Congress *and* Senate demand combat troops out of Iraq in 12 months

[ribonucleic]

Slim margins or not... that's now the official record.

Now comes the veto...

If American troops are still dying in Iraq in 2008 - and the economy has gotten as ugly as I think it's going to get - the Republican party will have only 2 choices:

1. Agree to impeachment - in effect, giving up a leg to save its life. Or,

2. Move to declare martial law.

By that point, the remaining zombies [20% of likely voters?] will not be sufficient to save the GOP from the passionate loathing of, essentially, everyone else. Faced with the prospect of banishment from power for at least a generation to come, we'll finally see exactly how far they're willing to go.

[headhuntersix]

By withdrawing troops now or giving a timeline this will embolden the enemy. The last time we did this we lost 3000 of our fellow citizens on 11,2001. Bill Clinton's withdrawl from Somalia and failure to see Bin Laden as an enemy caused those deaths. I think the next attack will be nuclear. This will be laid directly at the door of the libereral left who themselves will be banished permanently....People like u want us to loose for some unknown reason. It doesn't matter if you don't want the war..we have to win at this point. Your naive world outlook and increasingly un-American atitude is amazing.

[240 is Back]

martial law will cost the corporations trillions.  the nation will fall apart and enemies like Rus and China will make their move.

Bush has paraguay and cheney has dubai.  They be dipping out next year.  There will be no impeachment.  The war will end right before Bush leaves office.  We voted him in and gave him the blank check, this is what we get.

[Dos Equis]

By withdrawing troops now or giving a timeline this will embolden the enemy. The last time we did this we lost 3000 of our fellow citizens on 11,2001. Bill Clinton's withdrawl from Somalia and failure to see Bin Laden as an enemy caused those deaths. I think the next attack will be nuclear. This will be laid directly at the door of the libereral left who themselves will be banished permanently....People like u want us to loose for some unknown reason. It doesn't matter if you don't want the war..we have to win at this point. Your naive world outlook and increasingly un-American atitude is amazing.

I agree with this.  Even though I want our men and women to come home, passing a partisan bill with a hard deadline is clear green light signal to the enemy.

On the other hand, this is actually more substantive than those dumb resolutions criticizing the surge. 
 

[Cavalier22]

I hate partisanship. We need an independent, or at least someone from either party who is a honorable and  true LEADER.  A modern day Winston Churchill (preferably without the booze)

[militarymuscle69]

Slim margins or not... that's now the official record.

Now comes the veto...

If American troops are still dying in Iraq in 2008 - and the economy has gotten as ugly as I think it's going to get - the Republican party will have only 2 choices:

1. Agree to impeachment - in effect, giving up a leg to save its life. Or,

2. Move to declare martial law.

By that point, the remaining zombies [20% of likely voters?] will not be sufficient to save the GOP from the passionate loathing of, essentially, everyone else. Faced with the prospect of banishment from power for at least a generation to come, we'll finally see exactly how far they're willing to go.

why wait 12 months, lets pull out now. You seriously think that American soldiers are going to be willing to fight as hard and die for something that will end in 12 months no matter what?

[240 is Back]

passing a partisan bill with a hard deadline is clear green light signal to the enemy.

Oh.  I didn't realize after 4 years of winning the war despite a 2000 to 150,000 disadvantage, they needed motivation.  Yeah, this "green light" as you put it will make things tough as - um - they will do more bad stuff?

Look, Bush would run this war into the ground for 6 years with no results, and he'd be fine with it.  people see it's gone 4 years and they know we're no closer to any kind of win than we were after year 1.  Congress is simply doing what the people ask so they can keep their jobs.  You know, democracy?

[ribonucleic]

why wait 12 months, lets pull out now

You've sold me! 

Have your secretary draw up the papers and we'll sign them after lunch...

[headhuntersix]

Then we call all wear signs that say PUSSY....... . I wonder what lovely shade of uranium Salt Lake will look like in the winter.

[militarymuscle69]

Then we call all wear signs that say PUSSY....... . I wonder what lovely shade of uranium Salt Lake will look like in the winter.

you in SLC?

[headhuntersix]

Not me RIBO...I'm in KC currently..

[Decker]

By withdrawing troops now or giving a timeline this will embolden the enemy. The last time we did this we lost 3000 of our fellow citizens on 11,2001. Bill Clinton's withdrawl from Somalia and failure to see Bin Laden as an enemy caused those deaths. I think the next attack will be nuclear. This will be laid directly at the door of the libereral left who themselves will be banished permanently....People like u want us to loose for some unknown reason. It doesn't matter if you don't want the war..we have to win at this point. Your naive world outlook and increasingly un-American atitude is amazing.

I disagree with this assessment.  I think we are reviled b/c of US business investments in Arab lands.  At least that's what Bin Laden and his ilk say.  They don't want western culture in their homeland.

I think the whole "embolden" argument is propaganda b/c it is not provable.  It's mindreading.  How do you know what the terrorists will think?

A good counter argument would be:  The terrorists waited until the village idiot was installed as US president.  Bush's ascendancy to the presidency emboldened the terrorists to attack the US homeland.  They knew that would never be possible under Bill Clinton's watch.

[militarymuscle69]

Not me RIBO...I'm in KC currently..

Is Ribo mormon?? that would explain alot...

[militarymuscle69]

I disagree with this assessment.  I think we are reviled b/c of US business investments in Arab lands.  At least that's what Bin Laden and his ilk say.  They don't want western culture in their homeland.

I think the whole "embolden" argument is propaganda b/c it is not provable.  It's mindreading.  How do you know what the terrorists will think?

A good counter argument would be:  The terrorists waited until the village idiot was installed as US president.  Bush's ascendancy to the presidency emboldened the terrorists to attack the US homeland.  They knew that would never be possible under Bill Clinton's watch.

Yeah that's probably it, we know how quick Clinton would have acted when 9/11 happened!! LOL yeah that's it, they were scared of Clinton..lmao

[Decker]

Yeah that's probably it, we know how quick Clinton would have acted when 9/11 happened!! LOL yeah that's it, they were scared of Clinton..lmao

I'm not asserting the truth of the statement rather I'm showing the fallacy of the logic used.  But I really doubt that Clinton would sit in a child's classroom looking like a goddam dope for 20 minutes after being told our country was under attack.  Didn't President Bush just sit there?
I'm just speculating.

[headhuntersix]

Is Ribo mormon?? that would explain alot...

Not really..the CIA is heavily recruiting Mormons and such because they believ in the god and country crap..if u can get them to pull a trigger u have a pretty good troop I guess, atleast for that kind of work.

[militarymuscle69]

I'm not asserting the truth of the statement rather I'm showing the fallacy of the logic used.  But I really doubt that Clinton would sit in a child's classroom looking like a goddam dope for 20 minutes after being told our country was under attack.  Didn't President Bush just sit there?
I'm just speculating.

Clinton would have finished his BJ I can bet that... But that's right you libs want the president to run out of the school arms flailing, screaming and get the whole nation worked into a frenzy. We wouldn't want a president to be calm in a trying time while his cabinet members figured out the whole story. Kind of like when Reagan was almost shot, he remained calm and didn't get the nation worked up. I guess he should have held a press conference and screamed at his attempted killer...

[240 is Back]

I'm not asserting the truth of the statement rather I'm showing the fallacy of the logic used.  But I really doubt that Clinton would sit in a child's classroom looking like a goddam dope for 20 minutes after being told our country was under attack.  Didn't President Bush just sit there?
I'm just speculating.

FAA records show Bush knew about 3 of the hijackings, and 1 of the collisions before entering that classroom.

I'm not sure most people woudl have entered that classroom. 

[militarymuscle69]

FAA records show Bush knew about 3 of the hijackings, and 1 of the collisions before entering that classroom.

I'm not sure most people woudl have entered that classroom. 

not everyone can stay calm in an emergency. Tell me what good it would have done for him to run out of the school and hold a press conference..Could he had changed the course of the day?

[Decker]

Clinton would have finished his BJ I can bet that... But that's right you libs want the president to run out of the school arms flailing, screaming and get the whole nation worked into a frenzy. We wouldn't want a president to be calm in a trying time while his cabinet members figured out the whole story. Kind of like when Reagan was almost shot, he remained calm and didn't get the nation worked up. I guess he should have held a press conference and screamed at his attempted killer...

Since when does responding to an emergency translate into a confused hissy fit?

Let me put it in terminology you might be more receptive to:  Would Reagan sit there like a damn dope while the country was under attack?

I don't know either.

The only fact I do know is that Bush sat there doing nothing.

Nothing.

Your Reagan analogy is horrible.

[240 is Back]

not everyone can stay calm in an emergency. Tell me what good it would have done for him to run out of the school and hold a press conference..Could he had changed the course of the day?

Secret service protocol doesn't leave the commander in chief in an insecure, wide open campus like Booker was, on an announced visit, during an attack this nation hasn't seen in 60 years.

Plus, YES, when you say "Could he had changed the course of the day?", the answer is YES!!  Bush and Cheney were the only two human beings in the nation with authority to shoot down airplanes (thanks to convenient legislation they put in 2 months earlier). 

At 8:58 AM, he could have sat in his limo and ordered 77 and 93 shot down and saved abuot 150 lives.  So yes, my dear, he could have drastically changed the course of the day.

[militarymuscle69]

Secret service protocol doesn't leave the commander in chief in an insecure, wide open campus like Booker was, on an announced visit, during an attack this nation hasn't seen in 60 years.

Plus, YES, when you say "Could he had changed the course of the day?", the answer is YES!!  Bush and Cheney were the only two human beings in the nation with authority to shoot down airplanes (thanks to convenient legislation they put in 2 months earlier). 

At 8:58 AM, he could have sat in his limo and ordered 77 and 93 shot down and saved abuot 150 lives.  So yes, my dear, he could have drastically changed the course of the day.

blah blah blah......

[Decker]

blah blah blah......

But when you speculate as to what Clinton would do that's ok?

[militarymuscle69]

But when you speculate as to what Clinton would do that's ok?

LOL, I just do that to 240 because he thinks that Bush should have shot down the planes. I don't have a problem in the fact that he didn't. What if those planes could have been talked down, or if someone had retaken the hijackers and landed the plane safely. NO PRESIDENT has ever had to order a plane shot down on US soil, so we can say all day that we would have shot them down, but until in that position it is all just opinion.

[youandme]

LOL, I just do that to 240 because he thinks that Bush should have shot down the planes.

So your saying Bush should not have shot down the planes?