Author Topic: Sicko  (Read 3397 times)

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #25 on: July 04, 2007, 01:57:34 AM »
I don't have much to add to this thread but...

Doctors = Pill Pushers

 8)
S

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #26 on: July 04, 2007, 02:10:04 AM »
Wrong.  Here is what I said:

1.  "No one in the United States can be denied emergency health care."  Anti-patient dumping laws require hospitals to treat anyone who shows up.  They don't treat people with "minor problems" in the ER.  

2.  "There are a number of federal and state programs that provide preventive health for poor people."  This allows poor people with health problems to have access to health care, from check-ups to surgery.  

3.  "Most communities have clinics that offer free immunization for kids."  This doesn't deal with "minor problems" or problems at all.  Immunization is about prevention.  

4.  "Most employers offer health care plans."  Again, has nothing to do with "minor problems."  

5.  "Hawaii requires all employers to provide healthcare to employees who work at least 20 hours a week."  Didn't say anything about "minor problems."  

So how exactly did I "lay out services that only cover people for minor problems to make [my] point"?

50 million uninsured?   ::)  


Yes, almost 50 million, it's your guess over the census bureau's facts:
 http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/income_wealth/007419.html

And you know full well you're leaving out a big part of the picture... Go into the emergency room with a spurting vien and yes, you're going to get patched up, go in with a serious medical condition, cancer, heart, liver, brain, your ass isn't getting treatment and you know it.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #27 on: July 04, 2007, 02:11:08 AM »
I don't have much to add to this thread but...

Doctors = Pill Pushers

 8)
;D, yup, clueless pill pushers...

24KT

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2007, 02:29:47 AM »
Wrong.  Here is what I said:

1.  "No one in the United States can be denied emergency health care."  Anti-patient dumping laws require hospitals to treat anyone who shows up.  
They don't treat people with "minor problems" in the ER.  

2.  "There are a number of federal and state programs that provide preventive health for poor people."  This allows poor people with health problems to have access to health care, from check-ups to surgery.  

3.  "Most communities have clinics that offer free immunization for kids."  This doesn't deal with "minor problems" or problems at all.  Immunization is about prevention.  

4.  "Most employers offer health care plans."  Again, has nothing to do with "minor problems."  

5.  "Hawaii requires all employers to provide healthcare to employees who work at least 20 hours a week."  Didn't say anything about "minor problems."  

So how exactly did I "lay out services that only cover people for minor problems to make [my] point"?

50 million uninsured?   ::)  


Too bad that "requirement" wasn't a "requirement" when Mrs Edith Rodriguez went there.   ::)

It's only been 3 weeks (21 days) and already it's been conveniently shoved down the memory hole?

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=154653

w

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2007, 02:45:27 AM »
Too bad that "requirement" wasn't a "requirement" when Mrs Edith Rodriguez went there.   ::)

It's only been 3 weeks (21 days) and already it's been conveniently shoved down the memory hole?

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=154653


The movie also shows hospitals dumping patients.  caught on video, being dumbed after having their medical tags removed, still in their hospital gowns.  hmmmm....

24KT

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #30 on: July 04, 2007, 04:08:15 AM »
The movie also shows hospitals dumping patients.  caught on video, being dumbed after having their medical tags removed, still in their hospital gowns.  hmmmm....

Ya, but I didn't want to go there... as it boils my blood. Imagine that... hospitals maintaining an account with a cab company to routinely pick up dazed, disoriented, heavily medicated patients, some senior citizens, ...and dump them on the streets of downtown LA on skid row, still in their hospital gowns... with no knowledge of where they are, or even what planet they are on.  :'(

As bad as that is, apparently there were some medical insurance horror stories that were too painful, and too horrific to include in the movie, ...like the case of the woman who had a "wonderful policy". It covered EVERYTHING! ...including mental health as well. Well, one night she was viciously and horrifically raped. The trauma was so severe, she needed psychological counselling and therapy to deal with what happened to her. Her insurance company denied her. Since the therapy was needed as a consequence of the rape that previously occurred, ...the rape was classified as a "pre-existing condition" and on that basis, her claim for therapy was denied.

Then there was the rape victim who was denied coverage, because she was raped. Rape is a crime, and as such, her condition stemmed from an act of crime. Claim denied. That means if you get stabbed, it doesn't matter how long you've paid your insurance premiums or taken care of yourself, ...if you get stabbed or shot, or catch a stray bullet from some driveby, your insurance won't cover the operation to take the bullet out. Your poor health came about from an act of crime. CLAIM DENIED! 
w

Brixtonbulldog

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #31 on: July 04, 2007, 10:01:13 AM »
melt baby melt...  Thanks for covering the righty stance on healthcare, which we're all well versed on over and over and over... oh yea, nice try diverting from my being way off on talking about privatization in reply to your taxation comment...  I'd rather of had an "oh oops, my bust" but I'll take your meltdown with equal satisfaction ;D



You have got to be the dumbest poster on this thread.. at least Jag is just off in her own world.  Socializing isn't going to drive the the prices down .. it's going to take MORE from the pockets of the individual.  (How you see that as an improvement is testament to your lack of understanding).  The rich or "productive" in society have no obligation to care for the poor or "unproductive" in the free world.  That's socialism and it's already a proven failure.  Prices have to go down based on what the market determines and nothing else.  Everyone in this county receives medical care regardless of what they can afford already.. go much past that and it's an Orwell novel.  And I liked your comment about "need".. "from each his ability, to each his need" . sound familiar?

You can choose to continue crying about a system you obviously don't understand or you can keep making me laugh with you absurd, illogical opinions.. ; D

Dos Equis

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #32 on: July 04, 2007, 10:19:31 AM »
Yes, almost 50 million, it's your guess over the census bureau's facts:
 http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/income_wealth/007419.html

And you know full well you're leaving out a big part of the picture... Go into the emergency room with a spurting vien and yes, you're going to get patched up, go in with a serious medical condition, cancer, heart, liver, brain, your ass isn't getting treatment and you know it.

The point I am trying to make is numbers like "50 million" uninsured implies that there are 50 million without access to healthcare.  The numbers (and I looked at the link) don't clarify what kind of healthcare those without health insurance actually get, including the items I've already mentioned. 

So now I'm talking about spurting veins and not "minor problems"?  I'm actually talking about all kinds of health care.  I neglected to mention county and state hospitals that don't charge for their services. 

People with Medicare, Medicaid, state equivalents, etc. can indeed get treated for serious medical conditions.  By failing to include these people in the alleged "50 million" in uninsured, the number is grossly misleading.   

Dos Equis

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #33 on: July 04, 2007, 10:22:05 AM »
Too bad that "requirement" wasn't a "requirement" when Mrs Edith Rodriguez went there.   ::)

It's only been 3 weeks (21 days) and already it's been conveniently shoved down the memory hole?

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=154653



The hospital screwed up.  This wasn't patient dumping.  It was malpractice.   

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #34 on: July 04, 2007, 03:46:47 PM »
The point I am trying to make is numbers like "50 million" uninsured implies that there are 50 million without access to healthcare.  The numbers (and I looked at the link) don't clarify what kind of healthcare those without health insurance actually get, including the items I've already mentioned. 

So now I'm talking about spurting veins and not "minor problems"?  I'm actually talking about all kinds of health care.  I neglected to mention county and state hospitals that don't charge for their services. 

People with Medicare, Medicaid, state equivalents, etc. can indeed get treated for serious medical conditions.  By failing to include these people in the alleged "50 million" in uninsured, the number is grossly misleading.   
No it's not... The number of people who will be refused treatment do to a serious illness is about 50 million.  I'm going with the census data over your guesswork.

Dos Equis

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #35 on: July 05, 2007, 11:12:12 AM »
No it's not... The number of people who will be refused treatment do to a serious illness is about 50 million.  I'm going with the census data over your guesswork.

Where exactly does the census data say 50 million people "will be refused treatment" due to a "serious illness"?  Sounds like guesswork to me. 

Brixtonbulldog

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #36 on: July 05, 2007, 12:16:41 PM »
Where exactly does the census data say 50 million people "will be refused treatment" due to a "serious illness"?  Sounds like guesswork to me. 


In "sicko" of course!

Option D

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #37 on: July 05, 2007, 12:24:17 PM »
Again with the out-of-left-field references to male genitalia?

I see a definite pattern here.  :-X


are you saying nordic craves more wang than Liberace and Richard Simmons combined?

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #38 on: July 05, 2007, 01:17:34 PM »
Where exactly does the census data say 50 million people "will be refused treatment" due to a "serious illness"?  Sounds like guesswork to me. 
Come on, there is no guess work in knowing an unisured person is shit out of luck with with a serious illness.  You're the only person doing any guesswork here.

Dos Equis

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #39 on: July 05, 2007, 01:18:57 PM »

Dos Equis

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #40 on: July 05, 2007, 01:22:06 PM »
Come on, there is no guess work in knowing an unisured person is shit out of luck with with a serious illness.  You're the only person doing any guesswork here.

I am sort of guessing.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think those numbers include people on Medicare, Medicaid, and state programs (like Quest in Hawaii)?  Assuming they don't, then a person with no health insurance, but Medicaid can still be treated for a serious illness. 

WillRiker

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Re: Sicko
« Reply #41 on: October 27, 2007, 01:47:30 AM »
The only thing I'm confused about is the garbage flowing from your fingertips.  People want to pay less taxes for better care... privatization!  The Govt is a monopoly if left responsible for health care.  Privatization, free market, competition, is the only thing that will drive down the cost of health care in this country.  The less the govt is involved, the cheaper it will be (same as any other market!).  People need to be given the choice.. that choice is what FORCES the private sector companies to compete.  OVERALL, the govt will take what they want when they want it versus people choosing one company/doctor/hospital/ins over another and ultimately deciding how much they pay THEMSELVES.

Clear?

The concept that any service will be cheaper if supplied by the private sector instead of the government is seriously flawed. Private companies, and especially insurance companies, have the desire to monopolize. This idea was first recognized decades ago by Adam Smith. I live in the Netherlands, where since 2006 they introduced a form of competition between insurance companies with the idea that this will drive down insurance costs. What we have seen is that numerous of insurance companies were either part of a merger or takeover. Now we have only a few big companies, where we had dozen of ones. Basis economic theory, and practice!, tells us that the less companies the less competition. A clear example is that we have a small insurance company who offers next year an insurance for a lower price than the big companies. The result, the big companies were furious and tried to influence the smaller company!

Insurance is a complex product with a lot of barriers that leads automatically to lower competition. If you don't like your coffee at starbucks you can buy one at McDonald's. If you don't like a domestic supplier you can choose a foreign one. With insurance, the switching costs are super high. I am fairly educated but i can't make sense of the numerous small letters of different insurance companies.

In the end, only the shareholders will benefit and not the consumer