What exactly did Obama accomplish with healthcare reform?

[BM OUT]

240,the libertarian praising the destruction of America and patting Obama on the back.lol,what a clown.In two years the houses change,then the presidency in three years and all this will be overturned.Cap and trade will not pass anyway,in fact,I doubt Obama gets much more done.Democrats are not going to throw away their careers for him.He got this one by,but cap and trade,card check and the rest have no chance.

[Straw Man]

I know a doctor who I asked about this plan and you know what his answer to me was? 

"Stay as healthy as you can and avoid the need for any medical care, because you wont be able to get eventually".  

Anyone cheerring on this treason really should just be fucking shot at this point.  We have 12 Trillian on debt, 107 Trillion in unfunded liabilites we have no way to pay for, and people think its a good thing to add another entitlement on all of this? 

How fucking stupid are you people?

so according to this doctor you talked with he/she says that due to this bill eventually no one will be able to get health care?
so doctors will just be sitting around doing nothing?
If no one will be able to get health care then what will have changed for the 30 million + people who don't have health insurance and can't get health care now?

[Soul Crusher]

so according to this doctor you talked with he/she says that due to this bill eventually no one will be able to get health care?
so doctors will just be sitting around doing nothing?
If no one will be able to get health care then what will have changed for the 30 million + people who don't have health insurance and can't get health care now?

Straw - the reality is that there will be rationing and longer wait lines and restricted care.  They have already told you that many times yet for some reason you didnt want to hear it. 

Again - how do you add 30 Million new patients to a system without the medical providers to take in that new flood?  This is not complicated math, even for a lib like yourself.

Additionally, more and more docs are not taking medicade & medicare patients, just as millions and millions are both retiring and being moved on to medicade.  BTW - they are financing this mess with 500 billion in medicare cuts at the very same time tens of millions of boomers are moving on to medicare. 

How you can not see this is just putting your head in the sand.   

[Straw Man]

Straw - the reality is that there will be rationing and longer wait lines and restricted care.  They have already told you that many times yet for some reason you didnt want to hear it. 

Again - how do you add 30 Million new patients to a system without the medical providers to take in that new flood?  This is not complicated math, even for a lib like yourself.

Additionally, more and more docs are not taking medicade & medicare patients, just as millions and millions are both retiring and being moved on to medicade.  BTW - they are financing this mess with 500 billion in medicare cuts at the very same time tens of millions of boomers are moving on to medicare. 

How you can not see this is just putting your head in the sand.   

The problem is that those predicutions are all from Repubs and they suck at predicting anything

Thats how I can ignore it

[Soul Crusher]

The problem is that those predicutions are all from Repubs and they suck at predicting anything

Thats how I can ignore it

You mean like the Stim Bill keeping UE below 8%?

[Straw Man]

You mean like the Stim Bill keeping UE below 8%?

No, I mean like every prediction that the GOP has made for the last 8+ years

Shit, let's go back to when Medicare was passed.  Didn't Reagan say that was just the first step toward socialism and that soon the govt would tell your kid what kind of job they would have.

If the GOP Predictions are correct then they will be evident soon enough

More likely they are completely wrong and we'll all know that soon enought too

[Soul Crusher]

No, I mean like every prediction that the GOP has made for the last 8+ years

Shit, let's go back to when Medicare was passed.  Didn't Reagan say that was just the first step toward socialism and that soon the govt would tell your kid what kind of job they would have.

If the GOP Predictions are correct then they will be evident soon enough

More likely they are completely wrong and we'll all know that soon enought too

Fool, Medicare has 34 Trillion in unfunded liabilities we have no way to pay for and you applaud this? 

Do you not even care about our national debt and fiscal insolvency we are racing to?   

[Straw Man]

Fool, Medicare has 34 Trillion in unfunded liabilities we have no way to pay for and you applaud this? 

Do you not even care about our national debt and fiscal insolvency we are racing to?   

doing nothing would only have gotten us there even sooner

[Soul Crusher]

doing nothing would only have gotten us there even sooner

Great, hopefully when and if a gop pres is in there with a gop congress they can do the same thing as this. 

If something is always better than nothing, as that is what is now the mantra, than good, I cant wait to see when the right does the same shit that just occurred. 

[kcballer]

Obama accomplished what he set out to do.  It shows as a leader he can get things done.  I would think there would be some praise from a political standpoint on this board.  Considering he took a massive risk and had failing support in his party, he rallied it around and go the bill through.  From a purely political standpoint it shows he can face adversity and still prevail. 

Lets make no mistake if this was killed every single republican on this board would be talking about how ineffective he is as a president, how stupid his is and so on.  But now he passed it he's still somehow ineffective because republicans didn't come along?  They were never going to vote for health care reform.  They never have in all their years of running congress and they never will.  It's against the principals of the party and all they hoped to do was stall it long enough, create enough fear and doubt in the public mind to win the 2010 primaries and kill any semblance of reform.

[Soul Crusher]

Obama accomplished what he set out to do.  It shows as a leader he can get things done.  I would think there would be some praise from a political standpoint on this board.  Considering he took a massive risk and had failing support in his party, he rallied it around and go the bill through.  From a purely political standpoint it shows he can face adversity and still prevail. 

Lets make no mistake if this was killed every single republican on this board would be talking about how ineffective he is as a president, how stupid his is and so on.  But now he passed it he's still somehow ineffective because republicans didn't come along?  They were never going to vote for health care reform.  They never have in all their years of running congress and they never will.  It's against the principals of the party and all they hoped to do was stall it long enough, create enough fear and doubt in the public mind to win the 2010 primaries and kill any semblance of reform.

The fact is that he has huge majorities in the congress.  it was not as if he was working with a 50/50 SenatE and 50/50 House on this. 

[kcballer]

The fact is that he has huge majorities in the congress.  it was not as if he was working with a 50/50 SenatE and 50/50 House on this. 

He did have majorities but lets not forget the in fighting that occurred in the democratic party.  They may all be under the same banner but their was a lot of dissension over this.  Particularly as the tea party gained momentum many were thinking more about themselves than the party.  You highlighted this quite a lot i believe 333.  The fact he could get them to vote through that in such a highly contentious issue shows he can be a very effective leader.  He never wavered on it, never questioned it in the face of growing anger.  He did what he felt was best and got his party to believe it too.  It's the one area i always thought Bush was great in, when he believed something he didn't waiver.  Right or wrong a leader has to do what he believes in.   Surely you can praise him for that 333? 

[Soul Crusher]

He did have majorities but lets not forget the in fighting that occurred in the democratic party.  They may all be under the same banner but their was a lot of dissension over this.  Particularly as the tea party gained momentum many were thinking more about themselves than the party.  You highlighted this quite a lot i believe 333.  The fact he could get them to vote through that in such a highly contentious issue shows he can be a very effective leader.  He never wavered on it, never questioned it in the face of growing anger.  He did what he felt was best and got his party to believe it too.  It's the one area i always thought Bush was great in, when he believed something he didn't waiver.  Right or wrong a leader has to do what he believes in.   Surely you can praise him for that 333? 

Oh I said from day 1 he is a true believer and no Bill Clinton.   

[shootfighter1]

They just passed a 2700 page bill costing $1.2 trillion in the first decade, adding 118 new federal agencies, and hiring 16,000 new IRS agents to enforce the $570 billion in new tax increases and police the mandated coverage, cut medicare over 600billion, increased taxes on various medical companies which will be passed onto us and a 4% tax increase on people making $200K/yr and people earning $ from investments...many are not millionaires/billionairs. This cuts into the upper middle class. Many of us agree on the good handful of provisions in this bill, it's the rest of it that is poor and should be ammended or repealed.  Even if the bill is repealed, they will keep the popular provisions at this point.

No increased competition, no tort or malpractice reform either.

[Dos Equis]

Obama accomplished what he set out to do.  It shows as a leader he can get things done.  I would think there would be some praise from a political standpoint on this board.  Considering he took a massive risk and had failing support in his party, he rallied it around and go the bill through.  From a purely political standpoint it shows he can face adversity and still prevail. 

Lets make no mistake if this was killed every single republican on this board would be talking about how ineffective he is as a president, how stupid his is and so on.  But now he passed it he's still somehow ineffective because republicans didn't come along?  They were never going to vote for health care reform.  They never have in all their years of running congress and they never will.  It's against the principals of the party and all they hoped to do was stall it long enough, create enough fear and doubt in the public mind to win the 2010 primaries and kill any semblance of reform.

I can't praise this at all from a leadership standpoint.  He was a complete failure from that aspect.  This guy campaigned on doing things differently in DC and talked a lot about bipartisanship.  It was pure lip service.  A true leader would not have disregarded the majority of the public and steamrolled the opposition.  I'm really not impressed. 

[kcballer]

I can't praise this at all from a leadership standpoint.  He was a complete failure from that aspect.  This guy campaigned on doing things differently in DC and talked a lot about bipartisanship.  It was pure lip service.  A true leader would not have disregarded the majority of the public and steamrolled the opposition.  I'm really not impressed. 

Uh you're thinking way too much with your angry right wing hat.  Leaders make tough decisions and follow what they believe in.  If a leader payed attention to polls all the time it'd be a pretty sh*tty presidency cause all it would take would be a little anger and he'd have to change everything again.  Republicans were the party of no, they never had any intention of wanting health care reform, if they did why didn't we have it during their control periods?  It's obvious they just wanted to stall and create fear.  This is landmark legislation that in 10-20 years from now will be seen as a great step forward for America.  Of course many a neo con will still be crying themselves to sleep.

[Dos Equis]

Uh you're thinking way too much with your angry right wing hat.  Leaders make tough decisions and follow what they believe in.  If a leader payed attention to polls all the time it'd be a pretty sh*tty presidency cause all it would take would be a little anger and he'd have to change everything again.  Republicans were the party of no, they never had any intention of wanting health care reform, if they did why didn't we have it during their control periods?  It's obvious they just wanted to stall and create fear.  This is landmark legislation that in 10-20 years from now will be seen as a great step forward for America.  Of course many a neo con will still be crying themselves to sleep.

You're thinking way too much with your liberal hack hat.  Put on your common sense hat.  A candidate who ran on a platform of changing the partisan environment in Washington failed to live up to that promise. 

If we were only talking about polls, you might have a point.  But it's much more than that.  It's grass roots opposition.  It's every Republican in DC opposing the bill.  It's the failure of our leader to work with the opposition.