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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: andreisdaman on November 21, 2014, 09:04:07 AM
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YOu guys are killing your brains over the immigration issue.....Obama did the right thing......The people that he gave amnesty to WERE NEVER EVER GOING TO BE DEPORTED ANYWAY.....MANY OF THEM WORK..THEY HAVE CHILDREN WHO ARE ALREADY CITIZENS....THEY PAY TAXES...AND THEY ARE MOSTLY STABLE AND STAY OUT OF TROUBLE......
Why waste resources looking for them and deporting them?.....it makes no sense..better to focus on those who are a true danger.....ALSO...Obama did the right thing here because now ...ALL THOSE ILLEGALS WILL NOW HAVE TO REGISTER....NOW WE WILL KNOW WHERE THEY LIVE AND WHERE THEY WORK...whereas before they were living in the shadows and who knows where the hell they were or who they are, or what they were doing???
Finally, the big secret that Obama or no one else in giovernment wants to discuss is that THIS ACTION SAVES THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT A TON OF MONEY...it now costs an estimated $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....thats money we cvan't aford....it would bankrupt the country.....
The Republicans and conservatives were stalling on this issue....they had time to try to repeal Obamacare 40 times but did not lift a finger to work on the immigration issue EVEN WITH A MAJORITY IN CONGRESS.....and the fact of the matter is...THE REPUBLICANS HAVE DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO SECURE THE BORDERS EITHER, EVEN WHEN THEY HAVE THE PRESIDENCY, YET THEY CRITICIZE OBAMA FOR NOT DOING IT
I think the government may not want to tell us that the border is UNSECURABLE..it can't be done...even with a wall, Mexicans and other will still find a way around it...the Mexicans have been coming across this border for thousands of years.....since parts of the U.S. USED TO BE MEXICO.....they know all the tricks.....they are not gonna stop no matter what...MORE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN ARRESTED COMING ACROSS THE BORDER IN OBAMA'S PRESIDENCY THAN AT ANY TIME IN HISTORY EVEN THOUGH LESS ARE ACTUALLY COMING...and OBAMA HAS DEPORTED MORE ILLEGALS THAN ANY PRESIDENT EVER
BUT the Obama haters hate to conced any point which gives Obama credit for anything....thats the real problem.
GOOD JOB BY OBAMA
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YOu guys are killing your brains over the immigration issue.....Obama did the right thing......The people that he gave amnesty to WERE NEVER EVER GOING TO BE DEPORTED ANYWAY.....MANY OF THEM WORK..THEY HAVE CHILDREN WHO ARE ALREADY CITIZENS....THEY PAY TAXES...AND THEY ARE MOSTLY STABLE AND STAY OUT OF TROUBLE......
Why waste resources looking for them and deporting them?.....it makes no sense..better to focus on those who are a true danger.....ALSO...Obama did the right thing here because now ...ALL THOSE ILLEGALS WILL NOW HAVE TO REGISTER....NOW WE WILL KNOW WHERE THEY LIVE AND WHERE THEY WORK...whereas before they were living in the shadows and who knows where the hell they were or who they are, or what they were doing???
Finally, the big secret that Obama or no one else in giovernment wants to discuss is that THIS ACTION SAVES THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT A TON OF MONEY...it now costs an estimated $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....thats money we cvan't aford....it would bankrupt the country.....
The Republicans and conservatives were stalling on this issue....they had time to try to repeal Obamacare 40 times but did not lift a finger to work on the immigration issue EVEN WITH A MAJORITY IN CONGRESS.....and the fact of the matter is...THE REPUBLICANS HAVE DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO SECURE THE BORDERS EITHER, EVEN WHEN THEY HAVE THE PRESIDENCY, YET THEY CRITICIZE OBAMA FOR NOT DOING IT
I think the government may not want to tell us that the border is UNSECURABLE..it can't be done...even with a wall, Mexicans and other will still find a way around it...the Mexicans have been coming across this border for thousands of years.....since parts of the U.S. USED TO BE MEXICO.....they know all the tricks.....they are not gonna stop no matter what...MORE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN ARRESTED COMING ACROSS THE BORDER IN OBAMA'S PRESIDENCY THAN AT ANY TIME IN HISTORY EVEN THOUGH LESS ARE ACTUALLY COMING...and OBAMA HAS DEPORTED MORE ILLEGALS THAN ANY PRESIDENT EVER
BUT the Obama haters hate to conced any point which gives Obama credit for anything....thats the real problem.
GOOD JOB BY OBAMA
Shut the f.u.c.k up moron. You have no idea what this terrorist has caused. Seriously, just stfu.
Here's more of his destruction. But what do you care, he's black and thats all that matters, right?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2556502
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Obama could put you back in chains and sent back to Africa and you would love it
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Shut the f.u.c.k up moron. You have no idea what this terrorist has caused. Seriously, just stfu.
Here's more of his destruction. But what do you care, he's black and thats all that matters, right?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2556502
STFU is about what I expect from you and your feeble mind.......I know that intellectualism is too tough for you to handle
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They dont pay income taxes. Most work low wage jobs and they wouldn't be paying any income taxes even if there was a paper trail. They pay sales taxes but their children are also eligible for entitlement programs canceling out any tax they pay. Immigration doesn't work in a welfare state especially a welfare state with birthright citizenship.
In 2009 (based on data collected in 2010), 57 percent of households headed by an immigrant (legal and illegal) with children (under 18) used at least one welfare program, compared to 39 percent for native households with children.
Immigrant households’ use of welfare tends to be much higher than natives for food assistance programs and Medicaid. Their use of cash and housing programs tends to be similar to native households.
A large share of the welfare used by immigrant households with children is received on behalf of their U.S.-born children, who are American citizens. But even households with children comprised entirely of immigrants (no U.S.-born children) still had a welfare use rate of 56 percent in 2009.
Immigrant households with children used welfare programs at consistently higher rates than natives, even before the current recession. In 2001, 50 percent of all immigrant households with children used at least one welfare program, compared to 32 percent for natives.
Households with children with the highest welfare use rates are those headed by immigrants from the Dominican Republic (82 percent), Mexico and Guatemala (75 percent), and Ecuador (70 percent). Those with the lowest use rates are from the United Kingdom (7 percent), India (19 percent), Canada (23 percent), and Korea (25 percent).
The states where immigrant households with children have the highest welfare use rates are Arizona (62 percent); Texas, California, and New York (61 percent); Pennsylvania (59 percent); Minnesota and Oregon (56 percent); and Colorado (55 percent).
We estimate that 52 percent of households with children headed by legal immigrants used at least one welfare program in 2009, compared to 71 percent for illegal immigrant households with children. Illegal immigrants generally receive benefits on behalf of their U.S.-born children.
Illegal immigrant households with children primarily use food assistance and Medicaid, making almost no use of cash or housing assistance. In contrast, legal immigrant households tend to have relatively high use rates for every type of program.
High welfare use by immigrant-headed households with children is partly explained by the low education level of many immigrants. Of households headed by an immigrant who has not graduated high school, 80 percent access the welfare system, compared to 25 percent for those headed by an immigrant who has at least a bachelor’s degree.
An unwillingness to work is not the reason immigrant welfare use is high. The vast majority (95 percent) of immigrant households with children had at least one worker in 2009. But their low education levels mean that more than half of these working immigrant households with children still accessed the welfare system during 2009.
If we exclude the primary refugee-sending countries, the share of immigrant households with children using at least one welfare program is still 57 percent.
Welfare use tends to be high for both new arrivals and established residents. In 2009, 60 percent of households with children headed by an immigrant who arrived in 2000 or later used at least one welfare program; for households headed by immigrants who arrived before 2000 it was 55 percent.
For all households (those with and without children), the use rates were 37 percent for households headed by immigrants and 22 percent for those headed by natives.
Although most new legal immigrants are barred from using some welfare for the first five years, this provision has only a modest impact on household use rates because most immigrants have been in the United States for longer than five years; the ban only applies to some programs; some states provide welfare to new immigrants with their own money; by becoming citizens immigrants become eligible for all welfare programs; and perhaps most importantly, the U.S.-born children of immigrants (including those born to illegal immigrants) are automatically awarded American citizenship and are therefore eligible for all welfare programs at birth.
The eight major welfare programs examined in this report are SSI (Supplemental Security Income for low income elderly and disabled), TANF (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families), WIC (Women, Infants, and Children food program), free/reduced school lunch, food stamps (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program), Medicaid (health insurance for those with low incomes), public housing, and rent subsidies.
http://cis.org/immigrant-welfare-use-2011
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STFU is about what I expect from you and your feeble mind.......I know that intellectualism is too tough for you to handle
Blacks are the ones hurt most by illegals and you applaud this only cause its Obama - shame on you lemming
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Obama could put you back in chains and sent back to Africa and you would love it
He already has your mind in chains
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Blacks are the ones hurt most by illegals and you applaud this only cause its Obama - shame on you lemming
That's a fact right there. UE among blacks is something like 14-15%. Andre is so naive he doesn't realize that Obama screwed the black community over BIG TIME.
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They dont pay income taxes. Most work low wage jobs and they wouldn't be paying any income taxes even if there was a paper trail. They pay sales taxes but their children are also eligible for entitlement programs canceling out any tax they pay. Immigration doesn't work in a welfare state especially a welfare state with birthright citizenship.
In 2009 (based on data collected in 2010), 57 percent of households headed by an immigrant (legal and illegal) with children (under 18) used at least one welfare program, compared to 39 percent for native households with children.
Immigrant households’ use of welfare tends to be much higher than natives for food assistance programs and Medicaid. Their use of cash and housing programs tends to be similar to native households.
A large share of the welfare used by immigrant households with children is received on behalf of their U.S.-born children, who are American citizens. But even households with children comprised entirely of immigrants (no U.S.-born children) still had a welfare use rate of 56 percent in 2009.
Immigrant households with children used welfare programs at consistently higher rates than natives, even before the current recession. In 2001, 50 percent of all immigrant households with children used at least one welfare program, compared to 32 percent for natives.
Households with children with the highest welfare use rates are those headed by immigrants from the Dominican Republic (82 percent), Mexico and Guatemala (75 percent), and Ecuador (70 percent). Those with the lowest use rates are from the United Kingdom (7 percent), India (19 percent), Canada (23 percent), and Korea (25 percent).
The states where immigrant households with children have the highest welfare use rates are Arizona (62 percent); Texas, California, and New York (61 percent); Pennsylvania (59 percent); Minnesota and Oregon (56 percent); and Colorado (55 percent).
We estimate that 52 percent of households with children headed by legal immigrants used at least one welfare program in 2009, compared to 71 percent for illegal immigrant households with children. Illegal immigrants generally receive benefits on behalf of their U.S.-born children.
Illegal immigrant households with children primarily use food assistance and Medicaid, making almost no use of cash or housing assistance. In contrast, legal immigrant households tend to have relatively high use rates for every type of program.
High welfare use by immigrant-headed households with children is partly explained by the low education level of many immigrants. Of households headed by an immigrant who has not graduated high school, 80 percent access the welfare system, compared to 25 percent for those headed by an immigrant who has at least a bachelor’s degree.
An unwillingness to work is not the reason immigrant welfare use is high. The vast majority (95 percent) of immigrant households with children had at least one worker in 2009. But their low education levels mean that more than half of these working immigrant households with children still accessed the welfare system during 2009.
If we exclude the primary refugee-sending countries, the share of immigrant households with children using at least one welfare program is still 57 percent.
Welfare use tends to be high for both new arrivals and established residents. In 2009, 60 percent of households with children headed by an immigrant who arrived in 2000 or later used at least one welfare program; for households headed by immigrants who arrived before 2000 it was 55 percent.
For all households (those with and without children), the use rates were 37 percent for households headed by immigrants and 22 percent for those headed by natives.
Although most new legal immigrants are barred from using some welfare for the first five years, this provision has only a modest impact on household use rates because most immigrants have been in the United States for longer than five years; the ban only applies to some programs; some states provide welfare to new immigrants with their own money; by becoming citizens immigrants become eligible for all welfare programs; and perhaps most importantly, the U.S.-born children of immigrants (including those born to illegal immigrants) are automatically awarded American citizenship and are therefore eligible for all welfare programs at birth.
The eight major welfare programs examined in this report are SSI (Supplemental Security Income for low income elderly and disabled), TANF (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families), WIC (Women, Infants, and Children food program), free/reduced school lunch, food stamps (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program), Medicaid (health insurance for those with low incomes), public housing, and rent subsidies.
http://cis.org/immigrant-welfare-use-2011
even with low wage jobs they still pay taxes...if they are not paying taxes then its because they are working off the books..which is illegal and actually their having a job period is supposed to be illegal...however the Conservatives don't want that law enforced against businesses.....if that law was enforced the way its supposed to be, THERE WOULD PRACTICALLY BE NO MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...... I do concede your point that some illegals and their children get some benefits such as medicaid and food stamps but stats consistently show that its still a win for the U.S, in terms of the money/taxes illegals pay out as opposed to the services they get....
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That's a fact right there. UE among blacks is something like 14-15%. Andre is so naive he doesn't realize that Obama screwed the black community over BIG TIME.
its really odd that you and 333386 always resort to race-based arguments instead of debating on the merits.... ???.....The jobs that illegals take are jobs that blacks nor anyone else tend to not want anyway
STOP DEFLECTING
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even with low wage jobs they still pay taxes...if they are not paying taxes then its because they are working off the books..which is illegal and actually their having a job period is supposed to be illegal...however the Conservatives don't want that law enforced against businesses.....if that law was enforced the way its supposed to be, THERE WOULD PRACTICALLY BE NO MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...... I do concede your point that some illegals and their children get some benefits such as medicaid and food stamps but stats consistently show that its still a win for the U.S, in terms of the money/taxes illegals pay out as opposed to the services they get....
They aren't paying income taxes because they are off the books. Yes it's illegal but so is their very presence in the country. As long as birthright citizenship continues illegal immigration will be a problem. Before the great society if you couldn't make it in he United States you returned to your country of origin. The welfare state provides an incentive for illegals to stay. If they do work they get income tax free money and child care is subsidized. Plumb deal for sure.
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even with low wage jobs they still pay taxes...if they are not paying taxes then its because they are working off the books..which is illegal and actually their having a job period is supposed to be illegal...however the Conservatives don't want that law enforced against businesses.....if that law was enforced the way its supposed to be, THERE WOULD PRACTICALLY BE NO MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...... I do concede your point that some illegals and their children get some benefits such as medicaid and food stamps but stats consistently show that its still a win for the U.S, in terms of the money/taxes illegals pay out as opposed to the services they get....
Some will get benefits? Are you kidding? 5mil and I would bet more than 60-70% are on some kind of assistance. We're already paying for literal resorts that were especially built for them. Why don't you go cross any boarder in the world with out a visa and see what happens. As of right now, crime rates will skyrocket, communicable disease will increase, etc...shit, I don't know where to start.
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They aren't paying income taxes because they are off the books. Yes it's illegal but so is their very presence in the country. As long as birthright citizenship continues illegal immigration will be a problem. Before the great society if you couldn't make it in he United States you returned to your country of origin. The welfare state provides an incentive for illegals to stay. If they do work they get income tax free money and child care is subsidized. Plumb deal for sure.
Well I do think that as an illegal your child should not have birthright status.....I do agree that some illegals are using this to thier advantage.......but the law can't be changed because its a constitutional amendment....and no way are they gonna repeal it
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Well I do think that as an illegal your child should not have birthright status.....I do agree that some illegals are using this to thier advantage.......but the law can't be changed because its a constitutional amendment....and no way are they gonna repeal it
I feel bad for you bro - sad what you have become
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Obama could put you back in chains and sent back to Africa and you would love it
LMFAO
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They aren't paying income taxes because they are off the books. Yes it's illegal but so is their very presence in the country. As long as birthright citizenship continues illegal immigration will be a problem. Before the great society if you couldn't make it in he United States you returned to your country of origin. The welfare state provides an incentive for illegals to stay. If they do work they get income tax free money and child care is subsidized. Plumb deal for sure.
Exactly.
andreisdawoman is an anti american traitor same as his beloved messiah.
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Some will get benefits? Are you kidding? 5mil and I would bet more than 60-70% are on some kind of assistance. We're already paying for literal resorts that were especially built for them. Why don't you go cross any boarder in the world with out a visa and see what happens. As of right now, crime rates will skyrocket, communicable disease will increase, etc...shit, I don't know where to start.
I agree with some of what you say in terms of the cost of housing illegals and their use of medicaid and stuff like that......but again, the people who Obama is talking about are people we pass in the street everyday who have kids in school, are working, and stay out of trouble....the immigration serves are not gona find and deport them anyway......better to focus resources on the ones who cause mayhem
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I feel bad for you bro - sad what you have become
I was just thinking the same about you....before Obama was elected you actually had some good points and you and I mostly agreed on most topics.....unfortunately after his election you lost your mind......a pity
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Well I do think that as an illegal your child should not have birthright status.....I do agree that some illegals are using this to thier advantage.......but the law can't be changed because its a constitutional amendment....and no way are they gonna repeal it
You're right, birthright citizenship is not likely to be repealed. I think its important to find a way to curb mass immigration. It's not even a racial thing. If they were all potato eaters from Ireland I would feel the same way. We just don't need a large influx of immigrants especially immigrants who will ultimately be dependent on government services. It's just not wise business.
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I was just thinking the same about you....before Obama was elected you actually had some good points and you and I mostly agreed on most topics.....unfortunately after his election you lost your mind......a pity
Imam Obama Ayatollah el Baracki has been a disaster for this nation
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Unfortunately, there are a lot of people andre all around the country who could care less about those pesky little things like the Constitution, separation of powers, integrity, the law, etc. That is precisely why someone like Obama can do what he just did. His people will just line up like good little sheep. It's like he put a voodoo spell on them or something. And he also knows the media will give him cover.
We are so screwed.
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Unfortunately, there are a lot of people andre all around the country who could care less about those pesky little things like the Constitution, separation of powers, integrity, the law, etc. That is precisely why someone like Obama can do what he just did. His people will just line up like good little sheep. It's like he put a voodoo spell on them or something. And he also knows the media will give him cover.
We are so screwed.
Still think your friends are so smart bro? ;)
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Exactly.
andreisdawoman is an anti american traitor same as his beloved messiah.
Not anti american at all....I served in the army.....why would I want the nation to be torn down???....but we are broke as a country...17 to 18 trillion in debt...we have to use resources wisely.....and going after a bunch of people who are by and large not breaking the law or causing havoc is just a waste of money at this point and expensive...and don't let the republicans fol you....they have no answer either for this problem...all they do is ignore it and stick their head in the sand and talk about securing the borders...which is fine but what about those already here?...Obama is dealing with the reality as it is...not as we want it to be
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People who don't work and don't pay taxes could care less about the damage being done, to them its all about keeping the Dems in power, so they can keep their obamaphone, and have someone else pay the tab.
An exhaustive study by the Heritage Foundation has found that after amnesty, current unlawful immigrants would receive $9.4 trillion in government benefits and services and pay more than $3 trillion in taxes over their lifetimes. That leaves a net fiscal deficit (benefits minus taxes) of $6.3 trillion. That deficit would have to be financed by increasing the government debt or raising taxes on U.S. citizens.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/amnesty-for-illegal-immigrants-will-cost-america/2013/05/06/e5d19afc-b661-11e2-b94c-b684dda07add_story.html
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Still think your friends are so smart bro? ;)
Of course. Delusional and sometimes irrational when it comes to politics, but definitely smart.
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You're right, birthright citizenship is not likely to be repealed. I think its important to find a way to curb mass immigration. It's not even a racial thing. If they were all potato eaters from Ireland I would feel the same way. We just don't need a large influx of immigrants especially immigrants who will ultimately be dependent on government services. It's just not wise business.
I do agree we should maybe rethink large scale immigration...just like Europe is doing...but the fact of the matter is that immigrants...even illegals, make up a very small percentage of our population....unlike in Europe where the problem is much much worse...ibut itseems that no one in government has the wil to truly do anything about it...thus leading up to this action by Obama
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Imam Obama Ayatollah el Baracki has been a disaster for this nation
in what way exactly???....after his executive order, the nation is still standing...life goes on..we also thought gay marriage would be the end of civilization as we know it.....nope....and we also assumed legalization of marijuana would lead to the downfall of the nation....no again....people just fear the unknown
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Unfortunately, there are a lot of people andre all around the country who could care less about those pesky little things like the Constitution, separation of powers, integrity, the law, etc. That is precisely why someone like Obama can do what he just did. His people will just line up like good little sheep. It's like he put a voodoo spell on them or something. And he also knows the media will give him cover.
We are so screwed.
what Obama did was within his constitutional powers.....ther has been no movement on this issue sionce Obama has been president...because the Republicans keep delaying action on this issue....besides....Rona ld Reragan AND George Herbert Walker Bush did the same thing...legalized millions of illegals.....did that destroy the country??????...it's people's irrational hatred of Obama that is destroying the country
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in what way exactly???....
By you asking this question shows you are left wing idiot.
THERE IS NOT A SINGLE DAMN THING THAT OBAMATHECLOWN HAS DONE THAT HAS BEEN OF BENEFIT TO THE CITIZENS OF THE USA. NOT A SINGLE ONE!!!!!!!!!!
He will go down in history as the WORST PRESIDENT EVER.
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By you asking this question shows you are left wing idiot.
THERE IS NOT A SINGLE DAMN THING THAT OBAMATHECLOWN HAS DONE THAT HAS BEEN OF BENEFIT TO THE CITIZENS OF THE USA. NOT A SINGLE ONE!!!!!!!!!!
He will go down in history as the WORST PRESIDENT EVER.
WOW...talk about a lack of critical thinking skills...but..carry on!
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WOW...talk about a lack of critical thinking skills...but..carry on!
You should be the last one to talk about "lack of critical thinking skills" since you don't have 2 brain cells to rub together. My dog licks his balls and I bet he is still more intelligent than you.
Blacks were better off under Bush and yet you come on here celebrating an immigration move that will set black people even further. You sure are smart, sonny. You sure are smart. Yes, sah.
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You should be the last one to talk about "lack of critical thinking skills" since you don't have 2 brain cells to rub together. My dog licks his balls and I bet he is still more intelligent than you.
Blacks were better off under Bush and yet you come on here celebrating an immigration move that will set black people even further. You sure are smart, sonny. You sure are smart. Yes, sah.
contraqry to what you may think I don't look at things in terms of what will be good for blacks..I look at whats good for America...its really weird when guys like you who criticize blacks all day long start talking about whats good for blacks..as for the ball-licking comment....par for the course for you
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what Obama did was within his constitutional powers.....ther has been no movement on this issue sionce Obama has been president...because the Republicans keep delaying action on this issue....besides....Rona ld Reragan AND George Herbert Walker Bush did the same thing...legalized millions of illegals.....did that destroy the country??????...it's people's irrational hatred of Obama that is destroying the country
President Obama disagrees with you:
“America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the President, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job. But I can advocate for changes in the law so that we have a country that is both respectful of the law but also continues to be a great nation of immigrants. … With respect to the notion that I can just suspend deportations through executive order, that’s just not the case, because there are laws on the books that Congress has passed …. [W]e’ve got three branches of government. Congress passes the law. The executive branch’s job is to enforce and implement those laws. And then the judiciary has to interpret the laws. There are enough laws on the books by Congress that are very clear in terms of how we have to enforce our immigration system that for me to simply through executive order ignore those congressional mandates would not conform with my appropriate role as President.” (3/28/11)
And no, he didn't do what prior presidents have done. Prior presidents were trying to carry out the intent of laws passed by Congress. Obama is suspending deportations and effectively granting citizenship to illegal aliens. That is not what Congress intended.
This is a gross abuse of power.
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22 Times President Obama Said He Couldn’t Ignore or Create His Own Immigration Law -
http://www.speaker.gov/general/22-times-president-obama-said-he-couldn-t-ignore-or-create-his-own-immigration-law#sthash.tIuYTgXA.dpuf
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even with low wage jobs they still pay taxes...if they are not paying taxes then its because they are working off the books..which is illegal and actually their having a job period is supposed to be illegal...however the Conservatives don't want that law enforced against businesses.....if that law was enforced the way its supposed to be, THERE WOULD PRACTICALLY BE NO MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...... I do concede your point that some illegals and their children get some benefits such as medicaid and food stamps but stats consistently show that its still a win for the U.S, in terms of the money/taxes illegals pay out as opposed to the services they get....
low income workers like the majority of immigrants get more back in tax returns then they pay in income tax.
ARE YOU THAT FUCKING DUMB?
they are a net drag on the entitlement system....
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There is no way to enforce Obama's amnesty plan. The bureaucracy needed to process millions of illegals will be immense and expensive. Obama is really pushing the problem off for three years. What's going to happen to the illegals after three years have passed? Any illegal with a criminal record won't come forward but will remain in the country. The whole plan is a mess that is unenforceable.
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^^^
The entitlement systeme that already makes up more than 70% of the federal budget and skyrocketing.....
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There is no way to enforce Obama's amnesty plan. The bureaucracy needed to process millions of illegals will be immense and expensive. Obama is really pushing the problem off for three years. What's going to happen to the illegals after three years have passed? Any illegal with a criminal record won't come forward but will remain in the country. The whole plan is a mess that is unenforceable.
yup, how do you verify someone has been in the country for 5+ years?
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yup, how do you verify someone has been in the country for 5+ years?
You can't. The ridiculousness of it all is that Obama said he had to act because the Republicans didn't provide a comprehensive immigration reform plan. Obama's plan is neither comprehensive or expedient. The plan doesn't begin to take effect for months. He could have easily waited.
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contraqry to what you may think I don't look at things in terms of what will be good for blacks..I look at whats good for America...its really weird when guys like you who criticize blacks all day long start talking about whats good for blacks..as for the ball-licking comment....par for the course for you
How exactly does giving amnesty to 5 million uneducated, non English speakers good for America? Hell from your line of thinking I should be able to rob a bank, and if I can avoid capture for 5 years, I should get to keep the money and a pat on the back for job well done.
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low income workers like the majority of immigrants get more back in tax returns then they pay in income tax.
ARE YOU THAT FUCKING DUMB?
they are a net drag on the entitlement system....
Yes, he and millions like him actually are that dumb
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/09/16/undocumented-la-county-parents-projected-to-receive-650m-in-welfare-benefits/
Anchor babies cost LA county taxpayers ALONE nearly 2 billion a year. That's one county, a total net cost.
now the parents will be able to claim back EITC and other benefits beyond what the Anchors brought in for them
And also, now they can petition to bring the rest of their family across the border to join them
the tiny amount of SS contributions from $7 an hour picking fruit is not going to really shore up our welfare funds ::)
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Not anti american at all....I served in the army.....why would I want the nation to be torn down???....but we are broke as a country...17 to 18 trillion in debt...we have to use resources wisely.....and going after a bunch of people who are by and large not breaking the law or causing havoc is just a waste of money at this point and expensive...and don't let the republicans fol you....they have no answer either for this problem...all they do is ignore it and stick their head in the sand and talk about securing the borders...which is fine but what about those already here?...Obama is dealing with the reality as it is...not as we want it to be
Hey, don't worry about the 'being broke' thing. Where do you think money comes from anyway? It's not a finite resource all the way from the moons of Saturn. It's created out of nothing and it will keep on being created or taken a way as purpose sees fit. Be 100 trillion in the debt. That 100 trillion weren't real to start with. Nothing will happen. Stop worrying about The Debt and start worrying about your own life.
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Even assuming amnesty is the correct way to go, any policy that does not start with "build a wall" is destined to keep repeating itself and thus it is a stupid policy that will not solve anything.
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There is no way to enforce Obama's amnesty plan. The bureaucracy needed to process millions of illegals will be immense and expensive. Obama is really pushing the problem off for three years. What's going to happen to the illegals after three years have passed? Any illegal with a criminal record won't come forward but will remain in the country. The whole plan is a mess that is unenforceable.
It was already unenforceable anyway....they have already had de-facto amnesty since no one was pursuing them anyway....many of them have been in the country 10 years already
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How exactly does giving amnesty to 5 million uneducated, non English speakers good for America? Hell from your line of thinking I should be able to rob a bank, and if I can avoid capture for 5 years, I should get to keep the money and a pat on the back for job well done.
They are not non-English speakers as you call them...the vast majority speak English....and they have been here a long time....no one was going to deport them anyway....you're getting emotional for nothing
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They are not non-English speakers as you call them...the vast majority speak English....and they have been here a long time....no one was going to deport them anyway....you're getting emotional for nothing
How am I getting emotional? Since the .gov is not going to enforce the laws already on the books, we need immigration reform? Since congress hasn't done what POTUS wants, he is going to just issue an EO? What difference does it make that "they" have been here a long time? Rewarding people for breaking the laws of the Untied States from the moment they set foot in America is fucking stupid. You seem to forget all the immigrants that follow the law and get their citizenship in a legal manner, what about them? Should .gov refund all the money they have had to spend? No one has the "right" to cross the border and take up residence in this country illegally.
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How am I getting emotional? Since the .gov is not going to enforce the laws already on the books, we need immigration reform? Since congress hasn't done what POTUS wants, he is going to just issue an EO? What difference does it make that "they" have been here a long time? Rewarding people for breaking the laws of the Untied States from the moment they set foot in America is fucking stupid. You seem to forget all the immigrants that follow the law and get their citizenship in a legal manner, what about them? Should .gov refund all the money they have had to spend? No one has the "right" to cross the border and take up residence in this country illegally.
again..these people were not going to get deported anyway...Obama simply put them on the bottom of the list....A good thing I think...why waste time and money deporting people who by and large are working, paying taxes and not getting into trouble?????...it just makes our immigration courts even more inefficient than they are now
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again..these people were not going to get deported anyway...Obama simply put them on the bottom of the list....A good thing I think...why waste time and money deporting people who by and large are working, paying taxes and not getting into trouble?????...it just makes our immigration courts even more inefficient than they are now
what taxes are they paying andre?
how much in entitlements are they using?
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again..these people were not going to get deported anyway...Obama simply put them on the bottom of the list....A good thing I think...why waste time and money deporting people who by and large are working, paying taxes and not getting into trouble?????...it just makes our immigration courts even more inefficient than they are now
if they are not getting tossed out on their cucaracha like they deserve too - than what is the point of o-faggets plan?
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again..these people were not going to get deported anyway...Obama simply put them on the bottom of the list....A good thing I think...why waste time and money deporting people who by and large are working, paying taxes and not getting into trouble?????...it just makes our immigration courts even more inefficient than they are now
So basically you are surrendering to .gov not doing their job by not enforcing the laws? Brilliant, a few more like you and we can have a king, since there is nothing we can do anyway ::)
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It was already unenforceable anyway....they have already had de-facto amnesty since no one was pursuing them anyway....many of them have been in the country 10 years already
It is enforceable when you actually attempt to enforce the law. I don't care if they were in the country for ten years or not dump them over the border and let them apply to legally reenter the country. Fine the shit out of their kids until they comply. The kids are harboring fugitives after all.
Obamas plan is not enforceable, its not comprehensive , its not effective and its not expedient. He's passing the buck three years down the line. His actions are completely unnecessary and do nothing to solve the problem of illegal immigration.
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Obama: "Absolutely Not" Legitimate For Future Presidents To Use Executive Actions For Taxes
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GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, THIS WEEK: How do you respond to the argument, a future president comes in, wants lower taxes. Doesn’t happen. Congress won’t do it – he says I’m not going to prosecute those who don’t pay capital gains tax.
PRESIDENTOBAMA: Well, the truth of the matter is, George, that the reason that we have to do prosecutorial discretion in immigration is that we know we are not even close to being able to deal with the folks who have been here a long time. The vast majority of folks understand that they need to pay taxes, and when we conduct an audit, for example, we are selecting those folks who are most likely to be cheating. We’re not going after millions and millions of people who everybody knows are here and were taking advantage of low wages as they’re mowing lawns or cleaning out bedpans, and looking the other way – but then you got politicians suddenly going out there saying, suggesting somehow that we should be deporting all of them. Everybody knows, including Republicans, that we’re not going to deport 11 million people.
STEPHANOPOULOS: So you don’t think it’d be legitimate for a future president to make that argument?
OBAMA: With respect to taxes? Absolutely not. But what is true – what is true today is we don’t audit every single person, but we still expect that people are going to go ahead and follow the law. And we have limited resources, we have to make sure that we prioritize those folks who are most dangerous and we should acknowledge what everybody has already acknowledged through their actions – and Congress acknowledges through their budget – which is we’re not in the business of deporting millions of people or breaking up families.
::)
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Precedents and ‘Prosecutorial Discretion’: Questions Defenders of Obama's EO Must Answer
National Review ^ | 11/24/2014 | Jan Ting
Posted on 11/24/2014 8:34:46 AM by SeekAndFind
The president’s announcement last week of his executive order on immigration was fine rhetorically but entirely wrong on the facts.
He repeated, for instance, his often-expressed statement that “everyone” agrees that our immigration system is broken. That statement is untrue, because I, for one, do not know or believe that our immigration system is broken. We have the most generous legal-immigration system in the world. Each year it admits more legal permanent-resident immigrants with a clear path to full citizenship than all the rest of the world’s nations combined. We have an immigration system that’s worthy of our nation of immigrants.
What’s broken is the willingness of some Americans, especially politicians, to choose between admitting all who want to come here — which would be an immigration system with no limits — or, alternatively, enforcing a limit on how many immigrants we accept each year. If we make the latter choice, we have to turn away people, not because they’re bad people, but because admitting them would violate the limit we’ve set. And if they come anyway in violation of this limit, we have to try to deport them to enforce the limit.
That’s a binary choice: no limit at all or an enforced limit. And it’s a hard choice for many Americans, especially politicians. They can’t choose no limit, because that would be unpopular. But they also don’t want to turn away or deport any hard-working people who remind us of our own immigrant ancestors.
Faced with this quandary, President Obama and his supporters are serving up a third choice and couching it as “immigration reform,” which consists of keeping the limit on immigration on the books but not enforcing it. And when we end up with a large number of illegal immigrants, we’ll give them all amnesty. This solution might seem clever, but it’s a formula for more illegal immigration and permanent dysfunction.
How can you tell that a politician has no real policy to address the growing problem of illegal immigration? When all he talks about is maintaining border security and deporting criminals. Who’s not for that? That’s like being for motherhood and apple pie. But border security will never work by itself without policies that deter attempts to enter, such as interior enforcement, given that half or more of illegal immigrants enter legally and simply overstay their temporary visas or entry authorizations.
Critics of Obama’s unilateral executive orders say that it’s unconstitutional for the president to grant work authorization to 5 million illegal immigrants. The administration has countered by insisting that previous presidents have exercised similar power from the White House.
I contend that all the earlier precedents are quite different from President Obama’s orders. “Prosecutorial discretion” — the justification Obama is using for his orders — granted to a single beneficiary or a few beneficiaries based on the particular and unusual facts of individual cases is substantively different from a sweeping rule that changes the legal status of 5 million beneficiaries in one fell swoop.
Previous presidents have indeed exercised prosecutorial discretion in favor of groups of illegal aliens and awarded them employment authorization. But most of those cases involved the exercise of presidential authority over foreign policy, an area where the president’s power has been recognized to be substantial.
The precedent most frequently cited by those who defend Obama’s executive immigration order is a ruling on immigration by President George H. W. Bush in 1990. In this, Bush exercised prosecutorial discretion in favor of a large number of spouses and minor children of immigrants who had benefited from the immigration amnesty enacted by Congress four years earlier, in 1986. President Bush, unlike Obama, was working out the implementation of an amnesty statute already enacted by Congress. Having worked in the first Bush administration, I recall that the administration was in the middle of negotiations with Congress over what became the Immigration Act of 1990, which ratified the administration’s earlier action by creating visas for the spouses and minor children.
We might look to another precedent that applies to Obama’s executive action. In the 1952 Supreme Court decision in Youngstown Sheet & Tube v. Sawyer, known as the Steel Seizure Case, the Court ruled that President Truman did not have the authority on his own to seize a steel factory during the Korean War. Truman wished to avert a threatened work stoppage, but the Court held that he lacked constitutional authority to seize the business. Justice Jackson said in his opinion that the president’s authority is at its greatest when he acts with the express or implied consent of Congress, and it is at its lowest ebb when he acts in defiance of congressional enactments. Truman’s attempted seizure, like Obama’s action on immigration today, lacked congressional support.
Finally, I want to suggest some questions we should be asking of the Obama administration and its supporters.
First, let’s look at American workers. What is the impact of an executive order that adds 5 million or so additional workers to the labor market in America? How does that affect the job prospects of the 9 million unemployed Americans (of whom 2.9 million are long-term unemployed) and the 7 million involuntary part-time workers who want but can’t find full-time work? How does the addition of 5 million workers affect the future prospects for the 46 million Americans, almost one in six, who are receiving food stamps? And how will giving 5 million immigrants work authorization affect the groups with the highest unemployment rates? The official unemployment rate is now 5.8 percent, still high but coming down, but it’s 10.9 percent for African Americans, 18.6 percent for American teenagers, and 32.6 percent for African-American teenagers.
The American economy is growing by adding mainly part-time jobs. Wages remain stagnant, and even employed Americans feel job insecurity. President Obama says that rising income inequality is tearing at the social fabric of America. Indeed, even while wages stagnate, corporate profits are up and the stock market is hitting new record highs seemingly every week. Does adding 5 million more immigrant workers to the legal work force increase or decrease economic inequality?
Second, let’s consider the millions of people abroad who might be considering illegal immigration to the U.S. How does Obama’s granting of work authorization to 5 million illegal immigrants affect them? The poor people of the world may be poor, but they are not stupid. They are as capable as anyone else of using cost-benefit analysis to determine what is in their self-interest. If we want to deter them from illegally immigrating to the U.S., we should raise the costs of doing so — through more enforcement — and we should reduce the benefits. Conversely, if we want to encourage more illegal immigration, we should lower the costs through less enforcement and increase the benefits by providing work authorization — exactly as President Obama has just done in his executive order.
Third, we should ask, What is the impact of Obama’s executive order on qualified legal immigrants to the U.S.? Some of these recently arrived legal immigrants must now compete for jobs with the newly work-authorized 5 million. And what of the hundreds of thousands of qualified immigrants still waiting outside the U.S. for their chance to immigrate legally? The number of immigrant visas available each year is limited — some immigrants eager to come here legally have been waiting outside the U.S. for a visa for more than 20 years. How do they feel when they see that those who entered illegally as recently as five years ago are now rewarded with work authorization and prosecutorial discretion? Does the executive order make them feel like fools for respecting American law instead of violating it?
Finally, as the 2016 presidential-election cycle gets under way, we must ask every candidate to clarify his position on Obama’s executive order. If the Democrats nominate a candidate who supports and pledges to extend and expand the executive order, and if the Republicans nominate someone who pledges to revoke the executive order on the first day of his administration, the American people may have the unprecedented opportunity to vote directly on what our immigration policy ought to be.
— Jan C. Ting is a professor of law at Temple University Beasley School of Law in Philadelphia, where he teaches Citizenship and Immigration Law. He served as Assistant Commissioner of the Immigration and Naturalization Service of the U.S. Department of Justice during the administration of President George H. W. Bush.
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It is enforceable when you actually attempt to enforce the law. I don't care if they were in the country for ten years or not dump them over the border and let them apply to legally reenter the country. Fine the shit out of their kids until they comply. The kids are harboring fugitives after all.
Obamas plan is not enforceable, its not comprehensive , its not effective and its not expedient. He's passing the buck three years down the line. His actions are completely unnecessary and do nothing to solve the problem of illegal immigration.
again....NO PRESIDENT has tried to enforce immigration law.....This is done on purpose because our past presidents have bowed to mexican pressure not to enforce...but actually Obama has the best record of enforcement than any other president in terms of actually kicking people out of the country....but of course we conveniently skirt over that point in order to demonize Obama
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So basically you are surrendering to .gov not doing their job by not enforcing the laws? Brilliant, a few more like you and we can have a king, since there is nothing we can do anyway ::)
I love when you guys start using insults because that proves to me that Im getting to you and you've got nothing else in your argument...NO PRESIDENT either Dem or Repub has EVER ENFORCED THE LAW....Obama has at least deported many more illegals fqr and away than any other president.....but you conveniently overlook that...I wonder why????????????
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again....NO PRESIDENT has tried to enforce immigration law.....This is done on purpose because our past presidents have bowed to mexican pressure not to enforce...but actually Obama has the best record of enforcement than any other president in terms of actually kicking people out of the country....but of course we conveniently skirt over that point in order to demonize Obama
What you said was that it could not be enforced not that it wasn't being enforced. There is dispute about how accurate Obama's deportation numbers are. Obama's numbers don't seem consistent with the DHS numbers. I believe Obama's numbers are overstated for political purposes and the truth is probably somewhere between Obama's estimates and those of the DHS. You also have to consider the executive amnesty he's recently gave to children(most if not all being in their twenties)
Regardless, Obama's plan does nothing to remedy the problem. Obama's plan isn't any more enforceable than what he currently doesn't seem willing to enforce. So it's ridiculous to clap for Obama's plan because it accomplishes nothing and its unworkable. The plan is absent of important detail. How does one prove they've been in the country for five years? Do we take their word? How much evidence is required. How do we tax and fine them? Illegals with criminal records aren't going to come forward so claiming background checks will do anything is ridiculous if not down right lying. Well, how about people who have a criminal record in Mexico? How do we determine that? I'd bet my bottom dollar that Obama will include a provision to absolve people of crimes.
Obama and the Democrats controlled the White house and Senate for years but refused to act until now. Politics aside this is a terrible plan and does nothing.
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I love when you guys start using insults because that proves to me that Im getting to you and you've got nothing else in your argument...NO PRESIDENT either Dem or Repub has EVER ENFORCED THE LAW....Obama has at least deported many more illegals fqr and away than any other president.....but you conveniently overlook that...I wonder why????????????
I have a good idea - lets deport the 95'ers and replace each w a hot brazialian babe. Sounds like a good plan to me.
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I have a good idea - lets deport the 95'ers and replace each w a hot brazialian babe. Sounds like a good plan to me.
un huh...and might as well deport the 39'ers as well
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What you said was that it could not be enforced not that it wasn't being enforced. There is dispute about how accurate Obama's deportation numbers are. Obama's numbers don't seem consistent with the DHS numbers. I believe Obama's numbers are overstated for political purposes and the truth is probably somewhere between Obama's estimates and those of the DHS. You also have to consider the executive amnesty he's recently gave to children(most if not all being in their twenties)
Regardless, Obama's plan does nothing to remedy the problem. Obama's plan isn't any more enforceable than what he currently doesn't seem willing to enforce. So it's ridiculous to clap for Obama's plan because it accomplishes nothing and its unworkable. The plan is absent of important detail. How does one prove they've been in the country for five years? Do we take their word? How much evidence is required. How do we tax and fine them? Illegals with criminal records aren't going to come forward so claiming background checks will do anything is ridiculous if not down right lying. Well, how about people who have a criminal record in Mexico? How do we determine that? I'd bet my bottom dollar that Obama will include a provision to absolve people of crimes.
Obama and the Democrats controlled the White house and Senate for years but refused to act until now. Politics aside this is a terrible plan and does nothing.
well basically it hasn't been enforced because the secret is IT CANT BE....there are too many illegals in the United States...it costs $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....
10.000,000
X 29,000
___________
It would cost us almost 300 billion to deport every single illegal
and thats only the ones who are here now......no counting how many more would have come in while deporting the initial 10,000.000
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well basically it hasn't been enforced because the secret is IT CANT BE....there are too many illegals in the United States...it costs $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....
10.000,000
X 29,000
___________
It would cost us almost 300 billion to deport every single illegal
and thats only the ones who are here now......no counting how many more would have come in while deporting the initial 10,000.000
plenty of ways to get these people to begin deporting themselves, only a brainwashed moron thinks this is the only way to address this situation.
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well basically it hasn't been enforced because the secret is IT CANT BE....there are too many illegals in the United States...it costs $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....
10.000,000
X 29,000
___________
It would cost us almost 300 billion to deport every single illegal
and thats only the ones who are here now......no counting how many more would have come in while deporting the initial 10,000.000
It can be enforced. There is nothing stopping enforcement other than the will to do so. Fine children of illegals for allowing their parents to stay in the United States, fine companies for hiring illegals(that's already a law on the books). There are a variety of laws already on the books to facilitate enforcement.
No one is talking about what happens in three years. The amnesty(it is amnesty) just doesn't provide a stay of deportation for Conseula's eighty year old grandmother. Young people are also offered the ability to stay. What's going to happen to them in three years? What happens when the work permits laps or they are no longer employed? The odds are that Obama will offer citizenship in the future but if he doesn't its unlikely that any of these people will willingly leave. Three years from now the problem will be the same if not worse.
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well basically it hasn't been enforced because the secret is IT CANT BE....there are too many illegals in the United States...it costs $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....
10.000,000
X 29,000
___________
It would cost us almost 300 billion to deport every single illegal
and thats only the ones who are here now......no counting how many more would have come in while deporting the initial 10,000.000
if you use the FINE system, they self-deport.
If landlords and employers are fined for giving them work/shelter, they stop enabling the lawbreakers. They leave USA because they cannot find work or shelter.
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I love when you guys start using insults because that proves to me that Im getting to you and you've got nothing else in your argument...NO PRESIDENT either Dem or Repub has EVER ENFORCED THE LAW....Obama has at least deported many more illegals fqr and away than any other president.....but you conveniently overlook that...I wonder why????????????
What you don't seem to understand is I don't care what happened in the past, I live in the now. When anything is getting to you, you have to go back in time. How long before you bring up George Washington as some sort of justification for the executive branch of the government. You keep saying laws can't be enforced, then what good are they? Lets just open the borders and let every third world parasite in the run the nation into the ground.
Can't stop people from stealing, unenforceable, blanket amnesty for thieves.
Can't stop people from speeding, unenforceable, abolish speed limits
Can't stop people from killing, unenforceable, implement the "purge"
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It can be enforced. There is nothing stopping enforcement other than the will to do so. Fine children of illegals for allowing their parents to stay in the United States, fine companies for hiring illegals(that's already a law on the books). There are a variety of laws already on the books to facilitate enforcement.
No one is talking about what happens in three years. The amnesty(it is amnesty) just doesn't provide a stay of deportation for Conseula's eighty year old grandmother. Young people are also offered the ability to stay. What's going to happen to them in three years? What happens when the work permits laps or they are no longer employed? The odds are that Obama will offer citizenship in the future but if he doesn't its unlikely that any of these people will willingly leave. Three years from now the problem will be the same if not worse.
I would also add that these young people have plenty of time to have children. What happens in three years when they have young children? When their work permit expires are we going to send them back? I doubt it. This is one of the reasons why Obama's plan is defacto amnesty. They might not even be working? . Now that they have work permits some companies won't hire them anymore because they now have a paper trail. It's not likely they will be deported employed or not. Lets say they don't have children. What happens when the work permit expires? They aren't going to self-deport. Either its back to the shadows or the more likely scenario where they granted outright amnesty. The justification for the amnesty being they were in the country for three years and deserve it.
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well basically it hasn't been enforced because the secret is IT CANT BE....there are too many illegals in the United States...it costs $29,000 to deport ONE illegal.....
10.000,000
X 29,000
___________
It would cost us almost 300 billion to deport every single illegal
and thats only the ones who are here now......no counting how many more would have come in while deporting the initial 10,000.000
Well worth it
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That's hilarious. ;D
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plenty of ways to get these people to begin deporting themselves, only a brainwashed moron thinks this is the only way to address this situation.
Deport themselves to where?????????...they aint leaving...wishful thinking.....they will only self-deport when there are no jobs.....so how about they enforce the law that sasys businesses cannot hire illegals...funny how no one talks about that..especially Republicans......the fact of teh matter is that the gov't winks at this part of teh law and lets businesses like farms, restaurants and construction hire illegals.....they would ALL self-deport tomorrow if this law was respected
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Deport themselves to where?????????...they aint leaving...wishful thinking.....they will only self-deport when there are no jobs.....so how about they enforce the law that sasys businesses cannot hire illegals...funny how no one talks about that..especially Republicans......the fact of teh matter is that the gov't winks at this part of teh law and lets businesses like farms, restaurants and construction hire illegals.....they would ALL self-deport tomorrow if this law was respected
How about Kenyan, Congo, Uganda, Somalia, wherever the F, just leave now and take your ox tail, Jamaican patty, corn bread, tomali and enchalida eating self w you.
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It can be enforced. There is nothing stopping enforcement other than the will to do so. Fine children of illegals for allowing their parents to stay in the United States, fine companies for hiring illegals(that's already a law on the books). There are a variety of laws already on the books to facilitate enforcement.
No one is talking about what happens in three years. The amnesty(it is amnesty) just doesn't provide a stay of deportation for Conseula's eighty year old grandmother. Young people are also offered the ability to stay. What's going to happen to them in three years? What happens when the work permits laps or they are no longer employed? The odds are that Obama will offer citizenship in the future but if he doesn't its unlikely that any of these people will willingly leave. Three years from now the problem will be the same if not worse.
well exactly.....Obama didn't get us into this mess.....its due to the inaction of congress and the lack of will by both parties to enforce existing laws......Obama had to take some kind of action because Hispanics and Asians are his constituency..you can't blame him for that.....Even Bush wanted immigration reform and was rejected by his own party.....the fact is the republicans keep stalling and refuse to do ANYTHING on this issue....yet they had time to take votes to repeal Obamacare about 30-40 times
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if you use the FINE system, they self-deport.
If landlords and employers are fined for giving them work/shelter, they stop enabling the lawbreakers. They leave USA because they cannot find work or shelter.
EXACTLY
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well exactly.....Obama didn't get us into this mess.....its due to the inaction of congress and the lack of will by both parties to enforce existing laws......Obama had to take some kind of action because Hispanics and Asians are his constituency..you can't blame him for that.....Even Bush wanted immigration reform and was rejected by his own party.....the fact is the republicans keep stalling and refuse to do ANYTHING on this issue....yet they had time to take votes to repeal Obamacare about 30-40 times
KenyaCare is a bigger threat to the nation right now moron :'( :-*
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What you don't seem to understand is I don't care what happened in the past, I live in the now. When anything is getting to you, you have to go back in time. How long before you bring up George Washington as some sort of justification for the executive branch of the government. You keep saying laws can't be enforced, then what good are they? Lets just open the borders and let every third world parasite in the run the nation into the ground.
Can't stop people from stealing, unenforceable, blanket amnesty for thieves.
Can't stop people from speeding, unenforceable, abolish speed limits
Can't stop people from killing, unenforceable, implement the "purge"
what i'm trying to say to you is that WE HAVE ALREADY HAD DEFACTO AMNESTY......president Obama has arrested and deported record numbers of illegals yet the tide hasn't turned and they JUST KEEP ON COMING.....enforcement is difficult because we are overwhelmed.....why use precious resources to go after parents and grandmothers with children in schoool, and who work and stay out of trouble???...we don't have the time or money to go after everyone....so lets focus on the most dangerous....the republicans complain but have taken NO ACTION of solving this issue
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what i'm trying to say to you is that WE HAVE ALREADY HAD DEFACTO AMNESTY......president Obama has arrested and deported record numbers of illegals yet the tide hasn't turned and they JUST KEEP ON COMING.....enforcement is difficult because we are overwhelmed.....why use precious resources to go after parents and grandmothers with children in schoool, and who work and stay out of trouble???...we don't have the time or money to go after everyone....so lets focus on the most dangerous....the republicans complain but have taken NO ACTION of solving this issue
They keep coming because we don't enforce the law in any meaningful way.
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what i'm trying to say to you is that WE HAVE ALREADY HAD DEFACTO AMNESTY......president Obama has arrested and deported record numbers of illegals yet the tide hasn't turned and they JUST KEEP ON COMING.....enforcement is difficult because we are overwhelmed.....why use precious resources to go after parents and grandmothers with children in schoool, and who work and stay out of trouble???...we don't have the time or money to go after everyone....so lets focus on the most dangerous....the republicans complain but have taken NO ACTION of solving this issue
Here is the thing. If what we already had and what Obama is proposing is/was defacto amnesty why does Obama continue to lie about it? Also, Obama's amnesty isn't just grandmothers its young people sixteen and up. Plenty of time form them to have children.
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They keep coming because we don't enforce the law in any meaningful way.
we finally agree on something....that psychiatrist you're seeing must have fnally found some meds that work for you....
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we finally agree on something....that psychiatrist you're seeing must have fnally found some meds that work for you....
So then -Gaybama is choosing not to enforce the law correct? :'( :'( :'(
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what i'm trying to say to you is that WE HAVE ALREADY HAD DEFACTO AMNESTY......president Obama has arrested and deported record numbers of illegals yet the tide hasn't turned and they JUST KEEP ON COMING.....enforcement is difficult because we are overwhelmed.....why use precious resources to go after parents and grandmothers with children in schoool, and who work and stay out of trouble???...we don't have the time or money to go after everyone....so lets focus on the most dangerous....the republicans complain but have taken NO ACTION of solving this issue
Why do they just keep on coming? Because .gov does nothing to protect the border. Why go after them? Well because they are not supposed to be in the country. I really don't see what is so hard to grasp, you can call them undocumented or what ever you want, they still broke the law to enter this country. If the shit hole they came from is so bad, and there are about 5 million of them, seems to me they could go back and set shit right. But then again you wouldn't have the American tax payer footing the bill for them.
And while we are on the subject what the fuck did the democrats do when they controlled congress for about 40 years? Hell the POTUS had a dem majority in congress when he was elected, what did they do?
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So then -Gaybama is choosing not to enforce the law correct? :'( :'( :'(
As I've mentioned many times, Obama enforces immigration law and polices our borders more than any other president EVER.....We are apprehending so many illegals at the border we don't have a place to put them all.....so guess what happens?....THEY OFTENTIMES GET RELEASED into the community where its bye bye.....you never see them again.....or they release them over the the border and they come bacvk again and again....which is why I made the argument that its hard to enforce the immigration laws with the tide of illegals that we have coming in..we don't have the money , resources, or will to do it
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This is how you end illegal immigration. End birthrate citizenship for children of illegals. Children of illegals will not be allowed access to any benefits programs. Cut off the money and the incentive to stay is removed.
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As I've mentioned many times, Obama enforces immigration law and polices our borders more than any other president EVER.....We are apprehending so many illegals at the border we don't have a place to put them all.....so guess what happens?....THEY OFTENTIMES GET RELEASED into the community where its bye bye.....you never see them again.....or they release them over the the border and they come bacvk again and again....which is why I made the argument that its hard to enforce the immigration laws with the tide of illegals that we have coming in..we don't have the money , resources, or will to do it
Why is Obama continuing to lie about his plan being amnesty? Does he think we are all Grubers? And, I don't know why you keep taking Obama's deportation numbers at face value.
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Why do they just keep on coming? Because .gov does nothing to protect the border. Why go after them? Well because they are not supposed to be in the country. I really don't see what is so hard to grasp, you can call them undocumented or what ever you want, they still broke the law to enter this country. If the shit hole they came from is so bad, and there are about 5 million of them, seems to me they could go back and set shit right. But then again you wouldn't have the American tax payer footing the bill for them.
And while we are on the subject what the fuck did the democrats do when they controlled congress for about 40 years? Hell the POTUS had a dem majority in congress when he was elected, what did they do?
when the Dems controlled congress the problem simply wasn't as huge as it is now..as for Obama having a congressioal majority, he only had it for a short period of time and after seeing Bush crash and burn on this issue he knew he wasn't going to get it through congress either.....again both parties havve done nothing and this is how we got to here
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This is how you end illegal immigration. End birthrate citizenship for children of illegals. Children of illegals will not be allowed access to any benefits programs. Cut off the money and the incentive to stay is removed.
I agree......I don't think illegally born children should have citizenship either...but we just aren't going to change the constitution......its not happening..it was put in place because white supremacists wantes to deport all blacks after slavery ended due to claiming they were not citizens since their ancestors had been brought here...so it was decided that all people born on US soil were citizens
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when the Dems controlled congress the problem simply wasn't as huge as it is now..as for Obama having a congressioal majority, he only had it for a short period of time
LMFAO yea youre right it just became and issue in the last 4 years.
He had it for 2 straight years when he took office did he not? thats 1/3 of his current time in office.
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How the Obama Administration Inflates Deportation Statistics
For the last few years, the Obama Administration has claimed that it's deporting a record number of illegal aliens. But, the Administration is adding numbers to its overall deportation statistics that have not been historically included in the total number of annual deportations. Here's a look at how the Obama Administration has artificially inflated the number of deportations.
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/news/february-12-2013/how-obama-administration-inflates-deportation-statistics.html
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How the Obama Administration Inflates Deportation Statistics
For the last few years, the Obama Administration has claimed that it's deporting a record number of illegal aliens. But, the Administration is adding numbers to its overall deportation statistics that have not been historically included in the total number of annual deportations. Here's a look at how the Obama Administration has artificially inflated the number of deportations.
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/news/february-12-2013/how-obama-administration-inflates-deportation-statistics.html
dont you use facts!!!!
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when the Dems controlled congress the problem simply wasn't as huge as it is now..as for Obama having a congressioal majority, he only had it for a short period of time and after seeing Bush crash and burn on this issue he knew he wasn't going to get it through congress either.....again both parties havve done nothing and this is how we got to here
Wow.....
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F@&$# YOU, American voters!
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ZBU25dtI274/UWgEvl6ijTI/AAAAAAAAKgM/o1_PM7juLiI/s1600/ron-burgundy-2.jpg)
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/iGtGwkMSyWU/hqdefault.jpg)
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I agree......I don't think illegally born children should have citizenship either...but we just aren't going to change the constitution......its not happening..it was put in place because white supremacists wantes to deport all blacks after slavery ended due to claiming they were not citizens since their ancestors had been brought here...so it was decided that all people born on US soil were citizens
seems like a perfectly valid reason to keep it 250 years later
after all, as ferguson is showing we've barely moved on since then ::)
I wonder how we're going to pay for this? End mortgage tax breaks? Or just borrow more from China?
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Obama does NOT police the border more than any other President. They pad the numbers and distort reality...a common practice amongst third world dictators.
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/news/february-12-2013/how-obama-administration-inflates-deportation-statistics.html
It amazes me that ANYONE in this country still believes in this cult of of personality...that ANYONE still holds the belief that this empty suit is engaged, competent and honest.
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even with low wage jobs they still pay taxes...if they are not paying taxes then its because they are working off the books..which is illegal and actually their having a job period is supposed to be illegal...however the Conservatives don't want that law enforced against businesses.....if that law was enforced the way its supposed to be, THERE WOULD PRACTICALLY BE NO MORE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...... I do concede your point that some illegals and their children get some benefits such as medicaid and food stamps but stats consistently show that its still a win for the U.S, in terms of the money/taxes illegals pay out as opposed to the services they get....
Many of them pay social security taxes and will never be able to cash in.
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Good blurb on the pussy media not backing up free speech:
http://www.wwtdd.com/2014/11/mexicans-coming-through-yonder-window/
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Many of them pay social security taxes and will never be able to cash in.
Gee that's to bad ::), maybe they should try entering the country legally...............
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when the Dems controlled congress the problem simply wasn't as huge as it is now..as for Obama having a congressioal majority, he only had it for a short period of time and after seeing Bush crash and burn on this issue he knew he wasn't going to get it through congress either.....again both parties havve done nothing and this is how we got to here
Nope wasn't problem ::)
http://1950immigration.wordpress.com/operation-wetback/ (http://1950immigration.wordpress.com/operation-wetback/)
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LMFAO yea youre right it just became and issue in the last 4 years.
He had it for 2 straight years when he took office did he not? thats 1/3 of his current time in office.
so what?...two years is not enough time to force through that type of legislation...it wasn't done in the previous 100 years....so how do you expect Obama to do it in two?....and again..Bush had a majority in congress during his entire time in office and he couldn't get it through either
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Here's the question no one is answering. According to Andre the policy we have and the policy Obama advocates is defacto amnesty. My question is, if this is true why does Obama keep lying that it isn't amnesty?
Many of them pay social security taxes and will never be able to cash in.
I doubt this. Income levels are low for that group and if they do contribute it is a very insubstantial amount and way under what they would ever collect in benefits
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Why is Obama continuing to lie about his plan being amnesty? Does he think we are all Grubers? And, I don't know why you keep taking Obama's deportation numbers at face value.
Lying is a strong word.....and it is an amnesty because he is saying that immigration officers cannot touch the population this executive action is aimed at and that in terms of deportation, they are low priority and move to the bottom of the list...which basically means they ain't going no where no time soon.
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Lying is a strong word.....and it is an amnesty because he is saying that immigration officers cannot touch the population this executive action is aimed at and that in terms of deportation, they are low priority and move to the bottom of the list...which basically means they ain't going no where no time soon.
When someone repeatedly says something they know is false they are a liar. By the way, I've enjoyed the discussion. I'm glad we've both kept things civil.
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so what?...two years is not enough time to force through that type of legislation...it wasn't done in the previous 100 years....so how do you expect Obama to do it in two?....and again..Bush had a majority in congress during his entire time in office and he couldn't get it through either
Really? they managed to force the ACA through. And maybe, just maybe, we don't really need immigration reform. Maybe the US just needs to enforce the existing laws. Yeah I know that's just crazy talk ::)
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Really? they managed to force the ACA through. And maybe, just maybe, we don't really need immigration reform. Maybe the US just needs to enforce the existing laws. Yeah I know that's just crazy talk ::)
oh come on, lets not be childish.....you and I both know presidents come into office with an agenda..Immigration was not Obama's agenda....ACA was...he focused all of his energies on getting that passed...it was what he was elected on NOT the immigration issue.....
I wish you would stiop hurting your brain to come up with oppositional arguments and think rationally
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Really? they managed to force the ACA through. And maybe, just maybe, we don't really need immigration reform. Maybe the US just needs to enforce the existing laws. Yeah I know that's just crazy talk ::)
and again ...what do you say about the fact that Bush had EIGHT YEARS with a congrerssional majority and STILL couldn't get it done...why do you expect Obama to perform a miracle that Bush couldn't???
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so what?...two years is not enough time to force through that type of legislation...it wasn't done in the previous 100 years....so how do you expect Obama to do it in two?....and again..Bush had a majority in congress during his entire time in office and he couldn't get it through either
FORCE?
the dems had the house, senate and the presidency...what forcing would they have needed to do?
I thought you hated bush, now youre justifying obamas actions with his?
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and again ...what do you say about the fact that Bush had EIGHT YEARS with a congrerssional majority and STILL couldn't get it done...why do you expect Obama to perform a miracle that Bush couldn't???
Bush is not he POTUS, maybe we can blame Clinton? Reagan? Ford? How about FDR?
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oh come on, lets not be childish.....you and I both know presidents come into office with an agenda..Immigration was not Obama's agenda....ACA was...he focused all of his energies on getting that passed...it was what he was elected on NOT the immigration issue.....
I wish you would stiop hurting your brain to come up with oppositional arguments and think rationally
I see so now that he is a lame duck and lost the Senate, immigration is a big deal. I think you need to ponder rational thinking.
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FORCE?
the dems had the house, senate and the presidency...what forcing would they have needed to do?
I thought you hated bush, now youre justifying obamas actions with his?
WRONGO......I was a big time George Bush supporter.....I like the Bushes....I think Bush, his father and brother Jeb are what the Republican party should be....I have repeatedly saiid I would vote for Jeb....
as for your above assertion...just because you control all branches of Government you still can't just force the house to go along with you...you still have to convince your own party to vote for what you want....ask Bush...who had a congressional majority for his entire eight years
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Here's the question no one is answering. According to Andre the policy we have and the policy Obama advocates is defacto amnesty. My question is, if this is true why does Obama keep lying that it isn't amnesty?
I doubt this. Income levels are low for that group and if they do contribute it is a very insubstantial amount and way under what they would ever collect in benefits
Doesn't change the fact they are contributing.
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Doesn't change the fact they are contributing.
Good and hope they never get a cent back, we will call it a penalty for not being a citizen.
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Doesn't change the fact they are contributing.
actually they are a net drain on the system.
how much do they pay in taxes? how much do they take in entitlements?
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I see so now that he is a lame duck and lost the Senate, immigration is a big deal. I think you need to ponder rational thinking.
unfortunately you, like the other conservatives on here have a really really really hard time admitting when you're wrong
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unfortunately you, like the other conservatives on here have a really really really hard time admitting when you're wrong
Wrong about what exactly? That .gov refuses to enforce existing laws? Nope.
And what exactly needs to be reformed? It should be hard to gain citizenship in this country. An immigrant should have to demonstrate a skill that is beneficial to the Untied States.
You talk (type), but never actually say anything
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Doesn't change the fact they are contributing.
A small portion are but you can't really call it a contribution. I wouldn't call putting in a penny and taking out a dollar a contribution.
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Wrong about what exactly? That .gov refuses to enforce existing laws? Nope.
And what exactly needs to be reformed? It should be hard to gain citizenship in this country. An immigrant should have to demonstrate a skill that is beneficial to the Untied States.
You talk (type), but never actually say anything
you're deflecting.....but I expect that from you....he, who never admits he is wrong or concedes a point................as for having to demonstrate a skill for entrance into the country, the Irish, italians, poles, jews, germans, etc never had to show a skill when they came here by the millions.....however your point is well taken in this day and age....
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you're deflecting.....but I expect that from you....he, who never admits he is wrong or concedes a point................as for having to demonstrate a skill for entrance into the country, the Irish, italians, poles, jews, germans, etc never had to show a skill when they came here by the millions.....however your point is well taken in this day and age....
Yes, you're right. What America (and the black community especially) needs is 20-50 million unskilled, illiterate cucarachas on the dole. This will do wonders for America's GDP, unemployment rate and education system. ::)
Sadly, morons like you seem to make up the vast majority of the black population in this country. Is it any wonder that you're part of the permanent underclass?
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you're deflecting.....but I expect that from you....he, who never admits he is wrong or concedes a point................as for having to demonstrate a skill for entrance into the country, the Irish, italians, poles, jews, germans, etc never had to show a skill when they came here by the millions.....however your point is well taken in this day and age....
You do understand that the government in those days didn't give those unskilled Germans and poles literally tens of billions of taxpayer dollars? Because it seems like you might not be getting just how expensive this will be to us taxpayers
You do pay taxes, don't you?
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Yes, you're right. What America (and the black community especially) needs is 20-50 million unskilled, illiterate cucarachas on the dole. This will do wonders for America's GDP, unemployment rate and education system. ::)
Sadly, morons like you seem to make up the vast majority of the black population in this country. Is it any wonder that you're part of the permanent underclass?
every time you stick your head in a thread you bring up black people...why is that?....we are talking about immigration....if you don't understadn the topic and have to resort to racial nonsense as you always do then stay out of the thread
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every time you stick your head in a thread you bring up black people...why is that?....we are talking about immigration....if you don't understadn the topic and have to resort to racial nonsense as you always do then stay out of the thread
Gaybama screwed you
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Gaybama screwed you
still screwing you.....in your head and elsewhere 8)
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you're deflecting.....but I expect that from you....he, who never admits he is wrong or concedes a point................as for having to demonstrate a skill for entrance into the country, the Irish, italians, poles, jews, germans, etc never had to show a skill when they came here by the millions.....however your point is well taken in this day and age....
So now were going to go back to pre civil war America to attempt to prove that Obama is correct?
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you're deflecting.....but I expect that from you....he, who never admits he is wrong or concedes a point................as for having to demonstrate a skill for entrance into the country, the Irish, italians, poles, jews, germans, etc never had to show a skill when they came here by the millions.....however your point is well taken in this day and age....
There was no welfare then. It was sink or swim for those immigrants. If they could not make it they returned to their land of origin. Having a skill would have been advantageous for success.
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So now were going to go back to pre civil war America to attempt to prove that Obama is correct?
has nothing to do with Obama...although in your mind, EVERYTHING has to do with him...all I did was state a fact
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There was no welfare then. It was sink or swim for those immigrants. If they could not make it they returned to their land of origin. Having a skill would have been advantageous for success.
theres no welfare for them now either...I used to work in a homeless shelter...I should know....many of the men in the shelter were undocumented...all they got was free medical........no cash assistance , no food stamps, and they were ineligible for SSI, social security, or public housing
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http://www.ijreview.com/2014/11/206878-new-heads-explode-snl-skit-mocking-obama-schoolhouse-rock-parody-bill-becomes-law/
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has nothing to do with Obama...although in your mind, EVERYTHING has to do with him...all I did was state a fact
And it is completely nothing to do with the country today, if things were like they were back then the fuckers wouldn't be coming across the border in hoards.
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many of us guys have banged chicks after they have fallen asleep or passed out.
:-X