Is America a democracy or a hidden dictatorship?

[seauantea]

Do you think it would be wise to leave existential decisions up to the general population? Before you answer read over the comments from members on this board as a random sampling of mean American intellect; other than yourself and perhaps Berserker nobody has that requisite capacity to understand the issues they would theoretically be resolving.

[240 is Back]

Do you think it would be wise to leave existential decisions up to the general population? Before you answer read over the comments from members on this board as a random sampling of mean American intellect; other than yourself and perhaps Berserker nobody has that requisite capacity to understand the issues they would theoretically be resolving.

I believe that the average citizen CANNOT begin to understand the longterm resource and logistical/positional issues facing our country.  I have an MBA and an undergrad in history, and I can barely understand scratching the surface of the issues- economics and history.  Seriously, it boggles the mind.  Not enough oil to run the world, everyone is borrowing beyond earning, everything is being financed, coups are continual to keep friends in office who give us advantages at their resources, oil oil oil...

I enjoy looking at it, but I'll never understand a fraction of it.  I DO know that there is a group of agencies that ensures our leaders do whatever it takes to keep momentum on our side, and to ensure we're the only superpower- and it IS working.  Without it, you'd have a kuscinish winning the presidency, ending the war, creating a vacuum that Iran/China fills, and our economy unravels.




however, to answer your question, there is no way the average american has a clue.  On top of it, when you mention it, they reply with a 4th grade insult, usually calling you crazy or rolling their eyes.  You see it here from grown men in decent fields - they believe the bucks stops at the white house and every 4 years, longterm US goals and interests reset.  That's naive, and they are dumb.

[ToxicAvenger]

Good posts, Junaid. You're steering clear of the whole trying to come off as tough thing and making very valid posts with excellent arguements. I am proud of you. 

i NEVER try to come across as anything at any point...if i did dont ya think i'd kiss more ass on the vagina board? orrr try to be more tough by posting less poems?


i'm ME always...let the cards fall where they may




now..

your preception of me is dictated by YOUROWN person.


..think about dat

[24KT]

In other words, this group would decide 20 years ago that we'll be grabbing middle eastern oil in 2007, and let those elected deal with teh day to day mgmt.  They keep us from allowing short term horizon issues in the popularity contests known as presidential elections, get into the way of multi-decade trends and activities. 

  DING, DING, DING!!!

[Slapper]

IMHO, America is a democracy which functions inside a structure set forth by a small quiet group who doesn't take suggestions when it comes to longterm US interests.

In other words, this group would decide 20 years ago that we'll be grabbing middle eastern oil in 2007, and let those elected deal with teh day to day mgmt.  They keep us from allowing short term horizon issues in the popularity contests known as presidential elections, get into the way of multi-decade trends and activities. 

It's necessary to ensure nobody dose anything stupid that hurts our LT position, just to keep a 4 year job...

Are you suggesting the existence of a separate body of power, not observed in the Constitution, that works "in the shadow" and is solely responsible for long term foreign policy, with powers above and beyond that of our presidente? Council of Foreign Relations?

I think that once a president goes into office, the cake is basically already cut, and he/she (or he-she of course) gets to enforce, possibly, 15% of that policy. I also believe that when the Commander in Chief puts his hands on an out-of-reach subjects (like universal health care) someone lets him know that the Fav-4 dont like that (Kennedy found out the hard way guess). Policy is really set when they go into office, and (I guess) this is why democrat or republican administrations seem suspiciously similar in their ways, differing only on shallow subjects.

What I think is particularly worrysome is that things have changed for the worst decision-wise. We no longer have the Edisons or Einsteins to get us out of this predicament. And God knows that when you leave foreign policy to a group of senile individuals... Let's just say that the anger brough about, in part, by the inhability to get a decent hard-on, is eventually transferred to the policy, culminating in gross errors like Iraq or Viet Nam.

The big difference? None of them is willing to take the fault.

Bye.

[240 is Back]

I can't speak on most of the things you said there, I just do not know, nor do i have the interest to learn.  Some scabs you just don't pick!

I do believe that a system is in place to make sure one guy doesn't get into office and fck up 50 years of work to keep his job for another 4 years.

It has to be there to ensure longterm things  - like food, energy, medicine, education, agriculture, etc, are able to grow according to plan without some nutjob getting into office and creating problems that we cannot undo.

Sounds like JFK (threatening to disassemble the CIA and stop entry into vietnam) butted heads with this group.  We know how that ended, and we know that every president since has done what has been asked of him.

And think about JFK... if he HAD ended the CIA, I bet we would be in WAY worse shape, resource wise, in the world TODAY.  All the quiet ops in the 70s, 80s, and 90s which gave the US advantages - we would have NONE of that.  And without the good work they do - would USSR have won the Colr War?  Probably.

So would JFK had - incredibly - hurt 2007 America greatly by dismantling it?  I think the answer is yes.  This quiet group just "does its thing" and keeps the place running without us ever knowing.

Interesting, scary, and needed all at the same time!

[24KT]

240, It's already too late for you... sucking up now at this juncture won't help you.

You've already opened up too many people's eyes to the truth about 911.

HH6 has already picked out your cell at Gitmo. 

[240 is Back]

LOL... what spf should I bring?  I don't want to get a sunburn.

911 is the elephant in every room now.  Everyone knows it and everyone is scared to comment on it for fear of ending up being labeled a nut or a traitor for the simple act of asking why a skyscraper fell.  Didja see the slip of Therea heinz Kerry starting nodding the instant they mentioned thermate when Kerry was being asked about it? LOL...

9/11 is a sad day in our nation's history.  It really is the JFK of our generation.  Everybody knows and the guilty know if they don't comment on it, and just wait it out, people stop caring.

[egj13]

LOL... what spf should I bring?  I don't want to get a sunburn.

911 is the elephant in every room now.  Everyone knows it and everyone is scared to comment on it for fear of ending up being labeled a nut or a traitor for the simple act of asking why a skyscraper fell.  Didja see the slip of Therea heinz Kerry starting nodding the instant they mentioned thermate when Kerry was being asked about it? LOL...

9/11 is a sad day in our nation's history.  It really is the JFK of our generation.  Everybody knows and the guilty know if they don't comment on it, and just wait it out, people stop caring.

what did you make of the bridge that collapsed due to the fire melting the metal?

[240 is Back]

what did you make of the bridge that collapsed due to the fire melting the metal?

I noticed the parts of the bridge didn't convert to powder before hitting the ground  

great fuel store burning, bridge metal softened and fell.  Look at the pic - it doesn't *vaporize* as everything did on 9/11.

On 9/11, everything in all 3 buildings was converted to talcum powder sized concrete BEFORE it hit the ground.  It was a dadburn miracle!

[egj13]

I noticed the parts of the bridge didn't convert to powder before hitting the ground  

great fuel store burning, bridge metal softened and fell.  Look at the pic - it doesn't *vaporize* as everything did on 9/11.

On 9/11, everything in all 3 buildings was converted to talcum powder sized concrete BEFORE it hit the ground.  It was a dadburn miracle!

do you have a picture of the "talcum powder?"

[240 is Back]

do you have a picture of the "talcum powder?"

Do your research.  It was 100 mc. sized particles that flooded the NY streets in those giant pyroclastic clouds.  Seriously, do yourself a service and research this.

[Old_Rooster]

Do you think it would be wise to leave existential decisions up to the general population? Before you answer read over the comments from members on this board as a random sampling of mean American intellect; other than yourself and perhaps Berserker nobody has that requisite capacity to understand the issues they would theoretically be resolving.

Great post, its always amused me that some folks here actually think they would make better decisions if they were in the oval office, more likely they would pee in their pants all day every day.

I know one thing, the Al Quaeda leader would probably be elected president if some here made decisions.  Hell some here would probably lower the flag to half mast every time an insurgent was killed.

[egj13]

Do your research.  It was 100 mc. sized particles that flooded the NY streets in those giant pyroclastic clouds.  Seriously, do yourself a service and research this.

Well I would expect that to happen. Cement itself will pass a No. 200 sieve (water won't even do that). So in a crash of concrete there would be a very fine dust in the air. I just want to see a picture of the pile of talcum powder that was all that was left after the building collapsed.

[240 is Back]

Well I would expect that to happen. Cement itself will pass a No. 200 sieve (water won't even do that). So in a crash of concrete there would be a very fine dust in the air. I just want to see a picture of the pile of talcum powder that was all that was left after the building collapsed.

This is the remnants of th building.  Just google 'wtc7 pile' in google images and see many more.
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e207/Mercury2/9_16_pic05.jpg

the concrete from the building was converted to those giant dust clouds containing microscopic talcum-sized particles of concrete which flowed thru the streets.  They left piles all over the city. 

And you can look at ANY OTHER "CONCRETE CRASH" in history and see that the buildings don't powderize - they land in piles of solid concrete.

google building collapse and look at the pics.  They're piles of floors, desks, walls, etc.  In the case of 9/11, the buildings were converted to dust.

I'm pretty much retired from arguing WTC7 for hours - if you research it, you will learn that no building in history has ever fallen like this from plain ol fires.

8 second video:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8403741864603265979&q=wtc+7+new&hl=en

[Old_Rooster]

just when you think it can't get any funnier, 240 posts something else.

I'm gonna call Jack from 24 and get him on the case!  He will have all this figured out in 24 hours.

[240 is Back]

hahaha

dude, look at the massiveness of this building, and just how isolated the fires were.  

I really see why the 911 commission never addressed WTC7.  Anything they released would have been an obvious lie!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5604260445787335188&q=wtc+7+new&hl=en

[Old_Rooster]

hahaha

dude, look at the massiveness of this building, and just how isolated the fires were.  

I really see why the 911 commission never addressed WTC7.  Anything they released would have been an obvious lie!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5604260445787335188&q=wtc+7+new&hl=en

sure

[ToxicAvenger]

hahaha

dude, look at the massiveness of this building, and just how isolated the fires were.  

I really see why the 911 commission never addressed WTC7.  Anything they released would have been an obvious lie!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5604260445787335188&q=wtc+7+new&hl=en

remember..repb christians dont believe in science.

either that or the muslims have it right and islam is actually the true faith cause it sure took an act of god/allah to get a buncha inexperienced muslims with no flying experience to pull of the greatest terrorism attack against the biggest army on this planet


either that...or, our army are a bunch of dumbfucks..apparently everyone ws sleeping that day..yet we level iraq in week

[Decker]

Do you think it would be wise to leave existential decisions up to the general population? Before you answer read over the comments from members on this board as a random sampling of mean American intellect; other than yourself and perhaps Berserker nobody has that requisite capacity to understand the issues they would theoretically be resolving.

We don't have a direct democracy in this country.  We have a representative form of government instead of a direct democracy.

The best example of a direct democracy is the lynch mob.

An indirect democracy allows cooler, more informed heads to prevail while still preserving constitutional considerations and the voice of the people:  governance by consent of the governed.

[vikingpower]

We don't have a direct democracy in this country.  We have a representative form of government instead of a direct democracy.

The best example of a direct democracy is the lynch mob.

An indirect democracy allows cooler, more informed heads to prevail while still preserving constitutional considerations and the voice of the people:  governance by consent of the governed.

.

Clearly an oversight, much like will transpire the next time you call at 4am for bail money

I am disheartened that in spite of my previous post informing this board about the true nature of American government, not one of you understands the fundamental difference between a democracy and a constitutional republic.

Democracy means athenian or direct democracy; That is to say a nation whose decision making process is directly in the hands of the people and not elected representatives. Imagine every decision being a referendum. Obviously this is not practical in a nation with over 200m eligible voters, even if there is only a 35 percent voter turnout.

A constitutional republic means elected representatives legislate based on the constitution, this is the how modern democracy manifests itself, but it is not democracy in the classic sense of the word.

at least teh 3 of us understand what the deal is ... sad nobody else seems to get this important distinction

[Decker]

Clearly an oversight, much like will transpire the next time you call at 4am for bail money

I am disheartened that in spite of my previous post informing this board about the true nature of American government, not one of you understands the fundamental difference between a democracy and a constitutional republic.

Democracy means athenian or direct democracy; That is to say a nation whose decision making process is directly in the hands of the people and not elected representatives. Imagine every decision being a referendum. Obviously this is not practical in a nation with over 200m eligible voters, even if there is only a 35 percent voter turnout.

A constitutional republic means elected representatives legislate based on the constitution, this is the how modern democracy manifests itself, but it is not democracy in the classic sense of the word.

I hadn't seen this post.  Sorry for repeating. 

We have a democratic republican form of government--i.e. indirect democracy.

[ToxicAvenger]

.


at least teh 3 of us understand what the deal is ... sad nobody else seems to get this important distinction

old relativity joke..

yeesh man..

[vikingpower]

i dont get it?

[ToxicAvenger]

i dont get it?

penrose i think once said...only 3 people on this planet understand relativity..

einstein...hawkings..

and we r still looking for the 3rd person..


guess ya didn't know..



btw..

did ya knowif a beam of light is travelling alongside of youand you r going 75% of the speed of light..if ya measurethe speed of that beam it'll STILL measure the same as it would if you were standing still..

relatively speaking!