Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: mr.turbo on November 19, 2015, 07:45:32 PM
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A few things that are fact not fiction
A) Sambatyon - Read up on that guys, the river that throws stones all week and rests the seventh day confirmed by the US Govt. as it was hard to deny and planes sent there never returned and there is a kingdom there based on what russia claims but will not release the images they have from sat. lights.
B) Think about the following - The world has been around even according to the bible almost 6000 years, are you saying that all these 1000's of years noone was smart enough to create electric etc? Yet they knew how to figure out building massive structures etc?
All of a sudden within the past 100 or so years we became smart and we have all this advanced technology.
Maybe just maybe we stold this shit from somewhere else, a place where they had this stuff forever, a place that would make planet earth look old fashioned?
All of a sudden we figure out that we can use solar power? Did we figure it out on our own or did we figure it out by watching how some other planet or even a part of planet earth how they do it.
C) Ever stop and think that maybe when we send all this crap to other planets there are people there having the same conversation we are having here "did you see that rocket flying".
D) We figured out how to use something that god put on this planet called "Oil" yet we havent done anything with the magnetic field power god created, that will be the next big step using it to do anything pretty much from fly planes to many other things.
Stop and think yeah its cooler to laugh off everything
http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/ap_050523_creation_museum.html
thats just one place you can read up on it, mankind started when god created adam and eve nothing traces back before that unless you listen to mumbo jumbo people talk about, the jewish calendar was the one that was used up until we started counting after christ when people say BC im sure you know that means before christ so if its 500 BC its 2007 + 500 years ago
Read up on stuff written by normal well respected people, im just here repeating
I'm not a scientist so I'm not so sure
perhaps some of the brighter minds here can clarify this
???
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Not sure but the Earth is about 4.6 billion years old...
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Not sure but the Earth is about 4.6 billion years old...
not what the bible says though
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not what the bible says though
so what
who cares
everyones got their opinion.
Move on
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so what
who cares
everyones got their opinion.
Move on
what's your opinion?
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what's your opinion?
I like cake
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I like cake
there's a rational thought I can understand ;)
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It's a young earth. Not This Big Bang bullshit.
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The bible says many things such as bats are birds. (Leviticus 11:13-19)
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It's a young earth. Not This Big Bang bullshit.
how do you know this?
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i've asked a few getbiggers who refuse to answer either way.
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The bible says many things such as bats are birds. (Leviticus 11:13-19)
These are the birds you are to regard as unclean and not eat because they are unclean: the eagle,[a] the vulture, the black vulture, 14 the red kite, any kind of black kite, 15 any kind of raven, 16 the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, 17 the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, 18 the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, 19 the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the bat.
???
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i've asked a few getbiggers who refuse to answer either way.
touchy subject?
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The bible is kind of a "greatest hits" compilation, and it has many authors. Yes, there are those who insist it's literal, but that's a tiny slice of Christians.
It's disturbing when people high-five each-other over "calling out" people over this, and patting themselves over the back when people contradict themselves.
How old is the earth, you piece of shit? Is it 10 seconds long? Does time hang eternally like a drop of dew on an orange leaf? Can your watch predict when time will end?
You have no imagination and your argument is the product of a simple animal brain living in the slice of a moment like a sample of a petri dish that has been scraped onto a slide.
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The bible is kind of a "greatest hits" compilation, and it has many authors. Yes, there are those who insist it's literal, but that's a tiny slice of Christians.
It's disturbing when people high-five each-other over "calling out" people over this, and patting themselves over the back when people contradict themselves.
How old is the earth, you piece of shit? Is it 10 seconds long? Does time hang eternally like a drop of dew on an orange leaf? Can your watch predict when time will end?
You have no imagination and your argument is the product of a simple animal brain living in the slice of a moment like a sample of a petri dish that has been scraped onto a slide.
wow you have strong feelings about this.
By your logic, is it possible to know anything at all?
???
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https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/
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https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/
:D
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https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/
:-\
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I believe that the earth is very very very very old.
God created it..... and life was here: dinosaurs and other creatures that are now wrongly identified as being human forebearers. (Scientists find these ancient skeletons. This appears to combat the "young earth" theory)
Life on that earth ended with some sort of "disaster". The disaster could have been a meteor strike. Or it could have been Satan hitting the earth after he was hurled down from heaven. Jesus witnessed this event. Jesus: “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven (Luke 10:18).
God then re-created earth. But the fossils remained. Ancient skeltons remained. God made a garden. God took dirt and breathed like into it and made man. This man was named Adam. From Adam's rib, God made Eve. Adam and Eve were given dominion over all of the earth. (This is the young earth that Christian's often mention)
Unfortunately, satan was on the earth. Satan eventually temped Eve to sin against God. Eve sinned and then temped Adam to join her in sinning. Satan then took dominion over the earth.
2000+ years ago, Jesus Christ took back what Adam & Eve had previously lost to satan.
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https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/
I pray daily. Raised Catholic. I live right.
But this article... Wow.
It explains a lot.
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I believe that the earth is very very very very old.
God created it..... and life was here: dinosaurs and other creatures that are now wrongly identified as being human forebearers.
Life on that earth ended with some sort of "disaster". The disaster could have been a meteor. Or it could have been Satan hitting the earth after he was hurled down from heaven. Jesus witnessed this event. Jesus: “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven (Luke 10:18).
God then re-created earth. But the fossils remained. Ancient skeltons remained. God made a garden. God took dirt and breathed like into it and made man. This man was named Adam. (This is the young earth that Christian's often mention)
Unfortunately, satan was on the earth.
He still is on earth, disguised as a president of the United States and yes, he is evil.
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Not nearl as old as Wes.
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Not sure but the Earth is about 4.6 billion years old...
Sounds about right. The Earth was formed through accretion in the solar nebula, and so were all the other planets in our solar system. Our own sun was also formed via the dense compaction of solar dust. The sun is mostly hydrogen and releases its energy through the conversion of hydrogen to helium in nuclear reactions going off constantly. It will run out of hydrogen near the end of its life and then start fusing helium into carbon. Eventually helium will be depleted and heavier elements will follow and the sun will expand outward perhaps past the Earth and Mars. The oceans will evaporate.
But where did this dust come from? it came from other stars that lived before our solar system existed. Our ancestors are these ancient massive stars that had relatively short lives but seeded our galaxy with the solar nebula clouds that were necessary for star formation. During the supernova explosions heavy elements, even gold were produced. These solar Nebulae would hang out in space until the shock waves of a massive super or hyper nova explosion caused the cloud to spiral into motion which would ultimately lead to the formation of or sun and planets.
Our Universe is about 13.7 billion years old. Billions or even trillions of solar systems have been formed in the universe in billions of galaxies. The birth of a solar system is more common than that of a human it would seem.
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The Earth is precisely 0.0031 Wes old.
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I'm not a scientist so I'm not so sure
perhaps some of the brighter minds here can clarify this
???
Well, they aren't scientist either. They calculated that by the age of complete fictional characters, and that add up to be 6000 years. On the other hand, there is findings, for example a tools which humans was using more than 10 000 years ago, so this religious nonsense can't be true. Earliest humans, meaning homo sapiens, were living here 250 000 years a go, and earliest upright standing ancestor of ours(homo erectus) was here 1.8 million years ago. Oldest fossils are 3.5 billion years old, so the earth has to be somewhat older. Depending the source age of the earth is 3.8 to - 4.5 billion years. And how in the name of hell they know that? "The best estimate for Earth's age is based on radiometric dating of fragments from the Canyon Diablo iron meteorite. From the fragments, scientists calculated the relative abundances of elements that formed as radioactive uranium decayed over billions of years."- Wikipedia.
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These are the birds you are to regard as unclean and not eat because they are unclean: the eagle,[a] the vulture, the black vulture, 14 the red kite, any kind of black kite, 15 any kind of raven, 16 the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, 17 the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, 18 the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, 19 the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the bat.
???
To be fair if you look at what was being told in that book, basically, hygiene and don't eat animals that are infested with salmonella and ecoli, like no pork, no fowl. People back then didn't understand/couldn't understand the idea of cooking things fully, washing plates, washing hands. But they could understand when God told them just don't eat the shit and make sure you rinse your silverware in water before using them. A good example is that they are encouraged to eat lamb and lamb can basically be eaten raw if one so desired, as well as fish, but if you eat birds raw your ass gonna probably get really sick or die or both.
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Well, they aren't scientist either. They calculated that by the age of complete fictional characters, and that add up to be 6000 years. On the other hand, there is findings, for example a tools which humans was using more than 10 000 years ago, so this religious nonsense can't be true. Earliest humans, meaning homo sapiens, were living here 250 000 years a go, and earliest upright standing ancestor of ours(homo erectus) was here 1.8 million years ago. Oldest fossils are 3.5 billion years old, so the earth has to be somewhat older. Depending the source age of the earth is 3.8 to - 4.5 billion years. And how in the name of hell they know that? "The best estimate for Earth's age is based on radiometric dating of fragments from the Canyon Diablo iron meteorite. From the fragments, scientists calculated the relative abundances of elements that formed as radioactive uranium decayed over billions of years."- Wikipedia.
lol at you now using wikipedia. When CTer's use it, you laugh and make fun of them .lmao You're all over the fucking place dude.
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Guys, as I exposed this guys ties to Radical Islam in Canada and his sites and apps that he builds to promote Islam he is getting more and more enraged. It started with him making a threat to me for no good reason. I will not stop exposing him and will use all legal means to tell his Islamic neighbors about his sex related activity online as well as contact all his clients including various Muslim organizations to tell them who he really is. I already reported him to many groups that monitor radical Islamic terrorists.
This guy is an ISIS sympathizer openly here on getbig and other places.
If the forum rules were different, I would post openly exactly what I have on him, SO FAR.
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do people even know what a "year" is?
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Sounds about right. The Earth was formed though accretion in the solar nebula, and so were all the other planets in out solar system. Our own sun was also formed via the dense compaction of solar dust. The sun is mostly hydrogen and releases its energy through the conversion of hydrogen to helium in nuclear reactions going off constantly. It will run out of hydrogen near the end of its life and then start fusing helium into carbon. Eventually helium will be depleted and heavier elements will follow and the sun will expand outward perhaps past the Earth and Mars. The oceans will evaporate.
But where did this dust come from? it came from other stars that lived before our solar system existed. Our ancestors are these ancient massive stars that had relatively short lives but seeded our galaxy with the solar nebula clouds that were necessary for star formation. During the supernova explosions heavy elements, even gold were produced. These solar Nebulae would hang out in space until the shock waves of a massive super or hypernova explosion caused the cloud to spiral into motion which would ultimately lead to the formation of or sun and planets.
Our Universe is about 13.7 billion years old. Billions or even trillions of solar systems have been formed in the universe in billions of galaxies. The birth of a solar system is more common than that of a human it would seem.
clearly one of the brighter minds at work in this post
:o
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I pray daily. Raised Catholic. I live right.
But this article... Wow.
It explains a lot.
so far the link to "the answers book 2" kindly provided by coach is the only substantive material offered on behalf of the young earth creationists position. By that I mean the folks who take a literal interpretation of the material in the bible as factual truth that the world is 6000 years old.
In response to the science based claims about the age (creation) of the earth they would ask...
were you there???
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To be fair if you look at what was being told in that book, basically, hygiene and don't eat animals that are infested with salmonella and ecoli, like no pork, no fowl. People back then didn't understand/couldn't understand the idea of cooking things fully, washing plates, washing hands. But they could understand when God told them just don't eat the shit and make sure you rinse your silverware in water before using them. A good example is that they are encouraged to eat lamb and lamb can basically be eaten raw if one so desired, as well as fish, but if you eat birds raw your ass gonna probably get really sick or die or both.
I see, but what about eating bats? those critters look pretty tasty are we still not supposed to eat them?
lets keep this simple
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Guys, as I exposed this guys ties to Radical Islam in Canada and his sites and apps that he builds to promote Islam he is getting more and more enraged. It started with him making a threat to me for no good reason. I will not stop exposing him and will use all legal means to tell his Islamic neighbors about his sex related activity online as well as contact all his clients including various Muslim organizations to tell them who he really is. I already reported him to many groups that monitor radical Islamic terrorists.
This guy is an ISIS sympathizer openly here on getbig and other places.
If the forum rules were different, I would post openly exactly what I have on him, SO FAR.
why the hate ???
Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
— Matthew 22:35-40
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do people even know what a "year" is?
if I had to guess I would say it's how long it takes for the earth to travel around the sun
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not what the man's interpretation of the bible says though
fixed
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Not nearl as old as Wes.
a scientists opinion
more of he same
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I find it extremely hard to believe that there is a single person with ties to radical islam on here.
Religion has two functions left on earth:
1. To continue to moderate the critically limited (whether by choice or lack of wit) from acting without an overarching book of rules governing their actions. On the whole, we're keeping a lot of people from going crazy with this.
2. To give hope for after death, when the first law of thermodynamics is beyond their comprehension (hint: all energy in the universe existed from inflation to now, none of it has been destroyed).
(I'm guessing there is a lot of *whoosh* about that last bit)
Alas, though it has a third function that is still resident that makes those of us who do not believe in anything in particular (other than physics) extremely negative towards religion.
3. To give bat shit crazy ideas to the critically limited and legitimise their poor behaviour by suggesting said behaviour will be considered to have been "correct" in the afterlife.
It's hard to know if 1 outweighs 3, these days ::)
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I pray daily. Raised Catholic. I live right.
But this article... Wow.
It explains a lot.
No it doesn't. All it does is cast doubt on a method of dating. All religion ever does is cast doubt on rates of change and scientific accuracy, despite the fact that I can go outside tomorrow night and watch the ISS silhouette pass in front of the moon at a precise time down to the second, calculated by that oft-doubted science. Despite the fact science can land probes on chunks of rock travelling at ridiculous speeds. Despite the fact that we can measure and correctly predict time dilation between the people in the ISS and us on earth etc etc
The level of precision that is running this world's technology right now is profoundly accurate and continues to rise. If you understood that, you'd not be doubting science.
I think you're a fairly intelligent person - or you could be.
All the people who believe the earth is 6000 years have one thing in common. To abandon their belief, they have to take a chance of eternal damnation in the fires of hell. I get that. That is a tough thing to swallow.
The fact is, were it not the case that the fires of hell were waiting for a non-believer or a believer crossing into that territory, you wouldn't last 2 years believing the earth was 6000 years if you started digging into physics and the origins of the universe. Nobody would ever swallow such weak ass evidence against science. The only reason they do is because they are afraid for their future.
I'm not going to spend hours debating this with you or anybody, but that article explains abso-fucking-lutely, nothing. It is you who is being lied to. It is not proof to cast doubt on something. That article does nothing but say that it could not be true. It does nothing but soothe that nagging feeling at the back of your mind that is either truth or satan: that you're a party to a pack of lies.
Every day, science proves to you that it is a continually evolving towards accuracy movement.
Every day, faith puts its head in the sand and points only to moments where that accuracy has increased as if progress due to a new measurement is a negative thing.
But the one thing you can be fucking sure of is that at no stage will that 4.5 billion years ever, ever go back to 6000 years.
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no human can tell how old the earth is! And those who think they can, are some stupid mother fuckers believing their own lies!
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https://answersingenesis.org/age-of-the-earth/how-old-is-the-earth/
Lol
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No it doesn't. All it does is cast doubt on a method of dating. All religion ever does is cast doubt on rates of change and scientific accuracy, despite the fact that I can go outside tomorrow night and watch the ISS silhouette pass in front of the moon at a precise time down to the second, calculated by that oft-doubted science. Despite the fact science can land probes on chunks of rock travelling at ridiculous speeds. Despite the fact that we can measure and correctly predict time dilation between the people in the ISS and us on earth etc etc
The level of precision that is running this world's technology right now is profoundly accurate and continues to rise. If you understood that, you'd not be doubting science.
I think you're a fairly intelligent person - or you could be.
All the people who believe the earth is 6000 years have one thing in common. To abandon their belief, they have to take a chance of eternal damnation in the fires of hell. I get that. That is a tough thing to swallow.
The fact is, were it not the case that the fires of hell were waiting for a non-believer or a believer crossing into that territory, you wouldn't last 2 years believing the earth was 6000 years if you started digging into physics and the origins of the universe. Nobody would ever swallow such weak ass evidence against science. The only reason they do is because they are afraid for their future.
I'm not going to spend hours debating this with you or anybody, but that article explains abso-fucking-lutely, nothing. It is you who is being lied to. It is not proof to cast doubt on something. That article does nothing but say that it could not be true. It does nothing but soothe that nagging feeling at the back of your mind that is either truth or satan: that you're a party to a pack of lies.
Every day, science proves to you that it is a continually evolving towards accuracy movement.
Every day, faith puts its head in the sand and points only to moments where that accuracy has increased as if progress due to a new measurement is a negative thing.
But the one thing you can be fucking sure of is that at no stage will that 4.5 billion years ever, ever go back to 6000 years.
Great post. I wouldnt bother arguing with religious clowns. Life is to short.
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no human can tell how old the earth is! And those who think they can, are some stupid mother fuckers believing their own lies!
I mean, take this specimen for example.
He has defined a line in the sand which is that we cannot date the earth.
Yet, is that really a line that is accurate?
There is tons of evidence for dating things. Stellar evolution, geology on here and other planets, etc
If there is a lot of evidence, would it not follow that we should be able date the earth?
We currently have rovers on mars digging in the sand and finding conclusions that water was on that planet millions, if not billions of years ago.
Instead, this poor sap says "no! impossible!"
He closes his mind and then still expresses an opinion that it cannot be done. Where does anybody get closing their mind and saying something cannot be done? Fucking nowhere. None of what society is about today would exist were there only people with his mindset. He is a sheep who gets up, communicates with people around the world with technology that functions far beyond his understanding and he still thinks that his opinion on what we can or cannot do is his best evidence of the truth ::)
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no human can tell how old the earth is! They can have nice theories etc but no one can ever prove it. They can only prove it by their own theories they made up.
let me repeat that: Proven "fact" by theories made up by themself. How can u verify it? Please tell me!
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Guys, as I exposed this guys ties to Radical Islam in Canada and his sites and apps that he builds to promote Islam he is getting more and more enraged. It started with him making a threat to me for no good reason. I will not stop exposing him and will use all legal means to tell his Islamic neighbors about his sex related activity online as well as contact all his clients including various Muslim organizations to tell them who he really is. I already reported him to many groups that monitor radical Islamic terrorists.
This guy is an ISIS sympathizer openly here on getbig and other places.
If the forum rules were different, I would post openly exactly what I have on him, SO FAR.
Not clear who you are talking about.
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no human can tell how old the earth is! They can have nice theories etc but no one can ever prove it. They can only prove it by their own theories they made up.
let me repeat that: Proven "fact" by theories made up by themself. How can u verify it? Please tell me!
Good point. There can be evidence to support a given theory. Even compelling evidence. But that does not make it a fact.
Whether there is a God that created a universe or that the universe just popped up out of nothingness is both a matter of faith. Neither can be proven.
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not what the bible says though
Who is to say what a year looks like to God Allah?
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lol at you now using wikipedia. When CTer's use it, you laugh and make fun of them .lmao You're all over the fucking place dude.
So you, an idiot, are saying that fact which is readable from thousands of science articles around the internet, isn't fact if it is on Wikipedia? The difference here is simple. If crap is crap all over the internet, it will be crap in the Wikipedia. You and your kind of idiots can't understand the difference between the crap and the fact, so you are puzzled. Let me help you: The fact means a thing, a piece of information or knowledge, which has been proved to be a fact. As you remember, that proving thing was too hard to your kind of idiots, so you and the other foil hat idiots hasn't prove even a single detail of their fairytales, no matter which insane conspiracy theory we are talking about ;D
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Who is to say what a year looks like to God Allah?
that is what we are discussing
what's your position??!?
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not what the bible says though
Here's the thing, people assume my position on creation and the ages of the universe/earth, but since I was about 10 years old I've been questioning the ages of things and today I'm much more persuaded by an old earth and old universe perspective. I actually perceived a “day-age” notion of creation before I’d even realized it had been proposed. I asked my Mom about it as kid and she had no idea but said “it could be”.
Does this damage my faith or scripture? Not at all....it actually strengthens it (much longer discussion obviously).
Further, the age of the earth and the universe have no bearing whatsoever on faith in Jesus Christ and his revelation in my life.
Still, there is a part of me that has never been convinced of a young earth creation perspective. I am overcome with the evidence for an old earth and old universe and how current geological and cosmological findings help strengthen and align with the creation accounts in Genesis and Job (on which my faith is founded first but again a much longer discussion).
I am much more persuaded by the notion of 6 days of creation occurring over 6 ages and that in fact we are existing in God's 7th day/age of rest after his activity of creation (as all 6 creation days had a “morning and evening” except day 7 which appears to be ongoing to the present). The hebrew word for “day” is "yom" and actually has multiple definitions. "Yom" can refer to the daylight, an actual 24-hour day or a long expanse of time (ex: an age). Moses who was divinely inspired to write Genesis had no other Hebrew word other than “yom” to use to describe these things so we must be willing to step deeper into the text and the source languages to understand it (because Hebrew to English isn’t always 100% cut and dry). Hebrew words used in the Genesis creation account such as “happa’am” which literally translates into “at long last” (which Adam exclaimed after Eve’s creation) and Adam being asked to tend the entire garden and name all the animals, being put into deep sleep, being operated on for the creation of woman and the determination that man should no longer be alone (implying a period of loneliness on Adam’s part prior to Eve’s creation) would be hard, hard pressed to fit into a single 24 hour day. Also biblical references to the “generations of creation” and the biblical statement that a thousand years is like a day to God is compelling. These are just some things to consider and by no means an exhaustive list and I haven’t even discussed how creation events and cosmological and geological ages of the universe and earth align with creation accounts LOL….and they do!!
Gleason Archer was perhaps the foremost linguistic theologian who ever lived and prior to his death his explanation of biblical Hebrew (which he was an expert) puts the literal explanation of "yom" as a literal 24-hour day in Genesis 1 and 2 in absolute question.....he is by no means alone in this interpretation. There’s an old story that goes that as a student of languages Gleason would actually take notes in one language class using ancient Hittite LOL!!
Admittedly I was raised in a typical young earth (6000 years) literal days creation household, but I've done my own independent study and actually attended a series of lectures on these very topics over this last weekend (believers actually read and study). I've also made it my personal goal in 2014 to finally come to terms with my position on the age of the universe/earth, biblical creation accounts in Genesis and Job (and elsewhere…yes there are more creation accounts than Genesis), and my definite position on evolution. I see definite evidence for microbial changes (ex: evolution of bacteria and viruses yet both remain bacteria and viruses – the flu virus) and definite speciation in very small animals under 10lbs. We see that some birds (ex: some finches) have evolved slightly due to environmental circumstances (yet remain finches), but no significant evidence for a "macro evolution" position (one species into another) has ever been completely validated. The fossil evidence of the cambrian explosion (so many, many animals suddenly appearing at once) and the totality of fossil record lacking any specific transitioning examples simply doesn't support a species to species (macro) evolutionary change (and yes I'm aware that 'science' only has 'evolution' not 'macro' and 'micro'). We merely have artistic renderings (including some definite artistic license....the classic "deer to whale" evolution example) to help make the case. But a definite record of fossils? None yet. Even though our universe if almost 14 billion years old that is not enough time for a large species to evolve into another; hence some sects of the scientific community push for an even grander age of the cosmos than has been established in order to compensate for this…….modern cosmology refutes this “even older universe” position.
At this point in time I am much more persuaded and adopt an old-earth creationist perspective as I can still make a definite distinction between the concepts of age and evolution while in absolute support of creation, but I plan on continuing to study more debates (old v young creation, old creation v evolution, young creation v evolution, etc…) and continue my independent reading (I read this material everyday and listen to debates on these subjects almost daily). I’ve already taken university level physics, biology, genetics and chemistry courses (yes believers study science in school also) so I grasp the secular, scientific position (not exhaustively LOL, but beyond an average layman).
I’m humble enough to admit that I don’t have all the answers and believe me that coming to terms with this is not something I take lightly (it shakes some believers to their core and others to cry "heresy!!"), but like others I will continue to search out answers honestly and proactively. I’m simply willing to examine both secular science and theology and do so with an attitude of learning and humility.
Although, my foundation is now and forever in Jesus Christ
You also have to realize that the Hebrew language is quite small. One individual can memorize every word in the language so attempts at producing new translations from the same available manuscripts can produce slightly different translations in terms of OT material. Not all linguists agree on how words translate. Often times the differences are very slight, but occassionally they're significant.
For example, the word "yom" in Hebrew means day, but "yom" can be translated according to 5 or 6 correct definitions. In terms of the Genesis creation account some textual critics say "yom" means a literal 24-hour day and other textual critics say that same "yom" means an age or expanse of time. In this case the context is needed to help define, but (in this case) the context still has support for both young and old earth creationist perspectives.
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The bible says many things such as bats are birds. (Leviticus 11:13-19)
These are the birds you are to regard as unclean and not eat because they are unclean: the eagle,[a] the vulture, the black vulture, 14 the red kite, any kind of black kite, 15 any kind of raven, 16 the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, 17 the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, 18 the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, 19 the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the bat.
???
Modern classifications of animals are not found in the bible. Typically animals were grouped or referred to according to their own "kind" in scripture. That said, it would not be incorrect for the ancient hebraic culture to classify a winged animal (such as a bat) that has movements and hunting abilities similar to a bird within that type of animal kind. It's not a biblical error, but it certainly is a difference in classification methods of the ancient hebraic culture and today's modern biological animal taxonomy.
In actuality the crux of the verse is about the "cleanliness" of the animals as it refers to the Israelites and their alignment with Jehovah.
A species and a biblical "kind" are not the same.
For example, a dog is a kind of animal, but there are many breeds of dogs within the varying species of dogs.
God could bring forth many different species of dogs and breeds of dogs from a single kind of dog.
I suppose a kind would be more appropriately associated with a genus; although, the term "kind" isn't explicity defined in scripture nor is it directly associated with modern biological taxonomy.
If you step into the Christian worldview then you must allow God to be God and in doing so we trascend the bounds of naturalism. God neither requires the vehicle of evolution to bring forth many types of spiders from a single pair of spiders nor is he bound by the rules of man-made taxonomy.
For what it’s worth.
I'm just a regular guy...not a scientist...not a theologian. A regular guy that loves Jesus Christ and whose life was changed because of him.
If the earth is old then great. If the earth is young then great. Either way it was created by our Lord and Savior and I'm redeemed regardless.
Good thread....I enjoy these topics immensely! I always learn something new.
Hopefully it won't devolve into a typical "let's bash the Christians" dog pile thing.
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The bible is kind of a "greatest hits" compilation, and it has many authors. Yes, there are those who insist it's literal, but that's a tiny slice of Christians.
It's disturbing when people high-five each-other over "calling out" people over this, and patting themselves over the back when people contradict themselves.
How old is the earth, you piece of shit? Is it 10 seconds long? Does time hang eternally like a drop of dew on an orange leaf? Can your watch predict when time will end?
You have no imagination and your argument is the product of a simple animal brain living in the slice of a moment like a sample of a petri dish that has been scraped onto a slide.
You eat some mushrooms today? That was a very interesting paragraph.
My opinion on the earth, I'd say millions or billions of years old.
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For what it’s worth.
Good thread....I enjoy these topics immensely! I always learn something new.
Hopefully it won't devolve into a typical "let's bash the Christians" dog pile thing.
hey thanks for the detailed and thoughtful response
would love to get your input on the refugee situation in relation to the gospels, maybe in another thread 8)
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Good point. There can be evidence to support a given theory. Even compelling evidence. But that does not make it a fact.
Whether there is a God that created a universe or that the universe just popped up out of nothingness is both a matter of faith. Neither can be proven.
once again by this logic...is it possible to understand anything?
will the sun rise tomorrow?!?!?
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You eat some mushrooms today? That was a very interesting paragraph.
My opinion on the earth, I'd say millions or billions of years old.
Yeah, but what's that in dog years?
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that is what we are discussing
what's your position??!?
My position is somewhere between Nibaru and panty.
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My position is somewhere between Nibaru and panty.
I do recall you dismissing 100% of scientists on another subject so I'm gonna estimate your earth age at about 10,000 years.
:D
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Wes knows
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I believe that the earth is very very very very old.
God created it..... and life was here: dinosaurs and other creatures that are now wrongly identified as being human forebearers. (Scientists find these ancient skeletons. This appears to combat the "young earth" theory)
Life on that earth ended with some sort of "disaster". The disaster could have been a meteor strike. Or it could have been Satan hitting the earth after he was hurled down from heaven. Jesus witnessed this event. Jesus: “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven (Luke 10:18).
God then re-created earth. But the fossils remained. Ancient skeltons remained. God made a garden. God took dirt and breathed like into it and made man. This man was named Adam. From Adam's rib, God made Eve. Adam and Eve were given dominion over all of the earth. (This is the young earth that Christian's often mention)
Unfortunately, satan was on the earth. Satan eventually temped Eve to sin against God. Eve sinned and then temped Adam to join her in sinning. Satan then took dominion over the earth.
2000+ years ago, Jesus Christ took back what Adam & Eve had previously lost to satan.
Hey just noticed this.
One thing i don't get is how Jesus can see the earth get destroyed and live to tell about it. That tells me that Satan's arrival could not have been a catastrophic event...or was jesus in spirit form at the time before being born?
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no human can tell how old the earth is! And those who think they can, are some stupid mother fuckers believing their own lies!
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-science-figured-out-the-age-of-the-earth/ (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-science-figured-out-the-age-of-the-earth/)
http://www.space.com/24054-how-old-is-the-universe.html (http://www.space.com/24054-how-old-is-the-universe.html)
The universe cannot be younger than the objects contained inside of it. By determining the ages of the oldest stars, scientists are able to put a limit on the age.
The life cycle of a star is based on its mass. More massive stars burn faster than their lower-mass siblings. A star 10 times as massive as the sun will burn through its fuel supply in 20 million years, while a star with half the sun's mass will last more than 20 billion years. The mass also affects the brightness, or luminosity, of a star; more massive stars are brighter.
Dense collections of stars known as globular clusters have similar characteristics. The oldest known globular clusters have stars with ages between 11 and 18 billion years old. The wide range comes from problems in pinpointing the distances to the clusters, which affects estimates of brightness and thus mass. If the cluster is farther away than scientists have measured, the stars would be brighter, thus more massive, thus younger than calculated.
The uncertainty still creates a limit to the age of the universe; it must be at least 11 billion years old. It can be older, but not younger.
Expansion of the universe
The universe we live in is not flat and unchanging, but constantly expanding. If the expansion rate is known, scientists can work backwards to determine the universe's age, much like police officers can unravel the initial conditions that resulted in a traffic accident. Thus, finding the expansion rate of the universe — a number known as the Hubble constant — is key.
A number of factors determine the value of this constant. The first is the type of matter that dominates the universe. Scientists must determine the proportion of regular and dark matter to dark energy. Density also plays a role. A universe with a low density of matter is older than a matter-dominated one.
To determine the density and composition of the universe, scientists rely on missions such as NASA's Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) and The European Space Agency's Planck spacecraft. By measuring the thermal radiation left over from the Big Bang, missions such as these are able to determine the density, composition and expansion rate of the universe. The leftover radiation is known as the cosmic microwave background, and both WMAP and Planck have mapped it. [INFOGRAPHIC: Cosmic Microwave Background: Big Bang Relic Explained]
In 2012, WMAP estimated the age of the universe to be 13.772 billion years, with an uncertainty of 59 million years. In 2013, Planck measured the age of the universe at 13.82 billion years. Both of these fall within the lower limit of 11 billion years independently derived from the globular clusters, and both have smaller uncertainties than that number.
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Tooth DNA confirms ancient cousins lived alongside Homo sapiens and Neanderthals
http://www.sciencealert.com/fossilised-tooth-dna-confirms-ancient-cousins-lived-alongside-homo-sapiens-and-neanderthals
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He still is on earth, disguised as a president of the United States and yes, he is evil.
Lol, Obama is the devil, so was Bush before him and Clinton prior to that. I think it's fair to say that Bush Sr was also controlled by satan as well.
Why does lucifer get a pass on term limits?
Also who's in charge of China, South Korea and the Middle East in general?
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Not nearl as old as Wes.
;D ;D ;D
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Tooth DNA confirms ancient cousins lived alongside Homo sapiens and Neanderthals
http://www.sciencealert.com/fossilised-tooth-dna-confirms-ancient-cousins-lived-alongside-homo-sapiens-and-neanderthals
the bible says god created "adam" not... "denisovians"
8)
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the bible says god created "adam" not... "denisovians"
8)
If I well recall, the Adam and Eve story is not the original; it was copied from Sumerian mythology. I'm sure there are people here who know about this better than I do and can explain in more detail.
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If I well recall, the Adam and Eve story is not the original; it was copied from Sumerian mythology. I'm sure there are people here who know about this better than I do and can explain in more detail.
there's a couple problems with that
sumer is a 6000 year old civilization so...if the earth didn't exist the numbers don't work.
secondly, sumer is located in present day Iraq so uh we don't really talk about the history of that area
it just gets awkward
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How old is the Earth.
Hmmmm it's older than me (just)
And will No Doubt Last Longer Than Me.
HTH.
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there a couple problems with that
sumer is a 6000 year old civilization so...if the earth didn't exist the numbers don't work.
secondly, sumer is located in present day Iraq so uh we don't really talk about the history of that area
it just gets awkward
Sumerians, great culture and, as usual when it comes to great cultures they naturally exert great influence on smaller cultures. In this sense, Sumerian mythology spread across the Middle East and reached Hebrews/Jews. Also, the Babylon captivity put them in close contact with those myths. Many of the stories in the bible are actually retellings of Sumerian myths.
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Next up, "Is King Arthur Real? Was Guinevere cheating on him with Sir Lancelot? Do Thunderbirds really exist? And does Branch Warren have T-Rex DNA?"
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Great post. I wouldn't bother arguing with religious clowns. Life is to short.
This.
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By the way, where does the idea that the Earth is 6000 years old come from?
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By the way, where does the idea that the Earth is 6000 years old come from?
They added up everyone's age in the bible and it came to 6000 years. Bill Hicks taught me that.
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My position is somewhere between Nibaru and panty.
DAMMIT I made it with the wrong person :(
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Next up, "Is King Arthur Real? Was Guinevere cheating on him with Sir Lancelot? Do Thunderbirds really exist? And does Branch Warren have T-Rex DNA?"
Can we talk about Thunderbirds please? I'd enjoy that conversation.
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Next up, "Is King Arthur Real? Was Guinevere cheating on him with Sir Lancelot? Do Thunderbirds really exist? And does Branch Warren have T-Rex DNA?"
The brave, noble and gentle knight of the Round Table, Sir Pellias, gives his word of honor as to the existence of the great King Arthur.
(http://imageweb-cdn.magnoliasoft.net/bridgeman/fullsize/stc335713.jpg)
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They added up everyone's age in the bible and it came to 6000 years. Bill Hicks taught me that.
Well, the OT tells that in the beginning people could live for practically 1000 years.
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not what the bible says though
It was a MAN MADE BOOK that has gone on to be the #1 bestseller, but is ENTIRELY FICTION. It's about as real as the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter bunny. It's a story for adults who prefer to NOT deal with logic, rational thinking or reality. It's a MASS brainwashed state of delusion. Only the few that are fortunate enough to be able to think for THEMSELVES have escaped its tight grip.
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It was a MAN MADE BOOK that has gone on to be the #1 bestseller, but is ENTIRELY FICTION. It's about as real as the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter bunny. It's a story for adults who prefer to NOT deal with logic, rational thinking or reality. It's a MASS brainwashed state of delusion. Only the few that are fortunate enough to be able to think for THEMSELVES have escaped its tight grip.
my favorite quote ever actually comes from getbig, cant remember who or the exact wording, but along these lines:
"religion is an invention by men scared of their own mortality" or that cant face their own mortality,...something like that. I wish I could find it again
fuck religion and fuck the bible, hokiest shit ever
edit: here it is,...... Religion is something man created to cope with mortality.
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He still is on earth, disguised as a president of the United States and yes, he is evil.
Do you actually believe EVERYTHING your religion and political affiliation tells you to believe? How does it feel to be a mindless drone? I'm not even being facetious.
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no human can tell how old the earth is! And those who think they can, are some stupid mother fuckers believing their own lies!
Oh the irony. ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
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It was a MAN MADE BOOK that has gone on to be the #1 bestseller, but is ENTIRELY FICTION. It's about as real as the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter bunny. It's a story for adults who prefer to NOT deal with logic, rational thinking or reality. It's a MASS brainwashed state of delusion. Only the few that are fortunate enough to be able to think for THEMSELVES have escaped its tight grip.
I'm a simple man of faith. Given that I'm incapable of logical and rational thinking, void of reality, existing in a state of delusion and griped by religion that I'm unable to escape from? Further God is Santa and the bible is fiction?
Was that everything or did I miss any of the coffeehouse cliches?
You a lifetime atheist, a kid dragged to church that finally learned to think for himself or just trollin outta boredom?
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My guess is that you will find a serious correlation between
1) people who dropped out of high school or barely finished, and
2) people that believe the universe is only 6,000 years old.
You rarely meet a person with a Bachelors degree that will proudly say people and dinos used to be frolicking while Noah built his ark to fill with 2 of each animal.
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I'll put this here for the plebs to hear. Very recent.
There you go. Got that fixed up for you.
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My guess is that you will find a serious correlation between
1) people who dropped out of high school or barely finished, and
2) people that believe the universe is only 6,000 years old.
You rarely meet a person with a Bachelors degree that will proudly say people and dinos used to be frolicking while Noah built his ark to fill with 2 of each animal.
William F. Buckley was a practicing Catholic as is Bill O'Reilly.
Ted Cruz is an avowed Protestant.
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A little bit older than me, but not quite as old as Wes?
Hope you're well Wes. :)
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the bible makes no claims on the age of the earth.
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Some loving honesty from my heart for whoever is seeking God's grace:
All should turn from their sin, humble themselves before God, seek his forgiveness, believe that his death on Calvary's cross was loving payment for your sins, believe that he rose from the dead, confess him as Lord and Savior, be made a new person who is filled with his Holy Spirit, seek to hate sin, become a radically changed person who suddenly sees the world differently and seeks God's will for your life for the rest of your days.
Live for him. Seek him. Pray that he reveal his reality to you. Read his word. Study his word. Seek to truly understand his word. Feel his holy presence in your life. Worship him for he is worthy of praise. Love him as he has loved you. Represent Christ boldly, honestly and lovingly without fear. Spread his message of grace and redemption. Fear and know his wrath and judgement. Lovingly seek to keep everyone out of hell. Tell of the wonderful change God has made in your life.
I love you with a love established in Jesus Christ. He changed me and can change anyone. Forget man's silly debates and attempts to deny and suppress God. Forget organized religion and its man made nonsense. Surrender to the one and only God we all know exists. He is real. He is risen. He is alive. He is calling you today. Forget whatever mistakes you've made. Lay it all at his feet and be saved.
Love you all.
In Christ,
MOS
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Some loving honesty from my heart for whoever is seeking God's grace:
All should turn from their sin, humble themselves before God, seek his forgiveness, believe that his death on Calvary's cross was loving payment for your sins, believe that he rose from the dead, confess him as Lord and Savior, be made a new person who is filled with his Holy Spirit, seek to hate sin, become a radically changed person who suddenly sees the world differently and seeks God's will for your life for the rest of your days.
Live for him. Seek him. Pray that he reveal his reality to you. Read his word. Study his word. Seek to truly understand his word. Feel his holy presence in your life. Worship him for he is worthy of praise. Love him as he has loved you. Represent Christ boldly, honestly and lovingly without fear. Spread his message of grace and redemption. Fear and know his wrath and judgement. Lovingly seek to keep everyone out of hell. Tell of the wonderful change God has made in your life.
I love you with a love established in Jesus Christ. He changed me and can change anyone. Forget man's silly debates and attempts to deny and suppress God. Forget organized religion and its man made nonsense. Surrender to the one and only God we all know exists. He is real. He is risen. He is alive. He is calling you today. Forget whatever mistakes you've made. Lay it all at his feet and be saved.
Love you all.
In Christ,
MOS
what about the sins of the people who came before him?
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what about the sins of the people who came before him?
Like Abraham, righteousness was credited to them because of their faith in God.
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Wes's first PRO CARD in bodybuilding, the Master's of the Beginning of the UNIVERSE...
*** WES IS ON THE LEFT ***
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William F. Buckley was a practicing Catholic as is Bill O'Reilly.
Ted Cruz is an avowed Protestant.
Yeah, that was a very dumb quote/thought on his part.
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666 ^ 666 Satanic years - a number so large and beautiful that even Lucifer himself was startled by the barrage of digits.
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the bible makes no claims on the age of the earth.
This.
Among other issues, the fact that the Bible doesn't state how long Adam and Eve lived in the Garden of Eden before being exiled creates a little issue for a 6000 year old earth.
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the bible makes no claims on the age of the earth.
Christians sure do, though. Ask one.
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This.
Among other issues, the fact that the Bible doesn't state how long Adam and Eve lived in the Garden of Eden before being exiled creates a little issue for a 6000 year old earth.
All cleared up here, my friend, Kentucky:
http://creationmuseum.org
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Christians sure do, though. Ask one.
Not all. ;D And there are more such as I that could care less about such a trivial matter as the age of the Earth.
Be well.
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I pray daily. Raised Catholic. I live right.
But this article... Wow.
It explains a lot.
...about the idiocy of those who disregard scientific investigation and analysis and date the earth based on a mythological book written and compiled by men. Read a book beyond the Bible and you might learn something.
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...about the idiocy of those who disregard scientific investigation and analysis and date the earth based on a mythological book written and compiled by men. Read a book beyond the Bible and you might learn something.
Wait. So there are books other than the bible? Are you sure?
Ok, so if I want to know something about....oh I don't know......say ducks or Germany....that there's a book about ducks or Germany I can read and learn from?
Interesting.........very, very interesting.
Update.................. ....
So, I just talked to another Christian and he says your "book thing" is probably from the devil. Is it? Is it from the devil?!!! :o :'(
::) So weary of these limp, repetitive arguments and statements.
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So you, an idiot, are saying that fact which is readable from thousands of science articles around the internet, isn't fact if it is on Wikipedia? The difference here is simple. If crap is crap all over the internet, it will be crap in the Wikipedia. You and your kind of idiots can't understand the difference between the crap and the fact, so you are puzzled. Let me help you: The fact means a thing, a piece of information or knowledge, which has been proved to be a fact. As you remember, that proving thing was too hard to your kind of idiots, so you and the other foil hat idiots hasn't prove even a single detail of their fairytales, no matter which insane conspiracy theory we are talking about ;D
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...about the idiocy of those who disregard scientific investigation and analysis and date the earth based on a mythological book written and compiled by men. Read a book beyond the Bible and you might learn something.
The Bible, a book written by men who lived in different periods, and yet, they all agreed with each other...hmmmm
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Not all. ;D And there are more such as I that could care less about such a trivial matter as the age of the Earth.
Be well.
Do people usually speak in absolutes, though? I RARELY, if ever, mean all]. Figured it was just understood. Imagine how tedious it'd be to qualify every statement, or having to read someone else do it.
FTN.
I actually have a friend who does this instinctually, like a nervous tic: "That guy's a great drummer ... I mean, not saying he's the best drummer ever, or that some other drummer isn't better, just, you know ..."
I want to slap him every time.
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Do people usually speak in absolutes, though? I RARELY, if ever, mean all figured it was just understood. Imagine how tedious it'd be to qualify every statement, or having to read someone else do it.
FTN.
I actually have a friend who does this instinctually, like a nervous tic: "That guy's a great drummer ... I mean, not saying he's the best drummer ever, or that some other drummer isn't better, just, you know ..."
I want to slap him every time.
Hence my use of that "smilie" thing. ;D
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what's the verdict here?
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How old is the earth? Short answer: depends on your intelligence.
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not what the bible says though
The 6,000 yrs figure was from some bible scholar , Bishop Usher?
The bible doesn't provide an actual number of years.
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GOD has a 7000 year plan, 2000 from Adam to Noah, 2000 from Noah to Jesus, 2000 from Jesus to the millennial reign of Christ on Earth. We should be at 6000 years very soon so Christ reign should be very soon.
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It's a young earth. Not This Big Bang bullshit.
Where does petroleum oil come from?
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Wes can only reveal the truth.
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Where does petroleum oil come from?
Arco @ Palm/Kendall, friend. Damn close to three bucks again, bullshit.
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just out of curiosity why does it matter how old the earth is. We are here for 70 or 80 years and then gone. Why give a shit how old it is. Not gonna have an impact on your life
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The 6,000 yrs figure was from some bible scholar , Bishop Usher?
The bible doesn't provide an actual number of years.
this is an important distinction. Looks like the fellow's name was "Ussher"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ussher_chronology
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just out of curiosity why does it matter how old the earth is. We are here for 70 or 80 years and then gone. Why give a shit how old it is. Not gonna have an impact on your life
No Potato. We are only being tested before eternity in heaven. Duh. No proof though.
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No Potato. We are only being tested before eternity in heaven. Duh. No proof though.
fuk i hope not--all i want is a dirt nap
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My guess is that you will find a serious correlation between
1) people who dropped out of high school or barely finished, and
2) people that believe the universe is only 6,000 years old.
You rarely meet a person with a Bachelors degree that will proudly say people and dinos used to be frolicking while Noah built his ark to fill with 2 of each animal.
That's not a guess, that is the fact which has been proved by science. And to see it yourself, all you have to do is compare the IQ of different nations. If IQ is high, there is lot of atheists and high tech, if IQ is low, there is lot of religious bigots and low tech. Highest IQs are in Asian countries, South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, China, where religion is quite different than in the Europe or in the USA. Lowest IQs comes from African countries, where Islam rules everything and people lives in the clay huts. Scientist have made this comparison and find out, that it is a fact. Higher IQ = less religious people, and other way around. It is quite easy to understand, because the less you can comprehend with your own intelligence, the more you are dependent to beliefs. This is proved also by the foil hat morons, who are able to believe all kind of crap no matter if it is possible in this universe or not, and they have been proved to be the most stupid part of human kind ;D
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That's not a guess, that is the fact which has been proved by science. And to see it yourself, all you have to do is compare the IQ of different nations. If IQ is high, there is lot of atheists and high tech, if IQ is low, there is lot of religious bigots and low tech. Highest IQs are in Asian countries, South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, China, where religion is quite different than in the Europe or in the USA. Lowest IQs comes from African countries, where Islam rules everything and people lives in the clay huts. Scientist have made this comparison and find out, that it is a fact. Higher IQ = less religious people, and other way around. It is quite easy to understand, because the less you can comprehend with your own intelligence, the more you are dependent to beliefs. This is proved also by the foil hat morons, who are able to believe all kind of crap no matter if it is possible in this universe or not, and they have been proved to be the most stupid part of human kind ;D
Europeans aren't religious, exceptions being the catholic countries..