Cutler 18 weeks out from the O.

[phyxsius]

Ronnie will always have more veins popping out all over his body (like Branch) due to massive stack of drugs but Jay will always be more cut and polished than Ronnie

[Necrosis]

Ronnie will always have more veins popping out all over his body (like Branch) due to massive stack of drugs but Jay will always be more cut and polished than Ronnie

MORE CUT? ahahahhahaha.

what do you define as cuts?

[XXXII/LX]

Too bad his arms will look the same way on contest day, just a little darker. 

[eliscominblue]

Ronnie will always have more veins popping out all over his body (like Branch) due to massive stack of drugs but Jay will always be more cut and polished than Ronnie

The drugs have very little to do with vascularity...genetics is the reason.  Ronnie has had pipe-like veins long before he started with AAS.

[pobrecito]

The drugs have very little to do with vascularity...genetics is the reason.  Ronnie has had pipe-like veins long before he started with AAS.

Drugs play a role.

How vascular you appear is due to the genetic depth of your veins relative to the skin surface.

However, the more muscle you grow, the more you stimulate angiogenesis (the growth of blood vessels).

If you look at Ronnie during his Olympia reign, he has gotten MORE vascular (even in his arms), and this is to be expected given his increase in muscularity; the muscle needs more blood to feed it oxygen and nutrients.

[eliscominblue]

Drugs play a role.

How vascular you appear is due to the genetic depth of your veins relative to the skin surface.

However, the more muscle you grow, the more you stimulate angiogenesis (the growth of blood vessels).

If you look at Ronnie during his Olympia reign, he has gotten MORE vascular (even in his arms), and this is to be expected given his increase in muscularity; the muscle needs more blood to feed it oxygen and nutrients.

Exactly.  The original comment was "massive amounts of drugs" being the reason that Ronnie is more vascular than Jay.  To assume that Jay is less vascular than Ronnie because he takes "less" drugs than Ronnie is incorrect.  Drugs play a role but aren't the reason a person has vascularity.

[240 is Back]

That conditioning at 18 weeks out is unbelievable. I know that he has pretty much held his condition since the Olympia because of his incredibly busy appearance schedule. The positive is that he has represented the sport well by appearing in such incredible condition even during his off-season. The negative is that most pros use the off-season to either give their receptors a break or to grow. You have to figure that without an off-season, Jay has done neither. In my opinion, 2007 will see a Jay Cutler without improvements. The question is whether an improved Ronnie will be enough to regain the title.

Everyone should read this twice.  Dead on accurate.

[240 is Back]

Ronnie will always have more veins popping out all over his body (like Branch) due to massive stack of drugs but Jay will always be more cut and polished than Ronnie

Everyone eats at the same buffet.

That extreme vascularity is from genetics.  If there was a pill that did that for Jay, you'd better believe he'd be all over that.  Ronnie has that garden hose bicep vein.  Titus had it too.  A guy like cutler will never have that.  nothing to do with what they take.  Genetics.

[gh15]

Jay looks good.

Unfortunately Big Ron is too old and beat up (atrophied left lat). The old Ronnie would destroy Jay. But Ronnie is done.

Jay has great legs - but his back, delts, arms seem to have a layer of water or fat that obscures any definition 
Somehow he has striated quads, but not in his lower back, delts, or triceps. Just weird.

im sorry to disturbe this lovely thread but let me clarify it for you some so no questions are left,,

1. ron is black and jason is white
2. ron as a clean bodybuilder now days would compete at 260lb while jason would at 220lb
3. ron and jason are in 2 diff leages when it comes to muscle quality
4. jason has seo in the bodyparts mentioned which makes his veins even less visible than what they could  have been,, ron has NO SEO in his arms or any other bodypart,,lots of growth and igf but not no seo
5. if jason wanted to go the no seo route he wouldnt be standing on the stage next to ron but would be placing lower at about the same placing as matarazza in his days,,
6. if ron comes with no lat again he will lose again,, if he is healed he will be mr o,,as simple as that

[donrhummy]

2. ron as a clean bodybuilder now days would compete at 260lb while jason would at 220lb

Bull. This is right along with the same stuff said by Tom Prince. He said that completely clean/steroid-free he had to FIGHT to get below 240 lbs (was it 240?). Of course, that was quickly proven wrong. Not saying Ron would be as small as Pince but no way would he be COMPETING (i.e. super low fat) at 260 lbs completely clean.

[gh15]

ron = big fat black boy,,you see plenty of the at your gym,,only diff is ron got superior generic responspnse to hormones and been training in some way or another all his life,,

thomas = white thin swimmer build with superior response to hormones

thomas = 180lb clean or natural

ron = 250lb clean or natural if not more,,,see lee haney and sergio oliva

[dorkeroo]

Bull. This is right along with the same stuff said by Tom Prince. He said that completely clean/steroid-free he had to FIGHT to get below 240 lbs (was it 240?). Of course, that was quickly proven wrong. Not saying Ron would be as small as Pince but no way would he be COMPETING (i.e. super low fat) at 260 lbs completely clean.

Are you telling me that a 5'10" man at 260lbs natural in that kind of condition is not possible? gh might know some things about the bodybuilding scene, but, first year biology might not be his strong suit. I have been in school too long to believe that load of shit and neither should anyone else.

There is no hard and fast reason that either Ron or Jay have something up and over eachother. Many phenotypes are polygenic and as soon as you introduce exogenous hormones in the amounts these guys do, all bets are off. Nobody can predict any of this stuff.

[MADMAX6]

Everyone should read this twice.  Dead on accurate.

Why is it accurate?  Because Jay has been in great shape all year, that must mean that he nevers comes off and clean his system right?  WRONG, he never stops training, he's ALWAYS on his diet or close to it.  He's been off for a long time now and when he does start his prep, you will notice because he'll get a whole lot better.  I'll ask him if I can take some pics and keep you guys posted and show you the difference, if you guys think that Jay will not show improvements this year, you'll be really surprised.

[XXXII/LX]

Why is it accurate?  Because Jay has been in great shape all year, that must mean that he nevers comes off and clean his system right?  WRONG, he never stops training, he's ALWAYS on his diet or close to it.  He's been off for a long time now and when he does start his prep, you will notice because he'll get a whole lot better.  I'll ask him if I can take some pics and keep you guys posted and show you the difference, if you guys think that Jay will not show improvements this year, you'll be really surprised.

I fail to see the corralation between a wider waist and "improvement". 

[Sergio Rules 77]

Ronnie looks like a 60 year old pregnant drug addict with bitch tits. And whilst Jay's physique isn't my cup of tea, he hasn't looked as good since his NPC days. Take into account that the the reigning Mr Olympia always has a heads up with the judges and this year's O is practically a done deal. I think Victor is a bigger threat to Jay than Ronnie is. I've said it a million times but I'll say it again, what Ronnie has done to his body is such a shame .

SERGIO!!!!

[Sergio Rules 77]

I think ronnie looks very young...

He looks terrible in this pic. Not healthy at all.

SERGIO!!!!

[Sir William Idol]

how come jay can be so lean and have zero vascularity?

i was thinking the same thing.  ab etching / liposuction?

[Busted]

Bull. This is right along with the same stuff said by Tom Prince. He said that completely clean/steroid-free he had to FIGHT to get below 240 lbs (was it 240?). Of course, that was quickly proven wrong. Not saying Ron would be as small as Pince but no way would he be COMPETING (i.e. super low fat) at 260 lbs completely clean.

Ronnie was a college linebacker and already had a massive build before the drugs!  Jay is all drugs. Jay started taking Gear before Ronnie did, literally! (20-21 years old) and Ronnie is 7 years older than him! (started on the gear in the mid 90's) Ronnie turned pro at a Natural show! Yes when Ronnie is "retired" hes still going to be in the 250's range. Where Jay will fall around 190-210lbs.

Guys who were competing at "teen shows" IE Tom Prince, Jay Cutler, Branch etc. Are ALL DRUGS.  Ronnie didnt do a show until he was 26. And already competing as a heavy-weight.  Use some common sense here people!!!

[bigbiceps]

that will never happen, Jay is the Weider's wet dream, huge, blonde and blue eyed.

You forgot good looking and tall! 

Team Guntermania! 

[Tigerman]

im sorry to disturbe this lovely thread but let me clarify it for you some so no questions are left,,

1. ron is black and jason is white
2. ron as a clean bodybuilder now days would compete at 260lb while jason would at 220lb
3. ron and jason are in 2 diff leages when it comes to muscle quality
4. jason has seo in the bodyparts mentioned which makes his veins even less visible than what they could  have been,, ron has NO SEO in his arms or any other bodypart,,lots of growth and igf but not no seo
5. if jason wanted to go the no seo route he wouldnt be standing on the stage next to ron but would be placing lower at about the same placing as matarazza in his days,,
6. if ron comes with no lat again he will lose again,, if he is healed he will be mr o,,as simple as that

What is SEO ??

[Special Ed]

What is SEO ??

Site Enhancement Oil or Nolotil or some other injectable, non-absorbed substance that increases the size of the localized bodypart. See Dexter's biceps, Ernie Taylor's triceps, every pro's rear delts, Ronnie's calves, and Mike Dragnas' side delts.

Hope that helps.

[Tigerman]

Site Enhancement Oil or Nolotil or some other injectable, non-absorbed substance that increases the size of the localized bodypart. See Dexter's biceps, Ernie Taylor's triceps, every pro's rear delts, Ronnie's calves, and Mike Dragnas' side delts.

Hope that helps.

It does. Thanks.

[AVBG]

What is SEO ??

Something like Synthol

[Van_Bilderass]

Why is it accurate?  Because Jay has been in great shape all year, that must mean that he nevers comes off and clean his system right?  WRONG, he never stops training, he's ALWAYS on his diet or close to it.  He's been off for a long time now and when he does start his prep, you will notice because he'll get a whole lot better.  I'll ask him if I can take some pics and keep you guys posted and show you the difference, if you guys think that Jay will not show improvements this year, you'll be really surprised.

He hasn't been completely off, that's a bunch of BS. Maybe he went on "HRT" (cruising on just some test and GH), but completely off - no way.

[gh15]

Ronnie was a college linebacker and already had a massive build before the drugs!  Jay is all drugs. Jay started taking Gear before Ronnie did, literally! (20-21 years old) and Ronnie is 7 years older than him! (started on the gear in the mid 90's) Ronnie turned pro at a Natural show! Yes when Ronnie is "retired" hes still going to be in the 250's range. Where Jay will fall around 190-210lbs.

Guys who were competing at "teen shows" IE Tom Prince, Jay Cutler, Branch etc. Are ALL DRUGS.  Ronnie didnt do a show until he was 26. And already competing as a heavy-weight.  Use some common sense here people!!!

very good my friend,,very good


let me add little something here,,

to tell you jason is off hormones is to SPIT IN YOUR FACES as either fans or bodybuilders/lifters,,jason face are so red looks like hes going to explode any moment,,he is at his biggest yet tight kept size due to following pretty strict diet! that he does! this also contributes to minimal side effects in addition to lots of anti estrogen drugs and ephedrine/clen that keepts everything tight and nice,,but the level/layer of water on his body due to heavy steroid use is very noticable and can nnever go away no matter how clean he eats,,he also have lots of empty oil stuck there which make it look like a doll as in pure rubber or silicon rather than true muscle,,but it is a combo of the  (80-90% muscle and 10-20% seo)

but he is on as much hormones as ron if not more,,yes even right now,,jason NEVER  GOES OFF OFF AS IN OFF,, he may be on 1gram testosterone insted of 2 grams,,which is similar to 200lb bodybuilder who is on 500mg test insted of 1 gram,,but off? no there is always something,,many somethings in the system,,
this is true to any other top amatuer and pro bodybuilder around no matter what level they are,,

in addition jason will not get any bigger than 295 with this kind of condition since he stands at 7%,,he will get down to 275-280 at 4% and step on stage  like everytime,,

beside kevin and coupe more who built it up,,,99% of us take it down from 20 to 50lb for a show,,

now thats is more of the truth so...keep it this way

* also to keep it real,,ron never won no pro card natural,,not even close,,,clenbuterol and ephedrine and plenty of diff anabolics were running through hi system long before,,but yes he didnt do at no 17 year old,,,he did it later during college years