Author Topic: Personal training observations......  (Read 3116 times)

DIVISION

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Personal training observations......
« on: July 17, 2008, 08:09:49 PM »

As I reflect over my time as a CPT, it seems that many place too much emphasis on the type of certification a trainer holds over the actual ability of the trainer when grading them.

I've worked with trainers who held all kinds of certs.....from the NESTA, ACE, NASM and everything in-between.

One thing that stuck out to me was how the NASM certified trainers tended to train the same way, without any actual deviation or imagination in terms of variety.  Too much emphasis on circuit training and "core" balancing at the expense of a structured basic workout split.

One trainer in particular comes to mind, a guy who had no training experience prior to his NASM cert, and over time I noticed how he really didn't have any experience to fall back on other than what he learned through the NASM.  When he had trouble keeping clients, I remarked to him that he probably should have gotten a basic certification to start out with so he could gain some experience before embarking on an advanced course like NASM. 

It was easy to see that he was very limited in terms of the kinds of exercises and routines he'd do, and most everything he did was a circuit of some type.

The guy was having middle-aged, out of shape housewives balance on one leg while doing alternating bicep curls or ball squats without any eccentric control.

Many of his routines weren't appropriate for the type of clientelle he was training and it did affect his ability to keep clients.

Despite having an upper-level cert, he was a below par personal trainer and this point was not lost on me.

When I was recently hired by a private studio, I learned what was common knowledge in this industry.

The quality trainers don't stay at corporate gyms........they get hired at studios or own PT businesses.

While I am grateful for the training experience I received while working for LA Fitness, it was only a matter of time before I moved on.

The owner of the studio I'm employed at looks down on corporate gyms as a whole and in no uncertain terms told me that the trainers that stay working at them are there for a reason.

They just aren't good trainers or are simply scared to branch off on their own.

I also learned first hand that this industry is truly sink or swim.

My "interview" for the job was training one of the owner's loyal longtime clients given only basic background info.......everything was impromptu and I had to showcase what I could do while the owner watched and took notes.

That truly is the best test for a CPT, the ability to perform under pressure and give a client what they want in lieu of the owner.

As it turned out, the client loved my workout and had no qualms about training with me again, so I was hired on the spot.

You have to be able to perform.

When people are paying upwards of $70/hr, there's just no room for excuses.

So yes........a higher-end certification may look nice, but it really has nothing to do with what kind of trainer you are.

It think it's ironic that I'm making three times more per hour than the people I used to work with, despite some of them holding ACE, NASM and ACSM certs.

Working out of a studio is really what being a CPT is about....

No salespeople, no politics, no competition with other trainers.

The freedom to come and go, have my own key to the place, and the backing of an owner who is only interested in seeing his PT staff succeed.

Seeing it from this perspective, I wonder why any good trainer would stay at a corporate gym.

It's really not even a consideration.


DIV
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candidizzle

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2008, 08:38:42 PM »
oh brother

division, you would happen to be a person trainer, would you ?

 ::)

The Coach

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2008, 08:51:53 PM »
As I reflect over my time as a CPT, it seems that many place too much emphasis on the type of certification a trainer holds over the actual ability of the trainer when grading them.

I've worked with trainers who held all kinds of certs.....from the NESTA, ACE, NASM and everything in-between.

One thing that stuck out to me was how the NASM certified trainers tended to train the same way, without any actual deviation or imagination in terms of variety.  Too much emphasis on circuit training and "core" balancing at the expense of a structured basic workout split.

One trainer in particular comes to mind, a guy who had no training experience prior to his NASM cert, and over time I noticed how he really didn't have any experience to fall back on other than what he learned through the NASM.  When he had trouble keeping clients, I remarked to him that he probably should have gotten a basic certification to start out with so he could gain some experience before embarking on an advanced course like NASM. 

It was easy to see that he was very limited in terms of the kinds of exercises and routines he'd do, and most everything he did was a circuit of some type.

The guy was having middle-aged, out of shape housewives balance on one leg while doing alternating bicep curls or ball squats without any eccentric control.

Many of his routines weren't appropriate for the type of clientelle he was training and it did affect his ability to keep clients.

Despite having an upper-level cert, he was a below par personal trainer and this point was not lost on me.

When I was recently hired by a private studio, I learned what was common knowledge in this industry.

The quality trainers don't stay at corporate gyms........they get hired at studios or own PT businesses.

While I am grateful for the training experience I received while working for LA Fitness, it was only a matter of time before I moved on.

The owner of the studio I'm employed at looks down on corporate gyms as a whole and in no uncertain terms told me that the trainers that stay working at them are there for a reason.

They just aren't good trainers or are simply scared to branch off on their own.

I also learned first hand that this industry is truly sink or swim.

My "interview" for the job was training one of the owner's loyal longtime clients given only basic background info.......everything was impromptu and I had to showcase what I could do while the owner watched and took notes.

That truly is the best test for a CPT, the ability to perform under pressure and give a client what they want in lieu of the owner.

As it turned out, the client loved my workout and had no qualms about training with me again, so I was hired on the spot.

You have to be able to perform.

When people are paying upwards of $70/hr, there's just no room for excuses.

So yes........a higher-end certification may look nice, but it really has nothing to do with what kind of trainer you are.

It think it's ironic that I'm making three times more per hour than the people I used to work with, despite some of them holding ACE, NASM and ACSM certs.

Working out of a studio is really what being a CPT is about....

No salespeople, no politics, no competition with other trainers.

The freedom to come and go, have my own key to the place, and the backing of an owner who is only interested in seeing his PT staff succeed.

Seeing it from this perspective, I wonder why any good trainer would stay at a corporate gym.

It's really not even a consideration.


DIV

I've got 4 certs and fell 6mos short of a degree in physiology and kinesiology. Bottomline is It doesn't matter what kind of degree you have if you can't produce results for you're clients and that holds especially true if you train with athletes

jpm101

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2008, 09:11:13 AM »
Division: might need to know that your Personal Training Observation post may not be the best way to win friends and influence people on this site.  Perhaps a wee bit pretentious. I would give most experienced BB'ers, with serious heavy duty gym time, much more creditability  than the vast majority of  CPT's, PT's or whatever.

This is not to show any malice towards you, but can be considered as  friendly advice. Noticed that some of the questions posted by yourself seem a little too basic for any kind of CPT. Also notice that some guy's who post here will drop the "my client" bomb, while also asking BB'ing 101 very simple/dumb questions.

I am sure you are highly acclaimed with-in your field, with your  CPT certification hanging from a gold  chain around your neck. Thanks for sharing you training time values with us all. Good Luck.
F

DIVISION

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2008, 04:20:59 PM »
Division: might need to know that your Personal Training Observation post may not be the best way to win friends and influence people on this site.  Perhaps a wee bit pretentious. I would give most experienced BB'ers, with serious heavy duty gym time, much more creditability  than the vast majority of  CPT's, PT's or whatever.

This is not to show any malice towards you, but can be considered as  friendly advice. Noticed that some of the questions posted by yourself seem a little too basic for any kind of CPT. Also notice that some guy's who post here will drop the "my client" bomb, while also asking BB'ing 101 very simple/dumb questions.

I am sure you are highly acclaimed with-in your field, with your  CPT certification hanging from a gold  chain around your neck. Thanks for sharing you training time values with us all. Good Luck.

I agree with some of your points, just to clarify, I'm not downing BB's or anyone else, really.....

My background is in powerlifting, not bodybuilding and I've been doing it for years, since I was in the military actually.

I needed the training experience, so I went the route many people go...

After about two years of that, I got a better job offer from a private studio.

I only ask questions that are specific or problem areas that I don't deal with much like the one for INSOMNIA.

I'm not claiming to know it all....



DIV
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bassmaster

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2008, 09:20:12 PM »
div, most nasm trainers do train their clients with to much empashis on core and balance as the focal point, but the norm. of beginer clients need this do to their sedentary lifestyle. its the pt job to analize and progress the client to another style.  i once had a client that was a total gym rat, applied some of nasm theroy, but of course saw that the most appropriate thing to do with him was to train him "DC" style.

Again yes experince plays a big role,  you were fourtanate enough to have that. most Nasm cert. holders are nerds.. lol.  well most of them .  trainers would say  that i skipped stabalization phase and went straight to the power phase.. haha  don't get made cause your resign rate sucks and im stronger.

Alot of these nasm trainers are so confident that they don't see any error in what they do and as a result do not learn how to become better. As for stayin in the corprate world, some people live of the fact that their a "master trainer" 2000 sessions serv.  and make most of the money cause new hire can't compete and turnover is high. Shit i can tell you this the p.e.s and c.e.s.  certs are so easy to get, just print out the ? with the answers and sell to the highest bidder. i do see myself doing my own thing, so i agree with you on that one.

Is charles glass nasm certified? :)


Eisenherz

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2008, 12:21:06 AM »
Personal trainers  ::)

The Coach

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2008, 07:19:09 PM »
Personal trainers  ::)

Another brilliant post by a clueless newbe.

mcb650

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2008, 06:57:57 PM »
I go to Gold's here in SoCal and they have quite a few personal trainers. I don't spend much time watching them, but I do pay attention when I'm doing cardio or whatever else. I notice a lot of emphasis on ab routines. I see them over on the floor doing crunches constantly. Sometimes I see them doing that plyometic stuff, jumping onto a stool and shit like that. I don't think I've ever seen them once take a client over to the free weights, and only rarely the cables. I figure about 90% of the people that go in for personal training tell them they want a tighter midsection, so the trainers and bosses just stick them on crunches and light machines for half an hour and then hop them on the treadmill for 15-30 and call it a day. It's pretty obvious when you sign up for a membership at a big gym that all they really give a shit about is your money, so it's no big shock to realize that they don't really care all that much about their PT clients' progress either.

A few people I talked to at a smaller gym I went to a few years back paid for PT there, and that gym contracted an independent training company to come in and work with clients and they were actually pretty good. Taught the fundamentals and emphasized weight training and proper form and all of that.

Generally I think the trainers at the big name gyms aren't there for the long haul, they're just doing that while they're in school or looking for their real career. I'm sure they're pressured by the management to spend only as much time with clients as they're paid for and to upsell or re-up their training contracs as necessary. If it's how you make your living and if you really care about your clients and their progress, you're probably desperate to get out of that environment and into a private studio or your own company.

Devon97

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2008, 06:45:28 AM »
As I reflect over my time as a CPT, it seems that many place too much emphasis on the type of certification a trainer holds over the actual ability of the trainer when grading them.

I've worked with trainers who held all kinds of certs.....from the NESTA, ACE, NASM and everything in-between.

One thing that stuck out to me was how the NASM certified trainers tended to train the same way, without any actual deviation or imagination in terms of variety.  Too much emphasis on circuit training and "core" balancing at the expense of a structured basic workout split.

One trainer in particular comes to mind, a guy who had no training experience prior to his NASM cert, and over time I noticed how he really didn't have any experience to fall back on other than what he learned through the NASM.  When he had trouble keeping clients, I remarked to him that he probably should have gotten a basic certification to start out with so he could gain some experience before embarking on an advanced course like NASM. 

It was easy to see that he was very limited in terms of the kinds of exercises and routines he'd do, and most everything he did was a circuit of some type.

The guy was having middle-aged, out of shape housewives balance on one leg while doing alternating bicep curls or ball squats without any eccentric control.

Many of his routines weren't appropriate for the type of clientelle he was training and it did affect his ability to keep clients.

Despite having an upper-level cert, he was a below par personal trainer and this point was not lost on me.

When I was recently hired by a private studio, I learned what was common knowledge in this industry.

The quality trainers don't stay at corporate gyms........they get hired at studios or own PT businesses.

While I am grateful for the training experience I received while working for LA Fitness, it was only a matter of time before I moved on.

The owner of the studio I'm employed at looks down on corporate gyms as a whole and in no uncertain terms told me that the trainers that stay working at them are there for a reason.

They just aren't good trainers or are simply scared to branch off on their own.

I also learned first hand that this industry is truly sink or swim.

My "interview" for the job was training one of the owner's loyal longtime clients given only basic background info.......everything was impromptu and I had to showcase what I could do while the owner watched and took notes.

That truly is the best test for a CPT, the ability to perform under pressure and give a client what they want in lieu of the owner.

As it turned out, the client loved my workout and had no qualms about training with me again, so I was hired on the spot.

You have to be able to perform.

When people are paying upwards of $70/hr, there's just no room for excuses.

So yes........a higher-end certification may look nice, but it really has nothing to do with what kind of trainer you are.

It think it's ironic that I'm making three times more per hour than the people I used to work with, despite some of them holding ACE, NASM and ACSM certs.

Working out of a studio is really what being a CPT is about....

No salespeople, no politics, no competition with other trainers.

The freedom to come and go, have my own key to the place, and the backing of an owner who is only interested in seeing his PT staff succeed.

Seeing it from this perspective, I wonder why any good trainer would stay at a corporate gym.

It's really not even a consideration.


DIV

DIV,
I actually think its the other way around. The WORST PT's ( the majority of the time) are the ones in a small private studio or have their own facility. However they are the best business people.

Remember the small boutique studio generally has wealthy old folks and baby boomers or fat rich house wives. They are not there for results. They are paying 100$/hr for the warm hug, the private atmosphere and general ambiance that the studio provides.
Because of their age and inactivity the overwhelming majority of these clients have chronic pain/health issues and dont want to do much of anything but chit chat and walk on a T-mill & watch the flat screen TV during a session.
Sure the upperclass clientele might lose a few lbs of fat and improve their resting heart rate a bit but what keeps them comming back is the rapport they have with the owner or trainer.

As far as certs , outside of the liability issue they have absolutely no value.

elite_lifter

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2008, 07:39:36 AM »
rep counters  ::) get a real job stop living off your wives money.
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The Coach

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2008, 07:54:09 AM »
rep counters  ::) get a real job stop living off your wives money.

Really? Whats your "real" job?

elite_lifter

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2008, 07:56:36 AM »
Really? Whats your "real" job?
Occupying space in your mind  ;D
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The Coach

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2008, 07:59:00 AM »
Occupying space in your mind  ;D

No, not really. You just happen to post in the same thread as me.

elite_lifter

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2008, 08:02:06 AM »
No, not really. You just happen to post in the same thread as me.
:o, not nice to call someone a noob like you did in your above post. The big guy will hear about that ;)
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thewickedtruth

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2008, 09:57:30 AM »
As I reflect over my time as a CPT, it seems that many place too much emphasis on the type of certification a trainer holds over the actual ability of the trainer when grading them.

I've worked with trainers who held all kinds of certs.....from the NESTA, ACE, NASM and everything in-between.

One thing that stuck out to me was how the NASM certified trainers tended to train the same way, without any actual deviation or imagination in terms of variety.  Too much emphasis on circuit training and "core" balancing at the expense of a structured basic workout split.

One trainer in particular comes to mind, a guy who had no training experience prior to his NASM cert, and over time I noticed how he really didn't have any experience to fall back on other than what he learned through the NASM.  When he had trouble keeping clients, I remarked to him that he probably should have gotten a basic certification to start out with so he could gain some experience before embarking on an advanced course like NASM. 

It was easy to see that he was very limited in terms of the kinds of exercises and routines he'd do, and most everything he did was a circuit of some type.

The guy was having middle-aged, out of shape housewives balance on one leg while doing alternating bicep curls or ball squats without any eccentric control.

Many of his routines weren't appropriate for the type of clientelle he was training and it did affect his ability to keep clients.

Despite having an upper-level cert, he was a below par personal trainer and this point was not lost on me.

When I was recently hired by a private studio, I learned what was common knowledge in this industry.

The quality trainers don't stay at corporate gyms........they get hired at studios or own PT businesses.

While I am grateful for the training experience I received while working for LA Fitness, it was only a matter of time before I moved on.

The owner of the studio I'm employed at looks down on corporate gyms as a whole and in no uncertain terms told me that the trainers that stay working at them are there for a reason.

They just aren't good trainers or are simply scared to branch off on their own.

I also learned first hand that this industry is truly sink or swim.

My "interview" for the job was training one of the owner's loyal longtime clients given only basic background info.......everything was impromptu and I had to showcase what I could do while the owner watched and took notes.

That truly is the best test for a CPT, the ability to perform under pressure and give a client what they want in lieu of the owner.

As it turned out, the client loved my workout and had no qualms about training with me again, so I was hired on the spot.

You have to be able to perform.

When people are paying upwards of $70/hr, there's just no room for excuses.

So yes........a higher-end certification may look nice, but it really has nothing to do with what kind of trainer you are.

It think it's ironic that I'm making three times more per hour than the people I used to work with, despite some of them holding ACE, NASM and ACSM certs.

Working out of a studio is really what being a CPT is about....

No salespeople, no politics, no competition with other trainers.

The freedom to come and go, have my own key to the place, and the backing of an owner who is only interested in seeing his PT staff succeed.

Seeing it from this perspective, I wonder why any good trainer would stay at a corporate gym.

It's really not even a consideration.


DIV

i agree...

after being a PT for only a few months now. I still know why i hate PT's. It's not what you know but how you apply it. Just becasue the NASM said it was kosher or your ACE certification says you know what you're doing, you still might not. I have all of my fellow PT staff and even most of the sales staff at my current location training with me or always asking me for direction/advice with their clients. All I have is the NASM cert and to be honest, I think it's worthless.

Charlys69

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #16 on: August 05, 2008, 10:10:51 AM »
In the end everybody should learn as much as possible about Training & trying different Training-Systems to learn how much intensity & volume, what exercises, techniques, and so on.....your Body can handle, so you will progress over the long run....

Geo

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Re: Personal training observations......
« Reply #17 on: August 05, 2008, 07:28:44 PM »
it must be tough being a personal trainer and dealing with clients that you know (mentally) can't or won't take things to a next level as far as intensity...

I'm thinking if you're just gonna throw different variations of volume at them it would be easy