King using slin and claimed he didn't have Dexter use it either, I suspect the Dex may have started using later in life and or keeps his doses lower. As far as GH I know at the time King was conservative at around 8 ui's.
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Well, I have spoken to Joe on occasion and he did train King for two shows and he did NOT have King using slin and claimed he didn't have Dexter use it either, I suspect the Dex may have started using later in life and or keeps his doses lower. As far as GH I know at the time King was conservative at around 8 ui's.
Disgusted.
Great discussion .
I would be interesting to hear your opinion about the anabolics used back on the 80st. It seem that most of AAS users back on old day, relatively on good health, however, today we have seen people who have a lot of health issues , kidney problem , liver, die...ect
Dose that have to be because the length of the cycle, doses...ect
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Well, I have spoken to Joe on occasion and he did train King for two shows and he did NOT have King using slin and claimed he didn't have Dexter use it either, I suspect the Dex may have started using later in life and or keeps his doses lower. As far as GH I know at the time King was conservative at around 8 ui's.
What do u think is adequate use for GH for a normal gym rat physique kind of person without all the crazy sides u hear?
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Any level of leanness can be achieved through diet. Drugs have nothing to do with it.
x2...it's the amount of muscle that can be kept then drug will come into play
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I am talking about visceral fat behind the abdominal wall being the culprit in the case of distended stomachs we see on stage not inflammation nor hyperplasia of any giving organ. For example, I have seen up close someone with an inflamed liver from sclerosis and it's not in anyway a symmetrical look like you see from these guy on stage. He had an extremely lumpy look almost like a bowling ball was sticking out from under his lower rib cage.
I do agree w/ your observation that accumulation of visceral fat is the major culprit in these distended bellies.. but hyperplasia of the organs is also taking place for the GH + insulin abuser....especially when on for these many years... It may not be the outrageous dimensions/growth that many here claim.. but the cell signals are sent out for this type of cell proliferation.. this is not an opinion..And here is where the health hazards eventually surface. As I have stated before in other threads, the further breakdown and atrophy noticed in particular muscle groups seen in most aged bodybuilders.. such as an atrophied LEFT latissimus d. or even Right Tricep.. can be seen as the eventual impingement of spinal nerve roots coming out of a particular side via bone growth obstruction. this is bound to happen to most abusers .. Ever notice why there is a constant theme of an asymmetrical body part for these aging bodybuilders? The current deterioration of bodybuilding is an obvious culminated effect... The GH + Insulin must go if one wishes to see these classical v-tapers and healthier looking skin on stage..
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I do agree w/ your observation that accumulation of visceral fat is the major culprit in these distended bellies.. but hyperplasia of the organs is also taking place for the GH + insulin abuser....especially when on for these many years... It may not be the outrageous dimensions/growth that many here claim.. but the cell signals are sent out for this type of cell proliferation.. this is not an opinion..And here is where the health hazards eventually surface. As I have stated before in other threads, the further breakdown and atrophy noticed in particular muscle groups seen in most aged bodybuilders.. such as an atrophied LEFT latissimus d. or even Right Tricep.. can be seen as the eventual impingement of spinal nerve roots coming out of a particular side via bone growth obstruction. this is bound to happen to most abusers .. Ever notice why there is a constant theme of an asymmetrical body part for these aging bodybuilders? The current deterioration of bodybuilding is an obvious culminated effect... The GH + Insulin must go if one wishes to see these classical v-tapers and healthier looking skin on stage..
Can't and won't disagree as far as the effects of long tern high dose GH. In the case of Ronnie for example it would have been easy for his Dr to be able to tell if this type of bone growth has occurred by doing an MRI which I would imagine they have done maybe more than once. Although one would think that both sides would be affected almost equally in the case of bone growth. Usually when one has a slipped disk you will see only one side effected due to the disc moving in a non linear pattern meaning the disk itself would not impinge the nerve equally on both sides.
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x2...it's the amount of muscle that can be kept then drug will come into play
Not really. Lifetime Naturals don`t really lose any more or less muscle when dieting down than roiders.
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Can't and won't disagree as far as the effects of long tern high dose GH. In the case of Ronnie for example it would have been easy for his Dr to be able to tell if this type of bone growth has occurred by doing an MRI which I would imagine they have done maybe more than once. Although one would think that both sides would be affected almost equally in the case of bone growth. Usually when one has a slipped disk you will see only one side effected due to the disc moving in a non linear pattern meaning the disk itself would not impinge the nerve equally on both sides.
wasn't speaking in terms of the disk but rather the foramen(lateral portion of vertebra) where the particular spinal nerve root would exit.. this type of bone growth would not have to be symmetrical
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wasn't speaking in terms of the disk but rather the foramen(lateral portion of vertebra) where the particular spinal nerve root would exit.. this type of bone growth would not have to be symmetrical
I gotcha, so wouldn't you agree this could be seen on an MRI?
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So what exactly is the upside to using Slin?
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Not really. Lifetime Naturals don`t really lose any more or less muscle when dieting down than roiders.
lol
are you actually serious or trolling ?
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lol
are you actually serious or trolling ?
Serious. Lifetime Naturals do not lose hardly any muscle when dieting down. Plenty of studies out there to confirm this as well. Many done by Eric Helms.
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Not really. Lifetime Naturals don`t really lose any more or less muscle when dieting down than roiders.
Are Lifetime Naturals more natural than lifetime naturals?
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I have dieted down as a natty from like 20% to 12% and i garantee you i lost a lot of the little muscle i had. The strengh completly crashed too and it took me about 1,5 year to get back to my old strengh levels... So yeah cutting as a natty is disastrous. Even on gear right now im only maintaining my strengh and size not even progressing on most exercises on a strict low carb diet + a little cardio.
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The visceral fat is why I don't understand the use of insulin while dieting.
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I have dieted down as a natty from like 20% to 12% and i garantee you i lost a lot of the little muscle i had. The strengh completly crashed too and it took me about 1,5 year to get back to my old strengh levels... So yeah cutting as a natty is disastrous. Even on gear right now im only maintaining my strengh and size not even progressing on most exercises on a strict low carb diet + a little cardio.
No you didn`t. At 20 percent, your fat ass was able to lift heavier because you were a fat ass. You did not have any more muscle.
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Excellent topic, longtime since we had a serious bodybuilding related one.
On the visceral fat & insulin use, is this yet scientifically proven.?
I have thought this to be the case for some time.
Yet other sportsmen use insulin & we are not seeing the extended guts in them.
Is it the extra muscle mass that is causing it, & or the very large & varied concoction
Of steroids being used.
Clearly some combination of drugs has changed & changed the look of bodybuilders.
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Insulin and glucose metabolism are very interesting. Great observations, disgusted. Too much GH and slin abuse. Guys can't get rid of the hardcore fat stores because of impaired glucose metabolism and insulin resistance from GH abuse. They're wonderful in small doses but the synergy between them is parallel in both pros and cons. They work AMAZINGLY together, but they're also amazingly destructive if abused.
Insulin is such a strong storage hormone, you can't bulk haphazardly with it. It also promotes fat storage. People forget about this. The fat cells become brutal and hard like rock. Normal fat cells should break down with ease, but I've noticed that the last little bit of fat is amazingly stubborn. And I can imagine that if one abused insulin, it'd just compound to that issue to the point where it basically doesn't break down. Glucose metabolism is too impaired and the body doesn't/can't break down those fat stores like other subcutaneous fat stores that inflate and deflate with relative ease. That visceral fat that's been transformed is basically there to stay.
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This is the first I've heard of GH causing the atrophy seen in some bodybuilders. Danny seems to
know some things, I have no idea if this is really happening. It was put down as a result of training damage
by some Dr writing for MD.
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Insulin and glucose metabolism are very interesting. Great observations, disgusted. Too much GH and slin abuse. Guys can't get rid of the hardcore fat stores because of impaired glucose metabolism and insulin resistance from GH abuse. They're wonderful in small doses but the synergy between them is parallel in both pros and cons. They work AMAZINGLY together, but they're also amazingly destructive if abused.
Insulin is such a strong storage hormone, you can't bulk haphazardly with it. It also promotes fat storage. People forget about this. The fat cells become brutal and hard like rock. Normal fat cells should break down with ease, but I've noticed that the last little bit of fat is amazingly stubborn. And I can imagine that if one abused insulin, it'd just compound to that issue to the point where it basically doesn't break down. Glucose metabolism is too impaired and the body doesn't/can't break down those fat stores like other subcutaneous fat stores that inflate and deflate with relative ease. That visceral fat that's been transformed is basically there to stay.
pretty much when these guys quit everything including training cause going from anything remotley close to what they were to anything less is not worth a dime to them to go to gym to put in effort into.so they end up soft with most muscle gone or fat and not recognizing a once incredible build.
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I am talking about visceral fat behind the abdominal wall being the culprit in the case of distended stomachs we see on stage not inflammation nor hyperplasia of any giving organ. For example, I have seen up close someone with an inflamed liver from sclerosis and it's not in anyway a symmetrical look like you see from these guy on stage. He had an extremely lumpy look almost like a bowling ball was sticking out from under his lower rib cage.
You are half right so I will give you 4 out of ten, whats causes the gut in pro bodybuilding is insulin, the constant use of insulin increase the intra fat in the abs, A healthy person who uses insulin fucks up the insulin sensitivity in the body and the gut pushes out because of the increase intra fat, they should call it slin gut instead of gh gut LOL.
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Insulin is such a strong storage hormone, you can't bulk haphazardly with it. It also promotes fat storage. People forget about this. The fat cells become brutal and hard like rock. Normal fat cells should break down with ease, but I've noticed that the last little bit of fat is amazingly stubborn. And I can imagine that if one abused insulin, it'd just compound to that issue to the point where it basically doesn't break down. Glucose metabolism is too impaired and the body doesn't/can't break down those fat stores like other subcutaneous fat stores that inflate and deflate with relative ease. That visceral fat that's been transformed is basically there to stay.
Good stuff, Dustin
Insulin's primary purpose is regulation of blood sugar. So, the presence of Insulin in the blood signals the body to prioritize using glucose for energy and storing fat for future use.
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What do u think is adequate use for GH for a normal gym rat physique kind of person without all the crazy sides u hear?
If you have pharma seros everybody is different but start low and slowly increase. I think 2iu is plenty for a gym rat with patience, money and a connection.
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You are half right so I will give you 4 out of ten, whats causes the gut in pro bodybuilding is insulin, the constant use of insulin increase the intra fat in the abs, A healthy person who uses insulin fucks up the insulin sensitivity in the body and the gut pushes out because of the increase intra fat, they should call it slin gut instead of gh gut LOL.
So explain to me where I am only half right. BTW 4 out of ten isn't half.
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So explain to me where I am only half right. BTW 4 out of ten isn't half.
Hes just as accurate with his body stats.
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w need more topics like this on these boards,thats what bodybuilding is about it one word,knowledge and experiance
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Hes just as accurate with his body stats.
Precisely
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So explain to me where I am only half right. BTW 4 out of ten isn't half.
math not adding up, he just reworded what you stated.
I r confused.
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w need more topics like this on these boards,thats what bodybuilding is about it one word,knowledge and experiance
I concur. I'd pay money for guys like disgusted and no one to post on a more regular occasion.
Sure, a lot of this is just a rehash of things we've all discussed in the past. But it's good to go over things again, apply newly acquired experiences and observations and take another crack at the discussion. I love these kinds of discussions!
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I concur. I'd pay money for guys like disgusted and no one to post on a more regular occasion.
Sure, a lot of this is just a rehash of things we've all discussed in the past. But it's good to go over things again, apply newly acquired experiences and observations and take another crack at the discussion. I love these kinds of discussions!
AGREED.
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Through out the years we have definitely seen a change not only in the size of BBers but also the shape and conditioning too. Today it’s very common for guys to “miss their peak”. Years ago this rarely happened at the top level. Todays look has the top guys looking very big and full almost like their muscle were inflated with air. Yes we do see some striations of the muscle groups mainly the glutes and triceps. We see some good separation but long gone are the deep claw like striations that appeared in the shoulders and chest like the guys from the 70’s, 80’s and the early 90’s. They had a granite type look to them. It was a different look back then and I’m guessing that human evolution has little to do with the fact that they look so much different today. ;) Enter in GH and insulin. I’ve been around this sport for longer than I care to admit been around the heart of it all growing up near Pittsburgh which is NPC country. I’ve trained a few pros and plenty of amateurs over the last 30 years. I say this only to qualify little about what I speak of. OK so back on point and I am going to keep this briefer than what I normally would since I am on this site and don’t really know the text limit.
I’ll first talk briefly about Insulin. Insulin is an aging hormone that also promotes fat storage mainly visceral fat. Normally in in a regular person when they start dieting the first fat to go is the visceral fat or the fat that is mainly stored behind the abdominal wall. If one is using insulin this visceral fat will not go away first and will be very resistant to being used as energy The distended guts that we see so much today is actually fat behind the abdominal wall not enlarged organ growth. If an organ was that inflamed as to make the stomach stick out that far number 1 we would not see it done in such an even manner through out the ab region and number 2 I suspect this person would not live very long simply because such an enlarged organ would not function properly.
So why is it that we are seeing such unevenly distributed amounts of fat on the current guys today? Well there it is a two fold issue. We are seeing striated glutes right? These guys must be dieting hard right? Well in fact most of them are so it has to be genetics right? In a word NO! Look at it this way, when you go to the store to buy a cut of meat some cuts are leaner than others. Some cuts are very void of fat. I’m not talking about the part that the butcher trims off I am talking about the inner part that is marbleized with fat through out the entire cut. Some parts of the cow are leaner than other because of the fat receptors within the muscle itself. It’s the same in a human, certain parts of our anatomy as far as out musculature has a different density and fat receptors within.
With all the insulin that is being used today it is nearly impossible to get completely shredded. Remember earlier when I said that insulin promotes fat storage well it does and it does so in a non discriminatory way. Hence the ripped glutes striated triceps but to a lesser degree more marbilized fat storage within other muscle groups mainly in the torso area and the distended stomachs we commonly see today. So no it is not genetics that allows a person to get down to a very low level of body fat. So yes it really is easier for someone who is natural or has only used steroids to get a more striated look.
To touch upon GH breifly. At first GH does seems to help put on size and make one look better, but if you have noticed after years of long term high dose use a lot of the pros are unable to get back to their extremely lean ripped look they first had in their career. The one thing that GH will do after years of use is thicken the skin. Do I really need to say anymore on that matter? In fact that is one of the main benefits of GH as peoples skin gets thinner as they age.
One last thing about genetics. With all things being equal as far as fat levels go the part that is genetic about striations is the actual pattern of the muscle fibers themselves. Each person will have not only have a certain number of visible rows of fibers but the actual rows themselves will sometimes be more straight and this may make one appear to be more ripped or make a flexed muscle look more impressive while flexed. You see this a lot in the glute tricep and delt area. This is one of the main reasons Doug Miller looks so impressive with a low level of body fat. He was blessed not only with a pleasing muscle shape, but also good muscle fiber placement.
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