Author Topic: Mormon missionaries came by today (Read 4839 times)

Tre · « **on:** March 30, 2007, 07:29:58 PM »

And they are sticking to their guns about god having been a man before he became the god who created man, heavens, and earth.

Oldschool Flip · « **Reply #1 on:** April 02, 2007, 03:56:57 AM »

Gotta hand it to Mormons though. What a way to show people how lucky they are by sending them out into a world that mostly depises what they do and make sure they feel loved when they return. If that's not brainwashing to the fullest.

Butterbean · « **Reply #2 on:** April 02, 2007, 06:18:59 AM »

Tre, don't they also believe that Jesus and Satan were brothers?

Interesting Oldschool. I hadn't thought about that.

Tre · « **Reply #3 on:** April 02, 2007, 08:39:49 AM »

Yes - Jesus and Satan were brothers. A third of the 'hosts of heaven' followed Jesus, a third followed Lucifer, and they're fighting over the other third.

Butterbean · « **Reply #4 on:** April 02, 2007, 09:36:15 AM »

Quote from: Tre on April 02, 2007, 08:39:49 AM

Yes - Jesus and Satan were brothers. A third of the 'hosts of heaven' followed Jesus, a third followed Lucifer, and they're fighting over the other third.

Tre, you mean according to Mormonism, right?

The bible indicates that Jesus and Satan are NOT brothers as Jesus is God and Satan is a created being.

The bible does state that 1/3 of the angels (now demons) "fell" w/Satan, but all the others are Holy, meaning they worship God (Jesus). I had never heard the part of 1/3 being undecided. That must be in the Book of Mormon.

Tre · « **Reply #5 on:** April 04, 2007, 11:56:44 AM »

I think they're still nuts, but here's an explanation:

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Brochures/Is_Lucifer_the_Brother_of_Jesus.pdf

ATHEIST · « **Reply #6 on:** April 04, 2007, 01:43:48 PM »

They also believe the Garden of Eden was in Missouri or someplace..and that God and Jesus were two separate entities.
they also believe that Joseph Smith was an actual prophet and not just a crazy pedophile.

Tre · « **Reply #7 on:** April 04, 2007, 03:24:05 PM »

Quote from: ATHEIST on April 04, 2007, 01:43:48 PM

They also believe the Garden of Eden was in Missouri or someplace

That helps them to justify their claim that Jesus was not Black.

That's one reality that the most devout members will never accept.

Bigger Business · « **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2007, 05:04:57 AM »

yeah your jesus or god or whatever the fuck is way awesomer than theres

Tre · « **Reply #9 on:** April 08, 2007, 03:35:15 PM »

Quote from: STella on April 02, 2007, 09:36:15 AM

Tre, you mean according to Mormonism, right?

The bible indicates that Jesus and Satan are NOT brothers as Jesus is God and Satan is a created being.

The bible does state that 1/3 of the angels (now demons) "fell" w/Satan, but all the others are Holy, meaning they worship God (Jesus). I had never heard the part of 1/3 being undecided. That must be in the Book of Mormon.

My bad on that.

I asked one of the teachers for clarification today and he confirmed that 1/3 of the spirits in the "pre-existence" did indeed choose to follow Lucifer and that they were "cast out" by Jehovah, who is known as Heavenly Father by the Mormons.

The other 2/3 chose to follow JC and live on earth. The 1/3 who were cast out are not given the chance to live a mortal existence with a body here on earth. The 2/3 who went with JC are ALL the people who have lived or will live.

According to Mormonism, ALL people who have lived will be resurrected and get to one level or another in the afterlife, but some may suffer 'spiritual death' and not make it back to heaven at all.

I gathered some more info on other stuff today, too.

Butterbean · « **Reply #10 on:** April 10, 2007, 11:11:14 AM »

Quote from: Tre on April 08, 2007, 03:35:15 PM

The other 2/3 chose to follow JC and live on earth. The 1/3 who were cast out are not given the chance to live a mortal existence with a body here on earth. The 2/3 who went with JC are ALL the people who have lived or will live.

Are they saying that all people = angels? Or just that some angels became/become people?

Quote from: Tre on April 08, 2007, 03:35:15 PM

According to Mormonism, ALL people who have lived will be resurrected and get to one level or another in the afterlife, but some may suffer 'spiritual death' and not make it back to heaven at all.

I thought I had heard also that they believe that the resurrection of Christ made way for ALL people to be resurrected to eternal life, but that they would be in different degrees of heaven according to how "good of a Mormon" they were on earth. FOr instance, a Christian who is not a Mormon or a Muslim would be in the lowest level of heaven etc. I didn't know they believed in "spiritual death." Is that ceasing to exist or hell?

Quote from: Tre on April 08, 2007, 03:35:15 PM

I gathered some more info on other stuff today, too.

Please post more when you have time.

Colossus_500 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 10, 2007, 02:00:39 PM »

I also remember studying that people of color will never be able to achieve the status of being fully accepted in heaven. $:-\$

Dos Equis · « **Reply #12 on:** April 10, 2007, 07:04:21 PM »

Quote from: Colossus_500 on April 10, 2007, 02:00:39 PM

I also remember studying that people of color will never be able to achieve the status of being fully accepted in heaven. $:-\$

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=111923.25

CQ · « **Reply #13 on:** April 11, 2007, 04:12:00 AM »

Quote from: Colossus_500 on April 10, 2007, 02:00:39 PM

I also remember studying that people of color will never be able to achieve the status of being fully accepted in heaven. $:-\$

Well, isn't that just charming $:-\$

leaky_frog · « **Reply #14 on:** April 20, 2007, 11:27:37 PM »

Quote from: STella on April 10, 2007, 11:11:14 AM

Are they saying that all people = angels? Or just that some angels became/become people?
I thought I had heard also that they believe that the resurrection of Christ made way for ALL people to be resurrected to eternal life, but that they would be in different degrees of heaven according to how "good of a Mormon" they were on earth. FOr instance, a Christian who is not a Mormon or a Muslim would be in the lowest level of heaven etc. I didn't know they believed in "spiritual death." Is that ceasing to exist or hell?

Please post more when you have time.

According Church doctrine, angels can be divided into three classes, all of equal stature:
1) Spirits who have not yet come to Earth, and thus have no body,
2) Spirits of those who have died, and not yet been resurrected,
3) Resurrected beings with a perfect body.

Mormons do believe in three degrees of glory, or heavens. You don't have to be Mormon or Muslim or anything else to get into the bottom two, but yes for the top one. When Mormons talk about Spiritual Death, they are referring to being separated from the presence of God. Mormons believe in perpetual existence, or conciousness; ergo, we never cease to be.

leaky_frog · « **Reply #15 on:** April 20, 2007, 11:32:09 PM »

Quote from: CQ on April 11, 2007, 04:12:00 AM

Well, isn't that just charming $:-\$

Mormon doctrine allows for all people to receive full glory in Heaven, on condition of acceptance of the Gospel or Church, whether in this life or after death. There was a period beginning a few years after the foundation of the Church (1830) until 1978 when blacks could not hold the priesthood in the Church, though they could be baptized into the Church.

Parker · « **Reply #16 on:** May 07, 2007, 04:54:18 PM »

Frontline had a intersting two part on the Mormons. John Smith and Brimgham Young had multiple wives (plural marriage as they call . Young had 50+. They do this because Abraham had multiple wives

.

They talked about a massacre that the Mormons did on innocents, and then blamed it on the Indians.

Oh, and most of the women in these plural marriages are not lookers

tu_holmes · « **Reply #17 on:** May 08, 2007, 12:03:34 AM »

Quote from: Parker on May 07, 2007, 04:54:18 PM

Frontline had a intersting two part on the Mormons. John Smith and Brimgham Young had multiple wives (plural marriage as they call . Young had 50+. They do this because Abraham had multiple wives .

They talked about a massacre that the Mormons did on innocents, and then blamed it on the Indians.

Oh, and most of the women in these plural marriages are not lookers

Actually,

That's not entirely true.

The Men took multiple wives because as they traveled across the country, they tried to "spread their beliefs", and many of the men were killed for it...

Back then, a woman couldn't make it without a husband, so the men who were around, took those women in and made them their "wives".

Not saying the "Abraham" item isn't a part of it, but it is certainly not the whole reason.

24KT · « **Reply #18 on:** May 08, 2007, 03:25:52 AM »

Quote from: Tre on April 02, 2007, 08:39:49 AM

Yes - Jesus and Satan were brothers. A third of the 'hosts of heaven' followed Jesus, a third followed Lucifer, and they're fighting over the other third.

And Blacks are black because they were neutral when everyone was taking sides.

egj13 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 08, 2007, 05:52:46 AM »

Quote from: Colossus_500 on April 10, 2007, 02:00:39 PM

I also remember studying that people of color will never be able to achieve the status of being fully accepted in heaven. $:-\$

The church has changed their stance on blacks. They used to beleive that blackness was the mark of the devil but then BYU needed some athletes to stay competitive.

Parker · « **Reply #20 on:** May 08, 2007, 08:21:53 AM »

Quote from: tu_holmes on May 08, 2007, 12:03:34 AM

Actually,

That's not entirely true.

The Men took multiple wives because as they traveled across the country, they tried to "spread their beliefs", and many of the men were killed for it...

Back then, a woman couldn't make it without a husband, so the men who were around, took those women in and made them their "wives".

Not saying the "Abraham" item isn't a part of it, but it is certainly not the whole reason.

i gave a Cliff's Notes version. But Mormon fundamentalists use the Abraham excuse. It was said, by those who who were interviewd (Mormons and those who studied them) that John Smith was having difficulty controlling his sexuality (lust), meaning Trying to balance spirituality and sexuality. His first wife was the one who suffered....

leaky_frog · « **Reply #21 on:** May 08, 2007, 08:51:48 AM »

Quote from: egj13 on May 08, 2007, 05:52:46 AM

The church has changed their stance on blacks. They used to beleive that blackness was the mark of the devil but then BYU needed some athletes to stay competitive.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Tre · « **Reply #22 on:** May 08, 2007, 12:39:06 PM »

They preached that a woman couldn't get to heaven unless she was properly sealed or something. So, when the men got killed, someone had to marry the widows, to ensure that they didn't lose out on all their 'priesthood blessings' and whatnot.

Believe it or not, there are some pretty bright people who actually believe in this stuff (or at least who claim to) here in the 21st century.

egj13 · « **Reply #23 on:** May 09, 2007, 05:09:43 AM »

Quote from: garraeth on May 09, 2007, 12:48:21 AM

lol...and you know when you see a black student at BYU that he/she is an athlete

Funny cuz while I was going there I started to miss Asians...there's a complete void of cultural diversity there. Bunch of us whiteys...except, oddly enough, a fairly strong hispanic population around Provo -- omg there are some of the best mom and pop mexican food resturants in Provo and Orem...not what you'd expect out in whitey-ville. They I move back to southern california ("North Mexico") and all the mexican food here is shit corporate. Ironic.

Weren't there alot of hawaiian/samoans there?