Incentive(s) to train in a hardcore gym?

[Praetor Fenix]

I often hear weight-lifters lament the conversion/removal of hardcore iron dungeons in favor of more mainstream workout facilities.

Honestly, what would be so great about regularly training in a Metroflex or Temple?

From my perspective, the negative aspects are substantial:

1) Access to equipment.
        - It is well known that serious lifters generally perform more sets of any given exercise. In addition, they are more likely to use the limited equipment highly sought after by serious lifters (squat racks, the narrow benches, etc). Their attitude and focus limits the possibility that they would be willing to let another user work in with them, not to mention that few train alone, so you must take into account the length of time their partner(s) take as well.

2) Attitude / Annoying Habits
       - In general, the serious trainers feel entitled to more "space." They generally occupy more territory than the average gym participant, and remain planted for much longer. I've trained at hardcore gyms such as Hercules, and feel like I'm walking on eggshells around many of these guys. Although mainstream gyms have problems (such as curling in the squat rack, groups of 4-5 guys alternating on a bench), these problems are exceeded by the hardcore facilities (working out in front of the mirror while limiting access to dumbbells, planting their gymbag on the seat of good equipment while they're not using it, supersets, giant sets, etc.). The problems presented by the hardcore facility are much more difficult to circumvent too.

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".
Imagine occupying Ronnie's deadlift platform / squatrack when he first arrives to Metroflex?? 

The subtle rules, the implicit seniority, are distractions and a dedicated trainer should not have to memorize other people's routines, just simply have the freedom to do their thing yet be willing to find a suitable alternative should a conflict arise.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand the benefits (ambiance, motivation, camraderie). Unfortunately, its largely cosmetic and of peripheral importance to a bodybuilder's primary quest: to build muscle. It is far more important to perform the right exercises with the right period of rest in between sets to promote hypertrophy, and from my experience this can be accomplished more efficiently within a standard gym.

I've trained in a variety of gyms (university, boarding school in a weightlifting class, YMCA type public gyms, on-base military gyms, home gyms, exclusive "spas", private gyms, and hardcore facilities). In my opinion, the standard gym that many bodybuilders bitch about is in fact the most conducive environment for a good workout.

[tweeter]

I completely agree. While hardcore gyms are fun to train at every once in a while, I would not want to make one my regular gym. Plus there are usually no hot girls.

[ManBearPig...]

why don't you make every post of yours 4,000 words long?

[Cee21Jay]

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".

Very good description of a hardcore gym.  If you become established however , you will have the best workouts of your life. 

[chaos]

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".

bullshit, I never had an issue walking into a gym to work out, most everyone is accomidating to each other, working in sets or selecting secondary exersices if a piece of equipment is being used.

I would normally take a shot at you here, but I'm feeling nice

[Yev33]

I agree, as long as the dumbells go to at least 130lbs and all the equiplment I need is there,  I could care less about the atmosphere. I can even block out annoying music and I don't even wear headphones when I train. I usually train by myself and only focused on what I have to do. Being able to use the equipment that I need to use with no waiting is a very big priority to me. And if you need someone who is at least 250lbs and able to bb row at least 315 to spot you on the bench, you have bigger issues than deciding what gym to train at.   

[pumpher]

chalk.

[Croatch]

It's funny how at a "hardcore" gym, usually few people do anything without epic drug use.  What's "hardcore" about that?
Fucking clowns...hahah

[amc1980]

It's funny how at a "hardcore" gym, usually few people do anything without epic drug use.  What's "hardcore" about that?
Fucking clowns...hahah

[dodster]

I often hear weight-lifters lament the conversion/removal of hardcore iron dungeons in favor of more mainstream workout facilities.

Honestly, what would be so great about regularly training in a Metroflex or Temple?

From my perspective, the negative aspects are substantial:

1) Access to equipment.
        - It is well known that serious lifters generally perform more sets of any given exercise. In addition, they are more likely to use the limited equipment highly sought after by serious lifters (squat racks, the narrow benches, etc). Their attitude and focus limits the possibility that they would be willing to let another user work in with them, not to mention that few train alone, so you must take into account the length of time their partner(s) take as well.

2) Attitude / Annoying Habits
       - In general, the serious trainers feel entitled to more "space." They generally occupy more territory than the average gym participant, and remain planted for much longer. I've trained at hardcore gyms such as Hercules, and feel like I'm walking on eggshells around many of these guys. Although mainstream gyms have problems (such as curling in the squat rack, groups of 4-5 guys alternating on a bench), these problems are exceeded by the hardcore facilities (working out in front of the mirror while limiting access to dumbbells, planting their gymbag on the seat of good equipment while they're not using it, supersets, giant sets, etc.). The problems presented by the hardcore facility are much more difficult to circumvent too.

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".
Imagine occupying Ronnie's deadlift platform / squatrack when he first arrives to Metroflex?? 

The subtle rules, the implicit seniority, are distractions and a dedicated trainer should not have to memorize other people's routines, just simply have the freedom to do their thing yet be willing to find a suitable alternative should a conflict arise.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand the benefits (ambiance, motivation, camraderie). Unfortunately, its largely cosmetic and of peripheral importance to a bodybuilder's primary quest: to build muscle. It is far more important to perform the right exercises with the right period of rest in between sets to promote hypertrophy, and from my experience this can be accomplished more efficiently within a standard gym.

I've trained in a variety of gyms (university, boarding school in a weightlifting class, YMCA type public gyms, on-base military gyms, home gyms, exclusive "spas", private gyms, and hardcore facilities). In my opinion, the standard gym that many bodybuilders bitch about is in fact the most conducive environment for a good workout.

this guy woke up this mornin an had to enlighten us with this bullshit.

[MAXX]

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".

haha. you sound intimmidated. they wont hurt you little man.

[dodster]

It's funny how at a "hardcore" gym, usually few people do anything without epic drug use.  What's "hardcore" about that?
Fucking clowns...hahah

Because being a natural pussy u are scared to risk ur health by taking a shit load of drugs, which has the ability to make u a chemical monster!
I enjoy hardcore gyms, the chemical experiments give me motivation to train harder, and the freaks make u small. Do u consider urself to be the best built guy where U train? I f u do u have no space for improvement. If u were at a gym with ppl a lot better than u it would belittle u and should make u humble, and wanna train harder. a lot of naturals train at hardcore gyms for this reason, competing against what they cant beat, delivers the best physique they can build.

[@Brandon]

I trained at more than 100gyms all over the world as well.
I love hardcore gyms.
Hate the softcore gyms sissy shiny 1-50lbs dumbells.

The only thing I dont like that much when arriving in a new city
working out in hardcore places, is the staring.
The big lifters sometimes stare a lot.

Judging structure , mass, striations,
and symmetry.

Kind of like performing on stage.
When I bring girls with me, they say:
"everybody are looking at you when you lift, they dont look at me
they are looking you..., how can you concentrate?"
 

[Stark]

Read answer below... case closed.

[Bear]

Very good description of a hardcore gym.  If you become established however , you will have the best workouts of your life. 

Yeah, it kind of depends on your size. If you are conspicuously tiny compared to all the massive guys then you would necessarily feel a little intimidated, but if you're big enough not to harm the hardcore vibe then they'll soon accept you. Stupid but true. I usually find once someone sees you lifting a decent weight and sees that you're friendly and respectful then they're cool with you. A lot of guys probably think YOU are the big grumpy scary guy.

[dodster]

ppl in any gym, respect others, but u always get the clowns with ILS, or the pussies slamming 20lb db on the floor, which takes away the respect. Everybody in there to build muscle, brothers of iron, the freaks stare at the small uns and are just thinkin wat wud they look like if they jumped on deca and the combinations.

[SteelePegasus]

Yeah, it kind of depends on your size. If you are conspicuously tiny compared to all the massive guys then you would necessarily feel a little intimidated, but if you're big enough not to harm the hardcore vibe then they'll soon accept you. Stupid but true. I usually find once someone sees you lifting a decent weight and sees that you're friendly and respectful then they're cool with you. A lot of guys probably think YOU are the big grumpy scary guy.

what do you care what other guys think about you while working out?

here is my gym..very clean..tons of equipment...opens at 5am closes at 12pm

at 6am I have the entire weight section to myself..lots of cardio bunnies to look at..

only one complaint: no weight belt with the chain attachment for weighted dips and pull ups.

[Steve Pulcinella]

I think you are thinking way too long and hard about this stuff. I'm not going to go the usualy getbig route and call you a pussy and all that I just think that there are different gyms for different people. I own the so-called "hard-core" gym in my area and it has a great and condusive atmosphere. We keep it very clean and don't try to bust anybody's balls. Some people around here love my place, some people around here go to the Bally's down the road.

I often hear weight-lifters lament the conversion/removal of hardcore iron dungeons in favor of more mainstream workout facilities.

Honestly, what would be so great about regularly training in a Metroflex or Temple?

From my perspective, the negative aspects are substantial:

1) Access to equipment.
        - It is well known that serious lifters generally perform more sets of any given exercise. In addition, they are more likely to use the limited equipment highly sought after by serious lifters (squat racks, the narrow benches, etc). Their attitude and focus limits the possibility that they would be willing to let another user work in with them, not to mention that few train alone, so you must take into account the length of time their partner(s) take as well.

2) Attitude / Annoying Habits
       - In general, the serious trainers feel entitled to more "space." They generally occupy more territory than the average gym participant, and remain planted for much longer. I've trained at hardcore gyms such as Hercules, and feel like I'm walking on eggshells around many of these guys. Although mainstream gyms have problems (such as curling in the squat rack, groups of 4-5 guys alternating on a bench), these problems are exceeded by the hardcore facilities (working out in front of the mirror while limiting access to dumbbells, planting their gymbag on the seat of good equipment while they're not using it, supersets, giant sets, etc.). The problems presented by the hardcore facility are much more difficult to circumvent too.

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".
Imagine occupying Ronnie's deadlift platform / squatrack when he first arrives to Metroflex?? 

The subtle rules, the implicit seniority, are distractions and a dedicated trainer should not have to memorize other people's routines, just simply have the freedom to do their thing yet be willing to find a suitable alternative should a conflict arise.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand the benefits (ambiance, motivation, camraderie). Unfortunately, its largely cosmetic and of peripheral importance to a bodybuilder's primary quest: to build muscle. It is far more important to perform the right exercises with the right period of rest in between sets to promote hypertrophy, and from my experience this can be accomplished more efficiently within a standard gym.

I've trained in a variety of gyms (university, boarding school in a weightlifting class, YMCA type public gyms, on-base military gyms, home gyms, exclusive "spas", private gyms, and hardcore facilities). In my opinion, the standard gym that many bodybuilders bitch about is in fact the most conducive environment for a good workout.

[shiftedShapes]

what do you care what other guys think about you while working out?

here is my gym..very clean..tons of equipment...opens at 5am closes at 12pm

at 6am I have the entire weight section to myself..lots of cardio bunnies to look at..

only one complaint: no weight belt with the chain attachment for weighted dips and pull ups.

there are plenty of NYSC with dip belts, assuming you have a passport membership (or whatever NYSC calls their all access membership) you should just find one nearby with a dip belt.

[shiftedShapes]

I often hear weight-lifters lament the conversion/removal of hardcore iron dungeons in favor of more mainstream workout facilities.

Honestly, what would be so great about regularly training in a Metroflex or Temple?

From my perspective, the negative aspects are substantial:

1) Access to equipment.
        - It is well known that serious lifters generally perform more sets of any given exercise. In addition, they are more likely to use the limited equipment highly sought after by serious lifters (squat racks, the narrow benches, etc). Their attitude and focus limits the possibility that they would be willing to let another user work in with them, not to mention that few train alone, so you must take into account the length of time their partner(s) take as well.

2) Attitude / Annoying Habits
       - In general, the serious trainers feel entitled to more "space." They generally occupy more territory than the average gym participant, and remain planted for much longer. I've trained at hardcore gyms such as Hercules, and feel like I'm walking on eggshells around many of these guys. Although mainstream gyms have problems (such as curling in the squat rack, groups of 4-5 guys alternating on a bench), these problems are exceeded by the hardcore facilities (working out in front of the mirror while limiting access to dumbbells, planting their gymbag on the seat of good equipment while they're not using it, supersets, giant sets, etc.). The problems presented by the hardcore facility are much more difficult to circumvent too.

3) Microcosm
      - These hardcore facilities have a smaller base of guests, so it is difficult for newcomers to get established. On the same note, it is far more risky to be assertive due to the possibility of pissing someone "important" off. People in smaller hardcore facilities have their workout routines firmly entrenched, and are not as willing to deviate to secondary alternatives if you're somehow "in their way".
Imagine occupying Ronnie's deadlift platform / squatrack when he first arrives to Metroflex?? 

The subtle rules, the implicit seniority, are distractions and a dedicated trainer should not have to memorize other people's routines, just simply have the freedom to do their thing yet be willing to find a suitable alternative should a conflict arise.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand the benefits (ambiance, motivation, camraderie). Unfortunately, its largely cosmetic and of peripheral importance to a bodybuilder's primary quest: to build muscle. It is far more important to perform the right exercises with the right period of rest in between sets to promote hypertrophy, and from my experience this can be accomplished more efficiently within a standard gym.

I've trained in a variety of gyms (university, boarding school in a weightlifting class, YMCA type public gyms, on-base military gyms, home gyms, exclusive "spas", private gyms, and hardcore facilities). In my opinion, the standard gym that many bodybuilders bitch about is in fact the most conducive environment for a good workout.

You will make greater gains if you refocus your training on bodyweight exercises and spend a couple hundred bucks building a home gym.  You will be able to increase volume and rest time by having everything readily available all the time.

[Luv2Hurt]

There are always a couple A-holes anywhere you go.  I trained at hardcore places too and for the most part if you train hard, have good gym etiquette, and don't run your mouth you will be accepted by the clique.

But sometimes there is someone there that has to try and intimidate people for whatever reason, usually someone who feels their status threatened by you.  Kind of like a wolf pack, this can be diffused usually by introducing yourself to the person.  This will disarm most people....but there are a few who still wanna bring it to the next level, thats when you have to man up and just take no BS.  Most bully's will back away if you hold your own.

[MAXX]

There are always a couple A-holes anywhere you go.  I trained at hardcore places too and for the most part if you train hard, have good gym etiquette, and don't run your mouth you will be accepted by the clique.

But sometimes there is someone there that has to try and intimidate people for whatever reason, usually someone who feels their status threatened by you.  Kind of like a wolf pack, this can be diffused usually by introducing yourself to the person.  This will disarm most people....but there are a few who still wanna bring it to the next level, thats when you have to man up and just take no BS.  Most bully's will back away if you hold your own.

never met a bully at a gym. what did the "bully" do to you? grunt and throw the dumbells at the floor? 

[Brutal_1]

I trained at more than 100gyms all over the world as well.
I love hardcore gyms.
Hate the softcore gyms sissy shiny 1-50lbs dumbells.

The only thing I dont like that much when arriving in a new city
working out in hardcore places, is the staring.
The big lifters sometimes stare a lot.

Judging structure , mass, striations,
and symmetry.

Kind of like performing on stage.
When I bring girls with me, they say:
"everybody are looking at you when you lift, they dont look at me
they are looking you..., how can you concentrate?"
 

LOL, yeah this is VERY true, especially if you're new to a gym, get ready to be analyzed from head to toe 

I'd still prefer a hardcore gym as well...which are hard to find.  My pet peeve is the socializing at commercial gyms...you know all the guys hanging out joking real loud in between sets of bench (cause that's all they do)...that gets annoying when you're trying to get in the zone for the next heavy set.

THen you've got the gyms with all the gangsters...   

[triple_pickle]

only one complaint: no weight belt with the chain attachment for weighted dips and pull ups.

jeez, bring your own, this thing is like $25 

[Stark]

jeez, bring your own, this thing is like $25 

Lol I was thinking the exact same fuckin thing