Bonds is getting TOO CLOSE!

[pumpster]

Not much anticipation for this he loses despite getting it.

[bmacsys]

Not much anticipation for this he loses despite getting it.

Yeah, I really think nobody outside of San Francisco cares about either this record or his season home run record.

[OzmO]

Yeah, I really think nobody outside of San Francisco cares about either this record or his season home run record.

Not a lot of people here (SF bay area) give a crap either.

Bonds should just tie the record and then walk off the field for ever.  He's a disgrace.  He will never have the respect he thinks he deserves for what he's accomplished and that goes for Mark McGuire too.   

[MikeThaMachine]

Not a lot of people here (SF bay area) give a crap either.

Bonds should just tie the record and then walk off the field for ever.  He's a disgrace.  He will never have the respect he thinks he deserves for what he's accomplished and that goes for Mark McGuire too.   

Your blind to the fact that Barry is a serious candidate for the best player to EVER play the game of Baseball. Ignorance like yours never ceases to amaze me. What's next Jack Nicklaus was overrated, Michael Jordan was all hype, Carl Lewis had no competition, etc...

[bmacsys]

Your blind to the fact that Barry is a serious candidate for the best player to EVER play the game of Baseball. Ignorance like yours never ceases to amaze me. What's next Jack Nicklaus was overrated, Michael Jordan was all hype, Carl Lewis had no competition, etc...

I think Bonds has major issues that hurt him, of course the steroid thing. He is a known liar. How he treated his wife. His income tax issues. He treats most people like shitt including fans. He has never won a world series. He has terrible numbers in the post season. Add that shit up and it severely tarnishes him legacy.

[body88]

Your blind to the fact that Barry is a serious candidate for the best player to EVER play the game of Baseball. Ignorance like yours never ceases to amaze me. What's next Jack Nicklaus was overrated, Michael Jordan was all hype, Carl Lewis had no competition, etc...

A lot of sf fans get like this when people rip bonds. Almost like Bonds does not deserve the rep he has. He does not have a ring, and his postseason numbers do suck. That would hurt anyone. Nevermind a known cheater. Bonds has the talent to be considered one of the best to ever play the game. Problem is he took all kinds of illegal shit to get where he is record wise. That would taint anyones legacy. Makes what Hank did drug free even more impressive.

As for Jordan, Lewis, and Nichalus, they where not cheaters. You could come at me with the argument that we cannot know for sure if they took steroids or not, but that is a weak argument used by people who try to justify other players cheating. I know you wouldn't come at me with an argument like that

[body88]

I think Bonds has major issues that hurt him, of course the steroid thing. He is a known liar. How he treated his wife. His income tax issues. He treats most people like shitt including fans. He has never won a world series. He has terrible numbers in the post season. Add that shit up and it severely tarnishes him legacy.

Pretty clean cut case. All that would tarnish anyones legacy. The juice thing being the most obvious since it is cheating.

[MikeThaMachine]

A lot of sf fans get like this when people rip bonds. Almost like Bonds does not deserve the rep he has. He does not have a ring, and his postseason numbers do suck. That would hurt anyone. Nevermind a known cheater. Bonds has the talent to be considered one of the best to ever play the game. Problem is he took all kinds of illegal shit to get where he is record wise. That would taint anyones legacy. Makes what Hank did drug free even more impressive.

As for Jordan, Lewis, and Nichalus, they where not cheaters. You could come at me with the argument that we cannot know for sure if they took steroids or not, but that is a weak argument used by people who try to justify other players cheating. I know you wouldn't come at me with an argument like that

Well since they didn't used to even test how can you say it's cheating. Should they do investigations on every player to play after the introduction to steroids and void all their records and careers.

[Rearden Metal]

Pretty clean cut case. All that would tarnish anyones legacy. The juice thing being the most obvious since it is cheating.

Show me his negative test, body. Until then, s-p-e-c-u-l-a-t-i-o-n.

[pumpster]

Your blind to the fact that Barry is a serious candidate for the best player to EVER play the game of Baseball. Ignorance like yours never ceases to amaze me. What's next Jack Nicklaus was overrated, Michael Jordan was all hype, Carl Lewis had no competition, etc...

Time for you to get off his nutz just long enough to realize that he'll never be the clear-cut best ever player for various reasons, especially lack of heart. He doesn't have it even though you look past it and will try to excuse it. There have been other great players WITH that attribute coupled with great talent. He never had it and never will.

BTW stop preaching to others as if you somehow know better.

[pumpster]

Well since they didn't used to even test how can you say it's cheating. Should they do investigations on every player to play after the introduction to steroids and void all their records and careers.

You are so far up his ass that you refuse to accept your huge bias. Don't bother with yet another post that tries to excuse it.

[OzmO]

Your blind to the fact that Barry is a serious candidate for the best player to EVER play the game of Baseball. Ignorance like yours never ceases to amaze me. What's next Jack Nicklaus was overrated, Michael Jordan was all hype, Carl Lewis had no competition, etc...

The dude is on steroids.  Get over it already.   He will forever be held in suspicion and an astrix will be next to his name in the records books.

Jack Nicklaus and Michael Jordan were not.

Calm down.  Take a deep breath.

[Rearden Metal]

The dude is on steroids.  Get over it already.   He will forever be held in suspicion and an astrix will be next to his name in the records books.

Jack Nicklaus and Michael Jordan were not.

Calm down.  Take a deep breath.

Please prove that any other athlete IS NOT on steroids k thx.

[body88]

Please prove that any other athlete IS NOT on steroids k thx.

Proof of what others may or may not have done has nothing to do with it imo.

[body88]

Show me his negative test, body. Until then, s-p-e-c-u-l-a-t-i-o-n.

Not really. Bonds admitted under oath he took steroids. The testimony was leaked. he claimed he took them "unwillingly" but that does not change the fact he used them. The lawyer who leaked it just got 9 more months in jail this past week! His orig sentence we to lenient says a judge.

Not to mention who expects people to believe he did not know he was on juice for years? No test is needed to prove bonds cheated. The fact he is a cock sucker to everyone, has terrible postseason stats, and no ring tarnishes the greatest ever tag also.



 Barry Bonds testified to a grand jury that he used a clear substance and a cream given to him by a trainer who was indicted in a steroid-distribution ring, but said he didn't know they were steroids, the San Francisco Chronicle reported Friday.

Bonds told a U.S. grand jury that he used undetectable steroids known as "the cream" and "the clear," which he received from personal trainer Greg Anderson during the 2003 season. According to Bonds, the trainer told him the substances were the nutritional supplement flaxseed oil and a pain-relieving balm for the player's arthritis.
 
According to government attorneys, BALCO founder Victor Conte has identified the designer steroid THG as "the clear." A testosterone-based ointment was identified as "the cream." Olympic sprinter Tim Montgomery testified that Conte used flaxseed oil containers to send "the clear" to athletes.

According to a transcript of Bonds' Dec. 4, 2003, testimony reviewed by the Chronicle, prosecutors confronted the slugger with documents allegedly detailing the steroids he used -- "the cream," "the clear," human growth hormone, Depo-Testosterone, insulin and a drug for female infertility that can be used to mask steroid use.

[body88]

Well since they didn't used to even test how can you say it's cheating. Should they do investigations on every player to play after the introduction to steroids and void all their records and careers.

They can look at the leaked testimony where he admitted he "unwillingly" took juice.  They could take into account he had his best season ever as a geezer( only athlete in history to get better when they where over the hill). Check out his power numbers before and after. etc etc.


 Barry Bonds testified to a grand jury that he used a clear substance and a cream given to him by a trainer who was indicted in a steroid-distribution ring, but said he didn't know they were steroids, the San Francisco Chronicle reported Friday.

Bonds told a U.S. grand jury that he used undetectable steroids known as "the cream" and "the clear," which he received from personal trainer Greg Anderson during the 2003 season. According to Bonds, the trainer told him the substances were the nutritional supplement flaxseed oil and a pain-relieving balm for the player's arthritis.
 
According to government attorneys, BALCO founder Victor Conte has identified the designer steroid THG as "the clear." A testosterone-based ointment was identified as "the cream." Olympic sprinter Tim Montgomery testified that Conte used flaxseed oil containers to send "the clear" to athletes.

According to a transcript of Bonds' Dec. 4, 2003, testimony reviewed by the Chronicle, prosecutors confronted the slugger with documents allegedly detailing the steroids he used -- "the cream," "the clear," human growth hormone, Depo-Testosterone, insulin and a drug for female infertility that can be used to mask steroid use.

[OzmO]

Please prove that any other athlete IS NOT on steroids k thx.

Please prove to me ALL of them are.  k thx.

[OzmO]

Show me his negative test, body. Until then, s-p-e-c-u-l-a-t-i-o-n.

so was O.J.'s innocence.......k thx.

[tu_holmes]

so was O.J.'s innocence.......k thx.

OJ IS innocent... the Jury said so.

[pumpster]

Please prove to me ALL of them are.  k thx.

No one has to prove anything to you; most believe he was heavy into roids. Bottom line he loses badly in the court of public opinion, provable or not. Deal with it.

That's ASIDE from being an extremely unsavory character few care for.

[OzmO]

No one has to prove anything to you; most believe he was heavy into roids. Bottom line he loses badly in the court of public opinion, provable or not. Deal with it.

That's ASIDE from being an extremely unsavory character few care for.

Pumpster read higher up on the thread next time.   

I believe he was on steroids.  And i think he's an ass.

[Rearden Metal]

Pumpster read higher up on the thread next time.   

I believe he was on steroids.  And i think he's an ass.

I also believe he was on steroids, and I think he's an ass. Still, PLEASE FUCKING EXPLAIN TO ME HOW YOU DETERMINE WHICH ATHLETES ARE/WERE ON STEROIDS/GH OTHER THAN A TEST!!!.

Phsical manifestations of side effects are not apparent in all users. In fact, in most they are not noticable. Did you suspect Palmeiro used? Do you think Jeter does? If no, why not, because he doesn't have a big head (actually he does).

You don't know who's using because you can't know. There's hundreds of guys in every gym who use and you wouldn't have a clue, because they don't have insane muscle, aren't crazy strong, etc. Still, they are using.

MLB, NFL...shit Golf....EVEN TABLE TENNIS has a lot of doping going on. If you can pass the test, YOU ARE FUCKING CLEAR PEOPLE.

Until they test better or make everything legal, there is no even playing field. You don't know how long this has been happening. Steroids have been around for 50+ years, so your idols who were competing for big money WERE USING them for an edge. If you don't think so, you're naive.

So, where does that leave us for Bonds? Well, he's going to break a seemingly unbreakable record (until ARod and Bonds) that was set in an era where steroids existed, amphetamines existed and were rampant, and cocaine and other stimulants were used to perform. Guess what, he's playing the game just like it always has been played.

Why are we applauding Frank Thomas and not Bonds, because he's a nice guy? Why are we applauding Roger Clemens and not Bonds, because he is white? I don't get it. I applaud all these guys, Clemens is a hero of mine, and Bonds, whether you like him or not, is the most devastating hitter we've ever seen.

Stand up and applaud or sit down and shut up. Stop being hypocrites just because he's a dick.

[OzmO]

I also believe he was on steroids, and I think he's an ass. Still, PLEASE FUCKING EXPLAIN TO ME HOW YOU DETERMINE WHICH ATHLETES ARE/WERE ON STEROIDS/GH OTHER THAN A TEST!!!.

Phsical manifestations of side effects are not apparent in all users. In fact, in most they are not noticable. Did you suspect Palmeiro used? Do you think Jeter does? If no, why not, because he doesn't have a big head (actually he does).

You don't know who's using because you can't know. There's hundreds of guys in every gym who use and you wouldn't have a clue, because they don't have insane muscle, aren't crazy strong, etc. Still, they are using.

MLB, NFL...shit Golf....EVEN TABLE TENNIS has a lot of doping going on. If you can pass the test, YOU ARE FUCKING CLEAR PEOPLE.

Until they test better or make everything legal, there is no even playing field. You don't know how long this has been happening. Steroids have been around for 50+ years, so your idols who were competing for big money WERE USING them for an edge. If you don't think so, you're naive.

So, where does that leave us for Bonds? Well, he's going to break a seemingly unbreakable record (until ARod and Bonds) that was set in an era where steroids existed, amphetamines existed and were rampant, and cocaine and other stimulants were used to perform. Guess what, he's playing the game just like it always has been played.

Why are we applauding Frank Thomas and not Bonds, because he's a nice guy? Why are we applauding Roger Clemens and not Bonds, because he is white? I don't get it. I applaud all these guys, Clemens is a hero of mine, and Bonds, whether you like him or not, is the most devastating hitter we've ever seen.

Stand up and applaud or sit down and shut up. Stop being hypocrites just because he's a dick.

The issue here is not whether other players are on steroids, it is whether BONDS is on steroids and since you agree what does your post have to do with anything?

With or without steroids BONDS was a good player but his legacy will be forever marred with steroids.  He has shamed the game. 

[Dos Equis]

I also believe he was on steroids, and I think he's an ass. Still, PLEASE FUCKING EXPLAIN TO ME HOW YOU DETERMINE WHICH ATHLETES ARE/WERE ON STEROIDS/GH OTHER THAN A TEST!!!.

I don't think a guy adding muscle is proof that he is on the sauce.  You have to look at all of the facts.  Here is what convinced me:

- Complete transformation of his body.
- Doubled his homerun production.
- Head grew late in his 30s.
- Shoe size grew from 10.5 to 13 late in his 30s.  What is the non-drug use explanation for this?
- He admitted during his grand jury testimony that he was taking something, but claimed he thought it was flaxseed oil.   
- He was working hand-in-in-hand with a trainer who was using and selling and worked with an admitted dealer in Conte. 

The fact he didn't fail a drug test means absolutely nothing if he was taking something they couldn't test for.  Same is true of NFL players.  Only about 1 or 2 dummies turn up hot every year, when probably more than half the league is on something. 

[Rearden Metal]

I don't think a guy adding muscle is proof that he is on the sauce.  You have to look at all of the facts.  Here is what convinced me:

- Complete transformation of his body.
- Doubled his homerun production.
- Head grew late in his 30s.
- Shoe size grew from 10.5 to 13 late in his 30s.  What is the non-drug use explanation for this?
- He admitted during his grand jury testimony that he was taking something, but claimed he thought it was flaxseed oil.   
- He was working hand-in-in-hand with a trainer who was using and selling and worked with an admitted dealer in Conte. 

The fact he didn't fail a drug test means absolutely nothing if he was taking something they couldn't test for.  Same is true of NFL players.  Only about 1 or 2 dummies turn up hot every year, when probably more than half the league is on something. 

I agree with your assesment. Now, does Palmeiro exhibit these symptoms? My point isn't whether Bonds IS taking them, but with the contention that those who don't have symptoms and a snail trail simply aren't taking them.