Income tax is illegal in the USA?

[The True Adonis]

Whats really funny is that Steam power owns everything oil-powered, yet the American government DOES NOT allow this form of energy as a viable option, nor the rest of the world for that matter, due to the bargaining chip that is oil and the sanctions one soverign entity can enact when it controls such oil resevoirs.

[240 is Back]

American allies like the UK want to be in our good graces.  Blair is unpopular, but England will be the absolute LAST country in Europe to suffer when world oil gets scarce.

There are plenty of viable alternatives to oil, but people who invent them seem to die lol...

[The Squadfather]

Look, I want a 9/11 investigation more than anyone.  But the war in afghanistan was, IMO, completely justified before 9/11.  Look at the details.  The US wanted the oil, we put taleban into power to help us get it, they changed their mind, and you know the rest!

1991-1997: Oil Investment in Central Asia Follows Soviet CollapseThe Soviet Union collapses in 1991, creating several new nations in Central Asia.

1995-November 2001: US Lobbies India Over Enron Power PlantEnron’s $3 billion Dabhol, India power plant runs into trouble in 1995 when the Indian government temporarily cancels an agreement.

September-October 1995: Unocal Obtains Turkmenistan Pipeline DealOil company Unocal signs an $8 billion deal with Turkmenistan to construct two pipelines (one for oil, one for gas), as part of a larger plan for two pipelines intended to transport oil and gas from Turkmenistan through Afghanistan and into Pakistan.

December 1995: Caspian Sea Said to Contain Two-Thirds of World’s Known Oil Reserves

May 1996: US Seeks Stability in Afghanistan for Unocal Pipeline

June 24, 1996: Uzbekistan Cuts a Deal with EnronUzbekistan signs a deal with Enron

August 13, 1996: Unocal, Delta Oil Plan Afghan Pipeline

September 27, 1996: Victorious Taliban Supported by Pakistan; Viewed by US, Unocal as Stabilizing Force

October 7, 1996: Future Bush Envoy to Afghanistan Wants US to Help Taliban Unify Country, Build Pipeline

October 11, 1996: Afghan Pipeline Key to ‘One of the Great Prizes of the 21st Century’

August 1997: CIA Monitors Central Asia for Oil Reserves

October 27, 1997: Halliburton Announces Turkmenistan Project; Unocal and Delta Oil Form ConsortiumHalliburton, a company headed by future Vice President Dick Cheney

November 1997: Enron and bin Laden Family Team Up for Project

December 1997: Unocal Establishes Pipeline Training Facility Near bin Laden’s Compound

December 4, 1997: Taliban Representatives Visit Unocal in Texas

Early 1998: US Official Meets with Taliban; Promote Afghan Pipeline

June 23, 1998: Future VP Cheney Raves About Caspian Sea Opportunities

August 9, 1998: Northern Alliance Stronghold Conquered by Taliban; Pipeline Project Now Looks Promising

December 5, 1998: Unocal Abandons Afghan Pipeline Project

Late 1998: Taliban Stall Pipeline Negotiations to Keep Western Powers at Bay

1999: US Ready to Fight For Oil, Especially in Persian Gulf and Caspian Regions
A top level US policy document explicitly confirms the US military’s readiness to fight a war for oil. The report, Strategic Assessment 1999, prepared for the US Joint Chiefs of Staff and the secretary of defense, states, “energy and resource issues will continue to shape international security,” and if an oil “problem” arises, “US forces might be used to ensure adequate supplies.” Oil conflicts over production facilities and transport routes, particularly in the Persian Gulf and Caspian regions, are specifically envisaged. [Sydney Morning Herald, 5/20/2003]

July 4, 1999: Executive Order Issued Against Taliban

December 20, 1999: Iran Said to Be Supporting Conflict in Afghanistan to Further Their Own Pipeline Plans

December 19, 2000: US Seeks Taliban Overthrow

January 21, 2001: Bush Administration Takes Over; Many Have Oil Industry Connections

May 16, 2001: Cheney’s Energy Plan Foresees Government Helping US Companies Expand Into New Markets

May 23, 2001: Former Unocal Employee Becomes Bush’s Special Assistant to Middle East and Central Asia

June 27, 2001: India and Pakistan Discuss Building Pipeline Project Through Iran

July 21, 2001: US Official Threatens Possible Military Action Against Taliban by October if Pipeline Is Not Pursued

August 2, 2001: US Official Secretly Meets Taliban Ambassador in Last Attempt to Secure Pipeline Deal

September 11, 2001: The 9/11 Attack

October 5, 2001: Study Reveals Significant Oil and Gas Deposits in Afghanistan

October 9, 2001: Afghan Pipeline Idea Is Revived

December 8, 2001: US Oil Companies to Invest $200 Billion in Kazakhstan
January 1, 2002: Ex-Unocal Employee Becomes US Special Envoy and ’Real President’ of Afghanistan

February 9, 2002: Pakistani and Afghan Leaders Revive Afghanistan Pipeline

February 14, 2002: US Military Bases Line Afghan Pipeline Route

May 30, 2002: Afghan, Turkmen, and Pakistani Leaders Sign Pipeline Deal

December 27, 2002: Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Turkmenistan Agree on Building Pipeline

this is a real eye opener.

[240 is Back]

this is a real eye opener.

yeah, i used to be super pissed about 9/11, but now i understand why.

most americans would look at that, (it was on the news all those years) and not understand it.

The taleban really did fck us over. 

[240 is Back]

So basically bottom line bro the gov't feels like its ok to have young americans die for oil just because they decided to serve for their countries because of obvious sugar coated gov't bs to lure them to serve just to die for oil?

the take the 'greater good of all' appraoch.

They lose 3000 soldiers who signed up knowing the risk.  As a result, 300 million Americans will live with low gas prices, stocked grovery stores, cheap airline flights, and safe society. 

The rest of the world doesn't have enough power or water and it's all downhill from here.  There can only be one superpower.

It's f'cked up, and I have been one of the MOST vehement anti-war folks here for the last 6 month.

But i think now that I understand the purposes, I agree with the elective war/pre-emptive action.  It has nothing to do with WMD, other than the fact that Iraq and iran wanted them because they saw us taking out their neighbors and knew they were next.

Sometimes ya just gotta give your cash to the guy with a gun on you.  Sadaam could have retired to Africa with millions and lived happily ever after.

[240 is Back]

Rob like dude seriously my respect level for you has gone up sky rocket. Just curiousity bro where the hell do you get all these resources unless you have connections in foreign countries?? I mean i'm pretty sure the gov't prohibits any news agency including BCC to give information such as what you know?

no, this is all common knowledge and free for americans to learn.  much of it is in the washington post and NY Times actually!  This used to be boring, business stuff to me til i went to school for it.  now I see the real reasons behind it.

it's about our security - but not in the "maybe sadaam will launch a missile at us" sense, cause that is nonsense.  It's about "will china or russia take the oil first, then one of THEm will fire a hundred missiles at us"?

Many people only understand mushroom clouds, so that pretext works.  But in the real world, it's about the intentions of others in ten years that matter most, and most people don't see it.
 
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&before_9/11=pipelinePolitics

[Eyeball Chambers]

Whats really funny is that Steam power owns everything oil-powered,

You sure about that? 

[240 is Back]

here's the kicker...

both the republicans AND democrats are right.

The republicans are right - we need to invade iraq and iran for our own longterm health and survival.

the democrats are right - the wars in iran and iraq, spending 400B on Iraq, these things ARE technically bullshit, since the WMD lie was a load of crap.

Together tho, you'll notice that the politicians in DC tend to do the same thing.  They will scale back forces or cut money a bit, but we aren't pulling out of Iraq, no way either party lets that happen. 

Losing a loved one in war is horrible - but many say they would do it again because they're fighting for our freedom and way of life.   Without iraqi oil, we will be dealing with hugo and china scooting up thru mexico in the next 15 years.  Imagine how scary that would be.

It is what it is.  I think that if everyone knew what I knew, they would actually SUPPORT the war, which is currently at something like 20% approval rating.

[Big N]

here's the kicker...

both the republicans AND democrats are right.

The republicans are right - we need to invade iraq and iran for our own longterm health and survival.

the democrats are right - the wars in iran and iraq, spending 400B on Iraq, these things ARE technically bullshit, since the WMD lie was a load of crap.

Together tho, you'll notice that the politicians in DC tend to do the same thing.  They will scale back forces or cut money a bit, but we aren't pulling out of Iraq, no way either party lets that happen. 

Losing a loved one in war is horrible - but many say they would do it again because they're fighting for our freedom and way of life.   Without iraqi oil, we will be dealing with hugo and china scooting up thru mexico in the next 15 years.  Imagine how scary that would be.

It is what it is.  I think that if everyone knew what I knew, they would actually SUPPORT the war, which is currently at something like 20% approval rating.

I guess let me stop with this political stuff cause i'm definitely not into politics. Hopefully we'll all live in peace and that's all i care about. I dont hate anybody, just gotta leave some room for PEACE....if we'll ever have some in this world.

[Mr. Intenseone]

In Canada, once you make any significant amount of money, the crown takes about 50%. 

So much for your "free" health care system...LOL!!

[Hedgehog]

here's the kicker...

both the republicans AND democrats are right.

The republicans are right - we need to invade iraq and iran for our own longterm health and survival.

If you would at least get your basic facts straight...

Nowhere are "the republicans" claiming that USA needs to invade Iran for the longterm health and survival.

Sure, you may find one or two extremists, but believe me, it's not the policy of the GOP. Show me any quote that would suggest that.

the democrats are right - the wars in iran and iraq, spending 400B on Iraq, these things ARE technically bullshit, since the WMD lie was a load of crap.

There has not been any war in Iran. Or did I miss something?


You bunch Iran and Iraq together for some reason, which is so wrong to do. Two entirely different countries.

Different ethnicities, different cultures, different languages, et al.

-Hedge

[a_joker10]

240 rants about quite a bit of stuff were he blurs non linked information into some weird sort of an idea.
This form of argument is very common with CTers.
For example  The ISI in Pakistan and the CIA worked together to support the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan. The ISI took members if the Taliban into Pakistan when it fled Afghanistan. The ISI now is protecting the Taliban leaders.
In CT thought the CIA is protecting the Taliban. Even though CIA and the ISI have different goals.

Ummm.... steam energy is made by burning coal, oil or natural gas. Unless you mean geothermal or nuclear generated steam.

Steam energy is then used to make electricity.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/power.htm/printable

[Hedgehog]

240 rants about quite a bit of stuff were he blurs non linked information into some weird sort of an idea.
This form of argument is very common with CTers.
For example  The ISI in Pakistan and the CIA worked together to support the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan. The ISI took members if the Taliban into Pakistan when it fled Afghanistan. The ISI now is protecting the Taliban leaders.
In CT thought the CIA is protecting the Taliban. Even though CIA and the ISI have different goals.

You can't be serious...

Don't they consider time frame and shit like that?

-Hedge

[240 is Back]

joker,

I never said the Pakis did anything with the mujahadeen - they're 15 years apart.

Do the CIA and ISI have different goals? We'll have to disagree on that one, as the connections between them are pretty well established.  Also the morning breakfast between CIA's Goss and ISI's top general/atta money man - that's an interesting little piece of info.

joker, my mode of thinking is evolving, but that doesn't change facts (ISI breakfast with future CIA leader ON 9/11) and it doesn't change what I've written here (I never once said ISI was in with mujahadeen, the mid-80s proxy machine for warring with USSR)

[a_joker10]

The CIA gave the ISI weapons to give to mujahadeen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inter-Services_Intelligence
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen

[240 is Back]

The CIA gave the ISI weapons to give to mujahadeen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inter-Services_Intelligence
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen

this is suddenly YOUR topic, mate.

You brought it up and accused me of subscribing to this theory, which I know nothing about.

now you introduce WIKI links to it.

Perhaps YOU are the CTer here.

[a_joker10]

No, I had this convo with you and Sandy in the past.

You actually stated that CIA started  al qeada. Sandy was the one with the ISI stuff. You just agreed.
Both aren't true.

However, I stray from that when it comes to 911 and the wars.  I have studied it for nearly a year now, and I know 911 was at the very least allowed to happen to get us into war.  This is murder, and whoever it was - the pricks at the FAA up to whoever ordered them - need to be in a cell for doing it.  And the Afghani and iraqi wars were both justified by terrorism (and the CIS started al quida to do our dirty work in the 80s). 

[240 is Back]

No, I had this convo with you and Sandy in the past.

You actually stated that CIA started  al qeada. Sandy was the one with the ISI stuff. You just agreed.
Both aren't true.

Did the CIA give any money, intel, training, or weapons to the mujahadeen to fight Russia in the 80s?

[Dos Equis]

In Canada, once you make any significant amount of money, the crown takes about 50%. 

I've heard this before.  I don't know why anyone would want to live there.  The tax rate is absurd.

[Mr. Intenseone]

I've heard this before.  I don't know why anyone would want to live there.  The tax rate is absurd.

But thats how they pay for their "free" health care !!

[Wombat]

here's the kicker...

both the republicans AND democrats are right.

The republicans are right - we need to invade iraq and iran for our own longterm health and survival.

the democrats are right - the wars in iran and iraq, spending 400B on Iraq, these things ARE technically bullshit, since the WMD lie was a load of crap.

Together tho, you'll notice that the politicians in DC tend to do the same thing.  They will scale back forces or cut money a bit, but we aren't pulling out of Iraq, no way either party lets that happen. 

Losing a loved one in war is horrible - but many say they would do it again because they're fighting for our freedom and way of life.   Without iraqi oil, we will be dealing with hugo and china scooting up thru mexico in the next 15 years.  Imagine how scary that would be.

It is what it is.  I think that if everyone knew what I knew, they would actually SUPPORT the war, which is currently at something like 20% approval rating.

240...this is all short term stuff to make very rich people even more rich...The fact of the matter is that we are being lied to not to save our country but to make people very rich...

What would be big deal if we let china or Russia move in and take the resources? While they are doing that for a decade or two, the U.S could make oil obsolete...We have the technology and the know how to do it today...Sure we would take a huge hit in our economy but in the whole scheme of things--- big deal..

Our government isn't giving us a better life by lying to us and making us all rich with material items.. we are just brainwashed into thinking that is what we need out of life...For the better of all life on earth, this war was not necessary at all...Its only necessary for total globel domination...which is what they are up to...I can't be proud of any one government who believes they have to dominate all humans and use scare (terrorist)tactics to do so...The only thing this does it make a even smaller group of people even more powerful...

[240 is Back]

What would be big deal if we let china or Russia move in and take the resources? While they are doing that for a decade or two, the U.S could make oil obsolete...We have the technology and the know how to do it today...Sure we would take a huge hit in our economy but in the whole scheme of things--- big deal..

Dunno... I think it's the societal redesign that would be crippling.

200 million cars in the US today.
170,000 gas stations in the US today.
The Big 3 Automakers.
Several big oil companies.

Of course I'd love to see organic, solar, geo, or another alternative fuel clean up, with a nice converter for your car and everyone wins.  But the pricks in charge are unwilling, there are trillion dollar groups in the world who will do anything to "end" alternative fueling.

You sound right.  But people are too greedy and powerful to let you try it.

[gtbro1]

The American people are too stupid to band together for any cause.  They fail to realize that the power is in the people and if the people do not want to pay on a large scale, there is nothing that can be done.

   sure. Since they take it right out of your check before you get paid,sorta hard to NOT PAY isn't it...but wait,I forgot,you don't get a paycheck because you don't have a job.(read mooch off mom and dad)

[a_joker10]

I've heard this before.  I don't know why anyone would want to live there.  The tax rate is absurd.

Except for being freaking cold Canada is good place to live.
But to be specific our tax rats are graduated. The upper bracket is 44% for both provincial and federal tax for all money earned over $107,000.
The realized tax rate would be more like 30%.

Our health care is now starting to help us bring in manufacturing jobs because the company doesn't have to pay health benefits.

Plus we don't have 30 million people without coverage.

[240 is Back]

Our health care is now starting to help us bring in manufacturing jobs because the company doesn't have to pay health benefits.

Perhaps you haven't yet met our good friend outsourcing.