The Mr. Olympia, REAL or FIXED?

[OneMoreRep]

OH GOD...HERE WE GO AGAIN...ANOTHER RACIST ASS TRYING TO HIDE HIS CONTEMPT UNDER QUESTIONS ABOUT A FIXED CONTEST.

Are you alright?  I have no racist intentions here at all.  Noticed how I mentioned that I didn't like the mass game Ronnie plays and I also said that Gunter receives too many gift wrapped placings.  How is any of that Racist? There is no tongue-in-cheek approach to anything that I said, so please refrain from calling me a racist.  I asked a simple question and only seek honest responses, if you don't like my thread, just say so, but don't assume Im racist.  Thank you sir.

Yeah I can just imagine in America (of all places) that a contest would be FIXED so a BLACK man would win. OK..Everyone line up as I pass out the PROZAC,  because the DEVIL has lost his mind.

Again, let's calm down.  I just want your honest opinion.

While for years that 'no leg' Arnold won contest and praise, no one said...Hey HE HAS NO LEGS!!! While Dorian's waist spread as wide as the Atlantic ocean that separates America from england, tore one muscle after another, looked blocky and clumpy, could barely pose to save his life, and won one undeserved award after another...no one stood up and complained. But let a man whose muscles have muscles and is aesthetically more pleasing than most of the bodybuilders out there and all we hear are complaints of fixed contests, unfair judging or comments on why is the reigning winner still winning...how dumb is that? Maybe he is winning because he IS THE BEST!! not because he is BLACK. Now sad to say it is always someone white on this board worshiping another hasbeen white BB who has been retired from the sport for years or in some cases the BB is DEAD yet is still being compared to the reigning champ. This is like complaining about Mike Tyson winning match after match in his hey day...was it because he was Black or was the fight FIXED...OR WAS IT BECAUSE HE WAS THE BEST!!?..

Samson, again times  have changed.  Back in the time of Arnold there were no mediums such as this to post *opinions* with regards to the sport.  Many people complained about Arnold and indeed *MANY* believe that the 1981 Olympia was fixed, but again, there wasn't a good medium to broadcast these opinions.  Sadly, only the late Mike Mentzer had the testicular fortitude to speak about about any atrocities he witnessed within the industry.  Moreover, this good brother of iron was later tagged a crazyman heavily influenced by narcotics, further taking away from any validity his point might have had.  Also, Samson, if you further along read my posts to Shawn Ray, you would have noticed that I mentioned that Yates shouldn't have won a few times as well.  Not picking sides here my friend, hell, for all you know I could be a black man as well, but never was my post intended to flare up any issues of race.  Please, refrain from it and read it again.

To say BB is such a small sport yet the backbone of all sports, it is amazing how much mindless complaining there is within and amongst the fans of the support. My opinion is if you are that unhappy about the sport and its judging, the fact that steroids are used, that the competitors are turning into the real SUPERMEN that have been depicted in the comic books for years, then give up on involving yourself in the sport; save us all the comments and complaints and let those and only those who really enjoy the sport do so without the snide commentary or complaints.

Mindless complaining?  Samson, bodybuilding is not just what you see in the magazines and it is not just what you see on the Mr. Olympia stage or any other Pro competition held.  Bodybuilding affects peoplefrom all stages of life.  Im not the only one unhappy with the judging taking place within the sport and if I were to take your advice and not involved myself in the sport because of my dislike of the judging, then I guess more than 80% of the competitors would also jump ship on that account.  The steroids have been around sincethe beginning of the sport, but that doesn't mean that everyone has to use them neither.  I also think everyone should have an opinion about the sport, it is WE the basic fans who do keep this sport alive.  We do INDEED pay for the tickets to go to these venues, we do INDEED buy all these magazines, we do INDEED pay for all these supplements that furthermore allowfor the supplement companies to sponsor Pros to promote their product.  We are INDEED the fans.

So far as my opinion of Jay Cutler...his character showed on the last Olympia as he complained "All the Mr. Olympia has to do is show up and he wins" (translation...he won because he is BLACK) Jay you sorry BASTARD...Jay should be given the DIPSHIT AWARD!!! ...NO, JAY...All a contestant has to do is show up with his SHIT TOGETHER and he will win. Ronnie has his SHIT TOGETHER Now go and get your SHIT TOGETHER AND STOP BEING THE BITCH WE ALL KNOW YOU ARE ANYWAY!!!!!

Let's not insult Jay Cutler, because unless you put in a year's worth of money, training and emotional and psychological warfare in order to prep for the Mr. O, then you can't really understand what he went through.  Again, this isn't about black versus white, we aren't living in an age of knuckle dragging bohemoths that still carry around a noose and sling racial terms. 

Please, let's get this thread back in the right direction 

[MisterGX]

Yo, do the math:
41 years of Mr. Olympia Contest
10 different Champions:
Dickerson & Samir
Multiple winners include:
Scott
Sergio
Arnold
Columbo
Zane
Haney
Yates
Coleman

8 out of the 10 claimed the title at least Twice
2 out of the 10 claimed the title Three Times
4 out of the 10 claimed the title Six Times
2 out of the 10 claimed the title Seven Times
2 out of the 10 have claimed the title Eight Times
1 out of the 10 will go onto win it an unprecedented 9 Times!
Ummmmmm, ya think barring an injury, jail time, kidnapping or over sleeping dude wont win again, even if we had different judges?
Appearently, he is THAT GOOD!

Co-Sign!!!  But I'm not gonna count Mr. Cutler in making an upset to that 9th title.

[Hulkster]

Same contest and looks better than Coleman 2001 in fact he looks better than both of them 

thats only because you completely ignore Dorian's horrible thighs in the "ab and thigh" pose..

[Hulkster]

Personally, I think Ronnie was dominant in all wins except for 2001 and 2002 relative to his competition that night.  Even in 2000, he destroyed Kevin in all back poses, and was still damn good from the front.

Dorian should have lost in 1994 (Shawn), 1996 (Shawn)  and 1997 (Nasser).

Haney should have probably lost in 1990 (Labrada).

They have all had their "gifts".

[ManBearPig...]

Samson should give me head while i call him my slave!

[FREAKgeek]

  Many of you here have mentioned that whenever an actual Mr. Olympia champion, the likes of Ronnie, is present that no one else has a chance, because it's not common practice for a reigning champion to be dethrowned.  Why is that?  We don't need to be a bunch of judges sitting in little booths across from the stage to be able to say that many times the reigning champ lacks many things that the underdog has, so what gives?

  I don't see the motive for a Mr. O to be fixed. And if there were, I'm sure Weider is smart enough to know that it will ultimately undermine his business, as you couldn't keep this secret. I for one pretty much agree with every Mr. O outcome since its conception. There have been close calls, but I can still accept it and certainly dismiss anything fixed. It makes sense that a Mr. O is likely to repeat because he is probably the guy with the best genes for the sport.  Statistically, it's only been around for forty years. This is not a sufficient sampling to truly determine an average likelihood for a Mr. O to win. Remember, from 1979 - 1984, we also saw 6 different men. With the likes of Haney, Dorian and Ronnie, it's simply an era of statistical variance.

[pumpster]

As for Jay, his waist is too wide in my opinion.  Much like Dorian's.  A wide waist is the most detrimental flaw to a bodybuilder - even moreso than a gut in my opinion.  A gut can be sucked in, but a wide waist cannot.

Yates' waist as opposed to gut is something ND refuses to acknowledge, and is why Yates suffers from virtually every angle. Coleman has an edge in frontal shots because of this advantage and the taper that results from a smaller waist and greater size.

[pumpster]

I don't see the motive for a Mr. O to be fixed. And if there were, I'm sure Weider is smart enough to know that it will ultimately undermine his business, as you couldn't keep this secret.

Weider's just has a certain philosophy on the outcome of the contest. As long as the outcome isn't outrageous, it doesn't hurt him at all and in fact generates controversy that is good for his business. There have been a number of controversial outcomes, all of which just happened to go to the incumbent. A little too convenient; 40 years of contests is sufficient re: sample size, given the relative number of questionable decisions already.

In a near-monopoly with the the top BB contest, he can basically arrange the outcomes any number of ways-business-wise it can be just as easily argued that it's better for him to stay with the same winners from year to year. Personally I think he'd have been smarter to allow fairer results that would've led to more interesting rivalries, but he believes that from a business standpoint having an established winner's more important.

[pumpster]

I don't see the motive for a Mr. O to be fixed. And if there were, I'm sure Weider is smart enough to know that it will ultimately undermine his business, as you couldn't keep this secret.

Ya, waist may be number one, along with taper in general.

Regarding calves, ND ignores the reality that calves and forearms while important, don't have the same relevance. You're right, Coleman's calves aren't small, which means he only loses a smaller number of points, based on shape. That's far less important than not having sufficient size.

[gordiano]

Well, I believe Kevin beat him in 2000
I believe jay beat him in 2001 but he failed the Drug Test so I had no problem with Ronnie keeping the title.

Say what? Everybody is on shit, Cutler was the only one caught.....

[Platz]

So far as my opinion of Jay Cutler...his character showed on the last Olympia as he complained "All the Mr. Olympia has to do is show up and he wins" (translation...he won because he is BLACK) Jay you sorry BASTARD...Jay should be given the DIPSHIT AWARD!!! ...N

I guess you missed that part when Ronnie commented how Jay "Been smokin crack"  .

Jay is one of the most dedicated pros are his frustration is understandable. He got his Sandow stolen in 2001, and he's pretty much accurate when saying "All the Mr. Olympia has to do is show up and he wins".

Next...

[Hulkster]

Say what? Everybody is on shit, Cutler was the only one caught.....

and the fact that he was caught makes all the difference.

If the rules are drug testing everyone and we all know they are all on drugs, those who get caught get DQ'd.

don't get caught.  Everyone else managed to "pass".

[NarcissisticDeity]

From an aesthetic standpoint, waist is probably the #1 factor.  Calves are important too, but Ronnie does have huge calves, just lacking the diamond cuts which would make them stand out better.

The waist is CRITICAL.  I agree ND does not acknowledge this!  Yet some of his other favourites do indeed have small waists!  E.g., Frank Zane and Steve Reeves.

No...Matt I have acknowleged a small waist is critical , probably more than anyone I was complaining back in 1993 when Dorian beat Flex and he had a ' wide ' waist and thick obliques that wasn't anywhere near this  

[fang]

This is BODYBUILDING, not beauty contest. I don't care if the general public is disgusted with ronnie's physique. The general public does not understand BODYBUILDING. It has been like this for many years and it will be like this for years to come. Forget about promoting pleasing, symmetrical and easthetic physique. It is only going to ruin the sports.

If we were to change the sports for the sake of getting more recognition from the general public, then the sports will lose all its respect and integrity. I expect to see the most muscular person win in a show, not a person whose physique would please the 'world'.

[NarcissisticDeity]

and the fact that he was caught makes all the difference.

If the rules are drug testing everyone and we all know they are all on drugs, those who get caught get DQ'd.

don't get caught.  Everyone else managed to "pass".

Hulkster Ronnie used Red White and Blue posing trunks at the 2001 and according to the I.F.B.B. rulebook in " article 12 - Posing and Stage Presentation subsection 12.1 posing attire : The posing attire must meet the following guidlines : 1. Male competitors will wear posing trunks of a solid , nondistracting colour which are clean and decent , Metallic materials such as , gold or silver lame' may not be used to make trunks. "

And subsection 12.2 of the I.F.B.B rule book " 12.Stage Presentation : The following points will be strictly adhered to durring the competitor's stage presentation : 2. The use of props durring the Prejudging or Finals presentation is structly prohibited. "

So lets see his posing trunks were not a solid colour and he used a prop USA flag , so if you want to get technical Ronnie was in direct violation of the I.F.B.B. rules and should be disqualified  

[pumpster]

probably more than anyone I was complaining back in 1993 when Dorian beat Flex and he had a ' wide ' waist and thick obliques that wasn't anywhere near this 

Like this? Unlike Ron, Yates also looks bad from the front. ND can only find bad side-shots of Coleman.

More of Yates' signature shots..

[bigdumbbell]

um both, really fixed

[nicorulez]

So ND, if what you are saying is correct, wouldn't Ronnie have been docked for wearing the "king" outfit last year.  He did look like a badass at 280 ripped pounds, but maybe the judges should have defaulted him if what you say is true.  Personally, I like the guys to put on a little bit of a show.  Regardless, I don't think it was fixed the last few years as Ronnie has handed Jay's ass to him each time.  To appreciate it, you have to see it on PPV or INHD.  The problem with the ironagers like ND who defend Dorian to the death is that INHD and PPV were not covering the Mr. Olympia during Yate's reign.  Thus, all you have are pics.  Pumpster showed a couple of vids of Dorian from 1992 and another year, and you can clearly see that the competition has gotten much bigger in the last then years.  In 1993, he was a badass, but I would love to see a real vid of that show to compare to a Coleman or Cutler.  Cutler will likely win a Sandow or two after Ronnie retires unless Branch gets a back or Phil puts on 15-20 pounds.

[NarcissisticDeity]

So ND, if what you are saying is correct, wouldn't Ronnie have been docked for wearing the "king" outfit last year.  He did look like a badass at 280 ripped pounds, but maybe the judges should have defaulted him if what you say is true.  Personally, I like the guys to put on a little bit of a show.  Regardless, I don't think it was fixed the last few years as Ronnie has handed Jay's ass to him each time.  To appreciate it, you have to see it on PPV or INHD.  The problem with the ironagers like ND who defend Dorian to the death is that INHD and PPV were not covering the Mr. Olympia during Yate's reign.  Thus, all you have are pics.  Pumpster showed a couple of vids of Dorian from 1992 and another year, and you can clearly see that the competition has gotten much bigger in the last then years.  In 1993, he was a badass, but I would love to see a real vid of that show to compare to a Coleman or Cutler.  Cutler will likely win a Sandow or two after Ronnie retires unless Branch gets a back or Phil puts on 15-20 pounds.

What I did type is correct it was right from the I.F.B.B. rulebook , I have no clue why he wasn't penilized in 01 or 05  maybe he got permssion for the Kings Robe and Crown?

I don't think contests are fixed in a WWE sense but there is somthing very odd when a guy wins the symmetry & muscularity rounds and loses by 4 points  Ronnie dominated Jay in 03 but on the score sheets in 04/05 its been close and Jay last year actually beat Coleman in the back double biceps shot !! Ronnie has owned that pose since 1998 and Jay of all people beat him , and I believe he won the rear latspread as well , so Jay is making ground on Ronnie .

[alexxx]

Who can outlift whom? Can Dorian Yates come close to Ronnie Coleman's training stats?

[Palpatine Q]

Who can outlift whom? Can Dorian Yates come close to Ronnie Coleman's training stats?

Yes Ronnie dominates the strength round every year.

And Dorian used to win the "iron warrior" round when he was competing. especially the year he tore his puny bicep.

[alexxx]

crap I though I posted that in the 165 page garbage debate thread. 

[fearANDloathing]

Yo, do the math:
41 years of Mr. Olympia Contest
10 different Champions:
Dickerson & Samir
Multiple winners include:
Scott
Sergio
Arnold
Columbo
Zane
Haney
Yates
Coleman

8 out of the 10 claimed the title at least Twice
2 out of the 10 claimed the title Three Times
4 out of the 10 claimed the title Six Times
2 out of the 10 claimed the title Seven Times
2 out of the 10 have claimed the title Eight Times
1 out of the 10 will go onto win it an unprecedented 9 Times!

...as it should be, THe Olympia is a BIG MANS TITLE! step up or step da fuck off
Long live the freaks - everybody wanna be a bodybuilder but nobody wanna,....well you know the rest

[HUGEPECS]

No...Matt I have acknowleged a small waist is critical , probably more than anyone I was complaining back in 1993 when Dorian beat Flex and he had a ' wide ' waist and thick obliques that wasn't anywhere near this  

HE'S 3 MONTHS PREGNANT IN THIS PIC.... LOL