Genetics for steroids

[Bluto]

Most people who become great bodybuilders have great genetics from day 1. These are the guys that start to compete early on - lee priest, shawn ray, jay cutler and many others. they would be way above anyone else even if they didnt take steroids.

then we have a few where you look at old photos nobody would expect them to be able to put on any serious mass, but they respond incredibly well for steroids, so in that sense, they have great genetics.

what can be said about this group? how common is it? maybe the gym is full of average trainers that would explode if they just did a few cycles... 

[trab]

I think there's a lot to be said for it. Particularly insulin/ HGH response.
In the old days you had the odd guy out who grew large aesthetically shaped beefy muscles that are, basically I believe,  marbled w/ fat IN the meat like a cut of steak. Muscle that grew and stored fat INTERNALLY in  that manner. (any pros want to volunteer for bicep biopsies?)

I think that the insulin/ HGH protocol some have got down, can transform the right individual to this, from scrawny. But, not everyone.

Genetics are everything. Look at Jay Cutlers teen photos. I was looking at some old Pics of Chick too - a born BBer.

I forget who said, "it's not just genetics anymore, it's genetics for large doses of AAS". I think theres something to that. It don't lessen the amt of devotion it takes to pull off developing it though. That's long hard work, period. But most of us are never getting there regardless.

[ThaRealist]

I think it is mostly genetics from being around the bodybuilders I have before they were even state level champions all the guys I know had great genetics and responded well to AAS...I don't have the same great genetics as alot of the regional champ guys I have seen in the gym, but my body responds to AAS like theirs do...Ex: I have taken a cycle of just Test enath. at 500mg per week before while my friends were taking the same cycle and I was the only guy to jump up 8lbs in just over 2 weeks and starting adding inches to every body part; my friends would get pissed about it and expected the same with their bodies, but their bodies never responded like mine to AAS....On a side note: I have seen some skinny guys in the gym that had great symmetry and muscle fullness naturally only use a cycle of deca and blow up; so I do think it is genetics....

[Arnold jr]

I think it is mostly genetics from being around the bodybuilders I have before they were even state level champions all the guys I know had great genetics and responded well to AAS...I don't have the same great genetics as alot of the regional champ guys I have seen in the gym, but my body responds to AAS like theirs do...Ex: I have taken a cycle of just Test enath. at 500mg per week before while my friends were taking the same cycle and I was the only guy to jump up 8lbs in just over 2 weeks and starting adding inches to every body part; my friends would get pissed about it and expected the same with their bodies, but their bodies never responded like mine to AAS....On a side note: I have seen some skinny guys in the gym that had great symmetry and muscle fullness naturally only use a cycle of deca and blow up; so I do think it is genetics....

Genetics for BB is the ultimate blessing in this world...unfortunately, I was not blessed with super being genetics. However, I am a firm believer that with the right protocol, in regards to everything under the sun that encompasses BB, even those without the genetics of Ronnie Coleman can be successful. Future Mr. O's? Maybe, maybe not...but the famous phrase "bodybuilding without genetics" is not an empty statement.

[trab]

There's a lot to be said for stubborn (but intelligently applied) determination over being born w/ the
equivalent of a silver spoon for whatever endeavor in life.  Those who are given much, often take it for granted.

But then, Some just aren't cut out to be all that huge. Bone structure will tell ya a lot there. Don't mean a guy cant put on 20-40lbs of extra nice shape & more strength w/ it though.

1st cycles can usually just kick but if done right w/ legit stuff. That why it's important for some of these
Dodo's to think & learn a bit before they leap.

I recall reading a interview of Dennis James, where he said he gained 70lbs the 1st year he started lifting.
That's outrageous. Lookin @ the guys thickness, I believe it.

[ThaRealist]

There's a lot to be said for stubborn (but intelligently applied) determination over being born w/ the
equivalent of a silver spoon for whatever endeavor in life.  Those who are given much, often take it for granted.

But then, Some just aren't cut out to be all that huge. Bone structure will tell ya a lot there. Don't mean a guy cant put on 20-40lbs of extra nice shape & more strength w/ it though.

1st cycles can usually just kick but if done right w/ legit stuff. That why it's important for some of these
Dodo's to think & learn a bit before they leap.

I recall reading a interview of Dennis James, where he said he gained 70lbs the 1st year he started lifting.
That's outrageous. Lookin @ the guys thickness, I believe it.

Speaking on 1st cycles.....My 1st true cycle was Winny the first week and then added tren acet. for 6 weeks stacked with the Winny and I went from 180lbs to around 205-210lbs in that time frame it was amazing...Every cycle after that has had Test in it and I wouldn't change a thing...I can sit at around 200lbs even not using a cycle in 8months out of the year and when I am on cycle I can get up to around the 220's and have hit 230's before...It does make a difference in what you use too though; I always recommend human grade Test if you can get it, I have tried other Tests that weren't human grade and it makes all the difference in the world....

[dragonheart]

I think theres 2 elements of the genetics debate:

1.  The shape and fullness of your muscle bellies
2.  How easy some people can build muscle

You would be referring to group 2, as in their receptors respond very well to the gear.  I think alot of average guys in the gym would respond fairly well and add alot of size.  But I doubt many would ever get to olympia caliber, if thats what you're asking.

[trab]

I think theres 2 elements of the genetics debate:

1.  The shape and fullness of your muscle bellies
2.  How easy some people can build muscle

You would be referring to group 2, as in their receptors respond very well to the gear.  I think alot of average guys in the gym would respond fairly well and add alot of size.  But I doubt many would ever get to olympia caliber, if thats what you're asking.

I agree. Look at where some of these boys Biceps and triceps tie in, Lee Priest 4 eg.
Theres just a whole lot more fibres there to fill out to start with. BUT - It seems to me, if done right on the right guy
the insulin/HGH trick can create actual new fibres, not just hypertrophy. 

[HYDROLICS]

I think there's a lot to be said for it. Particularly insulin/ HGH response.
In the old days you had the odd guy out who grew large aesthetically shaped beefy muscles that are, basically I believe,  marbled w/ fat IN the meat like a cut of steak. Muscle that grew and stored fat INTERNALLY in  that manner. (any pros want to volunteer for bicep biopsies?)

I often wondered this till a few yeas ago. I spoke with a person who works with cadavers and they told me that humans do not have intramuscular fat like bovines and other larger mammals.

[bigjohN79]

If you want to be the "best" in this industry I wouldnt say "practice makes perfect" like in other sports, genetics will ultimately win u the shows, with the mix of gear of course =)

[trab]

I often wondered this till a few yeas ago. I spoke with a person who works with cadavers and they told me that humans do not have intramuscular fat like bovines and other larger mammals.

That's interesting, I think there may be anomalies here and there though? Check out some of those ultra-Fattie women , You know, the ones where the triceps Fat hangs below the elbow . It's like WTF. Most people CANT develop that!
Does your friend work w/ a large # of specimens? I'm not doubting you & he right, but check out some of these monster dudes arms.  ANd synthol clearly seems to make new space available to capillarize IMO.
I Dont know, but REAL info (like your friends) is worth way more than Parrot talk.

[HYDROLICS]

well, yes he has seen a lot. But the conversation wasnt very scientific. I basically asked him and he responded. All he said was "no human muscle is different than a cows". He went on to say "its more like a deer". I am sure that there are some extreme cases with extremely sedentary people. But I do think that there is some truth to what I was told. I live in wisconsin and do a fair amount of hunting, an can tell you that deer and other larger game do NOT have intramuscular fat either, maybe its just in slow moving lazy animals? No idea here......maybe ill research it a bit.

anyone else know anything??

[trab]

well, yes he has seen a lot. But the conversation wasnt very scientific. I basically asked him and he responded. All he said was "no human muscle is different than a cows". He went on to say "its more like a deer". I am sure that there are some extreme cases with extremely sedentary people. But I do think that there is some truth to what I was told. I live in wisconsin and do a fair amount of hunting, an can tell you that deer and other larger game do NOT have intramuscular fat either, maybe its just in slow moving lazy animals? No idea here......maybe ill research it a bit.

anyone else know anything??

Yeah, I've cut up my share of Wis whitetails too. I wonder if you dosed  'em  w/ insulin & GH (Deer growth hormone? Wis DNR ought to get right on that ) and caged them if that would change the picture.   It would Be interesting to ultrasound or whatever it takes to get a internal picture of these dudes w/ 20''+ guns. THey's  way out of the ordinary.