STEROIDS BULLSHIT!!!!!!!

[Voice of Doom]

You dont have to increase taxes to pay for universal healthcare.  This is a red-herring argument designed to scare an already overtaxed middle class into doing nothing.  All you have to do is redistribute the already collected tax money. 

  Right now our military budget exceeds the next 15 countries COMBINED.  Out of every 1 dollar of tax money collected, approximately 51 cents goes to miltary or miltary related use. 

Companies like the CIA, FBI, NSA and now homeland security have almost unlimited budgets (and thats just what they are legally forced to disclose).  Right now you could pay for full college tuition for every American high school student with the amount of money it takes to keep our armed forces in Iraq for 2 weeks!  Two weeks folks.  Full four years of the best education system in America, for free.  Would that help to make us more competitive in the global market?

  The really sad part of our military spending is that it tends to go to the already rich and connected corporations for "special" projects like new bombers, laser equipment and other high-technology.  Very little of it makes it to the families of the men and women doing the dying...their benefits are cut and curtailed as even now they are asked to do longer and longer tours.

Companies like Halliburton take billions of tax dollars providing a service that could be done cheaper (if there were open bid contracts) or even if they were handled by a specific government agency that had oversight and was responsible to the people.

It all depends on what the American people decide is more important.  Space lasers, small tactical nukes, MOAB's, another carrier, more private outsourcing at inflated rates, or covering everyone medically on the current or even reduced tax setup.

Dont be fooled by the "news" corps who have a vested interest in promoting corporate policy on the national level and get "paid" by endless commericals selling Viagra.  And don't be fooled by the rich politicians who can afford their own policy but usually take their "free" government paid healthcare. 

Poll after poll for the last 25 years indicates an OVERWHELMING majority of voters, regardless of political strip, would like to see universal heathcare in this country.  70 to 75% is typically the response.  This is of course why it doesn't make it to the political arena...ever! To qoute the New York Times, "It has no political support" (!)  By political support, of course, they mean the corporations that stand to lose billions of subsidized tax payer money!

As an example, in the 2004 televies debates, John Kerry (the democrat???) never once brought up or remarked to a question about universal or any government sponsored health program.  Not once...not in any of the three debates...not even in the "domestic policy" debate!  These are the debates where we (the public) get to decide which multi-millionaire, backed by billionaire corps, will do the best job for us "little" people.

Why would that be?



There is no friend anywhere - Lao Tse

[gatomjp]

I believe it's immoral...

You've still not made a good case for homosexuality's supposed immorality. Do you believe it's immoral only because it bothers you in some way? Do you believe it's immoral because homosexuality causes people to steal and kill? That's silly, of course, but would be a good reason to condemn it if it were true.

Do you see what I am getting at? You say you have no problem with gay people, and I believe you, BUT you have to slap an immorality sticker on them for no real reason you can define other than they can't procreate. Once again by your reasoning, heterosexual oral and anal sex is also immoral. Would you say that? If so, why? Because there is no procreation? Because it disgusts you? That's not enough of a reason.

I don't mean to pick on you, because there are people who post here who are far more intolerant than you, but I feel that you haven't completely examined your own biases.

[cheeksmaliod]

America is a country made up of diversity and if you can't handle that i suggest you find an island full of white chritians somewhere where you can all pray to Jesus and President Bush and await the on coming destruction of the earth. Republicans and religion do more to hinder the progress of man kind and technology then any other single entity.

They had that it was called america you idiot, thats exactly what he is saying hes against.

[INSOMNIA]

Its not homosexuality that bugs me...its the level of promiscuity that you hear about among them that is sickening. Many have had hundreds and even thousands of partners, most of it unprotected. Some of them are also bisexual and spreading the diseases to the hetero population. People that do this dont give a damn about themselves or anyone else..that is extremely dangerous(and immoral)...not something I like to think about. Maybe not being allowed to marry is part of the cause of this..?? anyhow if gay marraige was allowed I could see how some of this behavior might stop...if they were able to commit to each other in that way. That could be a good thing.

[The Squadfather]

Its not homosexuality that bugs me...its the level of promiscuity that you hear about among them that is sickening. Many have had hundreds and even thousands of partners, most of it unprotected. Some of them are also bisexual and spreading the diseases to the hetero population. People that do this dont give a damn about themselves or anyone else..that is extremely dangerous(and immoral)...not something I like to think about. Maybe not being allowed to marry is part of the cause of this..?? anyhow if gay marraige was allowed I could see how some of this behavior might stop...if they were able to commit to each other in that way. That could be a good thing.

bbbbbbooooooorrrrrrrrrriiiiiinnnnnngggggggggggggg. "commitment" is a fallacy.

[warrior_code]

You dont have to increase taxes to pay for universal healthcare.  This is a red-herring argument designed to scare an already overtaxed middle class into doing nothing.  All you have to do is redistribute the already collected tax money. 

  Right now our military budget exceeds the next 15 countries COMBINED.  Out of every 1 dollar of tax money collected, approximately 51 cents goes to miltary or miltary related use. 

Companies like the CIA, FBI, NSA and now homeland security have almost unlimited budgets (and thats just what they are legally forced to disclose).  Right now you could pay for full college tuition for every American high school student with the amount of money it takes to keep our armed forces in Iraq for 2 weeks!  Two weeks folks.  Full four years of the best education system in America, for free.  Would that help to make us more competitive in the global market?

  The really sad part of our military spending is that it tends to go to the already rich and connected corporations for "special" projects like new bombers, laser equipment and other high-technology.  Very little of it makes it to the families of the men and women doing the dying...their benefits are cut and curtailed as even now they are asked to do longer and longer tours.

Companies like Halliburton take billions of tax dollars providing a service that could be done cheaper (if there were open bid contracts) or even if they were handled by a specific government agency that had oversight and was responsible to the people.

It all depends on what the American people decide is more important.  Space lasers, small tactical nukes, MOAB's, another carrier, more private outsourcing at inflated rates, or covering everyone medically on the current or even reduced tax setup.

Dont be fooled by the "news" corps who have a vested interest in promoting corporate policy on the national level and get "paid" by endless commericals selling Viagra.  And don't be fooled by the rich politicians who can afford their own policy but usually take their "free" government paid healthcare. 

Poll after poll for the last 25 years indicates an OVERWHELMING majority of voters, regardless of political strip, would like to see universal heathcare in this country.  70 to 75% is typically the response.  This is of course why it doesn't make it to the political arena...ever! To qoute the New York Times, "It has no political support" (!)  By political support, of course, they mean the corporations that stand to lose billions of subsidized tax payer money!

As an example, in the 2004 televies debates, John Kerry (the democrat???) never once brought up or remarked to a question about universal or any government sponsored health program.  Not once...not in any of the three debates...not even in the "domestic policy" debate!  These are the debates where we (the public) get to decide which multi-millionaire, backed by billionaire corps, will do the best job for us "little" people.

Why would that be?



There is no friend anywhere - Lao Tse

Do you think the people in control will actually let the common people  have a say? 

The governments really don't give a shit about you or me.  If they actually did care about the general health of the public, smoking and alcohol would have been illegal a long time ago.  The evidence for steroids being harmful or causeing one to go insane is very weak compared to the evidence of cigarettes and alcohol showing these claims.  It is all about control with these people. 

[gatomjp]

Its not homosexuality that bugs me...its the level of promiscuity that you hear about among them that is sickening. Many have had hundreds and even thousands of partners, most of it unprotected. Some of them are also bisexual and spreading the diseases to the hetero population. People that do this dont give a damn about themselves or anyone else..that is extremely dangerous(and immoral)...not something I like to think about. Maybe not being allowed to marry is part of the cause of this..?? anyhow if gay marraige was allowed I could see how some of this behavior might stop...if they were able to commit to each other in that way. That could be a good thing.

Do you have a problem with the level of promiscuity among purely heterosexual people? The characteristics you describe perfectly match many heteros that I know!

Those are old facts, by the way. It was true at one time that promiscuity was rampant in the gay community (among the men, mostly) but I would bet that since the era of AIDS, homosexuals are statistically more careful and less promiscuous than heteros.

[Croatch]

bullshit, smoking doesn't hurt anyone but the smoker, if you don't like it go away from it, alcohol only hurts the person drinking it and don't give me this DWI bullshit either, plenty of sober people die in car accidents all the time, trying to legislate what people put into their own bodies is stupid.

Agreed.  2nd hand smoke is a political stand, nothing more.  They should legalize it all, coke, heroin, gear, then see where the chips fall.

[INSOMNIA]

Do you have a problem with the level of promiscuity among purely heterosexual people? The characteristics you describe perfectly match many heteros that I know!

Those are old facts, by the way. It was true at one time that promiscuity was rampant in the gay community (among the men, mostly) but I would bet that since the era of AIDS, homosexuals are statistically more careful and less promiscuous than heteros.

Yes absolutely I do. Statistics (and also seeing it firsthand by working in a largely gay community) that Ive seen over the years say that extreme promiscuity is by FAR more often the case among gay men. If I'm wrong about that please show me. Either way I find it a disturbing trend.

[INSOMNIA]

bullshit, smoking doesn't hurt anyone but the smoker, if you don't like it go away from it, alcohol only hurts the person drinking it and don't give me this DWI bullshit either, plenty of sober people die in car accidents all the time, trying to legislate what people put into their own bodies is stupid.

Youre kidding right? If I even smell smoke I have an asthma attack.    Kids growing up in a household full of smokers have no choice but to breathe it and dont know better to get away from it.

I have seen many families destroyed by alchoholism/drugs, including my own. Dont get me started.

[The Squadfather]

Youre kidding right? If I even smell smoke I have an asthma attack. Kids growing up in a household full of smokers have no choice but to breathe it and dont know better to get away from it.

I have seen many families destroyed by alchoholism/drugs, including my own. Dont get me started.

hahahah, oh brother, another hypochondriac, i'll bet you sanitize your hands 59 times a day don't you?

[gatomjp]

Yes absolutely I do. Statistics (and also seeing it firsthand by working in a largely gay community) that Ive seen over the years say that extreme promiscuity is by FAR more often the case among gay men. If I'm wrong about that please show me. Either way I find it a disturbing trend.

A few tidbits...

b) In a study of sexual behavior in homosexuals and heterosexuals, the researchers found that of gay and bisexual men, 24% had one male partner in their lifetime, 45% had 2-4 male partners, 13% had 5-9 male partners, and 18% had 10 or more sexual partners, which produces a mean of less than 6 partners.

 In a parallel study, a random sample of primarily straight men (n=3111 males who had had vaginal intercourse; of the total sample of n=3224 males, only 2.3% had indicated having had sex with both men and women), the mean number of sexual partners was 7.3, with 28.2% having 1-3 partners, and 23.3% having greater than 19 partners (Billy). This data indicates that gay men may have fewer number of sexual partners than heterosexuals.

J Billy-1993: Family Planning Perspectives 25:52-60
R Fay-1989, Science 243:338-348

In another set of studies, the first (n=2664) showed that gay men had an average of 6.5 sexual partners in the past 5 years. In fact, the authors of this paper report that "homosexual and bisexual men are much more likely than heterosexual men to be celibate" given the data in the table below, which compares their data to a second, parallel study of only heterosexual men (n=1235, age=18-49 yrs). The table indicates the percentage of men having the given number of sexual partners in the previous year [top row: Binson; bottom row: Dolcini]:

orientation    no partners    1 partner    2+ partners
gay    24 %    41 %    35 %
straight    8 %   80 %    12 %

D Binson-1995: Journal of Sex Research 32: 245-54.
M Dolcini-1993: Family Planning Perspectives 25: 208-14.

c) Homosexuals are NOT more likely to be child molesters. In a random sample of 175 child sex offenders 76% report having exclusive adult heterosexual behavior, and 24% report having adult bisexual behavior. The sexual attraction towards children is a pathology unrelated to sexual orientation.

A Groth-1978, Archives of Sexual Behavior 7(3): 175-181




I'm sure you can find statistics that show the opposite, but I have a question for you. Let's assume for the sake of argument that gays show about the same level of fidelity to one partner that straights do. Let's say they're pretty much the same as we are except for the gender they have sex with. Is there something about homosexuality that still bugs you?

[INSOMNIA]

I'm sure you can find statistics that show the opposite, but I have a question for you. Let's assume for the sake of argument that gays show about the same level of fidelity to one partner that straights do. Let's say they're pretty much the same as we are except for the gender they have sex with. Is there something about homosexuality that still bugs you?

Honestly, no..I judge people by how they treat me. Several of them are good friends of mine. My whole point was that allowiing gay marriage might curtail some of that if it is indeed the case.

[gatomjp]

Honestly, no..I judge people by how they treat me. Several of them are good friends of mine. My whole point was that allowiing gay marriage might curtail some of that if it is indeed the case.

I definitely agree with you on that! If some low-life, drug-taking, child-beating but HETERO loser can get married why can't two professional educated friends of mine, who both happen to be women, commit their lives to each other?

[INSOMNIA]

hahahah, oh brother, another hypochondriac, i'll bet you sanitize your hands 59 times a day don't you?

Im sorry for addressing one of your posts, I promise it wont happen again. You clearly dont have the capacity for intelligent conversation and/or are just an internet troll.

Have a nice day  

[gatomjp]

Im sorry for addressing one of your posts, I promise it wont happen again. You clearly dont have the capacity for intelligent conversation and/or are just an internet troll.

Have a nice day  

You're on Getbig, posting on a Squadfather thread! What did you expect?

[The Squadfather]

Im sorry for addressing one of your posts, I promise it wont happen again. You clearly dont have the capacity for intelligent conversation and/or are just an internet troll.

Have a nice day  

camn down dude it ain't that serious, why do some of these guys take this stuff so seriously, hahahahaham these "female bodybuilders" get on the drugs and lose their minds with their tempers, hahahaha, they don't realize they're still 5'5" 130 pounds with 11 inch arms.

[gatomjp]

camn down dude it ain't that serious, why do some of these guys take this stuff so seriously, hahahahaham these "female bodybuilders" get on the drugs and lose their minds with their tempers, hahahaha, they don't realize they're still 5'5" 130 pounds with 11 inch arms.

I think because it's really hard to communicate a tongue-in-cheek tone through the internet. Something said in a funny way, when seen in print, often comes off too harsh.

[INSOMNIA]

 

[Croatch]

hahahah, oh brother, another hypochondriac, i'll bet you sanitize your hands 59 times a day don't you? Roll Eyes

Yes, the same person who is allergic to rice, milk, and wheat...hahah  These guys always make me laugh.

[The Squadfather]

hahahah, these "women" who get on the juice are the worst, at least guys can take a joke to a certain extent, these "women" get on these drugs and all of a sudden they're 7'6" and 688 pounds at 3 percent bodyfat and brutal killers and not afraid of anyone, hahahaha, they're still skinny, short, weak midgets.

[climber]

Ok, lets get back to the point of this tread:

Steroids can definitely hasten violent behaviour. Couple steroids with someone who has a weak mind and it's a recipe for disaster. But, IMO not worse than alcohol, get that same person drunk and the same thing will happen.

[INSOMNIA]

Yes, the same person who is allergic to rice, milk, and wheat...hahah  These guys always make me laugh.

haha OWNED!!!! 

[gtbro1]

Squadfather is madder than a queer with lock jaw on Valentine's Day.

[Croatch]

Squadfather is madder than a queer with lock jaw on Valentine's Day.

I haven't heard that one.  I owe so much to getbig.com for really rounding me as an individual.  Thanks everyone.