remember one time i was doing incline benchs with this other guy i think we had on 275 at the time hes close to 300lbs i'm around 260-270, neither of us are fat and this young kid comes up 2 us and asks what to do because hes been training for a long time, always in the gym doesnt miss a workout. i ask him how long hes been training(he had no muscle at all) hes says...get this....i'm for real....no joke.....2 months, 3 to 4 times a week.